Re: [MBZ] OT power line ethernet

2013-08-30 Thread Fmiser
 Larry wrote:
 
  Is there any easy way to extend the rangeof my wifi  - I'
 like to use my laptop downstairs at times...

The easiest is a reflector for the antenna.

http://www.freeantennas.com/projects/Ez-10/

There are other, more effective ways - but they all cost a _lot_ more.

--   Philip

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Re: [MBZ] OT power line ethernet

2013-08-30 Thread Curt Raymond
Heh, if you had really high bandwidth stuff you'd be springing for 10Gb. 
Uncompressed HD video is around 150MB/s (thats mega BYTES).

Wednesday we installed another 32TB enclosure in the classroom with a new 10Gb 
switch. Slightly overkill for the typical home user ;)

-Curt

Date: Thu, 29 Aug 2013 22:42:42 -0400
From: Scott Ritchey ritche...@nc.rr.com
To: 'Mercedes Discussion List' mercedes@okiebenz.com
Subject: Re: [MBZ] OT power line ethernet
Message-ID: 3B51C08C203946E2A9EFD467AD7966FC@ScottHPPC
Content-Type: text/plain;    charset=us-ascii


This is what I did.  The wireless router is at one end of the house with an
access point (connected by Cat 5) is at the other end.  The really-high
bandwidth stuff (like 2 NAS units) is hard wired through a gigabit switch.
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Re: [MBZ] OT power line ethernet

2013-08-30 Thread OK Don
I wonder how you use a reflector with one of the new flat box WiFi MIMO
routers with no external antennas?
I'm thinking trial and error now --- a quarter wave length is about 1.2 --


On Thu, Aug 29, 2013 at 11:00 PM, Fmiser fmi...@gmail.com wrote:

 The easiest is a reflector for the antenna.

 http://www.freeantennas.com/projects/Ez-10/

 There are other, more effective ways - but they all cost a _lot_ more.

 --   Philip




-- 
OK Don
They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary
safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety. - Benjamin Franklin 1775
in this world nothing can be said to be certain, except death and taxes.
- Benjamin Franklin 1789
2013 F150, 19 mpg
2012 Passat TDI DSG, 45 mpg
1957 C182A, 12 mpg - but at 150 mph!
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Re: [MBZ] OT power line ethernet

2013-08-30 Thread Dan Penoff
Just hang a piece of foil up behind it...

Despite having internal antennas, most of these new encapsulated routers 
often have fittings for external antennas.

You might also see what is available in the way of antennas for the endpoint.  
I have gone that route with some success on desktop machines.

Dan

On Aug 30, 2013, at 7:54 PM, OK Don wrote:

 I wonder how you use a reflector with one of the new flat box WiFi MIMO
 routers with no external antennas?
 I'm thinking trial and error now --- a quarter wave length is about 1.2 --
 
 


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Re: [MBZ] OT power line ethernet

2013-08-30 Thread OK Don
Right, but you get interference patterns that cancel the signal in some
places, and boost it in others without properly placing the reflector -


On Fri, Aug 30, 2013 at 7:09 PM, Dan Penoff d...@penoff.com wrote:

 Just hang a piece of foil up behind it...

 Despite having internal antennas, most of these new encapsulated routers
 often have fittings for external antennas.

 You might also see what is available in the way of antennas for the
 endpoint.  I have gone that route with some success on desktop machines.

 Dan




-- 
OK Don
They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary
safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety. - Benjamin Franklin 1775
in this world nothing can be said to be certain, except death and taxes.
- Benjamin Franklin 1789
2013 F150, 19 mpg
2012 Passat TDI DSG, 45 mpg
1957 C182A, 12 mpg - but at 150 mph!
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Re: [MBZ] OT power line ethernet

2013-08-29 Thread Larry T

Thanks Scott -
Is there any easy way to extend the rangeof my wifi  - I' like to 
use my laptop downstairs at times...


