Re: [MBZ] Great car but it needs a motor
Stupid?? The SLS pump in my 83 wagon has lasted for 25 years/323,000 miles. On Fri, Oct 9, 2009 at 11:44 PM, David Bruckmann bruckma...@transcontinental.ca wrote: There's another option that may be somewhat simpler: plumb in another belt-driven high-pressure pump instead of the stupid timing-chain-driven MB pump. At least some of the W124 wagons have a dual-pressure, belt-driven pump (124-460-15-80 Vickers) for steering/self-levelling. That could almost certainly be adapted to a W123... D. At 10:48 PM + 10/9/09, mercedes-requ...@okiebenz.com wrote: Message: 11 Date: Fri, 09 Oct 2009 15:13:22 -0700 From: tyler casi...@usermail.com Subject: Re: [MBZ] Great car but it needs a motor To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Well, were they done properly? There's no inherent reason why a wagon wouldn't handle fine with a regular rear suspension. I'd be willing to bet that most of these conversions use stock sedan springs/shocks from a junkyard, which aren't stiff enough for a wagon. If I were going to do the swap I would cut the sedan springs down and add an aluminum spacer to get the correct ride height and spring rate, and get rear shocks that are valved properly for the increased rear weight (Bilstein will revalve their shocks cheaply). This would certainly be a lot cheaper and easier than replacing an engine- and would allow one to customize the spring and shock rate for the way they use their wagon. There's also a good chance that an aftermarket spring company somewhere makes the correct springs for this conversion. Other options that would work well are nivomat self contained leveling shocks, and air bags in the springs. I'm annoyed that people on here mostly parrot what Marshall said without understanding the context. ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://okiebenz.com/pipermail/mercedes_okiebenz.com/attachments/20091010/4575e113/attachment.html ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Great car but it needs a motor
Especially when you load it down and it stays at the correct height. Anybody remember this: http://www.okiebenz.com/funny/wagonoverload/ andrew strasfogel wrote: PEOPLE! I have two wagons - one with its original SLS and the other a spring/shock conversion to go with a replacement non-300TD engine. You are welcome to test drive and compare. I have done this many times, however, and while I can state with certainty that the non-SLS 300TD is safe to drive, the correctly suspended (?) 300TD has a more comfortable, stable suspension and is there fore more fun to drive. On Fri, Oct 9, 2009 at 11:32 PM, Tyler casi...@usermail.com wrote: Modifications aren't about knowing more than Mercedes or re-inventing the wheel- fitting a proper rate spring and damper to give you the handling you want isn't magic or rocket science- there are dozens of books about it and it's done properly on almost every car made, including the vast majority of W123s. The ONLY difference is that the wagon has more weight in the rear end and cargo capacity, requiring a different spring rate and dampener valve. How different? Look at the same engineering books as the magic mercedes engineers looked at, and calculate it the same way they did for the sedan. Why did they go to all of the extra trouble and expense of the hydraulic system then? Because it gives a smoother ride, and it's a good marketing gimmick- not because a spring is dangerous or less reliable. I for one prefer a stiffer ride and better handling than most car buyers, so it's reasonable for me to modify the suspension on my vehicles accordingly- and I do careful research and make conservative changes to ensure that the result is safe and reliable. There's nothing wrong with modifying a vehicle to suit your needs, if you know what you're doing and why you're doing it. It doesn't have to mean that you think the origional engineers were wrong to do what they did, or that you know more, just that the circumstances are extremely different. I have had excellent luck adding and removing features, and making minor changes to many different brands of car to allow them to work properly under the conditions I use them in, which are often somewhat different from those they were designed for. I don't, for example consider the fact that I prefer to add a loud audible alarm to my oil pressure and coolant level sensors an assault on the competence of the company who decided not to include one from the factory. Sincerely, Tyler On Oct 9, 2009, at 6:54 PM, Loren Faeth wrote: I have done quite a few engine swaps, even put a v-8 in a body made for 6 cyl inline ONLY. That was an adventure. I have worked on everything from tractors to medium duty trucks, houses, commercial buildings concrete, etc. I do not presume to know more about suspension than the team of German-trained engineers (real engineers) that designed the 123 SLS system. tyler, have at it, but I sincerely hope you are never coming toward me with your frankenheap on an Icy curve with a bump on a rainy night. At 06:34 PM 10/9/2009, you wrote: *Ahem* I believe the term here is put up or shut up. If its so easy just take a long weekend at Andrew's and show us how awesome you can make his car. I'm sure he'd give you dinner... -Curt Date: Fri, 09 Oct 2009 15:48:30 -0700 From: tyler casi...@usermail.com Subject: Re: [MBZ] Great car but it needs a motor To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Message-ID: 4acfbdbe.4020...@usermail.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed It IS trivial to use a spring with the correct spring rate... Anyone that can do an engine swap, could do this much cheaper and easier. Tyler Peter T. Arnold wrote: GO for it! Redesign it. I'm sure that the effort would be trivial to a fellow like you. -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://okiebenz.com/pipermail/mercedes_okiebenz.com/attachments/20091009/cfb2e204/attachment.html ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com Loren Faeth ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http
Re: [MBZ] Great car but it needs a motor
YES! That's the exact picture that I see in my mind when the springs vs SLS discussion comes up On Sat, Oct 10, 2009 at 10:58 AM, Kaleb C. Striplin ka...@striplin.netwrote: Especially when you load it down and it stays at the correct height. Anybody remember this: http://www.okiebenz.com/funny/wagonoverload/ -- OK Don CONSERVATIVE, n. A statesman who is enamored of existing evils, as distinguished from the Liberal, who wishes to replace them with others. The Devil's Dictionary Ambrose Bierce -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://okiebenz.com/pipermail/mercedes_okiebenz.com/attachments/20091010/081f49aa/attachment.html ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Great car but it needs a motor
Well, that wagon had fully working SLS, but I have it WAY overloaded. But yes, even with very little in the back, that is EXACTLY what the car will do if it was converted to springs. No amount of stiffening will get rid of that. If you did put in a stiff enough spring, when the car was unloaded, I would imagine it would be about like a pogo stick going down the road. OK Don wrote: YES! That's the exact picture that I see in my mind when the springs vs SLS discussion comes up On Sat, Oct 10, 2009 at 10:58 AM, Kaleb C. Striplin ka...@striplin.netwrote: Especially when you load it down and it stays at the correct height. Anybody remember this: http://www.okiebenz.com/funny/wagonoverload/ -- OK Don CONSERVATIVE, n. A statesman who is enamored of existing evils, as distinguished from the Liberal, who wishes to replace them with others. The Devil's Dictionary Ambrose Bierce -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://okiebenz.com/pipermail/mercedes_okiebenz.com/attachments/20091010/081f49aa/attachment.html ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com Internal Virus Database is out of date. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.409 / Virus Database: 270.13.113/2400 - Release Date: 09/28/09 05:51:00 -- Kaleb C. Striplin/Claremore, OK 95 E300, 92 500SEL, 92 300SD, 92 300E 4Matic, 91 300D, 91 300E, 89 560SEL, 87 300SDL x2, 85 380SE 5.0 Euro, 85 190D, 84 190D, 84 300D euro manny, 81 240D, 80 240D, 76 240D, 76 300D, http://www.okiebenz.com -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://okiebenz.com/pipermail/mercedes_okiebenz.com/attachments/20091010/c134c76e/attachment.html -- next part -- Internal Virus Database is out of date. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.409 / Virus Database: 270.13.113/2400 - Release Date: 09/28/09 05:51:00 ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Great car but it needs a motor
Tyler, Just out of curiousity can you actually answer a question many of us have asked you? Have you ever actually driven a 123 wagon? -Curt Date: Fri, 9 Oct 2009 20:32:51 -0700 From: Tyler casi...@usermail.com Subject: Re: [MBZ] Great car but it needs a motor To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Message-ID: 9fc5cfa6-65f4-4d5d-9256-5a2548418...@usermail.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed; delsp=yes Modifications aren't about knowing more than Mercedes or re-inventing the wheel- fitting a proper rate spring and damper to give you the handling you want isn't magic or rocket science- there are dozens of books about it and it's done properly on almost every car made, including the vast majority of W123s. The ONLY difference is that the wagon has more weight in the rear end and cargo capacity, requiring a different spring rate and dampener valve. How different? Look at the same engineering books as the magic mercedes engineers looked at, and calculate it the same way they did for the sedan. Why did they go to all of the extra trouble and expense of the hydraulic system then? Because it gives a smoother ride, and it's a good marketing gimmick- not because a spring is dangerous or less reliable. I for one prefer a stiffer ride and better handling than most car buyers, so it's reasonable for me to modify the suspension on my vehicles accordingly- and I do careful research and make conservative changes to ensure that the result is safe and reliable. There's nothing wrong with modifying a vehicle to suit your needs, if you know what you're doing and why you're doing it. It doesn't have to mean that you think the origional engineers were wrong to do what they did, or that you know more, just that the circumstances are extremely different. I have had excellent luck adding and removing features, and making minor changes to many different brands of car to allow them to work properly under the conditions I use them in, which are often somewhat different from those they were designed for. I don't, for example consider the fact that I prefer to add a loud audible alarm to my oil pressure and coolant level sensors an assault on the competence of the company who decided not to include one from the factory. Sincerely, Tyler -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://okiebenz.com/pipermail/mercedes_okiebenz.com/attachments/20091010/3b141d65/attachment.html ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Great car but it needs a motor
