Re: [MBZ] OT Vietnam all over again: Obama approves sending up to 450 more US troops to Iraq

2015-06-11 Thread Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes
We should only invade countries the size of - or smaller than - Grenada.

On Wed, Jun 10, 2015 at 9:02 PM, WILTON via Mercedes mercedes@okiebenz.com
wrote:

 'Zackly.

 Wilton

 - Original Message - From: G Mann via Mercedes 
 mercedes@okiebenz.com
 To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com
 Cc: G Mann g2ma...@gmail.com
 Sent: Wednesday, June 10, 2015 8:58 PM
 Subject: Re: [MBZ] OT Vietnam all over again: Obama approves sending up to
 450 more US troops to Iraq



  War is not won until the enemy begs you to stop killing them


 On Wed, Jun 10, 2015 at 2:29 PM, WILTON via Mercedes 
 mercedes@okiebenz.com
 wrote:

  Yep, sneaking into another one; probably gonna be home by Christmas, as
 usual.  That's what I've heard too many times, anyway.

 Wilton

 - Original Message - From: Meade Dillon via Mercedes 
 mercedes@okiebenz.com
 To: Mercedes mercedes@okiebenz.com
 Cc: Meade Dillon dillonm...@gmail.com
 Sent: Wednesday, June 10, 2015 2:18 PM
 Subject: [MBZ] OT Vietnam all over again: Obama approves sending up to
 450
 more US troops to Iraq


  How tragic.  The war that we'd already won under G.W. Bush is now slowly

 being turned into another micro-managed-from-the-oval-office slowly
 growing
 conflict, sure to take the lives of some of the young Americans sent
 there
 by Obama.



 http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2015/06/10/obama-approves-sending-up-to-450-more-us-troops-to-iraq/


 -
 Max
 Charleston SC
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Re: [MBZ] OT Vietnam all over again: Obama approves sending up to 450 more US troops to Iraq

2015-06-11 Thread Curt Raymond via Mercedes
We didn't have much luck there last time...
-Curt

  From: Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes mercedes@okiebenz.com
 To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com 
Cc: Andrew Strasfogel astrasfo...@gmail.com 
 Sent: Thursday, June 11, 2015 10:04 AM
 Subject: Re: [MBZ] OT Vietnam all over again: Obama approves sending up to 450 
more US troops to Iraq
   
We should only invade countries the size of - or smaller than - Grenada.

On Wed, Jun 10, 2015 at 9:02 PM, WILTON via Mercedes mercedes@okiebenz.com
wrote:

 'Zackly.

 Wilton

 - Original Message - From: G Mann via Mercedes 
 mercedes@okiebenz.com
 To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com
 Cc: G Mann g2ma...@gmail.com
 Sent: Wednesday, June 10, 2015 8:58 PM
 Subject: Re: [MBZ] OT Vietnam all over again: Obama approves sending up to
 450 more US troops to Iraq



  War is not won until the enemy begs you to stop killing them


 On Wed, Jun 10, 2015 at 2:29 PM, WILTON via Mercedes 
 mercedes@okiebenz.com
 wrote:

  Yep, sneaking into another one; probably gonna be home by Christmas, as
 usual.  That's what I've heard too many times, anyway.

 Wilton

 - Original Message - From: Meade Dillon via Mercedes 
 mercedes@okiebenz.com
 To: Mercedes mercedes@okiebenz.com
 Cc: Meade Dillon dillonm...@gmail.com
 Sent: Wednesday, June 10, 2015 2:18 PM
 Subject: [MBZ] OT Vietnam all over again: Obama approves sending up to
 450
 more US troops to Iraq


  How tragic.  The war that we'd already won under G.W. Bush is now slowly

 being turned into another micro-managed-from-the-oval-office slowly
 growing
 conflict, sure to take the lives of some of the young Americans sent
 there
 by Obama.



 http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2015/06/10/obama-approves-sending-up-to-450-more-us-troops-to-iraq/


 -
 Max
 Charleston SC
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Re: [MBZ] OT Vietnam all over again: Obama approves sending up to 450 more US troops to Iraq

2015-06-11 Thread Scott Ritchey via Mercedes
The is a pretty-clear case of snatching defeat from the jaws of victory.
This piece may interest some:
http://www.legion.org/magazine/226570/worlds-no-1-enemy


 -Original Message-
 From: Mann via Mercedes
 Sent: Thursday, June 11, 2015 12:14 PM
 
  If should'a and could'a were horses, all beggers would ride
 
 The last war this country entered and fought to win was WW2, and win we
did,
 not only because of the men that went to battle, but because the people at
 home produced more equipment and material than the enemy to supply
 them. When they came home they supported and honored those men.
 