LarryT

On 8/28/2013 5:06 PM, Scott Ritchey wrote:

A repeater will cut your effective bandwidth in half or worse.

-Original Message-
From: Mercedes [mailto:mercedes-boun...@okiebenz.com] On Behalf Of Larry T
Sent: Wednesday, August 28, 2013 1:39 PM
To: mercedes@okiebenz.com
Subject: Re: [MBZ] OT power line ethernet

speaking of the internet ;-)  I am considering a wifi repeater -- anyone
have good/bad recommendations?

Thanks
LarryT
91 300D

On 8/28/2013 10:02 AM, Craig wrote:

On Wed, 28 Aug 2013 08:16:44 -0400 Gerry Archer
arche...@embarqmail.com wrote:


If the circuits aren't listed, you can run a long wire (I've used a
series of extension cords) between the two distant receptacles and
check the voltage.  If the voltage is 110v it's the same leg; if the
voltage is 220v the receptacles are not on the same leg.

That should read,

If the circuits aren't listed, you can run a long wire (I've used a
series of extension cords) between the two distant receptacles. Then
measure the voltage between the two hot terminals. If the voltage is
zero, it's the same leg; if the voltage is 220 VAC, the receptacles are
not on the same leg.


Craig

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Re: [MBZ] OT power line ethernet

2013-08-29 Thread WILTON
How big is your estate?  Mine seems to work fine upstairs from downstairs, 
across house, out on terrace, etc.   ;)


Wilton

- Original Message - 
From: Larry T l02tur...@comcast.net

To: mercedes@okiebenz.com
Sent: Thursday, August 29, 2013 4:58 PM
Subject: Re: [MBZ] OT power line ethernet



Thanks Scott -
Is there any easy way to extend the rangeof my wifi  - I' like to use 
my laptop downstairs at times...


LarryT

On 8/28/2013 5:06 PM, Scott Ritchey wrote:

A repeater will cut your effective bandwidth in half or worse.

-Original Message-
From: Mercedes [mailto:mercedes-boun...@okiebenz.com] On Behalf Of Larry 
T

Sent: Wednesday, August 28, 2013 1:39 PM
To: mercedes@okiebenz.com
Subject: Re: [MBZ] OT power line ethernet

speaking of the internet ;-)  I am considering a wifi repeater -- anyone
have good/bad recommendations?

Thanks
LarryT
91 300D

On 8/28/2013 10:02 AM, Craig wrote:

On Wed, 28 Aug 2013 08:16:44 -0400 Gerry Archer
arche...@embarqmail.com wrote:


If the circuits aren't listed, you can run a long wire (I've used a
series of extension cords) between the two distant receptacles and
check the voltage.  If the voltage is 110v it's the same leg; if the
voltage is 220v the receptacles are not on the same leg.

That should read,

If the circuits aren't listed, you can run a long wire (I've used a
series of extension cords) between the two distant receptacles. Then
measure the voltage between the two hot terminals. If the voltage is
zero, it's the same leg; if the voltage is 220 VAC, the receptacles are
not on the same leg.


Craig

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Re: [MBZ] OT power line ethernet

2013-08-29 Thread Dan Penoff
You're better off trying an antenna than using a repeater or range extender, 
both of which will cause you to lose some bandwidth in the process.

Your access point will have some antennas attached to it that can be removed 
and a larger antenna or more directional antenna can be attached.

Dan

On Aug 29, 2013, at 4:58 PM, Larry T l02tur...@comcast.net wrote:

 Thanks Scott -
Is there any easy way to extend the rangeof my wifi  - I' like to use my 
 laptop downstairs at times...
 
 LarryT
 
 On 8/28/2013 5:06 PM, Scott Ritchey wrote:
 A repeater will cut your effective bandwidth in half or worse.
 
