Re: [MBZ] OT: Farmers cannot be trusted - what would they know about climate change?

2015-06-10 Thread Max Dillon via Mercedes
Yes!  I'll transfer to them in a heart beat.
-- 
Max Dillon
Charleston SC
'87 300TD
'95 E300

On June 9, 2015 11:27:36 PM EDT, Jim Cathey via Mercedes 
mercedes@okiebenz.com wrote:

What we _need_ is the BuSab!

-- Jim



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Re: [MBZ] OT: Farmers cannot be trusted - what would they know about climate change?

2015-06-09 Thread Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes
Or farmers to tell us the painful truth.  They must all be government
agents!

On Tue, Jun 9, 2015 at 10:46 AM, Meade Dillon via Mercedes 
mercedes@okiebenz.com wrote:

 Nothing new here, the earth's climate has always been changing.  Andrew -
 you should know that.  Even I took rocks for jocks in college...

 Humans excel at adjusting to a changing world.  We don't need increased
 government or higher taxes or energy costs to do that...

 -
 Max
 Charleston SC
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Re: [MBZ] OT: Farmers cannot be trusted - what would they know about climate change?

2015-06-09 Thread Rich Thomas via Mercedes
Clearly the answer is to raise taxes and send the money to turd-world 
kleptocrats, or the UN (I repeat myself)!


--R



On 6/9/15 10:57 AM, Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes wrote:

Or farmers to tell us the painful truth.  They must all be government
agents!

On Tue, Jun 9, 2015 at 10:46 AM, Meade Dillon via Mercedes 
mercedes@okiebenz.com wrote:


Nothing new here, the earth's climate has always been changing.  Andrew -
you should know that.  Even I took rocks for jocks in college...

Humans excel at adjusting to a changing world.  We don't need increased
government or higher taxes or energy costs to do that...

-
Max
Charleston SC
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Re: [MBZ] OT: Farmers cannot be trusted - what would they know about climate change?

2015-06-09 Thread Meade Dillon via Mercedes
Nothing new here, the earth's climate has always been changing.  Andrew -
you should know that.  Even I took rocks for jocks in college...

Humans excel at adjusting to a changing world.  We don't need increased
government or higher taxes or energy costs to do that...

-
Max
Charleston SC
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Re: [MBZ] OT: Farmers cannot be trusted - what would they know about climate change?

2015-06-09 Thread Curt Raymond via Mercedes
Do like in Liberia and give the land to oppressed black folks. That worked so 
well...
-Curt
  From: Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes mercedes@okiebenz.com
 To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com 
Cc: Andrew Strasfogel astrasfo...@gmail.com 
 Sent: Tuesday, June 9, 2015 12:06 PM
 Subject: Re: [MBZ] OT: Farmers cannot be trusted - what would they know about 
climate change?
   
How about throwing the Montana farmers off their land?  They are clearly
commies in the hire of third world kleptos.

On Tue, Jun 9, 2015 at 11:21 AM, Rich Thomas via Mercedes 
mercedes@okiebenz.com wrote:

 Clearly the answer is to raise taxes and send the money to turd-world
 kleptocrats, or the UN (I repeat myself)!

 --R



 On 6/9/15 10:57 AM, Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes wrote:

 Or farmers to tell us the painful truth.  They must all be government
 agents!

 On Tue, Jun 9, 2015 at 10:46 AM, Meade Dillon via Mercedes 
 mercedes@okiebenz.com wrote:

  Nothing new here, the earth's climate has always been changing.  Andrew -
 you should know that.  Even I took rocks for jocks in college...

 Humans excel at adjusting to a changing world.  We don't need increased
 government or higher taxes or energy costs to do that...

 -
 Max
 Charleston SC
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Re: [MBZ] OT: Farmers cannot be trusted - what would they know about climate change?

2015-06-09 Thread Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes
How about throwing the Montana farmers off their land?  They are clearly
commies in the hire of third world kleptos.

On Tue, Jun 9, 2015 at 11:21 AM, Rich Thomas via Mercedes 
mercedes@okiebenz.com wrote:

 Clearly the answer is to raise taxes and send the money to turd-world
 kleptocrats, or the UN (I repeat myself)!

 --R



 On 6/9/15 10:57 AM, Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes wrote:

 Or farmers to tell us the painful truth.  They must all be government
 agents!

 On Tue, Jun 9, 2015 at 10:46 AM, Meade Dillon via Mercedes 
 mercedes@okiebenz.com wrote:

  Nothing new here, the earth's climate has always been changing.  Andrew -
 you should know that.  Even I took rocks for jocks in college...

 Humans excel at adjusting to a changing world.  We don't need increased
 government or higher taxes or energy costs to do that...

 -
 Max
 Charleston SC
 ___
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Re: [MBZ] OT: Farmers cannot be trusted - what would they know about climate change?

2015-06-09 Thread Rich Thomas via Mercedes
I'm sure the DoI and BuRec are working on it as we speak.  It's for the 
children starving in Africa!


--R



On 6/9/15 12:06 PM, Andrew Strasfogel wrote:
How about throwing the Montana farmers off their land?  They are 
clearly commies in the hire of third world kleptos.