 Every war since then has been a police action with the goal of not
defeating
 the enemy, but to contain them. Society in general has not supported
these
 poorly defined police actions and neither has Congress.
 The police actions have been run by politicians, not military
commanders,
 and the goals have been poorly defined to the citizens, yet many
politicians
 have become wealthy while in office.
 
 So, I make the suggestions. If we fight, anywhere, let's fight to win.
 If a politician gets rich making war, let's treat them as the enemy.
 For example, Uranium mine rights sale... a recent example of things done
 below the table.. there are others. Like arms sales to Syria.
 
 Cloudy goals to deceive the public into loss of blood and treasure under
the
 banner of war discuised as a police action, do not make a cause for
war.
 
 Our present leadership only draws red lines in the sand to draw
attention
 away from the brown streak down the back of his pants.
 IMHO.
 
 On Thu, Jun 11, 2015 at 7:04 AM, Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes 
 mercedes@okiebenz.com wrote:
 
  We should only invade countries the size of - or smaller than - Grenada.
 
  On Wed, Jun 10, 2015 at 9:02 PM, WILTON via Mercedes 
  mercedes@okiebenz.com
  wrote:
 
   'Zackly.
  
   Wilton
  
   - Original Message - From: G Mann via Mercedes 
   mercedes@okiebenz.com
   To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com
   Cc: G Mann g2ma...@gmail.com
   Sent: Wednesday, June 10, 2015 8:58 PM
   Subject: Re: [MBZ] OT Vietnam all over again: Obama approves sending
   up
  to
   450 more US troops to Iraq
  
  
  
War is not won until the enemy begs you to stop killing them
  
  
   On Wed, Jun 10, 2015 at 2:29 PM, WILTON via Mercedes 
   mercedes@okiebenz.com
   wrote:
  
Yep, sneaking into another one; probably gonna be home by
Christmas,
  as
   usual.  That's what I've heard too many times, anyway.
  
   Wilton
  
   - Original Message - From: Meade Dillon via Mercedes 
   mercedes@okiebenz.com
   To: Mercedes mercedes@okiebenz.com
   Cc: Meade Dillon dillonm...@gmail.com
   Sent: Wednesday, June 10, 2015 2:18 PM
   Subject: [MBZ] OT Vietnam all over again: Obama approves sending
   up to
   450
   more US troops to Iraq
  
  
How tragic.  The war that we'd already won under G.W. Bush is now
  slowly
  
   being turned into another micro-managed-from-the-oval-office
   slowly growing conflict, sure to take the lives of some of the
   young Americans sent there by Obama.
  
  
  
  
  http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2015/06/10/obama-approves-sending-up-
 t
  o-450-more-us-troops-to-iraq/
  
  
   -
   Max
   Charleston SC
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Re: [MBZ] OT Vietnam all over again: Obama approves sending up to 450 more US troops to Iraq

2015-06-11 Thread G Mann via Mercedes
 If should'a and could'a were horses, all beggers would ride

The last war this country entered and fought to win was WW2, and win we
did, not only because of the men that went to battle, but because the
people at home produced more equipment and material than the enemy to
supply them. When they came home they supported and honored those men.

Every war since then has been a police action with the goal of not
defeating the enemy, but to contain them. Society in general has not
supported these poorly defined police actions and neither has Congress.
The police actions have been run by politicians, not military commanders,
and the goals have been poorly defined to the citizens, yet many
politicians have become wealthy while in office.

So, I make the suggestions. If we fight, anywhere, let's fight to win.
If a politician gets rich making war, let's treat them as the enemy.
For example, Uranium mine rights sale... a recent example of things done
below the table.. there are others. Like arms sales to Syria.

Cloudy goals to deceive the public into loss of blood and treasure under
the banner of war discuised as a police action, do not make a cause for
war.

