Re: [MBZ] Struts
I noticed that Charlie Hart is a moderator, too. Haven't talked to him in some years. Dan On May 4, 2013, at 1:43 PM, Max wrote: Just the diesel forum. Dan Penoff d...@penoff.com wrote: Of what? The MBCA forums? Dan, banned for life from MBCA Sent from my iPad ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Struts
You are banned from the MBCA forum? Why? Sent from my iPhone On May 5, 2013, at 8:57 AM, Dan Penoff d...@penoff.com wrote: I noticed that Charlie Hart is a moderator, too. Haven't talked to him in some years. Dan On May 4, 2013, at 1:43 PM, Max wrote: Just the diesel forum. Dan Penoff d...@penoff.com wrote: Of what? The MBCA forums? Dan, banned for life from MBCA Sent from my iPad ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Struts/MBCA
No. I am banned for life from the MBCA. Long story that I am not going to get into here. In a nutshell, the MBCA in the late 1990s was very fragmented and run by a small group of people for their own per$onal benefit. Some of us challenged them and in the process were banned. I was one of a number. I have been invited to re-join since then, but I see no value in it - especially if I can use the forums for free. The STAR would be good for the bottom of a birdcage but I don't have a bird, not to mention newspaper is pretty much free. Dan banned and proud of it On May 5, 2013, at 9:56 AM, dsereta...@yahoo.com wrote: You are banned from the MBCA forum? Why? Sent from my iPhone On May 5, 2013, at 8:57 AM, Dan Penoff d...@penoff.com wrote: I noticed that Charlie Hart is a moderator, too. Haven't talked to him in some years. Dan ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Struts
He is not omit banned from the forum he is banned from mbca in general, as are a few other people I know. Sent from my iPhone On May 5, 2013, at 8:56 AM, dsereta...@yahoo.com wrote: You are banned from the MBCA forum? Why? Sent from my iPhone On May 5, 2013, at 8:57 AM, Dan Penoff d...@penoff.com wrote: I noticed that Charlie Hart is a moderator, too. Haven't talked to him in some years. Dan On May 4, 2013, at 1:43 PM, Max wrote: Just the diesel forum. Dan Penoff d...@penoff.com wrote: Of what? The MBCA forums? Dan, banned for life from MBCA Sent from my iPad ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Struts
I still have an MBCA license plate frame that has been tastefully altered that says MBCA across the top and Sucks across the bottom. The local chapter folks have seen it and think it's a hoot. Dan On May 5, 2013, at 10:37 AM, Kaleb C. Striplin wrote: He is not omit banned from the forum he is banned from mbca in general, as are a few other people I know. Sent from my iPhone ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Struts/MBCA
Ah yes...the good old days.I'm sure there has been an entire regime change out and list have been lost. You could join the forums as Martha. Bob R On May 5, 2013 7:33 AM, Dan Penoff d...@penoff.com wrote: No. I am banned for life from the MBCA. Long story that I am not going to get into here. In a nutshell, the MBCA in the late 1990s was very fragmented and run by a small group of people for their own per$onal benefit. Some of us challenged them and in the process were banned. I was one of a number. I have been invited to re-join since then, but I see no value in it - especially if I can use the forums for free. The STAR would be good for the bottom of a birdcage but I don't have a bird, not to mention newspaper is pretty much free. Dan banned and proud of it On May 5, 2013, at 9:56 AM, dsereta...@yahoo.com wrote: You are banned from the MBCA forum? Why? Sent from my iPhone On May 5, 2013, at 8:57 AM, Dan Penoff d...@penoff.com wrote: I noticed that Charlie Hart is a moderator, too. Haven't talked to him in some years. Dan ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Struts/MBCA
