Re: Fwd: CamelBones: Will hack for food!
Another way to promote CB that I just thought of, why not get an article in The Perl Review? I know it's not a huge audience, but I do know chromatic usually lists what's in the latest issue when he puts out the O'Reilly Perl newsletter. I just thought of something else too, maybe an interview on Perlcast? I could ask Josh McAdams if he's interested in doing the interview (or maybe we could arrange for someone to interview you). Both are really good ideas. I spoke to brian d foy at Nordic Perl Workshop at the end of April about writing an article for the Perl Review and he seemed receptive. That is to say he welcomes articles, not that I should write it since I don't know if I am qualified to write it. Josh McAdams also was at the NPW and seems like a cool guy, Perlcast is growing in audience and this seems a perfect thing to do. Jeremiah
Re: CamelBones: Will hack for food!
Sherm Pendley wrote: On May 7, 2007, at 11:44 AM, Chris Nandor wrote: In article [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Sherm Pendley) wrote: I need donations to CamelBones. Or web hosting customers. Or consulting clients. Or a plain old-fashioned job. Or something - and I need it soon. Have you considered a Perl Foundation Grant? Surely this is more worthy than some of the other grants they've done. I've considered it, but one of the requirements is that the proposed project benefits a large segment of the Perl community. Honestly, I've never figured CamelBones would meet that requirement - Mac users are a pretty small niche, Cocoa developers a small niche within that, and Cocoa/Perl developers a small niche within that. Try it anyway! If you don't ask, the answer is always no. : ) Robert
Re: CamelBones: Will hack for food!
Sun, May 06, 2007 at 05:07:46PM -0400: Sherm Pendley mangled some bits into this alignment: On May 6, 2007, at 3:25 PM, Alex Robinson wrote: I wish even more that Apple had picked you up and made CamelBones a first class citizen. Good news: That may still happen. Good news indeed. Before I go any further I ought to introduce myself since I am new to the list. My name is Jeremiah Foster and I'm a perl hacker and OS X softie - perfect for this list eh? =) So, why has Apple ignored CamelBones? What all this means is, first-class scripting support is actually language-neutral, and even though Leopard will be the first OS version to include it, nothing about it will require Leopard. At the edges, specific support for RubyCocoa and PyObjC basically means that their frameworks and project templates are included with Leopard. Why did the OS X loving bit of the perl community sit by and let PyObjC become the default bridge. I blame the CamelBones management - i.e. myself. Great to see such candor from a developer, it is commendable. I blog and write a bit on O'Reilly's web site, maybe I can work out a blog posting about CamelBones? Hopefully that would add traffic/users/donations which would be a good thing. Let me know if you are interested sherm. I am afraid I cannot offer financial support at this time since I am also not gainfully employed in a permanent fashion, just some writing and such, but if I can help in other ways I would love to. Perhaps you can post a wish list to this mailing list so that those who can hack, provide bandwidth, etc. can contribute if that is useful to you. In any case, I am very interested in perl, OS X, and CamelBones and am willing to use my little soap box to further their vitality. Regards, Jeremiah
Re: CamelBones: Will hack for food!
Tue, May 08, 2007 at 05:25:35PM -0400: Sherm Pendley mangled some bits into this alignment: On May 7, 2007, at 6:23 AM, David Cantrell wrote: On Sun, May 06, 2007 at 08:25:49PM +0100, Alex Robinson wrote: Why did the OS X loving bit of the perl community sit by and let PyObjC become the default bridge. Because the vast majority of perl people who moved to OS X did so because it was Unix That Worked On A Laptop and not because it was Mac. Too many of us still sneer at anything non-Unix. It's not just in Mac circles either - there's a very widespread misconception that Perl is useful for system admins, web developers, and little else. One thing I find personally frustrating is the corollary, that Perl *programmers* must be admins or web devs. I find that frustrating because I'm not an admin, and while I don't mind web work, I don't want to focus on it exclusively. So, what can be done to change that? It's basically a PR/evangelism problem, which is well outside my area of expertise. Any suggestions? One or two cool apps will help. Coda is an excellent example of creating a buzz amongst creatives and developers. I also think Perl 6 is going to be really, really amazing but that may not directly aid CB, maybe present it with its own set of problems. But it would be pretty cool if CB had Perl 6 support and people could build OS X apps in Perl 6 with Cocoa bindings, w00t. Also the chattering classes, that is to say bloggers, of which I am an ignominious member, need to promote CB, perl, and Mac OS X development in general since OS X is a great platform for development and perl is a great language and CB is the perfect tool, etc. Jeremiah,
Re: CamelBones: Will hack for food!