 -Original Message-
 From: Mercedes [mailto:mercedes-boun...@okiebenz.com] On Behalf Of Larry T
 Sent: Wednesday, August 28, 2013 1:39 PM
 To: mercedes@okiebenz.com
 Subject: Re: [MBZ] OT power line ethernet
 
 speaking of the internet ;-)  I am considering a wifi repeater -- anyone
 have good/bad recommendations?
 
 Thanks
 LarryT
 91 300D
 
 On 8/28/2013 10:02 AM, Craig wrote:
 On Wed, 28 Aug 2013 08:16:44 -0400 Gerry Archer
 arche...@embarqmail.com wrote:
 
 If the circuits aren't listed, you can run a long wire (I've used a
 series of extension cords) between the two distant receptacles and
 check the voltage.  If the voltage is 110v it's the same leg; if the
 voltage is 220v the receptacles are not on the same leg.
 That should read,
 
 If the circuits aren't listed, you can run a long wire (I've used a
 series of extension cords) between the two distant receptacles. Then
 measure the voltage between the two hot terminals. If the voltage is
 zero, it's the same leg; if the voltage is 220 VAC, the receptacles are
 not on the same leg.
 
 
 Craig
 
 ___
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Re: [MBZ] OT power line ethernet

2013-08-29 Thread OK Don
Can you run Cat 5 to the downstairs and install another WiFi box?


On Thu, Aug 29, 2013 at 3:58 PM, Larry T l02tur...@comcast.net wrote:

 Thanks Scott -
 Is there any easy way to extend the rangeof my wifi  - I' like to use
 my laptop downstairs at times...

 LarryT


 On 8/28/2013 5:06 PM, Scott Ritchey wrote:

 A repeater will cut your effective bandwidth in half or worse.

 -Original Message-
 From: Mercedes 
 [mailto:mercedes-bounces@**okiebenz.commercedes-boun...@okiebenz.com]
 On Behalf Of Larry T
 Sent: Wednesday, August 28, 2013 1:39 PM
 To: mercedes@okiebenz.com
 Subject: Re: [MBZ] OT power line ethernet

 speaking of the internet ;-)  I am considering a wifi repeater -- anyone
 have good/bad recommendations?

 Thanks
 LarryT
 91 300D

 On 8/28/2013 10:02 AM, Craig wrote:

 On Wed, 28 Aug 2013 08:16:44 -0400 Gerry Archer
 arche...@embarqmail.com wrote:

  If the circuits aren't listed, you can run a long wire (I've used a
 series of extension cords) between the two distant receptacles and
 check the voltage.  If the voltage is 110v it's the same leg; if the
 voltage is 220v the receptacles are not on the same leg.

 That should read,

 If the circuits aren't listed, you can run a long wire (I've used a
 series of extension cords) between the two distant receptacles. Then
 measure the voltage between the two hot terminals. If the voltage is
 zero, it's the same leg; if the voltage is 220 VAC, the receptacles are
 not on the same leg.


 Craig

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-- 
OK Don
They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary
safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety. - Benjamin Franklin 1775
in this world nothing can be said to be certain, except death and taxes.
- Benjamin Franklin 1789
2013 F150, 19 mpg
2012 Passat TDI DSG, 45 mpg
1957 C182A, 12 mpg - but at 150 mph!
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Re: [MBZ] OT power line ethernet

2013-08-29 Thread Scott Ritchey

This is what I did.  The wireless router is at one end of the house with an
access point (connected by Cat 5) is at the other end.  The really-high
bandwidth stuff (like 2 NAS units) is hard wired through a gigabit switch.

-Original Message-
From: Mercedes [mailto:mercedes-boun...@okiebenz.com] On Behalf Of OK Don
Sent: Thursday, August 29, 2013 7:44 PM
To: Mercedes Discussion List
Subject: Re: [MBZ] OT power line ethernet

Can you run Cat 5 to the downstairs and install another WiFi box?


