[meteorite-list] Nice Sylacauga pic
http://www.xenophilia.com/zb/zb0005/image004.jpe Buckleboo __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
AW: [meteorite-list] Munionalusta watch
Huh Marcin, let's craft a Dronino- or Campowatch.. A Meteoritical Memento Mori Metronome. As time goes by you could see it rust and fall in pieces. 0,1% Water Resistant. Melancholically yours, Martin PS: Andreas Gryphius according to Babelfish (translated 2 times forth and back): They see, where you see only vanity on soil leader. Which manufactures for these today, this tears up violently tomorrow above violently: Where itzund cities stand, a meadow is on a shepherd dog dog, the child with the herds plays: Which flowers itzund excellently, soon is, zertreten, in order to become. Which is zerstoesst tomorrow and itzt in such, one is not way ash challenges and leg nothing not, which is eternal, no ore, no marble stone. Itzt laughs the luck we on, thunders soon the objections. High acts the fame must activity like a dream. Is the play of the time, which exist bright humans? OH- -! all this this is, which we respected for koestlich, like bad nullity, as color, dust and wind; As Wiesenblum, which one does not recover. Wishes still, what it is eternal do not combine humans to the respect! -Ursprüngliche Nachricht- Von: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Im Auftrag von Marcin Cimala - PolandMET Gesendet: Donnerstag, 11. Mai 2006 23:43 An: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Betreff: [meteorite-list] Munionalusta watch Ha, great watch. http://www.horlogerie-suisse.com/2005/antoine/tourbi.html -[ MARCIN CIMALA ]-[ I.M.C.A.#3667 ]- http://www.Meteoryt.net [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.PolandMET.com [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.Gao-Guenie.com GSM +48(607)535 195 [ Member of Polish Meteoritical Society ] __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
AW: [meteorite-list] Quesations and AD - Bilanga
Hiho, indeed I still keep back Matteo's prices vs. reality letter L-Z :-) With Bilanga we see that typical pattern of price fluctuation with new falls, which I told yesterday. When Bilanga first came to market, it was offered by only 2 sellers and it costed 60$/g. Some months later other were able to get material, the prices dropped to 25$/g, and consequently, because the ebay-fans thought there would be no hurry even sometimes to 12$/g on ebay - but at this point of time the best material was already gone, only splinters and fragments of minor quality compared to the before sold were listed there on ebay. Now Bilanga is more or less gone, rarely offered on ebay and in bad quality and for the few remaining pieces you have to pay at least 30$/g at the dealers. Remember Park Forest. Same pattern. In the first hype prices between 25-60$/g, more offerors, more ebay - I bought a little endcut from ebay, which hadn't seen the rain at 9$/g, nowadays we are again at 40$/g and up. Bensour - for a while standard price was 6$/g, on it's depression it was down to 1$/g on ebay for half a year, nowadays - I'd have to look, but I guess even on ebay it's 4$/g and larger complete specimens are difficult to find. Take Amgala/Oum Dreyga - first, which came out 8-10$/g, now it is still at a dead point of 3$/g on ebay, but the problem is, that those extremely fresh entire stones, which are so fresh, that you dare to touch them only with gloves are gone. And soon you won't find material at 3$ anymore. Christian's Kilabo - 4$/g were a joke for them, most material is gone and be sure to pay in 2 years 8/g. Hammami... and so on. Now to Anne's Bilanga, it is a truly unique piece! I never saw such an inclusion in Bilanga and I had a large bunch of pieces and I was looking around, because I had one with 2 shock planes and I tried to find others with a similar feature. Anne's is outstanding. I had only two pieces with metal, but the metal was a single tiny grain each where you needed a looking glass for. It is an important piece. I never found any clasts or xenoliths in Bilanga, and without the piece with shock lines, no others with signs of melt, so I would speculate, that the metal wasn't induced by impact, but that the parent body rather wasn't completely differenciated. Btw. Matteo, a friend of mine listed a small Bilanga with crust, which he once took from me 2 months ago on ebay and the result was 40-50$/g if I remember right. I personally was selling my Bilangas quite early after the 50-60$/g phase at 25$/g - for the main load I received a trading offer with material with a trade ratio, that would correspond to a gram price of 45$/g. My unique shocked Bilanga I sold without any remorse this year I think at 35$/g and the buyer was more than content and seen this extraordinary unique feature I think that Anne's price is appropriate. So Matteo, I think you are long enough in meteoritics to know, that outstanding and special pieces are paid with higher prices than crappy ones of the same locality. And additionally that ebay with its often erroneous prices on both ends of the spectrum is a bad guidebook. Cheers! Martin PS: Have to apologize for the Lancé, Kernouvé-mail, I clicked the wrong address, was thought for a client. - You are funny Matteo. You complain the market is ruin and then make comments like the above, while you yourself have some of the highest prices on meteorites. Did Haag's piece have nice crust like that? Did Haag's piece have the nice crystal as shown by Anne's great photos? Was Haag's piece over 100 grams (which is something you rarely ever see)? Likely not. That specimen should command a premium. I guess this just goes along with your market in ruin theory. Like you should be able to buy a meteorite like Park Forest for $4.00 a gram, when it was being retailed at $30 a gramand you wanted $50 a gram. Perhaps Martin should repost his price comparison list on what you want and what others want for the same meteorite. Clear Skies, Mark Bostick Wichita, Kansas www.meteoritearticles.com __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
AW: [meteorite-list] insomnia can cause clouding of consciousness
Dear list, we shouldn't loose in this discussions a more general sight. Dealers moan about the radical drop in prices, the difficulties to get the stuff classified, collectors bewail the lack of accurate data for their material, both groups permanently are afraid to experience a financial loss, scientists complain about a criminal plundering and feel to classify an ordinary chondrite is an emetic job; collectors and scientists accuse the dealers of being driven solely by rampant mammonism; collectors blame scientists and dealers to destroy fine specimens by cutting, dealers and collectors object to scientists to have an insufficient description system and no interest in bringing paired stuff together... If you read the list, then you inevitably get to the point, that the Sahara-boom must have been a downright terrible calamity!!! Well, I really don't know anymore, whether I have to make clear, that the short period of the desert rush, was and will be for all groups an incredible and, sadly, an irrecoverable enormous MEGA-TERA-PARA-BONANZA in all fields (hunting, collecting, sience, monetary aspects). Bernd, Joern, Dieter, Blaine, Alex - please you veterans help me to enlighten all those groups, that nowadays we are living in a meteoritical paradise !!! Tell them, how it was in the years before the desert rush. Tell them, how few different meteorites one could permanently acquire at all. Tell them, what an overwhelming sensation it was, to find exhibited on a dealers table a piece of a HOW or URE, which was larger sized than a fingernail! Tell them, what for a deep satisfaction it was, to get a pinhead sized bogey of something so exotic lice an ACAP or even a Moon in one's collection. Tell them, how catastrophically ruinous your fervor was, what efforts were to undertake to get a Brahin or a Sikhote into the colln. Good heavens folks, those weren't mythical ages aeons ago, that happened still 6-10 years ago! You Morocco-crusaders, tell them, how short those Sahara-boom lasted, tell them about the culmination 3 years ago, tell them how rapidly it is going to an end since. Scientists, tell them of those days, when it was an exiting event to get an eucrite on the table, tell them how appetently you were buying and trading the first desert finds! I really can't grok the permanent discussions here. What do we all want more On the one hand the permanent whining, that market is in ruin, on the other hand the whining about exaggerated prices, are you all blind? Collectors, the prices of today for desert material are 10-50 times LOWER than only a few years ago. What does it matter at this level, whether a DIO or a R has 200grams tkw or with its possible pairings 5kgs??? What shall those grieved faces, if you have bought a cumul EUC at 6$/g and some months later for a short period it is going for 2.5$/g ??? Do you seriously think, that in the very next few years prices will stay so low and that each type will still be disposable at will?? Dealers, what shall the anxiety that there is almost no profit to make at present times with desert and that you had losses with material bought a while ago? Sell meanwhile classical locations, they are stable and there you can earn money. And with desert: Don't you see, how the first type already tripled in price on ebay? Don't you see, that the supply from desert breaks down? Don't you see your collegues haply buying each brown boring stone they can get down there, for later folding their feet on the table in front of the fireplace in their villas? (Argh any wealthy sponsor out there, for whom we could organize a mighty additional old age pension, as long as it is still possible?) And what about those plaints about the missing data for NWAs? The stuff is incredible dirt cheap and everyone knows, that there's the rub, in the way, they were collected, whereon nobody had any influence. Strewnfield data simply can't be retrieved anymore. Whether the pairings will be set together again, we will see much later, I personally guess, as it is already the case, at least the most rare types will be compared. If you can't bear to have such orphans in your collection, just don't acquire NWAs, take classical locations or Oman-meteorites (as long as it's still possible), who do have all data, but are paid like NWAs at present. Or buy from real Sahara-hunters, who record the data of their true finds, like e.g. Franco or the Berouds. Instantaneously the dilemma between accurate tkw of possible pairings and the official classification of stones, to calm the collectors to get 100% officially the right stuff, can't be solved. (A dilemma which can't be resolved, Martin Pleonasticus is speaking). And also the reproaches against the Met.Soc and the Nom.Com aren't justified. Please check the archive, wasn't it last year, when Grossman explicitely invited collectors and dealers here on the list, to help with their ideas to improve the nomenclature system for NWA-meteorites? As one of
