Re: [meteorite-list] Phoenix Lander
Hi, Reinforcing the previous point: http://www.space.com/missionlaunches/080603-phoenix-update.html Sterling K. Webb - - Original Message - From: Francis Graham [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Tuesday, June 03, 2008 9:35 PM Subject: [meteorite-list] Phoenix Lander Dear List Mark Ford has a point. In the Apollo Lunar Missions, right away as soon as they emerged from the LM, the astronauts obtained a basket of moon rocks and sent it up to the LM. The reasoning was, if something went amiss, and they had to leave the lunar surface soon after landing, they would not return empty-handed. This was called a contingency sample. The argument also applies to unmanned missions. Phoenix might have had a provision for an immediate contingency analysis designed in to its program, but, at risk of peril, did not, and waited a week. Nonetheless it is a good idea to do contingency sampling. It might be also a good idea for a future Mars sample return mission to obtain an immediate contingency sample. If things go wrong, and the scoop arm later malfunctions while picking around for interesting stuff, or some such, at least they can blast the hurried small contingency sample off Mars and back to Earth. One can apply this also to astronomy. One might collect what data one can, even low grade, right away, in case it clouds up. Then do careful instrument tweaking if clouds stay away. In meteorite collecting, one can grab a few random samples around the crater ejecta and then, if the situation remains pleasant, seek out better samples elsewhere. Seems like a smart idea. There is a host of practical problems to which this idea can be applied, where time=increased chance of difficulties. Francis Graham __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Phoenix Lander
Hi Sterling et al., Naturally you have a valid point, and they must have their reasons, but surely, figuring out how to use the arm on Mars should surely all have been done on Earth sims many many times already? - as for having to write blocks of code and test it to make it move (Christ almighty, life really doesn't have to be that difficult y'know!), yes naturally there are the mars variables to worry about and the odd glitch etc, but just seems strange that they are this far in with relatively little to show (so far) that's all. But yes, hopefully I guess the diligence will pay off.. Remember, this is a remake mounted on an unused backup spacecraft, a hybrid, a kludge, an Apple running Windows which is emulating Unix (not literally, but you get the idea). You know how much data the Phoenix can hold overnight (if it needs to)? Yes, friends -- 14 Megabytes Yes but it is hardly a cobble together from radio shack we are talking fully tested custom made, top quality space hardware here! And it runs a pretty good Linux O/S deriv. I recall, which has no doubt even been tested too. (Programmer gag - I can understand if it is a Linux type OS they would need to rewrite a quick 'Mars driver', coz the one they have doesn't quite work...) 14 meg?! Actually that's massive considering most engineering data only needs to be simple binary text, you should see what the early stuff had to work with !! I did chuckle however when they announced the fact that the soil is sticking to the digger/scoop much more than they thought it would, - errm what exactly where they expecting in the martian high arctic during summer ? a nice dry sand that slides off the scoop like a dream?? Does anyone actually remember the moon? Lol. - I jest of course Mark -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Sterling K. Webb Sent: 04 June 2008 04:30 To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Phoenix Lander Hi, I note that all your examples involve return and the possibility of a rapid exit. We want a robot to last and to perform for as long as possible; it can't dash home and we wouldn't want it to. Operating a robot by telepresence over a long light-time delay is chancy. Phoenix has already had problems with radio transmission and various other minor glitches. I recommend reading the following piece about the way the command structure of the Phoenix robot works: http://phoenix.lpl.arizona.edu/blogsPost.php?bID=202 As you can see, it's not like pushing a big button on the Robot Control Panel. Things are done by writing blocks of VML2 code to accomplish a specific task, testing them, sending them, etc. As the SSI Co-Investigator says, Frankly, any day with a tomorrow is a good day on Mars. Remember, this is a remake