Hi all, I have blogged a bit about Camel Bones here on O'Reilly. Please comment if you would so that the python person who commented is not the sole comment. Nothing personal against python but it sucks. http://www.oreillynet.com/mac/blog/2007/05/developing_with_camel_bones_pe_1.html Jeremiah
Re: CamelBones: Will hack for food!
On 5/8/07, at 5:25 PM -0400, Sherm Pendley wrote: It's not just in Mac circles either - there's a very widespread misconception that Perl is useful for system admins, web developers, and little else. One thing I find personally frustrating is the corollary, that Perl *programmers* must be admins or web devs. I'm a retired mathematician, myself. I can't even administer my own (iMac) system, but I use Perl constantly. I am not particularly interested in Camel Bones, but I do use the ShuX application quite often. You had something to do with that didn't you, Sherm? I believe I got it from your site. Regards, Vic -- *---* mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] | Victor Thane Norton, Jr. | Mathematician and Motorcyclist | Bowling Green, OH 43402-2223, USA | Phone: 419-353-3399 *---* http://vic.norton.name
Re: CamelBones: Will hack for food!
On 5/9/07 Jeremiah Foster wrote: I have blogged a bit about Camel Bones here on O'Reilly. Please comment if you would so that the python person who commented is not the sole comment. Nothing personal against python but it sucks. But let's not turn this into a battle in the best language wars. All tools to all people, as needed, where useful! Best, - Bruce __bruce__van_allen__santa_cruz__ca__
Re: CamelBones: Will hack for food!
Wed, May 09, 2007 at 08:55:54AM -0700: Bruce Van Allen mangled some bits into this alignment: On 5/9/07 Jeremiah Foster wrote: I have blogged a bit about Camel Bones here on O'Reilly. Please comment if you would so that the python person who commented is not the sole comment. Nothing personal against python but it sucks. But let's not turn this into a battle in the best language wars. All tools to all people, as needed, where useful! Absolutely Bruce. I didn't mean to turn this into a language war. Just trying to be funny and glib. I apologize. Jeremiah
Re: CamelBones: Will hack for food!
On 5/9/07 Jeremiah Foster wrote: Wed, May 09, 2007 at 08:55:54AM -0700: Bruce Van Allen mangled some bits into this alignment: On 5/9/07 Jeremiah Foster wrote: I have blogged a bit about Camel Bones here on O'Reilly. Please comment if you would so that the python person who commented is not the sole comment. Nothing personal against python but it sucks. But let's not turn this into a battle in the best language wars. All tools to all people, as needed, where useful! Absolutely Bruce. I didn't mean to turn this into a language war. Just trying to be funny and glib. I apologize. Accepted. - Bruce __bruce__van_allen__santa_cruz__ca__
Re: CamelBones: Will hack for food!
On May 9, 2007, at 11:55 AM, Bruce Van Allen wrote: On 5/9/07 Jeremiah Foster wrote: I have blogged a bit about Camel Bones here on O'Reilly. Please comment if you would so that the python person who commented is not the sole comment. Nothing personal against python but it sucks. But let's not turn this into a battle in the best language wars. All tools to all people, as needed, where useful! That, indeed, is the philosophy of CamelBones. I'll say it again, in the land of the free: Use your freedom of choice! --Devo sherm-- Web Hosting by West Virginians, for West Virginians: http://wv-www.net Cocoa programming in Perl: http://camelbones.sourceforge.net
Re: CamelBones: Will hack for food!
On May 9, 2007, at 11:51 AM, Vic Norton wrote: On 5/8/07, at 5:25 PM -0400, Sherm Pendley wrote: It's not just in Mac circles either - there's a very widespread misconception that Perl is useful for system admins, web developers, and little else. One thing I find personally frustrating is the corollary, that Perl *programmers* must be admins or web devs. I'm a retired mathematician, myself. Is that something you can *really* retire from? Or are you doing the same thing you've always done, only now without bosses and schedules to distract you? :-) I can't even administer my own (iMac) system, but I use Perl constantly. I am not particularly interested in Camel Bones, but I do use the ShuX application quite often. You had something to do with that didn't you, Sherm? I believe I got it from your site. Yes, ShuX was the first CamelBones app. When I switched to Mac OS X, I found that a couple of years of using MacPerl and Shuck had thoroughly spoiled me for readable docs. I simply could not stand going back to reading them in fixed-pitch Monaco again. I had a little sign over my monitor for a while that said Times or Bust. :-) Funny thing is, I like Monaco for command-line work, and for editing text in BBEdit. It's only for reading docs that it really bothers my eyes. | Mathematician and Motorcyclist Have you seen the new Norton motorcycles? The Commando is *sweet*! :-) sherm-- Web Hosting by West Virginians, for West Virginians: http://wv-www.net Cocoa programming in Perl: http://camelbones.sourceforge.net
Fwd: CamelBones: Will hack for food!