AW: AW: [meteorite-list] insomnia can cause clouding of consciousness
Contra, Stan! you are speaking from that era, when almost nobody was collecting meteorites and there were worldwide 5 dealers, hence no market, the golden age of the 70ies and partially 80ies, when there was so few interest in meteorites, that there wasn't a market at all and the prices even lower than in the 1880ies. You are right, when you're telling, that in the 90ies the prices grew enormously - main factor, I think, was the upcoming internet and with it, the increasing number of collectors. Before almost every collector and every dealer, they all knew eachother in person (but not Martin, the kid). But the development of internet is irreversible, so those times are gone. it was no where nearly as easy to pick up a 5kg ureilitie. Well said, to illustrate it: Dingo Pup Donga, Dyalpur, Hajmah(a), Goalpara, Haverö, Lahrauli, Nilpena, North Haig, Novo-Urei had altogether 9kg. And else existed only Kenna with it's 10.7kg, wherefrom you could get your specimen and if you were extremely clever and lucky perhaps a historical crumb from Goalpara. That was it. And this we can exercise with all rare types. Nowadays Buckleboo-Martin was offering an Ure with 2.5$/g and he couldn't get rid of it, while 5-6 years ago, you had to pay 80-400$ for the first DaGs; 170-400$/g for the SAH-UREs, 350-900$/g for Goalpara. What would Stan have done, if he needed an R for his collection? Would he have paid 10$/g like today? No, he wouldn't have had any other choice, then to run to the Labennes to pay there 600$/g for their SAHs, (or to Sinclair at 750$). And what, if he would have felt a hunger for Moon? Hmm, ask Blaine, what he took for his first Moons, the alternative would have been to beg the MASTER on the knees to sell you a gram of Calcalong for 1 Mega$ and more. Make your homework and check the years of find/fall to see, how mere the assortment of the market was. Hah! When the famous HaH 237 was coming out first, even a collector from USA paid the European, who had it, the flighthotel only for showing him the stone! Man, Stan! Before desert with all rare types you had the choice between Zero and 1-3 stones and you simply had to take, what you were offered, for getting any at all into your collection. I would estimate, that there were not more than 100 different locales permanently available at all. Nowadays you have thousands to choose from. Of course there were also some meteorites, which were ridiculous cheap compared with today, take e.g. Allende, but others costed a lot more than today. Sikhote, when it became available. Chinga. Munionalusta. Campo and so on. And all in all, even if you would have been a multimillionaire, it would have been absolutely impossible for you, to built up a collection comparable to that, what you have now, Stan. Meow, In writing this lines, two things came up in my mind: Wasn't there an ureilite called Bartail? Never heard again from, or was it a hoax from Casper? And, there is so much literature by and about Nininger - do there anywhere exist pricelists from him? Buckleboo! Martin -Ursprüngliche Nachricht- Von: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Im Auftrag von stan . Gesendet: Dienstag, 9. Mai 2006 19:29 An: Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com; [EMAIL PROTECTED] Betreff: RE: AW: [meteorite-list] insomnia can cause clouding of consciousness Bernd, Joern, Dieter, Blaine, Alex - please you veterans help me to enlighten all those groups, that nowadays we are living in a meteoritical paradise !!! Tell them, how it was in the years before the desert rush. I dont know about the other guys you mentioned, but Blaine has 'been in the game' long enough to tell us how it was before not only the 'nwa era' but before the 'speculative frenzy' era. When I first became interested in meteorites common chonderites might command a few $ per gram - but zagami could be had for 50$/g, millbillillie or camel donga for 2$/g - even 100% crusted specimins. Nakhla at 400$/g was considered the ultimate rarity an murchison could be found for 10-20$/g for tumbnail sized pieces. The price crash of the nwa era was directly preceeded by a price inflation period when people with more money than sense thought meteorites would be a good investment. prices were driven up by new dealers trying to see if they could raise their prices faster than their competition. And this was faily recent history too. This time predated the nwa era by only a handfull of years. IIRC it was 13 or 14 years go when I was tickled pink that the price of camel donga had 'skyrocketed' to 4$/g and I unloaded a large number of complete individuals to Blaine Reed. Not a bad investment for a kid who saved up his lunch money to buy shiney rocks from space while in high school. I will admit that the avalibility of material was less back then. it was no where nearly as easy to pick up a 5kg ureilitie or winonaite then as it is today - but alot of the rare material was still much cheaper back then than
AW: AW: AW: [meteorite-list] insomnia can cause clouding of consciousness
Staan ! The prices of today are uncomparable cheap to any prices in the 200 years lasting history of meteorites. And, they will be gone soon and they never will come back!!! In 5 years you will rant here on the list about the greedy dealers having driven the prices high to nirvana, while most others simply will cry about the paradise lost. If Sahara is over and Oman closed, please Stan, tell me where should similar amounts of meteorites come from? There is only one possibility to get a situation like today in future: If the Antarctic finds would be released to commercialism. We are all so spoiled or to young (i.e. came to meteorites during the recent 5 years in times of the desert rush) to see the obvious. I'm sure, that most who have read my lines will think, that guy is a dealer, that panicking is for sure a gimmick to animate people to buy, as Blood is doing, if he's telling the same, as the Hupes and Farmer are doing, when they are telling Morocco is drying out. Well, we can't force you to be happy, We warned, we adviced.. everything else is up to you. See the prices in 3 years... By!!! Your Ollie PS: I missed in the 80ies the ordinary chondrites sold at 50$/kg I guess... Btw. Chondrites are said to be the most common type, or else: most meteorites are chondrites -Ursprüngliche Nachricht- Von: stan . [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Gesendet: Dienstag, 9. Mai 2006 22:08 An: Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com; [EMAIL PROTECTED] Betreff: RE: AW: AW: [meteorite-list] insomnia can cause clouding of consciousness Contra, Stan! you are speaking from that era, when almost nobody was collecting meteorites and there were worldwide 5 dealers, hence no market, the golden age of the 70ies and partially 80ies, when there was so few interest in meteorites, that there wasn't a market at all and the prices even lower than in the 1880ies. You are right, when you're telling, that in the 90ies the prices grew enormously - main factor, I think, was the upcoming internet and with it, the increasing number of collectors. Before almost every collector and every dealer, they all knew eachother in person (but not Martin, the kid). But the development of internet is irreversible, so those times are gone. I'm only 30 - I'm talking about the very tail end of the '80's and the begining of the '90's - only a few years before the nwa boom. there were still plenty of people collecting meteorites back then. Ask Bob Haag. if we are looking at historical price trends it's unfair to simply look at todays prices vs that of the prices seen in the peak of the speculative frenzy for meteorites. Those prices were unsustianable - even with todays increased collector base. __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Ancient price lists - let's collect them
