Re: [MBZ] Sticker on Used MB

2015-07-02 Thread Dan Penoff via Mercedes
Based on being notified of an age extension on an older MB, I have to assume 
that there is an Use By date for air bags. I have seen similar stickers on my 
cars.  That being said, I've never heard of anyone ever replacing all of their 
air bags based on their age

Dan

Sent from my iPad

 On Jul 2, 2015, at 11:09 AM, LarryT via Mercedes mercedes@okiebenz.com 
 wrote:
 
 I was browsing some used MBs and noticed a sticker in the door frame of a 
 ML320 that read;
 Steering Wheel -  06-2015
 Instrument Panel - 06-2015
 Left Front Door - 06-2015
 Right Front Door - 06-2015
 Left Front Door - 06-2015
 Right Front Door - 06-2015
 Left Roof Frame ---
 Right Roof frame --
 
 I assume there are air bags in each location and each will need to be 
 replaced at some point?  The sticker says they need to be replaced this 
 month, correct?   Seems  like that would require a large price reduction.   
 Don't recall the year of the ML  but I think it was between 2000 and 2005.  
 Is there a time frame when air bags need to be replace ?
 
 Thanks
 LarryT
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Re: [MBZ] Sticker on Used MB

2015-07-02 Thread archer75--- via Mercedes


According to the following statistics, you stand roughly one chance in 340,000 
of being injured or killed by an involuntarily exploding air bag in one of the 
car brands listed below. Since you also stand one chance in 4000 to 8000 of 
dying in a car accident in any one year depending on the circumstances, the 
exploding airbag odds look pretty good.
Gerry 

When car sensors detect a crash, a chemical reaction is triggered by the 
ignition of a solid hunk of propellant. The way propellant works in an airbag 
comes down to heat, moisture, and timing. A wad of chemicals sits inside a 
flattened metal canister until heated up—which makes those chemicals expand 
quickly and gaseously when the airbag needs to inflate. Vents on the back of 
the bag prevent the whole thing from being blown to bits. All this happens in 
about half the time it takes for a person to blink: between 100 and 200 
milliseconds.

That’s how it’s supposed to work, anyway.

But as many as one in seven cars on the roads in the United States may have 
defective airbags. That’s the scope of the ongoing automotive recall that 
includes 34 million cars—Toyota, Nissan, Honda, Mazda, Mitsubishi, General 
Motors, Subaru, Ford, Chrysler, and BMW are all affected. The defective 
Takata-made airbags explode with shrapnel, spraying motorists with sharp bits 
of metal, and have caused more than 100 injuries and at least eight deaths in 
the past decade.

The faulty airbags are being traced back to the chemical compound Takata now 
uses for propellant. The manufacturer changed the main ingredient from 
tetrazole to ammonium nitrate in 2001. Takata has defended its continued use of 
the latter, calling it “safe and effective for use in airbag inflators when 
properly engineered and manufactured,” in a statement. But employee emails show 
that there were “dire warnings about safety and quality lapses years before 
Takata Corp. would fully acknowledge the threat posed by its defective 
airbags,” according to a report by the Senate Commerce Committee this week. 
Senator Bill Nelson, a Floridan Democrat, says it now appears that Takata was 
aware of “serious safety and quality control lapses” in its factories as early 
as 2001.

Ammonium nitrate can expand rapidly as a gas without exploding, but it can also 
explode violently. It's pretty unstable, too, which means it can—and often 
does—blow up when it isn't supposed to. It’s cheap, which makes it desirable to 
manufacturers, but it’s unpredictable.

“And it's not regulated at all as a propellant,” said Byron Bloch, a car-design 
consultant and long-time advocate for automotive-safety 
technologiessnip

http://www.theatlantic.com/technology/archive/2015/06/airbags/396854/

More than you want to know about airbags:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Airbag

.

Rich Thomas wrote:
 Are they Takata airbags?  If so, they don't work anyway, so you can just 
 disregard
 --R
 
 On 7/2/15 12:18 PM, LarryT via Mercedes wrote:
  So the dates are when the Air Bags are supposed to be replaced? That 
  must be pretty expensive --
 
  Hmm I wonder how much of the mechanism is replaced?  Just the 
  explosive mechanism or just the sensors?  Don't know what kind of 
  explosives they use but from personal experience, I've seen bullets 
  that were hand-loaded 35+ years ago still fire like new. I doubt they 
  use smokeless gun powder but it's probably similar chemicals involved 
  (Perhaps).
 
