Re: [MBZ] If You're Gonna Go, Go in Style

2015-06-14 Thread G Mann via Mercedes
Well.. I have to say.. that is a real Collectors item...


On Sun, Jun 14, 2015 at 5:24 AM, Dan Penoff via Mercedes 
mercedes@okiebenz.com wrote:

 Like this:


 https://www.classicdriver.com/en/car/mercedes-benz/w12/1963/311989?plugin=trueplugin_id=181529

 Dan
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Re: [MBZ] If You're Gonna Go, Go in Style

2015-06-14 Thread G Mann via Mercedes
One last shot to hedge your bet for the hereafter... Regardless of your
life of sin.. if you look good on the way to the great dirt nap you will
be well remembered maybe..

That is one Finny you would just die to ride in... after all.

Wonder what it cost to restore to that condition.

On Sun, Jun 14, 2015 at 5:50 AM, Dan Penoff via Mercedes 
mercedes@okiebenz.com wrote:

 I love the big chrome cross on top.  Epic.

 Dan

  On Jun 14, 2015, at 8:46 AM, G Mann via Mercedes mercedes@okiebenz.com
 wrote:
 
  Well.. I have to say.. that is a real Collectors item...
 
 
  On Sun, Jun 14, 2015 at 5:24 AM, Dan Penoff via Mercedes 
  mercedes@okiebenz.com wrote:
 
  Like this:
 
 
 
 https://www.classicdriver.com/en/car/mercedes-benz/w12/1963/311989?plugin=trueplugin_id=181529
 
  Dan
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Re: [MBZ] If You're Gonna Go, Go in Style

2015-06-14 Thread Tom Savage via Mercedes
That's nice but the jaloponist in me wants to go like this:
https://www.dropbox.com/sc/qqmy3b3cpl0k4p5/AABybINWvDY9J417aF71tMkka

I guess I should ask Curt if he's encountered any Filipino funeral
processions/parades yet...

Tom
On Jun 14, 2015 7:25 AM, Dan Penoff via Mercedes mercedes@okiebenz.com
wrote:

 Like this:


 https://www.classicdriver.com/en/car/mercedes-benz/w12/1963/311989?plugin=trueplugin_id=181529

 Dan
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Re: [MBZ] If You're Gonna Go, Go in Style

2015-06-14 Thread Dan Penoff via Mercedes
I love the big chrome cross on top.  Epic.

Dan

 On Jun 14, 2015, at 8:46 AM, G Mann via Mercedes mercedes@okiebenz.com 
 wrote:
 
 Well.. I have to say.. that is a real Collectors item...
 
 
 On Sun, Jun 14, 2015 at 5:24 AM, Dan Penoff via Mercedes 
 mercedes@okiebenz.com wrote:
 
 Like this:
 
 
 https://www.classicdriver.com/en/car/mercedes-benz/w12/1963/311989?plugin=trueplugin_id=181529
 
 Dan
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 http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
 
 
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[MBZ] S500 Mystery Solved

2015-06-14 Thread Dan Penoff via Mercedes
So the issues finally come to an end, and Im a little put off by my 
stupidity...

Took the car to my trusted indie shop. After two hours of troubleshooting, they 
came back and said the MAF was sketchy and all of the hoses on the top of the 
engine were questionable. Fine. I drive it home and it's still running poorly 
at low RPMs, especially when taking off form a stop. Get above 1500 RPM or 20 
MPH, runs like a top. Hmm.

So I get a rebuilt MAF from MBUSA along with a full set of hoses for the 
topside of the engine.

Put everything on the car yesterday morning (and boy, were those hoses bad!) 
and the car still runs like crap. Dang it!

After my first test drive, I noticed besides the poor low speed operation, the 
left side cat was running hot. With this in mind, I'm thinking maybe I have a 
bad coil on that side of the engine.  So I pull the distributor caps to take a 
look to see if their condition yields any clues

Both caps are full of condensation. Grrr.

I clean both out, button everything up, drive the car. Runs like new.

Granted, the MAF was sketchy and the topside hoses were bad, but I can't help 
but wonder if the condensation wasn't part of the problem as well

What's important is that it's fixed. Lesson learned.

Dan
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[MBZ] If You're Gonna Go, Go in Style

2015-06-14 Thread Dan Penoff via Mercedes
Like this:

https://www.classicdriver.com/en/car/mercedes-benz/w12/1963/311989?plugin=trueplugin_id=181529

Dan
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Re: [MBZ] S500 Mystery Solved

2015-06-14 Thread Dan Penoff via Mercedes
Actually, it is normal in this climate.  I found on several occasions where the 
car was parked for 3-4 days (or more) that condensation would sometimes collect 
in the distributor caps, but a good hard drive would burn it out.  This was 
especially common when my son had the car at school, as the parking structure 
he parked the car in was a block from the waters of Tampa Bay. This, coupled 
with the temperature swings and humidity, added to being parked in a shaded 
area on concrete, created condensation on and under the car regularly.

The caps aren’t tightly sealed, and being at the front of the engine and in the 
airflow to some extent don’t get terribly hot compared to the rest of the 
engine compartment.

Numerous references to the same on the W140 Benzworld forums, too. Here is just 
one example of many:

http://www.benzworld.org/forums/w140-s-class/2300802-distributor-cap-question.html#post11537146

The amount of condensate was very small, but it was enough to affect the spark.

Dan

 
 On Jun 14, 2015, at 8:12 AM, Jim Cathey jim.cathey...@gmail.com wrote:
 
 Not solved.  Where did all this moisture come from?  That's
 not normal.  Is the crankcase ventilation plugged up such that
 a little bit of the blowby was coming 'round the shaft?  Did
 you hose down the engine a little too vigorously?  Ford any
 streams?  Buy the car in Florida, 'cheap'?
 
 -- Jim
 


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Re: [MBZ] S500 Mystery Solved

2015-06-14 Thread WILTON via Mercedes

ATTABOY!

Wilton

- Original Message - 
From: Dan Penoff via Mercedes mercedes@okiebenz.com

To: Mercedes List mercedes@okiebenz.com
Cc: Dan Penoff d...@penoff.com
Sent: Sunday, June 14, 2015 6:01 AM
Subject: [MBZ] S500 Mystery Solved


So the issues finally come to an end, and Im a little put off by my 
stupidity...


Took the car to my trusted indie shop. After two hours of troubleshooting, 
they came back and said the MAF was sketchy and all of the hoses on the 
top of the engine were questionable. Fine. I drive it home and it's still 
running poorly at low RPMs, especially when taking off form a stop. Get 
above 1500 RPM or 20 MPH, runs like a top. Hmm.


So I get a rebuilt MAF from MBUSA along with a full set of hoses for the 
topside of the engine.


Put everything on the car yesterday morning (and boy, were those hoses 
bad!) and the car still runs like crap. Dang it!


After my first test drive, I noticed besides the poor low speed operation, 
the left side cat was running hot. With this in mind, I'm thinking maybe I 
have a bad coil on that side of the engine.  So I pull the distributor 
caps to take a look to see if their condition yields any clues


Both caps are full of condensation. Grrr.

I clean both out, button everything up, drive the car. Runs like new.

Granted, the MAF was sketchy and the topside hoses were bad, but I can't 
help but wonder if the condensation wasn't part of the problem as well


What's important is that it's fixed. Lesson learned.

Dan
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Re: [MBZ] S500 Mystery Solved

2015-06-14 Thread Jim Cathey via Mercedes

Not solved.  Where did all this moisture come from?  That's
not normal.  Is the crankcase ventilation plugged up such that
a little bit of the blowby was coming 'round the shaft?  Did
you hose down the engine a little too vigorously?  Ford any
streams?  Buy the car in Florida, 'cheap'?

-- Jim


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Re: [MBZ] hey WILTON

2015-06-14 Thread Tom Savage via Mercedes
On Jun 13, 2015 8:30 AM, Dan Penoff via Mercedes mercedes@okiebenz.com
wrote:

 Tommy,

 You need to go to the tent sale.  It’s well worth the trip and you can
snag some unbelievable deals on A-E shoes.  Definitely an item on any A-E
wearer’s bucket list.

 And you can meet up with the Doobie Brothers while you’re there.  Well,
at least one of them.


Well, I am driving through Wisconsin on Tuesday... but do you really get
better pricing on site than over the phone?  It is moot, alas; between
vacation, new glasses, and a broken dishwasher, I'm not buying any shoes
this month (or next).

Tom
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Re: [MBZ] hey WILTON

2015-06-14 Thread Dan Penoff via Mercedes
The tent sale is the week of July 4th, or the first week in July, if I recall 
correctly.  They probably have something about it on their web site.

When I lived in Port there were no deals at the factory, other than they almost 
always had just about any shoe you wanted out of their selection.

Dan

 On Jun 14, 2015, at 9:31 AM, Tom Savage via Mercedes mercedes@okiebenz.com 
 wrote:
 
 Well, I am driving through Wisconsin on Tuesday... but do you really get
 better pricing on site than over the phone?  It is moot, alas; between
 vacation, new glasses, and a broken dishwasher, I'm not buying any shoes
 this month (or next).
 
 Tom
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[MBZ] Finnjet, the only car with a chrome bill bigger than its gas bill, comes up for sal | Hemmings Daily

2015-06-14 Thread Dwight Giles via Mercedes
http://blog.hemmings.com/index.php/2015/06/08/finnjet-the-only-car-with-a-chrome-bill-bigger-than-its-gas-bill-comes-up-for-sale/?refer=news
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Re: [MBZ] OT tin roof

2015-06-14 Thread Curt Raymond via Mercedes
I was thinking the same thing but PA isn't so far away and from what I know of 
the simple folk they'll do what they can to bring in money...
-Curt

  From: Curly McLain via Mercedes mercedes@okiebenz.com
 To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com 
Cc: Curly McLain 126die...@gmail.com 
 Sent: Saturday, June 13, 2015 10:48 PM
 Subject: Re: [MBZ] OT tin roof
   
Andrew sez:  Amish guys erected my new shed.

The end of the world must be neat is Amish guys condescend to go into 
the DC area.



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Re: [MBZ] OT tin roof

2015-06-14 Thread Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes
An old geezer, a whippersnapper, and a 25 year old.  What a team!

On Sat, Jun 13, 2015 at 11:15 PM, Curt Raymond via Mercedes 
mercedes@okiebenz.com wrote:

 I was thinking the same thing but PA isn't so far away and from what I
 know of the simple folk they'll do what they can to bring in money...
 -Curt

   From: Curly McLain via Mercedes mercedes@okiebenz.com
  To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com
 Cc: Curly McLain 126die...@gmail.com
  Sent: Saturday, June 13, 2015 10:48 PM
  Subject: Re: [MBZ] OT tin roof

 Andrew sez:  Amish guys erected my new shed.

 The end of the world must be neat is Amish guys condescend to go into
 the DC area.



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Re: [MBZ] OT tin roof

2015-06-14 Thread Dimitri via Mercedes
Andrew is his middle name. First name is Yoder

Sent from my iPhone

 On Jun 14, 2015, at 12:30 PM, Rich Thomas via Mercedes 
 mercedes@okiebenz.com wrote:
 
 Andrew is not a weird enough name, nor do you have 13 chirruns as far as I 
 know.  And you let the debbil into your home through the wires.
 
 --R
 
 On 6/14/15 12:09 PM, Andrew Strasfogel wrote:
 How do you know I'm not one of them??
 
 On Sun, Jun 14, 2015 at 11:46 AM, Rich Thomas via Mercedes 
 mercedes@okiebenz.com mailto:mercedes@okiebenz.com wrote:
 
They have infiltrated everywhere -- a quite prolific group. They'll 
 send some scouts out to an area, buy a farm or two (cash)
then the clan starts coming and buying up farms all around.
Probably not far from DC now.
 