I have an area director that was in my corner the whole time, and he is willing to vouch for me whenever I would want to return. I am invited to all of the chapter events and have always been welcome. I just don't have the time nor the inclination. The whole tenor of the organization and the local chapter has changed, and in a way that doesn't appeal to me. Our chapter is definitely better than it was, for sure, but it's more late model youngsters and some of the legacy people, and a very small, if any, contingent of DIY sorts of folks. I've got plenty of opportunities for social gatherings within my own circles. Just because the people who attend own MBs isn't a qualifier. Dan On May 5, 2013, at 11:34 AM, Bob Rentfro wrote: Ah yes...the good old days.I'm sure there has been an entire regime change out and list have been lost. You could join the forums as Martha. Bob R On May 5, 2013 7:33 AM, Dan Penoff d...@penoff.com wrote: No. I am banned for life from the MBCA. Long story that I am not going to get into here. In a nutshell, the MBCA in the late 1990s was very fragmented and run by a small group of people for their own per$onal benefit. Some of us challenged them and in the process were banned. I was one of a number. I have been invited to re-join since then, but I see no value in it - especially if I can use the forums for free. The STAR would be good for the bottom of a birdcage but I don't have a bird, not to mention newspaper is pretty much free. Dan banned and proud of it On May 5, 2013, at 9:56 AM, dsereta...@yahoo.com wrote: You are banned from the MBCA forum? Why? Sent from my iPhone On May 5, 2013, at 8:57 AM, Dan Penoff d...@penoff.com wrote: I noticed that Charlie Hart is a moderator, too. Haven't talked to him in some years. Dan ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Struts
You are banned from the MBCA forum? Why? Sent from my iPhone He was too clean for 'em! ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Struts/MBCA
I have an area director that was in my corner the whole time, and he is willing to vouch for me whenever I would want to return. I am invited to all of the chapter events and have always been welcome. Ah, Yes, the Kathy Vs. the hoity toitys era. A sad time for MBCA. ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Struts
Marshall asked me, from his death bed, to take over the moderator reigns... Craig diese...@pisquared.net wrote: On Fri, 03 May 2013 22:13:05 -0400 Max meadedil...@bellsouth.net wrote: That's it. Hopefully the OP will agree to publishing in The Star. Maxbumpo Moderator Mount Pleasant, SC Interesting. Craig ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com -- Max Dillon Charleston, SC '95 E300, '87 300TD, '73 Balboa 20 ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Struts
Of what? The MBCA forums? Dan, banned for life from MBCA Sent from my iPad On May 4, 2013, at 6:15 AM, Max meadedil...@bellsouth.net wrote: Marshall asked me, from his death bed, to take over the moderator reigns... Craig diese...@pisquared.net wrote: On Fri, 03 May 2013 22:13:05 -0400 Max meadedil...@bellsouth.net wrote: That's it. Hopefully the OP will agree to publishing in The Star. Maxbumpo Moderator Mount Pleasant, SC Interesting. Craig ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com -- Max Dillon Charleston, SC '95 E300, '87 300TD, '73 Balboa 20 ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Struts
Metal line connect everything from the leveling valve to the struts. My struts definitely have rubber hoses going to them, it's almost exactly analogous to a brake system. The struts shift position as the suspension travels, so a hard line would be no good unless it had quite a coil wound into it. -- Jim ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Struts
Just the diesel forum. Dan Penoff d...@penoff.com wrote: Of what? The MBCA forums? Dan, banned for life from MBCA Sent from my iPad On May 4, 2013, at 6:15 AM, Max meadedil...@bellsouth.net wrote: Marshall asked me, from his death bed, to take over the moderator reigns... Craig diese...@pisquared.net wrote: On Fri, 03 May 2013 22:13:05 -0400 Max meadedil...@bellsouth.net wrote: That's it. Hopefully the OP will agree to publishing in The Star. Maxbumpo Moderator Mount Pleasant, SC Interesting. Craig ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com -- Max Dillon Charleston, SC '95 E300, '87 300TD, '73 Balboa 20 ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com -- Max Dillon Charleston, SC '95 E300, '87 300TD, '73 Balboa 20 ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Struts
Yeah I started thinking about that after I sent the message. It's been a while now since I did the work down there. Manfred Date: Sat, 4 May 2013 07:03:28 -0700 From: Jim Cathey j...@windwireless.net Subject: Re: [MBZ] Struts Metal line connect everything from the leveling valve to the struts. My struts definitely have rubber hoses going to them, it's almost exactly analogous to a brake system. The struts shift position as the suspension travels, so a hard line would be no good unless it had quite a coil wound into it. -- Jim ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