On Thu, Aug 29, 2013 at 3:58 PM, Larry T l02tur...@comcast.net wrote:

 Thanks Scott -
 Is there any easy way to extend the rangeof my wifi  - I' like to use
 my laptop downstairs at times...

 LarryT


 On 8/28/2013 5:06 PM, Scott Ritchey wrote:

 A repeater will cut your effective bandwidth in half or worse.

 -Original Message-



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Re: [MBZ] OT power line ethernet

2013-08-29 Thread Jim Cathey

Is there any easy way to extend the rangeof my wifi


Move the AP so that it's more centrally located;
External higher-gain antenna.  Directional, if your
AP is on an edge or in a corner of your desired
service area.

-- Jim



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Re: [MBZ] OT power line ethernet

2013-08-28 Thread Dan Penoff
It's a simple Ethernet connection between two nodes. You could potentially 
connect multiple devices through it using a switch or hub.

Think of it this way: it is functionally equivalent to running an Ethernet 
cable between the two points where the devices are plugged in.

Dan

On Aug 27, 2013, at 7:18 PM, Kaleb C. Striplin ka...@striplin.net wrote:

 So on this discussion of this power line home ethernet deal, what I am 
 wanting to do is have a line from my upstairs office down to the main TV area 
 in the living room and have a router there to then connect the TV, sat box, 
 and DVD to it, in addition to having a wifi access point there.  So does 
 anybody know if this power line thing can serve the purpose of connecting the 
 router upstairs to the router downstairs?  So in other words multiple devices 
 would be coming thru that line.  Or is it strictly for extending the network 
 so 1 computer.
 
 ___
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Re: [MBZ] OT power line ethernet

2013-08-28 Thread Gerry Archer
FWIW:  Thinking back to an early version of this system, I seem to remember 
that if you don't have the plugin units on the same leg (most housewiring 
has a ground and two hot legs with 110v between the ground and each leg and 
220v between the two hot legs.)  the system won't work or works poorly.  If 
the power panel installer listed the circuits according to location, you 
might be able to figure out if the the receptacles you will use are on the 
same leg.  The legs are usually divided; one on the right of the cabinet and 
the other on the left, so it's easy to figure out if two circuits are on the 
same leg.
If the circuits aren't listed, you can run a long wire (I've used a series 
of extension cords) between the two distant receptacles and check the 
voltage.  If the voltage is 110v it's the same leg; if the voltage is 220v 
the receptacles are not on the same leg.

Hope my description isn't too confusing.
Gerry

On Aug 27, 2013, at 7:18 PM, Kaleb C. Striplin ka...@striplin.net 
wrote:
So on this discussion of this power line home ethernet deal, what I am 
wanting to do is have a line from my upstairs office down to the main TV 
area in the living room and have a router there to then connect the TV, 
sat box, and DVD to it, in addition to having a wifi access point there. 
So does anybody know if this power line thing can serve the purpose of 
connecting the router upstairs to the router downstairs?  So in other 
words multiple devices would be coming thru that line.  Or is it strictly 
for extending the network so 1 computer.



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Re: [MBZ] OT power line ethernet

2013-08-28 Thread Craig
On Wed, 28 Aug 2013 08:16:44 -0400 Gerry Archer
arche...@embarqmail.com wrote:

 If the circuits aren't listed, you can run a long wire (I've used a
 series of extension cords) between the two distant receptacles and
 check the voltage.  If the voltage is 110v it's the same leg; if the
 voltage is 220v the receptacles are not on the same leg.

That should read,

If the circuits aren't listed, you can run a long wire (I've used a
series of extension cords) between the two distant receptacles. Then
measure the voltage between the two hot terminals. If the voltage is
zero, it's the same leg; if the voltage is 220 VAC, the receptacles are
not on the same leg.


Craig

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Re: [MBZ] OT power line ethernet

2013-08-28 Thread Larry T
speaking of the internet ;-)  I am considering a wifi repeater -- anyone 
have good/bad recommendations?