--R
 
 
 
 
On 6/13/15 11:15 PM, Curt Raymond via Mercedes wrote:
 
I was thinking the same thing but PA isn't so far away and
from what I know of the simple folk they'll do what they can
to bring in money...
-Curt
 
   From: Curly McLain via Mercedes mercedes@okiebenz.com
mailto:mercedes@okiebenz.com
  To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com
mailto:mercedes@okiebenz.com
Cc: Curly McLain 126die...@gmail.com
mailto:126die...@gmail.com
  Sent: Saturday, June 13, 2015 10:48 PM
  Subject: Re: [MBZ] OT tin roof
Andrew sez:  Amish guys erected my new shed.
 
The end of the world must be neat is Amish guys condescend to
go into
the DC area.
 
 
 
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Re: [MBZ] OT tin roof

2015-06-14 Thread Rich Thomas via Mercedes
They have infiltrated everywhere -- a quite prolific group.  They'll 
send some scouts out to an area, buy a farm or two (cash) then the clan 
starts coming and buying up farms all around.  Probably not far from DC now.


--R



On 6/13/15 11:15 PM, Curt Raymond via Mercedes wrote:

I was thinking the same thing but PA isn't so far away and from what I know of 
the simple folk they'll do what they can to bring in money...
-Curt

   From: Curly McLain via Mercedes mercedes@okiebenz.com
  To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com
Cc: Curly McLain 126die...@gmail.com
  Sent: Saturday, June 13, 2015 10:48 PM
  Subject: Re: [MBZ] OT tin roof

Andrew sez:  Amish guys erected my new shed.


The end of the world must be neat is Amish guys condescend to go into
the DC area.



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Re: [MBZ] OT tin roof

2015-06-14 Thread Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes
How do you know I'm not one of them??

On Sun, Jun 14, 2015 at 11:46 AM, Rich Thomas via Mercedes 
mercedes@okiebenz.com wrote:

 They have infiltrated everywhere -- a quite prolific group.  They'll send
 some scouts out to an area, buy a farm or two (cash) then the clan starts
 coming and buying up farms all around.  Probably not far from DC now.

 --R




 On 6/13/15 11:15 PM, Curt Raymond via Mercedes wrote:

 I was thinking the same thing but PA isn't so far away and from what I
 know of the simple folk they'll do what they can to bring in money...
 -Curt

From: Curly McLain via Mercedes mercedes@okiebenz.com
   To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com
 Cc: Curly McLain 126die...@gmail.com
   Sent: Saturday, June 13, 2015 10:48 PM
   Subject: Re: [MBZ] OT tin roof
 Andrew sez:  Amish guys erected my new shed.

 The end of the world must be neat is Amish guys condescend to go into
 the DC area.



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Re: [MBZ] OT - Sunil?

2015-06-14 Thread Bob Rentfro via Mercedes
There are some days, however, when I really wish I could see a picture of
what Mao ate for breakfast.

Bob R
On Jun 12, 2015 8:10 AM, Dan Penoff via Mercedes mercedes@okiebenz.com
wrote:

 Mao won't do Fookbace or whatever he calls it.

 The Veteran's group is a very nice place with a lot of familiar folks.

 While I am very much anti-Facebook, it's one of the only places I frequent
 there.

 Dan

 Sent from my iPad

  On Jun 12, 2015, at 11:03 AM, Rick Knoble via Mercedes 
 mercedes@okiebenz.com wrote:
 
 
  However, all of the above mentioned folks are on Facebook, as is Loren
 Faeth, who
  used to be here also, and maybe is, kinda, but incognito...
 
  Alex also started a Mercedes Veterans FB group, to which most of the
 above belong,
  and Hollywood Fats is NOT a member.
 
  Hint to Mao. Hey, you are retired with nothing better to do than social
 media
 
  Rick
 
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Re: [MBZ] Finnjet, the only car with a chrome bill bigger than its gas bill, comes up for sal | Hemmings Daily

2015-06-14 Thread G Mann via Mercedes
I would consider it.. but only because I have not angered the Homeowners
Association recently, and they are overdue...

;) ... Unusual car to say the least..
I wonder if there is a video anywhere that details the construction of this
work of art.. Would be engaging to watch it evolve.

On Sun, Jun 14, 2015 at 7:10 AM, Dwight Giles via Mercedes 
mercedes@okiebenz.com wrote:


 http://blog.hemmings.com/index.php/2015/06/08/finnjet-the-only-car-with-a-chrome-bill-bigger-than-its-gas-bill-comes-up-for-sale/?refer=news
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Re: [MBZ] OT - A COUNTRY BOY REMEMBERS - GLOSSARY

2015-06-14 Thread Rich Thomas via Mercedes
Yonder -- some indeterminate location over yonder  Where it at? Over 
yonder sometimes with a nod of the head in a general direction


Plum wo out -- completely worn out

wawmehn -- a watermelon

all y'all -- evvabody

--R

On 6/13/15 11:04 PM, WILTON via Mercedes wrote:

More GLOSSARY
By Wilton Strickland

Wachamacallit, wachamadoodle -- whatever you may call it - a thing
Warda, warder -- water
Way up yonh -- a long way up there
Well, I do declare. -- I'm amazed.
Weuns -- we, us
Wheelbar' -- wheelbarrow
'While ago -- a few minutes ago
Whir -- where
Whuppin'-- spanking
Wid -- with
Wide open -- full speed, as fast as it will go
Wire grass -- wild Bermuda grass in the fields of d'backa, corn, 
cotton, etc.

Whoa, Ho -- signal or command for mule to stop
Who'da thunkit? -- Who would have thought 
Won't -- wasn't, weren't, will not
Wore out -- badly worn
Ya -- you
Yabut -- yes, but
Y'all, pl. all y'all -- you, Southern for youse guys (Y'all has always 
been plural for me; I've never used all y'all.)

Y'all's, y'allses -- your, yours
Yeah -- yes
Yep -- yes
Yestiddy -- yesterday
Yon't da? -- Do you want to?
You can't get blood out of a turnip. -- You can't take from me what I 
don't have (usually on the subject of money).

You'da -- you would/should have
You look like a gutted herring. -- You look really bad!
You may want horns, but you'll die mull-headed. -- Your wants have no 
bearing whatever on the situation.

Yourn -- your, yours
Your goose is cooked. --You are really in trouble.
Youse guys -- y'all, you (not native to the area; imported from up 
nawth and used by a native only in jest)

Yowbut -- Yes, but
Yungun -- child
Zink -- sink

Wilton

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[MBZ] Amish, was: OT tin roof

2015-06-14 Thread Curly McLain via Mercedes
No Amish would be caught dead working for the goobermnt, robbing 
people at gunpoint to do things the wealthy donors want.




How do you know I'm not one of them??

On Sun, Jun 14, 2015 at 11:46 AM, Rich Thomas via Mercedes 
mercedes@okiebenz.com wrote:


 They have infiltrated everywhere -- a quite prolific group.  They'll send
 some scouts out to an area, buy a farm or two (cash) then the clan starts
 coming and buying up farms all around.  Probably not far from DC now.


  --R
 


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Re: [MBZ] American policy

2015-06-14 Thread archer75--- via Mercedes
When the U.S. was flying nuclear bombs to the borders of the USSR and then 
turning back at the last minute during the late '40s, General Curt LeMay said 
we should keep right on going to Russian targets and nuke the communists back 
to the stone age.
I wonder what the world would be like nowadays if someone had given that 
command? 
Gerry

Rich Thomas wrote:
 I say we take off an nuke the whole site from orbit.  It's the only way to be 
 sure.
 
 On 6/13/15 7:28 PM, archer75--- via Mercedes wrote:
  America won the Cold War in large part because the Russians knew that 
  American avionics would give NATO control of the air in any prospective 
  war; that the Pershing missiles in Germany and Italy gave NATO an advantage 
  in any prospective nuclear exchange; and that the Reagan Strategic Defense 
  Initiative portended a new range of technologies that Russia couldn’t 
  match. China looked on from a distance and aligned itself with the dominant 
  technological superpower.
 
  If America wants to command China’s respect, it has to widen the technology 
  gap, rather than watch it shrink. If China believed that its weapons 
  systems were ineffective against American countermeasures, it would show 
  far more caution. But the opposite is true: the technology gap is closing, 
  and China knows it. America still has a technological lead and the 
  resources to widen it–should it choose to do so. There is no obvious 
  political constituency for such an effort though, and no prominent leader 
  commited to doing so. A return to the Eisenhower-Kennedy-Reagan commitment 
  to American technological superiority would also have enormously beneficial 
  effects for America’s lagging productivity. But it is hard to persuade 
  Americans that it is better to be tough than to sound tough.
 
  Asia Times
 
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Re: [MBZ] OT tin roof

2015-06-14 Thread archer75--- via Mercedes
You're not unless your fathers or mothers last name is one of the following. 
Strasfogel isn't on the list.

Miller, 
Stoltzfus,
Hershberger
Yoder
Hochstetler
Troyer
Schrock
Bontrager
Burkholder
Lehman
Lambright
King
Fisher
Lapp
Zook
Beiler
Hostetler
Hochstedler
Borkholder
Stoltzfoos
Byler
Harshberger.
Schwartz
Hilty
Lengacher
Graber
Wittmer
Nolt
Zimmerman.

I looked them up out of curiosity to see if Strasfogel was included.
Wife was part Mennonite from Lancaster County, Pa. The Amish are a Mennonite 
breakaway sect. Amish usually have a last name from this short list of last 
names.

Andrew Strasfogel wrote:
 How do you know I'm not one of them??
 
 On Sun, Jun 14, 2015 at 11:46 AM, Rich Thomas via Mercedes 
 mercedes@okiebenz.com wrote:
 
  They have infiltrated everywhere -- a quite prolific group.  They'll send
  some scouts out to an area, buy a farm or two (cash) then the clan starts
  coming and buying up farms all around.  Probably not far from DC now.
 
  --R
 
 
 
 
  On 6/13/15 11:15 PM, Curt Raymond via Mercedes wrote:
 
  I was thinking the same thing but PA isn't so far away and from what I
  know of the simple folk they'll do what they can to bring in money...
  -Curt
 
 From: Curly McLain via Mercedes mercedes@okiebenz.com
To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com
  Cc: Curly McLain 126die...@gmail.com
Sent: Saturday, June 13, 2015 10:48 PM
Subject: Re: [MBZ] OT tin roof
  Andrew sez:  Amish guys erected my new shed.
 
  The end of the world must be neat is Amish guys condescend to go into
  the DC area.
 
 
 
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Re: [MBZ] Finnjet, the only car with a chrome bill bigger than its gas bill, comes up for sal | Hemmings Daily

2015-06-14 Thread Rich Thomas via Mercedes

OK, Florida, so that explains a lot.

I wonder how that Mercedes diesel holds up 3 alternators and batteries 
and hauls that... thing... around?  I do like the bundts though.


Interesting it has been in the Houston art car parade.

--R



On 6/14/15 10:56 AM, G Mann via Mercedes wrote:

I would consider it.. but only because I have not angered the Homeowners
Association recently, and they are overdue...

;) ... Unusual car to say the least..
I wonder if there is a video anywhere that details the construction of this
work of art.. Would be engaging to watch it evolve.

On Sun, Jun 14, 2015 at 7:10 AM, Dwight Giles via Mercedes 
mercedes@okiebenz.com wrote:


http://blog.hemmings.com/index.php/2015/06/08/finnjet-the-only-car-with-a-chrome-bill-bigger-than-its-gas-bill-comes-up-for-sale/?refer=news
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Re: [MBZ] OT tin roof

2015-06-14 Thread Curt Raymond via Mercedes
Yoder is the family name of the Amish family that has a bakery near my camp in 
Maine...
-Curt

  From: Dimitri via Mercedes mercedes@okiebenz.com
 To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com 
Cc: Dimitri dsereta...@yahoo.com 
 Sent: Sunday, June 14, 2015 1:58 PM
 Subject: Re: [MBZ] OT tin roof
   
Andrew is his middle name. First name is Yoder

Sent from my iPhone

 On Jun 14, 2015, at 12:30 PM, Rich Thomas via Mercedes 
 mercedes@okiebenz.com wrote:
 
 Andrew is not a weird enough name, nor do you have 13 chirruns as far as I 
 know.  And you let the debbil into your home through the wires.
 
