Re: a case for native bounding asterisk support

2020-07-03 Thread John Gruber 
How could Markdown possibly change this now?

If you’re writing in a forum where bounding asterisks as literal asterisks are 
a thing you want, then you don’t want Markdown.

—J.G.
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Re: a case for native bounding asterisk support

2020-06-04 Thread Jason Davies 

On 4 Jun 2020, at 10:23, Jason Davies wrote:

like \*this\*  if they want them to be visible (it will be interesting 
to see if my markdown emailer passes that on safely to you all!


ah well, never mind;) [seen it on my phone, passed on the slashes]

Cheers,

Jason
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Re: a case for native bounding asterisk support

2020-06-04 Thread Jason Davies 
Just to throw in another voice saying this is never going to work: 
people talk as if these things are centuries old traditions but they're 
not. When people used typewriters, they underlined to mean bold; 
asterisks have been used in a number of ways since the invention and no 
one has ever had the power to dictate how things should be. I was 
using*to imply emphasis or a change of register long before markdown 
came along. Using italics is a way of changing the register of the text, 
and you still have to interpret that within the context of the genre you 
are writing in.  in poetry it means one thing, in academic texts another 
and so on.  Better to explain what they mean in your particular context 
as and when it arises than to try to move the whole world an inch to the 
left.


 I'm struggling to understand why people can't escape asterisks like 
\*this\*  if they want them to be visible (it will be interesting to see 
if my markdown emailer passes that on safely to you all!


On 4 Jun 2020, at 3:22, Christian Perry wrote:

One thing I'll add, if that's alright, when it comes to transitioning 
standards.




It wouldn't have to break anything to update MD syntax: simply present 
it as a new version, and note that certain conventions from old 
version are being deprecated. Put it on LTS and give the industry 15 
years to adapt (I'm serious about this).




Companies who want v1.1, with native bounding asterisk support, can 
transition sooner if they want.



Cheers,

Jason
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Re: a case for native bounding asterisk support

2020-06-04 Thread Wayne Brissette 



Allan Odgaard wrote on 2020-06-03 21:47:

nMark needed?”.

In short, it mentions how there were/are many diverging 
implementations of markdown, and they are trying to make one universal 
standard, they have been at it for five years, and yet we still do not 
have a standard that all implementations conform to.


Not really their fault to be fair. The issue is while they have tried to 
come out with a standard, a lot of people simply say, "I'll just use MD 
and these extensions that do 'x'". And there in lies the issue (along 
with Gruber himself who didn't want a standard and told folks to make 
their own if they didn't like what he came up with).


I like that the DITA community said, we have a standard, we need a 
standard if we're going to do anything with markdown, so they went with 
CommonMark. But this isn't the case many times because people have 
implemented things and don't want to change them now.


-Wayne
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Re: Markdown-Discuss Digest, Vol 185, Issue 1

2020-06-03 Thread Benoit Perdu 

I agree with Allan Odgaard on this:


But it?s obviously far too late to do anything about it now, as there
are thousands of parsers that use this convention, not to mention the
untold amount of user content that would render incorrectly, if the core
syntax of markdown was redefined.


Small businesses around me have used markdown (and Michel Fortin's 
Markdown extra) for years for web edition, and changing this old 
behaviour is bound to break many pages.


Nice seeing the list is alive anyway.

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Re: a case for native bounding asterisk support

2020-06-03 Thread Allan Odgaard 

On 4 Jun 2020, at 9:22, Christian Perry wrote:

It wouldn't have to break anything to update MD syntax: simply present 
it
as a new version, and note that certain conventions from old version 
are
being deprecated. Put it on LTS and give the industry 15 years to 
adapt

(I'm serious about this).


There is no authoritative standard that people follow when it comes to 
implementing markdown.


The closet thing is CommonMark: https://commonmark.org/

I suggest you read their “Why is CommonMark needed?”.

In short, it mentions how there were/are many diverging implementations 
of markdown, and they are trying to make one universal standard, they 
have been at it for five years, and yet we still do not have a standard 
that all implementations conform to.


And now you want to make a v1.1 of this non-existing standard that will 
be incompatible with every document out there?


I get that you are passionate about this, but you are approaching it in 
the wrong way.


You cannot centrally redefine how markdown should be interpreted, that 
is just not possible because none of the tens of thousands of people who 
have written markdown inspired parsers listen to a central body for how 
they should interpret/render text.


If you have a problem with the inability to use asterisks in Slack or 
similar, you need to contact the developers of that software and explain 
that there must be a way to opt out of automatically interpreting 
asterisks as emphasized.


Even if you did manage to get Gruber to update his website to say 
emphasized should be done with double-bangs, Slack would *not* change 
anything.

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Re: a case for native bounding asterisk support

2020-06-03 Thread Christian Perry 
One thing I'll add, if that's alright, when it comes to transitioning
standards.

It wouldn't have to break anything to update MD syntax: simply present it
as a new version, and note that certain conventions from old version are
being deprecated. Put it on LTS and give the industry 15 years to adapt
(I'm serious about this).

Companies who want v1.1, with native bounding asterisk support, can
transition sooner if they want.





On Wed, Jun 3, 2020 at 7:07 PM Christian Perry 
wrote:

> Well what *else* could it mean, whether it's true in one's groups or not?
>
> On Wed, Jun 3, 2020 at 7:05 PM Max Harmony  wrote:
>
>>
>>
>> > On 03 Jun 2020, at 21.55, Christian Perry 
>> wrote:
>> >
>> > And when we're talking about UGC in particular, the other uses of
>> bounding asterisks are much, much, much more common than the urge to
>> emphasize -- yet they depend upon the asterisks being displayed as-is.
>>
>> While that may be true *within your groups*, I don't think it's accurate
>> *universally*.
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Re: a case for native bounding asterisk support

2020-06-03 Thread Christian Perry 
Well what *else* could it mean, whether it's true in one's groups or not?

On Wed, Jun 3, 2020 at 7:05 PM Max Harmony  wrote:

>
>
> > On 03 Jun 2020, at 21.55, Christian Perry 
> wrote:
> >
> > And when we're talking about UGC in particular, the other uses of
> bounding asterisks are much, much, much more common than the urge to
> emphasize -- yet they depend upon the asterisks being displayed as-is.
>
> While that may be true *within your groups*, I don't think it's accurate
> *universally*.
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Re: a case for native bounding asterisk support

2020-06-03 Thread Max Harmony 


> On 03 Jun 2020, at 21.55, Christian Perry  
> wrote:
> 
> And when we're talking about UGC in particular, the other uses of bounding 
> asterisks are much, much, much more common than the urge to emphasize -- yet 
> they depend upon the asterisks being displayed as-is.

While that may be true *within your groups*, I don't think it's accurate 
*universally*.


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Re: a case for native bounding asterisk support

2020-06-03 Thread Christian Perry 
Respectfully, I don't think it's too late at all.

If I read your response correctly, a redefinition of syntax (in the case of
asterisks) would render user content "incorrectly." By incorrectly, you
mean that the content would be unformatted, displaying asterisks literally.

My understanding of the MD specs is that they were designed to parse
asterisks according to an already widespread convention. (My original
argument was incorrect in this respect -- this is indeed a use case with
precedent, equally alongside the others that I mentioned.) If asterisks
returned like bookends to their phrases, their understood meaning would
remain intact by those who read them. If you don't understand *exactly*
what I mean, then reread this sentence.

The edge case of bounding asterisks is that they're human-parseable when
displayed literally. And when we're talking about UGC in particular, the
other uses of bounding asterisks are much, much, much more common than the
urge to emphasize -- yet they depend upon the asterisks being displayed
as-is. (Emoting within fandom cultures is the main use case for which I'm
advocating: *tries to do something, gets frustrated when it makes it seem
like I'm formatting my text instead*)

Tens of millions of people use bounding asterisks to emote, every day --
but their choices of platforms that support this syntax has dwindled
precipitously due to auto-parsing. There is every bit of a case to be made
for markdown being the *cause* of incorrectly formatted text, when one
limits the scope to how real users talk to each other every day.

Maybe a separate set of guidelines for content platforms would be
appropriate. I see this as the only change that would need to be made. And
I assure you that if asterisks are shown just as they're written, it will
be seen as usage both intentional and understood, rather than incorrect.




On Wed, Jun 3, 2020 at 6:36 PM Allan Odgaard <
[email protected]> wrote:

> On 4 Jun 2020, at 5:29, Christian Perry wrote:
>
> > To move the conversation forward, I propose an alternative markdown
> > italicized syntax: *bounding double exclamation marks*.
> >
> > For example: Huzzah, we can !!finally!! use bounding asterisks again!
> > *celebrates with much rejoicing*
>
> The widespread convention in “my circles” prior to Markdown (mailing
> lists related to the Amiga), was *bold*, /italic/, and _underline_.
>
> Curiously Markdown appropriated the convention for both *bold* and
> _underline_ as italic (emphasized).
>
> But it’s obviously far too late to do anything about it now, as there
> are thousands of parsers that use this convention, not to mention the
> untold amount of user content that would render incorrectly, if the core
> syntax of markdown was redefined.
>
> Instead you need to lobby the various online communication platforms not
> to force markdown upon you as the only markup language, at least they
> should offer you a way to disable it.
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Re: a case for native bounding asterisk support

2020-06-03 Thread Allan Odgaard 

On 4 Jun 2020, at 5:29, Christian Perry wrote:


To move the conversation forward, I propose an alternative markdown
italicized syntax: *bounding double exclamation marks*.

For example: Huzzah, we can !!finally!! use bounding asterisks again!
*celebrates with much rejoicing*


The widespread convention in “my circles” prior to Markdown (mailing 
lists related to the Amiga), was *bold*, /italic/, and _underline_.


Curiously Markdown appropriated the convention for both *bold* and 
_underline_ as italic (emphasized).


But it’s obviously far too late to do anything about it now, as there 
are thousands of parsers that use this convention, not to mention the 
untold amount of user content that would render incorrectly, if the core 
syntax of markdown was redefined.


Instead you need to lobby the various online communication platforms not 
to force markdown upon you as the only markup language, at least they 
should offer you a way to disable it.

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"Re:"

2019-07-04 Thread Kaing Someth 



Sent from my iPhone
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Re: Responsive images and markdown

2019-03-31 Thread Tom Humiston 
Just a follow-up note to readers of this thread:

When I said that I "use post-processing in my PHP to rewrite footnote links (so 
that they don't conflict with those of other blog posts on the same page)", it 
was an unwarranted slander against PHP Markdown Extra.

I happened to re-read the [documentation][1] and discovered Michel Fortin has 
already built a config option into MDE, called 'fn_id_prefix', that allows one 
to pass an identifier for each blog post that is processed.

[1]: https://michelf.ca/projects/php-markdown/configuration/#markdown-extra

Cheers,
TH

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Re: Responsive images and markdown

2019-03-31 Thread Sherwood Botsford 
You got it.

I ran it by here to check to see if someone had already invented this
particular wheel.

I work *really* hard to keep content and presentation separate.  You can
easily get so wrapped up in tweaking presentation.

So my presentation is all done with CSS.  My only concession are the 
tags that modify the flow.  So:

.picfull is 95% of the container wide.  Used for a banner pic at the top of
the page, or at the foot of the page, sometimes used as a section separator
on a long page.
.pic, pic3, pic6 are 40%, 30% and 60% of the container width, and float
left.  picr, pic3r and pic6r do the same for the right.

I do have to be careful to not put two that float on the same side too
close together, or they stack up.  When that happens, I just move them both
into the same 

Nearly everything is sized in rem or in percentages.  Makes for a
reasonably responsive website.

But I'm finding that a LOT of my web traffic is coming from mobile devices.
(about 40%)  Given that my web site is marginal for a mobile phone in
portrait, I need to make two signficant upgrades.

One is to deliver smaller/more tightly cropped images to mobile devices.

The other is to come up with a cleaner menu on mobile devices.

Regards

Sherwood



On Sat, 30 Mar 2019 at 21:35, Tom Humiston  wrote:

> Okay, Sherwood, I think I'm getting it.
>
> You've got your site source in Markdown format. You want to change the
> images to HTML picture elements, each referring to three files that have a
> standardized naming scheme.
>
> So you're working on how to do the text manipulations with Perl. And you
> wondered if anyone here has a better way to come at it or had already got a
> tool for the job.
>
> I thought you wanted to represent in Markdown syntax _which_ images to
> manipulate and/or their _dimension data_. And then run a script to make the
> change.
>
> Sorry I can't help with Perl. Stack Overflow or a Perl discussion site is
> sure to have folk who can.
>
> I hadn't heard of Template Toolkit; thanks for that. For running my sites
> I use [Void] as a backbone and build it out with tweaks and expansions to
> the PHP and CSS as needed.
>
> [Void]: https://github.com/josephernest/void
>
>
> Cheers,
> Thomas
>
>
>
> > On 30 Mar 2019, at 10:56 AM, Sherwood Botsford 
> wrote:
> >
> > My parser doesn't support that extra syntax, and I don't understand perl
> well enough to swap parsers in Template Toolkit.
> >
> > I'm not sure how it helps me.  While I can add attributes this way, I
> still need to rewrite image.jpg as a series of strings, image-S.jpg;
> image-M.jpg; and image-L.jpg
> >
> > Another key aspect of this: My website at present has 300 pages in it.
> A sed script to turn  to  is a lot
> easier than editing every image reference.
> >
> >
> > Regards
> >
> > Sherwood
> >
> >
> >
> > On Fri, 29 Mar 2019 at 20:41, Tom Humiston  wrote:
> > Maybe I misunderstand you but I think one or the other of these will
> work:
> >
> >
> > ![Alt text here](/path/to/image.jpg){.parse_me}
> >
> > ![Alt text here](/path/to/image.jpg '700 500 50 10 138, 1400 1000
> 100 50 416')
> >
> >
> > The latter example is standard Markdown, the former adds a class in the
> manner of PHP Markdown Extra (and other parsers as well, I think).
> >
> > If you post-process, what you'll parse isn't much different from that:
> >
> >
> > 
> >
> > 
> >
> >
> > Whether you parse Markdown or HTML, all your script needs to look for is
> a class (or title) such as 'parse_me' OR a title consisting of numbers.
> Assuming that the filenames to be generated all follow the same pattern.
> >
> > > So all I need to do is write a code snippet that turns
> > >
> > > ![Alt text here](/path/to/image.jpg) into  the corresponding set of
> picture and src image tags.
> >
> >
> > Yup, I think we're just talking about two different ways of marking the
> images that your snippet will parse.
> >
> > HTH,
> > T
> >
> >
> >
> > > On 29 Mar 2019, at 7:44 AM, Sherwood Botsford 
> wrote:
> > >
> > >
> > > Reason I'm more inclined to preprocess is as follows:
> > >
> > > Markdown is visually simpler to parse.
> > >
> > > In template toolkit, I create the navigation system, using a 200 line
> TT2 script.  It's messy.  TT2 calls a markdown plugin.
> > >
> > > By using the  versus  I have a clear flag to identify where
> I need to work.  I think this will be simpler to do without going off the
> rails.
> > >
> > > So all I need to do is write a code snippet that turns
> > >
> > > ![Alt text here](/path/to/image.jpg) into  the corresponding set of
> picture and src image tags.
> > >
> > > If I use a variable for the parameters to pass to the srcset criteria,
> then I can change this once for the entire site.
> > >
> > > It will mean creating at least 2 additional images for each currently
> used image.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Regards
> > >
> > > Sherwood
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > On Wed, 27 Mar 2019 at 17:07, Tom Humiston 
> wrote:
> > > Sherwood, great question and well laid out. If

Re: Responsive images and markdown

2019-03-30 Thread Tom Humiston 
Okay, Sherwood, I think I'm getting it.

You've got your site source in Markdown format. You want to change the images 
to HTML picture elements, each referring to three files that have a 
standardized naming scheme.

So you're working on how to do the text manipulations with Perl. And you 
wondered if anyone here has a better way to come at it or had already got a 
tool for the job.

I thought you wanted to represent in Markdown syntax _which_ images to 
manipulate and/or their _dimension data_. And then run a script to make the 
change.

Sorry I can't help with Perl. Stack Overflow or a Perl discussion site is sure 
to have folk who can.

I hadn't heard of Template Toolkit; thanks for that. For running my sites I use 
[Void] as a backbone and build it out with tweaks and expansions to the PHP and 
CSS as needed.

[Void]: https://github.com/josephernest/void


Cheers,
Thomas



> On 30 Mar 2019, at 10:56 AM, Sherwood Botsford  wrote:
> 
> My parser doesn't support that extra syntax, and I don't understand perl well 
> enough to swap parsers in Template Toolkit.
> 
> I'm not sure how it helps me.  While I can add attributes this way, I still 
> need to rewrite image.jpg as a series of strings, image-S.jpg; image-M.jpg; 
> and image-L.jpg
> 
> Another key aspect of this: My website at present has 300 pages in it.  A sed 
> script to turn  to  is a lot easier 
> than editing every image reference.  
> 
> 
> Regards
> 
> Sherwood
> 
> 
> 
> On Fri, 29 Mar 2019 at 20:41, Tom Humiston  wrote:
> Maybe I misunderstand you but I think one or the other of these will work:
> 
> 
> ![Alt text here](/path/to/image.jpg){.parse_me}
> 
> ![Alt text here](/path/to/image.jpg '700 500 50 10 138, 1400 1000 100 50 
> 416')
> 
> 
> The latter example is standard Markdown, the former adds a class in the 
> manner of PHP Markdown Extra (and other parsers as well, I think).
> 
> If you post-process, what you'll parse isn't much different from that:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Whether you parse Markdown or HTML, all your script needs to look for is a 
> class (or title) such as 'parse_me' OR a title consisting of numbers. 
> Assuming that the filenames to be generated all follow the same pattern.
> 
> > So all I need to do is write a code snippet that turns
> > 
> > ![Alt text here](/path/to/image.jpg) into  the corresponding set of picture 
> > and src image tags.
> 
> 
> Yup, I think we're just talking about two different ways of marking the 
> images that your snippet will parse.
> 
> HTH,
> T
> 
> 
> 
> > On 29 Mar 2019, at 7:44 AM, Sherwood Botsford  wrote:
> > 
> > 
> > Reason I'm more inclined to preprocess is as follows:
> > 
> > Markdown is visually simpler to parse.
> > 
> > In template toolkit, I create the navigation system, using a 200 line TT2 
> > script.  It's messy.  TT2 calls a markdown plugin.
> > 
> > By using the  versus  I have a clear flag to identify where I 
> > need to work.  I think this will be simpler to do without going off the 
> > rails.
> > 
> > So all I need to do is write a code snippet that turns
> > 
> > ![Alt text here](/path/to/image.jpg) into  the corresponding set of picture 
> > and src image tags.
> > 
> > If I use a variable for the parameters to pass to the srcset criteria, then 
> > I can change this once for the entire site.
> > 
> > It will mean creating at least 2 additional images for each currently used 
> > image.
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Regards
> > 
> > Sherwood
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > On Wed, 27 Mar 2019 at 17:07, Tom Humiston  wrote:
> > Sherwood, great question and well laid out. If a good solution comes up 
> > I'll probably want it as well.
> > 
> > My idea is to _post-process_ the HTML output to convert marked data into a 
> > picture element, rather than to construct a picture up front that can 
> > withstand parsing from Markdown into HTML. In the source text, I suggest 
> > cramming the image's source data into the image's title attribute, which 
> > then gets unpacked in the post-processing.
> > 
> > I wrote the following as I was working out the idea.
> > 
> > ---
> > 
> > I haven't become familiar with the `` element but I get the idea 
> > from what you've presented. As for the CSS presentation, fancier things are 
> > of course possible but that doesn't change the need for well-structured 
> > content and good markup.
> > 
> > Like you, I've got no Javascript background, and I'm happy enough to keep 
> > it that way. In fact I'm not much of a programmer at all, which may be an 
> > advantage as I try to always empathize with the non-technical writers and 
> > readers.
> > 
> > So I'm looking at the data salad that supports 'picture' and thinking it 
> > hardly fits into standard prose, and I think one way to come at it is, 
> > firstly, to pick the appropriate existing Markdown that will tuck the 
> > structured data into a place it would pose no harm if visible to readers, 
> > and, secondly, to write a script that will _post-process_ the HTML and 
> > rewrite

Re: Responsive images and markdown

2019-03-30 Thread Sherwood Botsford 
My parser doesn't support that extra syntax, and I don't understand perl
well enough to swap parsers in Template Toolkit.

I'm not sure how it helps me.  While I can add attributes this way, I still
need to rewrite image.jpg as a series of strings, image-S.jpg; image-M.jpg;
and image-L.jpg

Another key aspect of this: My website at present has 300 pages in it.  A
sed script to turn  to  is a lot
easier than editing every image reference.