[MBZ] Struts
beginning to wonder whether the hydropneumatic struts themselves are the problem. They don't leak, but I am not getting any cushioning going over potholes and there is nothing else to blame. Any way to test their resiliency (if that's the word)? I rebuilt one of mine that was leaking, and there's not much in there. A piston with leak holes in it, with spring flaps over them. Hard to see how any kind of failure would make it _stiffer_. Springs fail by getting weaker, not stronger. -- Jim ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Struts
oh cr*ap. I wanted to buy some new toys. I am running out of options. On Fri, May 3, 2013 at 9:46 AM, Jim Cathey j...@windwireless.net wrote: beginning to wonder whether the hydropneumatic struts themselves are the problem. They don't leak, but I am not getting any cushioning going over potholes and there is nothing else to blame. Any way to test their resiliency (if that's the word)? I rebuilt one of mine that was leaking, and there's not much in there. A piston with leak holes in it, with spring flaps over them. Hard to see how any kind of failure would make it _stiffer_. Springs fail by getting weaker, not stronger. -- Jim __**_ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/**archive/http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/**mailman/listinfo/mercedes_**okiebenz.comhttp://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Struts
So you are saying they are rebuildable? I thought they were crimped shut. Tell us more... Dan On May 3, 2013, at 9:46 AM, Jim Cathey j...@windwireless.net wrote: beginning to wonder whether the hydropneumatic struts themselves are the problem. They don't leak, but I am not getting any cushioning going over potholes and there is nothing else to blame. Any way to test their resiliency (if that's the word)? I rebuilt one of mine that was leaking, and there's not much in there. A piston with leak holes in it, with spring flaps over them. Hard to see how any kind of failure would make it _stiffer_. Springs fail by getting weaker, not stronger. -- Jim ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Struts
The struts provide no spring action, because there is no energy storage medium inside (unless full of air, and it went in at atmospheric pressure and would be compressed to minuscule dimensions by the base pressure). The leak holes in the strut's interior piston provide the bulk of the damping, but some is provided by oil viscosity through the hose and into the accumulator. The coil springs support the bulk of the weight of the car, the strut's piston rod area (what goes through the seal) times the base pressure supports the rest of the weight, and as the system pressure rises due to oil being pumped into the accumulator by the strut, compressing _its_ stored nitrogen gas to higher pressures, the strut (like all springs) pushes back harder. The strut, however, in conjunction with the oil, is only a transmission, the force is all coming from the compressed nitrogen. If you have normal ride height and oil viscosity, and there are no abby-normal occlusions in the pipes, if you have extra-hard spring action it _has_ to be accumulator failure. There's just not enough there for it to be anything else. Going through my SEL the hard way was an education. The strut was made to be serviceable, though it is never done. Replacement only. The accumulator was not. If it were built more like the strut, with serviceable seals and a hard piston instead of a heavy rubber bladder, and a way to replenish the stored gas, the system would never need new parts except for seals. Small cheap parts, and a shot of nitrogen now and then from the bottle, with the suspension at full travel. Good as new. -- Jim ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Struts
another set of two NEW accumulators If one goes 'flat' that doubles the pressure in the other one, which will beat the crap out of it in no time. Hence equal pairs. -- Jim ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Struts