mounted on an unused backup spacecraft, a hybrid, a kludge, an Apple running Windows which is emulating Unix (not literally, but you get the idea). You know how much data the Phoenix can hold overnight (if it needs to)? Yes, friends -- 14 Megabytes. How big is the flash card in your digital camera? I think it's doing a wonderful job. Go slow. Test every foothold before you put your weight on it. Look before you leap. Small steps, small steps... Sterling K. Webb - - Original Message - From: Francis Graham [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Tuesday, June 03, 2008 9:35 PM Subject: [meteorite-list] Phoenix Lander Dear List Mark Ford has a point. In the Apollo Lunar Missions, right away as soon as they emerged from the LM, the astronauts obtained a basket of moon rocks and sent it up to the LM. The reasoning was, if something went amiss, and they had to leave the lunar surface soon after landing, they would not return empty-handed. This was called a contingency sample. The argument also applies to unmanned missions. Phoenix might have had a provision for an immediate contingency analysis designed in to its program, but, at risk of peril, did not, and waited a week. Nonetheless it is a good idea to do contingency sampling. It might be also a good idea for a future Mars sample return mission to obtain an immediate contingency sample. If things go wrong, and the scoop arm later malfunctions while picking around for interesting stuff, or some such, at least they can blast the hurried small contingency sample off Mars and back to Earth. One can apply this also to astronomy. One might collect what data one can, even low grade, right away, in case it clouds up. Then do careful instrument tweaking if clouds stay away. In meteorite collecting, one can grab a few random samples around the crater ejecta and then, if the situation remains pleasant, seek out better samples elsewhere. Seems like a smart idea. There is a host of practical problems to which this idea can be
[meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the Day - June 4, 2008
http://www.rocksfromspace.org/June_4_2008.html __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] New web site
Hello List, I have a new web site, I'm testing the new format to see if animations are working. Please let me now if its working for you. http://www.meteorman.org/ Thank You, Tim Heitz __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] New web site
Hi Tom, Your new web site looks great! Sonny -Original Message- From: Tim Heitz [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Meteorite List Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Wed, 4 Jun 2008 7:17 am Subject: [meteorite-list] New web site Hello List, I have a new web site, I'm testing the new format to see if animations are working. Please let me now if its working for you. http://www.meteorman.org/ Thank You, Tim Heitz __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] New web site
Hello Tim and good morning All! I love your images of you and these huge meteorites! Your Meteorite Creed: 1. I am powerless over meteorites and it has made my life unmanageable. I am sure most of everyone on this list feels the same. I guess you have seen many changes in the meteorite fields over the last 11 years. What are a few of them? With best regards, Moni _ Enjoy 5 GB of free, password-protected online storage. http://www.windowslive.com/skydrive/overview.html?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_Refresh_skydrive_062008 __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the Day - June 4, 2008
Hello again, Hanno can you tell us about your trip there, please? And the location, guess I could look it up. Thanks, Moni Date: Wed, 4 Jun 2008 04:12:15 -0700 From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Subject: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the Day - June 4, 2008 http://www.rocksfromspace.org/June_4_2008.html _ _ Instantly invite friends from Facebook and other social networks to join you on Windows Live™ Messenger. https://www.invite2messenger.net/im/?source=TXT_EML_WLH_InviteFriends __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] MACOVICH COLL. / HERITAGE NATURAL HISTORY SALE THIS SUNDAY
Folks: There is a natural history auction this Sunday at Heritage in Dallas that features some pretty terrific meteorites. http://www.macovich.com In particular, check-out the extraterrestrial Michigan http://www.macovich.com/lots/lot02.html All best / Darryl __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Ensisheim 2008!