Regards

Sherwood



On Fri, 29 Mar 2019 at 20:41, Tom Humiston  wrote:

> Maybe I misunderstand you but I think one or the other of these will work:
>
>
> ![Alt text here](/path/to/image.jpg){.parse_me}
>
> ![Alt text here](/path/to/image.jpg '700 500 50 10 138, 1400 1000 100
> 50 416')
>
>
> The latter example is standard Markdown, the former adds a class in the
> manner of PHP Markdown Extra (and other parsers as well, I think).
>
> If you post-process, what you'll parse isn't much different from that:
>
>
> 
>
> 
>
>
> Whether you parse Markdown or HTML, all your script needs to look for is a
> class (or title) such as 'parse_me' OR a title consisting of numbers.
> Assuming that the filenames to be generated all follow the same pattern.
>
> > So all I need to do is write a code snippet that turns
> >
> > ![Alt text here](/path/to/image.jpg) into  the corresponding set of
> picture and src image tags.
>
>
> Yup, I think we're just talking about two different ways of marking the
> images that your snippet will parse.
>
> HTH,
> T
>
>
>
> > On 29 Mar 2019, at 7:44 AM, Sherwood Botsford 
> wrote:
> >
> >
> > Reason I'm more inclined to preprocess is as follows:
> >
> > Markdown is visually simpler to parse.
> >
> > In template toolkit, I create the navigation system, using a 200 line
> TT2 script.  It's messy.  TT2 calls a markdown plugin.
> >
> > By using the  versus  I have a clear flag to identify where I
> need to work.  I think this will be simpler to do without going off the
> rails.
> >
> > So all I need to do is write a code snippet that turns
> >
> > ![Alt text here](/path/to/image.jpg) into  the corresponding set of
> picture and src image tags.
> >
> > If I use a variable for the parameters to pass to the srcset criteria,
> then I can change this once for the entire site.
> >
> > It will mean creating at least 2 additional images for each currently
> used image.
> >
> >
> >
> > Regards
> >
> > Sherwood
> >
> >
> >
> > On Wed, 27 Mar 2019 at 17:07, Tom Humiston  wrote:
> > Sherwood, great question and well laid out. If a good solution comes up
> I'll probably want it as well.
> >
> > My idea is to _post-process_ the HTML output to convert marked data into
> a picture element, rather than to construct a picture up front that can
> withstand parsing from Markdown into HTML. In the source text, I suggest
> cramming the image's source data into the image's title attribute, which
> then gets unpacked in the post-processing.
> >
> > I wrote the following as I was working out the idea.
> >
> > ---
> >
> > I haven't become familiar with the `` element but I get the
> idea from what you've presented. As for the CSS presentation, fancier
> things are of course possible but that doesn't change the need for
> well-structured content and good markup.
> >
> > Like you, I've got no Javascript background, and I'm happy enough to
> keep it that way. In fact I'm not much of a programmer at all, which may be
> an advantage as I try to always empathize with the non-technical writers
> and readers.
> >
> > So I'm looking at the data salad that supports 'picture' and thinking it
> hardly fits into standard prose, and I think one way to come at it is,
> firstly, to pick the appropriate existing Markdown that will tuck the
> structured data into a place it would pose no harm if visible to readers,
> and, secondly, to write a script that will _post-process_ the HTML and
> rewrite the element containing the picture data as a picture element at the
> desired position.
> >
> > That is:
> >
> > 1. Process your Markdown into HTML.
> > 2. Post-process the HTML to rewrite instances of picture data as
> `` elements.
> >
> > For the first step, two options that come to mind use extended Markdown
> syntax: the footnote and the description list.
> >
> > In either case I suppose you could include a keyword or key bit of
> syntax to mark the data in a way that will cause your bespoke
> post-processing script to recognize and act upon it.
> >
> > A __footnote__ would place the structured data _outside the flow of the
> main text_ (suitable if there is no post-processing) and allow almost any
> variety of temporary syntax for arranging that data. Another advantage is
> that the HTML link to the footnote, which would indicate where your script
> should insert the picture, can reside within a block-level element just as
> an `img` now can.  (The downside is that the footnote link cannot exist
> _without_ associated block-level content. Oh well.) Note that the keyword
> cannot be the

Re: Responsive images and markdown

2019-03-29 Thread Tom Humiston 
Maybe I misunderstand you but I think one or the other of these will work:


![Alt text here](/path/to/image.jpg){.parse_me}

![Alt text here](/path/to/image.jpg '700 500 50 10 138, 1400 1000 100 50 
416')


The latter example is standard Markdown, the former adds a class in the manner 
of PHP Markdown Extra (and other parsers as well, I think).

If you post-process, what you'll parse isn't much different from that:







Whether you parse Markdown or HTML, all your script needs to look for is a 
class (or title) such as 'parse_me' OR a title consisting of numbers. Assuming 
that the filenames to be generated all follow the same pattern.

> So all I need to do is write a code snippet that turns
> 
> ![Alt text here](/path/to/image.jpg) into  the corresponding set of picture 
> and src image tags.


Yup, I think we're just talking about two different ways of marking the images 
that your snippet will parse.

HTH,
T



> On 29 Mar 2019, at 7:44 AM, Sherwood Botsford  wrote:
> 
> 
> Reason I'm more inclined to preprocess is as follows:
> 
> Markdown is visually simpler to parse.
> 
> In template toolkit, I create the navigation system, using a 200 line TT2 
> script.  It's messy.  TT2 calls a markdown plugin.
> 
> By using the  versus  I have a clear flag to identify where I need 
> to work.  I think this will be simpler to do without going off the rails.
> 
> So all I need to do is write a code snippet that turns
> 
> ![Alt text here](/path/to/image.jpg) into  the corresponding set of picture 
> and src image tags.
> 
> If I use a variable for the parameters to pass to the srcset criteria, then I 
> can change this once for the entire site.
> 
> It will mean creating at least 2 additional images for each currently used 
> image.
> 
> 
> 
> Regards
> 
> Sherwood
> 
> 
> 
> On Wed, 27 Mar 2019 at 17:07, Tom Humiston  wrote:
> Sherwood, great question and well laid out. If a good solution comes up I'll 
> probably want it as well.
> 
> My idea is to _post-process_ the HTML output to convert marked data into a 
> picture element, rather than to construct a picture up front that can 
> withstand parsing from Markdown into HTML. In the source text, I suggest 
> cramming the image's source data into the image's title attribute, which then 
> gets unpacked in the post-processing.
> 
> I wrote the following as I was working out the idea.
> 
> ---
> 
> I haven't become familiar with the `` element but I get the idea 
> from what you've presented. As for the CSS presentation, fancier things are 
> of course possible but that doesn't change the need for well-structured 
> content and good markup.
> 
> Like you, I've got no Javascript background, and I'm happy enough to keep it 
> that way. In fact I'm not much of a programmer at all, which may be an 
> advantage as I try to always empathize with the non-technical writers and 
> readers.
> 
> So I'm looking at the data salad that supports 'picture' and thinking it 
> hardly fits into standard prose, and I think one way to come at it is, 
> firstly, to pick the appropriate existing Markdown that will tuck the 
> structured data into a place it would pose no harm if visible to readers, 
> and, secondly, to write a script that will _post-process_ the HTML and 
> rewrite the element containing the picture data as a picture element at the 
> desired position.
> 
> That is:
> 
> 1. Process your Markdown into HTML.
> 2. Post-process the HTML to rewrite instances of picture data as `` 
> elements.
> 
> For the first step, two options that come to mind use extended Markdown 
> syntax: the footnote and the description list.
> 
> In either case I suppose you could include a keyword or key bit of syntax to 
> mark the data in a way that will cause your bespoke post-processing script to 
> recognize and act upon it. 
> 
> A __footnote__ would place the structured data _outside the flow of the main 
> text_ (suitable if there is no post-processing) and allow almost any variety 
> of temporary syntax for arranging that data. Another advantage is that the 
> HTML link to the footnote, which would indicate where your script should 
> insert the picture, can reside within a block-level element just as an `img` 
> now can.  (The downside is that the footnote link cannot exist _without_ 
> associated block-level content. Oh well.) Note that the keyword cannot be the 
> footnote marker itself, as this is processed out by the Markdown script (at 
> least in the implementations of which I'm aware).
> 
> A __description list__ would place the data in a DL element, structured 
> either as a series of DT-DD pairs, or as the content of a single pair which 
> you could again structure in any fashion (as with the footnote). A 
> disadvantage is that the data will fall more within the surrounding prose 
> than would a footnote, but advantages may exist as well.
> 
> Below are examples of the Markdown I imagine, each using `\picture-data\` as 
> the identifier to be recognized in

Re: Responsive images and markdown

2019-03-29 Thread Sherwood Botsford 
Reason I'm more inclined to preprocess is as follows:

Markdown is visually simpler to parse.

In template toolkit, I create the navigation system, using a 200 line TT2
script.  It's messy.  TT2 calls a markdown plugin.

By using the  versus  I have a clear flag to identify where I
need to work.  I think this will be simpler to do without going off the
rails.

So all I need to do is write a code snippet that turns

![Alt text here](/path/to/image.jpg) into  the corresponding set of picture
and src image tags.

If I use a variable for the parameters to pass to the srcset criteria, then
I can change this once for the entire site.

It will mean creating at least 2 additional images for each currently used
image.



Regards

Sherwood



On Wed, 27 Mar 2019 at 17:07, Tom Humiston  wrote:

> Sherwood, great question and well laid out. If a good solution comes up
> I'll probably want it as well.
>
> My idea is to _post-process_ the HTML output to convert marked data into a
> picture element, rather than to construct a picture up front that can
> withstand parsing from Markdown into HTML. In the source text, I suggest
> cramming the image's source data into the image's title attribute, which
> then gets unpacked in the post-processing.
>
> I wrote the following as I was working out the idea.
>
> ---
>
> I haven't become familiar with the `` element but I get the idea
> from what you've presented. As for the CSS presentation, fancier things are
> of course possible but that doesn't change the need for well-structured
> content and good markup.
>
> Like you, I've got no Javascript background, and I'm happy enough to keep
> it that way. In fact I'm not much of a programmer at all, which may be an
> advantage as I try to always empathize with the non-technical writers and
> readers.
>
> So I'm looking at the data salad that supports 'picture' and thinking it
> hardly fits into standard prose, and I think one way to come at it is,
> firstly, to pick the appropriate existing Markdown that will tuck the
> structured data into a place it would pose no harm if visible to readers,
> and, secondly, to write a script that will _post-process_ the HTML and
> rewrite the element containing the picture data as a picture element at the
> desired position.
>
> That is:
>
> 1. Process your Markdown into HTML.
> 2. Post-process the HTML to rewrite instances of picture data as
> `` elements.
>
> For the first step, two options that come to mind use extended Markdown
> syntax: the footnote and the description list.
>
> In either case I suppose you could include a keyword or key bit of syntax
> to mark the data in a way that will cause your bespoke post-processing
> script to recognize and act upon it.
>
> A __footnote__ would place the structured data _outside the flow of the
> main text_ (suitable if there is no post-processing) and allow almost any
> variety of temporary syntax for arranging that data. Another advantage is
> that the HTML link to the footnote, which would indicate where your script
> should insert the picture, can reside within a block-level element just as
> an `img` now can.  (The downside is that the footnote link cannot exist
> _without_ associated block-level content. Oh well.) Note that the keyword
> cannot be the footnote marker itself, as this is processed out by the
> Markdown script (at least in the implementations of which I'm aware).
>
> A __description list__ would place the data in a DL element, structured
> either as a series of DT-DD pairs, or as the content of a single pair which
> you could again structure in any fashion (as with the footnote). A
> disadvantage is that the data will fall more within the surrounding prose
> than would a footnote, but advantages may exist as well.
>
> Below are examples of the Markdown I imagine, each using `\picture-data\`
> as the identifier to be recognized in post-processing. To structure the
> data I merely remove the angle brackets and line breaks (to minimize
> Markdown processing) and add semicolons as delimiters. The last example
> builds on the standard Markdown image format and thus does not require
> extended syntax.
>
>
> ## Example 1: Footnote
>
> A picture[^pic1] will go inside this paragraph.
>
> [^pic1]: \picture-data\ source media="(max-width: 700px)"
> sizes="(max-width: 500px) 50vw, 10vw" srcset="stick-figure-narrow.png 138w,
> stick-figure-hd-narrow.png 138w"; source media="(max-width: 1400px)"
> sizes="(max-width: 1000px) 100vw, 50vw" srcset="stick-figure.png 416w,
> stick-figure-hd.png 416w"; img src="stick-original.png" alt="Human"
>
>
> ## Example 2: Description List with Single Term
>
> Lorem ipsum dolor sit amet consectetur adipiscing whatever.
>
> \\picture-data\\
> :   source media="(max-width: 700px)" sizes="(max-width: 500px) 50vw,
> 10vw" srcset="stick-figure-narrow.png 138w, stick-figure-hd-narrow.png
> 138w"; source media="(max-width: 1400px)" sizes="(max-width: 1000px) 100vw,
> 50vw" srcset="stick-figure.png

Re: Responsive images and markdown

2019-03-27 Thread Tom Humiston 
Sherwood, great question and well laid out. If a good solution comes up I'll 
probably want it as well.

My idea is to _post-process_ the HTML output to convert marked data into a 
picture element, rather than to construct a picture up front that can withstand 
parsing from Markdown into HTML. In the source text, I suggest cramming the 
image's source data into the image's title attribute, which then gets unpacked 
in the post-processing.

I wrote the following as I was working out the idea.

---

I haven't become familiar with the `` element but I get the idea from 
what you've presented. As for the CSS presentation, fancier things are of 
course possible but that doesn't change the need for well-structured content 
and good markup.

Like you, I've got no Javascript background, and I'm happy enough to keep it 
that way. In fact I'm not much of a programmer at all, which may be an 
advantage as I try to always empathize with the non-technical writers and 
readers.

So I'm looking at the data salad that supports 'picture' and thinking it hardly 
fits into standard prose, and I think one way to come at it is, firstly, to 
pick the appropriate existing Markdown that will tuck the structured data into 
a place it would pose no harm if visible to readers, and, secondly, to write a 
script that will _post-process_ the HTML and rewrite the element containing the 
picture data as a picture element at the desired position.

That is:

1. Process your Markdown into HTML.
2. Post-process the HTML to rewrite instances of picture data as `` 
elements.

For the first step, two options that come to mind use extended Markdown syntax: 
the footnote and the description list.

In either case I suppose you could include a keyword or key bit of syntax to 
mark the data in a way that will cause your bespoke post-processing script to 
recognize and act upon it. 

A __footnote__ would place the structured data _outside the flow of the main 
text_ (suitable if there is no post-processing) and allow almost any variety of 
temporary syntax for arranging that data. Another advantage is that the HTML 
link to the footnote, which would indicate where your script should insert the 
picture, can reside within a block-level element just as an `img` now can.  
(The downside is that the footnote link cannot exist _without_ associated 
block-level content. Oh well.) Note that the keyword cannot be the footnote 
marker itself, as this is processed out by the Markdown script (at least in the 
implementations of which I'm aware).

A __description list__ would place the data in a DL element, structured either 
as a series of DT-DD pairs, or as the content of a single pair which you could 
again structure in any fashion (as with the footnote). A disadvantage is that 
the data will fall more within the surrounding prose than would a footnote, but 
advantages may exist as well.

Below are examples of the Markdown I imagine, each using `\picture-data\` as 
the identifier to be recognized in post-processing. To structure the data I 
merely remove the angle brackets and line breaks (to minimize Markdown 
processing) and add semicolons as delimiters. The last example builds on the 
standard Markdown image format and thus does not require extended syntax.


## Example 1: Footnote

A picture[^pic1] will go inside this paragraph.

[^pic1]: \picture-data\ source media="(max-width: 700px)" 
sizes="(max-width: 500px) 50vw, 10vw" srcset="stick-figure-narrow.png 138w, 
stick-figure-hd-narrow.png 138w"; source media="(max-width: 1400px)" 
sizes="(max-width: 1000px) 100vw, 50vw" srcset="stick-figure.png 416w, 
stick-figure-hd.png 416w"; img src="stick-original.png" alt="Human"


## Example 2: Description List with Single Term

Lorem ipsum dolor sit amet consectetur adipiscing whatever.

\\picture-data\\
:   source media="(max-width: 700px)" sizes="(max-width: 500px) 50vw, 10vw" 
srcset="stick-figure-narrow.png 138w, stick-figure-hd-narrow.png 138w"; source 
media="(max-width: 1400px)" sizes="(max-width: 1000px) 100vw, 50vw" 
srcset="stick-figure.png 416w, stick-figure-hd.png 416w"; img 
src="stick-original.png" alt="Human"

Lorem ipsum dolor sit amet consectetur adipiscing more of whatever.


## Example 3: Description List with Multiple Terms

\\picture-data\\

source1
: media="(max-width: 700px)" sizes="(max-width: 500px) 50vw, 10vw" 
srcset="stick-figure-narrow.png 138w, stick-figure-hd-narrow.png 138w"

source2
: media="(max-width: 1400px)" sizes="(max-width: 1000px) 100vw, 50vw" 
srcset="stick-figure.png 416w, stick-figure-hd.png 416w"; 

img
: src="stick-original.png" alt="Human"


## Example 4: Image + Footnote

Presumably you'd like a basic one-size-fits-all-screens 'img' element to be 
displayed in case there is no post-processing to create a picture element. 
Shifting the additional source data (beyond what is required for img) into a 
footnote could still be a good answer:

Re: Markdown turned my slash (/) into / and my double quote (") into "

2019-01-28 Thread Alan Hogan 
Markdown doesn’t do that. Markdown input is plain text and the output is HTML, 
including some HTML entities, but not double-encoded such that they would be 
visible when rendered as HTML.

If you are seeing entities in code blocks in the web pages you created with 
Prose (which I haven’t tried), then do report the bug to Prose’s maintainer(s).

Alan
On Jan 27, 2019, 1:26 AM -0800, Clement Yui-Wah Lee , 
wrote:
> Hi
>
> I am using markdown indirectly via Prose.io
>
> I noticed that Prose (or markdown?) turned my slash (/) into / and my 
> double quote (") into "
> This happened when the markdown is within a code block. Such as
> GET https://company.io/api/2.0/resource
> And in Prose it got turned into
> GET https://company.io/api/2.0/resource
> How can I avoid that? I googled a bit and searched a bit on the documentation 
> of Prose but the answer is not obvious to me. Thanks in advance!
>
> Virus-free. www.avg.com
> ___
> Markdown-Discuss mailing list
> [email protected]
> https://pairlist6.pair.net/mailman/listinfo/markdown-discuss
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Re: Leading/trailing whitespace in inline

2018-08-25 Thread Aristotle Pagaltzis 
Hi Dan,

* Dan  [2018-08-24 15:29]:
> I'm trying to document a codebase in markdown, and finding it
> difficult to include links inside my code examples. If I were writing
> HTML, I'd write:
>
> perl  href="https://daringfireball.net/projects/markdown/";>Markdown.pl < 
> input.md

that’s exactly what you should write in Markdown as well.

Markdown is HTML. There is a reason it doesn’t have as much syntax as
things like Textile and reStructuredText and it’s right there in the
name: unlike these others, Markdown is *not* a markup language. It’s
just HTML with some shorthand notations on top. That’s why it allows you
to just write HTML tags in your text as if it was HTML… because, it is.

So if there is no shorthand notation that does what you need, just use
the long form: HTML tags.

Consider the reason that Markdown has the backtick code span syntax:
because HTML makes it difficult to write about code – because you need
to entity-escape some very common characters. To fix that problem, the
shorthand syntax must disallow markup inside code, so that no characters
have special meaning, so that no characters need to be escaped.

Now consider your use case: you *want* to put markup inside your code.
That means you need *some* way to make *some* characters special. That
means your particular use case contradicts the requirements for the code
span shorthand.

Now, it would be possible to try and shoehorn something into the syntax
that would make it worse for its purpose (because suddenly you have to
escape some characters) but would allow putting markup into code. But
wait… marking up code is already what HTML is good at. So this would
just be a poor reinvention of HTML. Your use case is already covered
perfectly well by what HTML by itself already allows.

So, just use the HTML way of writing it. HTML is the right tool for your
job.

> But, there doesn't seem to be a way to achieve this in Markdown,
> because any markup i include inside backticks gets HTML encoded (as it
> should). The closest I can do in markdown is:
>
> `perl` [`Markdown.pl`](https://daringfireball.net/projects/markdown/)
> `< input.md`
>
> Which renders as
>
> perl  href="https://daringfireball.net/projects/markdown/";>Markdown.pl
>  < input.md
>
> but is fraught with style issues. Not only is a space a different
> width outside , but the theme I'm using puts a background and
> borders on code tags.
>
> As a workaround, would you be willing to allow _DoCodeSpans to
> preserve leading & trailing white space inside the backticks?
>
> --- Markdown.pl.orig  2018-08-24 08:47:13.603707569 -0400
> +++ Markdown.pl   2018-08-24 08:48:46.949349781 -0400
> @@ -983,8 +983,6 @@
>   (?!`)
>   @
>   my $c = "$2";
> - $c =~ s/^[ \t]*//g; # leading whitespace
> - $c =~ s/[ \t]*$//g; # trailing whitespace
>   $c = _EncodeCode($c);
>   "$c";
>   @egsx;
>
> With this patch, markdown like this:
>
> `perl `[`Markdown.pl`](https://daringfireball.net/projects/markdown/)` < 
> input.md`
>
> renders as
>
> perl  href="https://daringfireball.net/projects/markdown/";>Markdown.pl
>  < input.md
>
> with the whitespace inside the  and no space between the 
> and the , making it easier to clean up the look of the resulting
> webpage with CSS.

