[Mailman-Users] Mailman installation on Solaris 10
I'm beginning to replace the Mailman 2.1.9 installation on Solaris 9 Sparc, which has served us very well for the last two years. The new target machines are Sun Ultra 60's, one running Solaris 10-u4 (8/07) and the other, Solaris 10-u6 (10/08). All that is on either machine is a fresh install of Solaris (full install). While I've been through the drill of building and installing both Python and Mailman on Solaris before, I have a few obsrvations and questions. I went through the Mailman web page to find a download site. Going to Sourceforge offers only 2.12.rc1 unless you click stable on the first screen. I was unable to download either 2.1.11 or 2.1.12 from Sourceforge. That site links to Superb Hosting, which appears to be unresponsive. I had to get the software from the alternative GNU site. Both of the Solaris installs include Python 2.4.4. Whether the Solaris build is something resembling a full build or not, I don't know, but will soon find out unless someone has checked this out before me. In the past, getting anything resembling a full build of Python on Solaris has been a labor of love (porting the build scripts), and I'd prefer not to have to build and install another version of Python. I see Mark Sapiro's mail about incompatibility between 2.1.12rc1 and Python 2.4. My production installations have to have an archive search (not part of Mailman). In the past, we've used htDig 3.1.6, which is decidedly long in tooth, particularly as it requires gcc/g++ 2.95.3 to build (will not build with gcc 3 or above). For one installation, I'll filch the already-built binaries. However, I'll reopen the question of a better (and currently-maintained) search engine. I'm aware of a mail list discussing using Mhonarc and Mnogosearch, but nothing since the last posts to that site (early 2006). Is there something newer and better, or is doing the porting work needed to use Mnogosearch the best alternative available? One issue with the current 2.1.9 installation is performance while searching archives with htDig. We currently have 5gb of archives, and archive searches are very popular with our listers. I have picked up the patches for htDig-Mailman integration for 2.1.11 and assume I'm on my own for 2.1.12, for the present. Unless somebody tells me otherwise, I'll assume that I'm the first installing 2.1.12 on Solaris 10. That will go on the later (current rev) machine. Worth noting that on Solaris 10 10/08, it appears that sun has included the Studio 12 development system, with the c compiler in /usr/bin/cc. While our old nemesis, the BSD stub /usr/bin/cc is still there, a PATH that has /usr/bin before /usr/ucb should find a working cc. The config.pck files currently on the production system are for 2.1.9. If I build 2.1.11 and 2.1.12 as fresh builds and installs (no upgrade) and later copy my 2.1.9 config.pck files into them, will Mailman detect and correct the configuration? Any notes, comments, advice greatly appreciated. Hank -- Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3 Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/ Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/archive%40jab.org Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9
Re: [Mailman-Users] Mailman installation on Solaris 10
Hank van Cleef wrote: I went through the Mailman web page to find a download site. Going to Sourceforge offers only 2.12.rc1 unless you click stable on the first screen. I was unable to download either 2.1.11 or 2.1.12 from Sourceforge. That site links to Superb Hosting, which appears to be unresponsive. I had to get the software from the alternative GNU site. It was really slow when I just tried it, but worked eventually, You can select an alternate mirror on SF. Both of the Solaris installs include Python 2.4.4. Whether the Solaris build is something resembling a full build or not, I don't know, but will soon find out unless someone has checked this out before me. In the past, getting anything resembling a full build of Python on Solaris has been a labor of love (porting the build scripts), and I'd prefer not to have to build and install another version of Python. Configure requires distutils be available. It checks that it can import distutils.errors import distutils.sysconfig and also checks for the presence of the Python.h C header file, normally in /usr/include/pythonx.x/Python.h I see Mark Sapiro's mail about incompatibility between 2.1.12rc1 and Python 2.4. Good. My production server is running 2.1.12rc1 and Python 2.4.3 with the addition of the one patch to Scrubber.py. It is just by coincidence that a post that triggered that problem arrived the same day I upgraded. Just lucky I guess. I plan to upgrade that server soon to Python 2.6.1. I've done everything but 'make install'. It's a good thing I didn't do it before installing 2.1.12rc1 or that issue would have lurked until you found it wink. My production installations have to have an archive search (not part of Mailman). In the past, we've used htDig 3.1.6, which is decidedly long in tooth, particularly as it requires gcc/g++ 2.95.3 to build (will not build with gcc 3 or above). For one installation, I'll filch the already-built binaries. I have installed htDig from CVS http://htdig.cvs.sourceforge.net/htdig/ with gcc 4.1.1. However, I'll reopen the question of a better (and currently-maintained) search engine. I'm aware of a mail list discussing using Mhonarc and Mnogosearch, but nothing since the last posts to that site (early 2006). Is there something newer and better, or