Re: [Mailman-Users] mailman running very slow

2012-10-28 Thread Stephen J. Turnbull 
Lindsay Haisley writes:

 > I would have thought that everyone who works with or develops any
 > application or server that handles e-mail would know about swaks.

*They* probably do.  *I* am an economics professor[1] who moonlights
on programmer's editors and host admin for one such project. ;-)

Footnotes: 
[1]  With a strong interest in self-organizing systems such as
Internet standards and open source software development projects.

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Re: [Mailman-Users] mailman running very slow

2012-10-26 Thread Lindsay Haisley 
On Fri, 2012-10-26 at 14:02 +0900, Stephen J. Turnbull wrote:
> Lindsay Haisley writes:
>  > I would run swaks from the same box on which you run Mailman, and use -f
>  > with whatever Mailman uses as the envelope sender address for
>  > posts,
> 
> Wow, that's cool!  Thanks for the tip!

I would have thought that everyone who works with or develops any
application or server that handles e-mail would know about swaks.  But
then I kind of live in a bubble out here in the boonies of Texas.

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Re: [Mailman-Users] mailman running very slow

2012-10-25 Thread Stephen J. Turnbull 
Lindsay Haisley writes:

 > I would run swaks from the same box on which you run Mailman, and use -f
 > with whatever Mailman uses as the envelope sender address for
 > posts,

Wow, that's cool!  Thanks for the tip!

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Re: [Mailman-Users] mailman running very slow

2012-10-25 Thread Lindsay Haisley 
On Thu, 2012-10-25 at 15:10 -0400, Richard Shetron wrote:
> What arguments do you use to pretend to be mailman delivering to postfix 
> with swaks?

I would run swaks from the same box on which you run Mailman, and use -f
with whatever Mailman uses as the envelope sender address for posts,  If
you have VERP personalization turned on, this would be a "bounces"
address.  Send to a sample (test) address that's on the list, and use -s
with the FQN of the server which your Mailman installation uses.

All of this assumes, of course, that you're using postfix as a SMTP
server (DELIVERY_MODULE = 'SMTPDirect' as opposed to
DELIVERY_MODULE='Sendmail').  If you're using the latter, then swaks
won't help you.

BTW, it would be a good idea if you'd cc questions such as this to the
list.  There are some very good minds on the list who might well chime
in helpfully, and/or critique my response.

> I'm running on too much stress, too little sleep/food ;)
> 
> 
> On 10/24/2012 2:17 PM, Lindsay Haisley wrote:
> > On Wed, 2012-10-24 at 11:06 -0700, Brad Knowles wrote:
> >>> Another very useful tool for analyzing mail issues is swaks.
> >>
> >> Now that's a tool I had not heard of before.  I'm assuming you mean
> >> the tool at ?
> >>
> > That's the one.  I used to test SMTP stuff by using telnet to port 25
> > and talking to an SMTP server, but swaks does all the lifting for you,
> > and gives you a terminal display of the entire dialog in real time, so
> > you can see where a SMTP transaction is hanging, or timing out, or
> > whatever.  It's written in perl, and self-docs with a man-page like help
> > system.  It has a ton of useful options, and is truly, as advertised,
> > "the Swiss army knife for SMTP".  As a mail admin, I couldn't be without
> > it :)
> >


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Re: [Mailman-Users] mailman running very slow

2012-10-24 Thread Barry Warsaw 
On Oct 24, 2012, at 11:14 PM, Adam McGreggor wrote:

>On Wed, Oct 24, 2012 at 11:06:28AM -0700, Brad Knowles wrote:
>> On Oct 24, 2012, at 9:52 AM, Lindsay Haisley  wrote:
>> > Another very useful tool for analyzing mail issues is swaks.
>> 
>> Now that's a tool I had not heard of before.  I'm assuming you mean the tool 
>> at ?
>
>swaks truly is a lovely tool.

`apt-get install swaks`

Wow, indeed.  Very cool.  That'll make a nice Mailman 3 testing tool.

Cheers,
-Barry
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Re: [Mailman-Users] mailman running very slow

2012-10-24 Thread Adam McGreggor 
On Wed, Oct 24, 2012 at 11:06:28AM -0700, Brad Knowles wrote:
> On Oct 24, 2012, at 9:52 AM, Lindsay Haisley  wrote:
> > Another very useful tool for analyzing mail issues is swaks.
> 
> Now that's a tool I had not heard of before.  I'm assuming you mean the tool 
> at ?

swaks truly is a lovely tool.


