Re: [M100] Tandy Portable Disk Drive 2, but really 1

[Gregory McGill]

I'm starting to make my own :)  just need to make them .. i have put some
in stock in the meantime

had to figure out how to do it with a greaseweazel usb drive interface
..lots of fun

Greg

On Tue, Nov 22, 2022 at 7:58 PM Brian K. White  wrote:

> Yes well, yes, TPDD1 is almost entirely different. There is some
> overlap, some backwards compatibility from TPDD2 to TPDD1, but you need
> to be using the TPDD1 version of any and all directions.
>
> If Greg is out of TPDD1 util disks, you can create your own with pdd.sh
> if you want, but you don't need to bother.
>
> You don't need the util disk unless you just want to use the original
> software just for the heck of it. TS-DOS, DSKMGR, and TEENY are all
> available already from downloads, with a convenient bootstrapper
> installer from a pc, and ts-dos is better than Floppy anyway. And you
> said you also even have a ts-dos option rom which is even better than
> installing the ram version. So you're already all set even better than
> having the original disk.
>
> I have a stack of 100 blank disks right next to me that I was supposed
> to make 50 each tpdd1 & 2 disks for Greg since probably over two years
> ago. (Sorry Greg) So I imagine he's out of them, unless he started
> making them himself or got someone else to. Anyone can make them now.
> The means are all available on-line.
>
> pdd.sh comes with disk images of both tpdd1 & 2 util disks ready to go,
> with the command line right in the readme, and even links to the nice
> labels I made for the original set I made for Greg a few years ago so
> anyone can reproduce them, both the data and the labels. The label
> software is open source and the label design files even include links to
> where to buy the exact blank labels.
>
> So it's all reproducible and open source* if anyone really wants one and
> is sick of waiting for me to make some more for Greg. And the only
> hardware you need is the same tpdd drive you want the disk for, and a
> serial connection, all described in the hardware document linked in the
> pdd.sh readme.
>
> * Except of course the actual data in the disk image is copyright Tandy
> but, shrug, that would matter more to me if you could still call up a RS
> parts line and order a replacement 26-3808 or 26-3814 disk.
>
> --
> bkw
>
>
> On 11/19/22 14:35, Spencer wrote:
> > Does everybody want to hear a funny???  Guess what?  After reading links
> > from Brian (not the sheep dip guy Bruce) I realized there is a BIG
> > difference with the TPPD1 and the TPPD2. IT ACTUALLY says Portable Disk
> > Drive for TPPD1 and Portable Disk Drive 2 for TPPD2 right on the face!
> > What about that?? ;-)  Yep brain fart!  So I can do the bootstrap, but
> > no Utility Disk.  I looked at the link Brian gave me where I can buy the
> > Utility Disk for $15 BUT what I have to wait???.  ;-) Dang!
> >
> > All this time I was treating it like a TPPD2 - wow!  Too much on my mind!
> >
> > Spencer
> >
> > P.S. Let me hear the chuckles now.  ;-)
> >
> > On Tuesday, November 15, 2022 at 09:35:51 PM EST, Brian K. White
> >  wrote:
> >
> >
> > On 11/15/22 20:12, Spencer wrote:
> >  > I found this llink
> >  > (Tandy_Portable_Disk_Drive_Service_Manual_26-3808S_text.pdf
> >  > (archive.org)
> >  >
> > <
> https://ia802901.us.archive.org/13/items/tandyportablediskdriveservicemanual263808stext/Tandy_Portable_Disk_Drive_Service_Manual_26-3808S_text.pdf
> <
> https://ia802901.us.archive.org/13/items/tandyportablediskdriveservicemanual263808stext/Tandy_Portable_Disk_Drive_Service_Manual_26-3808S_text.pdf>>)
>  and
> it says "Service Manual" on the first page. It's not the typical service
> manuals I've seen.
> >
> > That's the software manual and is known, and is for TPDD1 not TPDD2.
> > One of the pages I linked already has it:
> > tandy.wiki/TPDD
> > And there you will also find an actual normal service manual, but again
> > for TPDD1 not TPDD2.
> >
> > When I said no one has turned up a service manual, I meant for TPDD2
> > because you were talking about a TPDD2.
> >
> > I also didn't realize you already had a whole other working TPDD2 to
> > compare against.
> >
> > If I had known you already had a whole other TPDD2 and already made it
> > work, I could have skipped a lot of that because you've already
> > successfully done it, which proves your 200 is ok, your disk is ok, you
> > have the right kind of disk, your cable is ok, and you know how to
> > perform the bootstrap.
> >
> > If you have TS-DOS in rom, then really that's the best, and in that
> > case, you actually don't want to try to install Floppy because they
> > conflict. Just use one or the other. I mean there are ways but it's not
> > worth getting into that. The simple answer is if you have TS-DOS,
> > especially in ROM or via REX#, then just use that and don't even bother
> > with the bootstrap procedure or Floppy.
> >
> > I brought up pdd.sh just for interrogating the drive at a lower level so
> > you can debug what's wrong. It can show at least if the 

Re: [M100] Tandy Portable Disk Drive 2, but really 1

[Brian K. White]

Yes well, yes, TPDD1 is almost entirely different. There is some 
overlap, some backwards compatibility from TPDD2 to TPDD1, but you need 
to be using the TPDD1 version of any and all directions.


