Re: [Marxism] Algerian activist criticises NZ liberal women wearing hijab as 'solidarity' re the mosque murders
POSTING RULES & NOTES #1 YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. #2 This mail-list, like most, is publicly & permanently archived. #3 Subscribe and post under an alias if #2 is a concern. * Totally agree with Michael. The whole "veil/scarf = oppression" narrative is ridiculous. This article by Lila Abu Lughod does a good job tearing it apart: https://org.uib.no/smi/seminars/Pensum/Abu-Lughod.pdf Amith R. Gupta On Wed, Mar 27, 2019 at 2:12 AM mkaradjis via Marxism < marxism@lists.csbs.utah.edu> wrote: > POSTING RULES & NOTES > #1 YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. > #2 This mail-list, like most, is publicly & permanently archived. > #3 Subscribe and post under an alias if #2 is a concern. > * > > An extremely unfortunate article. > Of course we should all support women's struggles against compulsory > veiling. In Iran a female lawyer has just been sentenced to 38 years in > prison for defending women's rights activists, who wre protesting > compuslory veiling. > But women have the right to wear a scarf over their heads just as they have > a right not to. Much as I can understand where an Algrian activist is > coming from, the sentence "At the times of Al Qaeda and Daesch – i.e. when > no one in the world can pretend to ignore what happens to women who do not > conform – isn’t donning the veil somehow short sighted?" - is basically > conflating the wearing of a scarf with al-Qaida and Daesh! > Where I work in western Sydney, many Muslim teachers, and countless Muslim > students, wear a scarf. Many would rightly laugh me off if I told them they > were only wearing it due to oppression. Imagine what they would think if I > compared them to Daesh. I'd probably lose my job as a racist. At least I'd > like to hope so. > Michael > > On Wed, Mar 27, 2019 at 2:44 PM Philip Ferguson via Marxism < > marxism@lists.csbs.utah.edu> wrote: > > > POSTING RULES & NOTES > > #1 YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. > > #2 This mail-list, like most, is publicly & permanently archived. > > #3 Subscribe and post under an alias if #2 is a concern. > > * > > > > "New Zealand Prime Minister Ms Jacinda Ardern, followed by other > officials > > (and then by ordinary citizens as well) saw it fit to wear a so-called > > Islamic head covering during their public functions. > > > > "We believe that there were many other symbols that could have been > chosen > > in order to comfort Muslim believers, than one which is contested the > world > > over by women of Muslim heritage, - believers and unbelievers alike. . . > . > > > > full at: > > > > > https://rdln.wordpress.com/2019/03/27/open-letter-from-algerian-woman-activist-on-the-wearing-headscarves/ > > _ > > Full posting guidelines at: http://www.marxmail.org/sub.htm > > Set your options at: > > https://lists.csbs.utah.edu/options/marxism/mkaradjis%40gmail.com > > > _ > Full posting guidelines at: http://www.marxmail.org/sub.htm > Set your options at: > https://lists.csbs.utah.edu/options/marxism/amithrgupta%40gmail.com _ Full posting guidelines at: http://www.marxmail.org/sub.htm Set your options at: https://lists.csbs.utah.edu/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Marxism] Algerian activist criticises NZ liberal women wearing hijab as 'solidarity' re the mosque murders
POSTING RULES & NOTES #1 YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. #2 This mail-list, like most, is publicly & permanently archived. #3 Subscribe and post under an alias if #2 is a concern. * An extremely unfortunate article. Of course we should all support women's struggles against compulsory veiling. In Iran a female lawyer has just been sentenced to 38 years in prison for defending women's rights activists, who wre protesting compuslory veiling. But women have the right to wear a scarf over their heads just as they have a right not to. Much as I can understand where an Algrian activist is coming from, the sentence "At the times of Al Qaeda and Daesch – i.e. when no one in the world can pretend to ignore what happens to women who do not conform – isn’t donning the veil somehow short sighted?" - is basically conflating the wearing of a scarf with al-Qaida and Daesh! Where I work in western Sydney, many Muslim teachers, and countless Muslim students, wear a scarf. Many would rightly laugh me off if I told them they were only wearing it due to oppression. Imagine what they would think if I compared them to Daesh. I'd probably lose my job as a racist. At least I'd like to hope so. Michael On Wed, Mar 27, 2019 at 2:44 PM Philip Ferguson via Marxism < marxism@lists.csbs.utah.edu> wrote: > POSTING RULES & NOTES > #1 YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. > #2 This mail-list, like most, is publicly & permanently archived. > #3 Subscribe and post under an alias if #2 is a concern. > * > > "New Zealand Prime Minister Ms Jacinda Ardern, followed by other officials > (and then by ordinary citizens as well) saw it fit to wear a so-called > Islamic head covering during their public functions. > > "We believe that there were many other symbols that could have been chosen > in order to comfort Muslim believers, than one which is contested the world > over by women of Muslim heritage, - believers and unbelievers alike. . . . > > full at: > > https://rdln.wordpress.com/2019/03/27/open-letter-from-algerian-woman-activist-on-the-wearing-headscarves/ > _ > Full posting guidelines at: http://www.marxmail.org/sub.htm > Set your options at: > https://lists.csbs.utah.edu/options/marxism/mkaradjis%40gmail.com > _ Full posting guidelines at: http://www.marxmail.org/sub.htm Set your options at: https://lists.csbs.utah.edu/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Marxism] Algerian activist criticises NZ liberal women wearing hijab as 'solidarity' re the mosque murders