My favorite part of my wagon was loading a bunch of people into it and feeling it rise to the right height. I think there was something wrong in that the car would leak down when it was off if you put a bunch of weight in (2 large folks in the back seat for instance) but as soon as it went into gear it would figure itself out. On Andrew's problem he really just needs an SLS equipped head right? Would it be more expensive to just swap heads than swap engines? Seems like while the head was off you'd get a good look at the engine too and have the opportunity to make sure everything was okay, and replace the headgasket of course. Man, all this talk makes me want another wagon. -Curt Date: Sat, 10 Oct 2009 10:58:21 -0500 From: Kaleb C. Striplin ka...@striplin.net Subject: Re: [MBZ] Great car but it needs a motor To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Message-ID: 4ad0af1d.7010...@striplin.net Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; Format=flowed Especially when you load it down and it stays at the correct height. Anybody remember this: http://www.okiebenz.com/funny/wagonoverload/ andrew strasfogel wrote: PEOPLE! I have two wagons - one with its original SLS and the other a spring/shock conversion to go with a replacement non-300TD engine. You are welcome to test drive and compare. I have done this many times, however, and while I can state with certainty that the non-SLS 300TD is safe to drive, the correctly suspended (?) 300TD has a more comfortable, stable suspension and is there fore more fun to drive. -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://okiebenz.com/pipermail/mercedes_okiebenz.com/attachments/20091010/ae486647/attachment.html ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Great car but it needs a motor
Ever drive one with bad spheres? My friend owned one which I later bought that had bad spheres, it was like driving a pogo stick. He had it one whole winter like that, I could never understand why anybody would want one. When he got the spheres replaced it all of a sudden made sense... -Curt Date: Sat, 10 Oct 2009 14:24:00 -0500 From: Kaleb C. Striplin ka...@striplin.net Subject: Re: [MBZ] Great car but it needs a motor To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Message-ID: 4ad0df50.2040...@striplin.net Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; Format=flowed Well, that wagon had fully working SLS, but I have it WAY overloaded. But yes, even with very little in the back, that is EXACTLY what the car will do if it was converted to springs. No amount of stiffening will get rid of that. If you did put in a stiff enough spring, when the car was unloaded, I would imagine it would be about like a pogo stick going down the road. -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://okiebenz.com/pipermail/mercedes_okiebenz.com/attachments/20091010/473bea3f/attachment.html ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Great car but it needs a motor
The little link to the valve on my wagon broke one day, the back popped up about a block from home, I felt like I was back in my buddy's 67 Chevy we put air shocks and big tires on back in high school. It looked pretty funny. --R Curt Raymond wrote: My favorite part of my wagon was loading a bunch of people into it and feeling it rise to the right height. I think there was something wrong in that the car would leak down when it was off if you put a bunch of weight in (2 large folks in the back seat for instance) but as soon as it went into gear it would figure itself out. ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Great car but it needs a motor
I once had to use a sedan engine in a wagon and do the head swap. Curt Raymond wrote: My favorite part of my wagon was loading a bunch of people into it and feeling it rise to the right height. I think there was something wrong in that the car would leak down when it was off if you put a bunch of weight in (2 large folks in the back seat for instance) but as soon as it went into gear it would figure itself out. On Andrew's problem he really just needs an SLS equipped head right? Would it be more expensive to just swap heads than swap engines? Seems like while the head was off you'd get a good look at the engine too and have the opportunity to make sure everything was okay, and replace the headgasket of course. Man, all this talk makes me want another wagon. -Curt -- Kaleb C. Striplin/Claremore, OK 95 E300, 92 500SEL, 92 300SD, 92 300E 4Matic, 91 300D, 91 300E, 89 560SEL, 87 300SDL x2, 85 380SE 5.0 Euro, 85 190D, 84 190D, 84 300D euro manny, 81 240D, 80 240D, 76 240D, 76 300D, http://www.okiebenz.com -- next part -- Internal Virus Database is out of date. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.409 / Virus Database: 270.13.113/2400 - Release Date: 09/28/09 05:51:00 ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Great car but it needs a motor
Yep, I have. Curt Raymond wrote: Ever drive one with bad spheres? My friend owned one which I later bought that had bad spheres, it was like driving a pogo stick. He had it one whole winter like that, I could never understand why anybody would want one. When he got the spheres replaced it all of a sudden made sense... -Curt -- Kaleb C. Striplin/Claremore, OK 95 E300, 92 500SEL, 92 300SD, 92 300E 4Matic, 91 300D, 91 300E, 89 560SEL, 87 300SDL x2, 85 380SE 5.0 Euro, 85 190D, 84 190D, 84 300D euro manny, 81 240D, 80 240D, 76 240D, 76 300D, http://www.okiebenz.com -- next part -- Internal Virus Database is out of date. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.409 / Virus Database: 270.13.113/2400 - Release Date: 09/28/09 05:51:00 ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Great car but it needs a motor
I've never heard of a suspension converted MB wagon that wasn't a complete disaster What the hell am i doing up at this hour? On 10/7/09, pm7...@comcast.net pm7...@comcast.net wrote: Marshal always gave the admonishment that any backyard attempt to convert the rear suspension would result in a very expensive uncomfortable suspension. USUALLY IN CAPS -- Peter Arnold Windsor, CT - Original Message - From: Meade M CIV SPAWARSYSCEN-ATLANTIC Dillon, 53310 meade.m.dil...@navy.mil To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Sent: Wednesday, October 7, 2009 6:57:52 AM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern Subject: Re: [MBZ] Great car but it needs a motor Do you have such a bastardized car? Almost every such car I've heard of was judged to be a very poor handling car compared to the original SLS. Max -Original Message- From: mercedes-boun...@okiebenz.com [mailto:mercedes-boun...@okiebenz.com] On Behalf Of Tyler Sent: Wednesday, October 07, 2009 3:26 AM To: Mercedes Discussion List Subject: Re: [MBZ] Great car but it needs a motor Assuming you have the proper spring rate (not just sedan springs), and bilstein HD shocks that are valved properly for a wagon- Surely it would handle at least as good as a brand new self leveling system- and better if you made it a little stiffer (which would also eliminate the need for the leveling feature). I personally think the SLS is mostly a marketing gimmick- especially on a car that isn't designed for heavy duty towing. I guess it lets them get by with softer springs than they otherwise would need to prevent sag when loaded, which makes the ride softer- but certainly doesn't improve handling over a set of stiff regular springs. Sincerely, Tyler 1987 190D Turbo Biodiesel On Oct 6, 2009, at 5:17 PM, Kaleb C. Striplin wrote: We are talking about a wagon here, correct? Putting in regular springs in a wagon makes for better handling? I think not. The SLS when working properly handles VERY well. It is a very simple system, very little goes wrong. That think will never be right if you just put springs in it. tyler wrote: It sounds like a lot of work and expense to reinstall the self levelling system- I'd just keep the regular rear suspension myself. Simpler, more reliable, and better handling. If it sags in the rear when you load it up, just get stiffer springs or some spacers. I've used overload springs with stock height, but a 20% stiffer rate on my Volvo wagons that I do a lot of towing with. It handles a little better, and doesn't really sag at all when I load it up- but I didn't notice any reduction in the ride quality. Tyler ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://okiebenz.com/pipermail/mercedes_okiebenz.com/attachments/20091007/7cf0a594/attachment.html ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com -- Sent from my mobile device ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Great car but it needs a motor
My 1985 300TD with the rear Bilstean shocks and disconnectged SLS isn't a disaster but it definitely doesn't ride or handle as nicely as my genuine SLS 1983 300TD, with 322k miles. So who wants my 1985 300D motor for FREE so I can install the proper engine and hook up my SLS? On Fri, Oct 9, 2009 at 6:14 AM, Gary Hurst jabbahur...@gmail.com wrote: I've never heard of a suspension converted MB wagon that wasn't a complete disaster What the hell am i doing up at this hour? On 10/7/09, pm7...@comcast.net pm7...@comcast.net wrote: Marshal always gave the admonishment that any backyard attempt to convert the rear suspension would result in a very expensive uncomfortable suspension. USUALLY IN CAPS -- Peter Arnold Windsor, CT - Original Message - From: Meade M CIV SPAWARSYSCEN-ATLANTIC Dillon, 53310 meade.m.dil...@navy.mil To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Sent: Wednesday, October 7, 2009 6:57:52 AM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern Subject: Re: [MBZ] Great car but it needs a motor Do you have such a bastardized car? Almost every such car I've heard of was judged to be a very poor handling car compared to the original SLS. Max -Original Message- From: mercedes-boun...@okiebenz.com [mailto:mercedes-boun...@okiebenz.com] On Behalf Of Tyler Sent: Wednesday, October 07, 2009 3:26 AM To: Mercedes Discussion List Subject: Re: [MBZ] Great car but it needs a motor Assuming you have the proper spring rate (not just sedan springs), and bilstein HD shocks that are valved properly for a wagon- Surely it would handle at least as good as a brand new self leveling system- and better if you made it a little stiffer (which would also eliminate the need for the leveling feature). I personally think the SLS is mostly a marketing gimmick- especially on a car that isn't designed for heavy duty towing. I guess it lets them get by with softer springs than they otherwise would need to prevent sag when loaded, which makes the ride softer- but certainly doesn't improve handling over a set of stiff regular springs. Sincerely, Tyler 1987 190D Turbo Biodiesel On Oct 6, 2009, at 5:17 PM, Kaleb C. Striplin wrote: We are talking about a wagon here, correct? Putting in regular springs in a wagon makes for better handling? I think not. The SLS when working properly handles VERY well. It is a very simple system, very little goes wrong. That think will never be right if you just put springs in it. tyler wrote: It sounds like a lot of work and expense to reinstall the self levelling system- I'd just keep the regular rear suspension myself. Simpler, more reliable, and better handling. If it sags in the rear when you load it up, just get stiffer springs or some spacers. I've used overload springs with stock height, but a 20% stiffer rate on my Volvo wagons that I do a lot of towing with. It handles a little better, and doesn't really sag at all when I load it up- but I didn't notice any reduction in the ride quality. Tyler ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://okiebenz.com/pipermail/mercedes_okiebenz.com/attachments/20091007/7cf0a594/attachment.html ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com -- Sent from my mobile device ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://okiebenz.com/pipermail/mercedes_okiebenz.com/attachments/20091009/5a8488b1/attachment.html ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Great car but it needs a motor