Great! A new thread is born! Let's do some history and gather together old price lists! Hey Alex, old messie, I'm sure somewhere you still have Reed's old lists? Some Haag lists? I already once converted by the gold price once Cohen's list into actual prices, I guess in one of Michael Blood's old columns it must be preserved. But meanwhile the gold price skyrocket, so it would be more expensive. With the Ward-lists it should be easier, as I'm sure, somewhere must exist inflation tables for the US-$. And I have left 2 compilations. A list with prices of 30 dealers from 1999 and one of 72 dealers from 2001. But first, before I could type them, someone has to buy some stones from me, I'm quite broke after the disaster of inundations in Romania and German customs holds back new material since 6 weeks. Buckleboo! Martin Hehehe, in 2000 average price for Gao-Guenie (26 offerors) wa 3.85$ per gram. Pultusk 43.10$/g. Nantan 1.43$/g (11 dealers). Deport 2$/g. DaG 476 1354$/g (13)... Campo 0.61$/g (17) PS: Buehler was funny. The rarest historical falls he had always much to cheap, the most common stuff to expensive, it is a pity, that the SML doesn't exist anymore. -Ursprüngliche Nachricht- Von: Peter Marmet [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Gesendet: Dienstag, 9. Mai 2006 22:18 An: Martin Altmann Betreff: Re: AW: AW: [meteorite-list] insomnia can cause clouding of consciousness Martin Altmann wrote: Nininger - do there anywhere exist pricelists from him? Not from him, but from Rolf Buhler (former Swiss Meteorite Lab), pricelist February 1990: e.g. : Campo del Cielo 3946 g $ 1524.-- Gibeon 143 g $ 352.-- Imilac 1170 g $ 7200.-- Brenham 101 g $ 1100.-- Pultusk 3 g $ 50.-- Alfianello 10 g $ 65.50 Allende Individuals @ $5 per gram New Sahara finds @ $4.50 per gram Due to an oversupply Millbillillie was reduced to $4.-- per gram Millbillillie slices with two lithologies were $5.70 per gram Zagami, only fragments and powder @ $262.-- per gram Camel Donga, fully crusted individuals @ $4.-- per gram Ensisheim 38.6 g $ 1230.-- Mainz 74.5 g $ 2050.-- Motta di Conti @ $ 8.20 per gram Erxleben @ $ 13.40 per gram Lancon @ $ 7.50 per gram Bacuburito @ $ 2.75 per gram... Peter __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
AW: AW: AW: AW: [meteorite-list] insomnia can cause cloudingof consciousness
Nothing anymore, cause nobody wanted the stuff or told us, that it is to expensive, we changed our profession. I switched to sell now hematite nodules as galactic energy sources for Feng-Shui designer furnishings, will do business in selling the new uniform horoscopes with all asteroids and I'm working as clown in the ruin of the Space-Park in Bremen. Andi is commuting between province in Japan, where he is a local wrestling hero (Gojira vs. Metajitofurankenstajn)and Tromso, where he works as an extra at the historical Viking open air festival. Stefan took his polishing and grinding devices and opened a studio for cosmetical manicure and finally Marcin is exporting moldavites to glass recycling firms in Germany and Moraskos as scrap-iron to China, because he get's out a better kilo-price as on ebay. Just a joke, but perhaps you may ask Stefan, whether he has smth left from the incredible NWA 2900 or from his strange 3er from the last special. Well a H7 or PAC just is ready, some Acapulco, but only mini-fullslices, Andis strange new iron you saw. A semi-oriented small entire Benguerir (small entire ones are very rare). I have to do now more historical stuff and the micro-thing, to raise funds for filling my cellar with all the Morocco-stuff, which the common collector scorns Meow! Martin Von: David Sukow [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Gesendet: Dienstag, 9. Mai 2006 22:31 An: Martin Altmann Betreff: Re: AW: AW: AW: [meteorite-list] insomnia can cause cloudingof consciousness Martin, you're killing me. Quick, man, what can I buy?!? :) I was going to say , don't tell everyone about this, the longer the public remains oblivious to the situation the longer I can afford to collect rare types! OK, enough silly emails from me to you, for a while. I just enjoy your posts very much and feel compelled to reply, at least privately. Buckling under your Boo, David __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
AW: [meteorite-list] RE: Self-Proclaimed Pairing Issues
Hi Mark, the reason for so many desert meteorites, especially ordinary chondrites, not being classified certainly is rooted in their commercialisation. With the prices paid for them during the last years and the all in all petty sales volumes that the meteorite market has and seen the costs to acquire and to sell desert chondrites, there is hardly any profite to make with them. Additional losses of money and time for a classification often can't be taken by the dealers, as most collectors wouldn't be willing to pay higher prices. Thus many sellers leave it to the buyer, whether he/she will let a chondrite classified. If you explore the desert segment of the market, you will find out, that most offerors are only semiprofessional dealers or collector-dealers or amateurs (in a non-pejorative sense), who don't have the pressure to make their living from meteorites and thus it is easier for them to bear the costs for classification, than for the professional dealers, who bring up the largest quantities of desert material or that there were bulk sellers of unclassified material, because that was the only way to have senseful earnings from meteorites. I write was, cause the diminishing supply from the deserts, doesn't allow any longer that method of dealing. Well and else, where a little money is still in with the desert stones, are only the exotic types and/or especially beautiful specimens, the non-representative thin layer of cream on top of the milk pot of the desert finds. - take a look to that platform called ebay, there you can often find per week more achondrites, CVs, R's etc than ordinary classified desert chondrites. Dealers would bother to let all stuff classified, but they simply can't afford it, because nobody is willing to pay the price for. it is bizarre that government funded institutions are tied up doing work for commercial companies/meteorite dealers, for often no more than a few grams of material!? Can't follow those argumentation. The recovery campaigns in Antarctica paid by tax money, which resulted in by far the largest number of finds and which are thus undoubtedly a great success, are very expensive. Therefore it might be not the worst deal in this respect, when the labs get in exchange for there analyses the deposit material for free. Of course it would be desirable, if that branches of the universities would have been financially better equipped, but that wasn't depending on them having used the means for classifying meteorites, I suppose. Trademark idea doesn't work, if it costs a fee. Collectors already aren't willing to pay adequate prices seen the costs, so for most offerors it would be impossible and even if it would be for free, the professional meteorite dealers are hardworking and simply wouldn't have the time to care for such paperwork. And finally, that what one always should have in mind before one starts to pick on people selling desert meteorites - no matter if they are amateurs, collectors or professional dealers, they do it because of their enthusiasm and dedication to our beloved stones. In respect of the financial efforts, the lifetime they have to spend, I'm very sure, that the vast majority of the list members here, wouldn't raise a finger for such mere resulting revenues. Buckleboo! Martin -Ursprüngliche Nachricht- Von: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Im Auftrag von mark ford Gesendet: Montag, 8. Mai 2006 12:33 An: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Betreff: RE: [meteorite-list] RE: Self-Proclaimed Pairing Issues Hi I think the real problem basically here is that fact that the classifying institutions are just unable to classify material quickly enough for the high turn over pace of the real life commercial world, the fact that it takes many months or even many years to classify even a simple Chondrite, is usually the reason that most people don't bother (I'm not saying that's morally right). But it needs to be way more accessible. I can't say I blame the institutions though either, to me it is bizarre that government funded institutions are tied up doing work for commercial companies/meteorite dealers, for often no more than a few grams of material!? As for not being able to trademark numbers I can only speak of my experience for the UK, but there CERTAINLY are numerous number trademarks (118118 is a classic example here in the UK) most are phone numbers for various services. Maybe then the US is different but it is not a problem for the UK at least. In fact looking into it, in theory one could trademark 'NWA869' for the whole of the UK and probably Europe for just a few hundred quid... Best, Mark Ford -Original Message- From: Meteoriteshow [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, May 08, 2006 9:56 AM To: mark ford; meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] RE: Self-Proclaimed Pairing Issues Hi Mark and All, Your suggestion is again a purely commercial point of view. I do not say
[meteorite-list] To the buyers of our NWA-R and NWA-Acap
Sorry list, for that abuse, with my computer crash I lost the informations, who took from us from the Rumuruti last autumn and more recently the Acap,(but I guess, mastermind Martin, remembered and emailed now all), want only to get sure, that all buyers got the information. (Perhaps it's a more useful info, that from the Acap still nice little polished fullslices are available?) They're fiiinally ready: NWA 4392 (prov.), R4 Chondrite, S2, W3, Fa38.4, Fs 9-17.5, tkw: 490 g, purchased in 2005 in Krefeld/Germany Acapulcoite: NWA 4399, Acapulcoite, Shock: low, Weathering: strong, Fa: 7.3 (6.5 - 7.8), Tkw: 210 g, purchased in 2005 in Tagounite/Marokko (will get a separate entry) Thanks! Martin __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
AW: [meteorite-list] Gifhorn in the news (in German!)