  Thanks -
  LarryT
  91 300D
 
  On 7/2/2015 11:56 AM, Curt Raymond via Mercedes wrote:
  I remember this being a big thing at one point where airbags were 
  supposed to stop working and we were all going to die in horrible 
  crashes.Last I heard it turns out that nobody really knows the 
  effective lifespan of an airbag.
  If you could use it as a negotiating tactic I'd say go for it. rel
  -Curt

  Based on being notified of an age extension on an older MB, I 
  have to assume that there is an Use By date for air bags. I have 
  seen similar stickers on my cars.  That being said, I've never heard 
  of anyone ever replacing all of their air bags based on their age
 
  Dan
 
  Sent from my iPad
 
  On Jul 2, 2015, at 11:09 AM, LarryT via Mercedes 
  mercedes@okiebenz.com wrote:
 
  I was browsing some used MBs and noticed a sticker in the door frame 
  of a ML320 that read;
  Steering Wheel -  06-2015
  Instrument Panel - 06-2015
  Left Front Door - 06-2015
  Right Front Door - 06-2015
  Left Front Door - 06-2015
  Right Front Door - 06-2015
  Left Roof Frame ---
  Right Roof frame --
 
  I assume there are air bags in each location and each will need to 
  be replaced at some point?  The sticker says they need to be 
  replaced this month, correct?  Seems  like that would require a 
  large price reduction.  Don't recall the year of the ML  but I think 
  it was between 2000 and 2005.  Is there a time frame when air bags 
  need to be replace ?
 
  Thanks
  

Re: [MBZ] Sticker on Used MB

2015-07-02 Thread Scott Ritchey via Mercedes
Actually, they work a little too good.

 -Original Message-
 From: Mercedes [mailto:mercedes-boun...@okiebenz.com] On Behalf Of Rich
 Thomas via Mercedes
 Sent: Thursday, July 02, 2015 12:33 PM
 To: mercedes@okiebenz.com
 Cc: Rich Thomas
 Subject: Re: [MBZ] Sticker on Used MB
 
 Are they Takata airbags?  If so, they don't work anyway, so you can just
 disregard
 
 --R
 
 
 
 On 7/2/15 12:18 PM, LarryT via Mercedes wrote:
  So the dates are when the Air Bags are supposed to be replaced? That
  must be pretty expensive --
 
  Hmm I wonder how much of the mechanism is replaced?  Just the
  explosive mechanism or just the sensors?  Don't know what kind of
  explosives they use but from personal experience, I've seen bullets
  that were hand-loaded 35+ years ago still fire like new. I doubt they
  use smokeless gun powder but it's probably similar chemicals involved
  (Perhaps).
 
  Thanks -
  LarryT
  91 300D
 
  On 7/2/2015 11:56 AM, Curt Raymond via Mercedes wrote:
  I remember this being a big thing at one point where airbags were
  supposed to stop working and we were all going to die in horrible
  crashes.Last I heard it turns out that nobody really knows the
  effective lifespan of an airbag.
  If you could use it as a negotiating tactic I'd say go for it. rel
  -Curt
 From: Dan Penoff via Mercedes mercedes@okiebenz.com
To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com
  Cc: Dan Penoff d...@penoff.com
Sent: Thursday, July 2, 2015 11:18 AM
Subject: Re: [MBZ] Sticker on Used MB
  Based on being notified of an age extension on an older MB, I
  have to assume that there is an Use By date for air bags. I have
  seen similar stickers on my cars.  That being said, I've never heard
  of anyone ever replacing all of their air bags based on their age
 
  Dan
 
  Sent from my iPad
 
  On Jul 2, 2015, at 11:09 AM, LarryT via Mercedes
  mercedes@okiebenz.com wrote:
 
  I was browsing some used MBs and noticed a sticker in the door frame
  of a ML320 that read; Steering Wheel -  06-2015 Instrument Panel -
  06-2015 Left Front Door - 06-2015 Right Front Door - 06-2015 Left
  Front Door - 06-2015 Right Front Door - 06-2015 Left Roof Frame
  --- Right Roof frame --
 
  I assume there are air bags in each location and each will need to
  be replaced at some point?  The sticker says they need to be
  replaced this month, correct?  Seems  like that would require a
  large price reduction.  Don't recall the year of the ML  but I think
  it was between 2000 and 2005.  Is there a time frame when air bags
  need to be replace ?
 
  Thanks
  LarryT
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Re: [MBZ] Sticker on Used MB

2015-07-02 Thread Dan Penoff via Mercedes
Those aren’t the ones that include shrapnel at no additional charge, are they?

The wife’s former Mazda 6 had one of these and it got swapped out by the 
stealer a couple of months ago. I understood them to be the functional 
equivalent of a Claymore or Bouncing Betty in your steering wheel.

Dan

 On Jul 2, 2015, at 8:14 PM, Scott Ritchey via Mercedes 
 mercedes@okiebenz.com wrote:
 
 Actually, they work a little too good.
 