Thanks
LarryT
91 300D

On 8/28/2013 10:02 AM, Craig wrote:

On Wed, 28 Aug 2013 08:16:44 -0400 Gerry Archer
arche...@embarqmail.com wrote:


If the circuits aren't listed, you can run a long wire (I've used a
series of extension cords) between the two distant receptacles and
check the voltage.  If the voltage is 110v it's the same leg; if the
voltage is 220v the receptacles are not on the same leg.

That should read,

If the circuits aren't listed, you can run a long wire (I've used a
series of extension cords) between the two distant receptacles. Then
measure the voltage between the two hot terminals. If the voltage is
zero, it's the same leg; if the voltage is 220 VAC, the receptacles are
not on the same leg.


Craig

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Re: [MBZ] OT power line ethernet

2013-08-28 Thread Fmiser
 Larry wrote:
 
 speaking of the internet ;-)  I am considering a wifi repeater --
 anyone have good/bad recommendations?

I have used a Zyxel.  Works okay.  I have also used a Buffalo
router which comes with DDWRT open-source firmware that could be
configured to do the same task.  

If I had the budget, I would get the Buffalo ($70 vs $50, if I
correctly recall).  I was rather impressed with the capability and
usability of the Buffalo.  Ah - I should mention I'm very familiar
with command line linux system administration which the Buffalo
supports (but does not require).

--   Philip

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Re: [MBZ] OT power line ethernet

2013-08-28 Thread Scott Ritchey

A repeater will cut your effective bandwidth in half or worse.

-Original Message-
From: Mercedes [mailto:mercedes-boun...@okiebenz.com] On Behalf Of Larry T
Sent: Wednesday, August 28, 2013 1:39 PM
To: mercedes@okiebenz.com
Subject: Re: [MBZ] OT power line ethernet

speaking of the internet ;-)  I am considering a wifi repeater -- anyone 
have good/bad recommendations?

Thanks
LarryT
91 300D

On 8/28/2013 10:02 AM, Craig wrote:
 On Wed, 28 Aug 2013 08:16:44 -0400 Gerry Archer
 arche...@embarqmail.com wrote:

 If the circuits aren't listed, you can run a long wire (I've used a
 series of extension cords) between the two distant receptacles and
 check the voltage.  If the voltage is 110v it's the same leg; if the
 voltage is 220v the receptacles are not on the same leg.
 That should read,

 If the circuits aren't listed, you can run a long wire (I've used a
 series of extension cords) between the two distant receptacles. Then
 measure the voltage between the two hot terminals. If the voltage is
 zero, it's the same leg; if the voltage is 220 VAC, the receptacles are
 not on the same leg.


 Craig

 ___
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[MBZ] OT power line ethernet

2013-08-27 Thread Kaleb C. Striplin
So on this discussion of this power line home ethernet deal, what 
I am wanting to do is have a line from my upstairs office down to 
the main TV area in the living room and have a router there to 
then connect the TV, sat box, and DVD to it, in addition to having 
a wifi access point there.  So does anybody know if this power 
line thing can serve the purpose of connecting the router upstairs 
to the router downstairs?  So in other words multiple devices 
would be coming thru that line.  Or is it strictly for extending 
the network so 1 computer.


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Re: [MBZ] OT power line ethernet

2013-08-27 Thread Craig
On Tue, 27 Aug 2013 18:00:41 -0500 Kaleb C. Striplin
ka...@striplin.net wrote:

 So does it run faster, slower, or the same as cat5?

Ordinary Cat-5 runs 100 megabits/second (Mbps -- note bits not bytes).
Most of the ones listed on Newegg say 200 Mbps; some say 500 Mbps.