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Re: [Mailman-Users] mailman running very slow

2012-10-24 Thread Richard Shetron 

I played with some settings and did some restarts and things look better:

Oct 24 17:13:22 2012 (5464) 
<7.0.1.0.0.20121023125107.046bd...@marchreport.com> smtp to 
marchreport_daily_alert_ctc01 for 3379 recips, completed in 151.441 seconds
Oct 24 17:16:11 2012 (5464) 
<7.0.1.0.0.20121023125107.046bd...@marchreport.com> smtp to 
marchreport_daily_alert_cta31 for 3826 recips, completed in 169.111 seconds
Oct 24 17:25:44 2012 (5464) 
<7.0.1.0.0.20121023125107.046bd...@marchreport.com> smtp to 
marchreport_daily_alert_ctc02 for 7202 recips, completed in 572.629 seconds
Oct 24 17:29:32 2012 (5464) 
<7.0.1.0.0.20121023125107.046bd...@marchreport.com> smtp to 
marchreport_daily_alert_ctc03 for 3694 recips, completed in 227.642 seconds


Thanks!
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Re: [Mailman-Users] mailman running very slow

2012-10-24 Thread Lindsay Haisley 
On Wed, 2012-10-24 at 11:06 -0700, Brad Knowles wrote:
> > Another very useful tool for analyzing mail issues is swaks.
> 
> Now that's a tool I had not heard of before.  I'm assuming you mean
> the tool at ?
> 
That's the one.  I used to test SMTP stuff by using telnet to port 25
and talking to an SMTP server, but swaks does all the lifting for you,
and gives you a terminal display of the entire dialog in real time, so
you can see where a SMTP transaction is hanging, or timing out, or
whatever.  It's written in perl, and self-docs with a man-page like help
system.  It has a ton of useful options, and is truly, as advertised,
"the Swiss army knife for SMTP".  As a mail admin, I couldn't be without
it :)

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Re: [Mailman-Users] mailman running very slow

2012-10-24 Thread Brad Knowles 
On Oct 24, 2012, at 9:52 AM, Lindsay Haisley  wrote:

>> That seem to be a very long time for processing a list.
>> 
> Yes, that's a long time.  If nothing has changed in your Mailman
> installation, I'd guess you're looking at an issue with the SMTP server,
> or possibly a network issue.  A look at your mail server logs and the
> timestamp data therein should give you a finer-grained look at the
> timing of SMTP events associated with Mailman's outgoing posts.

One thing I've found in the past is that frequently the mailing list 
administration and the SMTP MTA administration is done by different teams, and 
when one side asks the other if anything has changed the answer will frequently 
be "No, nothing at all".  However, in many cases, there were changes made that 
were felt to be so minor that they were trivial and wouldn't count as "real 
changes".  Nevertheless, many so-called "trivial" changes can frequently have 
impacts far above and beyond what was anticipated.

I'd encourage the OP to also check out their DNS caching resolver servers, to 
see if they've recently had any problems or made any changes (even apparently 
trivial ones).

> Another very useful tool for analyzing mail issues is swaks.

Now that's a tool I had not heard of before.  I'm assuming you mean the tool at 
?

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Re: [Mailman-Users] mailman running very slow

2012-10-24 Thread Mark Sapiro 
Richard Shetron wrote:
>
>Also mailing from a week ago are starting to come through, but I thought 
>I'd removed all of them from both the mailq and from mailman.  I thought 
>I new how to cancel/remove older mailings, but it seems not.  How do you 
>cancel old mailings?  I've cleared the postfix queue and I thought I'd 
>cleared the mailman qfiles.


If you removed all the entries from Mailman's queue files or at least
those in the out/ and retry/ queues, no old messages should be coming
from Mailman except for messages that were held for moderation and
have been subsequently approved.


>I'm also occasionally getting the following error in the smtp-failure log:
>
>Oct 24 06:00:01 2012 (29638) Low level smtp error: (4, 'Interrupted 
>system call'), msgid:<7.0.1.0.0.20121016133607.0469b...@marchreport.com>


See the FAQ at .


>We're using ubuntu with postfix.
>
>python processes:
>
[...]
>mailman   4585  0.0  0.0   9728  6904 ?S06:00   0:08 
>/usr/bin/python /var/lib/mailman/bin/qrunner --runner=MaildirRunner:0:1 -s


Why are you running MaildirRunner? are you actually using maildir
delivery to Mailman?


>another error in smtp-failure:
>
>Oct 24 09:37:18 2012 (4582) All recipients refused: {'mmm5...@aol.com': 
>(503, '5.5.1 Error: nested MAIL command')}, msgid: 
><7.0.1.0.0.20121016133607.0469b...@marchreport.com>


This indicates some serious confusion in Python's smtplib.