Should be BILSTEIN shocks. On Fri, Oct 9, 2009 at 11:24 AM, andrew strasfogel astrasfo...@gmail.comwrote: My 1985 300TD with the rear Bilstean shocks and disconnectged SLS isn't a disaster but it definitely doesn't ride or handle as nicely as my genuine SLS 1983 300TD, with 322k miles. So who wants my 1985 300D motor for FREE so I can install the proper engine and hook up my SLS? On Fri, Oct 9, 2009 at 6:14 AM, Gary Hurst jabbahur...@gmail.com wrote: I've never heard of a suspension converted MB wagon that wasn't a complete disaster What the hell am i doing up at this hour? On 10/7/09, pm7...@comcast.net pm7...@comcast.net wrote: Marshal always gave the admonishment that any backyard attempt to convert the rear suspension would result in a very expensive uncomfortable suspension. USUALLY IN CAPS -- Peter Arnold Windsor, CT - Original Message - From: Meade M CIV SPAWARSYSCEN-ATLANTIC Dillon, 53310 meade.m.dil...@navy.mil To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Sent: Wednesday, October 7, 2009 6:57:52 AM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern Subject: Re: [MBZ] Great car but it needs a motor Do you have such a bastardized car? Almost every such car I've heard of was judged to be a very poor handling car compared to the original SLS. Max -Original Message- From: mercedes-boun...@okiebenz.com [mailto:mercedes-boun...@okiebenz.com] On Behalf Of Tyler Sent: Wednesday, October 07, 2009 3:26 AM To: Mercedes Discussion List Subject: Re: [MBZ] Great car but it needs a motor Assuming you have the proper spring rate (not just sedan springs), and bilstein HD shocks that are valved properly for a wagon- Surely it would handle at least as good as a brand new self leveling system- and better if you made it a little stiffer (which would also eliminate the need for the leveling feature). I personally think the SLS is mostly a marketing gimmick- especially on a car that isn't designed for heavy duty towing. I guess it lets them get by with softer springs than they otherwise would need to prevent sag when loaded, which makes the ride softer- but certainly doesn't improve handling over a set of stiff regular springs. Sincerely, Tyler 1987 190D Turbo Biodiesel On Oct 6, 2009, at 5:17 PM, Kaleb C. Striplin wrote: We are talking about a wagon here, correct? Putting in regular springs in a wagon makes for better handling? I think not. The SLS when working properly handles VERY well. It is a very simple system, very little goes wrong. That think will never be right if you just put springs in it. tyler wrote: It sounds like a lot of work and expense to reinstall the self levelling system- I'd just keep the regular rear suspension myself. Simpler, more reliable, and better handling. If it sags in the rear when you load it up, just get stiffer springs or some spacers. I've used overload springs with stock height, but a 20% stiffer rate on my Volvo wagons that I do a lot of towing with. It handles a little better, and doesn't really sag at all when I load it up- but I didn't notice any reduction in the ride quality. Tyler ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://okiebenz.com/pipermail/mercedes_okiebenz.com/attachments/20091007/7cf0a594/attachment.html ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com -- Sent from my mobile device ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://okiebenz.com/pipermail/mercedes_okiebenz.com/attachments/20091009/4acfa446/attachment.html ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go
Re: [MBZ] Great car but it needs a motor
Well, were they done properly? There's no inherent reason why a wagon wouldn't handle fine with a regular rear suspension. I'd be willing to bet that most of these conversions use stock sedan springs/shocks from a junkyard, which aren't stiff enough for a wagon. If I were going to do the swap I would cut the sedan springs down and add an aluminum spacer to get the correct ride height and spring rate, and get rear shocks that are valved properly for the increased rear weight (Bilstein will revalve their shocks cheaply). This would certainly be a lot cheaper and easier than replacing an engine- and would allow one to customize the spring and shock rate for the way they use their wagon. There's also a good chance that an aftermarket spring company somewhere makes the correct springs for this conversion. Other options that would work well are nivomat self contained leveling shocks, and air bags in the springs. I'm annoyed that people on here mostly parrot what Marshall said without understanding the context. Tyler Gary Hurst wrote: I've never heard of a suspension converted MB wagon that wasn't a complete disaster What the hell am i doing up at this hour? On 10/7/09, pm7...@comcast.net pm7...@comcast.net wrote: Marshal always gave the admonishment that any backyard attempt to convert the rear suspension would result in a very expensive uncomfortable suspension. USUALLY IN CAPS -- Peter Arnold Windsor, CT ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Great car but it needs a motor
GO for it! Redesign it. I'm sure that the effort would be trivial to a fellow like you. I'm annoyed that people on here mostly parrot what Marshall said without understanding the context. When you have a minute between engineering changes on your suspension, why not find a new list? Tyler -- Pete Arnold This e-mail from Peter Arnold and any attachments to it are confidential to the intended recipient and may also be uncensored. If you have received it in error please consult your religious adviser. If you are not the intended recipient, why have you read this far? Please do not staple, spindle or otherwise mutilate this document, doing so may damage your screen. All communications may be subject to interception or monitoring by the men in black helicopters for security purposes. Please rely on your own swine flu virus checking as the sender cannot accept any liability for any damage arising from any bug or virus infection. ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Great car but it needs a motor
So in theory it could be done right. This doesn't quite negate the power of the fact that none of us has ever seen such a creature On 10/9/09, tyler casi...@usermail.com wrote: Well, were they done properly? There's no inherent reason why a wagon wouldn't handle fine with a regular rear suspension. I'd be willing to bet that most of these conversions use stock sedan springs/shocks from a junkyard, which aren't stiff enough for a wagon. If I were going to do the swap I would cut the sedan springs down and add an aluminum spacer to get the correct ride height and spring rate, and get rear shocks that are valved properly for the increased rear weight (Bilstein will revalve their shocks cheaply). This would certainly be a lot cheaper and easier than replacing an engine- and would allow one to customize the spring and shock rate for the way they use their wagon. There's also a good chance that an aftermarket spring company somewhere makes the correct springs for this conversion. Other options that would work well are nivomat self contained leveling shocks, and air bags in the springs. I'm annoyed that people on here mostly parrot what Marshall said without understanding the context. Tyler Gary Hurst wrote: I've never heard of a suspension converted MB wagon that wasn't a complete disaster What the hell am i doing up at this hour? On 10/7/09, pm7...@comcast.net pm7...@comcast.net wrote: Marshal always gave the admonishment that any backyard attempt to convert the rear suspension would result in a very expensive uncomfortable suspension. USUALLY IN CAPS -- Peter Arnold Windsor, CT ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com -- Sent from my mobile device ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Great car but it needs a motor
It IS trivial to use a spring with the correct spring rate... Anyone that can do an engine swap, could do this much cheaper and easier. Tyler Peter T. Arnold wrote: GO for it! Redesign it. I'm sure that the effort would be trivial to a fellow like you. ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Great car but it needs a motor
*Ahem* I believe the term here is put up or shut up. If its so easy just take a long weekend at Andrew's and show us how awesome you can make his car. I'm sure he'd give you dinner... -Curt Date: Fri, 09 Oct 2009 15:48:30 -0700 From: tyler casi...@usermail.com Subject: Re: [MBZ] Great car but it needs a motor To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Message-ID: 4acfbdbe.4020...@usermail.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed It IS trivial to use a spring with the correct spring rate... Anyone that can do an engine swap, could do this much cheaper and easier. Tyler Peter T. Arnold wrote: GO for it! Redesign it. I'm sure that the effort would be trivial to a fellow like you. -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://okiebenz.com/pipermail/mercedes_okiebenz.com/attachments/20091009/cfb2e204/attachment.html ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Great car but it needs a motor
Tyler, We're not just parroting what Marshall said, we're giving you real world experience about a car you've apparently never been in... Why screw around trying to bodge something that works really really well? What Andrew is trying to do is go BACK to what his car had before some other bodger bodged it which I think is admirable. For the record I've ridden in Volvo wagons, the older boxy (pre '91?) body style, they DO NOT compare to a 123 wagon. -Curt Date: Fri, 09 Oct 2009 15:13:22 -0700 From: tyler casi...@usermail.com Subject: Re: [MBZ] Great car but it needs a motor To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Message-ID: 4acfb582.2050...@usermail.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Well, were they done properly? There's no inherent reason why a wagon wouldn't handle fine with a regular rear suspension. I'd be willing to bet that most of these conversions use stock sedan springs/shocks from a junkyard, which aren't stiff enough for a wagon. If I were going to do the swap I would cut the sedan springs down and add an aluminum spacer to get the correct ride height and spring rate, and get rear shocks that are valved properly for the increased rear weight (Bilstein will revalve their shocks cheaply). This would certainly be a lot cheaper and easier than replacing an engine- and would allow one to customize the spring and shock rate for the way they use their wagon. There's also a good chance that an aftermarket spring company somewhere makes the correct springs for this conversion. Other options that would work well are nivomat self contained leveling shocks, and air bags in the springs. I'm annoyed that people on here mostly parrot what Marshall said without understanding the context. Tyler -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://okiebenz.com/pipermail/mercedes_okiebenz.com/attachments/20091009/7b1f21a8/attachment.html ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Great car but it needs a motor