That request would break other Markdown syntax.

Did you know you can write `` ` `` characters inside code spans without
escaping them? Your patch would make that translate into

 ` 

which makes this feature pretty useless.

This design is because after disallowing all markup inside code spans,
there is still one remaining problem with not requiring the author to
escape anything inside code spans: how do you make it possible to write
backticks inside code spans? And without requiring them to be escaped?

Markdown’s answer is: by allowing code spans to be delimited not just
with single backticks but by a sequence of backticks of whatever length
the author wants. Then the author can just write a greater number of
backticks as a delimiter than there are any backticks in a row anywhere
in the code, and then nothing in the code needs to be escaped.

But if the code itself starts with a backtick, how is Markdown to know
where the delimiter ends and the code starts? You have to set apart the
end of the delimiter and the start of the code. The obvious way to do
that is to put a space between the delimiter and the code.

*However* – and now we finally get to the problem with your proposal –,
this space is not part of the code. It’s part of the delimiter. It only
exists in the document because of the Markdown syntax rules, not because
it is part of the code. So it *must not* be in the output.

And that is why your patch to _DoCodeSpans is wrong.

Now, it might be possible to salvage your proposal by introducing an
exception, that trimming spaces from code spans only applies when more
than a

Re: Leading/trailing whitespace in inline

2018-08-24 Thread Fletcher Penney 
Dan,

A few comments:


1.  Probably the best way to do this in Markdown (and variants) is exactly how 
you did it in HTML:

> perl  href="https://daringfireball.net/projects/markdown/";>Markdown.pl < 
> input.md

It's more easily understood than the alternative you use, and more amenable to 
"post-processing" of your document that could conceivable occur (e.g. "I want 
to scrape all code fragments for another use").  And it works better with CSS 
as you yourself note.

2. The only reason I see for *not* doing this is if you are looking to export 
to other formats from a single source Markdown document (e.g. LaTeX, 
OpenDocument, etc.)  If you're using Markdown.pl, that doesn't apply.

3. "Markdown the syntax" is alive and well across many spin-off projects.

4."Markdown.pl the implementation" hasn't been updated in almost 14 years (Dec 
2004 for v 1.0.1).  No new features or fixes for long-standing bugs.  You're 
unlikely to see any new releases from Gruber based on his prior public 
comments.  Based on #1 above, I would not recommend modifying Markdown.pl as 
your request, but if you insist you could do it yourself.

5. Updates and bug-fixes notwithstanding, Markdown.pl has been far surpassed by 
multiple other Markdown projects in terms of performance.  I don't recommend 
that anyone use Markdown.pl any more, except for the most trivial of use cases. 
 There are too many good alternatives out there.  (I am, of course, biased 
about which of the *Multi*ple *Markdown* implementations I would recommend 
;)   (Couldn't resist the ridiculous pun there)

6. A search of the archives 
(https://pairlist6.pair.net/pipermail/markdown-discuss/ 
) will reveal that this 
mailing list is all but dead.  You'll probably reach a few diehard Markdown 
supporters and people who simply forgot to unsubscribe.  But you may find more 
active help using the support channels specific to a particular (active) 
Markdown implementation if you don't get sufficient help here.


My $.02,

Fletcher

-- 
Fletcher T. Penney
[email protected] 

> On Aug 24, 2018, at 9:21 AM, Dan  wrote:
> 
> I'm trying to document a codebase in markdown, and finding it difficult to 
> include links inside my code examples. If I were writing HTML, I'd write:
> 
> perl  href="https://daringfireball.net/projects/markdown/";>Markdown.pl < 
> input.md
> 
> But, there doesn't seem to be a way to achieve this in Markdown, because any 
> markup i include inside backticks gets HTML encoded (as it should). The 
> closest I can do in markdown is:
> 
> `perl` [`Markdown.pl`](https://daringfireball.net/projects/markdown/) `< 
> input.md`
> 
> Which renders as
> 
> perl  href="https://daringfireball.net/projects/markdown/";>Markdown.pl
>  < input.md
> 
> but is fraught with style issues. Not only is a space a different width 
> outside , but the theme I'm using puts a background and borders on code 
> tags.
> 
> As a workaround, would you be willing to allow _DoCodeSpans to preserve 
> leading & trailing white space inside the backticks?
> 
> --- Markdown.pl.orig  2018-08-24 08:47:13.603707569 -0400
> +++ Markdown.pl   2018-08-24 08:48:46.949349781 -0400
> @@ -983,8 +983,6 @@
>   (?!`)
>   @
>   my $c = "$2";
> - $c =~ s/^[ \t]*//g; # leading whitespace
> - $c =~ s/[ \t]*$//g; # trailing whitespace
>   $c = _EncodeCode($c);
>   "$c";
>   @egsx;
> 
> With this patch, markdown like this:
> 
> `perl `[`Markdown.pl`](https://daringfireball.net/projects/markdown/)` < 
> input.md`
> 
> renders as 
> 
> perl  href="https://daringfireball.net/projects/markdown/";>Markdown.pl
>  < input.md
> 
> with the whitespace inside the  and no space between the  and 
> the , making it easier to clean up the look of the resulting webpage with 
> CSS.
> 
> Thanks very much for your time & for Markdown.
> -Dan
> ___
> Markdown-Discuss mailing list
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Re: dean allen is gone

2018-06-18 Thread Lou Quillio 
On Tue, Feb 6, 2018 at 7:28 PM Lou Quillio  wrote:
>
> Could use some help with the draft WikiPedia article _Dean Cameron Allen_.

Someone has successfully created a WikiPedia article:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dean_Allen

LQ
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Re: dean allen is gone

2018-02-06 Thread Lou Quillio 
Could use some help with the draft WikiPedia article _Dean Cameron Allen_.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Draft:Dean_Cameron_Allen

The guidance I've received from WikiPedia editors is that more,
arms-length and verifiable sources/references are needed to
demonstrate notability. Perhaps some mention of favrd, citation of
AListApart articles, Joyent press releases, etc. Also, WikiPedia is
fussy about photography rights, so anyone with unambiguous ownership
of useful photos can be very helpful here.

Please contribute. I'm optimistic that a dca article will be approved
once there's more meat on its bones and it has multiple contributors.
Thanks.

LQ


On Tue, Feb 6, 2018 at 7:22 PM, Lou Quillio  wrote:
> On Tue, Jan 23, 2018 at 1:45 PM, bowerbird via Markdown-Discuss
>  wrote:
>> dean allen slipped the bonds last week.
>>
>> allen was one of the pioneers of light-markup,
>
> and a friend, and a very clever dude. I've submitted a draft, skeleton
> WikiPedia article ("Dean Cameron Allen"), which I suppose the
> WikiPedia gods must bless before it appears. Not sure how that works
> these days.
>
> LQ
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Re: dean allen is gone

2018-02-06 Thread Lou Quillio 
On Tue, Jan 23, 2018 at 1:45 PM, bowerbird via Markdown-Discuss
 wrote:
> dean allen slipped the bonds last week.
>
> allen was one of the pioneers of light-markup,

and a friend, and a very clever dude. I've submitted a draft, skeleton
WikiPedia article ("Dean Cameron Allen"), which I suppose the
WikiPedia gods must bless before it appears. Not sure how that works
these days.

LQ
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Re: whitespace at the start of code in a blockquote trimmed

2017-08-16 Thread Bram Mertens 
Thanks,

The part of Markdown.pl that causes this is in sub _DoBlockQuotes:
[bmertens.LAPTOP085] ➤ diff -u Markdown.pl{.orig,}
--- Markdown.pl.orig
+++ Markdown.pl
@@ -1065,14 +1065,6 @@
$bq = _RunBlockGamut($bq);  # recurse

$bq =~ s/^/  /g;
-   # These leading spaces screw with  content, so
we need to fix that:
-   $bq =~ s{
-   (\s*.+?)
-   }{
-   my $pre = $1;
-   $pre =~ s/^  //mg;
-   $pre;
-   }egsx;

"\n$bq\n\n\n";
}egmx;

I've removed this section and the document I'm working on works fine now.
But the comment suggests that this may introduce problems in other
documents so YMMV.

Regards

Bram

On Mon, Aug 14, 2017 at 4:43 PM Michel Fortin 
wrote:

> Looks like a bug in Markdown.pl. Pretty much all the other implementations
> of Markdown handle this correctly. So you can use another Markdown parser,
> or alternatively you can write the whole blockquote in HTML as a
> workaround. I think you can add spaces to all the lines too (so it looks
> better in the text document). Or you take some time to fix Markdown.pl.
>
> > Le 14 août 2017 à 9:03, Bram Mertens  a écrit
> :
> >
> > Hi,
> >
> > In a document I'm writing I wanted to include an extract from an email
> message as a blockquote.
> > The message contains a code extract which contains both a piece of ascii
> art (output from banner) as well as some lines that start with spaces.
> >
> > After converting the markdown to XHTML I noticed that the ascii art does
> not look as expected and some lines that start with spaces are displayed
> left-aligned. (Meaning the leading spaces are removed).
> >
> > The problem occurs only when the blocquote (> ) and code (4spaces) are
> combined.
> > Adding two more spaces somehow resolves the problem as well but that
> obviously makes the Markdown text look different.
> >
> > I've created a small sample and uploaded it to pastebin at
> https://pastebin.com/iCb3ESYZ.
> > It has the original text, the same text without blockquote and the
> version with the additional spaces added.
> > Converting that in dingus (
> https://daringfireball.net/projects/markdown/dingus) demonstrates the
> problem.
> >
> > Is this by design?
> > Is there another way to avoid this?
> >
> > Thanks in advance
> >
> > Bram
> > ___
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>
> --
> Michel Fortin
> https://michelf.ca
>
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Re: whitespace at the start of code in a blockquote trimmed

2017-08-14 Thread Michel Fortin 
Looks like a bug in Markdown.pl. Pretty much all the other implementations of 
Markdown handle this correctly. So you can use another Markdown parser, or 
alternatively you can write the whole blockquote in HTML as a workaround. I 
think you can add spaces to all the lines too (so it looks better in the text 
document). Or you take some time to fix Markdown.pl.

> Le 14 août 2017 à 9:03, Bram Mertens  a écrit :
> 
> Hi,
> 
> In a document I'm writing I wanted to include an extract from an email 
> message as a blockquote.
> The message contains a code extract which contains both a piece of ascii art 
> (output from banner) as well as some lines that start with spaces.
> 
> After converting the markdown to XHTML I noticed that the ascii art does not 
> look as expected and some lines that start with spaces are displayed 
> left-aligned. (Meaning the leading spaces are removed).
> 
> The problem occurs only when the blocquote (> ) and code (4spaces) are 
> combined.
> Adding two more spaces somehow resolves the problem as well but that 
> obviously makes the Markdown text look different.
> 
> I've created a small sample and uploaded it to pastebin at 
> https://pastebin.com/iCb3ESYZ.
> It has the original text, the same text without blockquote and the version 
> with the additional spaces added.
> Converting that in dingus 
> (https://daringfireball.net/projects/markdown/dingus) demonstrates the 
> problem.
> 
> Is this by design?
> Is there another way to avoid this?
> 
> Thanks in advance
> 
> Bram
> ___
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-- 
Michel Fortin
https://michelf.ca

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Re: an interesting throwaway line

2017-07-27 Thread Alan Hogan 
I’m not surprised that plus (+) is so uncommon. It doesn't look like a bullet 
and requires more work than hyphen.

Perhaps interestingly, however, my old experimental tool pmitool.com has a 
Markdown export mode that uses all three, because it generates lists of 
positive, negative, and neutral items.

On Jul 27, 2017, 12:01 PM -0700, Wolfgang Faust , wrote:
> > On Thu, Jul 27, 2017 at 1:16 PM, bowerbird via Markdown-Discuss 
> >  wrote:
> > > gruber posted about markdown
> > > on his daringfireball blog, which
> > > is rare enough to be noticeable.
> > >
> > > but it became fully remarkable
> > > when its final sentence made a
> > > passing reference to a possible
> > > "update to markdown" event --
> > > as if such a revision isn't a thing
> > > he's always steadfastly refused.
> > >
> > > this isn't a reading of tea-leaves.
> > >
> > > it is a sudden jarring appearance
> > > of tea-leaves in a place they have
> > > never ever appeared before now.
> > >
> > > -bowerbird
>
> Well, this is interesting! Here's the link, for easy reference: 
> https://daringfireball.net/2017/07/unordered_lists_in_markdown
> Mostly it's a discussion of bulleted list styles, but the relevant quote is 
> in the last paragraph:
> > But at the time, character-encoding mismatches were still a daily problem. 
> > Today, UTF-8 is sufficiently universal that using such characters in an 
> > update to Markdown would probably work out fine.
>
> --
> The views expressed above are exclusively mine, if anyone's.
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Re: an interesting throwaway line

2017-07-27 Thread Wolfgang Faust 
On Thu, Jul 27, 2017 at 1:16 PM, bowerbird via Markdown-Discuss <
[email protected]> wrote:

> gruber posted about markdown
> on his daringfireball blog, which
> is rare enough to be noticeable.
>
> but it became fully remarkable
> when its final sentence made a
> passing reference to a possible
> "update to markdown" event --
> as if such a revision isn't a thing
> he's always steadfastly refused.
>
> this isn't a reading of tea-leaves.
>
> it is a sudden jarring appearance
> of tea-leaves in a place they have
> never ever appeared before now.
>
> -bowerbird
>

Well, this *is* interesting! Here's the link, for easy reference:
https://daringfireball.net/2017/07/unordered_lists_in_markdown
Mostly it's a discussion of bulleted list styles, but the relevant quote is
in the last paragraph:
> But at the time, character-encoding mismatches were still a daily
problem. Today, UTF-8 is sufficiently universal that using such characters
in an update to Markdown would probably work out fine.

-- 
The views expressed above are exclusively mine, if anyone's.
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Re: Fixing Markdown Series @ Manuscripts News

2017-07-21 Thread James Smits 
Marty, any relation to Galen? 

Dennis, I get what your saying about a version identifier, but it would be much 
more cost effective if the community agreed upon a standard (say, CommonMark, 
or whatever since it was proposed as such), and threw a big-fat-lint warning in 
front of whomever wrote non-conformant MarkDown.  Your solution puts the burden 
on the subscriber of a MarkDown blob (bit, squibble, rave, whatever you want to 
call it) to process it properly, while the burden should be on the publisher 
(assuming they want it to be consumed.) 

I don't know. Without tangentially philosophizing politics for too long,maybe 
it's  technocrats' responsibility to spackle the cracks in human-relations. 

In any event, if a MarkDown statement (?) could be passed around reliably via 
JSON or some other structure, then the "integrated" web we see today would at 
least bump a minor version number. 

Jim 

PS. As I write this, it occurred to me that this idea may target an outmoded 
form of Cumputer>Human interaction I.e. The keyboard. 

Sent from my iPhone

> On Jul 21, 2017, at 4:11 PM, Marty McGowan  wrote:
> 
> Dennis,
> 
>my interest in following this discussion, now that i see you here, just 
> went from observer, to tracker,   maybe even participant.
> 
>i'm an emacs orgmode user.  are you?i've used pandoc to convert *.org 
> to *.md (and some back again).   my criteria for using either:   OrgMode for 
> stuff not needing curating when i'm gone, Markdown for text I'd hope that 
> others will maintain.   in this latter category, i've collected the text from 
> my sister's genealogy work on Ancestry and am re-purposing it to live on 
> McGowans.Org
> 
>Here's a tally by suffix of the files in this legacy:
> 
>   1 m4
>  65 md
>  58 mkd
> 341 org
>   1 src
>  66 txt
> 
> where the mkd (certainly) and the txt (likely) are Markdown, with src and m4 
> each having a spot.   so, it's Orgmode 341,  Markdown 191.
> 
>any advice here?
> 
> Thanks,
> =*+*-  Marty McGowan  908 230-3739
> http://alum.mit.edu/www/mcgowan
> 
> p.s. bill and i had a live session yesterday about keybase, where i'm 
> applemcg.
> 
> On Tue, Jul 18, 2017, at 11:01, Dennis E. Hamilton wrote:
> > It seems to me that the first thing to handle is coming up with a means
> > for identifying the version/variant/dialect/fork of "markdown" that a
> > file is coded in.
> >
> > I have been thinking that a variant of #! Would do it, but that's not
> > quite what that is used for (since it confuses format and the application
> > that is expected to process it).  (I am looking at #? Myself, but don't
> > have a clear proposal at
> >
> > I still think something like that is called for.  Have a way of
> > identifying the format of the text and, ideally, leading to where the
> > rules and definition can be found.  Have it in a form that can be
> > ignored, and still be forgiving when there is no such information and a
> > consuming software does the best that can be figured out.
> >
> >  - Dennis
> >
> > PS: I am looking at #? myself, for leading format specifying line(s).
> > Don't have a clear description so far, but there's more thinking at
> > <http://nfoware.com/notes/2017/02/n170201.htm>.  I will be using this for
> > some different formats that I want to introduce (having little or nothing
> > to do with markdown).
> >
> > > -Original Message-
> > > From: Markdown-Discuss [mailto:markdown-discuss-
> > > [email protected]] On Behalf Of Gerald Bauer
> > > Sent: Tuesday, July 18, 2017 05:49
> > > To: Discussion related to Markdown. 
> > > Subject: Fixing Markdown Series @ Manuscripts News
> > >
> > > Hello,
> > >
> > > First thanks for the great mailing list service. Since I'm just
> > > talking to myself here this will be my last post on markdown list
> > > (never say never ;-) Anyways, they never come back, don't they?
> > >
> > >
> > > If you follow along there are different ways to "fix" markdown:
> > >
> > [ ... ]
> >
> > ___
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> > [email protected]
> > https://pairlist6.pair.net/mailman/listinfo/markdown-discuss
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Re: Fixing Markdown Series @ Manuscripts News

2017-07-21 Thread Marty McGowan 
Dennis,

   my interest in following this discussion, now that i see you here, just went 
from observer, to tracker,   maybe even participant.
   i'm an emacs orgmode user.  are you?i've used pandoc to convert *.org to 
*.md (and some back again).   my criteria for using either:   OrgMode for stuff 
not needing curating when i'm gone, Markdown for text I'd hope that others will 
maintain.   in this latter category, i've collected the text from my sister's 
genealogy work on Ancestry and am re-purposing it to live on McGowans.Org
   Here's a tally by suffix of the files in this legacy:

  1 m4
 65 md
 58 mkd
341 org
  1 src
 66 txt

where the mkd (certainly) and the txt (likely) are Markdown, with src and m4 
each having a spot.   so, it's  Orgmode 341,  Markdown 191.
   any advice here?

Thanks,
=*+*-  Marty McGowan  908 230-3739
http://alum.mit.edu/www/mcgowan

p.s. bill and i had a live session yesterday about keybase, where i'm applemcg.
On Tue, Jul 18, 2017, at 11:01, Dennis E. Hamilton wrote:
> It seems to me that the first thing to handle is coming up with a means> for 
> identifying the version/variant/dialect/fork of "markdown" that a> file is 
> coded in.
>
> I have been thinking that a variant of #! Would do it, but that's not> quite 
> what that is used for (since it confuses format and the application> that is 
> expected to process it).  (I am looking at #? Myself, but don't> have a clear 
> proposal at
>
> I still think something like that is called for.  Have a way of
> identifying the format of the text and, ideally, leading to where the> rules 
> and definition can be found.  Have it in a form that can be
> ignored, and still be forgiving when there is no such information and a> 
> consuming software does the best that can be figured out.
>
>  - Dennis
>
> PS: I am looking at #? myself, for leading format specifying line(s).> Don't 
> have a clear description so far, but there's more thinking at
> <http://nfoware.com/notes/2017/02/n170201.htm>.  I will be using this for> 
> some different formats that I want to introduce (having little or nothing> to 
> do with markdown).
>
> > -Original Message-
> > From: Markdown-Discuss [mailto:markdown-discuss-
> > [email protected]] On Behalf Of Gerald Bauer
> > Sent: Tuesday, July 18, 2017 05:49
> > To: Discussion related to Markdown. > > 
> > Subject: Fixing Markdown Series @ Manuscripts News
> >
> > Hello,
> >
> > First thanks for the great mailing list service. Since I'm just> > 
> > talking to myself here this will be my last post on markdown list
> > (never say never ;-) Anyways, they never come back, don't they?
> >
> >
> > If you follow along there are different ways to "fix" markdown:> >
> [ ... ]
>
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RE: Fixing Markdown Series @ Manuscripts News

2017-07-18 Thread Dennis E. Hamilton 
It seems to me that the first thing to handle is coming up with a means for 
identifying the version/variant/dialect/fork of "markdown" that a file is coded 
in.