Hi everyone, I will be attending the fantastic Ensisheim meteorite show again this year, and the St Marie aux Mines mineral show the week after. I look forward to a couple of weeks in France and Germany, to escape the heat of Tucson! I will be displaying meteorites with Moritz Karl in Ensisheim, and perhaps some things with Hans in St Marie. I will not bring much, as I am not all that excited to work hard there, I prefer the eating and drinking part in France more than the working part:) If there is anything specific that all of my European customers want me to bring, please let me know now so that I can prepare the material. See you all in France in two weeks. Those of you who have never attended the Ensisheim show, you are really missing out, if at all possible it is a fine trip to make, and not all that expensive in that part of France. With Germany only about a 10 minute drive and Switzerland about 40 minutes, there are endless things to do there. Michael Farmer __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] New web site
Hi Moni and good evening Tim! 1. I am powerless over meteorites and it has made my life unmanageable. Your so right, Moni! I for instance am sleepless at night, Because there might be one of Tim's Meteorite Pushers under my bed! Martin -Ursprüngliche Nachricht- Von: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Im Auftrag von Moni Waiblinger Gesendet: Mittwoch, 4. Juni 2008 17:21 An: Tim Heitz; meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Betreff: Re: [meteorite-list] New web site Hello Tim and good morning All! I love your images of you and these huge meteorites! Your Meteorite Creed: 1. I am powerless over meteorites and it has made my life unmanageable. I am sure most of everyone on this list feels the same. I guess you have seen many changes in the meteorite fields over the last 11 years. What are a few of them? With best regards, Moni _ Enjoy 5 GB of free, password-protected online storage. http://www.windowslive.com/skydrive/overview.html?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_Refresh_ skydrive_062008 __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the Day - June 4, 2008
Hello Moni, nice to hear from you. Well, it is a simple story about this. Some weeks ago in our german meteorite forum _http://www.jgr-apolda.eu/_ (http://www.jgr-apolda.eu/) this cast of the Krahenberg meteorite was offered from a person that needed extremly fast some cash. He was a scientist and worked on the original meteorite years ago. I got in contact with him and we figured out this deal. Normaly I am a meteorite collector and not so much interested in casts, but the reason why I was personaly interested in this one is, that Krahenberg is my hometown meteorite. Krahenberg is only 20 minutes by car away from me. After I had the cast in my display I thought it would be nice to add some photos around it from the original location. For me personaly the most interested thing, was to be on the original place where this phantastic meteorite hit the ground. Best regards Hanno __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] RFS Picture of the Day: Krähe nberg (and Bob's Venus Stone)
Hello Moni, Hanno, and Listees, Just like Hanno, I'm not very interested in plaster casts of meteorites. I prefer the real thing ;-) But years ago, I just couldn't resist buying one of Bob Haag's plaster casts of his famous Venus Stone (a.k.a. Adamana). It is such a perfect example of a flight-oriented and flight-marked meteorite and I still see Bob on TV holding his Venus Stone and demonstrating to the TV audience how it must have come screaming through the Earth's atmosphere. For those who are not familiar with Bob's Venus Stone: NORTON O. R. (2002) The Cambridge Encyclopedia of Meteorites (Cambridge University Press, ISBN 0 521 62143 7, p. 53) or: HAAG R. (2003) The Robert Haag Collection of Meteorites (Private Collection Edition, Tucson, Arizona, 127pp.) = cover photo Best, Bernd __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] The Holocene Start Impacts
Hi all - There's little point in me mentioning here the First Peoples accounts of the Holocene Start Impacts. It will do nothing to improve the sale of Man and Impact in the Americas, as I've already shared those traditions here with the list members for free. Some dismiss them as nonsense, while others have used stronger words. My mistake in MIIA was to date them to 8,350 BCE, which cultural discontinuity actually marks the introduction of European disease vectors into North America by the Red Paint people. Science marches on. E.P. Grondine Man and Impact in the Americas __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Ensisheim 2008!