Our present leadership only draws red lines in the sand to draw attention
away from the brown streak down the back of his pants.
IMHO.

On Thu, Jun 11, 2015 at 7:04 AM, Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes 
mercedes@okiebenz.com wrote:

 We should only invade countries the size of - or smaller than - Grenada.

 On Wed, Jun 10, 2015 at 9:02 PM, WILTON via Mercedes 
 mercedes@okiebenz.com
 wrote:

  'Zackly.
 
  Wilton
 
  - Original Message - From: G Mann via Mercedes 
  mercedes@okiebenz.com
  To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com
  Cc: G Mann g2ma...@gmail.com
  Sent: Wednesday, June 10, 2015 8:58 PM
  Subject: Re: [MBZ] OT Vietnam all over again: Obama approves sending up
 to
  450 more US troops to Iraq
 
 
 
   War is not won until the enemy begs you to stop killing them
 
 
  On Wed, Jun 10, 2015 at 2:29 PM, WILTON via Mercedes 
  mercedes@okiebenz.com
  wrote:
 
   Yep, sneaking into another one; probably gonna be home by Christmas,
 as
  usual.  That's what I've heard too many times, anyway.
 
  Wilton
 
  - Original Message - From: Meade Dillon via Mercedes 
  mercedes@okiebenz.com
  To: Mercedes mercedes@okiebenz.com
  Cc: Meade Dillon dillonm...@gmail.com
  Sent: Wednesday, June 10, 2015 2:18 PM
  Subject: [MBZ] OT Vietnam all over again: Obama approves sending up to
  450
  more US troops to Iraq
 
 
   How tragic.  The war that we'd already won under G.W. Bush is now
 slowly
 
  being turned into another micro-managed-from-the-oval-office slowly
  growing
  conflict, sure to take the lives of some of the young Americans sent
  there
  by Obama.
 
 
 
 
 http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2015/06/10/obama-approves-sending-up-to-450-more-us-troops-to-iraq/
 
 
  -
  Max
  Charleston SC
  ___
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  To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
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Re: [MBZ] OT Vietnam all over again: Obama approves sending up to 450 more US troops to Iraq

2015-06-11 Thread fmiser via Mercedes
 G wrote:
 
 Every war since [WWII] has been a police action with
 the goal of not defeating the enemy, but to contain them.
 
 So, I make the suggestions. If we fight, anywhere, let's
 fight to win. If a politician gets rich making war, let's
 treat them as the enemy. 

Yup.  We should not commit one soldier to action until there
is a clearly defined military objective.  Then bring everyone
home when the objective is achieved.

Hindering terrorists is NOT a military objective.

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Re: [MBZ] OT Vietnam all over again: Obama approves sending up to 450 more US troops to Iraq

2015-06-10 Thread WILTON via Mercedes
Yep, sneaking into another one; probably gonna be home by Christmas, as 
usual.  That's what I've heard too many times, anyway.


Wilton

- Original Message - 
From: Meade Dillon via Mercedes mercedes@okiebenz.com

To: Mercedes mercedes@okiebenz.com
Cc: Meade Dillon dillonm...@gmail.com
Sent: Wednesday, June 10, 2015 2:18 PM
Subject: [MBZ] OT Vietnam all over again: Obama approves sending up to 450 
more US troops to Iraq




How tragic.  The war that we'd already won under G.W. Bush is now slowly
being turned into another micro-managed-from-the-oval-office slowly 
growing

conflict, sure to take the lives of some of the young Americans sent there
by Obama.

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2015/06/10/obama-approves-sending-up-to-450-more-us-troops-to-iraq/


-
Max
Charleston SC
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Re: [MBZ] OT Vietnam all over again: Obama approves sending up to 450 more US troops to Iraq

2015-06-10 Thread G Mann via Mercedes
War is not won until the enemy begs you to stop killing them


On Wed, Jun 10, 2015 at 2:29 PM, WILTON via Mercedes mercedes@okiebenz.com
wrote:

 Yep, sneaking into another one; probably gonna be home by Christmas, as
 usual.  That's what I've heard too many times, anyway.

