Re: [MBZ] '83 300SD unreliable fuel delivery

2006-01-31 Thread Marshall Booth

Luther Gulseth wrote:

My SD has it's moments of fuel pressure loss.  You can be crusing down the 
interstate and suddenly feel a power loss that lasts less than 1/2 
second...something exactly like taking your foot off and back on the throttle.  
Also, at cold start it's very rough and needs to have enough throttle to keep 
at least 800-900 RPM to run somewhat smooth and not die.  Glow plugs are barely 
2 years old and the injector pump and injectors were replaced by the P/O (maybe 
50kmi ago).  I've replaced all the rubber fuel line from tank to primer in the 
last 8 months.
I'm thinking from my experience in the semi-diesel world that I have a lift pump that's 
weak.  I read 07.1-145 Checking fuel pump and bypass valve and it seems that 
the bypass valve can get clogged and needs to be cleaned and the spring lengthened to 
increase tension.  Is there anyone else that has had an issue similar to this where 
cleaning the bypass valve fixed the issue or did they have to replace the fuel pump?

(btw fuel, primer,  lift...they all mean the same thing in the big diesel 
world)

TIA all,




The lift pump almost never fails (and the engine will still usually 
run if the fuel level is above 1/2)!! Look at the tank screen, the 
inline filter, the main filter or a plugged VENT line. A plugged vent 
line is the thing that most often causes the symptoms you describe in a 
Mercedes diesel (vacuum develops and prevents unrestricted fuel flow).


Marshall
--
  Marshall Booth (who doesn't respond to unsigned questions)
  der Dieseling Doktor [EMAIL PROTECTED]
'87 300TD 182Kmi, '84 190D 2.2 229Kmi, '85 190D 2.0 161Kmi, '87 190D 2.5 
turbo 237kmi




Re: [MBZ] '83 300SD unreliable fuel delivery

2006-01-31 Thread John Ervine

UDG - Joop Schmeitz wrote:

W116 runs 3.5 6cyl Dsl 


Come now, you can't post a sig like that without an explanation...

--
John L. Ervine
1981 240D 4-spd 268+kmi
1980 300TD 170+kmi
1980 300SD 277+kmi
1977 280S 4-spd 80+kmi



Re: [MBZ] '83 300SD unreliable fuel delivery

2006-01-31 Thread JFreezn
 
In a message dated 1/30/2006 11:48:28 A.M. US Mountain Standard Time,  
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

My SD  has it's moments of fuel pressure loss.  You can be crusing down the  
interstate and suddenly feel a power loss that lasts less than 1/2  
second...something exactly like taking your foot off and back on the  throttle. 
 Also, 
at cold start it's very rough and needs to have enough  throttle to keep at 
least 800-900 RPM to run somewhat smooth and not  die.  Glow plugs are barely 2 
years old and the injector pump and  injectors were replaced by the P/O (maybe 
50kmi ago).  I've replaced all  the rubber fuel line from tank to primer in 
the last 8 months.
I'm thinking  from my experience in the semi-diesel world that I have a lift 
pump that's  weak.  I read 07.1-145 Checking fuel pump and bypass valve and 
it seems  that the bypass valve can get clogged and needs to be cleaned and 
the spring  lengthened to increase tension.  Is there anyone else that has had 
an  issue similar to this where cleaning the bypass valve fixed the issue or 
did  they have to replace the fuel pump?



Luther,
 
Don't overlook the possibility that it is the boost protection switch,  
mounted on the intake manifold.  These will go bad and cut fuel just as you  
describe but at only 6 or 7 psi instead of 14-15 psi.   When the  switch closes 
it 
interrupts the pressure signal to the ALDA and the engine gets  fuel, the 
equivalent of an unblown car, which feels fairly anemic 
 
You can pull the wire from the switch to see if your problem goes  away.  Or 
you can remove it and rig a test connection with your mitevac or  air 
compressor.  Or a remote possibility is the turbo unloader valve  is failing 
and the 
pressure is excessive.  
 
Good luck,   

Jim  Friesen
Phoenix AZ
79 300SD, 262 K miles 
98 ML 320, 140 K  miles



Re: [MBZ] '83 300SD unreliable fuel delivery

2006-01-31 Thread Luther Gulseth
I might drive it up on ramps on that side.