 --R
 
 On 6/14/15 12:09 PM, Andrew Strasfogel wrote:
 How do you know I'm not one of them??
 
 On Sun, Jun 14, 2015 at 11:46 AM, Rich Thomas via Mercedes 
 mercedes@okiebenz.com mailto:mercedes@okiebenz.com wrote:
 
    They have infiltrated everywhere -- a quite prolific group.    They'll 
send some scouts out to an area, buy a farm or two (cash)
    then the clan starts coming and buying up farms all around.
    Probably not far from DC now.
 
    --R
 
 
 
 
    On 6/13/15 11:15 PM, Curt Raymond via Mercedes wrote:
 
        I was thinking the same thing but PA isn't so far away and
        from what I know of the simple folk they'll do what they can
        to bring in money...
        -Curt
 
              From: Curly McLain via Mercedes mercedes@okiebenz.com
        mailto:mercedes@okiebenz.com
          To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com
        mailto:mercedes@okiebenz.com
        Cc: Curly McLain 126die...@gmail.com
        mailto:126die...@gmail.com
          Sent: Saturday, June 13, 2015 10:48 PM
          Subject: Re: [MBZ] OT tin roof
            Andrew sez:  Amish guys erected my new shed.
 
        The end of the world must be neat is Amish guys condescend to
        go into
        the DC area.
 
 
 
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Re: [MBZ] If You're Gonna Go, Go in Style

2015-06-14 Thread Curt Raymond via Mercedes
Other than Jeepneys i haven't seen many cars older than 3-4 years. Most 
everything I've seen is late model asian cars although I did see a w140 
yesterday.
-Curt
  From: Tom Savage via Mercedes mercedes@okiebenz.com
 To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com 
Cc: Tom Savage tesav...@gmail.com 
 Sent: Sunday, June 14, 2015 9:23 AM
 Subject: Re: [MBZ] If You're Gonna Go, Go in Style
   
That's nice but the jaloponist in me wants to go like this:
https://www.dropbox.com/sc/qqmy3b3cpl0k4p5/AABybINWvDY9J417aF71tMkka

I guess I should ask Curt if he's encountered any Filipino funeral
processions/parades yet...

Tom
On Jun 14, 2015 7:25 AM, Dan Penoff via Mercedes mercedes@okiebenz.com
wrote:

 Like this:


 https://www.classicdriver.com/en/car/mercedes-benz/w12/1963/311989?plugin=trueplugin_id=181529

 Dan
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Re: [MBZ] OT tin roof

2015-06-14 Thread G Mann via Mercedes
 Liberal Amish ... ???

I had no idea they had gone Progressive ..
Do tell

Snark off.. ;))

On Sun, Jun 14, 2015 at 9:09 AM, Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes 
mercedes@okiebenz.com wrote:

 How do you know I'm not one of them??

 On Sun, Jun 14, 2015 at 11:46 AM, Rich Thomas via Mercedes 
 mercedes@okiebenz.com wrote:

  They have infiltrated everywhere -- a quite prolific group.  They'll send
  some scouts out to an area, buy a farm or two (cash) then the clan starts
  coming and buying up farms all around.  Probably not far from DC now.
 
  --R
 
 
 
 
  On 6/13/15 11:15 PM, Curt Raymond via Mercedes wrote:
 
  I was thinking the same thing but PA isn't so far away and from what I
  know of the simple folk they'll do what they can to bring in money...
  -Curt
 
 From: Curly McLain via Mercedes mercedes@okiebenz.com
To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com
  Cc: Curly McLain 126die...@gmail.com
Sent: Saturday, June 13, 2015 10:48 PM
Subject: Re: [MBZ] OT tin roof
  Andrew sez:  Amish guys erected my new shed.
 
  The end of the world must be neat is Amish guys condescend to go into
  the DC area.
 
 
 
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Re: [MBZ] American policy

2015-06-14 Thread G Mann via Mercedes
The thing that made the Cold War work for both sides, what the element of
mutually assured distruction .. Simply put.. if either side started, both
sides had enough nukes and the means to deliver them that all life would
have been deleted from the face of the earth.

So.. bravado aside.. Gen LeMay knew he wasn't going to get that order.. and
his Russian counterpart knew it as well.. but both had to take the sabers
out and rattle them regularly to keep the military / Industrial Complex
fully employed.

Regan made a gutsy and brilliant move with his star wars plan, It drove
the Russians to bankruptsy trying to out guess [and steal] technology that
did not actually exist, but was close enough to almost there to make them
believe USA was capable of neutralizing any of their weapons delivery,
which tipped the balance that had been in place for decades..

However.. now we are headed down the same road to snatch defeat from the
jaws of victory, through gross financial mismanagement.

On Sun, Jun 14, 2015 at 10:32 AM, archer75--- via Mercedes 
mercedes@okiebenz.com wrote:

 When the U.S. was flying nuclear bombs to the borders of the USSR and then
 turning back at the last minute during the late '40s, General Curt LeMay
 said we should keep right on going to Russian targets and nuke the
 communists back to the stone age.
 I wonder what the world would be like nowadays if someone had given that
 command?
 Gerry

 Rich Thomas wrote:
  I say we take off an nuke the whole site from orbit.  It's the only way
 to be sure.

  On 6/13/15 7:28 PM, archer75--- via Mercedes wrote:
   America won the Cold War in large part because the Russians knew
 that American avionics would give NATO control of the air in any
 prospective war; that the Pershing missiles in Germany and Italy gave NATO
 an advantage in any prospective nuclear exchange; and that the Reagan
 Strategic Defense Initiative portended a new range of technologies that
 Russia couldn’t match. China looked on from a distance and aligned itself
 with the dominant technological superpower.
  
   If America wants to command China’s respect, it has to widen the
 technology gap, rather than watch it shrink. If China believed that its
 weapons systems were ineffective against American countermeasures, it would
 show far more caution. But the opposite is true: the technology gap is
 closing, and China knows it. America still has a technological lead and the
 resources to widen it–should it choose to do so. There is no obvious
 political constituency for such an effort though, and no prominent leader
 commited to doing so. A return to the Eisenhower-Kennedy-Reagan commitment
 to American technological superiority would also have enormously beneficial
 effects for America’s lagging productivity. But it is hard to persuade
 Americans that it is better to be tough than to sound tough.
  
   Asia Times
  
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Re: [MBZ] American policy

2015-06-14 Thread Rich Thomas via Mercedes
I say we take off an nuke the whole site from orbit.  It's the only way 
to be sure.


--R

On 6/13/15 7:28 PM, archer75--- via Mercedes wrote:

America won the Cold War in large part because the Russians knew that 
American avionics would give NATO control of the air in any prospective war; that 
the Pershing missiles in Germany and Italy gave NATO an advantage in any prospective 
nuclear exchange; and that the Reagan Strategic Defense Initiative portended a new 
range of technologies that Russia couldn’t match. China looked on from a distance 
and aligned itself with the dominant technological superpower.

If America wants to command China’s respect, it has to widen the technology 
gap, rather than watch it shrink. If China believed that its weapons systems 
were ineffective against American countermeasures, it would show far more 
caution. But the opposite is true: the technology gap is closing, and China 
knows it. America still has a technological lead and the resources to widen 
it–should it choose to do so. There is no obvious political constituency for 
such an effort though, and no prominent leader commited to doing so. A return 
to the Eisenhower-Kennedy-Reagan commitment to American technological 
superiority would also have enormously beneficial effects for America’s lagging 
productivity. But it is hard to persuade Americans that it is better to be 
tough than to sound tough.

Asia Times

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Re: [MBZ] OT tin roof

2015-06-14 Thread Rich Thomas via Mercedes
Andrew is not a weird enough name, nor do you have 13 chirruns as far 
as I know.  And you let the debbil into your home through the wires.


--R

On 6/14/15 12:09 PM, Andrew Strasfogel wrote:

How do you know I'm not one of them??

On Sun, Jun 14, 2015 at 11:46 AM, Rich Thomas via Mercedes 
mercedes@okiebenz.com mailto:mercedes@okiebenz.com wrote:


They have infiltrated everywhere -- a quite prolific group. 
They'll send some scouts out to an area, buy a farm or two (cash)

then the clan starts coming and buying up farms all around.
Probably not far from DC now.

--R




On 6/13/15 11:15 PM, Curt Raymond via Mercedes wrote:

I was thinking the same thing but PA isn't so far away and
from what I know of the simple folk they'll do what they can
to bring in money...
-Curt

   From: Curly McLain via Mercedes mercedes@okiebenz.com
mailto:mercedes@okiebenz.com
  To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com
mailto:mercedes@okiebenz.com
Cc: Curly McLain 126die...@gmail.com
mailto:126die...@gmail.com
  Sent: Saturday, June 13, 2015 10:48 PM
  Subject: Re: [MBZ] OT tin roof
Andrew sez:  Amish guys erected my new shed.

The end of the world must be neat is Amish guys condescend to
go into
the DC area.



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Re: [MBZ] OT - Concrete Question

2015-06-14 Thread Curt Raymond via Mercedes
Dan at least doesn't have to worry about it ever freezing...
-Curt

  From: Mitch Haley via Mercedes mercedes@okiebenz.com
 To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com 
Cc: Mitch Haley mi...@mitchellhaley.com 
 Sent: Sunday, June 14, 2015 5:06 PM
 Subject: Re: [MBZ] OT - Concrete Question
   

My thoughts are not to let anybody pour anything bigger than about 10x10 
without 
grooving it for stress relief. The Amish dude who poured my dad's 40x24' garage 
did it in one piece and refused to notch it. Also didn't order air entrainment 
or fiber reinforcement or use reinforcing mesh. Also didn't slope it right, so 
the low spot was slightly east of center, when the low spot should have been at 
the doors on the west wall. So, within a few months, he had cracked concrete, 
and every time we get a driving rain there are puddles in the garage.

You might be able to pour 10x22 without making the joints/grooves, especially 
if 
it's fiber reinforced or they embed steel road mesh in it.

I helped a friend do a driveway pour about 11x40, maybe 20 years ago. The slab 
is still in good shape, but it's an average thickness of about 6, has road 
mesh 
in the middle of it, and was poured on a compressed sand base. Still, I'm 
impressed that it never cracked, considering the week or three it spends under 
water every spring. We made one frame about an inch lower than the other, 
leveled it off with a 2x6, went out to lunch, and then broomed it with a coarse 
push broom. Tied ropes to the broom head and handle, you'd pull the rope on the 
handle to broom a rough surface onto the concrete, then the other guy would 
haul 
it back to his side in the air, and then broom another 18 swath from low side 
to high side, repeat until entire surface is roughened.

Absolutely, positively, under pain of death, do not pour concrete over grass.
Hopefully there are zero contractors who would do that. Most contractors in MI 
will order a truckload of sand, tamp it down, and pour on top of that.

Mitch.





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Re: [MBZ] American policy

2015-06-14 Thread Curly McLain via Mercedes
When the U.S. was flying nuclear bombs to the borders of the USSR 
and then turning back at the last minute during the late '40s, 
General Curt LeMay said we should keep right on going to Russian 
targets and nuke the communists back to the stone age.
I wonder what the world would be like nowadays if someone had given 
that command?

Gerry


He was not alone.  Patton believed the same, as did McArthur.

There is evidence Patton was assassinated by our goobermnt to prevent 
him from starting a war with the rooskies


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Re: [MBZ] S500 Mystery Solved

2015-06-14 Thread Mitch Haley via Mercedes
Is that one of the reasons why Poos normally recommends the 1996-1999 cars with 
coils on plugs?