Hi Marcin, list I didn't attend there the last 2 times, so I didn't wrote a report. The problem of that fair not growing is that the number of exhibitors isn't getting larger. In my eyes it was a mistake to move the date from October to May. In former times it took place always 1 week before the Munich show (which is the largest in Europe), so that dealers from overseas or from far away, could do both shows on one trip. Same recipe works excellent with flourishing Ensisheim, which is placed one week before the St.Marie-show, which is also one of the largest minerals fair in Europe. Second problem is or was(?) the lack of audience. I remember in the year I took part in, there were hours, where not a single visitor got astray to the show room. Hundred yards away in the pedestrian zone of the town's center at the same time, it was very crowded with people taking their Sunday walk. Not a single marker to the show was placed there. Gifhorn has the same preconditions like Ensisheim, a small town, So I guess, the problem could be solved, in setting back the date to 1 week before Munich and a better organised advertising for the event. My ten thousand Lei (0.37$) Martin, the Buckleboo == Now my two thousant dollars Gifhorn was very nice fair 3-4 years ago. I was on fair No 2-3-4 I think but from the last 2 years it going down. Just find Martin Boockleboo report from Gifhorn 2005. Anyway if someone live 100-300km far from Gifhorn its not a problem. But for me and my friends its 800km. Too far to drive only fo little fun, and in the best years the Poland Team was one of the biggest on fair, 10-11 persons) Money in this hobby is very importand thing. We love meteorites but time is not good and money are importand. I think how to sell to have money for next meteorites, You think how to buy cheap to get more pieces for Your collection. Buying and selling its just half of the fun in meteorite business. Not only hunt them, watch them, cut/polish them. I stoped buy meteorites for my collection. I have found other way. I buy meteorites for sale. It is fun for me and pleasure, also if this not bring me back big profits. And if in mean time some collectors will be happy from specimens that they purchased from me it is just extra profit for me. CU in Ensisheim -[ MARCIN CIMALA ]-[ I.M.C.A.#3667 ]- http://www.Meteoryt.net [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.PolandMET.com [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.Gao-Guenie.com GSM +48(607)535 195 [ Member of Polish Meteoritical Society ] __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
AW: [meteorite-list] Re: Clowns . was Self Proclaimed PairingsIssues(SPPI)
That Baygorra-scam, - no Rob, I'm thinking not about you, but mainly about a Russian ebay clown, was extremely harmful. Now whenever a IAB from Southamerica in a little large quantity will appear, it will be suspected to be Campo. I have to experience this, when I'm selling the Brazilian Uruacu iron for the poor finder. Although the pieces are all recorded, the strewnfield is known and in situ pics do exist, I can sell it only at ridiculous prices. People think it might be Campo, like it was with most of those Baygorrias, Additionally Wasson wrote that Uruacu would be undistinguishable from Campo, but I suppose he had only a little sample, as Uruacu is macroscopically very distinct from Campo, whenver a piece was cut, it explodes from cohenite, scattered in wormshaped inclusions through and through. To find so much cohenite in a Campo, one has to cut a lot of specimens. Well and that's a pity. With the NWAs the danger with self-claimed identifications is much larger than with meteorites with names, and so I think, that the not so experienced collectors at least, should be sensitized about that problem. In respect thereof, Adam's statement is more than legitimate. Clown Martin. -Ursprüngliche Nachricht- Von: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Im Auftrag von Rob Wesel Gesendet: Samstag, 6. Mai 2006 11:22 An: Adam Hupe Cc: Meteorite List Betreff: Re: [meteorite-list] Re: Clowns . was Self Proclaimed PairingsIssues(SPPI) Dr. Irving has earned a Ph.D. and the Nom Com votes on his submissions. I think these qualifications speak for themselves as far as qualifying rocks In a lab, I have no doubt. But in the field, wasn't the majority of the money for that trip spent on a rock that turned out to be a brick from a kiln? So perhaps cutting parties and field pairings won't count, OK Every stone from NWA 2999 had a piece removed, thin-sections made and were all studied. Every multiple stone classification sharing the same nomenclature was voted on and approved. You have already publicly admitted that NWA 1110 was visually paired by a scientist and not every piece was tested. So maybe you tested NWA 2999 ad nauseam, dwindling resources for non commercial actual science and raising the price to collectors, but that didn't apply to getting your Martian out in a hurry before hundreds more were found. Since when has NWA 1877 ever sold for a thousand a gram? I don't recall saying it did I see you stole information from an AGU copyrighted abstract, posted it on your site and gave credit to NASA for it. While stole is a bit strong, you have me there and I will look to correct it. I pulled the NWA 3133 abstract off the NASA Abstract page and failed to include the source. Now that I did have classified, by the same guy that did yours. I can't win with you. You just don't like competition do you? Are you still dealing Campo as something else? Please refer the IMCA's official stamen on Baygorria, you are a member aren't you? This all boils down to me not conforming to your rules and has nothing to do with NomCom, MetSoc or IMCA. I can offer material I feel is likely to be paired as such. In some cases I feel the need to classify and in others I don't. I am not comparing the subtleties of various H chondrites that look like every other H chondrite, this olivine diogenite is pretty distinct. With NWA 2651 which IS paired to NWA 3133 I felt I couldn't make the call so I had it classified. Let the collectors decide, they know who they are dealing with and the safety that I will guarantee their satisfaction. The IMCA says I will follow MetSoc naming/pairing rules. If you find me saying this olivine diogenite IS paired with NWA 1877 then I will be in violation. I have classified NWA 1877 material on my website, it's $50 per gram and anyone is welcome to buy it if they feel safer. My NWA 1929 has a similar pricing for those classified and likely paired http://www.nakhladogmeteorites.com/catalog/nwa1929.htm . So to accuse me of any dishonesty is ridiculous and an obvious ploy to detract sales. You went from talking about classification to accusing me of lying. You have simply been outmaneuvered on this one, I found a way to sell it faster than you and make customers (including MetSoc and IMCA members) happy. You make more money and sell more stones than me, be happy with that. Stop throwing mud, you are losing ground. Haven't seen much public rally to your cause. We can continue this off list, the archives are full of this repetitious argument. Rob Wesel http://www.nakhladogmeteorites.com -- We are the music makers... and we are the dreamers of the dreams. Willy Wonka, 1971 - Original Message - From: Adam Hupe [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Friday, May 05, 2006 9:57 PM Subject: [meteorite-list] Re: Clowns . was Self Proclaimed Pairings Issues(SPPI) Rob, Since you felt it necessary to step up, claim
AW: [meteorite-list] RE: Doing the rounds - Part II
Sphaera.
It was nothing else than the most copied, most widespread astronomical text
in mediaeval times. It was printed still in the 17th century.
At 1350 it was even translated by Konrad from Megenberg into German.
Monopoly to the universities had the Catholic Church.
Resume. Nobody throughout the whole mediaeval epoch seriously stated that
the Earth would be a flat disk.
Not only that Church never had any problems with a round world, it was no
institution else than the Church, who propagated and taught the model of a
round globe.
The flat-world is a myth, a legend of modern times.
Of course there where the crusades, the reconquista, the pogroms against
Jews, the persuasion of heretics,
But parallely on the field of science, religion didn't matter to the Church.
Ambitious the antique knowledge and the Islamic texts were collected and
adepted, often with the help of Jewish translators. Such Islamic authors
like Al Battani, as-Sufi, Thabit Ibn Qurra and many others were authorities
for the scientific Latin literature and in scientific things, the Church was
quite liberal.
Take the monk Virgil, who was officially accused because of his position in
the antipodes-question, later they made him to a bishop.
Problems church had with the heliocentric model,
but funny enough Copernicus was attacked firstly by protestants and not by
catholics.
Catholic savants didn't use Copernicus model, because it was complicate, as
Copernicus used so many auxiliary circles to get the computed positions of
the planets closer to the real ones,
and because it gave worse accurate positions than the old epicyclic
geocentric model.
Later catholic astronomers also used Kepler's model, although it was
heliocentric.
And finally I can't see what navigation added to that question or influenced
Copernicus, Brahe, Kepler.
Wasn't it 1760+ when Harrison built his famous clocks and finally the
navigators could pinpoint the longitude?
Copernicus despite the step forward, was of course a child of his time. He
knew the astronomical literature from those times and from the traditions I
mentioned, methodically he borrowed from al-Zarquali and Thabit, perhaps he
had even a Latin translation of the Arabian heliocentrist, whose name
doesn't come to my mind at present.
And remember Kepler, who spend so many years to collect weather data to find
the correlation with the horoscope; weather forecasts by astrology is a
complex, where hundreds of texts exist from mediaeval times.
For me the real emancipation from ancient and islamic astronomy starts with
Tycho Brahe, who as first perceived that large scale and fixed mounted
instruments together with the use of accurate clocks (and the that was
accidentally the time, when mechanical clocks became accurate - the use of
clocks in astronomy he learned from his mentor Wilhelm IV of Kassel),
Are necessary to obtain exact observations.
(humm, shall I tell, that he wrote also a treatise about the different
astrological systems of houses?).
O.k. - that was it, sorry if it was off-topic,
but maybe it was interesting.
Buckleboo!
Martin
-Ursprüngliche Nachricht-
Von: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Im Auftrag von Sterling
K. Webb
Gesendet: Freitag, 5. Mai 2006 07:53
An: Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com; Martin Altmann; 'Rob McCafferty'
Betreff: Re: [meteorite-list] RE: Doing the rounds
Martin, List,
Martin wrote:
...recently I read in two independent articles that in mediaeval
times people would have thought and church taught, that the
Earth would be a flat disk, cause a round world would have
been inconsistent with the bible. What an incredible rubbish!!
(that prejudice about the disk firstly appeared in 17th century).
Well, Martin, I hate to tell you, but it is NOT TRUE that it is a
modern prejudice that the Church taught that the world was flat.
The Early Father Lactantius wrote extensively against the rotundity
of the Earth from 302 AD to 323 AD and promoted a flat Earth
with a box lid of the heavens over it, the Tabernacle Earth. By
the mid-Fourth century, the vast majority if the patristic fathers
were opposed to a spherical Earth, a long list: Cyril of Jerusalem,
Diodorus of Tarsus, Philoponus, St. Jerome... But the chief
promulgator of Flat-Earthism was Cosmas.
Cosmas Indicopleustes ('India-voyager') of Alexandria was a
Greek sailor in the early 6th century who traveled to Ethiopia,
India and Sri Lanka. He then became a monk and before 550 AD
wrote a strange book, copiously illustrated. There can be few books
which have attracted more derision than the Christian Topography
of Cosmas Indicopleustes. It advances the idea that the world is flat,
and that the heavens form the shape of a box with a curved lid.