Jim, Thanks for the information - it is quite helpful! I have never had to RR a hydraulic strut, so I wasn't aware that they could be disassembled. Where did you source the parts for it? Thanks, Dan On May 3, 2013, at 11:51 AM, Jim Cathey j...@windwireless.net wrote: The struts provide no spring action, because there is no energy storage medium inside (unless full of air, and it went in at atmospheric pressure and would be compressed to minuscule dimensions by the base pressure). The leak holes in the strut's interior piston provide the bulk of the damping, but some is provided by oil viscosity through the hose and into the accumulator. The coil springs support the bulk of the weight of the car, the strut's piston rod area (what goes through the seal) times the base pressure supports the rest of the weight, and as the system pressure rises due to oil being pumped into the accumulator by the strut, compressing _its_ stored nitrogen gas to higher pressures, the strut (like all springs) pushes back harder. The strut, however, in conjunction with the oil, is only a transmission, the force is all coming from the compressed nitrogen. If you have normal ride height and oil viscosity, and there are no abby-normal occlusions in the pipes, if you have extra-hard spring action it _has_ to be accumulator failure. There's just not enough there for it to be anything else. Going through my SEL the hard way was an education. The strut was made to be serviceable, though it is never done. Replacement only. The accumulator was not. If it were built more like the strut, with serviceable seals and a hard piston instead of a heavy rubber bladder, and a way to replenish the stored gas, the system would never need new parts except for seals. Small cheap parts, and a shot of nitrogen now and then from the bottle, with the suspension at full travel. Good as new. -- Jim ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Struts
IIRC Jim rebuilt a 126 strut. Recently on the MBCA forum a fellow posted a terrific step-by-step with pictures to rebuild a 123 strut. Dan Penoff d...@penoff.com wrote: Jim, Thanks for the information - it is quite helpful! I have never had to RR a hydraulic strut, so I wasn't aware that they could be disassembled. Where did you source the parts for it? Thanks, Dan On May 3, 2013, at 11:51 AM, Jim Cathey j...@windwireless.net wrote: The struts provide no spring action, because there is no energy storage medium inside (unless full of air, and it went in at atmospheric pressure and would be compressed to minuscule dimensions by the base pressure). The leak holes in the strut's interior piston provide the bulk of the damping, but some is provided by oil viscosity through the hose and into the accumulator. The coil springs support the bulk of the weight of the car, the strut's piston rod area (what goes through the seal) times the base pressure supports the rest of the weight, and as the system pressure rises due to oil being pumped into the accumulator by the strut, compressing _its_ stored nitrogen gas to higher pressures, the strut (like all springs) pushes back harder. The strut, however, in conjunction with the oil, is only a transmission, the force is all coming from the compressed nitrogen. If you have normal ride height and oil viscosity, and there are no abby-normal occlusions in the pipes, if you have extra-hard spring action it _has_ to be accumulator failure. There's just not enough there for it to be anything else. Going through my SEL the hard way was an education. The strut was made to be serviceable, though it is never done. Replacement only. The accumulator was not. If it were built more like the strut, with serviceable seals and a hard piston instead of a heavy rubber bladder, and a way to replenish the stored gas, the system would never need new parts except for seals. Small cheap parts, and a shot of nitrogen now and then from the bottle, with the suspension at full travel. Good as new. -- Jim ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com -- Max Dillon Charleston, SC '95 E300, '87 300TD, '73 Balboa 20 ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Struts
Where? I just looked in the W123 section and there is a guy who mentioned doing it but the thread hasn't been added to since. Link?? Dan On May 3, 2013, at 5:37 PM, Max wrote: IIRC Jim rebuilt a 126 strut. Recently on the MBCA forum a fellow posted a terrific step-by-step with pictures to rebuild a 123 strut. Dan Penoff d...@penoff.com wrote: Jim, Thanks for the information - it is quite helpful! I have never had to RR a hydraulic strut, so I wasn't aware that they could be disassembled. Where did you source the parts for it? Thanks, Dan On May 3, 2013, at 11:51 AM, Jim Cathey j...@windwireless.net wrote: ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Struts