Mitch.

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Re: [MBZ] OT tin roof

2015-06-14 Thread Mitch Haley via Mercedes

archer75--- via Mercedes wrote:

You're not unless your fathers or mothers last name is one of the following.

 Strasfogel isn't on the list.

Neither is Yutzy (big time Amish auctioneers near me) or Coblentz (contractors 
who built my dad's garage/workshop).


Mitch.

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Re: [MBZ] American policy

2015-06-14 Thread Scott Ritchey via Mercedes
As an early boomer, I heard this discussed often by the grownups  during
the early 50s.  I didn't understand it at the time but I do remember it.
The men (all either WWI or WWII vets) concurred with Patton, et al.

 
 When the U.S. was flying nuclear bombs to the borders of the USSR and
 then turning back at the last minute during the late '40s, General Curt
 LeMay said we should keep right on going to Russian targets and nuke
 the communists back to the stone age.
 I wonder what the world would be like nowadays if someone had given
 that command?
 Gerry
 


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Re: [MBZ] American policy

2015-06-14 Thread Scott Ritchey via Mercedes
O'Reilly's book lays out several elements of incredible coincidence for an 
accident.

 -Original Message-
 From: Mercedes [mailto:mercedes-boun...@okiebenz.com] On Behalf Of Jon
 Agne via Mercedes
 Sent: Sunday, June 14, 2015 3:36 PM
 To: Mercedes Discussion List
 Cc: Jon Agne
 Subject: Re: [MBZ] American policy
 
 Please elaborate…
 
 
  On Jun 14, 2015, at 2:59 PM, Curly McLain via Mercedes
 mercedes@okiebenz.com wrote:
 
 
  There is evidence Patton was assassinated by our goobermnt to prevent him
 from starting a war with the rooskies
 
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Re: [MBZ] S500 Mystery Solved

2015-06-14 Thread Dan Penoff via Mercedes
Absolutely. Stupid simple to work on, maintain or repair.

Dan


 On Jun 14, 2015, at 3:34 PM, Mitch Haley via Mercedes mercedes@okiebenz.com 
 wrote:
 
 Is that one of the reasons why Poos normally recommends the 1996-1999 cars 
 with coils on plugs?
 
 Mitch.
 
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Re: [MBZ] Wut I dun Lernt frum Wulding this week

2015-06-14 Thread Greg Fiorentino via Mercedes
Cleaning the slag from a previous weld should be pretty easy using a welding
hammer and a wire brush.  My experience welding was working as a
steamfitter/rigger for about a year on a powerhouse job along the Hudson
River (Roseton, NY)in the early 70s.  Also took a course at a tech school.
I do ok with a stick machine for thicker material, but resort to brazing (or
silver-solder) with a B tank and acetylene for the thinner stuff.  Less
burn-through because of lower temps, neater joints, and just as strong if
you use the correct rod.  Some alloys even wick nicely into tight joints.  I
got my gear and materials cheap or free from my brother, who was selling
high-tech welding supplies at the time.

Greg

-Original Message-
From: Mercedes [mailto:mercedes-boun...@okiebenz.com] On Behalf Of clay via
Mercedes
Sent: Sunday, June 14, 2015 1:20 PM
To: Mercedes Discussion List
Cc: clay
Subject: [MBZ] Wut I dun Lernt frum Wulding this week

It has been a week of dragging my butt outside in the heat and playing with
the flux core welding gun.  In that time I have gained some perspective on
just how much work making a decent weld is.

At first I was just banging about with the gun and burning through wire and
sheet metal.  It was really nasty, but I got a feel for the machine and the
gun.  Having the old brake rotor to play with allowed me to get comfortable
that I could lay down a good bead, but it seemed only on a heavy bit of
iron, not something thin, like what I need to know so I can repair the
rusted and rotted out floors in the 300D.  SO, zapping thick metal is eazy
peezy and most any monkey can do that.

I also found that flux core is not good to try to start and stop.  It took
me a bit to understand that the slag and cruft impedes a good weld, so you
need to clean the prior muck before you go at it again.  Getting it back to
bare metal would let the new bead adhere and flow instead of spattering out
pellet of micro death all over the world.  Flux is great for outdoor work,
which the car repair will be.  No need to worry the wind is blowing my
shielding gas away and the air flow also will make the toxic fumes move away
from the work.  That is a plus.

The HF welding toy is very basic and binary.  You have either BIG amp or
small amp button and a spastic wire feed control.  The little graphic under
the hood tells you if you need BIG or small and what wire speed for what
thickness of metal.  It lies and is very optimistic when dealing with thin
sheet metal.  At least if you expect to be laying down a continuous bead.  I
could not keep from blowing through the metal and having bad welds at the
0.5 wire speed (0-9 range) the graphic depicts.  I up the speed and it still
blows out, but at least the wire feeds.  The slow speed would not put out
wire dependably.  

The solution to that was to not try to make a bead, but to just put a bunch
or tacks all over the piece and then go back and put some more next to the
last ones.  Refer to cleaning the old slag above, and my attempts were more
successful.  That took a long time to figure out.  It also stopped the blow
outs, warpage and other troubles that build up of excess heat was causing.
Go slowly with lots of stitches from quick little spots of heat.  What I
also garnered from this learning curve was that the really hefty copper
welding heat sink could suck calories out of the work.  I do not have enough
hands to hold that and the gun, but it was eye opening.

I am fairly certain all this information was provided by Grant a week ago,
but seeing it with ones own eyes drives it home.  Much of my practice metal
has been dead computer cases.  It had a plethora of coatings, and even some
of the metal I picked up at the scrap store had a film.  For a very good end
product, you need a VERY clean work surface.  Initially, the wire wheel and
grinder elbow grease I applied was not enough to really give me a clean,
bare surface.  I thought it looked bare, but it was not.  SHINY metal is a
clean, bare surface.  No shine, not clean, no good welds will come.  All the
youtube videos and written explanations did not get that to sink in.  Seeing
it in action was the key.

The current steep learning curve involves welding sheet metal to a thicker L
bit.  The heavy L is rather solid and flat.  The body panels I need to tack
it and weld to are not so flat.  Gaps and uneven contact are not making for
a good weld.  I am still on the learning bench, not in actual car process.
The sheet metal is 18 gauge, the L is 1/8 to 3/16.  


clay 

2002 s430 - Victor, a Stately  well tailored chap
1974 450sl -  Frosch - Two tone green
1976 300D - Blei Vanst - it looks silvery
1972 220D - Gump - She was green, simple and ran
1995 E300D - Gave her life to save me against a Dame in a SUV POS 1987 SDL -
Beware Nigerian Scammers








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Re: [MBZ] Wut I dun Lernt frum Wulding this week

2015-06-14 Thread Dan Penoff via Mercedes
When I was rebuilding Miller “buzz boxes” during tech school we used 1/2 steel 
plate scraps to test them out.  That stuff is fun to weld with a stick welder 
that puts out 400 amps.

Our fabrication guy used to win bar bets welding two pieces of aluminum foil 
together with a Miller wire feed welder.  The crazy bastard could do it, too.

Dan


 On Jun 14, 2015, at 4:41 PM, Greg Fiorentino via Mercedes 
 mercedes@okiebenz.com wrote:
 
 Cleaning the slag from a previous weld should be pretty easy using a welding
 hammer and a wire brush.  My experience welding was working as a
 steamfitter/rigger for about a year on a powerhouse job along the Hudson
 River (Roseton, NY)in the early 70s.  Also took a course at a tech school.
 I do ok with a stick machine for thicker material, but resort to brazing (or
 silver-solder) with a B tank and acetylene for the thinner stuff.  Less
 burn-through because of lower temps, neater joints, and just as strong if
 you use the correct rod.  Some alloys even wick nicely into tight joints.  I
 got my gear and materials cheap or free from my brother, who was selling
 high-tech welding supplies at the time.
 
 Greg
 


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Re: [MBZ] 71 years and a day (and a week)

2015-06-14 Thread Scott Ritchey via Mercedes

Wilton,  Thanks for that first-hand account of D-day from ground level.

All: Maybe folks have already seen this (and I should have posted it a week
ago) but here is (IMO) a very interesting slide-show of D-day (and beyond)
events:   http://pt709.synology.me/NormandyLanding1.pps.  Left click on the
link should download the 6M pps file to your machine where you can play it.
I think there is value in seeing the scope of this effort; I certainly don't
have the words that would do it justice.

Scott





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Re: [MBZ] OT - Concrete Question

2015-06-14 Thread M. Mitchell Marmel via Mercedes
Make sure he has the rebar off the ground before pouring, and check that he
has the cement to sand ratio correct...

-MMM-


On Sun, Jun 14, 2015 at 3:35 PM, Dan Penoff via Mercedes 
mercedes@okiebenz.com wrote:

 I”ve got a well known and respected concrete contractor coming to the
 house on Tuesday afternoon to give me an estimate on adding an additional
 pad or extension to the side of my existing concrete driveway.

 While it should be fairly simple, and I know there’s not a lot of majik to
 pouring concrete, I thought I would ask here if anyone has experience with
 such things, and if so, anything I should ask or be wary of?

 It’s a rectangular area of about 10’ x 22’ with a sidewalk near one end.
 It essentially adds a parking space to the left side of the existing
 driveway on a flat area that is currently covered with grass.

 Thanks,

 Dan
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Re: [MBZ] Wut I dun Lernt frum Wulding this week

2015-06-14 Thread Jim Cathey via Mercedes

Wire feed welders are nicknamed glue guns.  Clearly, HF
does not make one such.  Using the Miller on clean, reasonably
thick sheet metal, and I understand the nickname.

-- Jim


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Re: [MBZ] OT - Concrete Question

2015-06-14 Thread Dan Penoff via Mercedes
I fully expect them to remove the grass, level the area, place a compacted 
gravel base and pour in two sections using rebar or reinforcing wire of some 
sort.  It’s got a slight, maybe 5-10 degree slope towards the property line, so 
they’ll need to take that into consideration when they order the mix, too.

I had a buddy at work get a Craigslist slab a couple of weeks ago in his back 
yard to park his boat on.  His kids sent him a picture of the guy pouring the 
slab, and it was directly over the grass.  Needless to say he was freaking out, 
but - too late!

You get what you pay for….

Dan

 On Jun 14, 2015, at 5:06 PM, Mitch Haley via Mercedes mercedes@okiebenz.com 
 wrote:
 
 
 My thoughts are not to let anybody pour anything bigger than about 10x10 
 without grooving it for stress relief. The Amish dude who poured my dad's 
 40x24' garage did it in one piece and refused to notch it. Also didn't order 
 air entrainment or fiber reinforcement or use reinforcing mesh. Also didn't 
 slope it right, so the low spot was slightly east of center, when the low 
 spot should have been at the doors on the west wall. So, within a few months, 
 he had cracked concrete, and every time we get a driving rain there are 
 puddles in the garage.
 
 You might be able to pour 10x22 without making the joints/grooves, especially 
 if it's fiber reinforced or they embed steel road mesh in it.
 
 I helped a friend do a driveway pour about 11x40, maybe 20 years ago. The 
 slab is still in good shape, but it's an average thickness of about 6, has 
 road mesh in the middle of it, and was poured on a compressed sand base. 
 Still, I'm impressed that it never cracked, considering the week or three it 
 spends under water every spring. We made one frame about an inch lower than 
 the other, leveled it off with a 2x6, went out to lunch, and then broomed it 
 with a coarse push broom. Tied ropes to the broom head and handle, you'd pull 
 the rope on the handle to broom a rough surface onto the concrete, then the 
 other guy would haul it back to his side in the air, and then broom another 
 18 swath from low side to high side, repeat until entire surface is 
 roughened.
 
 Absolutely, positively, under pain of death, do not pour concrete over grass.
 Hopefully there are zero contractors who would do that. Most contractors in 
 MI will order a truckload of sand, tamp it down, and pour on top of that.
 