 Wilton

 - Original Message - From: Meade Dillon via Mercedes 
 mercedes@okiebenz.com
 To: Mercedes mercedes@okiebenz.com
 Cc: Meade Dillon dillonm...@gmail.com
 Sent: Wednesday, June 10, 2015 2:18 PM
 Subject: [MBZ] OT Vietnam all over again: Obama approves sending up to 450
 more US troops to Iraq


  How tragic.  The war that we'd already won under G.W. Bush is now slowly
 being turned into another micro-managed-from-the-oval-office slowly
 growing
 conflict, sure to take the lives of some of the young Americans sent there
 by Obama.


 http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2015/06/10/obama-approves-sending-up-to-450-more-us-troops-to-iraq/


 -
 Max
 Charleston SC
 ___
 http://www.okiebenz.com

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Re: [MBZ] OT Vietnam all over again: Obama approves sending up to 450 more US troops to Iraq

2015-06-10 Thread WILTON via Mercedes

'Zackly.

Wilton

- Original Message - 
From: G Mann via Mercedes mercedes@okiebenz.com

To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com
Cc: G Mann g2ma...@gmail.com
Sent: Wednesday, June 10, 2015 8:58 PM
Subject: Re: [MBZ] OT Vietnam all over again: Obama approves sending up to 
450 more US troops to Iraq




War is not won until the enemy begs you to stop killing them


On Wed, Jun 10, 2015 at 2:29 PM, WILTON via Mercedes 
mercedes@okiebenz.com

wrote:


Yep, sneaking into another one; probably gonna be home by Christmas, as
usual.  That's what I've heard too many times, anyway.

Wilton

- Original Message - From: Meade Dillon via Mercedes 
mercedes@okiebenz.com
To: Mercedes mercedes@okiebenz.com
Cc: Meade Dillon dillonm...@gmail.com
Sent: Wednesday, June 10, 2015 2:18 PM
Subject: [MBZ] OT Vietnam all over again: Obama approves sending up to 
450

more US troops to Iraq


 How tragic.  The war that we'd already won under G.W. Bush is now slowly

being turned into another micro-managed-from-the-oval-office slowly
growing
conflict, sure to take the lives of some of the young Americans sent 
there

by Obama.


http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2015/06/10/obama-approves-sending-up-to-450-more-us-troops-to-iraq/


-
Max
Charleston SC
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Re: [MBZ] OT Vietnam all over again: Obama approves sending up to 450 more US troops to Iraq

2015-06-10 Thread Curly McLain via Mercedes

How tragic.  The war that we'd already won under G.W. Bush is now slowly
being turned into another micro-managed-from-the-oval-office slowly growing
conflict, sure to take the lives of some of the young Americans sent there
by Obama.

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2015/06/10/obama-approves-sending-up-to-450-more-us-troops-to-iraq/


-
Max
Charleston SC


Sam Clovis stated the criteria for involvement very well.   (USAF 
Col., Retired)

1. National Interest?
2. protection of resources necessary for our economy?
3.  Protection of our allies?

I am for Sam's criteria, then if we get involved, the involvement 
should be a Patton-like response and the day after the start, the 
rest of the world should be in shock beyond shock and awe so that 
every tin pot dictator will think 24 times before they provoke us 
ever again.(think twice a dozen times)


THAT was the USA I grew up in and that is what our folks in the 
Military services can do.


Teddy Roosevelt said it very well in his first term before he lost 
his mind.  Speak softly but carry a BIG stick  We have several big 
sticks available.


No bully (tin pan dictator) ever bothers again once you hit them 
hard.  Every 'merkun kid used to learn that on the schoolyard, 
whether the bully or the bullied.


I had a long fuse as a kid, but when the would be dictators didn't 
back off, the attack was calculated, positioned, deliberate and 
decisive.  It was also final.  Only one dumb irish kid ever came back 
for more.  After a couple years he forgot the lesson.  After the 
second lesson, he was never heard from again, going on 50 years now. 
He was around for a few more years, but his mouth was shut.  Dealing 
with tin pot dictators from Dung or Vlad on down to andorra is the 
same.


I didn't agree with reagan much when he was Pres, but history has 
born out his economic policies over the long haul, and the little tin 
pot dictator in libya was not heard from until billybob was elected 
and he thought he could mouth off safely.


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