POSTING RULES & NOTES #1 YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. #2 This mail-list, like most, is publicly & permanently archived. #3 Subscribe and post under an alias if #2 is a concern. * Here's what I wrote in response to this post on Redline: I absolutely support Marieme Helie Lucas comments about the cancelling of the atheist speaker in Canada. But the wearing of the veil as a statement of solidarity is a very different issue. Of course in places like Iran and Algeria women have been attacked and killed for not wearing the veil. It is important that the left does not confuse solidarity with Muslims with support for fundamentalism. But at the moment, the actual enemy of Muslims in Christchurch was a white nationalist killer who sees someone the wearing of a veil as a legitimate target for execution. The circumstances are very different so the symbolism of an action are also different. A woman I know who decided to wear the hijab for a day did her regular 15 minute duty outside the school gate 1km from the Linwood Muslim centre where some of the killings occurred. Within that 15 minutes, she was told at least six times to fuck off by passing drivers. No one on the staff is now under any illusions about the level of racist abuse Muslims, and particularly women, are subjected to on a daily basis. On the other hand, giving zakaat would be an invisible act of solidarity in terms of sending a message to the people whose white supremacist politics have given support to this killer. And of course, in a sense, people have done that too, because crowd sourcing pages have raised large amounts of money to support the survivors of the massacre. Ironically, I've just recently been engaged in an argument with a woman who also objected to the veil because, as a woman, she saw it as a mark of women's subservience and wanted to raise veiling as an campaign worth raising now. In my opinion it would actually divert attention from the solidarity issue into a campaign Islamophobes could feel comfortable in. I asked her if her solidarity with women forced to wear the veil would extend to supporting their right of return to her "home", from whence they had been expelled in 1948. I haven't heard from her since. We have to see the differences between our situation in New Zealand, where White Nationalism is the immediate threat and the situation of struggle in Muslim majority countries where Islamic fundamentalism is the threat. Different situation, different tactics. Cheers, John On Wed, Mar 27, 2019 at 4:44 PM Philip Ferguson via Marxism < marxism@lists.csbs.utah.edu> wrote: > POSTING RULES & NOTES > #1 YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. > #2 This mail-list, like most, is publicly & permanently archived. > #3 Subscribe and post under an alias if #2 is a concern. > * > > "New Zealand Prime Minister Ms Jacinda Ardern, followed by other officials > (and then by ordinary citizens as well) saw it fit to wear a so-called > Islamic head covering during their public functions. > > "We believe that there were many other symbols that could have been chosen > in order to comfort Muslim believers, than one which is contested the world > over by women of Muslim heritage, - believers and unbelievers alike. . . . > > full at: > > https://rdln.wordpress.com/2019/03/27/open-letter-from-algerian-woman-activist-on-the-wearing-headscarves/ > _ > Full posting guidelines at: http://www.marxmail.org/sub.htm > Set your options at: > https://lists.csbs.utah.edu/options/marxism/johnedmundson4%40gmail.com > -- The law locks up the man or woman Who steals the goose from off the common But leaves the greater villain loose Who steals the common from the goose _ Full posting guidelines at: http://www.marxmail.org/sub.htm Set your options at: https://lists.csbs.utah.edu/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
[Marxism] Algerian activist criticises NZ liberal women wearing hijab as 'solidarity' re the mosque murders
POSTING RULES & NOTES #1 YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. #2 This mail-list, like most, is publicly & permanently archived. #3 Subscribe and post under an alias if #2 is a concern. * "New Zealand Prime Minister Ms Jacinda Ardern, followed by other officials (and then by ordinary citizens as well) saw it fit to wear a so-called Islamic head covering during their public functions. "We believe that there were many other symbols that could have been chosen in order to comfort Muslim believers, than one which is contested the world over by women of Muslim heritage, - believers and unbelievers alike. . . . full at: https://rdln.wordpress.com/2019/03/27/open-letter-from-algerian-woman-activist-on-the-wearing-headscarves/ _ Full posting guidelines at: http://www.marxmail.org/sub.htm Set your options at: https://lists.csbs.utah.edu/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