The Mercedes hydraulic system is great, and I can understand wanting to make it work again. I'm just trying to say that a regular spring suspension is perfectly fine, and works great on the majority of stock vehicles that use them. A 300TD with sedan springs is horrible, but it's probably easier to raise the spring rate or install the correct springs than to replace the engine and reinstall all of the hydraulics. I have stiffened the springs on several cars by removing some spring and replacing it with a solid spacer- with great success. There are also a bunch of companies (like lesjoforsab.com and hrsprings.com) that would certainly sell you the correct springs, and probably provide advice on choosing a spring rate. What do Volvos have to do with this? I'm a huge fan of the Volvo 700/900/90 series wagons (1985-1998). The 80s models aren't as comfortable and refined as a W123- but do handle better because of a stiffer suspension, rack and pinion steering, and about 600lbs less weight. I'd love to replace my '87 740 Turbo with a 300TD (especially an 87 300TD), but it couldn't begin to do what I do with my 740 Turbo. The cooling system, transmission, and suspension on the Volvo are much simpler and heavier duty. Just a few weeks ago I towed my 22 foot 3500lb sailboat up a steep windy mountain road to go sailing on an alpine lake that's at 7000 feet elevation. I've also taken it camping several times in Baja, driving for days offroad on sand and rock while loaded with 1000lbs of gear and I've never had to do anything to the suspension other than stiffen the rear springs and add a locking differential. Somehow the Volvo has held up fine to this abuse for years and years, but I should eventually replace it with a 3/4 ton 4wd diesel pickup of some sort which is actually designed for this sort of use. Tyler Curt Raymond wrote: Tyler, We're not just parroting what Marshall said, we're giving you real world experience about a car you've apparently never been in... Why screw around trying to bodge something that works really really well? What Andrew is trying to do is go BACK to what his car had before some other bodger bodged it which I think is admirable. For the record I've ridden in Volvo wagons, the older boxy (pre '91?) body style, they DO NOT compare to a 123 wagon. -Curt Date: Fri, 09 Oct 2009 15:13:22 -0700 From: tyler casi...@usermail.com Subject: Re: [MBZ] Great car but it needs a motor To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Message-ID: 4acfb582.2050...@usermail.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Well, were they done properly? There's no inherent reason why a wagon wouldn't handle fine with a regular rear suspension. I'd be willing to bet that most of these conversions use stock sedan springs/shocks from a junkyard, which aren't stiff enough for a wagon. If I were going to do the swap I would cut the sedan springs down and add an aluminum spacer to get the correct ride height and spring rate, and get rear shocks that are valved properly for the increased rear weight (Bilstein will revalve their shocks cheaply). This would certainly be a lot cheaper and easier than replacing an engine- and would allow one to customize the spring and shock rate for the way they use their wagon. There's also a good chance that an aftermarket spring company somewhere makes the correct springs for this conversion. Other options that would work well are nivomat self contained leveling shocks, and air bags in the springs. I'm annoyed that people on here mostly parrot what Marshall said without understanding the context. Tyler ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Great car but it needs a motor
Or, rather than reinventing the wheel, just leave it like it was meant to be. I have not seen anyone parroting anything Marshall may have said without knowing what they were talking about. Have you owned/driven a wagon (or a LWB 126/140 etc) sedan with the properly working SLS? Have you driven one that has had the hack job done? I have. Big difference. tyler wrote: Well, were they done properly? There's no inherent reason why a wagon wouldn't handle fine with a regular rear suspension. I'd be willing to bet that most of these conversions use stock sedan springs/shocks from a junkyard, which aren't stiff enough for a wagon. If I were going to do the swap I would cut the sedan springs down and add an aluminum spacer to get the correct ride height and spring rate, and get rear shocks that are valved properly for the increased rear weight (Bilstein will revalve their shocks cheaply). This would certainly be a lot cheaper and easier than replacing an engine- and would allow one to customize the spring and shock rate for the way they use their wagon. There's also a good chance that an aftermarket spring company somewhere makes the correct springs for this conversion. Other options that would work well are nivomat self contained leveling shocks, and air bags in the springs. I'm annoyed that people on here mostly parrot what Marshall said without understanding the context. Tyler -- Kaleb C. Striplin/Claremore, OK 95 E300, 92 500SEL, 92 300SD, 92 300E 4Matic, 91 300D, 91 300E, 89 560SEL, 87 300SDL x2, 85 380SE 5.0 Euro, 85 190D, 84 190D, 84 300D euro manny, 81 240D, 80 240D, 76 240D, 76 300D, http://www.okiebenz.com -- next part -- Internal Virus Database is out of date. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.409 / Virus Database: 270.13.113/2400 - Release Date: 09/28/09 05:51:00 ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Great car but it needs a motor
I have done quite a few engine swaps, even put a v-8 in a body made for 6 cyl inline ONLY. That was an adventure. I have worked on everything from tractors to medium duty trucks, houses, commercial buildings concrete, etc. I do not presume to know more about suspension than the team of German-trained engineers (real engineers) that designed the 123 SLS system. tyler, have at it, but I sincerely hope you are never coming toward me with your frankenheap on an Icy curve with a bump on a rainy night. At 06:34 PM 10/9/2009, you wrote: *Ahem* I believe the term here is put up or shut up. If its so easy just take a long weekend at Andrew's and show us how awesome you can make his car. I'm sure he'd give you dinner... -Curt Date: Fri, 09 Oct 2009 15:48:30 -0700 From: tyler casi...@usermail.com Subject: Re: [MBZ] Great car but it needs a motor To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Message-ID: 4acfbdbe.4020...@usermail.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed It IS trivial to use a spring with the correct spring rate... Anyone that can do an engine swap, could do this much cheaper and easier. Tyler Peter T. Arnold wrote: GO for it! Redesign it. I'm sure that the effort would be trivial to a fellow like you. -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://okiebenz.com/pipermail/mercedes_okiebenz.com/attachments/20091009/cfb2e204/attachment.html ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com Loren Faeth ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Great car but it needs a motor
The problem is all of this has been tried many times before, it never works right. Loren Faeth wrote: I have done quite a few engine swaps, even put a v-8 in a body made for 6 cyl inline ONLY. That was an adventure. I have worked on everything from tractors to medium duty trucks, houses, commercial buildings concrete, etc. I do not presume to know more about suspension than the team of German-trained engineers (real engineers) that designed the 123 SLS system. tyler, have at it, but I sincerely hope you are never coming toward me with your frankenheap on an Icy curve with a bump on a rainy night. At 06:34 PM 10/9/2009, you wrote: *Ahem* I believe the term here is put up or shut up. If its so easy just take a long weekend at Andrew's and show us how awesome you can make his car. I'm sure he'd give you dinner... -Curt Date: Fri, 09 Oct 2009 15:48:30 -0700 From: tyler casi...@usermail.com Subject: Re: [MBZ] Great car but it needs a motor To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Message-ID: 4acfbdbe.4020...@usermail.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed It IS trivial to use a spring with the correct spring rate... Anyone that can do an engine swap, could do this much cheaper and easier. Tyler Peter T. Arnold wrote: GO for it! Redesign it. I'm sure that the effort would be trivial to a fellow like you. -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://okiebenz.com/pipermail/mercedes_okiebenz.com/attachments/20091009/cfb2e204/attachment.html ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com Loren Faeth ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com Internal Virus Database is out of date. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.409 / Virus Database: 270.13.113/2400 - Release Date: 09/28/09 05:51:00 -- Kaleb C. Striplin/Claremore, OK 95 E300, 92 500SEL, 92 300SD, 92 300E 4Matic, 91 300D, 91 300E, 89 560SEL, 87 300SDL x2, 85 380SE 5.0 Euro, 85 190D, 84 190D, 84 300D euro manny, 81 240D, 80 240D, 76 240D, 76 300D, http://www.okiebenz.com -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://okiebenz.com/pipermail/mercedes_okiebenz.com/attachments/20091009/67ef1c90/attachment.html -- next part -- Internal Virus Database is out of date. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.409 / Virus Database: 270.13.113/2400 - Release Date: 09/28/09 05:51:00 ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Great car but it needs a motor