 -Original Message-
 From: Mercedes [mailto:mercedes-boun...@okiebenz.com] On Behalf Of Rich
 Thomas via Mercedes
 Sent: Thursday, July 02, 2015 12:33 PM
 To: mercedes@okiebenz.com
 Cc: Rich Thomas
 Subject: Re: [MBZ] Sticker on Used MB
 
 Are they Takata airbags?  If so, they don't work anyway, so you can just
 disregard
 
 --R
 


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Re: [MBZ] Sticker on Used MB

2015-07-02 Thread Rich Thomas via Mercedes
Are they Takata airbags?  If so, they don't work anyway, so you can just 
disregard


--R



On 7/2/15 12:18 PM, LarryT via Mercedes wrote:
So the dates are when the Air Bags are supposed to be replaced? That 
must be pretty expensive --


Hmm I wonder how much of the mechanism is replaced?  Just the 
explosive mechanism or just the sensors?  Don't know what kind of 
explosives they use but from personal experience, I've seen bullets 
that were hand-loaded 35+ years ago still fire like new. I doubt they 
use smokeless gun powder but it's probably similar chemicals involved 
(Perhaps).


Thanks -
LarryT
91 300D

On 7/2/2015 11:56 AM, Curt Raymond via Mercedes wrote:
I remember this being a big thing at one point where airbags were 
supposed to stop working and we were all going to die in horrible 
crashes.Last I heard it turns out that nobody really knows the 
effective lifespan of an airbag.

If you could use it as a negotiating tactic I'd say go for it. rel
-Curt
   From: Dan Penoff via Mercedes mercedes@okiebenz.com
  To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com
Cc: Dan Penoff d...@penoff.com
  Sent: Thursday, July 2, 2015 11:18 AM
  Subject: Re: [MBZ] Sticker on Used MB
Based on being notified of an age extension on an older MB, I 
have to assume that there is an Use By date for air bags. I have 
seen similar stickers on my cars.  That being said, I've never heard 
of anyone ever replacing all of their air bags based on their age


Dan

Sent from my iPad

On Jul 2, 2015, at 11:09 AM, LarryT via Mercedes 
mercedes@okiebenz.com wrote:


I was browsing some used MBs and noticed a sticker in the door frame 
of a ML320 that read;

Steering Wheel -  06-2015
Instrument Panel - 06-2015
Left Front Door - 06-2015
Right Front Door - 06-2015
Left Front Door - 06-2015
Right Front Door - 06-2015
Left Roof Frame ---
Right Roof frame --

I assume there are air bags in each location and each will need to 
be replaced at some point?  The sticker says they need to be 
replaced this month, correct?  Seems  like that would require a 
large price reduction.  Don't recall the year of the ML  but I think 
it was between 2000 and 2005.  Is there a time frame when air bags 
need to be replace ?


Thanks
LarryT
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Re: [MBZ] Sticker on Used MB

2015-07-02 Thread Mitch Haley via Mercedes


 On July 2, 2015 at 7:21 PM Max Dillon via Mercedes mercedes@okiebenz.com
 wrote:
 
 
 I've got the original airbag from my '87 wagon.  I need a creative way to test
 it, if anyone has one (and no, I won't sit on it and detonate it, need a crash
 test dummy or some such).
 -- 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l3Ya6z-NlDo

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Re: [MBZ] Sticker on Used MB

2015-07-02 Thread Curt Raymond via Mercedes
That reminds me, I need to glue some walnuts onto my chipmunk traps. Little 
bastards are digging holes all over my yard, time to trim the population a 
little.
-Curt
  From: Mitch Haley via Mercedes mercedes@okiebenz.com
 To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com 
Cc: Mitch Haley mi...@mitchellhaley.com 
 Sent: Thursday, July 2, 2015 1:29 PM
 Subject: Re: [MBZ] Sticker on Used MB
   


 On July 2, 2015 at 7:21 PM Max Dillon via Mercedes mercedes@okiebenz.com
 wrote:
 
 
 I've got the original airbag from my '87 wagon.  I need a creative way to test
 it, if anyone has one (and no, I won't sit on it and detonate it, need a crash
 test dummy or some such).
 -- 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l3Ya6z-NlDo



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Re: [MBZ] Sticker on Used MB

2015-07-02 Thread Max Dillon via Mercedes
There may be something to work with here...
-- 
Max Dillon
Charleston SC
'87 300TD
'95 E300

On July 2, 2015 1:29:37 PM EDT, Mitch Haley via Mercedes 
mercedes@okiebenz.com wrote:


 On July 2, 2015 at 7:21 PM Max Dillon via Mercedes
mercedes@okiebenz.com
 wrote:
 
 
 I've got the original airbag from my '87 wagon.  I need a creative
way to test
 it, if anyone has one (and no, I won't sit on it and detonate it,
need a crash
 test dummy or some such).
 -- 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l3Ya6z-NlDo



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Re: [MBZ] Sticker on Used MB