The author cites passages of scripture (inaccurately) to support his
thesis, and attempts to argue down the idea of a spherical earth by
stigmatizing it as 'pagan.' Cosmas was basically a poorly-educated
crank (internet-style) but through him
AW: [meteorite-list] RE: Doing the rounds -Part I
strongly influenced from 12th century on the European science had larger ratios, probably because the knew the Indian Ocean. They had a range from 4:1 (Abulfeda) up to 11:1 (Al Battani, called Albagtenius, Geber). Pierre d'Ailly quoted all this different ratios in his Ymago Mundi at the end of 14th century and also Columbus had a copy of it. Only the circumference of the globe was controversial. That type of maps you will find added in the texts of your mentioned Isidor de Sevilla (570-636), who indeed made no concrete assertions about the sape of the Earth, but the part with the 5 climatic zones, I don't know... And also Hrabanus Maurus (780-856) speaks not explicitely neither from a flat nor from a round world. The added maps one could read as disk or as globes. Perhaps those question wasn't so important? Important is the tradition founding on Beda Venerabilis (7./8.century), Because here we find not only the maps of the inhabited world, like with Isidor, but also schematic pictures with the climatic zones, hence the celestial circles (equator, arctic circles, tropical circles) depicted on the Earth as definition of the climatic zones. Of course those maps are flat, cause they are drawn in manuscripts, but with the best sake, it makes no sense to deduct the celestial circles as lines on a flat world and we have there on the one hand the maps with the inhabited world with Jerusalem as center together with schematic maps with the view on the equator (2 disks would be to stupid..). I tried to find a pic on web from the map in the Beda-tradition by Lambert of St.Otmer from the liber floridus from the bibliotheque municipale in St.Otmer, Cod. 779 92v-93r, from ca. 1120 AD, can't find it at the moment, It's not only more beautiful than that Lambert-map below, no, there is also fat and large written in that map: GLOBUS TERRE. Perhaps you'll find it. Here the same map, but not so beautiful from a 12th century manuscript in Wolfenbuettel. http://www.henry-davis.com/MAPS/EMwebpages/217A.html I forgot, that in medieavel maps East is always up. There you can see in the left part, that, what we saw also on the other maps: Europe, Asia, Africa in the middle you have the equator, with water, and the hypothetical 4th continent to the right. Here you have such another examples, depicting the globe seen from the equator, according to Ambrosius Theodosius Macrobius somnium Scipionis, Scipio's dream)(around 400 AD), an even older line of tradition, who was an authority for such important cleric savants like Honorius of Autun (+/- 1120AD), Albertus Magnus (1193-1280) or Thomas of Aquin (1225-1274). This map here was painted in 9th century: http://www.geog.uni-heidelberg.de/~ttavk/weltkarten/800%20_macrobius.jpg Here another one in the Macrobius-tradition: http://kuerzer.de/Macrobius Especially cruel it was, that those modern flat-Earthener-philologist, who used this maps as proof of their hypothesis, had torn them out of their contexts. Those maps weren't genuine inventions of those, who painted them, but are based on the cosmographic and encyclopaedic works of that time, some of them are even directly taken from manuscripts, where explicitely the shape of the Earth was explained as to be round like a ball in the text (also with the classic antique evidences given). Sterling, I will write a second part, because now I need a cup of coffee and to get a free brain, containing many sources telling the Earth to be a globe, from the times before that little treaty of 1250, you mentioned. I guess, you mean John of Hollywood's (Sacrobosco) Almagest excerpt De Sphaera? And some words about the enormous reception this treatise had. Though it is so difficult, because I could write pages and pages with names of mediaeval authors and sources, because all have a globe and not a disk and in fact it is horribly difficult to find only a single one, who stated in that period of time the Earth to be a flat disk. I hope it's not boring, but I'm so enerved by this popular myth being still reproduced. Buckleboo Martin the Mythbuster PS: Sorry for my rough English. -Ursprüngliche Nachricht- Von: Sterling K. Webb [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Gesendet: Freitag, 5. Mai 2006 07:53 An: Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com; Martin Altmann; 'Rob McCafferty' Betreff: Re: [meteorite-list] RE: Doing the rounds Martin, List, Martin wrote: ...recently I read in two independent articles that in mediaeval times people would have thought and church taught, that the Earth would be a flat disk, cause a round world would have been inconsistent with the bible. What an incredible rubbish!! (that prejudice about the disk firstly appeared in 17th century). Well, Martin, I hate to tell you, but it is NOT TRUE that it is a modern prejudice that the Church taught that the world was flat. The Early Father Lactantius wrote extensively against the rotundity of the Earth from 302 AD to 323 AD and promoted a flat Earth with a box lid
AW: [meteorite-list] Self Proclaimed Pairings Issues (SPPI)
Shalala. Mainly for a dealer it is a economical decision, whether a stone has to be classified. Classification means: To deposite a share of 20% or 20g, to wait a year++ until a stone is ready for sale or to pay for the classification. A collector has to think about the abilities of a seller, to judge whether a stone is paired or not and then he might get a stone cheaper than the same classified material. But be told, that out there are amateur dealers, to which I could give a piece of the curbstone in front of my house, which, if they would be told, that it is a nakhlite, they would sell it as a nakhlite. Also if the seller has it from the same source like the seller, who let the material properly classify, you never can't be sure. I remember Besedin asking about the Marses paired to NWA 1110. Voilá take this page: http://www.meteorites-r-us.com/subcategory.cfm?subcat_id=221 These individual fragments still exhibit the orange-ish desert coating proving... Folks, Stefan and me took most probably from the same source as many others did, those Marses. This Nelson Oakes was even to lazy to clean his crumbs, states by his own decision, that his pieces are paired with NWA 1110, avoides hence the loss and costs by classification and asks 800$/g. We carefully cleaned each crumb we received from our source and a quarter of the material turned out to be limestone, after the dirt crust was removed. Our material we had let classified. We gave the 20% deposit share, we paid for the thin section and the analyses and finally, because the classification wasn't done yet, although with our own ability and under the microscope we saw, that the sorted out pieces were indeed Mars, we asked 300$/g of course with the guarantee to take the specimens back with full refund, if they would turn out not to be that, as what we sold them. Buy from this Oakes, who has a certain reputation, and you can't be sure, whether you get a limestone and that you pay for that 3 times more, although he was to scrooge to bear the expences for the classification. I think, that's what Greg wanted to express. Of course you can have luck and get the real McCoy, if you take an unclassified piece, wherefrom the seller claims, that it is paired with a known number, but also be aware that you might not get that, what you have paid for. So we reduce that question to the old sentence: Know your sellers. Buckleboo Martin PS: This is no ad, our Marses were sold out months ago. -Ursprüngliche Nachricht- Von: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Im Auftrag von stan . Gesendet: Freitag, 5. Mai 2006 23:04 An: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Betreff: RE: [meteorite-list] Self Proclaimed Pairings Issues (SPPI) when there is a way to be sure you're getting the real deal and the IMCA are helping in that regard. well thats the thing. following 'the rules' as Adam put it isnt a sure fire was of making sure you have a 100% guagantee of buying what you thought you were buying. There have been many cases of 'musical classifications' in the past and this will continue in the future. Furthermore when a new find is classified that consists of many stones / fragments TYPICALLY a type specimin is not provided for each and every single fragment of meteorite recovered. What does that mean? well from one extreem it means that the holder of the find is self pairing all of the material to that of the rock that the type specimin came from or at best a researcher is doing a cursory examination of all the fragments, but not the full battery of tests that are required to confirm an 'offical' pairing. The typical procedure is that any mass reported before a classification is published becomes 'official' - if it is not reported in time then a whole slew of testing must be preformed to verify a pairing - testing that is not required for specimins that do not have a type specimin submitted for if they are reported in time. This is the root of most discontent with the whole 'number' game. __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
AW: [meteorite-list] Its Spring !