~
~I cleaned the screen on my SD without making a mess. Run the tank down to
~reserve and jack the right side up as high as possible, best with a
~floorjack. The fuel will be at one side of the tank, leaving the hole where
~the screen is dry. Takes the same socket as the fuel sender (47mm or
~1-7/8).
~
~
~--
~Hans Neureiter, Houston, TX
~'82 300SD, '95 E300D
~___
~http://www.striplin.net
~For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/
~For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED]
~
~To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
~http://striplin.net/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_striplin.net



-- 
Luther   KB5QHU
Alma, Ark
'83 300SD (230,xxx kmi) 
'82 300CD (158,222 kmi)
'90 300E  '82 300D (parts or run?)



Re: [MBZ] '83 300SD unreliable fuel delivery

2006-01-31 Thread Kaleb C. Striplin
yep, you are exactly right, its going to either be that or the tank 
screen is plugging up.  I am leaning more toward the overload valve 
since the problem goes at goes.  If the screen was plugging up it would 
seem to me it would get worse and worse and finally not run at all 
rather than it only doing it every once in a while.


[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 
In a message dated 1/30/2006 11:48:28 A.M. US Mountain Standard Time,  
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:


My SD  has it's moments of fuel pressure loss.  You can be crusing down the  
interstate and suddenly feel a power loss that lasts less than 1/2  
second...something exactly like taking your foot off and back on the  throttle.  Also, 
at cold start it's very rough and needs to have enough  throttle to keep at 
least 800-900 RPM to run somewhat smooth and not  die.  Glow plugs are barely 2 
years old and the injector pump and  injectors were replaced by the P/O (maybe 
50kmi ago).  I've replaced all  the rubber fuel line from tank to primer in 
the last 8 months.
I'm thinking  from my experience in the semi-diesel world that I have a lift 
pump that's  weak.  I read 07.1-145 Checking fuel pump and bypass valve and 
it seems  that the bypass valve can get clogged and needs to be cleaned and 
the spring  lengthened to increase tension.  Is there anyone else that has had 
an  issue similar to this where cleaning the bypass valve fixed the issue or 
did  they have to replace the fuel pump?




Luther,
 
Don't overlook the possibility that it is the boost protection switch,  
mounted on the intake manifold.  These will go bad and cut fuel just as you  
describe but at only 6 or 7 psi instead of 14-15 psi.   When the  switch closes it 
interrupts the pressure signal to the ALDA and the engine gets  fuel, the 
equivalent of an unblown car, which feels fairly anemic 
 
You can pull the wire from the switch to see if your problem goes  away.  Or 
you can remove it and rig a test connection with your mitevac or  air 
compressor.  Or a remote possibility is the turbo unloader valve  is failing and the 
pressure is excessive.  
 
Good luck,   


Jim  Friesen
Phoenix AZ
79 300SD, 262 K miles 
98 ML 320, 140 K  miles


___
http://www.striplin.net
For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/
For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED]

To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
http://striplin.net/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_striplin.net





--
Kaleb C. Striplin/Claremore, OK
 89 560SEL, 87 300SDL, 85 380SE, 85 300D,
 84 250 LWB, 83 300TD, 81 300TD, 81 240D, 81 240D,
 76 450SEL, 76 240D, 76 300D, 74 240D, 69 250
http://www.striplin.net



Re: [MBZ] '83 300SD unreliable fuel delivery

2006-01-31 Thread Luther Gulseth
Overload valve is disconnected and by-passed.

~
~yep, you are exactly right, its going to either be that or the tank 
~screen is plugging up.  I am leaning more toward the overload valve 
~since the problem goes at goes.  If the screen was plugging up it would 
~seem to me it would get worse and worse and finally not run at all 
~rather than it only doing it every once in a while.
~



-- 
Luther   KB5QHU
Alma, Ark
'83 300SD (230,xxx kmi) 
'82 300CD (158,222 kmi)
'90 300E  '82 300D (parts or run?)



Re: [MBZ] '83 300SD unreliable fuel delivery

2006-01-31 Thread Hans Neureiter
I doubt the overload valve would be intermittent.
Tank vent is easy to check, just don't tighten the filler cap.


On 1/31/06, Luther Gulseth [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 Overload valve is disconnected and by-passed.

 ~
 ~yep, you are exactly right, its going to either be that or the tank
 ~screen is plugging up.  I am leaning more toward the overload valve
 ~since the problem goes at goes.  If the screen was plugging up it would
 ~seem to me it would get worse and worse and finally not run at all
 ~rather than it only doing it every once in a while.
 ~



 --
 Luther   KB5QHU
 Alma, Ark
 '83 300SD (230,xxx kmi)
 '82 300CD (158,222 kmi)
 '90 300E  '82 300D (parts or run?)