 Mitch.
 
 
 
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Re: [MBZ] American policy

2015-06-14 Thread Peter Frederick via Mercedes
I have always understood that what ended the Cold War had nothing at  
all to do with Reagan, but instead Chernobyl convinced Gorbachov that  
nuclear war was an invitation to the end of civilization -- no one  
would survive with a functioning economy or decent standard of living,  
even non-combatants.


And then the Russians stopped playing Cold War.   Game's over when  
one side quits playing.


It wasn't like the Soviet economy collapsed since it didn't function  
anyway, it was that it wasn't ever going to recover from WWII as long  
as Russia played Cold War.


Cracking their teeth on Afganistan didn't help much either -- sound  
familiar?


Peter

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Re: [MBZ] OT - Concrete Question

2015-06-14 Thread Dan Penoff via Mercedes
True.



 On Jun 14, 2015, at 5:59 PM, Curt Raymond via Mercedes 
 mercedes@okiebenz.com wrote:
 
 Dan at least doesn't have to worry about it ever freezing...
 -Curt


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Re: [MBZ] hey WILTON

2015-06-14 Thread Dan Penoff via Mercedes
Beats me, that’s why it’s best to check.  I recall it being around the end of 
June, first week of July, but the dates could change on a yearly basis.

What’s cool is that A-E uses this time to have a national sales meeting for all 
of their sales people, so the guy that’s waiting on you in the tent is often 
one of their regional sales people.  They’ll look over a shoe that’s tagged as 
a “second” and point out how one little stitch is a half a millimeter shorter 
than all the others.

You look at it and can’t tell the difference.

Dan


 On Jun 14, 2015, at 3:37 PM, Mitch Haley via Mercedes mercedes@okiebenz.com 
 wrote:
 
 I thought it was going to start this Thursday.
 I was planning on calling in a phone order to the Port Huron Shoebank.
 
 Mitch.
 
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Re: [MBZ] If You're Gonna Go, Go in Style

2015-06-14 Thread Rich Thomas via Mercedes
There was a pic the other day of the children coming home from the plane 
crash in France, a while line of white (E-class?) hearses, the adults 
later rode in black ones.  It was sad but made me wonder what happens to 
all those hearses after a time.  They would make great wagons.


--R



On 6/14/15 8:50 AM, Dan Penoff via Mercedes wrote:

I love the big chrome cross on top.  Epic.

Dan


On Jun 14, 2015, at 8:46 AM, G Mann via Mercedes mercedes@okiebenz.com wrote:

Well.. I have to say.. that is a real Collectors item...


On Sun, Jun 14, 2015 at 5:24 AM, Dan Penoff via Mercedes 
mercedes@okiebenz.com wrote:


Like this:


https://www.classicdriver.com/en/car/mercedes-benz/w12/1963/311989?plugin=trueplugin_id=181529

Dan
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Re: [MBZ] OT tin roof

2015-06-14 Thread Curt Raymond via Mercedes
I think theres some missing, you don't have Erb on there for one.
-Curt

  From: archer75--- via Mercedes mercedes@okiebenz.com
 To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com 
Cc: arche...@embarqmail.com arche...@embarqmail.com 
 Sent: Sunday, June 14, 2015 2:36 PM
 Subject: Re: [MBZ] OT tin roof
   
You're not unless your fathers or mothers last name is one of the following. 
Strasfogel isn't on the list.

Miller, 
Stoltzfus,
Hershberger
Yoder
Hochstetler
Troyer
Schrock
Bontrager
Burkholder
Lehman
Lambright
King
Fisher
Lapp
Zook
Beiler
Hostetler
Hochstedler
Borkholder
Stoltzfoos
Byler
Harshberger.
Schwartz
Hilty
Lengacher
Graber
Wittmer
Nolt
Zimmerman.

I looked them up out of curiosity to see if Strasfogel was included.
Wife was part Mennonite from Lancaster County, Pa. The Amish are a Mennonite 
breakaway sect. Amish usually have a last name from this short list of last 
names.

Andrew Strasfogel wrote:
 How do you know I'm not one of them??
 
 On Sun, Jun 14, 2015 at 11:46 AM, Rich Thomas via Mercedes 
 mercedes@okiebenz.com wrote:
 
  They have infiltrated everywhere -- a quite prolific group.  They'll send
  some scouts out to an area, buy a farm or two (cash) then the clan starts
  coming and buying up farms all around.  Probably not far from DC now.
 
  --R
 
 
 
 
  On 6/13/15 11:15 PM, Curt Raymond via Mercedes wrote:
 
  I was thinking the same thing but PA isn't so far away and from what I
  know of the simple folk they'll do what they can to bring in money...
  -Curt
 
         From: Curly McLain via Mercedes mercedes@okiebenz.com
   To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com
  Cc: Curly McLain 126die...@gmail.com
   Sent: Saturday, June 13, 2015 10:48 PM
   Subject: Re: [MBZ] OT tin roof
     Andrew sez:  Amish guys erected my new shed.
 
  The end of the world must be neat is Amish guys condescend to go into
  the DC area.
 
 
 
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 -
 No virus found in this message.
 Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
 Version: 2015.0.6030 / Virus Database: 4360/10010 - Release Date: 06/13/15
 


-- 
arche...@embarqmail.com arche...@embarqmail.com



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Re: [MBZ] American policy

2015-06-14 Thread Jon Agne via Mercedes
Please elaborate…


 On Jun 14, 2015, at 2:59 PM, Curly McLain via Mercedes 
 mercedes@okiebenz.com wrote:
 
 
 There is evidence Patton was assassinated by our goobermnt to prevent him 
 from starting a war with the rooskies

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Re: [MBZ] hey WILTON

2015-06-14 Thread Mitch Haley via Mercedes

Dan Penoff via Mercedes wrote:

The tent sale is the week of July 4th, or the first week in July, if I recall 
correctly.  They probably have something about it on their web site.


I thought it was going to start this Thursday.
I was planning on calling in a phone order to the Port Huron Shoebank.

Mitch.

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Re: [MBZ] OT - Concrete Question

2015-06-14 Thread Mitch Haley via Mercedes


My thoughts are not to let anybody pour anything bigger than about 10x10 without 
grooving it for stress relief. The Amish dude who poured my dad's 40x24' garage 
did it in one piece and refused to notch it. Also didn't order air entrainment 
or fiber reinforcement or use reinforcing mesh. Also didn't slope it right, so 
the low spot was slightly east of center, when the low spot should have been at 
the doors on the west wall. So, within a few months, he had cracked concrete, 
and every time we get a driving rain there are puddles in the garage.


You might be able to pour 10x22 without making the joints/grooves, especially if 
it's fiber reinforced or they embed steel road mesh in it.


I helped a friend do a driveway pour about 11x40, maybe 20 years ago. The slab 
is still in good shape, but it's an average thickness of about 6, has road mesh 
in the middle of it, and was poured on a compressed sand base. Still, I'm 
impressed that it never cracked, considering the week or three it spends under 
water every spring. We made one frame about an inch lower than the other, 
leveled it off with a 2x6, went out to lunch, and then broomed it with a coarse 
push broom. Tied ropes to the broom head and handle, you'd pull the rope on the 
handle to broom a rough surface onto the concrete, then the other guy would haul 
it back to his side in the air, and then broom another 18 swath from low side 
to high side, repeat until entire surface is roughened.


Absolutely, positively, under pain of death, do not pour concrete over grass.
Hopefully there are zero contractors who would do that. Most contractors in MI 
will order a truckload of sand, tamp it down, and pour on top of that.


Mitch.



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Re: [MBZ] Wut I dun Lernt frum Wulding this week

2015-06-14 Thread Curt Raymond via Mercedes
Wasn't it Will Rodgers that said some people have to pee on the electric fence 
for themselves? Sounds like Clay has started peeing.
When he runs out of the rotten HF wire that EVERYBODY says sucks and gets some 
better stuff maybe he'll believe the rest of the world on that too.
-Curt
  From: Jim Cathey via Mercedes mercedes@okiebenz.com
 To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com 
Cc: Jim Cathey jim.cathey...@gmail.com 
 Sent: Sunday, June 14, 2015 5:05 PM
 Subject: Re: [MBZ] Wut I dun Lernt frum Wulding this week
   
Wire feed welders are nicknamed glue guns.  Clearly, HF
does not make one such.  Using the Miller on clean, reasonably
thick sheet metal, and I understand the nickname.

-- Jim




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[MBZ] Get Your Own MB Truck

2015-06-14 Thread Dan Penoff via Mercedes
http://lego.gizmodo.com/official-pics-of-legos-new-mercedes-benz-construction-t-1710328292
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Re: [MBZ] Get Your Own MB Truck

2015-06-14 Thread Darren Marshall via Mercedes
If something's worth doin, it's worth doin right

Technic Lego g wagon
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=l0Y01Bq4Wus

Darren Marshall, Co-Founder

doejo.com
doejo.com/space
bowtruss.com
aquanautbrew.com

 On Jun 14, 2015, at 5:33 PM, Dan Penoff via Mercedes mercedes@okiebenz.com 
 wrote:
 
 http://lego.gizmodo.com/official-pics-of-legos-new-mercedes-benz-construction-t-1710328292
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Re: [MBZ] American policy

2015-06-14 Thread WILTON via Mercedes
A lot later than the 40's; I flew 'em on airborne alert in '64 - '66; last 
ones were on airborne alert in '68; 'stopped after B-52 crash and loss of 
nukes at Thule, Greenland, in '68..


Wilton

- Original Message - 
From: archer75--- via Mercedes mercedes@okiebenz.com

To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com
Cc: arche...@embarqmail.com
Sent: Sunday, June 14, 2015 1:32 PM
Subject: Re: [MBZ] American policy


When the U.S. was flying nuclear bombs to the borders of the USSR and then 
turning back at the last minute during the late '40s, General Curt LeMay 
said we should keep right on going to Russian targets and nuke the 
communists back to the stone age.
I wonder what the world would be like nowadays if someone had given that 
command?

Gerry

Rich Thomas wrote:
I say we take off an nuke the whole site from orbit.  It's the only way 
to be sure.



On 6/13/15 7:28 PM, archer75--- via Mercedes wrote:
 America won the Cold War in large part because the Russians knew 
 that American avionics would give NATO control of the air in any 
 prospective war; that the Pershing missiles in Germany and Italy gave 
 NATO an advantage in any prospective nuclear exchange; and that the 
 Reagan Strategic Defense Initiative portended a new range of 
 technologies that Russia couldn’t match. China looked on from a 
 distance and aligned itself with the dominant technological superpower.


 If America wants to command China’s respect, it has to widen the 
 technology gap, rather than watch it shrink. If China believed that its 
 weapons systems were ineffective against American countermeasures, it 
 would show far more caution. But the opposite is true: the technology 
 gap is closing, and China knows it. America still has a technological 
 lead and the resources to widen it–should it choose to do so. There is 
 no obvious political constituency for such an effort though, and no 
 prominent leader commited to doing so. A return to the 
 Eisenhower-Kennedy-Reagan commitment to American technological 
 superiority would also have enormously beneficial effects for America’s 
 lagging productivity. But it is hard to persuade Americans that it is 
 better to be tough than to sound tough.


 Asia Times

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Re: [MBZ] American policy

2015-06-14 Thread LarryT via Mercedes
if we were to start putting $$s into defense again (and the liberals 
would squeal) and keep ISIS etc., busy fighting each other if we just 
stirred them up against each other, we could improve our economy all 
around.  But instead we try to be nice so the bad guys will like us. LOL 
- that'll never happen cause they want us dead! They're not going to 
play nice with us.  Not sure I'd advocate using nukes because the 
prevailing winds tend to move the clouds all over the place.


I wonder if the end of The longest Day' verbiage was accurate when they 
had Patton saying we should go ahead and kick the Russians butt since 
we'd have to do so eventually  we- might as well do it when we had the 
resources in the area...