Modifications aren't about knowing more than Mercedes or re-inventing the wheel- fitting a proper rate spring and damper to give you the handling you want isn't magic or rocket science- there are dozens of books about it and it's done properly on almost every car made, including the vast majority of W123s. The ONLY difference is that the wagon has more weight in the rear end and cargo capacity, requiring a different spring rate and dampener valve. How different? Look at the same engineering books as the magic mercedes engineers looked at, and calculate it the same way they did for the sedan. Why did they go to all of the extra trouble and expense of the hydraulic system then? Because it gives a smoother ride, and it's a good marketing gimmick- not because a spring is dangerous or less reliable. I for one prefer a stiffer ride and better handling than most car buyers, so it's reasonable for me to modify the suspension on my vehicles accordingly- and I do careful research and make conservative changes to ensure that the result is safe and reliable. There's nothing wrong with modifying a vehicle to suit your needs, if you know what you're doing and why you're doing it. It doesn't have to mean that you think the origional engineers were wrong to do what they did, or that you know more, just that the circumstances are extremely different. I have had excellent luck adding and removing features, and making minor changes to many different brands of car to allow them to work properly under the conditions I use them in, which are often somewhat different from those they were designed for. I don't, for example consider the fact that I prefer to add a loud audible alarm to my oil pressure and coolant level sensors an assault on the competence of the company who decided not to include one from the factory. Sincerely, Tyler On Oct 9, 2009, at 6:54 PM, Loren Faeth wrote: I have done quite a few engine swaps, even put a v-8 in a body made for 6 cyl inline ONLY. That was an adventure. I have worked on everything from tractors to medium duty trucks, houses, commercial buildings concrete, etc. I do not presume to know more about suspension than the team of German-trained engineers (real engineers) that designed the 123 SLS system. tyler, have at it, but I sincerely hope you are never coming toward me with your frankenheap on an Icy curve with a bump on a rainy night. At 06:34 PM 10/9/2009, you wrote: *Ahem* I believe the term here is put up or shut up. If its so easy just take a long weekend at Andrew's and show us how awesome you can make his car. I'm sure he'd give you dinner... -Curt Date: Fri, 09 Oct 2009 15:48:30 -0700 From: tyler casi...@usermail.com Subject: Re: [MBZ] Great car but it needs a motor To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Message-ID: 4acfbdbe.4020...@usermail.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed It IS trivial to use a spring with the correct spring rate... Anyone that can do an engine swap, could do this much cheaper and easier. Tyler Peter T. Arnold wrote: GO for it! Redesign it. I'm sure that the effort would be trivial to a fellow like you. -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://okiebenz.com/pipermail/mercedes_okiebenz.com/attachments/20091009/cfb2e204/attachment.html ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com Loren Faeth ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Great car but it needs a motor
PEOPLE! I have two wagons - one with its original SLS and the other a spring/shock conversion to go with a replacement non-300TD engine. You are welcome to test drive and compare. I have done this many times, however, and while I can state with certainty that the non-SLS 300TD is safe to drive, the correctly suspended (?) 300TD has a more comfortable, stable suspension and is there fore more fun to drive. On Fri, Oct 9, 2009 at 11:32 PM, Tyler casi...@usermail.com wrote: Modifications aren't about knowing more than Mercedes or re-inventing the wheel- fitting a proper rate spring and damper to give you the handling you want isn't magic or rocket science- there are dozens of books about it and it's done properly on almost every car made, including the vast majority of W123s. The ONLY difference is that the wagon has more weight in the rear end and cargo capacity, requiring a different spring rate and dampener valve. How different? Look at the same engineering books as the magic mercedes engineers looked at, and calculate it the same way they did for the sedan. Why did they go to all of the extra trouble and expense of the hydraulic system then? Because it gives a smoother ride, and it's a good marketing gimmick- not because a spring is dangerous or less reliable. I for one prefer a stiffer ride and better handling than most car buyers, so it's reasonable for me to modify the suspension on my vehicles accordingly- and I do careful research and make conservative changes to ensure that the result is safe and reliable. There's nothing wrong with modifying a vehicle to suit your needs, if you know what you're doing and why you're doing it. It doesn't have to mean that you think the origional engineers were wrong to do what they did, or that you know more, just that the circumstances are extremely different. I have had excellent luck adding and removing features, and making minor changes to many different brands of car to allow them to work properly under the conditions I use them in, which are often somewhat different from those they were designed for. I don't, for example consider the fact that I prefer to add a loud audible alarm to my oil pressure and coolant level sensors an assault on the competence of the company who decided not to include one from the factory. Sincerely, Tyler On Oct 9, 2009, at 6:54 PM, Loren Faeth wrote: I have done quite a few engine swaps, even put a v-8 in a body made for 6 cyl inline ONLY. That was an adventure. I have worked on everything from tractors to medium duty trucks, houses, commercial buildings concrete, etc. I do not presume to know more about suspension than the team of German-trained engineers (real engineers) that designed the 123 SLS system. tyler, have at it, but I sincerely hope you are never coming toward me with your frankenheap on an Icy curve with a bump on a rainy night. At 06:34 PM 10/9/2009, you wrote: *Ahem* I believe the term here is put up or shut up. If its so easy just take a long weekend at Andrew's and show us how awesome you can make his car. I'm sure he'd give you dinner... -Curt Date: Fri, 09 Oct 2009 15:48:30 -0700 From: tyler casi...@usermail.com Subject: Re: [MBZ] Great car but it needs a motor To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Message-ID: 4acfbdbe.4020...@usermail.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed It IS trivial to use a spring with the correct spring rate... Anyone that can do an engine swap, could do this much cheaper and easier. Tyler Peter T. Arnold wrote: GO for it! Redesign it. I'm sure that the effort would be trivial to a fellow like you. -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://okiebenz.com/pipermail/mercedes_okiebenz.com/attachments/20091009/cfb2e204/attachment.html ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com Loren Faeth ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://okiebenz.com/pipermail/mercedes_okiebenz.com/attachments/20091009/e77f088d/attachment.html ___ http://www.okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Great car but it needs a motor
There's another option that may be somewhat simpler: plumb in another belt-driven high-pressure pump instead of the stupid timing-chain-driven MB pump. At least some of the W124 wagons have a dual-pressure, belt-driven pump (124-460-15-80 Vickers) for steering/self-levelling. That could almost certainly be adapted to a W123... D. At 10:48 PM + 10/9/09, mercedes-requ...@okiebenz.com wrote: Message: 11 Date: Fri, 09 Oct 2009 15:13:22 -0700 From: tyler casi...@usermail.com Subject: Re: [MBZ] Great car but it needs a motor To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Well, were they done properly? There's no inherent reason why a wagon wouldn't handle fine with a regular rear suspension. I'd be willing to bet that most of these conversions use stock sedan springs/shocks from a junkyard, which aren't stiff enough for a wagon. If I were going to do the swap I would cut the sedan springs down and add an aluminum spacer to get the correct ride height and spring rate, and get rear shocks that are valved properly for the increased rear weight (Bilstein will revalve their shocks cheaply). This would certainly be a lot cheaper and easier than replacing an engine- and would allow one to customize the spring and shock rate for the way they use their wagon. There's also a good chance that an aftermarket spring company somewhere makes the correct springs for this conversion. Other options that would work well are nivomat self contained leveling shocks, and air bags in the springs. I'm annoyed that people on here mostly parrot what Marshall said without understanding the context. ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Great car but it needs a motor
Have you ever actually driven an SLS equipped MB wagon? I had an '81, the car was basically a disaster but in those few cases where everything was working right it was one of the nicest cars I've ever driven. Didn't matter the weight in the car, the back end would figure it out. It never wallowed or had excessive roll and its the only car I've ever driven that I felt I could drive over a railroad crossing at whatever damn speed I wanted, very responsive... I've considered many times that were I to go cross country an MB wagon would be the vehicle to take... -Curt Date: Wed, 7 Oct 2009 00:25:49 -0700 From: Tyler casi...@usermail.com Subject: Re: [MBZ] Great car but it needs a motor To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Message-ID: 82983431-2ddf-4e86-b1dc-f7ac4656b...@usermail.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed; delsp=yes Assuming you have the proper spring rate (not just sedan springs), and bilstein HD shocks that are valved properly for a wagon- Surely it would handle at least as good as a brand new self leveling system- and better if you made it a little stiffer (which would also eliminate the need for the leveling feature). I personally think the SLS is mostly a marketing gimmick- especially on a car that isn't designed for heavy duty towing. I guess it lets them get by with softer springs than they otherwise would need to prevent sag when loaded, which makes the ride softer- but certainly doesn't improve handling over a set of stiff regular springs. Sincerely, Tyler 1987 190D Turbo Biodiesel On Oct 6, 2009, at 5:17 PM, Kaleb C. Striplin wrote: We are talking about a wagon here, correct? Putting in regular springs in a wagon makes for better handling? I think not. The SLS when working properly handles VERY well. It is a very simple system, very little goes wrong. That think will never be right if you just put springs in it. tyler wrote: It sounds like a lot of work and expense to reinstall the self levelling system- I'd just keep the regular rear suspension myself. Simpler, more reliable, and better handling. If it sags in the rear when you load it up, just get stiffer springs or some spacers. I've used overload springs with stock height, but a 20% stiffer rate on my Volvo wagons that I do a lot of towing with. It handles a little better, and doesn't really sag at all when I load it up- but I didn't notice any reduction in the ride quality. Tyler -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://okiebenz.com/pipermail/mercedes_okiebenz.com/attachments/20091008/5f8dca5f/attachment.html ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Great car but it needs a motor
