Re: [Marxism] Fw: [foil] Where's science in the bombast? Jayanti Narlikar Asks
POSTING RULES & NOTES #1 YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. #2 This mail-list, like most, is publicly & permanently archived. #3 Subscribe and post under an alias if #2 is a concern. * Sorry,Here is the URL http://www.asianage.com/columnists/where-s-science-bombast-647Vijaya Kumar marla On Sunday, March 15, 2015 8:57 PM, Marla Vijaya kumar via Marxism wrote: POSTING RULES & NOTES #1 YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. #2 This mail-list, like most, is publicly & permanently archived. #3 Subscribe and post under an alias if #2 is a concern. * Comrades, Sorry. I had seen it a bit late, but the posting by Sukla Sen in foil forum is interesting.The article is written by Prof. Jayant Narlikar, a very famous Indian Astrophysist on the claim of Hindu fundamentalits that all modern knowledge of today is already known to Vedic Aryans. An excelling and compelling arguement.Vijaya Kumar Marla On Wednesday, March 11, 2015 1:23 PM, Sukla Sen wrote: [The author needs no introduction. He has made quite a few compelling points. Trying to highlight just of these. TV, aeroplane or nuclear warheads did not appear in a vacuum. These are very much components and products of a chain of scientific/technological developments - ***not*** stand-alone random achievements. Just to illustrate, there can simply be no TV without electricity And, of course, no "scientist", worth one's salt, would accept a claim unsupported by credible evidence.] http://www.asianage.com/columnists/where-s-science-bombast-647 Where's science in the bombast? Mar 11, 2015 Jayanti V. Narlikar One often hears claims that our ancient ancestors were scientifically advanced. So far such claims have stood on weak foundations with descriptions that can, at best, be described as 'poetic'. There's no scientific manual to back these claims. Were our ancient ancestors scientifically advanced? This question is often posed to a scientist, more often than not in the expectation that the answer will be in the affirmative. The scientist, of course, will base his or her reply on whatever evidence is available. The evidence could be in the form of relics or artefacts that are seen today. Such items should suggest that they came from a high-tech environment that might have existed in the past. For example, the relics at Harappa and Mohenjodaro indicate the existence of good town planning, including drainage system, trade areas, etc. Thus archaeologists can piece together a relatively coherent picture of the Indus Valley civilisation. Another possible line of evidence could come from written records left behind by an old civilisation. In this context one often hears claims that our ancient ancestors, going back to the Vedic era, were scientifically advanced. So far such claims have stood on weak foundations with descriptions that can, at best, be described as "poetic". There's no scientific manual to back these claims. Thus the Ramayan mentions the Pushpak Viman which flew in a very easily manoeuvrable mode that would make a modern helicopter envy its construction. Likewise, the Mahabharat talks of the ultimate weapon, the Brahmastra, which may have been a superior version of a nuclear powered missile. In the same epic we also read of the guided missile which killed Ghatotkacha and, of course, about Sanjaya who provided a running commentary of the war based on the distant vision that he was endowed with, thus making a case for advanced TV technology. Persuasive though such stories may be, there are many gaps in them if you probe further. Take nuclear weaponry, for instance. If the ancients knew all about it, then they must also have known about another natural force, the force of electricity and magnetism. This is the force that provides us with so many amenities, like lighting and fans, air conditioning and refrigeration, electric trains, facilities of communication, and so on. Yet, there is no mention of this force in our epics. At a different level, the provision of tap water is considered a basic amenity today. Indeed, we can say that today the government considers water on tap and electricity for lighting basic amenities to be provided to every village. But if you read the Mahabharat, you will not find this amenity existing even in the royal palace of the King of Hastinapur. Why I lay stress on the knowledge of electricity and magnetism is because in modern science this was the basic force, studied most extensively, and it was through this force that the atom could be probed. Later applications of this technology led scientists to the probing of the nucleus of the atom. The realisation of what is meant by nuclear energy came after such probes
[Marxism] Fw: [foil] Where's science in the bombast? Jayanti Narlikar Asks