Yes Marcin it is. And your great photos encourage the collectors after that long winter, to set the old brown stones aside, the meteoriticists to leave their microscopes and the sellers to crawl out from their stifling holes away from the computer, to get out on the fresh air and to enjoy. So will I do now, but not before to point the crazy NWA 4040 out to you, which Stefan set on his page for sale: http://www.meteoriten.com/special.html ,which is as varied and diversified as a flowering spring meadow. And again Stefan, you didnt find the right price. I told you, that it would be good for minimum 15/g. Be quick, at least here in Europe list mails have since a while a delay of 1-2 days. And now I should throw some Heine and Moerike into babelfish ., but I rather run to the woods. Buckleboo! Martin Von: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Im Auftrag von Marcin Cimala - PolandMET Gesendet: Mittwoch, 3. Mai 2006 16:16 An: Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Betreff: [meteorite-list] Its Spring ! OK, I know, its totally Off Topic, but, who know if on one of my photos is somewhere any meteorite lay underground. (Yes I know, sorry for my Cimala-like english) Its photos from tooday, from my garden and nearest forest. On first photos is unique flower that exist only in my region. Its beautifull. http://www.meteoryt.net/ebay/wiosna.htm have fun ! -[ MARCIN CIMALA ]-[ I.M.C.A.#3667 ]- http://www.Meteoryt.net [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.PolandMET.com [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.Gao-Guenie.com GSM +48(607)535 195 [ Member of Polish Meteoritical Society ] __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
AW: [meteorite-list] RE: Doing the rounds
In fact without the church, we really would live in a dark age nowadays. Smth which is always forgotten, as the discipline of History of Science is mainly philology, a branch which since decades isn't directly en vogue. For a period of about 800 years the church was the only institution collecting knowledge, doing science and educating students. And nowadays we wouldn't for sure live in such a technically and scientifically developed (socially I'm not so sure) world, if there wasn't done the enormous transfer of knowledge by the clerics in mediaeval times of the classical sciences, which the Islamic scientist rescued and enlarged. Already before 1000 A.D. the first Arabian texts (btw. Astronomical treaties) were translated to Latin by monks, take as an example the manual for using the planispheric astrolabe by Gerbert d'Aurillac (950 - 1003), the later pope Sylvester II. and in the main stream later in 13.th century it was of course also the church, who cared for translating and spread the scientific literature from islamic occupied Spain, mainly with the help of Mozarabs and bilingual jewish savants. Copernicus, Brahe, Kepler weren't isolated ingenious solitaires, they founded on a tradition and a 600 years lasting history of ideas, collected and taught by the scholars of the church. Without church no antique knowledge, no renaissance, no reconnaissance, no modern science. It is astonishing to me, how few is taught today about those for the development of the occident most important period in history on universities. For astronomers physicists science starts with Newton, as science would fall suddenly like an apple from a tree and the philologists, who could read the texts, rather like to occupy with novels about knights and stuff, and the normal consumers see on cinema Giordano burning, a pissed-off Gallilei sitting in his villa, or think, that Columbus' achievement beside of the enormous size of his nose was, that he didn't fell off from the disk or are lost in the mists of Avalon. Imagine, recently I read in two independent articles in the largest German astronomy (one was from a Prof. of physics) magazine, that in mediaeval times people would have thought and church taught, that the Earth would be a flat disk, cause a round world would have been inconsistent with the bible. What an incredible rubbish!! (that prejudice about the disk firstly appeared in 17th century). Buckleboo Martin -Ursprüngliche Nachricht- Von: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Im Auftrag von Rob McCafferty Gesendet: Freitag, 5. Mai 2006 00:23 An: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Betreff: [meteorite-list] RE: Doing the rounds Don't worry about getting excommunicated. They can't do that unless you're already a member. Though maybe you are. Incidentally, the Vatican's position has softened tremendously in the last few years. BBC Radio Scotland had the Vatican's Meteorite representative on at about 830am this morning. I didn't even know they had one of the worlds largest meteorite collections let alone a representative to talk about it. I missed a lot of it because out on this island, the reception isn't great and it's even worse since I tore the ariel off the roof putting my car in a ditch a couple of months back. What I did pick up was that they agree with the scientists over the age of the Earth and theologically speaking, they have no problem with any of the theories over the creation of the universe or even the concept of life on other planets. Galileo has had 10 years to recover from the burns of hell now so I'm sure he feels pretty vindicated. House arrest isn't so bad, not if you've got a telescope, a microscope, some meteorites and the internet so he must have enjoyed it about 25% by my maths. As a scientist who is a Christian, a lot of people as me about the church changing it's stance over Galileo. I tend to be rather glib in my response. The wittiest repost is along the lines of, He got out of Hell on appeal which is no surprise because guess where all the lawyers are It's a larf innit? Rob McC __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
AW: [meteorite-list] New price of hunting meteorites!
Dave, try this, but dont be so cruel and don't find the Albin main mass of a ton. 2 carrots/hour. http://www.lokfuehrer-hamburg.de/esel.jpg Bavaria: diesel 5.40$ premium 6.39$ -Ursprüngliche Nachricht- Von: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Im Auftrag von Dave Freeman mjwy Gesendet: Dienstag, 2. Mai 2006 04:28 An: Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Betreff: [meteorite-list] New price of hunting meteorites! Dear List; Here's the new price of hunting meteorites in SW Wyoming. regular unleaded $2.41 diesel 2.51 premium 2.61 real cost: driving for ever and not finding any. Best, Dave F. __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
AW: [meteorite-list] Fwd: Hunk of Burnin' ... ?Hunky Hocky Puck?
I recieved that message too with a picture. If the piece is a meteorite at all, it is much to weathered to originate from a recent fall. The story has a smell. I guess Mr. Lajos found it in the fireplace, where he's cooking his pörkölt. Jó étvátgyat! Martin -Ursprüngliche Nachricht- Von: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Im Auftrag von Robert Verish Gesendet: Samstag, 29. April 2006 02:19 An: Meteorite-list Meteoritecentral Betreff: [meteorite-list] Fwd: Hunk of Burnin' ... ?Hunky Hocky Puck? - Forward to IMCA - From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2006 09:59:17 +0200 Subject:1991 MUSEUM DIREKTION Dear Professor! We have a 0,40 kg (399 grams) meteorite, which broke my brothers garage door 15 years ago at dawn; If you are interested in it, we would be pleased to sell it to you. According to the descriptions, we believe that this meteorite is of Mars origin. I can send you a picture of it this Wednesday. http://marzmeteorite.tripod.com/mars-rocks/meteorit_hu.jpg GB Tisztelt Professzor Úr Jó napot kívánok, van egy 0, 40 kg (399 gramm) meteoritunk, ami 15 évvel ezelõtt egy hajnalban törte át az öcsém garázsajtaját. A napokban tudtuk meg, hogy Önök vásárolnak fel meteoritot, ha érdekli Önöket, akkor szívesen eladnánk. A leírások alapján nagyon úgy néz ki, hogy a nálunk lévõ darab Mars bolygó eredetû. E hét szerdán képet is tudok róla küldeni. H Sehr geehrter Herr Professor, Guten Tag, vor 15 Jahren, an einem Frühmorgen, wurde die Garagen-Tür meines Bruders von einem Meteorit- Stück von 0,40 kg (399 Gramm) eingeschlagen. In diesen Tagen erfuhren wir, indem Sie solche Meteoriten ankaufen würden. Sollten Sie daran Interesse haben, dann würden wir es Ihnen sehr gerne verkaufen. Laut Beschreibungen sieht so aus, als wäre es vom Mars gekommen. Am Mittwoch dieser Woche kann ich Ihnen auch ein Foto darüber schicken. D Gentile signor Professore, Buongiorno, noi abbiamo un meteorite da 0,40 kg, (399 grammi) che in unalba, 15 anni fa ci ha rotto la porta del garage del mio fratello. Abbiamo appreso solo in questi giorni che Voi acquistate tali meteoriti, cosi la mia domanda a Voi è: se naveste linteresse, Ve lo vendessimo volentieri. Secondo le descrizioni può darsi che il meteorite in nostro possesso avrebbe la provenienza dal Marte. Una foto di questo, io potrei mandarvi questo mercoledì. I Lajos Molnár Sales-Manager /Interprete a traduttore (H-I-D) H-1046 Budapest, Via : Farkaserdõ u.7 X/55 Tel/ Fax: 0036 -1-3-807-334, Cell: 0036-20-588-1652. E-Mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] o [EMAIL PROTECTED] Web: http://eu-xoron.fw.hu Budapest, 28-04-2006. __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
AW: [meteorite-list] ...and treasure hunting (a rant)... and astrology!