So many could have, should have, would haves, but we'll never know.

LarryT
91 300D

On 6/14/2015 2:43 PM, G Mann via Mercedes wrote:

The thing that made the Cold War work for both sides, what the element of
mutually assured distruction .. Simply put.. if either side started, both
sides had enough nukes and the means to deliver them that all life would
have been deleted from the face of the earth.

So.. bravado aside.. Gen LeMay knew he wasn't going to get that order.. and
his Russian counterpart knew it as well.. but both had to take the sabers
out and rattle them regularly to keep the military / Industrial Complex
fully employed.

Regan made a gutsy and brilliant move with his star wars plan, It drove
the Russians to bankruptsy trying to out guess [and steal] technology that
did not actually exist, but was close enough to almost there to make them
believe USA was capable of neutralizing any of their weapons delivery,
which tipped the balance that had been in place for decades..

However.. now we are headed down the same road to snatch defeat from the
jaws of victory, through gross financial mismanagement.

On Sun, Jun 14, 2015 at 10:32 AM, archer75--- via Mercedes 
mercedes@okiebenz.com wrote:


When the U.S. was flying nuclear bombs to the borders of the USSR and then
turning back at the last minute during the late '40s, General Curt LeMay
said we should keep right on going to Russian targets and nuke the
communists back to the stone age.
I wonder what the world would be like nowadays if someone had given that
command?
Gerry

Rich Thomas wrote:

I say we take off an nuke the whole site from orbit.  It's the only way

to be sure.


On 6/13/15 7:28 PM, archer75--- via Mercedes wrote:

America won the Cold War in large part because the Russians knew

that American avionics would give NATO control of the air in any
prospective war; that the Pershing missiles in Germany and Italy gave NATO
an advantage in any prospective nuclear exchange; and that the Reagan
Strategic Defense Initiative portended a new range of technologies that
Russia couldn’t match. China looked on from a distance and aligned itself
with the dominant technological superpower.

If America wants to command China’s respect, it has to widen the

technology gap, rather than watch it shrink. If China believed that its
weapons systems were ineffective against American countermeasures, it would
show far more caution. But the opposite is true: the technology gap is
closing, and China knows it. America still has a technological lead and the
resources to widen it–should it choose to do so. There is no obvious
political constituency for such an effort though, and no prominent leader
commited to doing so. A return to the Eisenhower-Kennedy-Reagan commitment
to American technological superiority would also have enormously beneficial
effects for America’s lagging productivity. But it is hard to persuade
Americans that it is better to be tough than to sound tough.

Asia Times

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Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
Version: 2015.0.6030 / Virus Database: 4360/10010 - Release Date:

06/13/15


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Re: [MBZ] OT Anti-gun crowd kills another woman in NJ

2015-06-14 Thread LarryT via Mercedes
It always makes me LOL when the anti-gunners say they don't want 
everyone to be able to get guns so all the people around her/him might 
have one.  Then someone asks them What makes you think they don't have 
one already? It seems the snti-gun crowd believe a law will stop a 
criminal.  Even with over 22,000 gun laws on the books, the criminals 
still get guns when they want one!  They're called criminals for a 
reason.  The only thing that stops a bad guy with a gun is a good guy 
with a gun.   All those restrictive orders just seem to make the ex's angry!


LarryT

On 6/10/2015 2:15 PM, Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes wrote:

How did violent Ex obtain a gun legally?

On Wed, Jun 10, 2015 at 2:12 PM, Meade Dillon via Mercedes 
mercedes@okiebenz.com wrote:


She was trying to follow the law, waiting for approval for her permit to
own a gun (about 65 days it looks like) when her violent ex killed her.

Ladies please don't let something so stupid happen to you.  Restraining
orders don't work, police can't protect you, you've got to take action and
be prepared.


http://www.foxnews.com/us/2015/06/10/no-one-helped-her-nj-woman-murdered-by-ex-while-waiting-for-gun-permit/

-
Max
Charleston SC
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Re: [MBZ] OT Anti-gun crowd kills another woman in NJ

2015-06-14 Thread Kaleb C. Striplin via Mercedes
People in general are stupid, especially liberals 

Sent from my iPhone

 On Jun 14, 2015, at 7:33 PM, LarryT via Mercedes mercedes@okiebenz.com 
 wrote:
 
 It always makes me LOL when the anti-gunners say they don't want everyone to 
 be able to get guns so all the people around her/him might have one.  Then 
 someone asks them What makes you think they don't have one already? It 
 seems the snti-gun crowd believe a law will stop a criminal.  Even with over 
 22,000 gun laws on the books, the criminals still get guns when they want 
 one!  They're called criminals for a reason.  The only thing that stops a bad 
 guy with a gun is a good guy with a gun.   All those restrictive orders just 
 seem to make the ex's angry!
 
 LarryT
 
 On 6/10/2015 2:15 PM, Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes wrote:
 How did violent Ex obtain a gun legally?
 
 On Wed, Jun 10, 2015 at 2:12 PM, Meade Dillon via Mercedes 
 mercedes@okiebenz.com wrote:
 
 She was trying to follow the law, waiting for approval for her permit to
 own a gun (about 65 days it looks like) when her violent ex killed her.
 
 Ladies please don't let something so stupid happen to you.  Restraining
 orders don't work, police can't protect you, you've got to take action and
 be prepared.
 
 
 http://www.foxnews.com/us/2015/06/10/no-one-helped-her-nj-woman-murdered-by-ex-while-waiting-for-gun-permit/
 
 -
 Max
 Charleston SC
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Re: [MBZ] American policy

2015-06-14 Thread archer75--- via Mercedes
These flights happened before the Russians had a significant means of 
retaliation IIRC; which would have left the U.S. the worlds only nuclear power 
considering that China would have been given the choice of eliminating their 
nuclear weapons or suffering the same fate as the USSR. MAD came later IIRC.
In retrospect, the U.S. would have, in fact, become the worlds policeman and 
probably avoided the situation we have now.
Our legislators didn't understand the principles of international power 
politics back then, and apparently still don't; especially Representative Hank 
Johnson of Georgia:

http://www.snopes.com/politics/quotes/guamtip.asp

Gerry

G Mann wrote:

 The thing that made the Cold War work for both sides, what the element of
 mutually assured distruction .. Simply put.. if either side started, both
 sides had enough nukes and the means to deliver them that all life would
 have been deleted from the face of the earth.
 
 So.. bravado aside.. Gen LeMay knew he wasn't going to get that order.. and
 his Russian counterpart knew it as well.. but both had to take the sabers
 out and rattle them regularly to keep the military / Industrial Complex
 fully employed.
 
 Regan made a gutsy and brilliant move with his star wars plan, It drove
 the Russians to bankruptsy trying to out guess [and steal] technology that
 did not actually exist, but was close enough to almost there to make them
 believe USA was capable of neutralizing any of their weapons delivery,
 which tipped the balance that had been in place for decades..
 
 However.. now we are headed down the same road to snatch defeat from the
 jaws of victory, through gross financial mismanagement.
 
 On Sun, Jun 14, 2015 at 10:32 AM, archer75--- via Mercedes 
 mercedes@okiebenz.com wrote:
 
  When the U.S. was flying nuclear bombs to the borders of the USSR and then
  turning back at the last minute during the late '40s, General Curt LeMay
  said we should keep right on going to Russian targets and nuke the
  communists back to the stone age.
  I wonder what the world would be like nowadays if someone had given that
  command?
  Gerry
 
  Rich Thomas wrote:
   I say we take off an nuke the whole site from orbit.  It's the only way
  to be sure.
 
   On 6/13/15 7:28 PM, archer75--- via Mercedes wrote:
America won the Cold War in large part because the Russians knew
  that American avionics would give NATO control of the air in any
  prospective war; that the Pershing missiles in Germany and Italy gave NATO
  an advantage in any prospective nuclear exchange; and that the Reagan
  Strategic Defense Initiative portended a new range of technologies that
  Russia couldn’t match. China looked on from a distance and aligned itself
  with the dominant technological superpower.
   
If America wants to command China’s respect, it has to widen the
  technology gap, rather than watch it shrink. If China believed that its
  weapons systems were ineffective against American countermeasures, it would
  show far more caution. But the opposite is true: the technology gap is
  closing, and China knows it. America still has a technological lead and the
  resources to widen it–should it choose to do so. There is no obvious
  political constituency for such an effort though, and no prominent leader
  commited to doing so. A return to the Eisenhower-Kennedy-Reagan commitment
  to American technological superiority would also have enormously beneficial
  effects for America’s lagging productivity. But it is hard to persuade
  Americans that it is better to be tough than to sound tough.
   
Asia Times
   
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   Version: 2015.0.6030 / Virus Database: 4360/10010 - Release Date:
  06/13/15
 
 
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Re: [MBZ] Wut I dun Lernt frum Wulding this week

2015-06-14 Thread clay via Mercedes
I actually read the destructions that came with the zapper.  I followed the set 
up to the letter and even made sure the wheels were in the proper orientation 
for the wire I was using.  There are no teeth to the wheels that would provide 
decent bite.  Just some knurling like you would find on a dime in the grooves.  
I have the tension adjusted almost to the point of strangling the wire.  It 
does not speed up or make the wire feed properly.

I am thinking the low speed setting is actually in Dummy mode.  Since there is 
no adjustment for heat, just speed, it could be a failsafe.   The lowest speeds 
must be regulated in such a manner that using it on thin sheet metal would not 
allow it to function long enough to burn through.  Maybe it is set to feed 
tacks so you do not overheat and warp.  Sort of forcing you to start and stop 
against your will.



clay 

2002 s430 - Victor, a Stately  well tailored chap
1974 450sl -  Frosch - Two tone green
1976 300D - Blei Vanst - it looks silvery
1972 220D - Gump - She was green, simple and ran
1995 E300D - Gave her life to save me against a Dame in a SUV
POS 1987 SDL - Beware Nigerian Scammers








On Jun 14, 2015, at 5:03 PM, G Mann via Mercedes wrote:

 Just had a flash on something our new welder said in an earlier post about
 the wire not feeding consistantly..
 
 I've never been into the bowels of a Harbor Fright unit.. but there should
 be a tension adjustment on the wire feed motor. [everyone I've used to
 date did have one.] If that tension is loose, the wire will not feed
 exactly according to the magic number on the dial...
 
 Check that, why don't you.. And.. get a small roll of flux wire, not made
 in china.
 
 On Sun, Jun 14, 2015 at 3:00 PM, Curt Raymond via Mercedes 
 mercedes@okiebenz.com wrote:
 
 Wasn't it Will Rodgers that said some people have to pee on the electric
 fence for themselves? Sounds like Clay has started peeing.
 When he runs out of the rotten HF wire that EVERYBODY says sucks and gets
 some better stuff maybe he'll believe the rest of the world on that too.
 -Curt
  From: Jim Cathey via Mercedes mercedes@okiebenz.com
 To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com
 Cc: Jim Cathey jim.cathey...@gmail.com
 Sent: Sunday, June 14, 2015 5:05 PM
 Subject: Re: [MBZ] Wut I dun Lernt frum Wulding this week
 
 Wire feed welders are nicknamed glue guns.  Clearly, HF
 does not make one such.  Using the Miller on clean, reasonably
 thick sheet metal, and I understand the nickname.
 
 -- Jim
 
 
 
 
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Re: [MBZ] Amish, was: OT tin roof

2015-06-14 Thread Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes
Wow, that's quite a few metaphors mixed up in there, Curly. Yet - I feel
strangely empowered...

On Sun, Jun 14, 2015 at 12:23 PM, Curly McLain via Mercedes 
mercedes@okiebenz.com wrote:

 No Amish would be caught dead working for the goobermnt, robbing people at
 gunpoint to do things the wealthy donors want.


  How do you know I'm not one of them??