2015-07-02 Thread Curt Raymond via Mercedes
I remember this being a big thing at one point where airbags were supposed to 
stop working and we were all going to die in horrible crashes.Last I heard it 
turns out that nobody really knows the effective lifespan of an airbag.
If you could use it as a negotiating tactic I'd say go for it.
-Curt
  From: Dan Penoff via Mercedes mercedes@okiebenz.com
 To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com 
Cc: Dan Penoff d...@penoff.com 
 Sent: Thursday, July 2, 2015 11:18 AM
 Subject: Re: [MBZ] Sticker on Used MB
   
Based on being notified of an age extension on an older MB, I have to assume 
that there is an Use By date for air bags. I have seen similar stickers on my 
cars.  That being said, I've never heard of anyone ever replacing all of their 
air bags based on their age

Dan

Sent from my iPad

 On Jul 2, 2015, at 11:09 AM, LarryT via Mercedes mercedes@okiebenz.com 
 wrote:
 
 I was browsing some used MBs and noticed a sticker in the door frame of a 
 ML320 that read;
 Steering Wheel -  06-2015
 Instrument Panel - 06-2015
 Left Front Door - 06-2015
 Right Front Door - 06-2015
 Left Front Door - 06-2015
 Right Front Door - 06-2015
 Left Roof Frame ---
 Right Roof frame --
 
 I assume there are air bags in each location and each will need to be 
 replaced at some point?  The sticker says they need to be replaced this 
 month, correct?  Seems  like that would require a large price reduction.  
 Don't recall the year of the ML  but I think it was between 2000 and 2005.  
 Is there a time frame when air bags need to be replace ?
 
 Thanks
 LarryT
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Re: [MBZ] Sticker on Used MB

2015-07-02 Thread Max Dillon via Mercedes
I thought that MB recently added ten years to the original ten years of air bag 
life?

I've got the original airbag from my '87 wagon.  I need a creative way to test 
it, if anyone has one (and no, I won't sit on it and detonate it, need a crash 
test dummy or some such).
-- 
Max Dillon
Charleston SC
'87 300TD
'95 E300
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Re: [MBZ] Sticker on Used MB

2015-07-02 Thread LarryT via Mercedes
So the dates are when the Air Bags are supposed to be replaced? That 
must be pretty expensive --


Hmm I wonder how much of the mechanism is replaced?  Just the explosive 
mechanism or just the sensors?  Don't know what kind of explosives they 
use but from personal experience, I've seen bullets that were 
hand-loaded 35+ years ago still fire like new.  I doubt they use 
smokeless gun powder but it's probably similar chemicals involved (Perhaps).


Thanks -
LarryT
91 300D

On 7/2/2015 11:56 AM, Curt Raymond via Mercedes wrote:

I remember this being a big thing at one point where airbags were supposed to 
stop working and we were all going to die in horrible crashes.Last I heard it 
turns out that nobody really knows the effective lifespan of an airbag.
If you could use it as a negotiating tactic I'd say go for it. rel
-Curt
   From: Dan Penoff via Mercedes mercedes@okiebenz.com
  To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com
Cc: Dan Penoff d...@penoff.com
  Sent: Thursday, July 2, 2015 11:18 AM
  Subject: Re: [MBZ] Sticker on Used MB

Based on being notified of an age extension on an older MB, I have to assume that there is an Use By date for air bags. I have seen similar stickers on my cars.  That being said, I've never heard of anyone ever replacing all of their air bags based on their age


Dan

Sent from my iPad


On Jul 2, 2015, at 11:09 AM, LarryT via Mercedes mercedes@okiebenz.com wrote:

I was browsing some used MBs and noticed a sticker in the door frame of a ML320 
that read;
Steering Wheel -  06-2015
Instrument Panel - 06-2015
Left Front Door - 06-2015
Right Front Door - 06-2015
Left Front Door - 06-2015
Right Front Door - 06-2015
Left Roof Frame ---
Right Roof frame --

I assume there are air bags in each location and each will need to be replaced 
at some point?  The sticker says they need to be replaced this month, correct?  
Seems  like that would require a large price reduction.  Don't recall the year 
of the ML  but I think it was between 2000 and 2005.  Is there a time frame 
when air bags need to be replace ?

Thanks
LarryT
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Re: [MBZ] Sticker on Used MB

2015-07-02 Thread LarryT via Mercedes
supposedly, the self test is the SRS light that comes on with the 
ignition indicates a good air bag.


Larry
91 300D

On 7/2/2015 7:21 PM, Max Dillon via Mercedes wrote:

I thought that MB recently added ten years to the original ten years of air bag 
life?

I've got the original airbag from my '87 wagon.  I need a creative way to test 
it, if anyone has one (and no, I won't sit on it and detonate it, need a crash 
test dummy or some such).


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