Humm, I have a question, which is spooking in my mind concerning astrology. Well to the planets (incl. Sun, Moon) were ascribed basic properties like cold, hot, humid, dry. For the horoscope one takes their position related to the sections of ecliptic, who again have those basic properties and this whole, how it lies in the sections of the houses for the point of time and for the geographical place wherein or for the prediction should be made. (well in medieval times there were 6 concurring ways of drawing the lines of houses, I guess today most use that of Regiomontanus, where unfortunately all Inuit have the same fate...). + some simple angles between them and other points. I saw also, that nowadays the modern planets are in use too, Uranus, Neptun and Pluto and even Vesta!! Well, if I would take now all known asteroids from the main belt and attribute to them, as they have similar distances and circulation times, the same attributes, then, because of their large number and their homogenous distribution, the other planets have no significance anymore and each horoscope for each place and time would be always the same, wouldn't it? So I guess one could answer to the Deep Impact-Lady: It simply doesn't matter. I think I should be an astrologer, more money to make as with stones from the skies and with my new idea, it would be a very comfort job. (Hula! Mr Hulk Starrockers has some rare names micros on ebay. Peace River, Waconda, New Concord, Kernouve, Ibbenbueren - I guess somewhere in stock we have also some Vouille, Beenham, Warrenton, Bremervoerde, Kesen, Hvittis and more of the above mentioned and if someone is hungry for a 53kg Uruacu, just gimme a hint. I didn't made an Ad for sooo long time!) Buckleboo! (The Kammels send me so many photos of the Buckleboo place!!!) Martin -Ursprüngliche Nachricht- Von: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Im Auftrag von tracy latimer Gesendet: Freitag, 28. April 2006 19:37 An: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Betreff: [meteorite-list] Meteorites, science, and treasure hunting (a rant) After reading some of the earlier posts to the lists, I got on my high horse and fired off a message that apparently got lost on the way. That's good, because it was fairly mean-spirited; a private message from Mr. T in response to an earlier post was much more civil in tone. I didn't need to jump into the pigpen with both feet. After consideration (and a break to tone things down), I stand by much of what I said in my earlier, regretted post: was anything of significant cultural or scientific value actually harmed by this admittedly somewhat commercial venture? Was the boost to science outweighed by any damage done? There seems to be a trend toward modern Luddites, who try to slow or stop anything resembling scientific progress in the name of ill-considered 'sensitivities': ecological, cultural, or other. Science must be respectful of these things, but it shouldn't come to a screeching halt without good reason, and too many of the reasons being promoted today are someone else's personal bee in the bonnet, without equally good science to back it up. One of the examples I gave was the woman who attempted to sue NASA over the Deep Impact project; she claimed it interfered with her astrological projections! Until an artifact is located, examined, and curated, it's nothing but an interesting feature rotting in the dirt. Respectfully, Tracy Latimer __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
AW: [meteorite-list] TAGISH LAKE NEWS / Question to List
I say: ALH84001 for the press. Kaidun for the type freaks. Tucson Ring for the Americans Nogata for the history lovers Buckleboo for me. Or Hoba for dinner. Skol Martin _ Von: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Im Auftrag von Darryl Pitt Gesendet: Samstag, 22. April 2006 13:24 An: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Betreff: [meteorite-list] TAGISH LAKE NEWS / Question to List The appearance of the following story had me wondering what everyone thinks are, commercially speaking, the most valuable meteoriteslets say meteorites (or large specimens thereof) which are both institutionally and privately heldyour TOP FIVE of each. Thanks! Look! On the ground! It's $750,000 worth of rock! http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/story/RTGAM.20060422.wxmeteorite22/B NStory/Science/home http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/story/RTGAM.20060422.wxmeteorite22/B NStory/Science/home Globe and Mail - Canada Calgary To scientists, they are priceless clues about the origins of life, but now, six years after he found some frozen meteorite fragments that weigh ... See all stories on this topic http://news.google.com/news?ie=utf8oe=utf8persist=1hl=enclient=googlen cl=http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/story/RTGAM.20060422.wxmeteorite22 /BNStory/Science/home http://news.google.com/news?ie=utf8oe=utf8persist=1hl=enclient=googlen cl=http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/story/RTGAM.20060422.wxmeteorite22 /BNStory/Science/home _ This as-it-happens Google Alert is brought to you by Google. Remove http://www.google.com/alerts/remove?s=EEAw0F1e4UgXdEXgxdbx7DAhl=en http://www.google.com/alerts/remove?s=EEAw0F1e4UgXdEXgxdbx7DAhl=en this alert. Create http://www.google.com/alerts?hl=en http://www.google.com/alerts?hl=en another alert. Manage http://www.google.com/alerts/manage?hl=en http://www.google.com/alerts/manage?hl=en your alerts. -- End of Forwarded Message __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
AW: [meteorite-list] Treasure
You'd sell human remains to the highest bidder if it were legal. Well, check those ebay category: Collectibles Religions, Spirituality Christianity Relics Buckleboo, Martin PS: Who is just back from inundated South-Romania with the pockets full of samples of the new fall. No, just a joke. Bad terrain, mountains up to 1500m, forest.. I guess, the probability, that it will be found is very low. Von: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Im Auftrag von Thaddeus Besedin Gesendet: Donnerstag, 27. April 2006 04:35 An: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Betreff: [meteorite-list] Treasure I'm referring to the pits that you are digging, not indices of impact force that scar the earth, such as craters. I am not calling meteorites relics - it is the presentation of meteorite hunting by this particular program as tantamount to treasure (cultural relic ) hunting with impunity. This relic hunting is being promoted by your show. The impact is great: it costs us all our cultural heritage. Meteorite hunting is not the problem. How many times must I repeat this? It is the attitude that is the problem. You do realize that no matter when the fall happened, Brenham meteorites were either observed by humans, a threat to life in the strewn field (with obvious ecological implications), or buried beneath sediments possibly containing traces of events too small for your slobbering regard. EBay: you said it all. You'd sell human remains to the highest bidder if it were legal __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
AW: [meteorite-list] Repost, no replies. Meteorite living database
Hi Kevin, There was such a project with most of those specifications a while ago (worlf-of-meteorites by Bernhard Rems), but it had to be shut down, because of the mere feedback of the collectors. On another project is orking at present Pierre-Marie Pelé, let's hope, that he will have a better feedback. Cheers! Martin -Ursprüngliche Nachricht- Von: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Im Auftrag von Kevin Forbes Gesendet: Dienstag, 4. April 2006 15:21 An: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Betreff: [meteorite-list] Repost, no replies. Meteorite living database Hello all, I am reposting this as there were no replies at all. Was it such a bad idea?? Hi list, I would like to propose the development online, with all your help and input, A living upadatedable database for our collections and items for sale. The database would of couse have to have live ONLINE on someones server that has 24/7 online access. I suggest that it be in a format that allows a personal copy for each meteorite collector to be run on their own machine. That the copy on each collectors machine maintain a valid database of their own collection,. It should allow for media files of specimens to be displayed., BMP, JPG, MPEG, whatever. And that their database, occassioanally, or at will, update the main database server. The intention of updating the database server is so that all other users databases are also updated with the latest information, which should include, New additions to personal collections, New additions to items for sale, New additions to the Met Bull, etc. I am somewhat fluent in Borland Delphi, but help is always appreciated. This may be above me in the world these days, I don't know, unless we try. I know that there are a lot of programmers out there, and lots of languages, maybe we can get something together? I think this would be a serious contribution towards the study, specimen location, and availability of specimens on the internet and indeed the world, once completed and operational. If the collector does not wish their items to be displayed to the world, the program should run in, PERSONAL MODE. (but that anyone running in personal mode be displayed to other users as such) I posess, a personal Borland Delphi license, which means that any software that I develop, must be totally free to users. (which has always been the case, see Ford Decoding, google) If I purchase a commercial license, I can sell it. About $ 1500 USD At the moment, everything is free. All your suggestions are welcome. A thought I had. :-) Cheers all, Kevin, VK3UKF. __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
AW: [meteorite-list] International shipping isssues
Hi Harlan, Adam Since 6 years, Im shipping to and am recieving parcels from many different countries and all continents. Whole Europe (only Slowakia, Slowenia, Norway, Portugal, Andorra, Albania, Monaco, Vatican, Moldawia, Iceland, Liechtenstein, Latvia, Estonia, Greece, Bulgaria, Belarus and Ukraine I hadnt yet), USA Canada, AustraliaNew Zealand, Far East, several countries in Africa, Middle South America. In all this years a single letter disappeared - was from USA to Germany and once a parcel from Morocco was sent back without any reason, well and about 90% of all, which is thicker than a normal letter containing a single sheet of paper from Germany to Walachia, a somewhat special region in Romania, to other regions of that country there were no problems. (No disquiets for those, who always collect stuff for the poor children there, Im sending the cases with a private bus company, everything arrives). Another exception shall be Russia, where I heard it is impossible to send from and to send to, as there would be stolen a similar percentage as in Walachia. Special caution also need shipments from USA to Iran and vice versa, as your partner in Iran may get troubles, there its better to ship it with a stop in Europe. So Harlan, with a loss of less then one-tenth of a percent, Id say international shipping is save. My stuff from Germany to USA takes by airmail in general 5 10days. Without airmail in general not more than 3 weeks. Only once it took 5 weeks in the X-mas traffic, but from time to time slow ship is as fast as airmail. I learned from a post employee, that no matter whether it is labelled as airmail or slow mail, all items from Germany to U.S. are sent together by plane. How long it takes then, depends on the US-services. I remember the time after Sep-11, there obviously the shipments were checked more