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Just figured out that this only went to Jeremiah. Begin forwarded message: From: Tom Yarrish [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: May 9, 2007 9:11:08 AM CDT To: Jeremiah Foster [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: CamelBones: Will hack for food! -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On May 9, 2007, at 5:59 AM, Jeremiah Foster wrote: Tue, May 08, 2007 at 05:25:35PM -0400: Sherm Pendley mangled some bits into this alignment: On May 7, 2007, at 6:23 AM, David Cantrell wrote: On Sun, May 06, 2007 at 08:25:49PM +0100, Alex Robinson wrote: Why did the OS X loving bit of the perl community sit by and let PyObjC become the default bridge. Because the vast majority of perl people who moved to OS X did so because it was Unix That Worked On A Laptop and not because it was Mac. Too many of us still sneer at anything non-Unix. It's not just in Mac circles either - there's a very widespread misconception that Perl is useful for system admins, web developers, and little else. One thing I find personally frustrating is the corollary, that Perl *programmers* must be admins or web devs. I find that frustrating because I'm not an admin, and while I don't mind web work, I don't want to focus on it exclusively. So, what can be done to change that? It's basically a PR/evangelism problem, which is well outside my area of expertise. Any suggestions? One or two cool apps will help. Coda is an excellent example of creating a buzz amongst creatives and developers. I also think Perl 6 is going to be really, really amazing but that may not directly aid CB, maybe present it with its own set of problems. But it would be pretty cool if CB had Perl 6 support and people could build OS X apps in Perl 6 with Cocoa bindings, w00t. Also the chattering classes, that is to say bloggers, of which I am an ignominious member, need to promote CB, perl, and Mac OS X development in general since OS X is a great platform for development and perl is a great language and CB is the perfect tool, etc. Jeremiah, Another way to promote CB that I just thought of, why not get an article in The Perl Review? I know it's not a huge audience, but I do know chromatic usually lists what's in the latest issue when he puts out the O'Reilly Perl newsletter. I just thought of something else too, maybe an interview on Perlcast? I could ask Josh McAdams if he's interested in doing the interview (or maybe we could arrange for someone to interview you). Tom -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.5 (Darwin) iD8DBQFGQiEhZWzkfeDiTw4RAu7UAJ9aVlo1/qgWW8dpceEjznmXwB/qCgCfaLbI vd/CbTsiNksKfmhJmy/KARk= =3gW0 -END PGP SIGNATURE-
Re: CamelBones: Will hack for food!
On Wed, May 9, 2007 3:50 pm, Sherm Pendley said: So, the next version - 1.2 release, preceded by 1.1.x betas - will also be licensed under the same terms: GPL or Artistic, your choice. I wouldn't have had a problem with a commercial program using CB anyway, even before the license change - the LGPL only requires that the framework can be easily replaced with a custom version, and the structure of an .app bundle makes that a trivial task. Also, I've been looking at PyGame, and watching how much enthusiasm it helps generate around Python. Games could definitely be a killer app area here. If you are looking for an app that would get widely used, I've got an idea that's been on the top of my 'when I have time to program' list for the past ~2 years... Macs desperately _need_ a an app to manage third-party software updates. Something that you could run periodically to keep software up to date, avoiding having every seprate program connect to the internet on startup and check for itself. (Invariably the wrong time to do an update...) My basic thought is to create a folder in the 'Application Support' directory where apps can drop an XML file with their current version, a link to where update files can be found, and their public key of some sort. The update file would just be another XML file with the current version, and some information on paid/nonpaid, license changes, what's updated, etc. Both the update file and the program update itself would be signed by the company, and the updater app doesn't accept any update that doesn't have a valid signature. The program should either be runnable manually or on schedule(s), where it checks to see if the programs registered with it (by them dropping the file in the 'Application Support' subfolder) need updating. Then it can download, install, or just notify the user. Using CPAN, this should be a fairly quick project, I think. But it would take me a few days just get back up to speed enough on Cocoa to start it, and I have _no_ spare time. (I literally don't even have a single vacation day this year.) I've got the design in my head, but it could be ages before I get a chance to write it. I'd love to pay someone to do it, but... Well, I just donated all my spare change to Sherm already. ;) I _do_ have time to discuss though, if people want info. (I can do that at work, where I have little to do. But I can't program outside projects there.) Anyway, if people are looking for a 'killer app', I think this could generate a lot of interest if done well. And, as long as the end result is free and open-source (for this, I care that people can use it) I don't care who programs it. If no one else is interested, I'll probably do it eventually, but it'll be years before I have a chance... Daniel T. Staal --- This email copyright the author. Unless otherwise noted, you are expressly allowed to retransmit, quote, or otherwise use the contents for non-commercial purposes. This copyright will expire 5 years after the author's death, or in 30 years, whichever is longer, unless such a period is in excess of local copyright law. ---
Re: CamelBones: Will hack for food!