 On Sun, Jun 14, 2015 at 11:46 AM, Rich Thomas via Mercedes 
 mercedes@okiebenz.com wrote:

   They have infiltrated everywhere -- a quite prolific group.  They'll
 send
  some scouts out to an area, buy a farm or two (cash) then the clan
 starts
  coming and buying up farms all around.  Probably not far from DC now.

--R
  


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Re: [MBZ] OT - Sunil?

2015-06-14 Thread Mountain Man via Mercedes
Bob R wrote:
 There are some days, however, when I really wish I could see a picture of
 what Mao ate for breakfast.

NOT Gene  Judes.
A egg, some Fage strained greek yogurt full fat, toast, grapefruit.
...yah, that didn't answer the question, except for reality...
mao

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Re: [MBZ] OT - Sunil?

2015-06-14 Thread Mountain Man via Mercedes
Rick wrote:
 No computer? No internet service?

No mobile phone, which is what most fookbace users have, i think?
mao

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Re: [MBZ] OT tin roof

2015-06-14 Thread archer75--- via Mercedes

 archer75--- via Mercedes wrote:
  You're not unless your fathers or mothers last name is one of the following.
   Strasfogel isn't on the list.
 
 Neither is Yutzy (big time Amish auctioneers near me) or Coblentz 
 (contractors 
 who built my dad's garage/workshop).
 Mitch.
 ___
When you try to pin down names to particular subcultures it's nearly 
impossible. Few people who didn't know would ever think Miller was Amish. 
Certainly Strasfogels ancestors could be Amish but the chances of Strasfogel 
himself being Amish are low based on what we know about him. I think 
Strasfogels statement was t.i.c., and mine was certainly t.i.c.
Gerry

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Re: [MBZ] Wut I dun Lernt frum Wulding this week

2015-06-14 Thread G Mann via Mercedes
Just had a flash on something our new welder said in an earlier post about
the wire not feeding consistantly..

I've never been into the bowels of a Harbor Fright unit.. but there should
be a tension adjustment on the wire feed motor. [everyone I've used to
date did have one.] If that tension is loose, the wire will not feed
exactly according to the magic number on the dial...

Check that, why don't you.. And.. get a small roll of flux wire, not made
in china.

On Sun, Jun 14, 2015 at 3:00 PM, Curt Raymond via Mercedes 
mercedes@okiebenz.com wrote:

 Wasn't it Will Rodgers that said some people have to pee on the electric
 fence for themselves? Sounds like Clay has started peeing.
 When he runs out of the rotten HF wire that EVERYBODY says sucks and gets
 some better stuff maybe he'll believe the rest of the world on that too.
 -Curt
   From: Jim Cathey via Mercedes mercedes@okiebenz.com
  To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com
 Cc: Jim Cathey jim.cathey...@gmail.com
  Sent: Sunday, June 14, 2015 5:05 PM
  Subject: Re: [MBZ] Wut I dun Lernt frum Wulding this week

 Wire feed welders are nicknamed glue guns.  Clearly, HF
 does not make one such.  Using the Miller on clean, reasonably
 thick sheet metal, and I understand the nickname.

 -- Jim




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Re: [MBZ] Wut I dun Lernt frum Wulding this week

2015-06-14 Thread OK Don via Mercedes
We had a contractor build a 14x28' steel patio cover last year. For some
reason they needed a new welder, and the contractor brought a new HF unit.
The welder spend about an hour trying to get it to work correctly, then
called the contractor and read him the riot act. A new Lincoln unit from
Lowes arrived, and the welder was a happy man. The job looks good as well.
You get what you pay for.
Yes, Curt - read my tag line . . .

On Sun, Jun 14, 2015 at 7:03 PM, G Mann via Mercedes mercedes@okiebenz.com
wrote:

 Just had a flash on something our new welder said in an earlier post about
 the wire not feeding consistantly..

 I've never been into the bowels of a Harbor Fright unit.. but there should
 be a tension adjustment on the wire feed motor. [everyone I've used to
 date did have one.] If that tension is loose, the wire will not feed
 exactly according to the magic number on the dial...

 Check that, why don't you.. And.. get a small roll of flux wire, not made
 in china.




-- 
OK Don

NSA: The only branch of government that actually listens to US citizens!

*“Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry and narrow-mindedness, and many of
our people need it sorely on these accounts.”* – Mark Twain

There are three kinds of men: The ones that learns by reading. The few who
learn by observation. The rest of them have to pee on the electric fence
for themselves.

WILL ROGERS, *The Manly Wisdom of Will Rogers*
2013 F150, 18 mpg
2012 Passat TDI DSG, 44 mpg
1957 C182A, 12 mpg - but at 150 mph!
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Re: [MBZ] OT tin roof

2015-06-14 Thread archer75--- via Mercedes

There probably are. Erb is a Mennonite name:

Erb, a Mennonite family name, was first represented in North America by 
Nicholas Erb (1679-1740), who came to Lancaster County, Pennsylvania from the 
Emmental, Switzerland via the Palatinate, Germany before 1722.

http://gameo.org/index.php?title=Erb_family

Gerry

Curt Raymond wrote:
 I think theres some missing, you don't have Erb on there for one.
 -Curt
 
   From: archer75--- via Mercedes mercedes@okiebenz.com
  To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com 
 Cc: arche...@embarqmail.com arche...@embarqmail.com 
  Sent: Sunday, June 14, 2015 2:36 PM
  Subject: Re: [MBZ] OT tin roof

 You're not unless your fathers or mothers last name is one of the following. 
 Strasfogel isn't on the list.
 
 Miller, 
 Stoltzfus,
 Hershberger
 Yoder
 Hochstetler
 Troyer
 Schrock
 Bontrager
 Burkholder
 Lehman
 Lambright
 King
 Fisher
 Lapp
 Zook
 Beiler
 Hostetler
 Hochstedler
 Borkholder
 Stoltzfoos
 Byler
 Harshberger.
 Schwartz
 Hilty
 Lengacher
 Graber
 Wittmer
 Nolt
 Zimmerman.
 
 I looked them up out of curiosity to see if Strasfogel was included.
 Wife was part Mennonite from Lancaster County, Pa. The Amish are a Mennonite 
 breakaway sect. Amish usually have a last name from this short list of last 
 names.
 
 Andrew Strasfogel wrote:
  How do you know I'm not one of them??
  
  On Sun, Jun 14, 2015 at 11:46 AM, Rich Thomas via Mercedes 
  mercedes@okiebenz.com wrote:
  
   They have infiltrated everywhere -- a quite prolific group.  They'll send
   some scouts out to an area, buy a farm or two (cash) then the clan starts
   coming and buying up farms all around.  Probably not far from DC now.
  
   --R
  
  
  
  
   On 6/13/15 11:15 PM, Curt Raymond via Mercedes wrote:
  
   I was thinking the same thing but PA isn't so far away and from what I
   know of the simple folk they'll do what they can to bring in money...
   -Curt
  
          From: Curly McLain via Mercedes mercedes@okiebenz.com
    To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com
   Cc: Curly McLain 126die...@gmail.com
    Sent: Saturday, June 13, 2015 10:48 PM
    Subject: Re: [MBZ] OT tin roof
      Andrew sez:  Amish guys erected my new shed.
  
   The end of the world must be neat is Amish guys condescend to go into
   the DC area.
  
  
  
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Re: [MBZ] American policy

2015-06-14 Thread Curly McLain via Mercedes

Please elaborateŠ


 On Jun 14, 2015, at 2:59 PM, Curly McLain via 
Mercedes mercedes@okiebenz.com wrote:



  There is evidence Patton was assassinated by 
our goobermnt to prevent him from starting a war 
with the rooskies


http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/northamerica/usa/3869117/General-George-S.-Patton-was-assassinated-to-silence-his-criticism-of-allied-war-leaders-claims-new-book.html

Do a search for General George Patton assassinated  You will see both sides.

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Re: [MBZ] Wut I dun Lernt frum Wulding this week

2015-06-14 Thread G Mann via Mercedes
Question I failed to ask:

What diameter wire are you using? .020, .030 or .035 ?

To use the .020 wire, you will need to change the wheel gap adjustment to
fit the smaller wire AND change the wire guide in the business end of the
torch to fit the smaller wire.

Smaller wire will give you a hotter, smaller weld puddle, so you will need
to change your speed of torch movement to adapt. However, with smaller
wire, you should get a weld puddle that is more correct size for thinner
sheet metal. If you have an amperage adjustment, crank it down for the
smaller wire.

Again, do spot welds, Hammer and dolly the welds while still red, which
will flatten the weld joint and make better contact, thus better welds..
Your tack weld should be 1/8 to 1/4 inch long, so as you work the panel
into position [tack on one side.. hammer/dolly to flatten tack the
other side .. hammer/dolly to flatten.. As you work around the repair..
soon you have the patch contained with the weld joint overlap nice and
flat from hammer / dolly and on the second pass.. instead of tack welds 4
inches apart.. go in between the 4 inch tacks.. same routine.. so on second
pass you have a tack ever 2 inches.. repeat as necessary..

Soon you have a good repair.

On Sun, Jun 14, 2015 at 6:26 PM, clay via Mercedes mercedes@okiebenz.com
wrote:

 I actually read the destructions that came with the zapper.  I followed
 the set up to the letter and even made sure the wheels were in the proper
 orientation for the wire I was using.  There are no teeth to the wheels
 that would provide decent bite.  Just some knurling like you would find on
 a dime in the grooves.  I have the tension adjusted almost to the point of
 strangling the wire.  It does not speed up or make the wire feed properly.

 I am thinking the low speed setting is actually in Dummy mode.  Since
 there is no adjustment for heat, just speed, it could be a failsafe.   The
 lowest speeds must be regulated in such a manner that using it on thin
 sheet metal would not allow it to function long enough to burn through.
 Maybe it is set to feed tacks so you do not overheat and warp.  Sort of
 forcing you to start and stop against your will.



 clay

 2002 s430 - Victor, a Stately  well tailored chap
 1974 450sl -  Frosch - Two tone green
 1976 300D - Blei Vanst - it looks silvery
 1972 220D - Gump - She was green, simple and ran
 1995 E300D - Gave her life to save me against a Dame in a SUV
 POS 1987 SDL - Beware Nigerian Scammers








 On Jun 14, 2015, at 5:03 PM, G Mann via Mercedes wrote:

  Just had a flash on something our new welder said in an earlier post
 about
  the wire not feeding consistantly..
 
  I've never been into the bowels of a Harbor Fright unit.. but there
 should
  be a tension adjustment on the wire feed motor. [everyone I've used to
  date did have one.] If that tension is loose, the wire will not feed
  exactly according to the magic number on the dial...
 
  Check that, why don't you.. And.. get a small roll of flux wire, not made
  in china.
 
  On Sun, Jun 14, 2015 at 3:00 PM, Curt Raymond via Mercedes 
  mercedes@okiebenz.com wrote:
 
  Wasn't it Will Rodgers that said some people have to pee on the electric
  fence for themselves? Sounds like Clay has started peeing.
  When he runs out of the rotten HF wire that EVERYBODY says sucks and
 gets
  some better stuff maybe he'll believe the rest of the world on that too.
  -Curt
   From: Jim Cathey via Mercedes mercedes@okiebenz.com
  To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com
  Cc: Jim Cathey jim.cathey...@gmail.com
  Sent: Sunday, June 14, 2015 5:05 PM
  Subject: Re: [MBZ] Wut I dun Lernt frum Wulding this week
 
  Wire feed welders are nicknamed glue guns.  Clearly, HF
  does not make one such.  Using the Miller on clean, reasonably
  thick sheet metal, and I understand the nickname.
 
  -- Jim
 
 
 
 
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Re: [MBZ] American policy

2015-06-14 Thread G Mann via Mercedes
I make the motion that all Congress should have to pass drug and alcohol
tests BEFORE voting.

All in favor so signify by saying AYE

Apparently, having an IQ greater than your shoe size is not a requirement
for being elected to Congress.. as wittnessed by the link shown.. Classic..