On Tue, Jun 9, 2015 at 11:21 AM, Rich Thomas via Mercedes 
mercedes@okiebenz.com mailto:mercedes@okiebenz.com wrote:


Clearly the answer is to raise taxes and send the money to
turd-world kleptocrats, or the UN (I repeat myself)!

--R



On 6/9/15 10:57 AM, Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes wrote:

Or farmers to tell us the painful truth.  They must all be
government
agents!

On Tue, Jun 9, 2015 at 10:46 AM, Meade Dillon via Mercedes 
mercedes@okiebenz.com mailto:mercedes@okiebenz.com wrote:

Nothing new here, the earth's climate has always been
changing.  Andrew -
you should know that.  Even I took rocks for jocks in
college...

Humans excel at adjusting to a changing world.  We don't
need increased
government or higher taxes or energy costs to do that...

-
Max
Charleston SC
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Re: [MBZ] OT: Farmers cannot be trusted - what would they know about climate change?

2015-06-09 Thread Curt Raymond via Mercedes
Dang,
Right continent anyway.
-Curt
  From: Dan Penoff via Mercedes mercedes@okiebenz.com
 To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com 
Cc: Dan Penoff d...@penoff.com 
 Sent: Tuesday, June 9, 2015 1:04 PM
 Subject: Re: [MBZ] OT: Farmers cannot be trusted - what would they know about 
climate change?
   
I think you're thinking of Zimbabwe (Rhodesia).

Dan

Sent from my iPad



 On Jun 9, 2015, at 12:52 PM, Curt Raymond via Mercedes 
 mercedes@okiebenz.com wrote:
 
 Do like in Liberia and give the land to oppressed black folks. That worked so 
 well...
 -Curt
      From: Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes mercedes@okiebenz.com
 To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com 
 Cc: Andrew Strasfogel astrasfo...@gmail.com 
 Sent: Tuesday, June 9, 2015 12:06 PM
 Subject: Re: [MBZ] OT: Farmers cannot be trusted - what would they know about 
 climate change?
 
 How about throwing the Montana farmers off their land?  They are clearly
 commies in the hire of third world kleptos.
 
 On Tue, Jun 9, 2015 at 11:21 AM, Rich Thomas via Mercedes 
 mercedes@okiebenz.com wrote:
 
 Clearly the answer is to raise taxes and send the money to turd-world
 kleptocrats, or the UN (I repeat myself)!
 
 --R
 
 
 
 On 6/9/15 10:57 AM, Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes wrote:
 
 Or farmers to tell us the painful truth.  They must all be government
 agents!
 
 On Tue, Jun 9, 2015 at 10:46 AM, Meade Dillon via Mercedes 
 mercedes@okiebenz.com wrote:
 
  Nothing new here, the earth's climate has always been changing.  Andrew -
 you should know that.  Even I took rocks for jocks in college...
 
 Humans excel at adjusting to a changing world.  We don't need increased
 government or higher taxes or energy costs to do that...
 
 -
 Max
 Charleston SC
 ___
 http://www.okiebenz.com
 
 To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
 
 To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
 http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
 
 
 
 
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Re: [MBZ] OT: Farmers cannot be trusted - what would they know about climate change?

2015-06-09 Thread Mitch Haley via Mercedes

Saying the Montana Farmers Union supports MMGW is like saying Change.org
supports MMGW. 

There's a reason why the first thing you see upon visiting MFU's web site is
Global Climate Change.

Mitch. 

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Re: [MBZ] OT: Farmers cannot be trusted - what would they know about climate change?

2015-06-09 Thread Dan Penoff via Mercedes
I think you're thinking of Zimbabwe (Rhodesia).

Dan

Sent from my iPad

 On Jun 9, 2015, at 12:52 PM, Curt Raymond via Mercedes 
 mercedes@okiebenz.com wrote:
 
 Do like in Liberia and give the land to oppressed black folks. That worked so 
 well...
 -Curt
  From: Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes mercedes@okiebenz.com
 To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com 
 Cc: Andrew Strasfogel astrasfo...@gmail.com 
 Sent: Tuesday, June 9, 2015 12:06 PM
 Subject: Re: [MBZ] OT: Farmers cannot be trusted - what would they know about 
 climate change?
 
 How about throwing the Montana farmers off their land?  They are clearly
 commies in the hire of third world kleptos.
 
 On Tue, Jun 9, 2015 at 11:21 AM, Rich Thomas via Mercedes 
 mercedes@okiebenz.com wrote:
 
 Clearly the answer is to raise taxes and send the money to turd-world
 kleptocrats, or the UN (I repeat myself)!
 
 --R
 
 
 
 On 6/9/15 10:57 AM, Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes wrote:
 
 Or farmers to tell us the painful truth.  They must all be government
 agents!
 
 On Tue, Jun 9, 2015 at 10:46 AM, Meade Dillon via Mercedes 
 mercedes@okiebenz.com wrote:
 
   Nothing new here, the earth's climate has always been changing.  Andrew -
 you should know that.  Even I took rocks for jocks in college...
 
 Humans excel at adjusting to a changing world.  We don't need increased
 government or higher taxes or energy costs to do that...
 