On 5/9/07 Peter N Lewis wrote: Perhaps folks have some ideas for apps that could be written in CamelBones? Something that would presumably use some of the vast CPAN facilities to make something cool with minimal programming effort. Mine would not be as flashy as games, but I'm working toward two related CB goals: - a GUI for a bunch of data-handling and text processing stuff that I now do in Perl using cli or BBEdit worksheets and then import to Filemaker for some outputs and also for lookups and data input by non-technical users; and - a spreadsheet GUI that is nothing but a means of accessing and displaying the cells of a table, no built-in functions, with an API capable of accepting libraries of whatever Perl code I need to use (math, text, network) for operations by cell, row, column, sub-table. Adelante! - Bruce __bruce__van_allen__santa_cruz__ca__
Re: CamelBones: Will hack for food!
On May 9, 2007, at 4:32 PM, Daniel T. Staal wrote: Macs desperately _need_ a an app to manage third-party software updates. Something that you could run periodically to keep software up to date, avoiding having every seprate program connect to the internet on startup and check for itself. A good idea. But http://metaquark.de/appfresh/ may have beat you to it. :-) -- Chris Devers
Re: CamelBones: Will hack for food!
On May 7, 2007, at 11:44 AM, Chris Nandor wrote: In article [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Sherm Pendley) wrote: I need donations to CamelBones. Or web hosting customers. Or consulting clients. Or a plain old-fashioned job. Or something - and I need it soon. Have you considered a Perl Foundation Grant? Surely this is more worthy than some of the other grants they've done. I've considered it, but one of the requirements is that the proposed project benefits a large segment of the Perl community. Honestly, I've never figured CamelBones would meet that requirement - Mac users are a pretty small niche, Cocoa developers a small niche within that, and Cocoa/Perl developers a small niche within that. On the other hand, it appears that quite a few of Perl's heavy hitters are using Macs. And it certainly couldn't hurt to ask. So I'll write up a proposal for this round, and see what happens. sherm-- Web Hosting by West Virginians, for West Virginians: http://wv-www.net Cocoa programming in Perl: http://camelbones.sourceforge.net
Re: CamelBones: Will hack for food!
On May 7, 2007, at 6:23 AM, David Cantrell wrote: On Sun, May 06, 2007 at 08:25:49PM +0100, Alex Robinson wrote: Why did the OS X loving bit of the perl community sit by and let PyObjC become the default bridge. Because the vast majority of perl people who moved to OS X did so because it was Unix That Worked On A Laptop and not because it was Mac. Too many of us still sneer at anything non-Unix. It's not just in Mac circles either - there's a very widespread misconception that Perl is useful for system admins, web developers, and little else. One thing I find personally frustrating is the corollary, that Perl *programmers* must be admins or web devs. I find that frustrating because I'm not an admin, and while I don't mind web work, I don't want to focus on it exclusively. So, what can be done to change that? It's basically a PR/evangelism problem, which is well outside my area of expertise. Any suggestions? sherm-- Web Hosting by West Virginians, for West Virginians: http://wv-www.net Cocoa programming in Perl: http://camelbones.sourceforge.net
Re: CamelBones: Will hack for food!