I have been thinking that a variant of #! Would do it, but that's not quite 
what that is used for (since it confuses format and the application that is 
expected to process it).  (I am looking at #? Myself, but don't have a clear 
proposal at 

I still think something like that is called for.  Have a way of identifying the 
format of the text and, ideally, leading to where the rules and definition can 
be found.  Have it in a form that can be ignored, and still be forgiving when 
there is no such information and a consuming software does the best that can be 
figured out.

 - Dennis

PS: I am looking at #? myself, for leading format specifying line(s).  Don't 
have a clear description so far, but there's more thinking at 
.  I will be using this for some 
different formats that I want to introduce (having little or nothing to do with 
markdown).

> -Original Message-
> From: Markdown-Discuss [mailto:markdown-discuss-
> [email protected]] On Behalf Of Gerald Bauer
> Sent: Tuesday, July 18, 2017 05:49
> To: Discussion related to Markdown. 
> Subject: Fixing Markdown Series @ Manuscripts News
> 
> Hello,
> 
> First thanks for the great mailing list service. Since I'm just
> talking to myself here this will be my last post on markdown list
> (never say never ;-) Anyways, they never come back, don't they?
> 
> 
> If you follow along there are different ways to "fix" markdown:
> 
[ ... ]

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Re: Markdown-Discuss Digest, Vol 169, Issue 6

2017-06-09 Thread ferdinando traversa 
There is one problem. The markdown isn't a default option!


Il giorno ven 9 giu 2017 alle ore 07:32 <
[email protected]> ha scritto:

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> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
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> Today's Topics:
>
>1. bear design award (bowerbird)
>
>
> --
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Thu, 8 Jun 2017 18:29:31 -0400
> From: bowerbird 
> To: [email protected], [email protected]
> Subject: bear design award
> Message-ID: <[email protected]>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>
> apple gave a design award to "bear",
> a light-markup word-processing app.
>
>
> http://www.bear-writer.com
>
>
>
>
> https://developer.apple.com/design/awards/#bear
>
>
> -bowerbird
>
>
>
> -- next part --
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Re: Feed.TXT - A Free Feeds Format in Plain Text w/ Structured Meta Data and Markdown ;-)

2017-06-07 Thread Gerald Bauer 
Hello,

> aaron swartz in 2002 said:
>   http://www.aaronsw.com/2002/rss30

   RSS 3.0 looks great. Love the focus on plain text and keeping it simple.

   Compared to the new Feed.txt [1] the "old" RSS 3.0 might too simple
e.g. the rule about indenting your content in multi-line values look
like not practical that easy will break things.

  Feed.txt has proper dividers for blocks and content but otherwise
keeps the simplicity that looks like a joke ;-)

 E.g.

|>>>   starts a feed
 divides a content block
  ends a meta data block
<<<|   ends a feed

   That's it. To use multi-line content just "paste" it into your
feed. No encoding or indendation rules. Keep it simple. Maybe rebrand
it as RSS 5.0 or something ;-) Cheers.

[1] https://feedtxt.github.io
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Re: Feed.TXT - A Free Feeds Format in Plain Text w/ Structured Meta Data and Markdown ; -)

2017-06-07 Thread Gerald Bauer 
Hello,

> As far as I can tell there is no upside to JSON feed other than "it isn't 
> XML".  I don't see a business case for supporting another feed format simply 
> because JSON is easier to parse.

Dare I say that you have never worked with trying to read / parse
RSS. Here's the RSS parser / builder for the "universal" feedparser
(from my humble self ;-) [1] and here's the JSON version [2].

 What's the difference? What's the "business case"?

 Do you know how many ways are there to encode html content in RSS 2.0?

- description may or may not be full content; it may be actually a
"description" e.g. summary
-  there might be the RDF/RSS 1.0 content module uses in RSS 2.0
holding the content
-  or might be the summary in the RSS Yahoo media extension?
-  and on and on

   No can you tell me if you find the content if the content is in
html or xhtml or escaped html or in plain text?

Bonus: How do you find the banner image for content or the feed
icon or the author avatar? Did you know that atomic RSS is now a "best
practice", that is, atom elements inside RSS 2.0?

Anyways, in JSON Feed and in Feed.TXT (even simpler) if you want
to lookup the content in html it is always in content_html. A bonus
summary is in summary (always in text) and content in plain text is in
content_text.

  Now where's the money? I'd say that's the wrong way to look at
it. I'd say learn from evolution - simpler, easier wins - might take
years - but watch ;-). Cheers.

PS: Bonus: Talk Notes from last week "Meet Jason Feed - The New Web
Feed & Syndication Guy - The Future of Online News 'n' Facebook & Co"
[3].

[1] 
https://github.com/feedparser/feedparser/blob/master/lib/feedparser/builder/rss.rb
[2] 
https://github.com/feedparser/feedparser/blob/master/lib/feedparser/builder/json.rb
[3] https://github.com/geraldb/talks/blob/master/jsonfeed.md

2017-06-06 18:41 GMT+02:00 James Smits :
> I know this is the wrong list for this, but JSON Feed seems like as much of
> a joke as Feed.TXT.  RSS works and has widespread adoption.  As far as I can
> tell there is no upside to JSON feed other than "it isn't XML".  I don't see
> a business case for supporting another feed format simply because JSON is
> easier to parse.
>
> On Tue, Jun 6, 2017 at 3:25 AM, Gerald Bauer  wrote:
>>
>> Hello,
>>
>>The structured meta data block is (simplified) YAML [1] e.g:
>>
>> id:http://therecord.co/chris-parrish
>>  title: Special #1 - Chris Parrish
>>  url:   http://therecord.co/chris-parrish
>>  summary:   Brent interviews Chris Parrish, co-host of The Record and
>> one-half of Aged & Distilled.
>>  published: 2014-05-09T14:04:00-07:00
>>  attachments:
>>  - url:
>> http://therecord.co/downloads/The-Record-sp1e1-ChrisParrish.m4a
>>mime_type: audio/x-m4a
>>size_in_bytes: 89970236,
>>duration_in_seconds: 6629
>>
>>
>>As an alternative you can use "classic" JSON or newer human
>> versions (e.g. SON - Simple Object Notation, JSON5 or HJSON, for
>> example). If you use JSON than the begin / next / end marker change
>> e.g.:
>>
>>|>>>  becomes|{
>>becomes   }/{
>><<<|  becomes}|
>>
>>  Cheers.
>>
>> [1] Good point- I know JSON is a subset of YAML and JSON is YAML but
>> YAML is not JSON etc.
>>
>> PS: In difference to the new YAML Feed format - Feed.TXT looks like a
>> joke too ;-) It's easy it can't be true but it's for real e.g. all
>> content blocks use plain text with markdown formatting conventions ;-)
>>  No more need to clean the HTML for cross-site scripting etc.
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>
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re: Feed.TXT - A Free Feeds Format in Plain Text w/ Structured Meta Data and Markdown ;-)

2017-06-06 Thread bowerbird via Markdown-Discuss 

gerald said:
>   May I highlight the latest (and greatest) feed format




aaron swartz in 2002 said:
>   http://www.aaronsw.com/2002/rss30



-bowerbird
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Re: Feed.TXT - A Free Feeds Format in Plain Text w/ Structured Meta Data and Markdown ; -)

2017-06-06 Thread Scott Granneman 
You just said it yourself: it’s easier to parse. That’s the business 
case.


Scott
--
R. Scott Granneman
[email protected] ~ www.granneman.com
Contact info: granneman.tel

“You must first have a lot of patience to learn to have patience.”
  ---Stanislaw Lem

On 6 Jun 2017, at 12:41, James Smits wrote:

I know this is the wrong list for this, but JSON Feed seems like as 
much of
a joke as Feed.TXT.  RSS works and has widespread adoption.  As far as 
I

can tell there is no upside to JSON feed other than "it isn't XML".  I
don't see a business case for supporting another feed format simply 
because

JSON is easier to parse.

On Tue, Jun 6, 2017 at 3:25 AM, Gerald Bauer  
wrote:



Hello,

   The structured meta data block is (simplified) YAML [1] e.g:

id:http://therecord.co/chris-parrish
 title: Special #1 - Chris Parrish
 url:   http://therecord.co/chris-parrish
 summary:   Brent interviews Chris Parrish, co-host of The Record and
one-half of Aged & Distilled.
 published: 2014-05-09T14:04:00-07:00
 attachments:
 - url:
http://therecord.co/downloads/The-Record-sp1e1-ChrisParrish.m4a
   mime_type: audio/x-m4a
   size_in_bytes: 89970236,
   duration_in_seconds: 6629


   As an alternative you can use "classic" JSON or newer human
versions (e.g. SON - Simple Object Notation, JSON5 or HJSON, for
example). If you use JSON than the begin / next / end marker change
e.g.:

   |>>>  becomes|{
   becomes   }/{
   <<<|  becomes}|

 Cheers.

[1] Good point- I know JSON is a subset of YAML and JSON is YAML but
YAML is not JSON etc.

PS: In difference to the new YAML Feed format - Feed.TXT looks like a
joke too ;-) It's easy it can't be true but it's for real e.g. all
content blocks use plain text with markdown formatting conventions 
;-)

 No more need to clean the HTML for cross-site scripting etc.
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Re: Feed.TXT - A Free Feeds Format in Plain Text w/ Structured Meta Data and Markdown ; -)

2017-06-06 Thread SP 
XML is so ugly that it's a big deal when something isn't written in it :)

-- 
SP
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Re: Feed.TXT - A Free Feeds Format in Plain Text w/ Structured Meta Data and Markdown ; -)

2017-06-06 Thread James Smits 
I know this is the wrong list for this, but JSON Feed seems like as much of
a joke as Feed.TXT.  RSS works and has widespread adoption.  As far as I
can tell there is no upside to JSON feed other than "it isn't XML".  I
don't see a business case for supporting another feed format simply because
JSON is easier to parse.

On Tue, Jun 6, 2017 at 3:25 AM, Gerald Bauer  wrote:

> Hello,
>
>The structured meta data block is (simplified) YAML [1] e.g:
>
> id:http://therecord.co/chris-parrish
>  title: Special #1 - Chris Parrish
>  url:   http://therecord.co/chris-parrish
>  summary:   Brent interviews Chris Parrish, co-host of The Record and
> one-half of Aged & Distilled.
>  published: 2014-05-09T14:04:00-07:00
>  attachments:
>  - url:
> http://therecord.co/downloads/The-Record-sp1e1-ChrisParrish.m4a
>mime_type: audio/x-m4a
>size_in_bytes: 89970236,
>duration_in_seconds: 6629
>
>
>As an alternative you can use "classic" JSON or newer human
> versions (e.g. SON - Simple Object Notation, JSON5 or HJSON, for
> example). If you use JSON than the begin / next / end marker change
> e.g.:
>
>|>>>  becomes|{
>becomes   }/{
><<<|  becomes}|
>
>  Cheers.
>
> [1] Good point- I know JSON is a subset of YAML and JSON is YAML but
> YAML is not JSON etc.
>
> PS: In difference to the new YAML Feed format - Feed.TXT looks like a
> joke too ;-) It's easy it can't be true but it's for real e.g. all
> content blocks use plain text with markdown formatting conventions ;-)
>  No more need to clean the HTML for cross-site scripting etc.
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Re: Feed.TXT - A Free Feeds Format in Plain Text w/ Structured Meta Data and Markdown ; -)

2017-06-06 Thread Gerald Bauer 
Hello,

   The structured meta data block is (simplified) YAML [1] e.g:

id:http://therecord.co/chris-parrish
 title: Special #1 - Chris Parrish
 url:   http://therecord.co/chris-parrish
 summary:   Brent interviews Chris Parrish, co-host of The Record and
one-half of Aged & Distilled.
 published: 2014-05-09T14:04:00-07:00
 attachments:
 - url:
http://therecord.co/downloads/The-Record-sp1e1-ChrisParrish.m4a
   mime_type: audio/x-m4a
   size_in_bytes: 89970236,
   duration_in_seconds: 6629


   As an alternative you can use "classic" JSON or newer human
versions (e.g. SON - Simple Object Notation, JSON5 or HJSON, for
example). If you use JSON than the begin / next / end marker change
e.g.:

   |>>>  becomes|{
   becomes   }/{
   <<<|  becomes}|

 Cheers.

[1] Good point- I know JSON is a subset of YAML and JSON is YAML but
YAML is not JSON etc.

PS: In difference to the new YAML Feed format - Feed.TXT looks like a
joke too ;-) It's easy it can't be true but it's for real e.g. all
content blocks use plain text with markdown formatting conventions ;-)
 No more need to clean the HTML for cross-site scripting etc.
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Re: Feed.TXT - A Free Feeds Format in Plain Text w/ Structured Meta Data and Markdown ; -)

2017-06-05 Thread James Smits 
So is that pure YAML, or YAML with JSON conventions,?

Sent from my iPhone

> On Jun 5, 2017, at 7:55 PM, Gerald Bauer  wrote:
> 
> Hello,
> 
>   May I highlight the latest (and greatest) feed format in -
> surprise, surprise - plain text with markdown formatting ;-)
> 
>   The structured meta data is in (simplified) yaml or (human) json.
> 
>   See samples at the Feed.TXT project site [1]
> 
>Questions? Comments? Welcome. Cheers.
> 
> [1] https://feedtxt.github.io
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Re: beaker-browser supports light-markup sites

2017-06-02 Thread Sherwood Botsford 
FWIW  my solution is to use TextWrangler for editing markdown files,
fswatch to monitor the directory tree, and process the MD files to html
files.

This allows me a consitent editor environment.  (I hate swtiching editors.)



Regards

Sherwood


On 2 June 2017 at 00:32, Gerald Bauer  wrote:

> Hello,
>
> > falls in the solution-in-search-of-a-problem tag?
> >
> > help my out of myopia.
>
>Maybe an analogy helps:
>
>Who needs markdown - it's a solution-in-search-of-a-problem. Just
> write HTML. That's the same myopia. HTML *is* plain text and *is*
> beautiful.
>
>Anyways, use what works for you. Emacs is great. Cheers.
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Re: beaker-browser supports light-markup sites

2017-06-01 Thread Gerald Bauer 
Hello,

> falls in the solution-in-search-of-a-problem tag?
>
> help my out of myopia.

   Maybe an analogy helps:

   Who needs markdown - it's a solution-in-search-of-a-problem. Just
write HTML. That's the same myopia. HTML *is* plain text and *is*
beautiful.

   Anyways, use what works for you. Emacs is great. Cheers.
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Re: beaker-browser supports light-markup sites

2017-06-01 Thread Marty McGowan 
at the risk of appearing like a curmudgeon,
a. where's emacs, and
b.  the profusion of editors falls in the
solution-in-search-of-a-problem tag?

help my out of myopia.

=*+*-  Marty McGowan  908 230-3739
http://alum.mit.edu/www/mcgowan

On Thu, Jun 1, 2017, at 01:34, Gerald Bauer wrote:
> Hello,
> 
>Thanks for highlighting beaker browser. Why not add it to the
> "Awesome Markdown Editors & (Pre)viewers" page [1]?  It's all markdown
> in the browser on github ;-)
> 
>Cheers.
> 
> [1] https://github.com/mundimark/awesome-markdown-editors
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Re: beaker-browser supports light-markup sites

2017-05-31 Thread Gerald Bauer 
Hello,

   Thanks for highlighting beaker browser. Why not add it to the
"Awesome Markdown Editors & (Pre)viewers" page [1]?  It's all markdown
in the browser on github ;-)

   Cheers.

[1] https://github.com/mundimark/awesome-markdown-editors
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Re: Instantly convert a webpage to Markdown

2017-04-07 Thread Gerald Bauer 
Hello,

Thanks for sharing the "Heck Yes Markdown" site / service.

   Add it the Awesome Markdown [1] page in the "Hypertext Markup
Language (HTML) to Markdown / More"  section. Cheers.

[1] https://github.com/mundimark/awesome-markdown
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Re: Proposal for (source-side) hyphenation support

2017-04-01 Thread Nico Huber 
On 01.04.2017 23:45, Fletcher T. Penney wrote:
> 
> 
> On 4/1/17 5:16 PM, Aristotle Pagaltzis wrote:
>>
 4. As to your specific syntax suggestion, this would not work well
 in MultiMarkdown, as the `\\\n` syntax is already used to indicate
 linebreaks, in addition to the `  \n` (space-space-newline) to
 improve visibility.

 
>>> Every language where I've seen escaped new-line chars so far, used it
>>> to ignore the line break.
>> That’s exactly what Fletcher just said MultiMarkdown already does.
>>
>>> We should fix MultiMarkdown then ;) just kidding
>> What’s there to fix?
> 
> Actually, MMD doesn't use escaped new-lines to ignore, but rather to
> convert to .  In fact, the default action is to ignore newlines, so
> I'm unclear as to why one would escape them for that purpose:
> 
> This line\n
> and another line.
> 
> The newline character is ignored -- the generated HTML (or LaTeX or ODF,
> etc) treats the output the same whether the text is included on a single
> line (replacing \n with a space) or keeping the \n intact.
> 
> I don't understand how Markdown could ignore the newline any more than
> it already does. ;)

It copies them to HTML. That's not ignoring. In HTML (etc) it's sup-
posed to be interpreted as whitespace. That's not ignoring either.

In my proposal, ignoring the new-line character would serve the purpose
to recombine a word that was broken after a hyphen. Currently you'd get
a space after the hyphen in the output.

Nico

> 
> 
> MMD allows this:
> 
> This line\\\n
> and another line.
> 
> to become:
> 
> This line
> and another line.
> 
> The main reason being that it is difficult to quickly identify the
> "space-space-newline" syntax otherwise required to insert a linebreak
> (unless your text editor specifically flags it in some way -- MMD
> Composer does this, for instance).
> 
> 
> (I realize this is tangential to the main thread, but didn't want to
> confuse anyone stumbling across this thread.)
> 
> Fletcher
> 
> 
> PS> I just reread your (Nico) comment again, and realized that when I
> read "every language" I assumed you meant "every Markdown variant",
> which honestly did not make much sense to me (as above).  If instead, I
> substitute "every programming language", then your comments do make
> sense to me, as newlines are not necessarily ignored in all programming
> languages.  In that case, however, the default is to ignore them so a
> separate notation to tell Markdown to ignore a newline is unnecessary.
> In that scenario, one should not read the "\\\n" syntax as escaping a
> newline per se, but rather hijacking the escape syntax for a slightly
> different purpose so that I did not have to introduce an entirely new
> syntax for linebreaks.  In MMD version 6, I do the same thing for
> "\\space" to mean a non-breaking space.  The advantage of this syntax is
> that the fallback for "\\\n" and "\\space" in other Markdown parsers
> besides MMD is to simply treat them as a regular newline and regular
> space, which is not the end of the world in most situations.
> 

Right, I meant "language" in the "programming language" sense.

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Re: Proposal for (source-side) hyphenation support

2017-04-01 Thread Fletcher T. Penney 



On 4/1/17 5:16 PM, Aristotle Pagaltzis wrote:



4. As to your specific syntax suggestion, this would not work well
in MultiMarkdown, as the `\\\n` syntax is already used to indicate
linebreaks, in addition to the `  \n` (space-space-newline) to
improve visibility.



Every language where I've seen escaped new-line chars so far, used it
to ignore the line break.

That’s exactly what Fletcher just said MultiMarkdown already does.


We should fix MultiMarkdown then ;) just kidding

What’s there to fix?


Actually, MMD doesn't use escaped new-lines to ignore, but rather to 
convert to .  In fact, the default action is to ignore newlines, so 
I'm unclear as to why one would escape them for that purpose:


This line\n
and another line.

The newline character is ignored -- the generated HTML (or LaTeX or ODF, 
etc) treats the output the same whether the text is included on a single 
line (replacing \n with a space) or keeping the \n intact.


I don't understand how Markdown could ignore the newline any more than 
it already does. ;)



MMD allows this:

This line\\\n
and another line.

to become:

This line
and another line.

The main reason being that it is difficult to quickly identify the 
"space-space-newline" syntax otherwise required to insert a linebreak 
(unless your text editor specifically flags it in some way -- MMD 
Composer does this, for instance).



(I realize this is tangential to the main thread, but didn't want to 
confuse anyone stumbling across this thread.)


Fletcher


PS> I just reread your (Nico) comment again, and realized that when I 
read "every language" I assumed you meant "every Markdown variant", 
which honestly did not make much sense to me (as above).  If instead, I 
substitute "every programming language", then your comments do make 
sense to me, as newlines are not necessarily ignored in all programming 
languages.  In that case, however, the default is to ignore them so a 
separate notation to tell Markdown to ignore a newline is unnecessary. 
In that scenario, one should not read the "\\\n" syntax as escaping a 
newline per se, but rather hijacking the escape syntax for a slightly 
different purpose so that I did not have to introduce an entirely new 
syntax for linebreaks.  In MMD version 6, I do the same thing for 
"\\space" to mean a non-breaking space.  The advantage of this syntax is 
that the fallback for "\\\n" and "\\space" in other Markdown parsers 
besides MMD is to simply treat them as a regular newline and regular 
space, which is not the end of the world in most situations.