Sadly I won`t be able to make it to Ensisheim this year. :( I will surely miss all of the great times and experiences, but especially all of our friendly European collectors and dealers who have always welcomed us with open arms. Yes... especially my good friend Norbert Classen and his wife, who have graciously put up with me these last two years for a couple of days at his house. The cuckoo clock is still cu-ckooing! Have a good time everyone! Looking forward to many pics and stories! Dave From: Michael Farmer [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [meteorite-list] Ensisheim 2008! To: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Date: Wednesday, June 4, 2008, 12:04 PM Hi everyone, I will be attending the fantastic Ensisheim meteorite show again this year, and the St Marie aux Mines mineral show the week after. I look forward to a couple of weeks in France and Germany, to escape the heat of Tucson! I will be displaying meteorites with Moritz Karl in Ensisheim, and perhaps some things with Hans in St Marie. I will not bring much, as I am not all that excited to work hard there, I prefer the eating and drinking part in France more than the working part:) If there is anything specific that all of my European customers want me to bring, please let me know now so that I can prepare the material. See you all in France in two weeks. Those of you who have never attended the Ensisheim show, you are really missing out, if at all possible it is a fine trip to make, and not all that expensive in that part of France. With Germany only about a 10 minute drive and Switzerland about 40 minutes, there are endless things to do there. Michael Farmer __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Meteoite Identification video part 1
Hi All, Check out my new meteorite identification video part 1. Parts 2 and 3 will be on iron and stony iron meteorites. I may have to change a few thing due to how you tube changes the appearance of the finished video. Sonny http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lD1hUJaS_Fk www.nevadameteorites.com __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] New web site
Hello Martin,Moni, I have been powerless over cool looking meteorites for some time now. ABOUT THE METEORITE PUSHER The Meteorite Pusher is the distant cousin of the Google rock pusher. A man named Jimmy Oogle made these pushers and called them the Oogle later he sold them on a web site he called google, meaning go--oogle (The Google) back in the early 1990's a startup company called Google bought the web site name Google from him for $80,000 If only Jimmy would have known it would be worth millions today. Push those meteorites my way, Tim -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Martin Altmann Sent: Wednesday, June 04, 2008 1:52 PM To: Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] New web site Hi Moni and good evening Tim! 1. I am powerless over meteorites and it has made my life unmanageable. Your so right, Moni! I for instance am sleepless at night, Because there might be one of Tim's Meteorite Pushers under my bed! Martin -Ursprüngliche Nachricht- Von: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Im Auftrag von Moni Waiblinger Gesendet: Mittwoch, 4. Juni 2008 17:21 An: Tim Heitz; meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Betreff: Re: [meteorite-list] New web site Hello Tim and good morning All! I love your images of you and these huge meteorites! Your Meteorite Creed: 1. I am powerless over meteorites and it has made my life unmanageable. I am sure most of everyone on this list feels the same. I guess you have seen many changes in the meteorite fields over the last 11 years. What are a few of them? With best regards, Moni _ Enjoy 5 GB of free, password-protected online storage. http://www.windowslive.com/skydrive/overview.html?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_Refresh_ skydrive_062008 __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Meteoite Identification video part 1
Hi Sonny, As a relative newcomer, I appreciate your instructional video. I have only one suggestion. The blue lettering you used in the video was hard to read, especially once it begins to fade. I would recommend choosing some really bright colored lettering, and then not have it fade so quickly. As it is, one has to really read fast in order to read the text before it disappears. It's hard to examine the meteorite and read the text in the short space of time allowed. Does this make sense? Best wishes, Greg Lindh To: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Date: Wed, 4 Jun 2008 18:22:21 -0400 From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [meteorite-list] Meteoite Identification video part 1 Hi All, Check out my new meteorite identification video part 1. Parts 2 and 3 will be on iron and stony iron meteorites. I may have to change a few thing due to how you tube changes the appearance of the finished video. Sonny http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lD1hUJaS_Fk www.nevadameteorites.com __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Meteoite Identification video part 1
Hey Sonny, Pretty cool! You musta read my mind, I just finished - part 3 - meteorite I.D. for iron and pallasite meteorites. I'm uploading it now and will make it public in the morning! Here's alink to my Meteorite I.D. videos for chondrites - parts 1 and 2 http://www.mr-meteorite.com/meteoriteidentification.htm Ruben Garcia Phoenix, Arizona http://www.mr-meteorite.com __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