On Tue, 27 Aug 2013 18:17:57 -0500 Kaleb C. Striplin
ka...@striplin.net wrote:


 So on this discussion of this power line home ethernet deal, what 
 I am wanting to do is have a line from my upstairs office down to 
 the main TV area in the living room and have a router there to 
 then connect the TV, sat box, and DVD to it, in addition to having 
 a wifi access point there.  So does anybody know if this power 
 line thing can serve the purpose of connecting the router upstairs 
 to the router downstairs?  So in other words multiple devices 
 would be coming thru that line.  Or is it strictly for extending 
 the network so 1 computer.

Anything you can stuff onto one Cat-5 cable you can put onto a
ethernet-over-powerline adapter. The individual devices put their traffic
on the cable simultaneously with different addresses; they don't care
what the transmission medium is.

So, yes, you can do what you want.


Craig

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Re: [MBZ] OT power line ethernet

2013-08-27 Thread Greg Fiorentino
I use one of the 100 mb/s units, and it works fine for browsing.  I would
suggest a faster one for streaming video.  It works just like a piece of
cable, so you can connect whatever to it (router, switch etc.)

Greg

-Original Message-
From: Mercedes [mailto:mercedes-boun...@okiebenz.com] On Behalf Of Kaleb C.
Striplin
Sent: Tuesday, August 27, 2013 4:18 PM
To: Mercedes Discussion List
Subject: [MBZ] OT power line ethernet

So on this discussion of this power line home ethernet deal, what I am
wanting to do is have a line from my upstairs office down to the main TV
area in the living room and have a router there to then connect the TV, sat
box, and DVD to it, in addition to having a wifi access point there.  So
does anybody know if this power line thing can serve the purpose of
connecting the router upstairs to the router downstairs?  So in other words
multiple devices would be coming thru that line.  Or is it strictly for
extending the network so 1 computer.

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Re: [MBZ] OT power line ethernet

2013-08-27 Thread Fmiser
 Kaleb wrote:
 
 So on this discussion of this power line home ethernet deal, what 
 I am wanting to do is have a line from my upstairs office down to 
 the main TV area in the living room and have a router there to 
 then connect the TV, sat box, and DVD to it, in addition to
 having a wifi access point there.  So does anybody know if this
 power line thing can serve the purpose of connecting the router
 upstairs to the router downstairs?  So in other words multiple
 devices would be coming thru that line.  Or is it strictly for
 extending the network so 1 computer.

Here is a $35 product from newegg.  It is rated for 200 Mbps, which
is the same as the old standard 100baseT fast ethernet.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16833704164

Prices go up from there.

Regarding the terminology.  A router is a device that function as
a gate keeper between two separate networks - like the internet
and your in-the-house local network.  It often has firewall
functions too.  

An ethernet switch is effectively a smart hub and for none
administrators just know that a switch is better than a hub -
but hubs are now hard to find.  This devise functions like a
telephone switchboard allowing all the devices plugged into it to
talk to each other.

A wifi access point is a device that links wifi and wired.

A very common device is a wifi router that is a combination of
router, ethernet switch, and wifi access point.

So - it seems you have a router in the office.  This is the gate
keeper between your house and the outside world.  It probably has 5
or so ethernet connections on it - 4 for inside, 1 for outside.
Maybe it has WIFI on it too.

For the living room to have internet access, you need to connect
the router.  If 
 * the office router has WIFI
 * the signal is strong enough
 * every living room device has WIFI

then you are all set.  If not, (you don't want to trust the WIFI
signal), then you will need more equipment.  

If the office has WIFI and it covers the living room well, then you
won't need another access point.  

If you have multiple devices in the living room, then you probably
need an ethernet switch.

To connect the living room to the office, you need a CAT5 (or
greater) cable - or equivalent.  If there is a practical cable
path, I would recommend CAT6 cable.  Otherwise, one of those
ethernet-over-power-wires could work.  Another option is a
backwards access point that will turn WIFI back into wired that
can be connected to the living room switch.

Attached is a quick sketch.

--Philip

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