On Sun, Jun 14, 2015 at 5:51 PM, archer75--- via Mercedes 
mercedes@okiebenz.com wrote:

 These flights happened before the Russians had a significant means of
 retaliation IIRC; which would have left the U.S. the worlds only nuclear
 power considering that China would have been given the choice of
 eliminating their nuclear weapons or suffering the same fate as the USSR.
 MAD came later IIRC.
 In retrospect, the U.S. would have, in fact, become the worlds policeman
 and probably avoided the situation we have now.
 Our legislators didn't understand the principles of international power
 politics back then, and apparently still don't; especially Representative
 Hank Johnson of Georgia:

 http://www.snopes.com/politics/quotes/guamtip.asp

 Gerry

 G Mann wrote:

  The thing that made the Cold War work for both sides, what the element of
  mutually assured distruction .. Simply put.. if either side started,
 both
  sides had enough nukes and the means to deliver them that all life would
  have been deleted from the face of the earth.
 
  So.. bravado aside.. Gen LeMay knew he wasn't going to get that order..
 and
  his Russian counterpart knew it as well.. but both had to take the sabers
  out and rattle them regularly to keep the military / Industrial Complex
  fully employed.
 
  Regan made a gutsy and brilliant move with his star wars plan, It drove
  the Russians to bankruptsy trying to out guess [and steal] technology
 that
  did not actually exist, but was close enough to almost there to make
 them
  believe USA was capable of neutralizing any of their weapons delivery,
  which tipped the balance that had been in place for decades..
 
  However.. now we are headed down the same road to snatch defeat from the
  jaws of victory, through gross financial mismanagement.
 
  On Sun, Jun 14, 2015 at 10:32 AM, archer75--- via Mercedes 
  mercedes@okiebenz.com wrote:
 
   When the U.S. was flying nuclear bombs to the borders of the USSR and
 then
   turning back at the last minute during the late '40s, General Curt
 LeMay
   said we should keep right on going to Russian targets and nuke the
   communists back to the stone age.
   I wonder what the world would be like nowadays if someone had given
 that
   command?
   Gerry
  
   Rich Thomas wrote:
I say we take off an nuke the whole site from orbit.  It's the only
 way
   to be sure.
  
On 6/13/15 7:28 PM, archer75--- via Mercedes wrote:
 America won the Cold War in large part because the Russians
 knew
   that American avionics would give NATO control of the air in any
   prospective war; that the Pershing missiles in Germany and Italy gave
 NATO
   an advantage in any prospective nuclear exchange; and that the Reagan
   Strategic Defense Initiative portended a new range of technologies that
   Russia couldn’t match. China looked on from a distance and aligned
 itself
   with the dominant technological superpower.

 If America wants to command China’s respect, it has to widen the
   technology gap, rather than watch it shrink. If China believed that its
   weapons systems were ineffective against American countermeasures, it
 would
   show far more caution. But the opposite is true: the technology gap is
   closing, and China knows it. America still has a technological lead
 and the
   resources to widen it–should it choose to do so. There is no obvious
   political constituency for such an effort though, and no prominent
 leader
   commited to doing so. A return to the Eisenhower-Kennedy-Reagan
 commitment
   to American technological superiority would also have enormously
 beneficial
   effects for America’s lagging productivity. But it is hard to persuade
   Americans that it is better to be tough than to sound tough.

 Asia Times

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   To 

[MBZ] Wut I dun Lernt frum Wulding this week

2015-06-14 Thread clay via Mercedes
It has been a week of dragging my butt outside in the heat and playing with the 
flux core welding gun.  In that time I have gained some perspective on just how 
much work making a decent weld is.

At first I was just banging about with the gun and burning through wire and 
sheet metal.  It was really nasty, but I got a feel for the machine and the 
gun.  Having the old brake rotor to play with allowed me to get comfortable 
that I could lay down a good bead, but it seemed only on a heavy bit of iron, 
not something thin, like what I need to know so I can repair the rusted and 
rotted out floors in the 300D.  SO, zapping thick metal is eazy peezy and most 
any monkey can do that.

I also found that flux core is not good to try to start and stop.  It took me a 
bit to understand that the slag and cruft impedes a good weld, so you need to 
clean the prior muck before you go at it again.  Getting it back to bare metal 
would let the new bead adhere and flow instead of spattering out pellet of 
micro death all over the world.  Flux is great for outdoor work, which the car 
repair will be.  No need to worry the wind is blowing my shielding gas away and 
the air flow also will make the toxic fumes move away from the work.  That is a 
plus.

The HF welding toy is very basic and binary.  You have either BIG amp or small 
amp button and a spastic wire feed control.  The little graphic under the hood 
tells you if you need BIG or small and what wire speed for what thickness of 
metal.  It lies and is very optimistic when dealing with thin sheet metal.  At 
least if you expect to be laying down a continuous bead.  I could not keep from 
blowing through the metal and having bad welds at the 0.5 wire speed (0-9 
range) the graphic depicts.  I up the speed and it still blows out, but at 
least the wire feeds.  The slow speed would not put out wire dependably.  

The solution to that was to not try to make a bead, but to just put a bunch or 
tacks all over the piece and then go back and put some more next to the last 
ones.  Refer to cleaning the old slag above, and my attempts were more 
successful.  That took a long time to figure out.  It also stopped the blow 
outs, warpage and other troubles that build up of excess heat was causing.  Go 
slowly with lots of stitches from quick little spots of heat.  What I also 
garnered from this learning curve was that the really hefty copper welding heat 
sink could suck calories out of the work.  I do not have enough hands to hold 
that and the gun, but it was eye opening.

I am fairly certain all this information was provided by Grant a week ago, but 
seeing it with ones own eyes drives it home.  Much of my practice metal has 
been dead computer cases.  It had a plethora of coatings, and even some of the 
metal I picked up at the scrap store had a film.  For a very good end product, 
you need a VERY clean work surface.  Initially, the wire wheel and grinder 
elbow grease I applied was not enough to really give me a clean, bare surface.  
I thought it looked bare, but it was not.  SHINY metal is a clean, bare 
surface.  No shine, not clean, no good welds will come.  All the youtube videos 
and written explanations did not get that to sink in.  Seeing it in action was 
the key.

The current steep learning curve involves welding sheet metal to a thicker L 
bit.  The heavy L is rather solid and flat.  The body panels I need to tack it 
and weld to are not so flat.  Gaps and uneven contact are not making for a good 
weld.  I am still on the learning bench, not in actual car process.  The sheet 
metal is 18 gauge, the L is 1/8 to 3/16.  


clay 

2002 s430 - Victor, a Stately  well tailored chap
1974 450sl -  Frosch - Two tone green
1976 300D - Blei Vanst - it looks silvery
1972 220D - Gump - She was green, simple and ran
1995 E300D - Gave her life to save me against a Dame in a SUV
POS 1987 SDL - Beware Nigerian Scammers








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[MBZ] OT - Concrete Question

2015-06-14 Thread Dan Penoff via Mercedes
I”ve got a well known and respected concrete contractor coming to the house on 
Tuesday afternoon to give me an estimate on adding an additional pad or 
extension to the side of my existing concrete driveway.

While it should be fairly simple, and I know there’s not a lot of majik to 
pouring concrete, I thought I would ask here if anyone has experience with such 
things, and if so, anything I should ask or be wary of?

It’s a rectangular area of about 10’ x 22’ with a sidewalk near one end.  It 
essentially adds a parking space to the left side of the existing driveway on a 
flat area that is currently covered with grass.

Thanks,

Dan
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Re: [MBZ] Wut I dun Lernt frum Wulding this week

2015-06-14 Thread G Mann via Mercedes
Good report on your progress.

Welding 1/8th stock [.125 thousands thick] to 18 gage [55. thousands
thick] is a serious challenge for beginner..

The first problem you will have is to get enough weld heat on the .125
stock to penetrate without destroying the 55. material with that much
heat.

Now it's time for development of hand eye coordination.. Start the arc on
the heavy material first, then flow the weld puddle into the light
material, then get out of the weld..
Good contact between the heavy metal and the light metal is absolutely
critical. If there is a gap... you will stay in the weld joint to long
trying to stack up liquid metal to fill the gap.. which will heat transfer
to the lighter metal and burn through it.. quickly.

Set up some practice pieces with the thicknesses and work with them.. it
will come to you.


On Sun, Jun 14, 2015 at 1:19 PM, clay via Mercedes mercedes@okiebenz.com
wrote:

 It has been a week of dragging my butt outside in the heat and playing
 with the flux core welding gun.  In that time I have gained some
 perspective on just how much work making a decent weld is.

 At first I was just banging about with the gun and burning through wire
 and sheet metal.  It was really nasty, but I got a feel for the machine and
 the gun.  Having the old brake rotor to play with allowed me to get
 comfortable that I could lay down a good bead, but it seemed only on a
 heavy bit of iron, not something thin, like what I need to know so I can
 repair the rusted and rotted out floors in the 300D.  SO, zapping thick
 metal is eazy peezy and most any monkey can do that.

 I also found that flux core is not good to try to start and stop.  It took
 me a bit to understand that the slag and cruft impedes a good weld, so you
 need to clean the prior muck before you go at it again.  Getting it back to
 bare metal would let the new bead adhere and flow instead of spattering out
 pellet of micro death all over the world.  Flux is great for outdoor work,
 which the car repair will be.  No need to worry the wind is blowing my
 shielding gas away and the air flow also will make the toxic fumes move
 away from the work.  That is a plus.

 The HF welding toy is very basic and binary.  You have either BIG amp or
 small amp button and a spastic wire feed control.  The little graphic under
 the hood tells you if you need BIG or small and what wire speed for what
 thickness of metal.  It lies and is very optimistic when dealing with thin
 sheet metal.  At least if you expect to be laying down a continuous bead.
 I could not keep from blowing through the metal and having bad welds at the
 0.5 wire speed (0-9 range) the graphic depicts.  I up the speed and it
 still blows out, but at least the wire feeds.  The slow speed would not put
 out wire dependably.

 The solution to that was to not try to make a bead, but to just put a
 bunch or tacks all over the piece and then go back and put some more next
 to the last ones.  Refer to cleaning the old slag above, and my attempts
 were more successful.  That took a long time to figure out.  It also
 stopped the blow outs, warpage and other troubles that build up of excess
 heat was causing.  Go slowly with lots of stitches from quick little spots
 of heat.  What I also garnered from this learning curve was that the really
 hefty copper welding heat sink could suck calories out of the work.  I do
 not have enough hands to hold that and the gun, but it was eye opening.

 I am fairly certain all this information was provided by Grant a week ago,
 but seeing it with ones own eyes drives it home.  Much of my practice metal
 has been dead computer cases.  It had a plethora of coatings, and even some
 of the metal I picked up at the scrap store had a film.  For a very good
 end product, you need a VERY clean work surface.  Initially, the wire wheel
 and grinder elbow grease I applied was not enough to really give me a
 clean, bare surface.  I thought it looked bare, but it was not.  SHINY
 metal is a clean, bare surface.  No shine, not clean, no good welds will
 come.  All the youtube videos and written explanations did not get that to
 sink in.  Seeing it in action was the key.

 The current steep learning curve involves welding sheet metal to a thicker
 L bit.  The heavy L is rather solid and flat.  The body panels I need to
 tack it and weld to are not so flat.  Gaps and uneven contact are not
 making for a good weld.  I am still on the learning bench, not in actual
 car process.  The sheet metal is 18 gauge, the L is 1/8 to 3/16.


 clay

 2002 s430 - Victor, a Stately  well tailored chap
 1974 450sl -  Frosch - Two tone green
 1976 300D - Blei Vanst - it looks silvery
 1972 220D - Gump - She was green, simple and ran
 1995 E300D - Gave her life to save me against a Dame in a SUV
 POS 1987 SDL - Beware Nigerian Scammers








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