Agreed. We had an 84 TE, an 85 TD, 88 TE and the 87 TD. They are wonderful. I would love to have SLS in the 300SDLs. Maybe I should salvage all the SLS parts from the TD and figure out a way to put them on the SDL. I had to put almost everything to do with the SLS new on the 88TE. The ride is worth it. I hope some year that the powers at MBNA will deem us worthy to have a Diesel wagon again SOME YEAR!!! It has been 23 years! Anyone at MBNA listening ok, I didn't think so. At 06:45 PM 10/8/2009, you wrote: Have you ever actually driven an SLS equipped MB wagon? I had an '81, the car was basically a disaster but in those few cases where everything was working right it was one of the nicest cars I've ever driven. Didn't matter the weight in the car, the back end would figure it out. It never wallowed or had excessive roll and its the only car I've ever driven that I felt I could drive over a railroad crossing at whatever damn speed I wanted, very responsive... I've considered many times that were I to go cross country an MB wagon would be the vehicle to take... -Curt Date: Wed, 7 Oct 2009 00:25:49 -0700 From: Tyler casi...@usermail.com Subject: Re: [MBZ] Great car but it needs a motor To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Message-ID: 82983431-2ddf-4e86-b1dc-f7ac4656b...@usermail.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed; delsp=yes Assuming you have the proper spring rate (not just sedan springs), and bilstein HD shocks that are valved properly for a wagon- Surely it would handle at least as good as a brand new self leveling system- and better if you made it a little stiffer (which would also eliminate the need for the leveling feature). I personally think the SLS is mostly a marketing gimmick- especially on a car that isn't designed for heavy duty towing. I guess it lets them get by with softer springs than they otherwise would need to prevent sag when loaded, which makes the ride softer- but certainly doesn't improve handling over a set of stiff regular springs. Sincerely, Tyler 1987 190D Turbo Biodiesel On Oct 6, 2009, at 5:17 PM, Kaleb C. Striplin wrote: We are talking about a wagon here, correct? Putting in regular springs in a wagon makes for better handling? I think not. The SLS when working properly handles VERY well. It is a very simple system, very little goes wrong. That think will never be right if you just put springs in it. tyler wrote: It sounds like a lot of work and expense to reinstall the self levelling system- I'd just keep the regular rear suspension myself. Simpler, more reliable, and better handling. If it sags in the rear when you load it up, just get stiffer springs or some spacers. I've used overload springs with stock height, but a 20% stiffer rate on my Volvo wagons that I do a lot of towing with. It handles a little better, and doesn't really sag at all when I load it up- but I didn't notice any reduction in the ride quality. Tyler -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://okiebenz.com/pipermail/mercedes_okiebenz.com/attachments/20091008/5f8dca5f/attachment.html ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com Loren Faeth ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Great car but it needs a motor
I cant believe they never came out with a 2.5 turbo wagon, or the later 606 wagon, or a 606 turbo wagon in the 210 Loren Faeth wrote: Agreed. We had an 84 TE, an 85 TD, 88 TE and the 87 TD. They are wonderful. I would love to have SLS in the 300SDLs. Maybe I should salvage all the SLS parts from the TD and figure out a way to put them on the SDL. I had to put almost everything to do with the SLS new on the 88TE. The ride is worth it. I hope some year that the powers at MBNA will deem us worthy to have a Diesel wagon again SOME YEAR!!! It has been 23 years! Anyone at MBNA listening ok, I didn't think so. -- Kaleb C. Striplin/Claremore, OK 95 E300, 92 500SEL, 92 300SD, 92 300E 4Matic, 91 300D, 91 300E, 89 560SEL, 87 300SDL x2, 85 380SE 5.0 Euro, 85 190D, 84 190D, 84 300D euro manny, 81 240D, 80 240D, 76 240D, 76 300D, http://www.okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Great car but it needs a motor
They DID! they are ALL OVER the REST of the world! MBNA has deemed that we don't want them here. At 09:56 PM 10/8/2009, you wrote: I cant believe they never came out with a 2.5 turbo wagon, or the later 606 wagon, or a 606 turbo wagon in the 210 Loren Faeth wrote: Agreed. We had an 84 TE, an 85 TD, 88 TE and the 87 TD. They are wonderful. I would love to have SLS in the 300SDLs. Maybe I should salvage all the SLS parts from the TD and figure out a way to put them on the SDL. I had to put almost everything to do with the SLS new on the 88TE. The ride is worth it. I hope some year that the powers at MBNA will deem us worthy to have a Diesel wagon again SOME YEAR!!! It has been 23 years! Anyone at MBNA listening ok, I didn't think so. -- Kaleb C. Striplin/Claremore, OK 95 E300, 92 500SEL, 92 300SD, 92 300E 4Matic, 91 300D, 91 300E, 89 560SEL, 87 300SDL x2, 85 380SE 5.0 Euro, 85 190D, 84 190D, 84 300D euro manny, 81 240D, 80 240D, 76 240D, 76 300D, http://www.okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com Loren Faeth ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Great car but it needs a motor
Assuming you have the proper spring rate (not just sedan springs), and bilstein HD shocks that are valved properly for a wagon- Surely it would handle at least as good as a brand new self leveling system- and better if you made it a little stiffer (which would also eliminate the need for the leveling feature). I personally think the SLS is mostly a marketing gimmick- especially on a car that isn't designed for heavy duty towing. I guess it lets them get by with softer springs than they otherwise would need to prevent sag when loaded, which makes the ride softer- but certainly doesn't improve handling over a set of stiff regular springs. Sincerely, Tyler 1987 190D Turbo Biodiesel On Oct 6, 2009, at 5:17 PM, Kaleb C. Striplin wrote: We are talking about a wagon here, correct? Putting in regular springs in a wagon makes for better handling? I think not. The SLS when working properly handles VERY well. It is a very simple system, very little goes wrong. That think will never be right if you just put springs in it. tyler wrote: It sounds like a lot of work and expense to reinstall the self levelling system- I'd just keep the regular rear suspension myself. Simpler, more reliable, and better handling. If it sags in the rear when you load it up, just get stiffer springs or some spacers. I've used overload springs with stock height, but a 20% stiffer rate on my Volvo wagons that I do a lot of towing with. It handles a little better, and doesn't really sag at all when I load it up- but I didn't notice any reduction in the ride quality. Tyler ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Great car but it needs a motor
Do you have such a bastardized car? Almost every such car I've heard of was judged to be a very poor handling car compared to the original SLS. Max -Original Message- From: mercedes-boun...@okiebenz.com [mailto:mercedes-boun...@okiebenz.com] On Behalf Of Tyler Sent: Wednesday, October 07, 2009 3:26 AM To: Mercedes Discussion List Subject: Re: [MBZ] Great car but it needs a motor Assuming you have the proper spring rate (not just sedan springs), and bilstein HD shocks that are valved properly for a wagon- Surely it would handle at least as good as a brand new self leveling system- and better if you made it a little stiffer (which would also eliminate the need for the leveling feature). I personally think the SLS is mostly a marketing gimmick- especially on a car that isn't designed for heavy duty towing. I guess it lets them get by with softer springs than they otherwise would need to prevent sag when loaded, which makes the ride softer- but certainly doesn't improve handling over a set of stiff regular springs. Sincerely, Tyler 1987 190D Turbo Biodiesel On Oct 6, 2009, at 5:17 PM, Kaleb C. Striplin wrote: We are talking about a wagon here, correct? Putting in regular springs in a wagon makes for better handling? I think not. The SLS when working properly handles VERY well. It is a very simple system, very little goes wrong. That think will never be right if you just put springs in it. tyler wrote: It sounds like a lot of work and expense to reinstall the self levelling system- I'd just keep the regular rear suspension myself. Simpler, more reliable, and better handling. If it sags in the rear when you load it up, just get stiffer springs or some spacers. I've used overload springs with stock height, but a 20% stiffer rate on my Volvo wagons that I do a lot of towing with. It handles a little better, and doesn't really sag at all when I load it up- but I didn't notice any reduction in the ride quality. Tyler ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Great car but it needs a motor
Marshal always gave the admonishment that any backyard attempt to convert the rear suspension would result in a very expensive uncomfortable suspension. USUALLY IN CAPS -- Peter Arnold Windsor, CT - Original Message - From: Meade M CIV SPAWARSYSCEN-ATLANTIC Dillon, 53310 meade.m.dil...@navy.mil To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Sent: Wednesday, October 7, 2009 6:57:52 AM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern Subject: Re: [MBZ] Great car but it needs a motor Do you have such a bastardized car? Almost every such car I've heard of was judged to be a very poor handling car compared to the original SLS. Max -Original Message- From: mercedes-boun...@okiebenz.com [mailto:mercedes-boun...@okiebenz.com] On Behalf Of Tyler Sent: Wednesday, October 07, 2009 3:26 AM To: Mercedes Discussion List Subject: Re: [MBZ] Great car but it needs a motor Assuming you have the proper spring rate (not just sedan springs), and bilstein HD shocks that are valved properly for a wagon- Surely it would handle at least as good as a brand new self leveling system- and better if you made it a little stiffer (which would also eliminate the need for the leveling feature). I personally think the SLS is mostly a marketing gimmick- especially on a car that isn't designed for heavy duty towing. I guess it lets them get by with softer springs than they otherwise would need to prevent sag when loaded, which makes the ride softer- but certainly doesn't improve handling over a set of stiff regular springs. Sincerely, Tyler 1987 190D Turbo Biodiesel On Oct 6, 2009, at 5:17 PM, Kaleb C. Striplin wrote: We are talking about a wagon here, correct? Putting in regular springs in a wagon makes for better handling? I think not. The SLS when working properly handles VERY well. It is a very simple system, very little goes wrong. That think will never be right if you just put springs in it. tyler wrote: It sounds like a lot of work and expense to reinstall the self levelling system- I'd just keep the regular rear suspension myself. Simpler, more reliable, and better handling. If it sags in the rear when you load it up, just get stiffer springs or some spacers. I've used overload springs with stock height, but a 20% stiffer rate on my Volvo wagons that I do a lot of towing with. It handles a little better, and doesn't really sag at all when I load it up- but I didn't notice any reduction in the ride quality. Tyler ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://okiebenz.com/pipermail/mercedes_okiebenz.com/attachments/20091007/7cf0a594/attachment.html ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Great car but it needs a motor