is doing the porting work needed to use Mnogosearch the best alternative available? One issue with the current 2.1.9 installation is performance while searching archives with htDig. We currently have 5gb of archives, and archive searches are very popular with our listers. I have picked up the patches for htDig-Mailman integration for 2.1.11 and assume I'm on my own for 2.1.12, for the present. The patches will apply with some 'offsets' and one 'fuzz'. If you want a set that applies clean you can get them at http://www.msapiro.net/mm/index.patch.2.1.12 and http://www.msapiro.net/mm/htdig.patch.2.1.12 (mirrored at http://fog.ccsf.edu/~msapiro/mm/index.patch.2.1.12 and http://fog.ccsf.edu/~msapiro/mm/htdig.patch.2.1.12) There are also two other patches in that directory named 'nightly_htdig' and 'rundig' which apply after the first two and which implement updating the htDig database when possible instead of rebuilding it from scratch every time. Unless somebody tells me otherwise, I'll assume that I'm the first installing 2.1.12 on Solaris 10. That will go on the later (current rev) machine. Worth noting that on Solaris 10 10/08, it appears that sun has included the Studio 12 development system, with the c compiler in /usr/bin/cc. While our old nemesis, the BSD stub /usr/bin/cc is still there, a PATH that has /usr/bin before /usr/ucb should find a working cc. The config.pck files currently on the production system are for 2.1.9. If I build 2.1.11 and 2.1.12 as fresh builds and installs (no upgrade) and later copy my 2.1.9 config.pck files into them, will Mailman detect and correct the configuration? Yes. It will detect that they are old and convert them on the fly. In theory, it will even convert config.db files from Mailman 1.x, but I won't guarantee that that one is error free. -- Mark Sapiro m...@msapiro.netThe highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, Californiabetter use your sense - B. Dylan -- Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3 Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/ Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/archive%40jab.org Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9
Re: [Mailman-Users] Mailman installation on Solaris 10 crashes
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On Feb 2, 2007, at 1:25 AM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: crashing on install of the Japanese and Korean Codecs. I swapped some offlist E-mails with Barry Sapiro and told him that I would I'm almost afraid to ask who Barry Sapiro is. Is that some kind of mashup of me and Mark? :) And another WHOOPS! Another over-the-hill geezer special. But since I saw the backside of the big 70 a while back, I suppose I'm entitled to one once in a while. WHOOPS! What is with the very clear /opt/sfw/lib/python2.3 when I just installed 2.5 and put it in /usr/local/bin? I would additionally make sure /usr/local/bin is first on your $PATH. There is a great deal of discussion (and some religious fervor) on the Solaris newsgroups about having (or refusing to have) a /usr/local directory on a Solaris system. The anti faction has some very strong points. Putting the /usr filesystem on its own filesystem mounted read-only is a good security measure. I bypass the arguments by putting /usr/local on its own filesystem. A better PATH layout for Solaris 9 or 10 would probably end with /usr/ccs/bin:/usr/local/bin:/opt/sfw/bin:/usr/sfw/bin Those directories all have to be added locally to the Solaris distribution defaults. Sun has moved to including more and more of what was known to Unix developers as the GNU suite in Solaris in the /usr/sfw directory, with some GNU things (bash, gzip) in /usr/bin. Time was (Solaris 2.5.1) that the GNU suite was all add-on from packages on the bonus software companion disk. What I'm working out is a suitable layout for a Solaris 10 development system that requires a minimum of jiggery-pokery for compiling various open source software packages. The system that actually runs Mailman in production is a different minimally-configured hardened-up Solaris box. A lot of this is OS-specific and site-specific, and probably discussion here should be limited to getting Python and Mailman installed. An additional (and very well-known) Solaris gotcha is the error line /usr/ucb/cc: language optional software package not installed Evidently, the Solaris Python looks for a cc in the path. /usr/ucb/cc is simply a stub that most Solaris sysadmins rename or move after installation. The Sun Studio 11 native compiler is probably compatible with it, but there is still the objection to using an older Python. It's actually probably the Makefile that's finding /usr/ucb/cc. Pretty well-known failure mode on Solaris. Make sure a usable C compiler (either named gcc or cc wink) is first on your $PATH. No doubt. What I posted was the result of some offlist discussions I had with Mark about problems building Mailman on Solaris that were posted here a week or so ago. I offered to investigate a few of these on a fresh install of Solaris 10 11/06 before I had fully configured the box to my normal layout. Ultimately, that box will be configured to use the Sun development system (Studio 11, has cc and CC wink). There are decisions that a Solaris administrator has to make, such as whether to download and compile sendmail, apache, and bind; or to use the Sun distribution versions. I think that the decision is clear about Python---download and build your own, and configure your system so that it is the Python of choice on your site. (I'll note in passing that I didn't like the looks of the additional compiling in the Python install, and am going to go back to revisit that). Hank -- Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users Mailman FAQ: http://www.python.org/cgi-bin/faqw-mm.py Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/ Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/archive%40jab.org Security Policy: http://www.python.org/cgi-bin/faqw-mm.py?req=showamp;file=faq01.027.htp