--
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Re: Proposal for (source-side) hyphenation support

2017-04-01 Thread Aristotle Pagaltzis 
* Nico Huber  [2017-04-01 12:48]:
> On 01.04.2017 04:22, Fletcher T. Penney wrote:
> > 2. To me, this seems to be a rather idiosyncratic request.
> > I understand that it is a desirable feature to you, but I suspect
> > the number of others who desire this feature is quite low (witness
> > that most replies don't even *understand* your request, much less
> > support it.)
>
> I thought the general idea behind Markdown is to mark up text while
> maintaining readability (of the untransformed source). And I doubt the
> reaction on this list counts as representative.

The constituency for this feature would be people who manually hyphenate
their plain-text documents. That makes me very sure that the reaction on
this list is representative.

> > 4. As to your specific syntax suggestion, this would not work well
> > in MultiMarkdown, as the `\\\n` syntax is already used to indicate
> > linebreaks, in addition to the `  \n` (space-space-newline) to
> > improve visibility.
> >
> > 
>
> Every language where I've seen escaped new-line chars so far, used it
> to ignore the line break.

That’s exactly what Fletcher just said MultiMarkdown already does.

> We should fix MultiMarkdown then ;) just kidding

What’s there to fix?

Regards,
-- 
Aristotle Pagaltzis // 
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Re: Proposal for (source-side) hyphenation support

2017-04-01 Thread Nico Huber 
Hi Fletcher,

On 01.04.2017 04:22, Fletcher T. Penney wrote:
> Nico,
> 
> Just for the sake of giving you an on-topic reply ;) 

thank you!

> 
> I understand that you don't want to change HTML, just the Markdown
> syntax to basically ignore manually entered hyphens at the end of lines.
> 
> 1. Markdown, per se, is frozen as it has not seen an update in 10+ years
> (I'm too lazy to check exact dates right now, but it's close enough.)
> So, at best, you could hope to get your proposal accepted by some subset
> of Markdown variants.  Or create your own.  ;)

Well, it's never too late ;) a pity though. I'll have people add it to
their software if anyone ever complains about my hyphens (I'm usually
not the one who converts my Markdown).

> 
> 2. To me, this seems to be a rather idiosyncratic request.  I understand
> that it is a desirable feature to you, but I suspect the number of
> others who desire this feature is quite low (witness that most replies
> don't even *understand* your request, much less support it.)

I thought the general idea behind Markdown is to mark up text while
maintaining readability (of the untransformed source). And I doubt the
reaction on this list counts as representative.

> 
> 3. I think your best bet is to implement it yourself in your own build
> of Markdown (or whatever variant you prefer.)  That could be done rather
> quickly, as compared to the time it would take to garner enough support
> to implement it more broadly.  Alternatively, you could quickly create a
> pre-processing script that searches for your regexp and strips out any
> matches before passing your source to your markdown processor. Something
> like the following (not tested, just to prompt actual ideas):
> 
> cat text.md | perl -pe 's/\-\n([^\n])/$1/g' | Markdown.pl >
> output.html
> 
> 4. As to your specific syntax suggestion, this would not work well in
> MultiMarkdown, as the `\\\n` syntax is already used to indicate
> linebreaks, in addition to the `  \n` (space-space-newline) to improve
> visibility.
> 
> 

Every language where I've seen escaped new-line chars so far, used it to
ignore the line break. We should fix MultiMarkdown then ;) just kidding

> Hope some of that helps...

Yep, especially the "is frozen" part (on Daring Fireball it still says
this ML is the place to discuss "formatting syntax").

Nico

> 
> 
> Fletcher
> 
> 
> On 3/31/17 12:57 PM, Nico Huber wrote:
>> Hi there,
>>
>> don't know if this has been discussed before, or if I just overlooked
>> how to do it: I'm missing support for hyphenation in Markdown files.
>> Looking at always ragged HTML pages is already hard enough, so I can't
>> bear anything but halfway justified text in my editor and manually hy-
>> phenate words.
>>
>> I would do it as follows: 1. If a hyphen followed by a single new-line
>> character is encountered "-\n[^\n]", drop the hyphen and any following
>> whitespace. 2. In case you have to break a word that includes a hyphen,
>> you would escape the new-line character "-\\\n". Like this: Escape new-\
>> line character to preserve the hyphen. This way, the hyphen wouldn't
>> occur in front of the new-line char and 1. doesn't apply. Although, any
>> whitespace following the new-line char would also have to be dropped in
>> this case.
>>
>> What do you think?
>>
>> Regards,
>> Nico

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Re: Proposal for (source-side) hyphenation support

2017-03-31 Thread Fletcher T. Penney 

Nico,

Just for the sake of giving you an on-topic reply ;) 

I understand that you don't want to change HTML, just the Markdown 
syntax to basically ignore manually entered hyphens at the end of lines.


1. Markdown, per se, is frozen as it has not seen an update in 10+ years 
(I'm too lazy to check exact dates right now, but it's close enough.) 
So, at best, you could hope to get your proposal accepted by some subset 
of Markdown variants.  Or create your own.  ;)


2. To me, this seems to be a rather idiosyncratic request.  I understand 
that it is a desirable feature to you, but I suspect the number of 
others who desire this feature is quite low (witness that most replies 
don't even *understand* your request, much less support it.)


3. I think your best bet is to implement it yourself in your own build 
of Markdown (or whatever variant you prefer.)  That could be done rather 
quickly, as compared to the time it would take to garner enough support 
to implement it more broadly.  Alternatively, you could quickly create a 
pre-processing script that searches for your regexp and strips out any 
matches before passing your source to your markdown processor. 
Something like the following (not tested, just to prompt actual ideas):


cat text.md | perl -pe 's/\-\n([^\n])/$1/g' | Markdown.pl > 
output.html

4. As to your specific syntax suggestion, this would not work well in 
MultiMarkdown, as the `\\\n` syntax is already used to indicate 
linebreaks, in addition to the `  \n` (space-space-newline) to improve 
visibility.





Hope some of that helps...


Fletcher


On 3/31/17 12:57 PM, Nico Huber wrote:

Hi there,

don't know if this has been discussed before, or if I just overlooked
how to do it: I'm missing support for hyphenation in Markdown files.
Looking at always ragged HTML pages is already hard enough, so I can't
bear anything but halfway justified text in my editor and manually hy-
phenate words.

I would do it as follows: 1. If a hyphen followed by a single new-line
character is encountered "-\n[^\n]", drop the hyphen and any following
whitespace. 2. In case you have to break a word that includes a hyphen,
you would escape the new-line character "-\\\n". Like this: Escape new-\
line character to preserve the hyphen. This way, the hyphen wouldn't
occur in front of the new-line char and 1. doesn't apply. Although, any
whitespace following the new-line char would also have to be dropped in
this case.

What do you think?

Regards,
Nico
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RE: Proposal for (source-side) hyphenation support

2017-03-31 Thread Dennis E. Hamilton 


> -Original Message-
> From: Nico Huber [mailto:[email protected]]
> Sent: Friday, March 31, 2017 11:33
> To: [email protected]; Discussion related to Markdown.  [email protected]>
> Subject: Re: Proposal for (source-side) hyphenation support
> 
> On 31.03.2017 19:27, Dennis E. Hamilton wrote:
> >
> >
> >> -Original Message-
> >> From: Markdown-Discuss [mailto:markdown-discuss-
> >> [email protected]] On Behalf Of Nico Huber
> >> Sent: Friday, March 31, 2017 09:58
> >> To: markdown-discuss 
> >> Subject: Proposal for (source-side) hyphenation support
> >>
> >> Hi there,
> >>
> >> don't know if this has been discussed before, or if I just overlooked
> >> how to do it: I'm missing support for hyphenation in Markdown files.
> >> Looking at always ragged HTML pages is already hard enough, so I
> can't
> >> bear anything but halfway justified text in my editor and manually
> hy-
> >> phenate words.
[ ... ]
> >
> > I think we need to think about how this is conveyed into HTML, and
> what
> > browsers might do, since that is where the actual layout width is
> > determined.  It should be assumed that reflow can happen at any time
> and
> > the soft-hyphen might be usable along with whatever other automatic
> > hyphenation the browser uses.
> >
> > A direct method would be to insert soft-hyphen (SHY) codes, code-point
> > 0xAD in Unicode and in Latin-1.
> >
> > I recommend working backward from that to find a Markdown escape that
> > serves this purpose.
> 
> Sorry, I should have made it more clear. I'm not talking about any
> effective change of the output. My purpose is to enhance readability
> of the Markdown source. Any "escape" that differs visually much from
> the usual hyphen before a line break wouldn't serve "this purpose".
[orcmid] 

I don't understand the use-case you describe.  What do you expect the 
(canonical) HTML to be and how is it determined that a hard hyphen is involved?

Or are you breaking the hyphenation in the markdown but don't want the break in 
the result; you want to glue the word back together (and reflow of the output 
makes a break or not)?

Is this more like you want to insert a hard break in the Markdown text, but it 
is invisible in the output, sort of like the C-Language(s) "\" line-ending?


> 
> The ability to add hyphenation hints in the output might be useful,
> too. But is off topic for me.
> 
> Nico

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Re: Proposal for (source-side) hyphenation support

2017-03-31 Thread Nico Huber 
On 01.04.2017 00:26, Joshua Haase wrote:
> Sherwood Botsford  writes:
> 
>> You don't want to do it in markdown at all.
>>
>> A better way to do this would be with a dictionary that knew how words were
>> hyphenated, and it would insert soft hyphens globally.
>>
>> This would likely be a post processing step.  E.g. Markdown -> Html ->
>> softhypenate.
> 
> I agree.

Huh, could you please open your own thread. I already tried to make it
clear that hyphenation in the output format is off-topic.

Nico

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Re: Proposal for (source-side) hyphenation support

2017-03-31 Thread Joshua Haase 
Sherwood Botsford  writes:

> You don't want to do it in markdown at all.
>
> A better way to do this would be with a dictionary that knew how words were
> hyphenated, and it would insert soft hyphens globally.
>
> This would likely be a post processing step.  E.g. Markdown -> Html ->
> softhypenate.

I agree.
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Re: Proposal for (source-side) hyphenation support

2017-03-31 Thread Sherwood Botsford 
You don't want to do it in markdown at all.

A better way to do this would be with a dictionary that knew how words were
hyphenated, and it would insert soft hyphens globally.

This would likely be a post processing step.  E.g. Markdown -> Html ->
softhypenate.

You want it to be separate because different languages have differing
conventions.

Ideally, you want it robust.  So you try to do as much as possible with
rules, then you are explicit with the odd balls.  This would make a program
that did the right thing most of the time.

This *should* happen in the browser.

I won't hold my breath.

Regards

Sherwood


On 31 March 2017 at 12:33, Nico Huber  wrote:

> On 31.03.2017 19:27, Dennis E. Hamilton wrote:
> >
> >
> >> -Original Message-
> >> From: Markdown-Discuss [mailto:markdown-discuss-
> >> [email protected]] On Behalf Of Nico Huber
> >> Sent: Friday, March 31, 2017 09:58
> >> To: markdown-discuss 
> >> Subject: Proposal for (source-side) hyphenation support
> >>
> >> Hi there,
> >>
> >> don't know if this has been discussed before, or if I just overlooked
> >> how to do it: I'm missing support for hyphenation in Markdown files.
> >> Looking at always ragged HTML pages is already hard enough, so I can't
> >> bear anything but halfway justified text in my editor and manually hy-
> >> phenate words.
> >>
> >> I would do it as follows: 1. If a hyphen followed by a single new-line
> >> character is encountered "-\n[^\n]", drop the hyphen and any following
> >> whitespace. 2. In case you have to break a word that includes a hyphen,
> >> you would escape the new-line character "-\\\n". Like this: Escape new-\
> >> line character to preserve the hyphen. This way, the hyphen wouldn't
> >> occur in front of the new-line char and 1. doesn't apply. Although, any
> >> whitespace following the new-line char would also have to be dropped in
> >> this case.
> >>
> >> What do you think?
> > [orcmid]
> >
> > I think we need to think about how this is conveyed into HTML, and what
> > browsers might do, since that is where the actual layout width is
> > determined.  It should be assumed that reflow can happen at any time and
> > the soft-hyphen might be usable along with whatever other automatic
> > hyphenation the browser uses.
> >
> > A direct method would be to insert soft-hyphen (SHY) codes, code-point
> > 0xAD in Unicode and in Latin-1.
> >
> > I recommend working backward from that to find a Markdown escape that
> > serves this purpose.
>
> Sorry, I should have made it more clear. I'm not talking about any
> effective change of the output. My purpose is to enhance readability
> of the Markdown source. Any "escape" that differs visually much from
> the usual hyphen before a line break wouldn't serve "this purpose".
>
> The ability to add hyphenation hints in the output might be useful,
> too. But is off topic for me.
>
> Nico
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Re: Proposal for (source-side) hyphenation support

2017-03-31 Thread Nico Huber 
On 31.03.2017 19:27, Dennis E. Hamilton wrote:
> 
> 
>> -Original Message-
>> From: Markdown-Discuss [mailto:markdown-discuss-
>> [email protected]] On Behalf Of Nico Huber
>> Sent: Friday, March 31, 2017 09:58
>> To: markdown-discuss 
>> Subject: Proposal for (source-side) hyphenation support
>>
>> Hi there,
>>
>> don't know if this has been discussed before, or if I just overlooked
>> how to do it: I'm missing support for hyphenation in Markdown files.
>> Looking at always ragged HTML pages is already hard enough, so I can't
>> bear anything but halfway justified text in my editor and manually hy-
>> phenate words.
>>
>> I would do it as follows: 1. If a hyphen followed by a single new-line
>> character is encountered "-\n[^\n]", drop the hyphen and any following
>> whitespace. 2. In case you have to break a word that includes a hyphen,
>> you would escape the new-line character "-\\\n". Like this: Escape new-\
>> line character to preserve the hyphen. This way, the hyphen wouldn't
>> occur in front of the new-line char and 1. doesn't apply. Although, any
>> whitespace following the new-line char would also have to be dropped in
>> this case.
>>
>> What do you think?
> [orcmid] 
> 
> I think we need to think about how this is conveyed into HTML, and what
> browsers might do, since that is where the actual layout width is
> determined.  It should be assumed that reflow can happen at any time and
> the soft-hyphen might be usable along with whatever other automatic
> hyphenation the browser uses.
> 
> A direct method would be to insert soft-hyphen (SHY) codes, code-point
> 0xAD in Unicode and in Latin-1.  
> 
> I recommend working backward from that to find a Markdown escape that
> serves this purpose.

Sorry, I should have made it more clear. I'm not talking about any
effective change of the output. My purpose is to enhance readability
of the Markdown source. Any "escape" that differs visually much from
the usual hyphen before a line break wouldn't serve "this purpose".

The ability to add hyphenation hints in the output might be useful,
too. But is off topic for me.

Nico
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RE: Proposal for (source-side) hyphenation support

2017-03-31 Thread Dennis E. Hamilton 


> -Original Message-
> From: Markdown-Discuss [mailto:markdown-discuss-
> [email protected]] On Behalf Of Nico Huber
> Sent: Friday, March 31, 2017 09:58
> To: markdown-discuss 
> Subject: Proposal for (source-side) hyphenation support
> 
> Hi there,
> 
> don't know if this has been discussed before, or if I just overlooked
> how to do it: I'm missing support for hyphenation in Markdown files.
> Looking at always ragged HTML pages is already hard enough, so I can't
> bear anything but halfway justified text in my editor and manually hy-
> phenate words.
> 
> I would do it as follows: 1. If a hyphen followed by a single new-line
> character is encountered "-\n[^\n]", drop the hyphen and any following
> whitespace. 2. In case you have to break a word that includes a hyphen,
> you would escape the new-line character "-\\\n". Like this: Escape new-\
> line character to preserve the hyphen. This way, the hyphen wouldn't
> occur in front of the new-line char and 1. doesn't apply. Although, any
> whitespace following the new-line char would also have to be dropped in
> this case.
> 
> What do you think?
[orcmid] 

I think we need to think about how this is conveyed into HTML, and what 
browsers might do, since that is where the actual layout width is determined.  
It should be assumed that reflow can happen at any time and the soft-hyphen 
might be usable along with whatever other automatic hyphenation the browser 
uses.

A direct method would be to insert soft-hyphen (SHY) codes, code-point 0xAD in 
Unicode and in Latin-1.  

I recommend working backward from that to find a Markdown escape that serves 
this purpose.

> 
> Regards,
> Nico
> ___
> Markdown-Discuss mailing list
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Re: Original Markdown.pl v1.0.1 Script (Anno 2004) Unzipped and Archived for Easy Browsing on Github

2017-03-20 Thread Gerald Bauer 
Hello,

   Great. Thanks for highlighting the Markdown repo. Way better. Has
all the version from 1.0 to 1.0.2b8.  Might upgrade to 1.0.2b8 ;-)
not sure where I can find it. Cheers.

PS: By the way I added the SmartyPants "addon" [1] to the repo too.

[1] https://github.com/mundimark/markdown.pl/tree/master/smartypants

2017-03-20 15:47 GMT+01:00 Aristotle Pagaltzis :
> Hi Gerald,
>
> * Gerald Bauer  [2017-03-20 14:48]:
>> Anyone knows if the original Markdown.pl [1] script by John Gruber
>> has a home on GitHub (or similar service) for easy browsing?
>
> some time ago I set up a repo which has each Markdown.pl release as
> a commit on master: https://github.com/ap/Markdown
>
> Or rather, every release I could still find. The release tarballs and
> zips are all committed in the `sources` branch, together with a script
> to generate the `master` branch history from them, plus a README to
> explain the whole conceit: https://github.com/ap/Markdown/tree/sources
>
> I have been intending to ping John about this, as well as to put out
> a public call for anyone who happens to still have other releases,
> but that hasn’t happened yet. Nevertheless, what’s there is at least
> a start.
>
> Regards,
> --
> Aristotle Pagaltzis // 
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Re: Original Markdown.pl v1.0.1 Script (Anno 2004) Unzipped and Archived for Easy Browsing on Github

2017-03-20 Thread Aristotle Pagaltzis 
Hi Gerald,

* Gerald Bauer  [2017-03-20 14:48]:
> Anyone knows if the original Markdown.pl [1] script by John Gruber
> has a home on GitHub (or similar service) for easy browsing?

some time ago I set up a repo which has each Markdown.pl release as
a commit on master: https://github.com/ap/Markdown

Or rather, every release I could still find. The release tarballs and
zips are all committed in the `sources` branch, together with a script
to generate the `master` branch history from them, plus a README to
explain the whole conceit: https://github.com/ap/Markdown/tree/sources

I have been intending to ping John about this, as well as to put out
a public call for anyone who happens to still have other releases,
but that hasn’t happened yet. Nevertheless, what’s there is at least
a start.

Regards,
-- 
Aristotle Pagaltzis // 
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Re: Markdown documents to OO/LO Writer and Impress

2016-11-16 Thread H 
On November 12, 2016 5:45:28 PM EST, H  wrote:
>This is promising and I would love to try MultiMarkdown. I went to your
>site and downloaded from github but the latest version is sadly not
>compatible with Windows Vista I have on my netbook. Is there a 32-bit
>version that I can try? Also, I see there is a Mac-version but I also
>need to run it on CentOS (Red Hat).
>
>The above are showstoppers of course but does MultiMarkdown support
>"folding", i.e. hiding sections like in a DOS outliner?
>
>On 11/12/2016 12:49 PM, Fletcher T. Penney wrote:
>> MultiMarkdown has supported the Flat OpenDocument format for many
>years. It currently supports it for Writer documents, but there is no
>reason the same approach couldn't be used to create Impress
>presentations. Technically, one could also create spreadsheet files as
>well, but not sure that's a good idea.
>>
>> In fact, using the existing beamer format output and the ODF format
>conversions, it should be relatively easy to create a converter for
>presentations.
>>
>>
>> https://github.com/fletcher/MultiMarkdown-5
>>
>> http://fletcherpenney.net/multimarkdown/
>>
>>
>> Fletcher
>>
>>
>>
>> On 11/12/16 12:24 PM, Dennis E. Hamilton wrote:
>>>
>>>
 -Original Message-
 From: Markdown-Discuss [mailto:markdown-discuss-
 [email protected]] On Behalf Of H
 Sent: Saturday, November 12, 2016 08:34
 To: Markdown Discussion Mailing List
>
 Subject: Markdown documents to OO/LO Writer and Impress

 I am a recent convert to using markdown for creating draft
>documents,
 outlines etc. My primary OS is CentOS where I use geany with a
>plugin
 although I believe gedit also allows for creating/editing markdown
 documents(?) On windows I have both geany, markdown pad íí, and
>notepad
 ii.

 I do use tables a lot and since I like to use markdown for outlines
>of
 complex documents I would like to see easy folding of sections,
>similar
 to what you could do with the old DOS outliners. Alas, combining
>those
 two requirements in a modern editor seems impossible...