 -
 Max
 Charleston SC
 ___
 http://www.okiebenz.com
 
 To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
 
 To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
 http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
 
 
 
 
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Re: [MBZ] OT: Farmers cannot be trusted - what would they know about climate change?

2015-06-09 Thread Dan Penoff via Mercedes
You could be right.

I don't know much about Liberia, so it's very possible they did something along 
those lines. I was thinking that Liberia was where Henry Ford had the big 
rubber plantations.

In Zimbabwe the colonialist (British) owned and pretty much ran the country for 
several hundred years, I believe. The locals were subjugated and used as cheap 
labor, as that was what the British were really good at doing. Agriculture was 
the big thing there, and the colonialists had these massive, sprawling farms 
all over the place. We had a bunch of customers there who grew tobacco in 
quantities that were simply staggering.

Sometime in the last 15-20 years, I believe, the locals had had enough, and 
pretty much went medieval on the Brits, killing, raping, pillaging, etc., and 
returning their rightful lands back to themselves.

Of course, now that they've destroyed all the infrastructure and dismantled the 
economic engines of the country, the place pretty well went into the toilet.

This is the African country you've read about where inflation is so bad that 
pocket change is a million dollar bill in the local currency.

Victoria Falls is nice, however.

Dan

Sent from my iPad

 On Jun 9, 2015, at 1:08 PM, Curt Raymond via Mercedes mercedes@okiebenz.com 
 wrote:
 
 Dang,
 Right continent anyway.
 -Curt
  From: Dan Penoff via Mercedes mercedes@okiebenz.com
 To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com 
 Cc: Dan Penoff d...@penoff.com 
 Sent: Tuesday, June 9, 2015 1:04 PM
 Subject: Re: [MBZ] OT: Farmers cannot be trusted - what would they know about 
 climate change?
 
 I think you're thinking of Zimbabwe (Rhodesia).
 
 Dan
 
 Sent from my iPad
 
 
 
 On Jun 9, 2015, at 12:52 PM, Curt Raymond via Mercedes 
 mercedes@okiebenz.com wrote:
 
 Do like in Liberia and give the land to oppressed black folks. That worked 
 so well...
 -Curt
 

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Re: [MBZ] OT: Farmers cannot be trusted - what would they know about climate change?

2015-06-09 Thread Curt Raymond via Mercedes
I was merely pointing out how effective government is at dealing with farmers...
-Curt
  From: Andrew Strasfogel astrasfo...@gmail.com
 To: Curt Raymond curtlud...@yahoo.com; Mercedes Discussion List 
mercedes@okiebenz.com 
 Sent: Tuesday, June 9, 2015 1:32 PM
 Subject: Re: [MBZ] OT: Farmers cannot be trusted - what would they know about 
climate change?
   
Hey, I don't have to defend everythjing that ever happened in Africa.  if you 
want to change the topic change the subject line. Sheesh


On Tue, Jun 9, 2015 at 1:29 PM, Curt Raymond via Mercedes 
mercedes@okiebenz.com wrote:

Took some reading: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_ZimbabweTurns out 
they got independence in 1980 and like so many ex-empire states promptly 
squandered it. In the '90s they let the black minority overrun the farms owned 
by white farmers. The untrained black farmers then took the breadbasket of 
Africa and ruined it...
-Curt
      From: Dan Penoff via Mercedes mercedes@okiebenz.com
 To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com
Cc: Dan Penoff d...@penoff.com
 Sent: Tuesday, June 9, 2015 1:19 PM
 Subject: Re: [MBZ] OT: Farmers cannot be trusted - what would they know about 
climate change?

You could be right.

I don't know much about Liberia, so it's very possible they did something along 
those lines. I was thinking that Liberia was where Henry Ford had the big 
rubber plantations.

In Zimbabwe the colonialist (British) owned and pretty much ran the country for 
several hundred years, I believe. The locals were subjugated and used as cheap 
labor, as that was what the British were really good at doing. Agriculture was 
the big thing there, and the colonialists had these massive, sprawling farms 
all over the place. We had a bunch of customers there who grew tobacco in 
quantities that were simply staggering.

Sometime in the last 15-20 years, I believe, the locals had had enough, and 
pretty much went medieval on the Brits, killing, raping, pillaging, etc., and 
returning their rightful lands back to themselves.

Of course, now that they've destroyed all the infrastructure and dismantled the 
economic engines of the country, the place pretty well went into the toilet.

This is the African country you've read about where inflation is so bad that 
pocket change is a million dollar bill in the local currency.

Victoria Falls is nice, however.

Dan

Sent from my iPad



 On Jun 9, 2015, at 1:08 PM, Curt Raymond via Mercedes mercedes@okiebenz.com 
 wrote:

 Dang,
 Right continent anyway.
 -Curt
      From: Dan Penoff via Mercedes mercedes@okiebenz.com
 To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com
 Cc: Dan Penoff d...@penoff.com
 Sent: Tuesday, June 9, 2015 1:04 PM
 Subject: Re: [MBZ] OT: Farmers cannot be trusted - what would they know about 
 climate change?

 I think you're thinking of Zimbabwe (Rhodesia).