Rich, have you contacted this guy yet? I've sent him an email but no response yet. Max -Original Message- From: mercedes-boun...@okiebenz.com [mailto:mercedes-boun...@okiebenz.com] On Behalf Of Rich Thomas Sent: Monday, October 05, 2009 8:11 AM To: Mercedes Discussion List Subject: [MBZ] Great car but it needs a motor http://charleston.craigslist.org/cto/1406417804.html Solid construction, incomparable fit and finish, constructed of high grade materials, it does not show the signs of aging that would be expected in a 25-year-old car. There is no shimmy or shake in the body, no out of character vibrations, and absolutely no rattles or squeaks from the interior. the Engine is bad . The interior and exterior finish is factory original in very good condition, no rust at all underneath. This car has been maintained regularly. We have replaced the alternator, starter, glow plugs fuel pump and brake pads. New battery on 2008. Less than 8,000 miles on all four tires. We have all maintenance and repair records less then 8000 on new transmission. Needs a motor. antenna motor. All other power options and accesories are in working condition. It has been having an intermittent problem with fuel injection. Driving and riding in this car is an exceptionally pleasurable experience. It averages 25-30 MPG. With a little TLC, you will enjoy many miles of happy motoring! -R ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Great car but it needs a motor
Uh, no. I have one foot in the grave already, if I even contacted someone about another old Benz I would be summarily executed and covered up, with no words said over my mortal remains. --R Dillon, Meade M CIV SPAWARSYSCEN-ATLANTIC, 53310 wrote: Rich, have you contacted this guy yet? I've sent him an email but no response yet. Max -Original Message- From: mercedes-boun...@okiebenz.com [mailto:mercedes-boun...@okiebenz.com] On Behalf Of Rich Thomas Sent: Monday, October 05, 2009 8:11 AM To: Mercedes Discussion List Subject: [MBZ] Great car but it needs a motor http://charleston.craigslist.org/cto/1406417804.html Solid construction, incomparable fit and finish, constructed of high grade materials, it does not show the signs of aging that would be expected in a 25-year-old car. There is no shimmy or shake in the body, no out of character vibrations, and absolutely no rattles or squeaks from the interior. the Engine is bad . The interior and exterior finish is factory original in very good condition, no rust at all underneath. This car has been maintained regularly. We have replaced the alternator, starter, glow plugs fuel pump and brake pads. New battery on 2008. Less than 8,000 miles on all four tires. We have all maintenance and repair records less then 8000 on new transmission. Needs a motor. antenna motor. All other power options and accesories are in working condition. It has been having an intermittent problem with fuel injection. Driving and riding in this car is an exceptionally pleasurable experience. It averages 25-30 MPG. With a little TLC, you will enjoy many miles of happy motoring! -R ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Great car but it needs a motor
So Rich, do we have a deal yet? Should I have my girl call your girl? On Wed, Oct 7, 2009 at 8:29 AM, Rich Thomas richthomas79td...@constructivity.net wrote: Uh, no. I have one foot in the grave already, if I even contacted someone about another old Benz I would be summarily executed and covered up, with no words said over my mortal remains. --R Dillon, Meade M CIV SPAWARSYSCEN-ATLANTIC, 53310 wrote: Rich, have you contacted this guy yet? I've sent him an email but no response yet. Max -Original Message- From: mercedes-boun...@okiebenz.com [mailto:mercedes-boun...@okiebenz.com] On Behalf Of Rich Thomas Sent: Monday, October 05, 2009 8:11 AM To: Mercedes Discussion List Subject: [MBZ] Great car but it needs a motor http://charleston.craigslist.org/cto/1406417804.html Solid construction, incomparable fit and finish, constructed of high grade materials, it does not show the signs of aging that would be expected in a 25-year-old car. There is no shimmy or shake in the body, no out of character vibrations, and absolutely no rattles or squeaks from the interior. the Engine is bad . The interior and exterior finish is factory original in very good condition, no rust at all underneath. This car has been maintained regularly. We have replaced the alternator, starter, glow plugs fuel pump and brake pads. New battery on 2008. Less than 8,000 miles on all four tires. We have all maintenance and repair records less then 8000 on new transmission. Needs a motor. antenna motor. All other power options and accesories are in working condition. It has been having an intermittent problem with fuel injection. Driving and riding in this car is an exceptionally pleasurable experience. It averages 25-30 MPG. With a little TLC, you will enjoy many miles of happy motoring! -R ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://okiebenz.com/pipermail/mercedes_okiebenz.com/attachments/20091007/f3facdb0/attachment.html ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Great car but it needs a motor
exactly. Dillon, Meade M CIV SPAWARSYSCEN-ATLANTIC, 53310 wrote: Do you have such a bastardized car? Almost every such car I've heard of was judged to be a very poor handling car compared to the original SLS. Max -Original Message- From: mercedes-boun...@okiebenz.com [mailto:mercedes-boun...@okiebenz.com] On Behalf Of Tyler Sent: Wednesday, October 07, 2009 3:26 AM To: Mercedes Discussion List Subject: Re: [MBZ] Great car but it needs a motor Assuming you have the proper spring rate (not just sedan springs), and bilstein HD shocks that are valved properly for a wagon- Surely it would handle at least as good as a brand new self leveling system- and better if you made it a little stiffer (which would also eliminate the need for the leveling feature). I personally think the SLS is mostly a marketing gimmick- especially on a car that isn't designed for heavy duty towing. I guess it lets them get by with softer springs than they otherwise would need to prevent sag when loaded, which makes the ride softer- but certainly doesn't improve handling over a set of stiff regular springs. Sincerely, Tyler 1987 190D Turbo Biodiesel On Oct 6, 2009, at 5:17 PM, Kaleb C. Striplin wrote: We are talking about a wagon here, correct? Putting in regular springs in a wagon makes for better handling? I think not. The SLS when working properly handles VERY well. It is a very simple system, very little goes wrong. That think will never be right if you just put springs in it. tyler wrote: It sounds like a lot of work and expense to reinstall the self levelling system- I'd just keep the regular rear suspension myself. Simpler, more reliable, and better handling. If it sags in the rear when you load it up, just get stiffer springs or some spacers. I've used overload springs with stock height, but a 20% stiffer rate on my Volvo wagons that I do a lot of towing with. It handles a little better, and doesn't really sag at all when I load it up- but I didn't notice any reduction in the ride quality. Tyler ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com -- Kaleb C. Striplin/Claremore, OK 95 E300, 92 500SEL, 92 300SD, 92 300E 4Matic, 91 300D, 91 300E, 89 560SEL, 87 300SDL x2, 85 380SE 5.0 Euro, 85 190D, 84 190D, 84 300D euro manny, 81 240D, 80 240D, 76 240D, 76 300D, http://www.okiebenz.com -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://okiebenz.com/pipermail/mercedes_okiebenz.com/attachments/20091007/9f2136ef/attachment.html -- next part -- Internal Virus Database is out of date. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.409 / Virus Database: 270.13.113/2400 - Release Date: 09/28/09 05:51:00 ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Great car but it needs a motor
Yep. BTW, I still have a running 1985 300D motor for sale FREE. The motor is in a running, driving 300TD. All you pay for is the removal cost (at an indy mechanic of my choosing in Rockville, MD). Happy motoring! On Mon, Oct 5, 2009 at 5:45 PM, Dwight E. Giles, Jr degco...@cox.netwrote: Happy Motoring'-Wasn't that the old Esso ad? I date myself. Dwight E. Giles, Jr. 1978 240D 4 speed. 218K + miles. 1990 300D 2.5t 170K miles. Wickford, RI -Original Message- From: mercedes-boun...@okiebenz.com [mailto:mercedes-boun...@okiebenz.com] On Behalf Of Bob Rentfro Sent: Monday, October 05, 2009 5:15 PM To: Mercedes Discussion List Subject: Re: [MBZ] Great car but it needs a motor Anyone who describes a car as able to give you happy motoring isn't hooked up right. Never have I thought, I'd really like to motor today...I long for an automobile that would afford me happy motoring... Bob R ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://okiebenz.com/pipermail/mercedes_okiebenz.com/attachments/20091006/657f3474/attachment.html ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Great car but it needs a motor
So if I came by with my engine hoist could I become your indy of choice? --R andrew strasfogel wrote: Yep. BTW, I still have a running 1985 300D motor for sale FREE. The motor is in a running, driving 300TD. All you pay for is the removal cost (at an indy mechanic of my choosing in Rockville, MD). Happy motoring! On Mon, Oct 5, 2009 at 5:45 PM, Dwight E. Giles, Jr degco...@cox.netwrote: Happy Motoring'-Wasn't that the old Esso ad? I date myself. Dwight E. Giles, Jr. 1978 240D 4 speed. 218K + miles. 1990 300D 2.5t 170K miles. Wickford, RI -Original Message- From: mercedes-boun...@okiebenz.com [mailto:mercedes-boun...@okiebenz.com] On Behalf Of Bob Rentfro Sent: Monday, October 05, 2009 5:15 PM To: Mercedes Discussion List Subject: Re: [MBZ] Great car but it needs a motor Anyone who describes a car as able to give you happy motoring isn't hooked up right. Never have I thought, I'd really like to motor today...I long for an automobile that would afford me happy motoring... Bob R ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://okiebenz.com/pipermail/mercedes_okiebenz.com/attachments/20091006/657f3474/attachment.html ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://okiebenz.com/pipermail/mercedes_okiebenz.com/attachments/20091006/2013b707/attachment.html ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Great car but it needs a motor
Yes, provided you also hooked up my replacement engine. On Tue, Oct 6, 2009 at 10:21 AM, Rich Thomas richthomas79td...@constructivity.net wrote: So if I came by with my engine hoist could I become your indy of choice? --R andrew strasfogel wrote: Yep. BTW, I still have a running 1985 300D motor for sale FREE. The motor is in a running, driving 300TD. All you pay for is the removal cost (at an indy mechanic of my choosing in Rockville, MD). Happy motoring! On Mon, Oct 5, 2009 at 5:45 PM, Dwight E. Giles, Jr degco...@cox.net wrote: Happy Motoring'-Wasn't that the old Esso ad? I date myself. Dwight E. Giles, Jr. 1978 240D 4 speed. 218K + miles. 1990 300D 2.5t 170K miles. Wickford, RI -Original Message- From: mercedes-boun...@okiebenz.com [mailto: mercedes-boun...@okiebenz.com] On Behalf Of Bob Rentfro Sent: Monday, October 05, 2009 5:15 PM To: Mercedes Discussion List Subject: Re: [MBZ] Great car but it needs a motor Anyone who describes a car as able to give you happy motoring isn't hooked up right. Never have I thought, I'd really like to motor today...I long for an automobile that would afford me happy motoring... Bob R ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://okiebenz.com/pipermail/mercedes_okiebenz.com/attachments/20091006/657f3474/attachment.html ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://okiebenz.com/pipermail/mercedes_okiebenz.com/attachments/20091006/2013b707/attachment.html ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://okiebenz.com/pipermail/mercedes_okiebenz.com/attachments/20091006/4efd0f4b/attachment.html ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Great car but it needs a motor