 ___
 http://www.striplin.net
 For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/
 For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED]

 To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
 http://striplin.net/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_striplin.net




--
Hans Neureiter, Houston, TX
'82 300SD, '95 E300D


Re: [MBZ] '83 300SD unreliable fuel delivery

2006-01-31 Thread Craig McCluskey
On Tue, 31 Jan 2006 09:56:12 -0500 Luther Gulseth [EMAIL PROTECTED]
wrote:

 Overload valve is disconnected and by-passed.

Overload valve? What's that?


Craig



Re: [MBZ] '83 300SD unreliable fuel delivery

2006-01-31 Thread Marshall Booth

[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 
In a message dated 1/30/2006 11:48:28 A.M. US Mountain Standard Time,  
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:


My SD  has it's moments of fuel pressure loss.  You can be crusing down the  
interstate and suddenly feel a power loss that lasts less than 1/2  
second...something exactly like taking your foot off and back on the  throttle.  Also, 
at cold start it's very rough and needs to have enough  throttle to keep at 
least 800-900 RPM to run somewhat smooth and not  die.  Glow plugs are barely 2 
years old and the injector pump and  injectors were replaced by the P/O (maybe 
50kmi ago).  I've replaced all  the rubber fuel line from tank to primer in 
the last 8 months.
I'm thinking  from my experience in the semi-diesel world that I have a lift 
pump that's  weak.  I read 07.1-145 Checking fuel pump and bypass valve and 
it seems  that the bypass valve can get clogged and needs to be cleaned and 
the spring  lengthened to increase tension.  Is there anyone else that has had 
an  issue similar to this where cleaning the bypass valve fixed the issue or 
did  they have to replace the fuel pump?




Luther,
 
Don't overlook the possibility that it is the boost protection switch,  
mounted on the intake manifold.  These will go bad and cut fuel just as you  
describe but at only 6 or 7 psi instead of 14-15 psi.   When the  switch closes it 
interrupts the pressure signal to the ALDA and the engine gets  fuel, the 
equivalent of an unblown car, which feels fairly anemic 
 
You can pull the wire from the switch to see if your problem goes  away.  Or 
you can remove it and rig a test connection with your mitevac or  air 
compressor.  Or a remote possibility is the turbo unloader valve  is failing and the 
pressure is excessive.  


Unlike when the wastegate opens to limit further boost and power, when 
the overboost switch activates, power instantly drops about 30% (but the 
engine should NOT stall - there should be sufficient fuel to allow the 
engine to run at about 70% of full power). Check this by disconnecting 
the electric line to the switchover valve of bypass the pressure line 
thru the switchover valve (directly from the intake manifold to the 
ALDA). Vacuum in the tank can choke off fuel/power and may even cause 
the engine to stall, but simply opening (and then reclosing) the gas cap 
and letting air rush in, restores fuel flow (at least for many miles). 
This tends to happen unpredictably but usually only after you've been 
driving for a while.


Marshall
--
  Marshall Booth (who doesn't respond to unsigned questions)
  der Dieseling Doktor [EMAIL PROTECTED]
'87 300TD 182Kmi, '84 190D 2.2 229Kmi, '85 190D 2.0 161Kmi, '87 190D 2.5 
turbo 237kmi




Re: [MBZ] '83 300SD unreliable fuel delivery

2006-01-31 Thread Marshall Booth

Craig McCluskey wrote:

On Tue, 31 Jan 2006 09:56:12 -0500 Luther Gulseth [EMAIL PROTECTED]
wrote:


Overload valve is disconnected and by-passed.


Overload valve? What's that?


The switchover valve that's operated by the overboost pressure switch on 
the intake manifold!


Marshall
--
  Marshall Booth (who doesn't respond to unsigned questions)
  der Dieseling Doktor [EMAIL PROTECTED]
'87 300TD 182Kmi, '84 190D 2.2 229Kmi, '85 190D 2.0 161Kmi, '87 190D 2.5 
turbo 237kmi




Re: [MBZ] '83 300SD unreliable fuel delivery

2006-01-31 Thread R A Bennell
Is there a gasket, seal, o ring or something similar on the screen assembly
that should be replaced when this is removed? Obviously, if so, it is a good
plan to have it available before pulling the plug out.

Randy B in Winnipeg

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Hans Neureiter
Sent: Monday, January 30, 2006 4:41 PM
To: Mercedes Discussion List
Subject: Re: [MBZ] '83 300SD unreliable fuel delivery


I cleaned the screen on my SD without making a mess. Run the tank down to
reserve and jack the right side up as high as possible, best with a
floorjack. The fuel will be at one side of the tank, leaving the hole where
the screen is dry. Takes the same socket as the fuel sender (47mm or
1-7/8).