 Dan

 Sent from my iPad



 On Jun 9, 2015, at 12:52 PM, Curt Raymond via Mercedes 
 mercedes@okiebenz.com wrote:

 Do like in Liberia and give the land to oppressed black folks. That worked 
 so well...
 -Curt
   

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Re: [MBZ] OT: Farmers cannot be trusted - what would they know about climate change?

2015-06-09 Thread Curt Raymond via Mercedes
Took some reading: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_ZimbabweTurns out 
they got independence in 1980 and like so many ex-empire states promptly 
squandered it. In the '90s they let the black minority overrun the farms owned 
by white farmers. The untrained black farmers then took the breadbasket of 
Africa and ruined it...
-Curt
  From: Dan Penoff via Mercedes mercedes@okiebenz.com
 To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com 
Cc: Dan Penoff d...@penoff.com 
 Sent: Tuesday, June 9, 2015 1:19 PM
 Subject: Re: [MBZ] OT: Farmers cannot be trusted - what would they know about 
climate change?
   
You could be right.

I don't know much about Liberia, so it's very possible they did something along 
those lines. I was thinking that Liberia was where Henry Ford had the big 
rubber plantations.

In Zimbabwe the colonialist (British) owned and pretty much ran the country for 
several hundred years, I believe. The locals were subjugated and used as cheap 
labor, as that was what the British were really good at doing. Agriculture was 
the big thing there, and the colonialists had these massive, sprawling farms 
all over the place. We had a bunch of customers there who grew tobacco in 
quantities that were simply staggering.

Sometime in the last 15-20 years, I believe, the locals had had enough, and 
pretty much went medieval on the Brits, killing, raping, pillaging, etc., and 
returning their rightful lands back to themselves.

Of course, now that they've destroyed all the infrastructure and dismantled the 
economic engines of the country, the place pretty well went into the toilet.

This is the African country you've read about where inflation is so bad that 
pocket change is a million dollar bill in the local currency.

Victoria Falls is nice, however.

Dan

Sent from my iPad



 On Jun 9, 2015, at 1:08 PM, Curt Raymond via Mercedes mercedes@okiebenz.com 
 wrote:
 
 Dang,
 Right continent anyway.
 -Curt
      From: Dan Penoff via Mercedes mercedes@okiebenz.com
 To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com 
 Cc: Dan Penoff d...@penoff.com 
 Sent: Tuesday, June 9, 2015 1:04 PM
 Subject: Re: [MBZ] OT: Farmers cannot be trusted - what would they know about 
 climate change?
 
 I think you're thinking of Zimbabwe (Rhodesia).
 
 Dan
 
 Sent from my iPad
 
 
 
 On Jun 9, 2015, at 12:52 PM, Curt Raymond via Mercedes 
 mercedes@okiebenz.com wrote:
 
 Do like in Liberia and give the land to oppressed black folks. That worked 
 so well...
 -Curt
    

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Re: [MBZ] OT: Farmers cannot be trusted - what would they know about climate change?

2015-06-09 Thread Meade Dillon via Mercedes
Andrew, oh my, you must help them, HELP THEM!!!  Quick, get a bill in front
of Congress to start a new program to HELP THEM!!!

Wait, they are humans, very adaptable and hard working humans at that, and
they've already solved the issue at their level...  All they needed was to
be left alone and allowed to use their minds and their resources.  Imagine
that!

Move along folks, nothing to see here, move along...

-
Max
Charleston SC

On Tue, Jun 9, 2015 at 1:49 PM, Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes 
mercedes@okiebenz.com wrote:

 Which was clearly off point.

 The point is that farmers whose LIVELIHOOD depends on climate norms have
 had to adjust their planting schedules due to a major shift in climate
 trends - a large increase in temperatures.  These aren't liberals or tree
 huggers, nor do most of them vote Democratic I would surmise.  They have
 credibility in reporting on what is happening to the climate because it
 affects their income.  If you fail to see this then you are like the
 figurative man pretending to be asleep.

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Re: [MBZ] OT: Farmers cannot be trusted - what would they know about climate change?

2015-06-09 Thread Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes
Not to worry:

May was wettest month in U.S. historyPublished: Tuesday, June 9, 2015

Last month was the wettest month on record in the contiguous United States,
according to National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration meteorologists.

Nearly 200 trillion gallons of rain and snow fell over the Lower 48 states
in May, according to climate scientist Jake Crouch, with an average of 4.36
inches of total precipitation falling on the Lower 48.

A stalled pattern of storms dumped water on the central United States,
especially Texas and Oklahoma, to drive up the numbers. Those states had
been in five-year droughts that ended in just a month.

It's like one disaster ending a catastrophe, Crouch said.

Fourteen states had one of their 10 wettest Mays ever; all of them were
located west of the Mississippi River and east of California.

This May was one of only seven Mays on record in the United States to
average more than 4 inches of total precipitation. But it's hard to make
any connections from a single month to climate change, Crouch said (AP/*New
York Times*
http://www.nytimes.com/aponline/2015/06/08/science/ap-us-sci-wettest-may.html?rref=collection%2Fsectioncollection%2Fscience_r=0,
June 8). *-- BTP*

On Tue, Jun 9, 2015 at 2:53 PM, Andrew Strasfogel astrasfo...@gmail.com
wrote:

 This Congress???  You must be joking.