Found it: http://www.mbca.org/forum/2012-09-07/84-300td-rear-struts#comment-7223080 Dan On May 3, 2013, at 5:37 PM, Max wrote: IIRC Jim rebuilt a 126 strut. Recently on the MBCA forum a fellow posted a terrific step-by-step with pictures to rebuild a 123 strut. ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Struts
That's it. Hopefully the OP will agree to publishing in The Star. Dan Penoff d...@penoff.com wrote: Found it: http://www.mbca.org/forum/2012-09-07/84-300td-rear-struts#comment-7223080 Dan On May 3, 2013, at 5:37 PM, Max wrote: IIRC Jim rebuilt a 126 strut. Recently on the MBCA forum a fellow posted a terrific step-by-step with pictures to rebuild a 123 strut. ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com -- Max Dillon Charleston, SC '95 E300, '87 300TD, '73 Balboa 20 ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Struts
Just saying. Back in the day the Star had a lot of articles for DIY owners. Not so much these days. Maybe it's just a sign of the times as there is so little owners can do on the more recent (post 124 chassis) models. Scott -Original Message- From: Mercedes [mailto:mercedes-boun...@okiebenz.com] On Behalf Of Max Sent: Friday, May 03, 2013 10:13 PM To: Mercedes Discussion List Subject: Re: [MBZ] Struts That's it. Hopefully the OP will agree to publishing in The Star. Dan Penoff d...@penoff.com wrote: Found it: http://www.mbca.org/forum/2012-09-07/84-300td-rear-struts#comment-7223080 Dan On May 3, 2013, at 5:37 PM, Max wrote: IIRC Jim rebuilt a 126 strut. Recently on the MBCA forum a fellow posted a terrific step-by-step with pictures to rebuild a 123 strut. ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com -- Max Dillon Charleston, SC '95 E300, '87 300TD, '73 Balboa 20 ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Struts
On Fri, 03 May 2013 22:13:05 -0400 Max meadedil...@bellsouth.net wrote: That's it. Hopefully the OP will agree to publishing in The Star. Maxbumpo Moderator Mount Pleasant, SC Interesting. Craig ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Struts
A fellow on the MBCA forums did a write up of how to do a rebuild. Expected head shaking by MBUSA folks about how you can not rebuild them clay On May 3, 2013, at 6:46 AM, Jim Cathey wrote: beginning to wonder whether the hydropneumatic struts themselves are the problem. They don't leak, but I am not getting any cushioning going over potholes and there is nothing else to blame. Any way to test their resiliency (if that's the word)? I rebuilt one of mine that was leaking, and there's not much in there. A piston with leak holes in it, with spring flaps over them. Hard to see how any kind of failure would make it _stiffer_. Springs fail by getting weaker, not stronger. -- Jim ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Struts
I wasn't aware that they could be disassembled. Mine did. Where did you source the parts for it? Local hydraulics supply. Had to take disassembled parts in, they measured 'em and pulled replacements off the shelf. So you are saying they are rebuildable? Mine was. I thought they were crimped shut. Mine was not, snap ring. No guarantees about yours. See: http://userweb.windwireless.net/~jimc/SELlog.html#13Dec2010 -- Jim ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Struts?
'Drove along behind a Lincoln Navigator for few blocks 30 minutes ago; 'must have had springs, shocks, etc., lashed/bolted down firmly - 'noticed every ripple in the street amplified in up/down movement of the vehicle. Wilton - Original Message - From: Dieselhead 126die...@gmail.com To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Sent: Tuesday, May 01, 2012 11:40 PM Subject: Re: [MBZ] Struts? Can't say for sure on a 201, but i did that many times on 124s. So for once in my life I finally diagnosed something rather than just throwing parts at it. The '84 190D darts which I believe I've complained about before. It'll rapidly want to shift right or left while going straight. In turns its tight and composed. I hoisted each corner in turn and wiggled each wheel side/side, up/down and lifted from below with a hardwood 2x4. In side/side I could detect a small amount of movement. In looking at it it would appear the strut will actually twist slightly, nothing else in the steering moves noticeably at that point. Looks to me like I need struts which isn't a huge surprise, one rear shock was dying, the other was missing completely. I'd asked about this before and somebody said I could get the springs out with a floorjack if I was careful, am I remembering that correctly? Thanks -Curt ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Struts?