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Re: [Mailman-Users] mailman running very slow

2012-10-24 Thread Lindsay Haisley 
On Wed, 2012-10-24 at 09:54 -0400, Richard Shetron wrote:
> Oct 23 13:42:13 2012 (19673) 
> <7.0.1.0.0.20121016133607.0469b...@marchreport.com> smtp to 
> marchreport_daily_alert_ctc10 for 2 recips, completed in 168.029
> seconds
> 
> That seem to be a very long time for processing a list.
> 
Yes, that's a long time.  If nothing has changed in your Mailman
installation, I'd guess you're looking at an issue with the SMTP server,
or possibly a network issue.  A look at your mail server logs and the
timestamp data therein should give you a finer-grained look at the
timing of SMTP events associated with Mailman's outgoing posts.

Another very useful tool for analyzing mail issues is swaks.

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[Mailman-Users] mailman running very slow

2012-10-24 Thread Richard Shetron 

Yes I've tried to research via google, etc.  I've run through the page at:
http://wiki.list.org/display/DOC/4.78+Troubleshooting-+No+mail+going+out+to+lists+members

I'm running ubuntu with mailman 2.1.14 and things seem to be taking 
forever.  Until a few days ago things were running fine.  There have 
been no config/system changes.


One of the things I'm seeing is is the smtp log file:

Oct 23 13:42:13 2012 (19673) 
<7.0.1.0.0.20121016133607.0469b...@marchreport.com> smtp to 
marchreport_daily_alert_ctc10 for 2 recips, completed in 168.029 seconds


That seem to be a very long time for processing a list.

Also mailing from a week ago are starting to come through, but I thought 
I'd removed all of them from both the mailq and from mailman.  I thought 
I new how to cancel/remove older mailings, but it seems not.  How do you 
cancel old mailings?  I've cleared the postfix queue and I thought I'd 
cleared the mailman qfiles.


I'm also occasionally getting the following error in the smtp-failure log:

Oct 24 06:00:01 2012 (29638) Low level smtp error: (4, 'Interrupted 
system call'), msgid:<7.0.1.0.0.20121016133607.0469b...@marchreport.com>


We're using ubuntu with postfix.

python processes:

mailman   4576  0.0  0.0   9608  4792 ?Ss   06:00   0:00 
/usr/bin/python /var/lib/mailman/bin/mailmanctl -s start
mailman   4577  0.0  0.0   9552  6456 ?S06:00   0:00 
/usr/bin/python /var/lib/mailman/bin/qrunner --runner=ArchRunner:0:1 -s
mailman   4578  0.0  0.1  17420 14696 ?S06:00   0:01 
/usr/bin/python /var/lib/mailman/bin/qrunner --runner=BounceRunner:0:1 -s
mailman   4579  0.0  0.0   9528  6436 ?S06:00   0:00 
/usr/bin/python /var/lib/mailman/bin/qrunner --runner=CommandRunner:0:1 -s
mailman   4580  0.0  0.0   9544  6444 ?S06:00   0:00 
/usr/bin/python /var/lib/mailman/bin/qrunner --runner=IncomingRunner:0:1 -s
mailman   4581  0.0  0.0   9520  6488 ?S06:00   0:00 
/usr/bin/python /var/lib/mailman/bin/qrunner --runner=NewsRunner:0:1 -s
mailman   4582  0.2  0.1  14628 11964 ?S06:00   0:25 
/usr/bin/python /var/lib/mailman/bin/qrunner --runner=OutgoingRunner:0:1 -s
mailman   4583  0.0  0.1  12332  9688 ?S06:00   0:00 
/usr/bin/python /var/lib/mailman/bin/qrunner --runner=VirginRunner:0:1 -s
mailman   4584  0.0  0.0   9512  6448 ?S06:00   0:00 
/usr/bin/python /var/lib/mailman/bin/qrunner --runner=RetryRunner:0:1 -s
mailman   4585  0.0  0.0   9728  6904 ?S06:00   0:08 
/usr/bin/python /var/lib/mailman/bin/qrunner --runner=MaildirRunner:0:1 -s



another error in smtp-failure:

Oct 24 09:37:18 2012 (4582) All recipients refused: {'mmm5...@aol.com': 
(503, '5.5.1 Error: nested MAIL command')}, msgid: 
<7.0.1.0.0.20121016133607.0469b...@marchreport.com>


The SMTP settings in mm_cfg.py:

MAILMAN_SITE_LIST = 'mailman'
SMTPPORT = 587
#SMTPHOST = 'mail.marchreport.com'  Just did this change from name to ip
SMTPHOST = '71.244.124.123'

postfix listens on 587:
master.cf:587  inet  n   -   n   -   120   smtpd
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