 On Tue, Jun 9, 2015 at 2:44 PM, Meade Dillon via Mercedes 
 mercedes@okiebenz.com wrote:

 Andrew, oh my, you must help them, HELP THEM!!!  Quick, get a bill in
 front
 of Congress to start a new program to HELP THEM!!!

 Wait, they are humans, very adaptable and hard working humans at that, and
 they've already solved the issue at their level...  All they needed was to
 be left alone and allowed to use their minds and their resources.  Imagine
 that!

 Move along folks, nothing to see here, move along...

 -
 Max
 Charleston SC

 On Tue, Jun 9, 2015 at 1:49 PM, Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes 
 mercedes@okiebenz.com wrote:

  Which was clearly off point.
 
  The point is that farmers whose LIVELIHOOD depends on climate norms have
  had to adjust their planting schedules due to a major shift in climate
  trends - a large increase in temperatures.  These aren't liberals or
 tree
  huggers, nor do most of them vote Democratic I would surmise.  They have
  credibility in reporting on what is happening to the climate because it
  affects their income.  If you fail to see this then you are like the
  figurative man pretending to be asleep.
 
 ___
 http://www.okiebenz.com

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Re: [MBZ] OT: Farmers cannot be trusted - what would they know about climate change?

2015-06-09 Thread Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes
Which was clearly off point.

The point is that farmers whose LIVELIHOOD depends on climate norms have
had to adjust their planting schedules due to a major shift in climate
trends - a large increase in temperatures.  These aren't liberals or tree
huggers, nor do most of them vote Democratic I would surmise.  They have
credibility in reporting on what is happening to the climate because it
affects their income.  If you fail to see this then you are like the
figurative man pretending to be asleep.

On Tue, Jun 9, 2015 at 1:36 PM, Curt Raymond via Mercedes 
mercedes@okiebenz.com wrote:

 I was merely pointing out how effective government is at dealing with
 farmers...
 -Curt
   From: Andrew Strasfogel astrasfo...@gmail.com
  To: Curt Raymond curtlud...@yahoo.com; Mercedes Discussion List 
 mercedes@okiebenz.com
  Sent: Tuesday, June 9, 2015 1:32 PM
  Subject: Re: [MBZ] OT: Farmers cannot be trusted - what would they know
 about climate change?

 Hey, I don't have to defend everythjing that ever happened in Africa.  if
 you want to change the topic change the subject line. Sheesh


 On Tue, Jun 9, 2015 at 1:29 PM, Curt Raymond via Mercedes 
 mercedes@okiebenz.com wrote:

 Took some reading: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_ZimbabweTurns
 out they got independence in 1980 and like so many ex-empire states
 promptly squandered it. In the '90s they let the black minority overrun the
 farms owned by white farmers. The untrained black farmers then took the
 breadbasket of Africa and ruined it...
 -Curt
   From: Dan Penoff via Mercedes mercedes@okiebenz.com
  To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com
 Cc: Dan Penoff d...@penoff.com
  Sent: Tuesday, June 9, 2015 1:19 PM
  Subject: Re: [MBZ] OT: Farmers cannot be trusted - what would they know
 about climate change?

 You could be right.

 I don't know much about Liberia, so it's very possible they did something
 along those lines. I was thinking that Liberia was where Henry Ford had the
 big rubber plantations.

 In Zimbabwe the colonialist (British) owned and pretty much ran the
 country for several hundred years, I believe. The locals were subjugated
 and used as cheap labor, as that was what the British were really good at
 doing. Agriculture was the big thing there, and the colonialists had these
 massive, sprawling farms all over the place. We had a bunch of customers
 there who grew tobacco in quantities that were simply staggering.

 Sometime in the last 15-20 years, I believe, the locals had had enough,
 and pretty much went medieval on the Brits, killing, raping, pillaging,
 etc., and returning their rightful lands back to themselves.

 Of course, now that they've destroyed all the infrastructure and
 dismantled the economic engines of the country, the place pretty well went
 into the toilet.

 This is the African country you've read about where inflation is so bad
 that pocket change is a million dollar bill in the local currency.

 Victoria Falls is nice, however.

 Dan

 Sent from my iPad



  On Jun 9, 2015, at 1:08 PM, Curt Raymond via Mercedes 
 mercedes@okiebenz.com wrote:
 
  Dang,
  Right continent anyway.
  -Curt
   From: Dan Penoff via Mercedes mercedes@okiebenz.com
  To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com
  Cc: Dan Penoff d...@penoff.com
  Sent: Tuesday, June 9, 2015 1:04 PM
  Subject: Re: [MBZ] OT: Farmers cannot be trusted - what would they know
 about climate change?
 
  I think you're thinking of Zimbabwe (Rhodesia).
 
  Dan
 
  Sent from my iPad
 
 
 
  On Jun 9, 2015, at 12:52 PM, Curt Raymond via Mercedes 
 mercedes@okiebenz.com wrote:
 
  Do like in Liberia and give the land to oppressed black folks. That
 worked so well...
  -Curt
 

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Re: [MBZ] OT: Farmers cannot be trusted - what would they know about climate change?