POSTING RULES & NOTES #1 YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. #2 This mail-list, like most, is publicly & permanently archived. #3 Subscribe and post under an alias if #2 is a concern. * Comrades, Sorry. I had seen it a bit late, but the posting by Sukla Sen in foil forum is interesting.The article is written by Prof. Jayant Narlikar, a very famous Indian Astrophysist on the claim of Hindu fundamentalits that all modern knowledge of today is already known to Vedic Aryans. An excelling and compelling arguement.Vijaya Kumar Marla On Wednesday, March 11, 2015 1:23 PM, Sukla Sen wrote: [The author needs no introduction. He has made quite a few compelling points. Trying to highlight just of these. TV, aeroplane or nuclear warheads did not appear in a vacuum. These are very much components and products of a chain of scientific/technological developments - ***not*** stand-alone random achievements. Just to illustrate, there can simply be no TV without electricity And, of course, no "scientist", worth one's salt, would accept a claim unsupported by credible evidence.] http://www.asianage.com/columnists/where-s-science-bombast-647 Where's science in the bombast? Mar 11, 2015 Jayanti V. Narlikar One often hears claims that our ancient ancestors were scientifically advanced. So far such claims have stood on weak foundations with descriptions that can, at best, be described as 'poetic'. There's no scientific manual to back these claims. Were our ancient ancestors scientifically advanced? This question is often posed to a scientist, more often than not in the expectation that the answer will be in the affirmative. The scientist, of course, will base his or her reply on whatever evidence is available. The evidence could be in the form of relics or artefacts that are seen today. Such items should suggest that they came from a high-tech environment that might have existed in the past. For example, the relics at Harappa and Mohenjodaro indicate the existence of good town planning, including drainage system, trade areas, etc. Thus archaeologists can piece together a relatively coherent picture of the Indus Valley civilisation. Another possible line of evidence could come from written records left behind by an old civilisation. In this context one often hears claims that our ancient ancestors, going back to the Vedic era, were scientifically advanced. So far such claims have stood on weak foundations with descriptions that can, at best, be described as "poetic". There's no scientific manual to back these claims. Thus the Ramayan mentions the Pushpak Viman which flew in a very easily manoeuvrable mode that would make a modern helicopter envy its construction. Likewise, the Mahabharat talks of the ultimate weapon, the Brahmastra, which may have been a superior version of a nuclear powered missile. In the same epic we also read of the guided missile which killed Ghatotkacha and, of course, about Sanjaya who provided a running commentary of the war based on the distant vision that he was endowed with, thus making a case for advanced TV technology. Persuasive though such stories may be, there are many gaps in them if you probe further. Take nuclear weaponry, for instance. If the ancients knew all about it, then they must also have known about another natural force, the force of electricity and magnetism. This is the force that provides us with so many amenities, like lighting and fans, air conditioning and refrigeration, electric trains, facilities of communication, and so on. Yet, there is no mention of this force in our epics. At a different level, the provision of tap water is considered a basic amenity today. Indeed, we can say that today the government considers water on tap and electricity for lighting basic amenities to be provided to every village. But if you read the Mahabharat, you will not find this amenity existing even in the royal palace of the King of Hastinapur. Why I lay stress on the knowledge of electricity and magnetism is because in modern science this was the basic force, studied most extensively, and it was through this force that the atom could be probed. Later applications of this technology led scientists to the probing of the nucleus of the atom. The realisation of what is meant by nuclear energy came after such probes. It is hard to see how one may arrive at the discovery of nuclear energy, completely bypassing the electromagnetic effects. Returning to the concept of a manual, I would consider it as strong evidence in support of our ancestors being in possession of modern technology, if a manual is produced to show that it describes a nuts-and-bolts kit of how a machine was constructed. I have been shown the book Brihad Vimana Shastra as such a manual for making flying objects. Alas, it fails to provide the full details