 Now I would also like to create drafts of documents and of slide
 presentations in markdown to later be transferred to OpenOffice or
 LibreOffice Writer for finishing the text documents or OpenOffice
>or
 LibreOffice Impress for finishing slide presentations. Ideally
>allowing
 me to go both ways for the final version.

 I do not seem able to accomplish the latter and have not found the
>ideal
 markdown editor yet - suggestions welcome!
>>> [orcmid]
>>>
>>> There is a single-file XML format for ODF documents that would work
>for conversion from markdown and import to one of LibreOffice Writer or
>LibreOffice Impress.  This works so long as (1) you have no images or
>other external imports and (2) you can come up with a converter.  Since
>conversions to HTML are commonplace, it might be possible to craft a
>converter that makes ODF single-file XML instead.  But someone needs to
>hack on the respective code.  Fortunately, the ODF Table format matches
>the row-major order that is used in the Markdown and in HTML tables. 
>Styling is different, but a converter would do some sort of fixed
>stylings (and font settings) that could be changed in the desktop
>software.  You would also be editing pagination, headers/footers, etc.,
>in the target software anyhow.  There might be a way to set up
>templates for some of this and merge those in, but I don't know enough
>about that to be entirely confident about it.
>>>
>>> Apache OpenOffice does not consume the single-file XML format, so
>there is a bit more work to provide a conversion in that case.  Namely,
>AOO and LibreOffice both accept the Zip-package format of ODF documents
>and those can be produced with a bit more effort - the contents of the
>Zip is a set of XML files plus a manifest.  The single-file format is
>convertible to the Zip-package format in a straightforward manner, so
>it would be a good step-up from a single-file producer.  The greatest
>advantage is the fact that there is compression and now a way to
>package images and other artifacts within the multi-file contents of
>the ODF package.
>>>
>>> Adding either of these conversions as input filters to either
>OpenOffice.org descendant is probably beyond the call of duty. It would
>be easier to have a converter essentially "pipe" its output into one of
>them, which is practical.
>>>
>>> Also, Microsoft office will consume the ODF package formats for Text
>(Writer) and Presentation (Impress) formats, and anything originated in
>MarkDown should import just fine.
>>>
>>> Finally, if you can find a Markdown to RTF or any of the classic or
>OOXML Microsoft Office formats, that should produce something simple
>enough that you can import into one of LibreOffice or Apache OpenOffice
>with decent fidelity as well.
>>>
>>> These are all interesting challenge projects for document-processing
>tools.  Whether

Re: Markdown documents to OO/LO Writer and Impress

2016-11-12 Thread H 

Just found the 32-bit version, downloaded, installed and tried to launch it but 
it cannot be launched on Vista (no error messages.) Is it supposed to work on 
Vista?


On 11/12/2016 5:45 PM, H wrote:

This is promising and I would love to try MultiMarkdown. I went to your site 
and downloaded from github but the latest version is sadly not compatible with 
Windows Vista I have on my netbook. Is there a 32-bit version that I can try? 
Also, I see there is a Mac-version but I also need to run it on CentOS (Red 
Hat).

The above are showstoppers of course but does MultiMarkdown support "folding", 
i.e. hiding sections like in a DOS outliner?

On 11/12/2016 12:49 PM, Fletcher T. Penney wrote:

MultiMarkdown has supported the Flat OpenDocument format for many years. It 
currently supports it for Writer documents, but there is no reason the same 
approach couldn't be used to create Impress presentations. Technically, one 
could also create spreadsheet files as well, but not sure that's a good idea.

In fact, using the existing beamer format output and the ODF format 
conversions, it should be relatively easy to create a converter for 
presentations.


https://github.com/fletcher/MultiMarkdown-5

http://fletcherpenney.net/multimarkdown/


Fletcher



On 11/12/16 12:24 PM, Dennis E. Hamilton wrote:




-Original Message-
From: Markdown-Discuss [mailto:markdown-discuss-
[email protected]] On Behalf Of H
Sent: Saturday, November 12, 2016 08:34
To: Markdown Discussion Mailing List 
Subject: Markdown documents to OO/LO Writer and Impress

I am a recent convert to using markdown for creating draft documents,
outlines etc. My primary OS is CentOS where I use geany with a plugin
although I believe gedit also allows for creating/editing markdown
documents(?) On windows I have both geany, markdown pad íí, and notepad
ii.

I do use tables a lot and since I like to use markdown for outlines of
complex documents I would like to see easy folding of sections, similar
to what you could do with the old DOS outliners. Alas, combining those
two requirements in a modern editor seems impossible...

Now I would also like to create drafts of documents and of slide
presentations in markdown to later be transferred to OpenOffice or
LibreOffice Writer for finishing the text documents or OpenOffice or
LibreOffice Impress for finishing slide presentations. Ideally allowing
me to go both ways for the final version.

I do not seem able to accomplish the latter and have not found the ideal
markdown editor yet - suggestions welcome!

[orcmid]

There is a single-file XML format for ODF documents that would work for 
conversion from markdown and import to one of LibreOffice Writer or LibreOffice 
Impress.  This works so long as (1) you have no images or other external 
imports and (2) you can come up with a converter.  Since conversions to HTML 
are commonplace, it might be possible to craft a converter that makes ODF 
single-file XML instead.  But someone needs to hack on the respective code.  
Fortunately, the ODF Table format matches the row-major order that is used in 
the Markdown and in HTML tables.  Styling is different, but a converter would 
do some sort of fixed stylings (and font settings) that could be changed in the 
desktop software.  You would also be editing pagination, headers/footers, etc., 
in the target software anyhow.  There might be a way to set up templates for 
some of this and merge those in, but I don't know enough about that to be 
entirely confident about it.

Apache OpenOffice does not consume the single-file XML format, so there is a 
bit more work to provide a conversion in that case.  Namely, AOO and 
LibreOffice both accept the Zip-package format of ODF documents and those can 
be produced with a bit more effort - the contents of the Zip is a set of XML 
files plus a manifest.  The single-file format is convertible to the 
Zip-package format in a straightforward manner, so it would be a good step-up 
from a single-file producer.  The greatest advantage is the fact that there is 
compression and now a way to package images and other artifacts within the 
multi-file contents of the ODF package.

Adding either of these conversions as input filters to either OpenOffice.org descendant 
is probably beyond the call of duty. It would be easier to have a converter essentially 
"pipe" its output into one of them, which is practical.

Also, Microsoft office will consume the ODF package formats for Text (Writer) 
and Presentation (Impress) formats, and anything originated in MarkDown should 
import just fine.

Finally, if you can find a Markdown to RTF or any of the classic or OOXML 
Microsoft Office formats, that should produce something simple enough that you 
can import into one of LibreOffice or Apache OpenOffice with decent fidelity as 
well.

These are all interesting challenge projects for document-processing tools.  
Whether there are enough piece parts out there to simply create a workflow 
through

Re: Markdown documents to OO/LO Writer and Impress

2016-11-12 Thread H 

This is promising and I would love to try MultiMarkdown. I went to your site 
and downloaded from github but the latest version is sadly not compatible with 
Windows Vista I have on my netbook. Is there a 32-bit version that I can try? 
Also, I see there is a Mac-version but I also need to run it on CentOS (Red 
Hat).

The above are showstoppers of course but does MultiMarkdown support "folding", 
i.e. hiding sections like in a DOS outliner?

On 11/12/2016 12:49 PM, Fletcher T. Penney wrote:

MultiMarkdown has supported the Flat OpenDocument format for many years. It 
currently supports it for Writer documents, but there is no reason the same 
approach couldn't be used to create Impress presentations. Technically, one 
could also create spreadsheet files as well, but not sure that's a good idea.

In fact, using the existing beamer format output and the ODF format 
conversions, it should be relatively easy to create a converter for 
presentations.


https://github.com/fletcher/MultiMarkdown-5

http://fletcherpenney.net/multimarkdown/


Fletcher



On 11/12/16 12:24 PM, Dennis E. Hamilton wrote:




-Original Message-
From: Markdown-Discuss [mailto:markdown-discuss-
[email protected]] On Behalf Of H
Sent: Saturday, November 12, 2016 08:34
To: Markdown Discussion Mailing List 
Subject: Markdown documents to OO/LO Writer and Impress

I am a recent convert to using markdown for creating draft documents,
outlines etc. My primary OS is CentOS where I use geany with a plugin
although I believe gedit also allows for creating/editing markdown
documents(?) On windows I have both geany, markdown pad íí, and notepad
ii.

I do use tables a lot and since I like to use markdown for outlines of
complex documents I would like to see easy folding of sections, similar
to what you could do with the old DOS outliners. Alas, combining those
two requirements in a modern editor seems impossible...

Now I would also like to create drafts of documents and of slide
presentations in markdown to later be transferred to OpenOffice or
LibreOffice Writer for finishing the text documents or OpenOffice or
LibreOffice Impress for finishing slide presentations. Ideally allowing
me to go both ways for the final version.

I do not seem able to accomplish the latter and have not found the ideal
markdown editor yet - suggestions welcome!

[orcmid]

There is a single-file XML format for ODF documents that would work for 
conversion from markdown and import to one of LibreOffice Writer or LibreOffice 
Impress.  This works so long as (1) you have no images or other external 
imports and (2) you can come up with a converter.  Since conversions to HTML 
are commonplace, it might be possible to craft a converter that makes ODF 
single-file XML instead.  But someone needs to hack on the respective code.  
Fortunately, the ODF Table format matches the row-major order that is used in 
the Markdown and in HTML tables.  Styling is different, but a converter would 
do some sort of fixed stylings (and font settings) that could be changed in the 
desktop software.  You would also be editing pagination, headers/footers, etc., 
in the target software anyhow.  There might be a way to set up templates for 
some of this and merge those in, but I don't know enough about that to be 
entirely confident about it.

Apache OpenOffice does not consume the single-file XML format, so there is a 
bit more work to provide a conversion in that case.  Namely, AOO and 
LibreOffice both accept the Zip-package format of ODF documents and those can 
be produced with a bit more effort - the contents of the Zip is a set of XML 
files plus a manifest.  The single-file format is convertible to the 
Zip-package format in a straightforward manner, so it would be a good step-up 
from a single-file producer.  The greatest advantage is the fact that there is 
compression and now a way to package images and other artifacts within the 
multi-file contents of the ODF package.

Adding either of these conversions as input filters to either OpenOffice.org descendant 
is probably beyond the call of duty. It would be easier to have a converter essentially 
"pipe" its output into one of them, which is practical.

Also, Microsoft office will consume the ODF package formats for Text (Writer) 
and Presentation (Impress) formats, and anything originated in MarkDown should 
import just fine.

Finally, if you can find a Markdown to RTF or any of the classic or OOXML 
Microsoft Office formats, that should produce something simple enough that you 
can import into one of LibreOffice or Apache OpenOffice with decent fidelity as 
well.

These are all interesting challenge projects for document-processing tools.  
Whether there are enough piece parts out there to simply create a workflow 
through them is more desirable and others here might have solutions.

Thanks for your interesting question.

 - Dennis


Thank you.






___
Markdown-Discuss

Re: Markdown documents to OO/LO Writer and Impress

2016-11-12 Thread H 

On 11/12/2016 12:24 PM, Dennis E. Hamilton wrote:



-Original Message-
From: Markdown-Discuss [mailto:markdown-discuss-
[email protected]] On Behalf Of H
Sent: Saturday, November 12, 2016 08:34
To: Markdown Discussion Mailing List 
Subject: Markdown documents to OO/LO Writer and Impress

I am a recent convert to using markdown for creating draft documents,
outlines etc. My primary OS is CentOS where I use geany with a plugin
although I believe gedit also allows for creating/editing markdown
documents(?) On windows I have both geany, markdown pad íí, and notepad
ii.

I do use tables a lot and since I like to use markdown for outlines of
complex documents I would like to see easy folding of sections, similar
to what you could do with the old DOS outliners. Alas, combining those
two requirements in a modern editor seems impossible...

Now I would also like to create drafts of documents and of slide
presentations in markdown to later be transferred to OpenOffice or
LibreOffice Writer for finishing the text documents or OpenOffice or
LibreOffice Impress for finishing slide presentations. Ideally allowing
me to go both ways for the final version.

I do not seem able to accomplish the latter and have not found the ideal
markdown editor yet - suggestions welcome!

[orcmid]

There is a single-file XML format for ODF documents that would work for 
conversion from markdown and import to one of LibreOffice Writer or LibreOffice 
Impress.  This works so long as (1) you have no images or other external 
imports and (2) you can come up with a converter.  Since conversions to HTML 
are commonplace, it might be possible to craft a converter that makes ODF 
single-file XML instead.  But someone needs to hack on the respective code.  
Fortunately, the ODF Table format matches the row-major order that is used in 
the Markdown and in HTML tables.  Styling is different, but a converter would 
do some sort of fixed stylings (and font settings) that could be changed in the 
desktop software.  You would also be editing pagination, headers/footers, etc., 
in the target software anyhow.  There might be a way to set up templates for 
some of this and merge those in, but I don't know enough about that to be 
entirely confident about it.

Apache OpenOffice does not consume the single-file XML format, so there is a 
bit more work to provide a conversion in that case.  Namely, AOO and 
LibreOffice both accept the Zip-package format of ODF documents and those can 
be produced with a bit more effort - the contents of the Zip is a set of XML 
files plus a manifest.  The single-file format is convertible to the 
Zip-package format in a straightforward manner, so it would be a good step-up 
from a single-file producer.  The greatest advantage is the fact that there is 
compression and now a way to package images and other artifacts within the 
multi-file contents of the ODF package.

Adding either of these conversions as input filters to either OpenOffice.org descendant 
is probably beyond the call of duty.  It would be easier to have a converter essentially 
"pipe" its output into one of them, which is practical.

Also, Microsoft office will consume the ODF package formats for Text (Writer) 
and Presentation (Impress) formats, and anything originated in MarkDown should 
import just fine.

Finally, if you can find a Markdown to RTF or any of the classic or OOXML 
Microsoft Office formats, that should produce something simple enough that you 
can import into one of LibreOffice or Apache OpenOffice with decent fidelity as 
well.

These are all interesting challenge projects for document-processing tools.  
Whether there are enough piece parts out there to simply create a workflow 
through them is more desirable and others here might have solutions.

Thanks for your interesting question.

  - Dennis

Thank you.





I would rather not have to do any development but was hoping that open-source 
word processors such as OpenOffice and LibreOffice would support a productivity 
tool as composing text in markdown format out of the box (or with minimal 
adjustments)... Again, I am looking to do my document writing and slide 
composition in a markdown editor and then do the final polishing and applying 
styles etc. in OO/LO. I would only want whatever the document/slide default 
formatting happens to be applied when I transfer it to OO/LO, i.e., default 
formatting for Heading1, Heading2, body text, lists, table headers, table 
bodies etc., nothing else.

As for my other question, has anyone found a markdown editor - most importantly CentOS 
but also Windows as a backup - that supports "folding" similar to what the DOS 
outliners allowed you to do? With this feature - which does not depend on any changes to 
the markdown format - you could more easily work on longer, more complex documents 
without getting lost in the details. Importantly, this feature should be easily usable 
from the keyboard, just like when using the DOS outliners.

Re: Markdown documents to OO/LO Writer and Impress

2016-11-12 Thread Fletcher T. Penney 
MultiMarkdown has supported the Flat OpenDocument format for many years. 
It currently supports it for Writer documents, but there is no reason 
the same approach couldn't be used to create Impress presentations. 
Technically, one could also create spreadsheet files as well, but not 
sure that's a good idea.


In fact, using the existing beamer format output and the ODF format 
conversions, it should be relatively easy to create a converter for 
presentations.



https://github.com/fletcher/MultiMarkdown-5

http://fletcherpenney.net/multimarkdown/


Fletcher



On 11/12/16 12:24 PM, Dennis E. Hamilton wrote:




-Original Message-
From: Markdown-Discuss [mailto:markdown-discuss-
[email protected]] On Behalf Of H
Sent: Saturday, November 12, 2016 08:34
To: Markdown Discussion Mailing List 
Subject: Markdown documents to OO/LO Writer and Impress

I am a recent convert to using markdown for creating draft documents,
outlines etc. My primary OS is CentOS where I use geany with a plugin
although I believe gedit also allows for creating/editing markdown
documents(?) On windows I have both geany, markdown pad íí, and notepad
ii.

I do use tables a lot and since I like to use markdown for outlines of
complex documents I would like to see easy folding of sections, similar
to what you could do with the old DOS outliners. Alas, combining those
two requirements in a modern editor seems impossible...

Now I would also like to create drafts of documents and of slide
presentations in markdown to later be transferred to OpenOffice or
LibreOffice Writer for finishing the text documents or OpenOffice or
LibreOffice Impress for finishing slide presentations. Ideally allowing
me to go both ways for the final version.

I do not seem able to accomplish the latter and have not found the ideal
markdown editor yet - suggestions welcome!

[orcmid]

There is a single-file XML format for ODF documents that would work for 
conversion from markdown and import to one of LibreOffice Writer or LibreOffice 
Impress.  This works so long as (1) you have no images or other external 
imports and (2) you can come up with a converter.  Since conversions to HTML 
are commonplace, it might be possible to craft a converter that makes ODF 
single-file XML instead.  But someone needs to hack on the respective code.  
Fortunately, the ODF Table format matches the row-major order that is used in 
the Markdown and in HTML tables.  Styling is different, but a converter would 
do some sort of fixed stylings (and font settings) that could be changed in the 
desktop software.  You would also be editing pagination, headers/footers, etc., 
in the target software anyhow.  There might be a way to set up templates for 
some of this and merge those in, but I don't know enough about that to be 
entirely confident about it.

Apache OpenOffice does not consume the single-file XML format, so there is a 
bit more work to provide a conversion in that case.  Namely, AOO and 
LibreOffice both accept the Zip-package format of ODF documents and those can 
be produced with a bit more effort - the contents of the Zip is a set of XML 
files plus a manifest.  The single-file format is convertible to the 
Zip-package format in a straightforward manner, so it would be a good step-up 
from a single-file producer.  The greatest advantage is the fact that there is 
compression and now a way to package images and other artifacts within the 
multi-file contents of the ODF package.

Adding either of these conversions as input filters to either OpenOffice.org descendant 
is probably beyond the call of duty.  It would be easier to have a converter essentially 
"pipe" its output into one of them, which is practical.

Also, Microsoft office will consume the ODF package formats for Text (Writer) 
and Presentation (Impress) formats, and anything originated in MarkDown should 
import just fine.

Finally, if you can find a Markdown to RTF or any of the classic or OOXML 
Microsoft Office formats, that should produce something simple enough that you 
can import into one of LibreOffice or Apache OpenOffice with decent fidelity as 
well.

These are all interesting challenge projects for document-processing tools.  
Whether there are enough piece parts out there to simply create a workflow 
through them is more desirable and others here might have solutions.

Thanks for your interesting question.

 - Dennis


Thank you.






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--
Fletcher T. Penney
[email protected]
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RE: Markdown documents to OO/LO Writer and Impress

2016-11-12 Thread Dennis E. Hamilton 


> -Original Message-
> From: Markdown-Discuss [mailto:markdown-discuss-
> [email protected]] On Behalf Of H
> Sent: Saturday, November 12, 2016 08:34
> To: Markdown Discussion Mailing List 
> Subject: Markdown documents to OO/LO Writer and Impress
> 
> I am a recent convert to using markdown for creating draft documents,
> outlines etc. My primary OS is CentOS where I use geany with a plugin
> although I believe gedit also allows for creating/editing markdown
> documents(?) On windows I have both geany, markdown pad íí, and notepad
> ii.
> 
> I do use tables a lot and since I like to use markdown for outlines of
> complex documents I would like to see easy folding of sections, similar
> to what you could do with the old DOS outliners. Alas, combining those
> two requirements in a modern editor seems impossible...
> 
> Now I would also like to create drafts of documents and of slide
> presentations in markdown to later be transferred to OpenOffice or
> LibreOffice Writer for finishing the text documents or OpenOffice or
> LibreOffice Impress for finishing slide presentations. Ideally allowing
> me to go both ways for the final version.
> 
> I do not seem able to accomplish the latter and have not found the ideal
> markdown editor yet - suggestions welcome!
[orcmid] 

There is a single-file XML format for ODF documents that would work for 
conversion from markdown and import to one of LibreOffice Writer or LibreOffice 
Impress.  This works so long as (1) you have no images or other external 
imports and (2) you can come up with a converter.  Since conversions to HTML 
are commonplace, it might be possible to craft a converter that makes ODF 
single-file XML instead.  But someone needs to hack on the respective code.  
Fortunately, the ODF Table format matches the row-major order that is used in 
the Markdown and in HTML tables.  Styling is different, but a converter would 
do some sort of fixed stylings (and font settings) that could be changed in the 
desktop software.  You would also be editing pagination, headers/footers, etc., 
in the target software anyhow.  There might be a way to set up templates for 
some of this and merge those in, but I don't know enough about that to be 
entirely confident about it.