2015-06-09 Thread Curt Raymond via Mercedes
Yeah, so what?Sure maybe the climate is warming, but we've been coming out of 
an ice age for a couple thousand years right? Isn't global warming actually 
NORMAL in the age of human experience? The temperature record goes back to the 
late 1800s but the last ice age ended around 11,000 years ago. Haven't we been 
steadily warming since then?
Seems like its a big ask to prove that humans are making the planet warm up 
when it was doing it anyway.
-Curt

  From: Andrew Strasfogel astrasfo...@gmail.com
 To: Curt Raymond curtlud...@yahoo.com; Mercedes Discussion List 
mercedes@okiebenz.com 
 Sent: Tuesday, June 9, 2015 1:49 PM
 Subject: Re: [MBZ] OT: Farmers cannot be trusted - what would they know about 
climate change?
   
Which was clearly off point.The point is that farmers whose LIVELIHOOD 
depends on climate norms have had to adjust their planting schedules due to a 
major shift in climate trends - a large increase in temperatures.  These aren't 
liberals or tree huggers, nor do most of them vote Democratic I would surmise.  
They have credibility in reporting on what is happening to the climate because 
it affects their income.  If you fail to see this then you are like the 
figurative man pretending to be asleep.


On Tue, Jun 9, 2015 at 1:36 PM, Curt Raymond via Mercedes 
mercedes@okiebenz.com wrote:

I was merely pointing out how effective government is at dealing with farmers...
-Curt
      From: Andrew Strasfogel astrasfo...@gmail.com
 To: Curt Raymond curtlud...@yahoo.com; Mercedes Discussion List 
mercedes@okiebenz.com
 Sent: Tuesday, June 9, 2015 1:32 PM
 Subject: Re: [MBZ] OT: Farmers cannot be trusted - what would they know about 
climate change?

Hey, I don't have to defend everythjing that ever happened in Africa.  if you 
want to change the topic change the subject line. Sheesh


On Tue, Jun 9, 2015 at 1:29 PM, Curt Raymond via Mercedes 
mercedes@okiebenz.com wrote:

Took some reading: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_ZimbabweTurns out 
they got independence in 1980 and like so many ex-empire states promptly 
squandered it. In the '90s they let the black minority overrun the farms owned 
by white farmers. The untrained black farmers then took the breadbasket of 
Africa and ruined it...
-Curt
      From: Dan Penoff via Mercedes mercedes@okiebenz.com
 To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com
Cc: Dan Penoff d...@penoff.com
 Sent: Tuesday, June 9, 2015 1:19 PM
 Subject: Re: [MBZ] OT: Farmers cannot be trusted - what would they know about 
climate change?

You could be right.

I don't know much about Liberia, so it's very possible they did something along 
those lines. I was thinking that Liberia was where Henry Ford had the big 
rubber plantations.

In Zimbabwe the colonialist (British) owned and pretty much ran the country for 
several hundred years, I believe. The locals were subjugated and used as cheap 
labor, as that was what the British were really good at doing. Agriculture was 
the big thing there, and the colonialists had these massive, sprawling farms 
all over the place. We had a bunch of customers there who grew tobacco in 
quantities that were simply staggering.

Sometime in the last 15-20 years, I believe, the locals had had enough, and 
pretty much went medieval on the Brits, killing, raping, pillaging, etc., and 
returning their rightful lands back to themselves.

Of course, now that they've destroyed all the infrastructure and dismantled the 
economic engines of the country, the place pretty well went into the toilet.

This is the African country you've read about where inflation is so bad that 
pocket change is a million dollar bill in the local currency.

Victoria Falls is nice, however.

Dan

Sent from my iPad



 On Jun 9, 2015, at 1:08 PM, Curt Raymond via Mercedes mercedes@okiebenz.com 
 wrote:

 Dang,
 Right continent anyway.
 -Curt
      From: Dan Penoff via Mercedes mercedes@okiebenz.com
 To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com
 Cc: Dan Penoff d...@penoff.com
 Sent: Tuesday, June 9, 2015 1:04 PM
 Subject: Re: [MBZ] OT: Farmers cannot be trusted - what would they know about 
 climate change?

 I think you're thinking of Zimbabwe (Rhodesia).

 Dan

 Sent from my iPad



 On Jun 9, 2015, at 12:52 PM, Curt Raymond via Mercedes 
 mercedes@okiebenz.com wrote:

 Do like in Liberia and give the land to oppressed black folks. That worked 
 so well...
 -Curt
   

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Re: [MBZ] OT: Farmers cannot be trusted - what would they know about climate change?

2015-06-09 Thread Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes
There's a saying that you can't wake a man who pretends to be sleeping...

On Tue, Jun 9, 2015 at 1:08 PM, Curt Raymond via Mercedes 
mercedes@okiebenz.com wrote:

 Dang,
 Right continent anyway.
 -Curt
   From: Dan Penoff via Mercedes mercedes@okiebenz.com
  To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com
 Cc: Dan Penoff d...@penoff.com
  Sent: Tuesday, June 9, 2015 1:04 PM
  Subject: Re: [MBZ] OT: Farmers cannot be trusted - what would they know
 about climate change?