Re: [Mailman-Users] Mailman installation on Solaris 10 crashes
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On Feb 2, 2007, at 1:25 AM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: crashing on install of the Japanese and Korean Codecs. I swapped some offlist E-mails with Barry Sapiro and told him that I would I'm almost afraid to ask who Barry Sapiro is. Is that some kind of mashup of me and Mark? :) WHOOPS! What is with the very clear /opt/sfw/lib/python2.3 when I just installed 2.5 and put it in /usr/local/bin? I would additionally make sure /usr/local/bin is first on your $PATH. An additional (and very well-known) Solaris gotcha is the error line /usr/ucb/cc: language optional software package not installed Evidently, the Solaris Python looks for a cc in the path. /usr/ucb/cc is simply a stub that most Solaris sysadmins rename or move after installation. The Sun Studio 11 native compiler is probably compatible with it, but there is still the objection to using an older Python. It's actually probably the Makefile that's finding /usr/ucb/cc. Pretty well-known failure mode on Solaris. Make sure a usable C compiler (either named gcc or cc wink) is first on your $PATH. - -Barry -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.5 (Darwin) iQCVAwUBRcNPeXEjvBPtnXfVAQIYiQP/WF2jmsyk8wPVK8bwF4tWeD88RyEAjK0C sPYZW2PhOqPNyppovUpf2idrxych+WUwnKimU2y0vcFEbLcwqCDQmdLQjNbClkEA E+EK6Q2loPQiRMcTRTU9x04RIjNlVb4rdPlHW/FjSktTICXXFyNrPpYaBQ1bugtY gu+81Nqj0OI= =no6x -END PGP SIGNATURE- -- Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users Mailman FAQ: http://www.python.org/cgi-bin/faqw-mm.py Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/ Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/archive%40jab.org Security Policy: http://www.python.org/cgi-bin/faqw-mm.py?req=showamp;file=faq01.027.htp
[Mailman-Users] Mailman installation on Solaris 10 crashes
A couple of weeks ago there were two or three posts about Mailman crashing on install of the Japanese and Korean Codecs. I swapped some offlist E-mails with Barry Sapiro and told him that I would investigate this for him when I did a fresh install of Solaris 10 on a box to be used as a Mailman mail server. Accordingly, this afternoon I did a default Jumpstart install of the Solaris 10 entire package on an Ultra 60 and added a gcc 3.3 development system from a Solaris Software Companion disk. One additional item was to set the install default path to pick up needed directories that are not included in the Solaris base install. PATH=$PATH:/usr/ccs/bin:/usr/sfw/bin:/usr/local/bin:/opt/sfw/bin The last three directories in that order are significant. I did a build and install of Python 2.5 in /usr/local, and configured Mailman with the needed mail and cgi gid statments, then ran a make. Make install failed. The key section in the installation output is this: (cd ./$p ; umask 02 ; PYTHONPATH=/usr/local/mailman/pythonlib /usr/sfw/bin/p ython setup.py --quiet install --install-lib /usr/local/mailman/pythonlib --ins tall-purelib /usr/local/mailman/pythonlib --install-data /usr/local/mailman/pyt honlib); \ done /usr/sfw/lib/python2.3/distutils/dist.py:213: UserWarning: 'licence' distribution option is deprecated; use 'license' warnings.warn(msg) /usr/ucb/cc: language optional software package not installed error: command '/usr/sfw/lib/python2.3/pycc' failed with exit status 1 *** Error code 1 make: Fatal error: Command failed for target `install-packages' Current working directory /usr/local/src/mailman-2.1.9/misc WHOOPS! What is with the very clear /opt/sfw/lib/python2.3 when I just installed 2.5 and put it in /usr/local/bin? Yes, Sun has included an older version of Python in the Solaris 10 distribution. To build and install with a locally-built Python, you have to put --with-python=/path/to/python as a flag to the configure script. Doing so produced a clean make and install. Note that while the fact that the wrong version of Python is not clearly evident until the installation crashes, the make step is also done with the same version. As of this writing, I don't know what issues this raises for Mailman at runtime. Nor do I know what issues are raised if the offending packages are removed. The actual version reported is 2.3.3, and pkginfo includes the notation GNOME, so the runtime, at least, has some involvement if you are using the gnome desktop. An additional (and very well-known) Solaris gotcha is the error line /usr/ucb/cc: language optional software package not installed Evidently, the Solaris Python looks for a cc in the path. /usr/ucb/cc is simply a stub that most Solaris sysadmins rename or move after installation. The Sun Studio 11 native compiler is probably compatible with it, but there is still the objection to using an older Python. Hank -- Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users Mailman FAQ: http://www.python.org/cgi-bin/faqw-mm.py Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/ Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/archive%40jab.org Security Policy: http://www.python.org/cgi-bin/faqw-mm.py?req=showamp;file=faq01.027.htp