Hook it up to what? --R andrew strasfogel wrote: Yes, provided you also hooked up my replacement engine. On Tue, Oct 6, 2009 at 10:21 AM, Rich Thomas richthomas79td...@constructivity.net wrote: So if I came by with my engine hoist could I become your indy of choice? --R andrew strasfogel wrote: Yep. BTW, I still have a running 1985 300D motor for sale FREE. The motor is in a running, driving 300TD. All you pay for is the removal cost (at an indy mechanic of my choosing in Rockville, MD). Happy motoring! On Mon, Oct 5, 2009 at 5:45 PM, Dwight E. Giles, Jr degco...@cox.net wrote: ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Great car but it needs a motor
I am hoping to find a 300TD (wagon) motor to install so I can reconnect the self levelling system (SLS) on my wagon. Currently, the car is fitted with a perfectly adequate replacement 300D replacement engine from a non wagon. The PO disconnected the SLS (removed the hydraulic struts) and installed normal Bilstein shocks when he installed the current motor (which of course has no SLS pump). Idiot. Do you really need a turbodiesel engine, or are you messing with me? On Tue, Oct 6, 2009 at 10:49 AM, Rich Thomas richthomas79td...@constructivity.net wrote: Hook it up to what? --R andrew strasfogel wrote: Yes, provided you also hooked up my replacement engine. On Tue, Oct 6, 2009 at 10:21 AM, Rich Thomas richthomas79td...@constructivity.net wrote: So if I came by with my engine hoist could I become your indy of choice? --R andrew strasfogel wrote: Yep. BTW, I still have a running 1985 300D motor for sale FREE. The motor is in a running, driving 300TD. All you pay for is the removal cost (at an indy mechanic of my choosing in Rockville, MD). Happy motoring! On Mon, Oct 5, 2009 at 5:45 PM, Dwight E. Giles, Jr degco...@cox.net wrote: ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://okiebenz.com/pipermail/mercedes_okiebenz.com/attachments/20091006/2369eebf/attachment.html ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Great car but it needs a motor
yes --R andrew strasfogel wrote: Do you really need a turbodiesel engine, or are you messing with me? ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Great car but it needs a motor
Haha. If you mess around with me I will donate my engine to someone else. On Tue, Oct 6, 2009 at 6:07 PM, Rich Thomas richthomas79td...@constructivity.net wrote: yes --R andrew strasfogel wrote: Do you really need a turbodiesel engine, or are you messing with me? ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://okiebenz.com/pipermail/mercedes_okiebenz.com/attachments/20091006/e62d361b/attachment.html ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Great car but it needs a motor
It sounds like a lot of work and expense to reinstall the self levelling system- I'd just keep the regular rear suspension myself. Simpler, more reliable, and better handling. If it sags in the rear when you load it up, just get stiffer springs or some spacers. I've used overload springs with stock height, but a 20% stiffer rate on my Volvo wagons that I do a lot of towing with. It handles a little better, and doesn't really sag at all when I load it up- but I didn't notice any reduction in the ride quality. Tyler andrew strasfogel wrote: I am hoping to find a 300TD (wagon) motor to install so I can reconnect the self levelling system (SLS) on my wagon. Currently, the car is fitted with a perfectly adequate replacement 300D replacement engine from a non wagon. The PO disconnected the SLS (removed the hydraulic struts) and installed normal Bilstein shocks when he installed the current motor (which of course has no SLS pump). Idiot. Do you really need a turbodiesel engine, or are you messing with me? ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Great car but it needs a motor
We are talking about a wagon here, correct? Putting in regular springs in a wagon makes for better handling? I think not. The SLS when working properly handles VERY well. It is a very simple system, very little goes wrong. That think will never be right if you just put springs in it. tyler wrote: It sounds like a lot of work and expense to reinstall the self levelling system- I'd just keep the regular rear suspension myself. Simpler, more reliable, and better handling. If it sags in the rear when you load it up, just get stiffer springs or some spacers. I've used overload springs with stock height, but a 20% stiffer rate on my Volvo wagons that I do a lot of towing with. It handles a little better, and doesn't really sag at all when I load it up- but I didn't notice any reduction in the ride quality. Tyler andrew strasfogel wrote: I am hoping to find a 300TD (wagon) motor to install so I can reconnect the self levelling system (SLS) on my wagon. Currently, the car is fitted with a perfectly adequate replacement 300D replacement engine from a non wagon. The PO disconnected the SLS (removed the hydraulic struts) and installed normal Bilstein shocks when he installed the current motor (which of course has no SLS pump). Idiot. Do you really need a turbodiesel engine, or are you messing with me? ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com -- Kaleb C. Striplin/Claremore, OK 95 E300, 92 500SEL, 92 300SD, 92 300E 4Matic, 91 300D, 91 300E, 89 560SEL, 87 300SDL x2, 85 380SE 5.0 Euro, 85 190D, 84 190D, 84 300D euro manny, 81 240D, 80 240D, 76 240D, 76 300D, http://www.okiebenz.com -- next part -- Internal Virus Database is out of date. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.409 / Virus Database: 270.13.113/2400 - Release Date: 09/28/09 05:51:00 ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
[MBZ] Great car but it needs a motor
http://charleston.craigslist.org/cto/1406417804.html Solid construction, incomparable fit and finish, constructed of high grade materials, it does not show the signs of aging that would be expected in a 25-year-old car. There is no shimmy or shake in the body, no out of character vibrations, and absolutely no rattles or squeaks from the interior. the Engine is bad . The interior and exterior finish is factory original in very good condition, no rust at all underneath. This car has been maintained regularly. We have replaced the alternator, starter, glow plugs fuel pump and brake pads. New battery on 2008. Less than 8,000 miles on all four tires. We have all maintenance and repair records less then 8000 on new transmission. Needs a motor. antenna motor. All other power options and accesories are in working condition. It has been having an intermittent problem with fuel injection. Driving and riding in this car is an exceptionally pleasurable experience. It averages 25-30 MPG. With a little TLC, you will enjoy many miles of happy motoring! -R ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Great car but it needs a motor
Maybe *just* an antenna motor! On Mon, Oct 5, 2009 at 8:10 AM, Rich Thomas richthomas79td...@constructivity.net wrote: http://charleston.craigslist.org/cto/1406417804.html Solid construction, incomparable fit and finish, constructed of high grade materials, it does not show the signs of aging that would be expected in a 25-year-old car. There is no shimmy or shake in the body, no out of character vibrations, and absolutely no rattles or squeaks from the interior. the Engine is bad . The interior and exterior finish is factory original in very good condition, no rust at all underneath. This car has been maintained regularly. We have replaced the alternator, starter, glow plugs fuel pump and brake pads. New battery on 2008. Less than 8,000 miles on all four tires. We have all maintenance and repair records less then 8000 on new transmission. Needs a motor. antenna motor. All other power options and accesories are in working condition. It has been having an intermittent problem with fuel injection. Driving and riding in this car is an exceptionally pleasurable experience. It averages 25-30 MPG. With a little TLC, you will enjoy many miles of happy motoring! -R ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://okiebenz.com/pipermail/mercedes_okiebenz.com/attachments/20091005/3b440a3e/attachment.html ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Great car but it needs a motor
Anyone who describes a car as able to give you happy motoring isn't hooked up right. Never have I thought, I'd really like to motor today...I long for an automobile that would afford me happy motoring... Bob R On Mon, Oct 5, 2009 at 2:04 PM, andrew strasfogel astrasfo...@gmail.comwrote: Maybe *just* an antenna motor! On Mon, Oct 5, 2009 at 8:10 AM, Rich Thomas richthomas79td...@constructivity.net wrote: http://charleston.craigslist.org/cto/1406417804.html Solid construction, incomparable fit and finish, constructed of high grade materials, it does not show the signs of aging that would be expected in a 25-year-old car. There is no shimmy or shake in the body, no out of character vibrations, and absolutely no rattles or squeaks from the interior. the Engine is bad . The interior and exterior finish is factory original in very good condition, no rust at all underneath. This car has been maintained regularly. We have replaced the alternator, starter, glow plugs fuel pump and brake pads. New battery on 2008. Less than 8,000 miles on all four tires. We have all maintenance and repair records less then 8000 on new transmission. Needs a motor. antenna motor. All other power options and accesories are in working condition. It has been having an intermittent problem with fuel injection. Driving and riding in this car is an exceptionally pleasurable experience. It averages 25-30 MPG. With a little TLC, you will enjoy many miles of happy motoring! -R ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://okiebenz.com/pipermail/mercedes_okiebenz.com/attachments/20091005/3b440a3e/attachment.html ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://okiebenz.com/pipermail/mercedes_okiebenz.com/attachments/20091005/f76f9844/attachment.html ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Great car but it needs a motor
Happy Motoring'-Wasn't that the old Esso ad? I date myself. Dwight E. Giles, Jr. 1978 240D 4 speed. 218K + miles. 1990 300D 2.5t 170K miles. Wickford, RI -Original Message- From: mercedes-boun...@okiebenz.com [mailto:mercedes-boun...@okiebenz.com] On Behalf Of Bob Rentfro Sent: Monday, October 05, 2009 5:15 PM To: Mercedes Discussion List Subject: Re: [MBZ] Great car but it needs a motor Anyone who describes a car as able to give you happy motoring isn't hooked up right. Never have I thought, I'd really like to motor today...I long for an automobile that would afford me happy motoring... Bob R ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