 I think you're thinking of Zimbabwe (Rhodesia).

 Dan

 Sent from my iPad



  On Jun 9, 2015, at 12:52 PM, Curt Raymond via Mercedes 
 mercedes@okiebenz.com wrote:
 
  Do like in Liberia and give the land to oppressed black folks. That
 worked so well...
  -Curt
   From: Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes mercedes@okiebenz.com
  To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com
  Cc: Andrew Strasfogel astrasfo...@gmail.com
  Sent: Tuesday, June 9, 2015 12:06 PM
  Subject: Re: [MBZ] OT: Farmers cannot be trusted - what would they know
 about climate change?
 
  How about throwing the Montana farmers off their land?  They are clearly
  commies in the hire of third world kleptos.
 
  On Tue, Jun 9, 2015 at 11:21 AM, Rich Thomas via Mercedes 
  mercedes@okiebenz.com wrote:
 
  Clearly the answer is to raise taxes and send the money to turd-world
  kleptocrats, or the UN (I repeat myself)!
 
  --R
 
 
 
  On 6/9/15 10:57 AM, Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes wrote:
 
  Or farmers to tell us the painful truth.  They must all be government
  agents!
 
  On Tue, Jun 9, 2015 at 10:46 AM, Meade Dillon via Mercedes 
  mercedes@okiebenz.com wrote:
 
   Nothing new here, the earth's climate has always been changing.
 Andrew -
  you should know that.  Even I took rocks for jocks in college...
 
  Humans excel at adjusting to a changing world.  We don't need
 increased
  government or higher taxes or energy costs to do that...
 
  -
  Max
  Charleston SC
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  To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
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Re: [MBZ] OT: Farmers cannot be trusted - what would they know about climate change?

2015-06-09 Thread Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes
Hey, I don't have to defend everythjing that ever happened in Africa.  if
you want to change the topic change the subject line. Sheesh

On Tue, Jun 9, 2015 at 1:29 PM, Curt Raymond via Mercedes 
mercedes@okiebenz.com wrote:

 Took some reading: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_ZimbabweTurns
 out they got independence in 1980 and like so many ex-empire states
 promptly squandered it. In the '90s they let the black minority overrun the
 farms owned by white farmers. The untrained black farmers then took the
 breadbasket of Africa and ruined it...
 -Curt
   From: Dan Penoff via Mercedes mercedes@okiebenz.com
  To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com
 Cc: Dan Penoff d...@penoff.com
  Sent: Tuesday, June 9, 2015 1:19 PM
  Subject: Re: [MBZ] OT: Farmers cannot be trusted - what would they know
 about climate change?

 You could be right.

 I don't know much about Liberia, so it's very possible they did something
 along those lines. I was thinking that Liberia was where Henry Ford had the
 big rubber plantations.

 In Zimbabwe the colonialist (British) owned and pretty much ran the
 country for several hundred years, I believe. The locals were subjugated
 and used as cheap labor, as that was what the British were really good at
 doing. Agriculture was the big thing there, and the colonialists had these
 massive, sprawling farms all over the place. We had a bunch of customers
 there who grew tobacco in quantities that were simply staggering.

 Sometime in the last 15-20 years, I believe, the locals had had enough,
 and pretty much went medieval on the Brits, killing, raping, pillaging,
 etc., and returning their rightful lands back to themselves.

 Of course, now that they've destroyed all the infrastructure and
 dismantled the economic engines of the country, the place pretty well went
 into the toilet.

 This is the African country you've read about where inflation is so bad
 that pocket change is a million dollar bill in the local currency.

 Victoria Falls is nice, however.

 Dan

 Sent from my iPad



  On Jun 9, 2015, at 1:08 PM, Curt Raymond via Mercedes 
 mercedes@okiebenz.com wrote:
 
  Dang,
  Right continent anyway.
  -Curt
   From: Dan Penoff via Mercedes mercedes@okiebenz.com
  To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com
  Cc: Dan Penoff d...@penoff.com
  Sent: Tuesday, June 9, 2015 1:04 PM
  Subject: Re: [MBZ] OT: Farmers cannot be trusted - what would they know
 about climate change?
 
  I think you're thinking of Zimbabwe (Rhodesia).
 
  Dan
 
  Sent from my iPad
 
 
 
  On Jun 9, 2015, at 12:52 PM, Curt Raymond via Mercedes 
 mercedes@okiebenz.com wrote:
 
  Do like in Liberia and give the land to oppressed black folks. That
 worked so well...
  -Curt
 

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Re: [MBZ] OT: Farmers cannot be trusted - what would they know about climate change?

2015-06-09 Thread Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes
This Congress???  You must be joking.

On Tue, Jun 9, 2015 at 2:44 PM, Meade Dillon via Mercedes 
mercedes@okiebenz.com wrote:

 Andrew, oh my, you must help them, HELP THEM!!!  Quick, get a bill in front
 of Congress to start a new program to HELP THEM!!!

 Wait, they are humans, very adaptable and hard working humans at that, and
 they've already solved the issue at their level...  All they needed was to
 be left alone and allowed to use their minds and their resources.  Imagine
 that!