I *think* I did the wheel bearings last year, maybe 15k ago. I finally got a dial indicator and seem to have figured out how to use it adequately. I can't feel any play in the bearing itself. How would I diagnose the upper strut mount? It looks and feels solid. Fred and I drove a car with a bad one a couple years ago and it was terrible. To replace it you just pull the nut on the end of the upper mount, pull the rubber and replace? Rusty has Febi for $44 apiece. On a 185k mile car it seems like I should go with Febi. -Curt Date: Mon, 30 Apr 2012 18:58:49 -0500 From: Peter Frederick psf...@earthlink.net To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Subject: Re: [MBZ] Struts? Message-ID: 280df520-14d0-45e5-8058-dd914cae8...@earthlink.net Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed More likely to be the upper strut mount that the strut unless they are really sloppy and loose. When the rubber separates in the upper mount, the steering knuckle can move sideways, changing the tracking. Also check the ball joints and boots -- if the boots are torn, replace the ball joints. Verify that the wheel bearings are good and properly adjusted. If there is any play in the tie rod ends, replace tie rods, drag link, and stabilizer. The latter is most important, as the lack of dampening is usually what kills the tie rod ends. I'm on my third one so far, expect to find bad or loose wheel bearings and bad strut mounts, although bad strut mounts lead to a swooping sensation while turning. Wheel bearings are often OK under side pressure, but let the wheels wander with no side load. Peter On Apr 30, 2012, at 6:51 PM, Curt Raymond wrote: I love Kaleb's ability, or willingness I guess, to read a message and respond with a short, to the point diagnosis. He's wrong, but its short and to the point with no weasel words. ;) Links are about 1 year old. Everything in the rear end is nice and tight, I know what shot rear links feel like and its a distinctly rear end breaking loose kind of feeling. This is a front end darting kind of feeling. -Curt ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Struts?
When you say boots you mean bellows thats what Rusty's site has anyway. Theres also dust sleeve which is a weird looking split ring of some sort. -Curt Date: Tue, 01 May 2012 12:17:56 -0400 From: Max meadedil...@bellsouth.net To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Subject: Re: [MBZ] Fwd: Re: Struts? anuvuhab Message-ID: a69e7157-3157-4090-9bbc-9bbbfd295...@email.android.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Curt Raymond curtlud...@yahoo.com wrote: Do I need anything else with them? Theres lots of other bits listed on Rusty's site. Boots, strut mounts, maybe anti-lock brake wire cradles. -- Max Dillon Charleston SC '95 E300, '87 300TD ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Struts?
Can't say for sure on a 201, but i did that many times on 124s. So for once in my life I finally diagnosed something rather than just throwing parts at it. The '84 190D darts which I believe I've complained about before. It'll rapidly want to shift right or left while going straight. In turns its tight and composed. I hoisted each corner in turn and wiggled each wheel side/side, up/down and lifted from below with a hardwood 2x4. In side/side I could detect a small amount of movement. In looking at it it would appear the strut will actually twist slightly, nothing else in the steering moves noticeably at that point. Looks to me like I need struts which isn't a huge surprise, one rear shock was dying, the other was missing completely. I'd asked about this before and somebody said I could get the springs out with a floorjack if I was careful, am I remembering that correctly? Thanks -Curt ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
[MBZ] Struts?
So for once in my life I finally diagnosed something rather than just throwing parts at it. The '84 190D darts which I believe I've complained about before. It'll rapidly want to shift right or left while going straight. In turns its tight and composed. I hoisted each corner in turn and wiggled each wheel side/side, up/down and lifted from below with a hardwood 2x4. In side/side I could detect a small amount of movement. In looking at it it would appear the strut will actually twist slightly, nothing else in the steering moves noticeably at that point. Looks to me like I need struts which isn't a huge surprise, one rear shock was dying, the other was missing completely. I'd asked about this before and somebody said I could get the springs out with a floorjack if I was careful, am I remembering that correctly? Thanks -Curt ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Struts?