Apache OpenOffice does not consume the single-file XML format, so there is a 
bit more work to provide a conversion in that case.  Namely, AOO and 
LibreOffice both accept the Zip-package format of ODF documents and those can 
be produced with a bit more effort - the contents of the Zip is a set of XML 
files plus a manifest.  The single-file format is convertible to the 
Zip-package format in a straightforward manner, so it would be a good step-up 
from a single-file producer.  The greatest advantage is the fact that there is 
compression and now a way to package images and other artifacts within the 
multi-file contents of the ODF package.

Adding either of these conversions as input filters to either OpenOffice.org 
descendant is probably beyond the call of duty.  It would be easier to have a 
converter essentially "pipe" its output into one of them, which is practical.

Also, Microsoft office will consume the ODF package formats for Text (Writer) 
and Presentation (Impress) formats, and anything originated in MarkDown should 
import just fine.

Finally, if you can find a Markdown to RTF or any of the classic or OOXML 
Microsoft Office formats, that should produce something simple enough that you 
can import into one of LibreOffice or Apache OpenOffice with decent fidelity as 
well.

These are all interesting challenge projects for document-processing tools.  
Whether there are enough piece parts out there to simply create a workflow 
through them is more desirable and others here might have solutions.

Thanks for your interesting question.

 - Dennis
> 
> Thank you.
> 
> 
> 


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Re: Installing Markdown

2016-11-07 Thread mofo syne 
Ah well then. Well hopefully it was helpful. Good luck

On Mon, Nov 7, 2016 at 1:51 PM, Erika Knollenberg via Markdown-Discuss <
[email protected]> wrote:

> Thank you for asking, it's been so long I don't recall how to use this
> forum. I was able to get my resume submitted successfully, however I was
> not accepted.
>
>
> On Sunday, November 6, 2016 9:28 AM, mofo syne  wrote:
>
>
> How did you resume go btw?
>
> On Fri, Feb 26, 2016 at 3:49 PM, mofo syne  wrote:
>
> oh another thing to add. If you don't mind, what does your resume look
> like, if you have any pdf copy, that would be great
>
> On Fri, Feb 26, 2016 at 12:37 PM, mofo syne  wrote:
> > Okay, here is a copy of the markdown file (markdown file is .md ). I
> > use it to create a pdf via pandoc.
> >
> > I recommend using atom editor https://atom.io/ to edit the file. But
> > you could use haroopad as well in http://pad.haroopress.com/.
> >
> > Or notepad if you really want. You'll get the idea when you see my
> resume.
> >
> > Oh btw, I'm new to resume writing, feel free to provide suggestions.
> >
> > On Fri, Feb 26, 2016 at 3:57 AM, Erika Knollenberg
> >  wrote:
> >> Yes, that would be wonderful. Most certainly I won't distribute it to
> >> anyone. If it makes you feel more comfortable, you could change your
> >> personal contact information to dummy info.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> On Thursday, February 25, 2016 9:34 AM, mofo syne 
> >> wrote:
> >>
> >>
> >> Oh it's literally just a text file where you use email style text
> >> notation for **bolding text** or pointing out headers. If you need a
> >> copy of my markdown resume, I can show you what it looks like. Just
> >> don't go distributing it to everyone.
> >>
> >> On Fri, Feb 26, 2016 at 1:57 AM, Erika Knollenberg via
> >> Markdown-Discuss  > wrote:
> >>> I have been assigned to submit a resume for an application to a school
> >>> using
> >>> Markdown. They gave me this link:
> >>> http://daringfireball.net/ projects/markdown/
>  with the following
> >>> instructions: "Your resume, written in Markdown and submitted as a
> GitHub
> >>> Gist." I've visted the link and downloaded Markdown. When it didn't
> have a
> >>> way to "install" like typical software, I revisited the site and I
> >>> downloaded Perl 5.22.00. I've also downloaded CPAN
> >>> (http://search.cpan.org/dist/ Digest-MD5/MD5.pm
> ). Now there is a little
> >>> blue
> >>> icon in the Markdown folder, but all it opens is a black box. It
> doesn't
> >>> open something that should look like this
> >>> (https://www.youtube.com/ watch?v=oba3Czjyras
> ). I've watched a couple of
> >>> tutorials on how to use it and it's fairly simple. I understand all the
> >>> 'coding' I need to use. The problem is figuring out how to install the
> >>> software. I'm not an IT person. I'm good at using programs, not fixing
> >>> them
> >>> or understanding things out-of-the-ordinary computer installations. Can
> >>> someone please give me some direction (using layman's terms) to get
> this
> >>> up
> >>> and moving? Thank you very much for your help. I am using a Windows 7
> >>> computer.
> >>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> __ _
> >>> Markdown-Discuss mailing list
> >>> [email protected]. net 
> >>> https://pairlist6.pair.net/ mailman/listinfo/markdown- discuss
> 
> >>
> >>>
> >>
> >>
>
>
>
>
>
> ___
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>
>
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Re: Installing Markdown

2016-11-06 Thread Erika Knollenberg via Markdown-Discuss 
Thank you for asking, it's been so long I don't recall how to use this forum. I 
was able to get my resume submitted successfully, however I was not accepted.  

On Sunday, November 6, 2016 9:28 AM, mofo syne  wrote:
 

 How did you resume go btw?
On Fri, Feb 26, 2016 at 3:49 PM, mofo syne  wrote:

oh another thing to add. If you don't mind, what does your resume look
like, if you have any pdf copy, that would be great

On Fri, Feb 26, 2016 at 12:37 PM, mofo syne  wrote:
> Okay, here is a copy of the markdown file (markdown file is .md ). I
> use it to create a pdf via pandoc.
>
> I recommend using atom editor https://atom.io/ to edit the file. But
> you could use haroopad as well in http://pad.haroopress.com/.
>
> Or notepad if you really want. You'll get the idea when you see my resume.
>
> Oh btw, I'm new to resume writing, feel free to provide suggestions.
>
> On Fri, Feb 26, 2016 at 3:57 AM, Erika Knollenberg
>  wrote:
>> Yes, that would be wonderful. Most certainly I won't distribute it to
>> anyone. If it makes you feel more comfortable, you could change your
>> personal contact information to dummy info.
>>
>>
>>
>> On Thursday, February 25, 2016 9:34 AM, mofo syne 
>> wrote:
>>
>>
>> Oh it's literally just a text file where you use email style text
>> notation for **bolding text** or pointing out headers. If you need a
>> copy of my markdown resume, I can show you what it looks like. Just
>> don't go distributing it to everyone.
>>
>> On Fri, Feb 26, 2016 at 1:57 AM, Erika Knollenberg via
>> Markdown-Discuss  wrote:
>>> I have been assigned to submit a resume for an application to a school
>>> using
>>> Markdown. They gave me this link:
>>> http://daringfireball.net/ projects/markdown/ with the following
>>> instructions: "Your resume, written in Markdown and submitted as a GitHub
>>> Gist." I've visted the link and downloaded Markdown. When it didn't have a
>>> way to "install" like typical software, I revisited the site and I
>>> downloaded Perl 5.22.00. I've also downloaded CPAN
>>> (http://search.cpan.org/dist/ Digest-MD5/MD5.pm). Now there is a little
>>> blue
>>> icon in the Markdown folder, but all it opens is a black box. It doesn't
>>> open something that should look like this
>>> (https://www.youtube.com/ watch?v=oba3Czjyras). I've watched a couple of
>>> tutorials on how to use it and it's fairly simple. I understand all the
>>> 'coding' I need to use. The problem is figuring out how to install the
>>> software. I'm not an IT person. I'm good at using programs, not fixing
>>> them
>>> or understanding things out-of-the-ordinary computer installations. Can
>>> someone please give me some direction (using layman's terms) to get this
>>> up
>>> and moving? Thank you very much for your help. I am using a Windows 7
>>> computer.
>>
>>>
>>>
>>> __ _
>>> Markdown-Discuss mailing list
>>> [email protected]. net
>>> https://pairlist6.pair.net/ mailman/listinfo/markdown- discuss
>>
>>>
>>
>>




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Re: Why Markdown? Why Text? #1 - Single Source Publishing - One Text, Many Formats

2016-10-22 Thread Gerald Bauer 
Hello,

   FYI: I've moved the Why Markdown? Why Text? page [1] to the Mundi
Mark org. Cheers.

[1] https://github.com/mundimark/why-markdown

2016-03-30 1:44 GMT+02:00 Gerald Bauer :
> Hello,
>
>I've started a new initiative called "Why Markdown? Why Text?".
>
>The idea is to collect arguments why text is the past, present and
> future of writing and publishing.
>
>Argument #1 - Single Source Publishing - One Text, Many Formats
>
>See the repo [1] in Markdown ;-) for more. Still early. Questions?
> Comments? Welcome. Cheers.
>
> [1] https://github.com/manuscripts/why-markdown
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Re: Tab size of code blocks

2016-10-02 Thread Igor Zhbanov 
Hi Michel,

2016-10-02 14:25 GMT+03:00 Michel Fortin :
> Le 2 oct. 2016 à 6:24, Igor Zhbanov  a écrit :
>>
>> Hi.
>>
>> Markdown allows to include code blocks by using
>> ```c
>>printf("Hello World¥n");
>> ```
>
> Technically this syntax is an extension that is not part of the reference 
> Markdown spec. But it's true that many (most?) Markdown parsers support it 
> today.

Yes. And I'm talking about extending the markdown syntax. ;-) If it's possible.

>> But it doesn't allow to specify the tab size (number of spaces). As I see,
>> Markdown states that the tab size is 4: "To produce a code block
>> in Markdown, simply indent every line of the block by at least 4 spaces
>> or 1 tab."
>
> You will have to check if the parser you are using has a setting like this. 
> For instance, there is one called [`tab_width`][1] in PHP Markdown. But note 
> that its effect will apply to everything in the document, not just code 
> blocks, so be cautious about using tabs to indent lists and other things if 
> you change this settings. Most likely, Gitlab uses another parser, so it it 
> might behave differently if it has such a setting.

Gitlab uses redcarpet ruby gem to parse markdown. And it has 4 spaces
hardcoded in expand_tabs function. I've written them letter too.

I think ideally we should have both global and per-block settings.
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Re: Tab size of code blocks

2016-10-02 Thread Michel Fortin 
Le 2 oct. 2016 à 6:24, Igor Zhbanov  a écrit :
> 
> Hi.
> 
> Markdown allows to include code blocks by using
> ```c
>printf("Hello World¥n");
> ```

Technically this syntax is an extension that is not part of the reference 
Markdown spec. But it's true that many (most?) Markdown parsers support it 
today.

> But it doesn't allow to specify the tab size (number of spaces). As I see,
> Markdown states that the tab size is 4: "To produce a code block
> in Markdown, simply indent every line of the block by at least 4 spaces
> or 1 tab."

You will have to check if the parser you are using has a setting like this. For 
instance, there is one called [`tab_width`][1] in PHP Markdown. But note that 
its effect will apply to everything in the document, not just code blocks, so 
be cautious about using tabs to indent lists and other things if you change 
this settings. Most likely, Gitlab uses another parser, so it it might behave 
differently if it has such a setting.

 [1]: https://michelf.ca/projects/php-markdown/configuration/#markdown


-- 
Michel Fortin
https://michelf.ca

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Re: Awesome Markdown Series Moved - New Home @ Mundi Mark - All About Markup & Markdown

2016-08-15 Thread Gerald Bauer 
Hello,

   FYI: I've moved the rest along to Mundi Mark e.g.

   - Can I Use __ ?  (Markdown Version)
   - Markdown Tools
   - Markdown Tools > Books
   - and some more

   See the new front page [1] for more. Cheers.

[1] https://mundimark.github.io
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Re: Added Markdown support to wrap(1)

2016-05-06 Thread Marty McGowan 
What attracted me to Markdown was it's underlying principle, that text
can be readable, and readily converted into formatted documents.  

What lead me to Markdown took a few decades: I used a syntactic means to
format documents, developed while writing in nroff/troff at the turn of
the 70s/80s.  I delivered a talk at the '82 Usenix "Make with M4".  
What steered me to M4? That  {nt}roff, in order to be useful, had a
macro facility.   In my judgement, too easily confused with the Xroff
command language.   So, "get yourself the equivalent functionality, that
when Xroff is superseded, you won't have to re-format all your papers in
the new language, simply cast the defining macros to emit the new stuff.
 e.g.   

   _H( N, this is heading level N)   

And this was a decade before I'd heard of HTML.  

The two problem areas were m4's bindings with commas and parens, though
gnu m4 added some features to overcome those limitations, but the biggy
was the feature Markdown was best at: headers, paragraphs and lists.   a
natural presentation with minimal noise.

So i give Markdown credit for putting me on the right path, and even
used it to publish my e-book: Shell Functions.   Which I hope to update
soon.   But now, I edit the text in emacs, OrgMode, and produce the
Leanpub/Markdown by using pandoc. 

The thing i like about pandoc is it eliminates my need to anticipate the
next wave of document production: no need to upgrade 139 macro
definitions.   Markdown had arrived just in the nick of time before I
was about to write the TeX productions.  

The other thing pandoc has done for me is rescue my sister's
considerable effort in publishing the history pages of our family
genealogy (1400 people).   The tree-portion she was able to export into
GEDCOM, and re-import to WikiTree;  I've easily converted  the narrative
portion to both a Markdown and an emacs OrgMode format.   The question
remains,   which of the available alternative formats (I'm thinking
Markdown) is most likely to be embraced by the next generation. 

Pardon for taking valuable space, if not some of your time, on this
personal ramble.   I believe it's useful to share why and how some of
our tools are begin used.

Cheers,

=*+*-
Marty McGowan 908 230-3739
[email protected]; http://alum.mit.edu/www/mcgowan


On Fri, May 6, 2016, at 10:32 AM, Paul J. Lucas wrote:
> On May 6, 2016, at 5:25 AM, Sherwood Botsford 
> wrote:
> 
> > He's made a plugin that reformats comments, and does The Right Thing with 
> > MD within comments.
> 
> ... I started wrap in 1996 (!) to
> scratch my particular itch as someone who enjoys coding for its own sake.
>  Perhaps Marty did something similar.
> 
> I announced wrap’s Markdown support on the list in case others might find
> it useful.  If so, great; if not, just keep using what you’re using. 
> There’s really no need for anything else.
> 
> - Paul
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Re: Added Markdown support to wrap(1)

2016-05-06 Thread Paul J. Lucas 
On May 6, 2016, at 5:25 AM, Sherwood Botsford  wrote:

> He's made a plugin that reformats comments, and does The Right Thing with MD 
> within comments.

And I presume it’s limited to emacs.  If I wanted to use it for some other 
editor, or as part of another pipeline, or as part of a source code repository 
commit hook, I probably couldn’t use the plugin.

> To me this is something that the text editor should do automatically. This, 
> and it's ilk, such as wrap, par, etc. have to be run as an external command, 
> piping out and in.

If you hadn’t seen some other editor, let’s call it, say, “iv” [sic] and I 
pre-configured it binding a certain key sequence to call an external command, 
and sat you down in front of it for you to use and didn’t tell you it used an 
external command, you wouldn’t know the difference.

You can’t be pointing out that it’s technically slightly less efficient because 
it has to spawn another process, I don’t think, because it’s all been completed 
by the time your fingers come completely off the keys.  It is a text editor, 
after all, that spends most of its time waiting for a human to press keys.  
Efficiency at that level simply doesn’t matter.

If I had a Way-Back machine and release wrap with Markdown support before the 
emacs plugin, perhaps I could have commented, “If only people learned to write 
code the Unix way with pipes.”  Nah, I wouldn’t do that.  Why not?  Because, as 
I stated initially, I started wrap in 1996 (!) to scratch my particular itch as 
someone who enjoys coding for its own sake.  Perhaps Marty did something 
similar.

I announced wrap’s Markdown support on the list in case others might find it 
useful.  If so, great; if not, just keep using what you’re using.  There’s 
really no need for anything else.

- Paul
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Re: Added Markdown support to wrap(1)

2016-05-06 Thread Sherwood Botsford 
He's made a plugin that reformats comments, and does The Right Thing with
MD within comments.

To me this is something that the text editor should do automatically.
This, and it's ilk, such as wrap, par, etc. have to be run as an external
command, piping out and in.

Respectfully,

Sherwood of Sherwood's Forests


On 5 May 2016 at 11:24, Paul J. Lucas  wrote:

> I'm really not sure what you're trying to say. Your mail seems to be all
> over the map.
>
> This certainly isn't the forum for a vi vs. emacs war.
>
> - Paul
>
> > On May 5, 2016, at 9:38 AM, Marty McGowan  wrote:
> >
> > paul,
> >
> >   being a bwk follower (the K  in awk),  i'm a fan of well-focused
> >   tools; i suspect "wrap" is such.
> >
> >   however, wrapping is but a single feature in emacs.  oh, if the world
> >   had the patience to learn emacs.
> >
> >   and in a note of self-contradiction, it is a bit difficult to
> >   reconcile heavy command-line use with such an editor.
> >
> >i thank markdown for having lead me to OrgMode.   and now my
> >command-line format converter is "pandoc".  depending on the venue
> >(e.g. leanpub) it does a fine job of producing the necessary
> >markdown.
> >
> > =*+*-
> > Marty McGowan 908 230-3739
> > [email protected]; http://alum.mit.edu/www/mcgowan
> >
> >> On Thu, May 5, 2016, at 12:16 AM, Paul J. Lucas wrote:
> >> Hello -
> >>
> >> I’ve been hacking on wrap(1) and wrapc(1) that are text and
> >> source-code-comment reformatters, respectively, for a long time.  I
> >> started them to scratch my particular itch, namely the ability to easily
> >> rewrap text (and, in particular, comments in source code) while in an
> >> editor.  See:
> >>
> >>https://github.com/paul-j-lucas/wrap
> >
> >>
> >> ___
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> >> [email protected]
> >> https://pairlist6.pair.net/mailman/listinfo/markdown-discuss
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Re: Added Markdown support to wrap(1)

2016-05-05 Thread Paul J. Lucas 
I'm really not sure what you're trying to say. Your mail seems to be all over 
the map.

This certainly isn't the forum for a vi vs. emacs war.

- Paul

> On May 5, 2016, at 9:38 AM, Marty McGowan  wrote:
> 
> paul,
> 
>   being a bwk follower (the K  in awk),  i'm a fan of well-focused
>   tools; i suspect "wrap" is such.   
> 
>   however, wrapping is but a single feature in emacs.  oh, if the world
>   had the patience to learn emacs.
> 
>   and in a note of self-contradiction, it is a bit difficult to
>   reconcile heavy command-line use with such an editor.
> 
>i thank markdown for having lead me to OrgMode.   and now my
>command-line format converter is "pandoc".  depending on the venue
>(e.g. leanpub) it does a fine job of producing the necessary
>markdown.
> 
> =*+*-
> Marty McGowan 908 230-3739
> [email protected]; http://alum.mit.edu/www/mcgowan
> 
>> On Thu, May 5, 2016, at 12:16 AM, Paul J. Lucas wrote:
>> Hello -
>> 
>> I’ve been hacking on wrap(1) and wrapc(1) that are text and
>> source-code-comment reformatters, respectively, for a long time.  I
>> started them to scratch my particular itch, namely the ability to easily
>> rewrap text (and, in particular, comments in source code) while in an
>> editor.  See:
>> 
>>https://github.com/paul-j-lucas/wrap
> 
>> 
>> ___
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Re: Added Markdown support to wrap(1)

2016-05-05 Thread Marty McGowan 
paul,

   being a bwk follower (the K  in awk),  i'm a fan of well-focused
   tools; i suspect "wrap" is such.   

   however, wrapping is but a single feature in emacs.  oh, if the world
   had the patience to learn emacs.

   and in a note of self-contradiction, it is a bit difficult to
   reconcile heavy command-line use with such an editor.

i thank markdown for having lead me to OrgMode.   and now my
command-line format converter is "pandoc".  depending on the venue
(e.g. leanpub) it does a fine job of producing the necessary
markdown.

=*+*-
Marty McGowan 908 230-3739
[email protected]; http://alum.mit.edu/www/mcgowan

On Thu, May 5, 2016, at 12:16 AM, Paul J. Lucas wrote:
> Hello -
> 
> I’ve been hacking on wrap(1) and wrapc(1) that are text and
> source-code-comment reformatters, respectively, for a long time.  I
> started them to scratch my particular itch, namely the ability to easily
> rewrap text (and, in particular, comments in source code) while in an
> editor.  See:
> 
>   https://github.com/paul-j-lucas/wrap

> 
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Re: Markdown Tools Directory - Open Source Plain Text to HTML n LaTeX Converter Tools n Libraries - Add More Tools!

2016-04-19 Thread Shane McCarron 
No - we still hear you.

On Tue, Apr 19, 2016 at 11:49 AM, Gerald Bauer 
wrote:

> Hello,
>
>   Thanks to Aslak Raanes for adding Mistune, Libsoldout, Blackfriday &
> Python-Markdown to the Markdown Tools list [1].
>
>   I've also added a one-liner description from the github project
> sites.  Anything missing? Additions welcome [2]. Cheers.
>
> PS: By the way - love the names e.g. Sold Out!  or Black Friday  -
> when I search for markdown usually half the results are about markdown
> madness (that is, buy now - cheap prices, etc.) or fund manager
> marking down their investments ;-)   Anyways, looks like I'm just
> talking to myself on this markdown list.
>
> [1] http://manuscripts.github.io/markdown-tools
> [2] https://github.com/manuscripts/markdown-tools
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-- 
Shane McCarron
Managing Director, Applied Testing and Technology, Inc.
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Re: Markdown Tools Directory - Open Source Plain Text to HTML n LaTeX Converter Tools n Libraries - Add More Tools!