 Move along folks, nothing to see here, move along...

 -
 Max
 Charleston SC

 On Tue, Jun 9, 2015 at 1:49 PM, Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes 
 mercedes@okiebenz.com wrote:

  Which was clearly off point.
 
  The point is that farmers whose LIVELIHOOD depends on climate norms have
  had to adjust their planting schedules due to a major shift in climate
  trends - a large increase in temperatures.  These aren't liberals or tree
  huggers, nor do most of them vote Democratic I would surmise.  They have
  credibility in reporting on what is happening to the climate because it
  affects their income.  If you fail to see this then you are like the
  figurative man pretending to be asleep.
 
 ___
 http://www.okiebenz.com

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 To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
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Re: [MBZ] OT: Farmers cannot be trusted - what would they know about climate change?

2015-06-09 Thread Curt Raymond via Mercedes
State data isn't out yet but MA was very dry in May, less than an inch I'd 
guess. We're way up now, probably had close to an inch today...



Curt



Sent from Yahoo Mail on Android

From:Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes mercedes@okiebenz.com
Date:Tue, Jun 9, 2015 at 3:01 PM
Subject:Re: [MBZ] OT: Farmers cannot be trusted - what would they know about 
climate change?

Not to worry:

May was wettest month in U.S. historyPublished: Tuesday, June 9, 2015

Last month was the wettest month on record in the contiguous United States,
according to National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration meteorologists.

Nearly 200 trillion gallons of rain and snow fell over the Lower 48 states
in May, according to climate scientist Jake Crouch, with an average of 4.36
inches of total precipitation falling on the Lower 48.

A stalled pattern of storms dumped water on the central United States,
especially Texas and Oklahoma, to drive up the numbers. Those states had
been in five-year droughts that ended in just a month.

It's like one disaster ending a catastrophe, Crouch said.

Fourteen states had one of their 10 wettest Mays ever; all of them were
located west of the Mississippi River and east of California.

This May was one of only seven Mays on record in the United States to
average more than 4 inches of total precipitation. But it's hard to make
any connections from a single month to climate change, Crouch said (AP/*New
York Times*
http://www.nytimes.com/aponline/2015/06/08/science/ap-us-sci-wettest-may.html?rref=collection%2Fsectioncollection%2Fscience_r=0,
June 8). *-- BTP*


On Tue, Jun 9, 2015 at 2:53 PM, Andrew Strasfogel astrasfo...@gmail.com
wrote:

 This Congress???  You must be joking.

 On Tue, Jun 9, 2015 at 2:44 PM, Meade Dillon via Mercedes 
 mercedes@okiebenz.com wrote:

 Andrew, oh my, you must help them, HELP THEM!!!  Quick, get a bill in
 front
 of Congress to start a new program to HELP THEM!!!

 Wait, they are humans, very adaptable and hard working humans at that, and
 they've already solved the issue at their level...  All they needed was to
 be left alone and allowed to use their minds and their resources.  Imagine
 that!

 Move along folks, nothing to see here, move along...

 -
 Max
 Charleston SC

 On Tue, Jun 9, 2015 at 1:49 PM, Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes 
 mercedes@okiebenz.com wrote:

  Which was clearly off point.
 
  The point is that farmers whose LIVELIHOOD depends on climate norms have
  had to adjust their planting schedules due to a major shift in climate
  trends - a large increase in temperatures.  These aren't liberals or
 tree
  huggers, nor do most of them vote Democratic I would surmise.  They have
  credibility in reporting on what is happening to the climate because it
  affects their income.  If you fail to see this then you are like the
  figurative man pretending to be asleep.
 
 ___
 http://www.okiebenz.com

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Re: [MBZ] OT: Farmers cannot be trusted - what would they know about climate change?

2015-06-09 Thread Curly McLain via Mercedes
Yeah, so what?Sure maybe the climate is warming, but we've been 
coming out of an ice age for a couple thousand years right? Isn't 
global warming actually NORMAL in the age of human experience? The 
temperature record goes back to the late 1800s but the last ice age 
ended around 11,000 years ago. Haven't we been steadily warming 
since then?
Seems like its a big ask to prove that humans are making the planet 
warm up when it was doing it anyway.

-Curt




Do not confuse special cause variation with normal variation.  This 
is exactly what Curt is saying.


NORMAL variation of this planet has ranged from ice age to the 
tropics.  In medieval times, Erik the Red's viking ship burned so 
much fossil fuel it warmed the whole planet and greenland was great 
for growing stuff when he got there.   NOT!  The planet warmed 
without Erik's help, and even the hordes of viking subrubans and 
escalades didn't raise the temp. Ol Erik was an early land promoter.


Ater that the planet went into a mini Ice age.  THen it warmed for a 
couple hunnert years.  Now it is cooling again.


All the falsified evidence doesn't change the facts, or science.

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Re: [MBZ] OT: Farmers cannot be trusted - what would they know about climate change?

2015-06-09 Thread Jim Cathey via Mercedes

I'm sure the DoI and BuRec are working on it as we speak.


What we _need_ is the BuSab!

-- Jim


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