Curt. Rear suspension/springs can be removed with a jack, carefully, as per Jim's instructions. My 190D would lurch to the right at every shift but behave in corners, loose rear links. Used one from Bent and new lower control arm bushings from Rusty, (bought for the olde 190E) and it now is as it should be. Had to buy brake backing plates as mine were all rusted out in the center. All Hail Rusty! Fred Moir Lynn MA Diesel preferred. From: Curt Raymond curtlud...@yahoo.com To: Diesel List mercedes@okiebenz.com Sent: Monday, April 30, 2012 9:40 AM Subject: [MBZ] Struts? So for once in my life I finally diagnosed something rather than just throwing parts at it. The '84 190D darts which I believe I've complained about before. It'll rapidly want to shift right or left while going straight. In turns its tight and composed. I hoisted each corner in turn and wiggled each wheel side/side, up/down and lifted from below with a hardwood 2x4. In side/side I could detect a small amount of movement. In looking at it it would appear the strut will actually twist slightly, nothing else in the steering moves noticeably at that point. Looks to me like I need struts which isn't a huge surprise, one rear shock was dying, the other was missing completely. I'd asked about this before and somebody said I could get the springs out with a floorjack if I was careful, am I remembering that correctly? Thanks -Curt ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Struts?
I should have added the list of replacement parts: Rear links (all of 'em) Tires subframe mounts (all 4) rear shocks Tie rods I was going to do the center link and idler arm but can't detect any movement in those at all. The only place I can see any untoward movement at all is in the front struts, they'll twist just slightly which seems to match in nicely to what I feel when driving, it feels like the front wheels are not well attached to the steering. -Curt Date: Mon, 30 Apr 2012 07:49:56 -0700 (PDT) From: Frederick Moir fredy4.s...@yahoo.com To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Subject: Re: [MBZ] Struts? Message-ID: 1335797396.25059.yahoomail...@web125006.mail.ne1.yahoo.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Curt. Rear suspension/springs can be removed with a jack, carefully, as per Jim's instructions. My 190D would lurch to the right at every shift but behave in corners, loose rear links. Used one from Bent and new lower control arm bushings from Rusty, (bought for the olde 190E) and it now is as it should be. Had to buy brake backing plates as mine were all rusted out in the center. All Hail Rusty! Fred Moir Lynn MA Diesel preferred. From: Curt Raymond curtlud...@yahoo.com To: Diesel List mercedes@okiebenz.com Sent: Monday, April 30, 2012 9:40 AM Subject: [MBZ] Struts? So for once in my life I finally diagnosed something rather than just throwing parts at it. The '84 190D darts which I believe I've complained about before. It'll rapidly want to shift right or left while going straight. In turns its tight and composed. I hoisted each corner in turn and wiggled each wheel side/side, up/down and lifted from below with a hardwood 2x4. In side/side I could detect a small amount of movement. In looking at it it would appear the strut will actually twist slightly, nothing else in the steering moves noticeably at that point. Looks to me like I need struts which isn't a huge surprise, one rear shock was dying, the other was missing completely. I'd asked about this before and somebody said I could get the springs out with a floorjack if I was careful, am I remembering that correctly? Thanks -Curt ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Struts?
You don't need to touch the spring. Pull the most suspect strut, test in accordance with manual (compress a required distance on a bathroom scale, measure amount of force required to compress). -- Max Dillon Charleston SC '95 E300, '87 300TD ___ ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Struts?
The rub is that I don't want to pull the stupid thing twice... Could the shock still have reasonable damping ability but allow the wheel to twist? -Curt Date: Mon, 30 Apr 2012 13:00:18 -0400 From: Max meadedil...@bellsouth.net To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Subject: Re: [MBZ] Struts? Message-ID: d198b238-b8dd-45af-aff8-901942894...@email.android.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 You don't need to touch the spring. Pull the most suspect strut, test in accordance with manual (compress a required distance on a bathroom scale, measure amount of force required to compress). -- Max Dillon Charleston SC '95 E300, '87 300TD ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Struts?
your rear links are shot. On 4/30/2012 8:40 AM, Curt Raymond wrote: So for once in my life I finally diagnosed something rather than just throwing parts at it. The '84 190D darts which I believe I've complained about before. It'll rapidly want to shift right or left while going straight. In turns its tight and composed. I hoisted each corner in turn and wiggled each wheel side/side, up/down and lifted from below with a hardwood 2x4. In side/side I could detect a small amount of movement. In looking at it it would appear the strut will actually twist slightly, nothing else in the steering moves noticeably at that point. Looks to me like I need struts which isn't a huge surprise, one rear shock was dying, the other was missing completely. I'd asked about this before and somebody said I could get the springs out with a floorjack if I was careful, am I remembering that correctly? Thanks -Curt ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com - No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 2012.0.1913 / Virus Database: 2411/4964 - Release Date: 04/28/12 ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Struts?