On 1/30/06, Luther Gulseth [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 it has been ongoing for several months.  I will get the tanks as low as
 possible and check the tank screen.

 I'm getting the idea that lift pumps don't have many problems in the 617
 engines.

 ~
 ~
 ~On Monday, January 30, 2006, at 02:55 PM, Luther Gulseth wrote:
 ~
 ~  I've never had a quality issue with their fuel.
 ~
 ~   There's a first time for everything.
 ~
 ~Johnny B.
 ~I Mac Therefore I am



 --
 Luther   KB5QHU
 Alma, Ark
 '83 300SD (230,xxx kmi)
 '82 300CD (158,222 kmi)
 '90 300E  '82 300D (parts or run?)

 ___
 http://www.striplin.net
 For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/
 For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED]

 To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
 http://striplin.net/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_striplin.net




--
Hans Neureiter, Houston, TX
'82 300SD, '95 E300D
___
http://www.striplin.net
For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/
For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED]

To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
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Re: [MBZ] '83 300SD unreliable fuel delivery

2006-01-30 Thread John Berryman


On Monday, January 30, 2006, at 01:47 PM, Luther Gulseth wrote:



My SD has it's moments of fuel pressure loss.  You can be crusing down 
the interstate and suddenly feel a power loss that lasts less than 1/2 
second...something exactly like taking your foot off and back on the 
throttle.  Also, at cold start it's very rough and needs to have 
enough throttle to keep at least 800-900 RPM to run somewhat smooth 
and not die.  Glow plugs are barely 2 years old and the injector pump 
and injectors were replaced by the P/O (maybe 50kmi ago).  I've 
replaced all the rubber fuel line from tank to primer in the last 8 
months.
I'm thinking from my experience in the semi-diesel world that I have a 
lift pump that's weak.  I read 07.1-145 Checking fuel pump and bypass 
valve and it seems that the bypass valve can get clogged and needs to 
be cleaned and the spring lengthened to increase tension.  Is there 
anyone else that has had an issue similar to this where cleaning the 
bypass valve fixed the issue or did they have to replace the fuel  pump?


(btw fuel, primer,  lift...they all mean the same thing in the big 
diesel world)


TIA all,



	Have you checked/cleaned/changed the primary filter? They can and do 
clog and I'm sure you know the car will run as you described. The 
secondary (spin-on) filter can clog too but is less likely to.
	Silly question: Could you be low on fuel? I've had some lying fuel 
gauges cause me to run low. How about water in the fuel? It happens.


Johnny B.
I Mac Therefore I am


Re: [MBZ] '83 300SD unreliable fuel delivery

2006-01-30 Thread Jim Cathey
I'm thinking from my experience in the semi-diesel world that I have a 
lift pump that's weak.


The hand-operated primer pump can start to leak air.  Try using it,
if it oozes fuel at all it's a bad sign.

-- Jim




Re: [MBZ] '83 300SD unreliable fuel delivery

2006-01-30 Thread Luther Gulseth
Fuel filters were changed after a Diesel Purge at the last valve adjust in 
early November.  Problem happens with a full or empty tank of fuel.  Primer 
pump might be a year old now and is the new style.  I don't know about water in 
the fuel, I might purchase some addative and give that a try.  I've always 
fueled at the same location (unless on a road trip, then always at FlyingJ) 
with both the CD and SD and my parents fill their '85D up at the same location. 
 I've never had a quality issue with their fuel.

~
~
~On Monday, January 30, 2006, at 01:47 PM, Luther Gulseth wrote:
~
~
~
~   Have you checked/cleaned/changed the primary filter? They can and do 
~clog and I'm sure you know the car will run as you described. The 
~secondary (spin-on) filter can clog too but is less likely to.
~   Silly question: Could you be low on fuel? I've had some lying fuel 
~gauges cause me to run low. How about water in the fuel? It happens.
~
~Johnny B.
~I Mac Therefore I am



-- 
Luther   KB5QHU
Alma, Ark
'83 300SD (230,xxx kmi) 
'82 300CD (158,222 kmi)
'90 300E  '82 300D (parts or run?)



Re: [MBZ] '83 300SD unreliable fuel delivery

2006-01-30 Thread B Dike
Luther,
   
  My cars will exhibit precisely those symptoms when I get a bad batch of bio, 
or if temps go below cloud point.
   