2016-04-19 Thread Gerald Bauer 
Hello,

  Thanks to Aslak Raanes for adding Mistune, Libsoldout, Blackfriday &
Python-Markdown to the Markdown Tools list [1].

  I've also added a one-liner description from the github project
sites.  Anything missing? Additions welcome [2]. Cheers.

PS: By the way - love the names e.g. Sold Out!  or Black Friday  -
when I search for markdown usually half the results are about markdown
madness (that is, buy now - cheap prices, etc.) or fund manager
marking down their investments ;-)   Anyways, looks like I'm just
talking to myself on this markdown list.

[1] http://manuscripts.github.io/markdown-tools
[2] https://github.com/manuscripts/markdown-tools
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Re: *bold* _italics_ ~strikethrough~ One Billion WhatsApp Writers Learn Text Formatting Markdown-Style

2016-04-02 Thread Klaus Mueller 

Hi folks,

Am 01.04.2016 um 00:44 schrieb Gerald Bauer:

*bold*
   _italics_
   ~strikethrough~

1,000,000,000+ WhatsApp Writers Learn Text Formatting Markdown-Style. Wow!

pretty cool! ;)

but it does not work for me. I tested it with Whats App Version 
2.12.556; [telegraph] says you need 2.12.535



thx
klml

[telegraph]: 
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/technology/2016/03/29/whatsapp-adds-bold-italics-and-strikethrough-text-options/


--
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Re: Can I use _____? Markdown Version - Anyone?

2016-03-21 Thread Gerald Bauer 
Hello,
   Thanks for your kind words.

> Wouldn't a simple  work as well?

  That works, but is HTML ;-)  Nothing wrong with HTML.

  Using \ is Markdown-style and works for LaTeX, and other formats too.

  Cheers.
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Re: Can I use _____? Markdown Version - Anyone?

2016-03-21 Thread Alan Hogan 
Great idea. I like it. 

>From the escaped line break page:

> Note: in multiline and grid table cells, this is the only way to create a 
> hard line break, since trailing spaces in the cells are ignored.

Wouldn't a simple  work as well?

Alan

> On Mar 21, 2016, at 3:16 AM, Gerald Bauer  wrote:
> 
> Hello,
> 
>  The first version of the Markdown Can I Use __ ? version / site is
> now live [1].
> 
>   See the Can I Use Heading Attributes? page as an example with an
> converter compatibility table [2].
> 
>  Questions? Comments? Welcome. Cheers.
> 
> PS: The site source is open source (on GitHub) and public domain [3].
> 
> [1] http://manuscripts.github.io/markdown-can-i-use
> [2] http://manuscripts.github.io/markdown-can-i-use/heading_attributes
> [3] https://github.com/manuscripts/markdown-can-i-use
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Re: Can I use _____? Markdown Version - Anyone?

2016-03-21 Thread Gerald Bauer 
Hello,

  The first version of the Markdown Can I Use __ ? version / site is
now live [1].

   See the Can I Use Heading Attributes? page as an example with an
converter compatibility table [2].

  Questions? Comments? Welcome. Cheers.

PS: The site source is open source (on GitHub) and public domain [3].

[1] http://manuscripts.github.io/markdown-can-i-use
[2] http://manuscripts.github.io/markdown-can-i-use/heading_attributes
[3] https://github.com/manuscripts/markdown-can-i-use
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re: markdown rules / recommendations

2016-03-08 Thread bowerbird via Markdown-Discuss 

gerald said:
>   If you know another
see what the brett terpstra says:
>   http://brettterpstra.com/2015/08/24/write-better-markdown/


-bowerbird


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Re: Markdown Lint - Markdown Style / Rules Checker - Book Edition (in Manuscripts)

2016-03-07 Thread Gerald Bauer 
Hello,

   FYI: I've updated the book template and you can now link to all
rules for easy reference with anchors e.g.

  - 001 - Header levels should only increment by one level at a time

 => http://manuscripts.github.io/markdown-lint#MD001

  - 002 - First header should be a h1 header

 => http://manuscripts.github.io/markdown-lint#MD002

   and so on.

   Found another Markdown Style Guide by Ciro Santilli [1]. If you
know anothers or have you own rules / recommendations. Let us know.
Cheers.

[1] http://www.cirosantilli.com/markdown-style-guide
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Re: Static Times Q&A with Thomas Leitner - author of the kramdown library and tools for markdown

2016-03-01 Thread Gerald Bauer 
Hello,

   Good news Thomas Leitner will talk this Thursday, March 3rd at Vienna.rb [1]

If you have any questions for Thomas Leitner, please post them
here and I will (try my best) and ask Thomas in person and write-up
all answers and post them here.

   Questions about kramdown, markdown and friends?

   Cheers.

[1] http://www.vienna-rb.at
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Re: How to add Google Maps to a Markdown document

2016-02-29 Thread Tom Humiston 
Yes, just paste the code into your document. HTML elements (such code for a 
Google map) are allowed to sit alongside plain text in a Markdown document.


> On Feb 29, 2016, at 5:11 PM, Rajesh Jain  wrote:
> 
> Hello
> 
> Is there a possibility to add Google Maps to a Markdown document? 
> 
> Thanks, Raj
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Re: How to add Google Maps to a Markdown document

2016-02-29 Thread Gerald Bauer 
Hello,

>  Is there a possibility to add Google Maps to a Markdown document?

  Sure. Just add the HTML ;-)  Nothing wrong with "embedding" HTML
inside markdown. If it doesn't look Markdown-y enough just use a macro
e.g.

  {% gmap  params %}

   that hides the HTML generation. Cheers.
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Re: Can I use _____? Markdown Version - Anyone?

2016-02-27 Thread Gerald Bauer 
Hello,

   Addendum:  For your reference the Can I use___ ? link [1] Cheers.

[1] http://caniuse.com
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Re: Installing Markdown

2016-02-25 Thread Gringo Jack 
OK don't know how I got into this situation BUT the best I have found is
this   https://cloose.github.io/CuteMarkEd/

On Thu, Feb 25, 2016 at 2:51 PM, Sherwood Botsford 
wrote:

> One gotcha:  There are about a zillion implementations of Markdown.  Be
> sure that you don't use a feature that isn't implemented in your reader's
> version.
>
> Respectfully,
>
> Sherwood of Sherwood's Forests
>
> Sherwood Botsford
> Sherwood's Forests --  http://Sherwoods-Forests.com
> 780-848-2548
> 50042 Range Rd 31
> Warburg, Alberta T0C 2T0
>
>
> On 25 February 2016 at 10:45, Marios Zindilis  wrote:
>
>> For this use case, you don't have to install anything. For convenience,
>> you can use an online editor, like http://dillinger.io/ to help you edit
>> your document, then copy the Markdown text and paste it in a Gist.
>>
>> --
>> Marios Zindilis
>>
>> On Thu, Feb 25, 2016 at 3:19 PM, Alan Hogan 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> The thing is, if you have been asked to submit a document in markdown
>>> format, you don’t need any software at all, at least not beyond your
>>> favorite text editor (or Github's website itself). Just use .md instead of
>>> .txt as the file extension. Markdown the software takes a
>>> Markdown-formatted document and outputs an HTML document. At that point,
>>> you would no longer be submitting a Markdown doc.
>>>
>>> And yes, markdown.pl is a command line tool. You are expected to invoke
>>> it from the shell.
>>>
>>> Alan
>>>
>>> On Feb 25, 2016, at 6:57 AM, Erika Knollenberg via Markdown-Discuss <
>>> [email protected]> wrote:
>>>
>>> I have been assigned to submit a resume for an application to a school
>>> using Markdown. They gave me this link:
>>> http://daringfireball.net/projects/markdown/ with the following
>>> instructions: "Your resume, written in Markdown
>>>  and submitted as a GitHub
>>> Gist ." I've visted the link and downloaded
>>> Markdown. When it didn't have a way to "install" like typical software, I
>>> revisited the site and I downloaded Perl 5.22.00. I've also downloaded CPAN
>>> (http://search.cpan.org/dist/Digest-MD5/MD5.pm). Now there is a little
>>> blue icon in the Markdown folder, but all it opens is a black box. It
>>> doesn't open something that should look like this (
>>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oba3Czjyras). I've watched a couple of
>>> tutorials on how to use it and it's fairly simple. I understand all the
>>> 'coding' I need to use. The problem is figuring out how to install the
>>> software. I'm not an IT person. I'm good at using programs, not fixing them
>>> or understanding things out-of-the-ordinary computer installations. Can
>>> someone please give me some direction (using layman's terms) to get this up
>>> and moving? Thank you very much for your help. I am using a Windows 7
>>> computer.
>>>
>>> ___
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>>> https://pairlist6.pair.net/mailman/listinfo/markdown-discuss
>>>
>>>
>>> ___
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>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Marios Zindilis
>>
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>>
>
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Re: Installing Markdown

2016-02-25 Thread Sherwood Botsford 
One gotcha:  There are about a zillion implementations of Markdown.  Be
sure that you don't use a feature that isn't implemented in your reader's
version.

Respectfully,

Sherwood of Sherwood's Forests

Sherwood Botsford
Sherwood's Forests --  http://Sherwoods-Forests.com
780-848-2548
50042 Range Rd 31
Warburg, Alberta T0C 2T0


On 25 February 2016 at 10:45, Marios Zindilis  wrote:

> For this use case, you don't have to install anything. For convenience,
> you can use an online editor, like http://dillinger.io/ to help you edit
> your document, then copy the Markdown text and paste it in a Gist.
>
> --
> Marios Zindilis
>
> On Thu, Feb 25, 2016 at 3:19 PM, Alan Hogan  wrote:
>
>> The thing is, if you have been asked to submit a document in markdown
>> format, you don’t need any software at all, at least not beyond your
>> favorite text editor (or Github's website itself). Just use .md instead of
>> .txt as the file extension. Markdown the software takes a
>> Markdown-formatted document and outputs an HTML document. At that point,
>> you would no longer be submitting a Markdown doc.
>>
>> And yes, markdown.pl is a command line tool. You are expected to invoke
>> it from the shell.
>>
>> Alan
>>
>> On Feb 25, 2016, at 6:57 AM, Erika Knollenberg via Markdown-Discuss <
>> [email protected]> wrote:
>>
>> I have been assigned to submit a resume for an application to a school
>> using Markdown. They gave me this link:
>> http://daringfireball.net/projects/markdown/ with the following
>> instructions: "Your resume, written in Markdown
>>  and submitted as a GitHub
>> Gist ." I've visted the link and downloaded
>> Markdown. When it didn't have a way to "install" like typical software, I
>> revisited the site and I downloaded Perl 5.22.00. I've also downloaded CPAN
>> (http://search.cpan.org/dist/Digest-MD5/MD5.pm). Now there is a little
>> blue icon in the Markdown folder, but all it opens is a black box. It
>> doesn't open something that should look like this (
>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oba3Czjyras). I've watched a couple of
>> tutorials on how to use it and it's fairly simple. I understand all the
>> 'coding' I need to use. The problem is figuring out how to install the
>> software. I'm not an IT person. I'm good at using programs, not fixing them
>> or understanding things out-of-the-ordinary computer installations. Can
>> someone please give me some direction (using layman's terms) to get this up
>> and moving? Thank you very much for your help. I am using a Windows 7
>> computer.
>>
>> ___
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>>
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>>
>
>
> --
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>
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Re: Installing Markdown

2016-02-25 Thread Alan Hogan 
Yes! There are quite a number of such tools. GitHub Gists themselves have a 
preview / result view, IIRC, but it’s not side-by-side. There are websites that 
do this, though, and desktop software, as well. I don’t use Windows, though, so 
I can’t recommend any for that system.

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Re: Installing Markdown

2016-02-25 Thread Marios Zindilis 
For this use case, you don't have to install anything. For convenience, you
can use an online editor, like http://dillinger.io/ to help you edit your
document, then copy the Markdown text and paste it in a Gist.

--
Marios Zindilis

On Thu, Feb 25, 2016 at 3:19 PM, Alan Hogan  wrote:

> The thing is, if you have been asked to submit a document in markdown
> format, you don’t need any software at all, at least not beyond your
> favorite text editor (or Github's website itself). Just use .md instead of
> .txt as the file extension. Markdown the software takes a
> Markdown-formatted document and outputs an HTML document. At that point,
> you would no longer be submitting a Markdown doc.
>
> And yes, markdown.pl is a command line tool. You are expected to invoke
> it from the shell.
>
> Alan
>
> On Feb 25, 2016, at 6:57 AM, Erika Knollenberg via Markdown-Discuss <
> [email protected]> wrote:
>
> I have been assigned to submit a resume for an application to a school
> using Markdown. They gave me this link:
> http://daringfireball.net/projects/markdown/ with the following
> instructions: "Your resume, written in Markdown
>  and submitted as a GitHub
> Gist ." I've visted the link and downloaded
> Markdown. When it didn't have a way to "install" like typical software, I
> revisited the site and I downloaded Perl 5.22.00. I've also downloaded CPAN
> (http://search.cpan.org/dist/Digest-MD5/MD5.pm). Now there is a little
> blue icon in the Markdown folder, but all it opens is a black box. It
> doesn't open something that should look like this (
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oba3Czjyras). I've watched a couple of
> tutorials on how to use it and it's fairly simple. I understand all the
> 'coding' I need to use. The problem is figuring out how to install the
> software. I'm not an IT person. I'm good at using programs, not fixing them
> or understanding things out-of-the-ordinary computer installations. Can
> someone please give me some direction (using layman's terms) to get this up
> and moving? Thank you very much for your help. I am using a Windows 7
> computer.
>
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>
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>


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Re: Installing Markdown

2016-02-25 Thread Alan Hogan 
The thing is, if you have been asked to submit a document in markdown format, 
you don’t need any software at all, at least not beyond your favorite text 
editor (or Github's website itself). Just use .md instead of .txt as the file 
extension. Markdown the software takes a Markdown-formatted document and 
outputs an HTML document. At that point, you would no longer be submitting a 
Markdown doc.

And yes, markdown.pl is a command line tool. You are expected to invoke it from 
the shell. 

Alan

> On Feb 25, 2016, at 6:57 AM, Erika Knollenberg via Markdown-Discuss 
>  wrote:
> 
> I have been assigned to submit a resume for an application to a school using 
> Markdown. They gave me this link: 
> http://daringfireball.net/projects/markdown/ with the following instructions: 
> "Your resume, written in Markdown and submitted as a GitHub Gist." I've 
> visted the link and downloaded Markdown. When it didn't have a way to 
> "install" like typical software, I revisited the site and I downloaded Perl 
> 5.22.00. I've also downloaded CPAN 
> (http://search.cpan.org/dist/Digest-MD5/MD5.pm). Now there is a little blue 
> icon in the Markdown folder, but all it opens is a black box. It doesn't open 
> something that should look like this 
> (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oba3Czjyras). I've watched a couple of 
> tutorials on how to use it and it's fairly simple. I understand all the 
> 'coding' I need to use. The problem is figuring out how to install the 
> software. I'm not an IT person. I'm good at using programs, not fixing them 
> or understanding things out-of-the-ordinary computer installations. Can 
> someone please give me some direction (using layman's terms) to get this up 
> and moving? Thank you very much for your help. I am using a Windows 7 
> computer.
> 
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Re: Manuscripts - New Book Format for Markdown

2016-02-24 Thread Gerald Bauer 
Hello,

   Thanks. Great to see that gitbook in V3 is adding themes in git
repos, see /theme-default [1] for example.  Might be great to see more
book themes and maybe in the future make them kind of "independent" of
the book builder.

   Cheers.

PS: Some more markdown book builders  - there's also gittobook [2] and
- of course - pandoc [3].

[1] https://github.com/GitbookIO/theme-default
[2] https://github.com/diversen/gittobook
[3] http://pandoc.org/epub.html
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Re: Manuscripts - New Book Format for Markdown

2016-02-24 Thread Tom Short 
Here are a couple more:

- https://www.gitbook.com/
- https://www.softcover.io/

On Mon, Feb 22, 2016 at 6:45 PM, Gerald Bauer 
wrote:

> Hello,
>
>   FYI: Just found another markdown book maker and format called mdBook
> (in Rust) by Mathieu David.
>
>  See the docu [1] or the source [2]. Anyothers? Let us know. Cheers
>
> [1] http://azerupi.github.io/mdBook
> [2] https://github.com/azerupi/mdBook
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Re: Interested in Learning Markdown? Join us for the Vienna.html Meetup Feb/23rd (Free)

2016-02-24 Thread Gerald Bauer 
Hello,
FYI: If anyone is interested in kramdown / markdown - Thomas
Leitner has posted the slides for yesterday's Vienna.html talk titled
"Using Markdown with the kramdown Library and Tools" online [1].

 Cheers.

PS: Tip of the day - Did you know? kramdown can also convert HTML back
into kramdown source? On the command line use: `kramdown -i html -o
kramdown`


[1] http://talks.gettalong.org/2016-02-vienna-html


2016-01-14 14:26 GMT+01:00 Gerald Bauer :
> Hello,
>
>If you happen to be in Central Europe - you're invited to the next
> Vienna.html meetup [1] on Feb/23rd in Austria.
>
>We're proud to host the lead developer of the kramdown library 'n'
> tools that power GitHub Pages, Jekyll, LeanPub, etc.
>
>Title: Using Markdown (HTML “Shortcodes” in Plain Vanilla Text)
> with the kramdown Library and Tools by Thomas Leitner
>
>   Bio: Thomas Leitner is head of the computer group of the mathematics
> department of the University of Vienna and lead developer of the
> kramdown library and tool - a fast, markdown-superset processor (in
> ruby) for converting plain old vanilla text into hypertext (powering
> GitHub Pages, Jekyll, and friends).
>
>
>
>   Join us. Free, everyone welcome. Cheers.
>
> PS: Know any other free Markdown meetups / events? Let us know.
>
> [1] http://viennahtml.github.io
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re: Manuscripts - New Book Format for Markdown

2016-02-23 Thread bowerbird via Markdown-Discuss 

should be ready "real soon now"...


>   http://markua.com


>   https://leanpub.com/markua/read


>   https://github.com/markuadoc



yet another markdown flavor,
specialized for book creation,
from the humans at leanpub...


-bowerbird


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Re: Manuscripts - New Book Format for Markdown

2016-02-22 Thread Gerald Bauer 
Hello,

  FYI: Just found another markdown book maker and format called mdBook
(in Rust) by Mathieu David.

 See the docu [1] or the source [2]. Anyothers? Let us know. Cheers

[1] http://azerupi.github.io/mdBook
[2] https://github.com/azerupi/mdBook
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re: New Static Site Theme for World (Literature) Classics in Markdown e.g. A Tale of Two Cities, The Trial, etc.

2016-02-16 Thread bowerbird via Markdown-Discuss 

shane said:
>   Wow - that's impressive!


yes, it is.


i was fairly skeptical of the commonmark effort -- 
xkcd.com 927, lowest-common-denominator, etc.
-- but i have to give 'em credit for this script here.


i once said that i thought multmarkdown had the
edge to be leader of any markdown convergence,
because the offline app was a huge advantage...


but now, with electron, any javascript routine can
be bundled into offline apps, which means that a
fundamental shift in the tipping-point has occurred.


and with node-js, commonmark could set up a site
with an api and do all server-required conversions.
the bandwidth charges might become fairly hefty,
but setting up the site is probably a eight-hour job.


with server and client handled, bingo consistency.


hasn't happened yet, and might not, but the path
is now fairly clear, for people who want to see it...


in my humble opinion.


-bowerbird


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Re: New Static Site Theme for World (Literature) Classics in Markdown e.g. A Tale of Two Cities, The Trial, etc.

2016-02-16 Thread Shane McCarron 
Wow - that's impressive!

On Tue, Feb 16, 2016 at 5:45 PM, bowerbird via Markdown-Discuss <
[email protected]> wrote:

> gerald-
>
> congratulations on the new wrinkle...
>
> ***
>
> speaking of meet-ups
>
> >   http://viennahtml.github.io
>
> congratulations to kramdown for being
> selected the github-approved converter.
>
> which means it'd sure be nice to have a
> javascript implementation of kramdown.
>
> because i can now say, unequivocally,
> that commonmark excels in this arena.
>
> the javascript converter is here:
> >   https://github.com/jgm/commonmark.js
>
> demo:
> >   http://zenmagiclove.com/simple/commonmark-moby.html
>
> i've shown conversion-time in the title-bar.
>
> when you can convert a file like moby dick
> (1.2 megs) in under a second, you've got
> awesome client-side power working for you.
>
> -bowerbird
>
>
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>


-- 
Shane McCarron
Managing Director, Applied Testing and Technology, Inc.
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