If Greg is out of TPDD1 util disks, you can create your own with pdd.sh 
if you want, but you don't need to bother.


You don't need the util disk unless you just want to use the original 
software just for the heck of it. TS-DOS, DSKMGR, and TEENY are all 
available already from downloads, with a convenient bootstrapper 
installer from a pc, and ts-dos is better than Floppy anyway. And you 
said you also even have a ts-dos option rom which is even better than 
installing the ram version. So you're already all set even better than 
having the original disk.


I have a stack of 100 blank disks right next to me that I was supposed 
to make 50 each tpdd1 & 2 disks for Greg since probably over two years 
ago. (Sorry Greg) So I imagine he's out of them, unless he started 
making them himself or got someone else to. Anyone can make them now. 
The means are all available on-line.


pdd.sh comes with disk images of both tpdd1 & 2 util disks ready to go, 
with the command line right in the readme, and even links to the nice 
labels I made for the original set I made for Greg a few years ago so 
anyone can reproduce them, both the data and the labels. The label 
software is open source and the label design files even include links to 
where to buy the exact blank labels.


So it's all reproducible and open source* if anyone really wants one and 
is sick of waiting for me to make some more for Greg. And the only 
hardware you need is the same tpdd drive you want the disk for, and a 
serial connection, all described in the hardware document linked in the 
pdd.sh readme.


* Except of course the actual data in the disk image is copyright Tandy 
but, shrug, that would matter more to me if you could still call up a RS 
parts line and order a replacement 26-3808 or 26-3814 disk.


--
bkw


On 11/19/22 14:35, Spencer wrote:
Does everybody want to hear a funny???  Guess what?  After reading links 
from Brian (not the sheep dip guy Bruce) I realized there is a BIG 
difference with the TPPD1 and the TPPD2. IT ACTUALLY says Portable Disk 
Drive for TPPD1 and Portable Disk Drive 2 for TPPD2 right on the face!  
What about that?? ;-)  Yep brain fart!  So I can do the bootstrap, but 
no Utility Disk.  I looked at the link Brian gave me where I can buy the 
Utility Disk for $15 BUT what I have to wait???.  ;-) Dang!


All this time I was treating it like a TPPD2 - wow!  Too much on my mind!

Spencer

P.S. Let me hear the chuckles now.  ;-)

On Tuesday, November 15, 2022 at 09:35:51 PM EST, Brian K. White 
 wrote:



On 11/15/22 20:12, Spencer wrote:
 > I found this llink
 > (Tandy_Portable_Disk_Drive_Service_Manual_26-3808S_text.pdf
 > (archive.org)
 > 
>) and it says "Service Manual" on the first page. It's not the typical service manuals I've seen.


That's the software manual and is known, and is for TPDD1 not TPDD2.
One of the pages I linked already has it:
tandy.wiki/TPDD
And there you will also find an actual normal service manual, but again
for TPDD1 not TPDD2.

When I said no one has turned up a service manual, I meant for TPDD2
because you were talking about a TPDD2.

I also didn't realize you already had a whole other working TPDD2 to
compare against.

If I had known you already had a whole other TPDD2 and already made it
work, I could have skipped a lot of that because you've already
successfully done it, which proves your 200 is ok, your disk is ok, you
have the right kind of disk, your cable is ok, and you know how to
perform the bootstrap.

If you have TS-DOS in rom, then really that's the best, and in that
case, you actually don't want to try to install Floppy because they
conflict. Just use one or the other. I mean there are ways but it's not
worth getting into that. The simple answer is if you have TS-DOS,
especially in ROM or via REX#, then just use that and don't even bother
with the bootstrap procedure or Floppy.

I brought up pdd.sh just for interrogating the drive at a lower level so
you can debug what's wrong. It can show at least if the drive firmware
is running and communicating and it's just a physical problem for
instance. "drive not ready" from TS-DOS doesn't tell you really anything.

But it's barely documented so it's also kind of arcane to try to use
unless you're me I guess. But for instance maybe if you try a format,
and it spins the drive and steps the head, but always fails verify, or
if trying to read a raw sector always yields all 00's or drive not
ready, maybe that means there's a problem with the head or