  Thanks,
   
  Bruce

Luther Gulseth [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
  My SD has it's moments of fuel pressure loss. You can be crusing down the 
interstate and suddenly feel a power loss that lasts less than 1/2 
second...something exactly like taking your foot off and back on the throttle. 
Also, at cold start it's very rough and needs to have enough throttle to keep 
at least 800-900 RPM to run somewhat smooth and not die. Glow plugs are barely 
2 years old and the injector pump and injectors were replaced by the P/O (maybe 
50kmi ago). I've replaced all the rubber fuel line from tank to primer in the 
last 8 months.
I'm thinking from my experience in the semi-diesel world that I have a lift 
pump that's weak. I read 07.1-145 Checking fuel pump and bypass valve and it 
seems that the bypass valve can get clogged and needs to be cleaned and the 
spring lengthened to increase tension. Is there anyone else that has had an 
issue similar to this where cleaning the bypass valve fixed the issue or did 
they have to replace the fuel pump?

(btw fuel, primer,  lift...they all mean the same thing in the big diesel 
world)

TIA all,


-- 
Luther KB5QHU
Alma, Ark
'83 300SD (230,xxx kmi) 
'82 300CD (158,222 kmi)
'90 300E  '82 300D (parts or run?)

___
http://www.striplin.net
For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/
For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED]

To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
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Bruce
82 300CD 334kmi 'His'
85 300CD 240kmi 'Hers'
75 240D 202kmi 'Donner'
77 240D 204kmi 'Blitzen'

-
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On Monday, January 30, 2006, at 02:55 PM, Luther Gulseth wrote:

  I've never had a quality issue with their fuel.

There's a first time for everything.

Johnny B.
I Mac Therefore I am


Re: [MBZ] '83 300SD unreliable fuel delivery

2006-01-30 Thread UDG - Joop Schmeitz
95% of all fuel problems are caused because of dirt in the tank.

Empty your tank as much as possible (use hose or pump dsl out)
Go under your car, remove primary filter (this is the filter in the tank)

Have a look it will be dirty all over, clean it and the problem will be
solved.

Joopster
W116 runs 3.5 6cyl Dsl 

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
On Behalf Of John Berryman
Sent: 30 January, 2006 9:36 PM
To: Mercedes Discussion List
Subject: Re: [MBZ] '83 300SD unreliable fuel delivery


On Monday, January 30, 2006, at 02:55 PM, Luther Gulseth wrote:

  I've never had a quality issue with their fuel.

There's a first time for everything.

Johnny B.
I Mac Therefore I am
___
http://www.striplin.net
For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used
parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED]

To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
http://striplin.net/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_striplin.net






Re: [MBZ] '83 300SD unreliable fuel delivery

2006-01-30 Thread Luther Gulseth
it has been ongoing for several months.  I will get the tanks as low as 
possible and check the tank screen.

I'm getting the idea that lift pumps don't have many problems in the 617 
engines.

~
~
~On Monday, January 30, 2006, at 02:55 PM, Luther Gulseth wrote:
~
~  I've never had a quality issue with their fuel.
~
~   There's a first time for everything.
~
~Johnny B.
~I Mac Therefore I am



-- 
Luther   KB5QHU
Alma, Ark
'83 300SD (230,xxx kmi) 
'82 300CD (158,222 kmi)
'90 300E  '82 300D (parts or run?)



Re: [MBZ] '83 300SD unreliable fuel delivery

2006-01-30 Thread Kaleb C. Striplin

the screen in your tank is getting plugged up.

Luther Gulseth wrote:


My SD has it's moments of fuel pressure loss.  You can be crusing down the 
interstate and suddenly feel a power loss that lasts less than 1/2 
second...something exactly like taking your foot off and back on the throttle.  
Also, at cold start it's very rough and needs to have enough throttle to keep 
at least 800-900 RPM to run somewhat smooth and not die.  Glow plugs are barely 
2 years old and the injector pump and injectors were replaced by the P/O (maybe 
50kmi ago).  I've replaced all the rubber fuel line from tank to primer in the 
last 8 months.
I'm thinking from my experience in the semi-diesel world that I have a lift pump that's 
weak.  I read 07.1-145 Checking fuel pump and bypass valve and it seems that 
the bypass valve can get clogged and needs to be cleaned and the spring lengthened to 
increase tension.  Is there anyone else that has had an issue similar to this where 
cleaning the bypass valve fixed the issue or did they have to replace the fuel pump?

(btw fuel, primer,  lift...they all mean the same thing in the big diesel 
world)

TIA all,




--
Kaleb C. Striplin/Claremore, OK
 89 560SEL, 87 300SDL, 85 380SE, 85 300D,
 84 250 LWB, 83 300TD, 81 300TD, 81 240D, 81 240D,
 76 450SEL, 76 240D, 76 300D, 74 240D, 69 250
http://www.striplin.net