Sherm et al., I know that a great deal of Bioinformatics people also use Perl ... and Macs! If some of the framework could be shown how it would be good for these people to use Camelbones, maybe that would help with takeup. I tend to just use the Tk library for all my UI stuff (or web browser) and don't worry about Cocoa at all. I agree that restricting Perl to use in sysadmin work, or CGI development, is unfortunate. I use if for everything ... Good luck with the search for work! I'm happy to host downloads, etc. from any of my servers. Best wishes, John. On 8 May 2007, at 22:25, Sherm Pendley wrote: On May 7, 2007, at 6:23 AM, David Cantrell wrote: On Sun, May 06, 2007 at 08:25:49PM +0100, Alex Robinson wrote: Why did the OS X loving bit of the perl community sit by and let PyObjC become the default bridge. Because the vast majority of perl people who moved to OS X did so because it was Unix That Worked On A Laptop and not because it was Mac. Too many of us still sneer at anything non-Unix. It's not just in Mac circles either - there's a very widespread misconception that Perl is useful for system admins, web developers, and little else. One thing I find personally frustrating is the corollary, that Perl *programmers* must be admins or web devs. I find that frustrating because I'm not an admin, and while I don't mind web work, I don't want to focus on it exclusively. So, what can be done to change that? It's basically a PR/evangelism problem, which is well outside my area of expertise. Any suggestions? sherm-- Web Hosting by West Virginians, for West Virginians: http://wv-www.net Cocoa programming in Perl: http://camelbones.sourceforge.net Dr. John G. Keating Department of Computer Science National University of Ireland, Maynooth Maynooth, Co. Kildare, IRELAND. Email:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Tel:+353 1 708 3854 FAX:+353 1 708 3848 - Manny: Let's paaarrrtt ... Bernard:Don't you dare use the word party as a verb in this shop
Re: CamelBones: Will hack for food!
At 5:25 PM -0400 5/8/07, Sherm Pendley wrote: there's a very widespread misconception that Perl is useful for system admins, web developers, and little else. One thing I find personally frustrating is the corollary, that Perl *programmers* must be admins or web devs. I find that frustrating because I'm not an admin, and while I don't mind web work, I don't want to focus on it exclusively. So, what can be done to change that?... I certainly don't know -- I'm a physician, not a professional programmer, but I have used many scripts, including scripts written in Perl, to increase my office productivity and to make throughput easier. I also use it in non-office matters as my tool of choice whenever graphic files are involved. In general, I find Perl to be very useful when I'm dealing with data that is mostly in the form of strings, which happens for me in a number of circumstances. HTH, Jonathan
Re: CamelBones: Will hack for food!
I need donations to CamelBones. Or web hosting customers. Or consulting clients. Or a plain old-fashioned job. Or something - and I need it soon. Good luck Sherm. I wish I had work I could punt your way. I wish even more that Apple had picked you up and made CamelBones a first class citizen. So, why has Apple ignored CamelBones?. Why did the OS X loving bit of the perl community sit by and let PyObjC become the default bridge. How depressing is it that there's not even a mention of perl in this quick round up by John Gruber (himself a keen user of perl)? http://daringfireball.net/2007/02/dynamic_scripting_languages And that's before Rails gets bundled by default with Leopard...
Re: CamelBones: Will hack for food!
On Sun, May 06, 2007 at 08:25:49PM +0100, Alex Robinson wrote: Why did the OS X loving bit of the perl community sit by and let PyObjC become the default bridge. Because the vast majority of perl people who moved to OS X did so because it was Unix That Worked On A Laptop and not because it was Mac. Too many of us still sneer at anything non-Unix. -- David Cantrell | Enforcer, South London Linguistic Massive I apologize if I offended you personally, I intended to do it professionally. -- Steve Champeon, on the nanog list
Re: CamelBones: Will hack for food!
In article [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Sherm Pendley) wrote: I need donations to CamelBones. Or web hosting customers. Or consulting clients. Or a plain old-fashioned job. Or something - and I need it soon. Have you considered a Perl Foundation Grant? Surely this is more worthy than some of the other grants they've done. -- Chris Nandor [EMAIL PROTECTED]http://pudge.net/ Open Source Technology Group [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://ostg.com/
Re: CamelBones: Will hack for food!
I need donations to CamelBones. Or web hosting customers. Or consulting clients. Or a plain old-fashioned job. Or something - and I need it soon. Hi Sherm, I have some work for you. I use ruby and the mechanize object to pull down pages off the web and parse them. There is a lot of mystery involved with it, especially in debugging. I am flying blind and can't see what I am getting back. Especially logging in and redirection. The documentation is very light. I would be willing to pay you $700 for an ebook 10 pages or so, that describes how to set up an environment for debugging mech issues and stepwise shows ways to solve them. You would be free to sell the ebook to others as well. Joe Alotta
Re: CamelBones: Will hack for food!