I love Kaleb's ability, or willingness I guess, to read a message and respond with a short, to the point diagnosis. He's wrong, but its short and to the point with no weasel words. ;) Links are about 1 year old. Everything in the rear end is nice and tight, I know what shot rear links feel like and its a distinctly rear end breaking loose kind of feeling. This is a front end darting kind of feeling. -Curt Date: Mon, 30 Apr 2012 16:42:45 -0500 From: Kaleb C. Striplin ka...@striplin.net To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Subject: Re: [MBZ] Struts? Message-ID: assp.9467eed3f5.4f9f0755.9090...@striplin.net Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed your rear links are shot. On 4/30/2012 8:40 AM, Curt Raymond wrote: So for once in my life I finally diagnosed something rather than just throwing parts at it. The '84 190D darts which I believe I've complained about before. It'll rapidly want to shift right or left while going straight. In turns its tight and composed. I hoisted each corner in turn and wiggled each wheel side/side, up/down and lifted from below with a hardwood 2x4. In side/side I could detect a small amount of movement. In looking at it it would appear the strut will actually twist slightly, nothing else in the steering moves noticeably at that point. Looks to me like I need struts which isn't a huge surprise, one rear shock was dying, the other was missing completely. I'd asked about this before and somebody said I could get the springs out with a floorjack if I was careful, am I remembering that correctly? Thanks -Curt ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Struts?
More likely to be the upper strut mount that the strut unless they are really sloppy and loose. When the rubber separates in the upper mount, the steering knuckle can move sideways, changing the tracking. Also check the ball joints and boots -- if the boots are torn, replace the ball joints. Verify that the wheel bearings are good and properly adjusted. If there is any play in the tie rod ends, replace tie rods, drag link, and stabilizer. The latter is most important, as the lack of dampening is usually what kills the tie rod ends. I'm on my third one so far, expect to find bad or loose wheel bearings and bad strut mounts, although bad strut mounts lead to a swooping sensation while turning. Wheel bearings are often OK under side pressure, but let the wheels wander with no side load. Peter On Apr 30, 2012, at 6:51 PM, Curt Raymond wrote: I love Kaleb's ability, or willingness I guess, to read a message and respond with a short, to the point diagnosis. He's wrong, but its short and to the point with no weasel words. ;) Links are about 1 year old. Everything in the rear end is nice and tight, I know what shot rear links feel like and its a distinctly rear end breaking loose kind of feeling. This is a front end darting kind of feeling. -Curt Date: Mon, 30 Apr 2012 16:42:45 -0500 From: Kaleb C. Striplin ka...@striplin.net To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Subject: Re: [MBZ] Struts? Message-ID: assp.9467eed3f5.4f9f0755.9090...@striplin.net Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed your rear links are shot. On 4/30/2012 8:40 AM, Curt Raymond wrote: So for once in my life I finally diagnosed something rather than just throwing parts at it. The '84 190D darts which I believe I've complained about before. It'll rapidly want to shift right or left while going straight. In turns its tight and composed. I hoisted each corner in turn and wiggled each wheel side/side, up/ down and lifted from below with a hardwood 2x4. In side/side I could detect a small amount of movement. In looking at it it would appear the strut will actually twist slightly, nothing else in the steering moves noticeably at that point. Looks to me like I need struts which isn't a huge surprise, one rear shock was dying, the other was missing completely. I'd asked about this before and somebody said I could get the springs out with a floorjack if I was careful, am I remembering that correctly? Thanks -Curt ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