On May 6, 2007, at 3:25 PM, Alex Robinson wrote: I wish even more that Apple had picked you up and made CamelBones a first class citizen. Good news: That may still happen. So, why has Apple ignored CamelBones? They asked around internally for sponsor engineers to accept the job of reviewing a scripting bridge for code quality, running compatibility tests, etc. They found volunteers for Python and Ruby early on - but not for Perl. The good news is, there's a volunteer for Perl now too, and the pushed-back release date for Leopard has bought us a little breathing room. So there's still a chance for Perl to be a first class citizen. The bad news is, we arrived late to the party and there's a lot of catching up to do. The key is supporting the .scriptingbridge metadata. Objective-C is very introspective, so finding out about classes and methods at runtime is easy. Scriptingbridge is an XML format that describes the parts of a framework that aren't so easily found at runtime, such as C functions, enums, and globals. This was first introduced in RubyCocoa, and is currently available in the latest pre-release for RubyCocoa. The PyObjC team has agreed to support it as well. I wasn't privy to the conversation inside of Apple, but I get the impression that the tipping point was when they found those two communities had agreed on a common format for this, meaning that Apple could provide very good support for *any* bridge that adopts it, with a single effort. Or maybe they instigated that agreement - I honestly don't know. Regardless, I've agreed to support .scriptingbridge metadata as well - it's a great idea, and I'm not afflicted with NIH syndrome. The .scriptingbridge format and general scheme is public information - I've verified with Apple that it's not NDA'd. And it's not limited to Leopard; I intend to use it for Tiger and Panther versions of CamelBones as well. I can also tell you that Apple has included me on the private mailing list where its development is being organized. Also, I've been given access to the latest up to the minute version of the tool that generates metadata from header files. It's straight off the engineer's desk, newer even than the latest available Leopard build - which I've also been given access to. One thing I can't get into is which specific frameworks have been blessed with the addition of bridging metadata in Leopard. BridgingSupport is public information - how Leopard uses it is not. So don't ask me. :-) What all this means is, first-class scripting support is actually language-neutral, and even though Leopard will be the first OS version to include it, nothing about it will require Leopard. At the edges, specific support for RubyCocoa and PyObjC basically means that their frameworks and project templates are included with Leopard. It would be a nice symbolic gesture for Apple to include such things for CamelBones as well, and very valuable from an advocacy standpoint, but it wouldn't be a show-stopper if developers had to download those pieces separately - it's what you're doing right now. Either way, CamelBones apps will enjoy the same deep level of bridging support that's available to any bridge. Why did the OS X loving bit of the perl community sit by and let PyObjC become the default bridge. I blame the CamelBones management - i.e. myself. Seriously - I've made a lot of mistakes along the way. One of them - a big one - was allowing my own troubles to affect my enthusiasm for CamelBones, and even blaming it for my troubles. Another was not making regular releases. Yet another was not providing adequate docs and examples. I'm working hard to overcome these problems. This thread is an example of how I'm addressing the first. I didn't start by moaning about how CB hasn't made a lot of money, or threatening to stop working on it, as I've done in the past. That habit, I think, has shaken a lot of people's confidence. So I said the simple truth, that I'm in a hard spot, and need to find work and/or donations. I'm releasing far more often recently - approximately monthly. And, I've started adding more examples - the recent SimpleDBI is just the first. How depressing is it that there's not even a mention of perl in this quick round up by John Gruber (himself a keen user of perl)? http://daringfireball.net/2007/02/dynamic_scripting_languages And that's before Rails gets bundled by default with Leopard... In the interest of fairness, that was also before Catalyst was bundled with CamelBones. :-) sherm-- Web Hosting by West Virginians, for West Virginians: http://wv-www.net Cocoa programming in Perl: http://camelbones.sourceforge.net
CamelBones: Will hack for food!
Okay, the subject is sensationalistic - I'm not in danger of starving, and neither are my cats. But, I am less than two weeks away from losing my internet connection and web server. I'm broke and unemployed, or whatever the term is for owning a business that has zero paying customers. I guess that's what I get for living in the sticks - there's apparently as much demand for software developers in WV as there is for evolutionary biologists in Kansas. I need donations to CamelBones. Or web hosting customers. Or consulting clients. Or a plain old-fashioned job. Or something - and I need it soon. sherm-- Web Hosting by West Virginians, for West Virginians: http://wv-www.net Cocoa programming in Perl: http://camelbones.sourceforge.net