carefully and there were some remarkable delays. Vice versa from US to Germany it takes quite the same time. But remarkable delays can happen, if customs gets the parcel (about 7% are x-rayed at present). Often not before 2 or 3 weeks one finds a note in the letter box, that one has to appear at the office. (record was 5 weeks). Delays caused by the customs can be accelerated, if either the addressee has a registered customs number (like a firm) or if a high value is declared on the green sticker. In both cases the addressee has to pay taxes and most are not willing to do so. Registered letters seem to be treated better, from my experience, there unexplicable delays occure more rarely. But again, the shipping rate is higher, and most addressees dont want to pay it. Most losses seems to appear on-the-spot at the addressees, who suffer from the disaffection of their very local delivery personnel. Some of my collectors ask me always to send registered with personal hand-over, as quite often the stuff doesnt arrive, no matter from where it was sent. Others have somewhat strange postmans, who insist that the names of all inhabitants of the apartment must be noted on the envelope ect. And this might also explain e.g. that Matteo complained that several shipments didnt arrive, while other Italian collectors have no problems. Buckleboo! Martin Von: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Im Auftrag von harlan trammell Gesendet: Donnerstag, 30. März 2006 19:59 An: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com; [EMAIL PROTECTED] Betreff: RE: [meteorite-list] International shipping isssues international shipping is 100% risk- insurance stops at the border and once it is out of our hands (U.S.) they might get it, or they might not. i try to make my buyers aware of that. i have had fair luck w/ fed-ex, but there is no legit insurance. once it leaves our borders, i really wonder what the incentive is to deliver it at all. i will be gradually switching over to yahoo mail (it has 100 FREE megs of storage). please cc to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] From: Adam Hupe [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Subject: [meteorite-list] International shipping isssues Date: Thu, 30 Mar 2006 07:44:19 -0800 Dear List, I was wondering if anybody else is having problems with shipping to other countries, specifically Germany? It seems that about every six months I go through a cycle were things are seriously delayed or in rare cases lost when using USPS Airmail to Germany. I have made hundreds of international shipments and have only had one other incident with another country outside of Germany and this was only a delay. I always ship within 24 hours of payment and to have something take over 30 days is unacceptable. Can anybody tell me how the German postal systems works and why it is so inconsistent? I have had 14 incidences with shipments to Germany the last two years: 10-with month or better delays 2- lost for over six months and returned to me even though the address' were correct 1-opened with no item
[meteorite-list] Lampiayrie - classification question
Hola list? What happened to the classification of that fall from Burkina Faso, called Lampiayrie ?? Felt Nov. 2003. Looks like brecciated, equilibrated L or LL. Can't be that difficult... Some said 2 years ago, that it's under classification, But I never heard a result. Where is the problem, I guess it's more interesting to bring an observed fall to classification, then the 200st wheathered NWA-L5. My collectors are wondering. Any news? Marcin? Mike? Buckleboo! Martin __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
AW: [meteorite-list] Water fun
How high was the cut loss? Did you also try to cut irons? -Ursprüngliche Nachricht- Von: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Im Auftrag von [EMAIL PROTECTED] Gesendet: Montag, 20. März 2006 16:25 An: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Betreff: [meteorite-list] Water fun Grrr my 4th try.. Hi As a person who like test new tortue techniques on meteorites I was very happy when one private industrial factory purchased first in whole region equipment to cut using high presure water. Machinery was 1 month old and when I told them what I want try to cut 3/4 of live personel come and watch cutting process. I take my 3kg SAU001 half specimen to try cut it. Cutting surface was 10cm long and 9cm high. Ofcourse this is not the best way to cut stones, but I was very curious how will look cut surface. I tell them to change cutting speed 3 times. They start cut with 20mm/min and this was too fast, hen 5 and 10mm per minute. Here is results http://www.meteoryt.net/ebay/prefel1.jpg http://www.meteoryt.net/ebay/prefel2.jpg http://www.meteoryt.net/ebay/prefel3.jpg Now Im looking only for laser and plasma cutting equipment to produce some ataxites from my morasko :) PS, anyone interested in water cutted slice of Sau001 307g ? :D -[ MARCIN CIMALA ]-[ I.M.C.A.#3667 ]- http://www.Meteoryt.net [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.PolandMET.com [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.Gao-Guenie.com GSM +48(607)535 195 [ Member of Polish Meteoritical Society ] __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Happy Birthday Dirk Ross!
Our man in Far East is bringing the spring! May his countenance stay free of shock veines also for the next 3 halves of his life and may he find as much glass in the ground as he can carry! Cheers! Buckleboo. __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
AW: [meteorite-list] Semi-Ad: Opinion asked
Hi Dean, I see no problems at all. Such auctions provides only detailed information about phenomenons appearing in meteorites and they are not thought to stand up to other offerors or auctions. If I'm already writing, I have a question: Benld hit a Pontiac Coupe, Peekskill a Chevy Malibu, Neagari a Subaru Leone 4WD, But what for a model was the Worden car? Meow? Martin -Ursprüngliche Nachricht- Von: dean bessey [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Gesendet: Freitag, 17. März 2006 21:45 An: Martin Altmann; meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Betreff: Re: [meteorite-list] Semi-Ad: Opinion asked You have to be careful with Information auctions. About a year ago several people on a coin discussion group that I am a member of decided to try this and warn people about ancient fake coins and a couple got suspended from ebay. (Unlike meteorites Ancient Coin fakes are a SERIOUS problem on ebay). If you in any way imply that there are fakes listed on ebay and give ways to avoid them you could well run into problems with ebay (Ebay dont like you saying that there are fakes listed on their site). So if somebody else is planning to do something similar educating or warning potential buyers about fakes using info auctions be careful that you dont cross ebays fake info line. That being said my personal opinion is that this can be a good idea and as long as the text is kept in the positive and dont get to detailed on sellers it should be OK. (ie: Say this is how to tell a genuine meteorite and not If somebody in an ebay auction says this then it is a fake). There is a fine line here and wither you get in trouble with ebay could well be dependant on who at ebay looks over the complaint. Cheers DEAN __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
AW: AW: AW: [meteorite-list] Empty quarter expedition
they found no meteorites, why afterwards the commercial hunters had in the very same fields remarkable finds - with the aim to animate you instead of disavow those hunters to invite them to join the Suisse team. With an adequate payment for them, it would be a perfect win/win situation, cause the expeditions most probably would have better results and those greedy depredators wouldn't have to sell their finds at the doubled kg-price of Emmentaler cheese anylonger. Sorry for my remarks being somewhat longish, for most members of this forum those issues are known, obvious and evident (and I presume that e.g. Beda Hofmann wouldn't share the perspective of Prof.Matter neither), but as here on this list are also several new collectors, I thought it was necessary to avoid them getting wrong impressions. Regards, Martin Altmann -Ursprüngliche Nachricht- Von: stan . [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Gesendet: Freitag, 17. März 2006 03:05 An: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED]; meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Betreff: RE: AW: AW: [meteorite-list] Empty quarter expedition 5) Collecting of meteorites and of any other samples in Antarctica falls under the Antarctic Treaty and has to be approved by the mission leader. All samples must be listed and recorded. Despite of this the US legislators saw the need to pass a bill which declares unauthorized possession and trading of meteorites as illegal. Why do you think this action was necessary?? if you look at the legislation in question you will see that the ban was passed because the us had signed but not yet ratified the antarctic treaty, so it was not in legal force. furthermore the legislation does not declares unauthorized possession and trading of meteorites as illegal in any way shape or form. it simply states that minerlogic activities must be for research, not commerical. there is no prohibitation of private ownership of antarctic meteorites, not any body that 'authorizes' collection. should a private party wish to collect metoeirtes from antarctica they are free do do so per the previously mentioned conditions. __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Semi-Ad: Opinion asked
Hola list, what do you think about that kind of auction, my friend Dr.Brinker set up? Item number: 6612147920 http://cgi.ebay.com/BA-s-Meteorites-Consultation-Hour_W0QQitemZ6612147920QQc ategoryZ3239QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem Thanks! Martin __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
AW: AW: [meteorite-list] Empty quarter expedition
you instead of disavow those hunters to invite them to join the Suisse team. With an adequate payment for them, it would be a perfect win/win situation, cause the expeditions most probably would have better results and those greedy depredators wouldn't have to sell their finds at the doubled kg-price of Emmentaler cheese anylonger. Sorry for my remarks being somewhat longish, for most members of this forum those issues are known, obvious and evident (and I presume that e.g. Beda Hofmann wouldn't share the perspective of Prof.Matter neither), but as here on this list are also several new collectors, I thought it was necessary to avoid them getting wrong impressions. Regards, Martin Altmann -Ursprüngliche Nachricht- Von: Albert Matter [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Gesendet: Mittwoch, 15. März 2006 13:06 An: Martin Altmann Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Betreff: Re: AW: [meteorite-list] Empty quarter expedition After Compliments, The accusations made in this e-mail letter and the partly unprofessional statements require an answer and clarifications. What has the unprofessional statement concerning publishing in GeoArabia to do with the issue under question? I am a sedimentologist/geochemist and have amongst other projects on the hydrogeology of Oman and paleoclimate of southern Arabia over many years carried out with my teams basic research on basin analysis and diagenesis of hydrocarbon bearing basins in many countries from Indonesia to the Americas and from the North Sea to the Mediterranean Basin. Why do you think the petroleum industry was keen to collaborate with us and providing access to their wealth of unpublished data and especially core samples which made the projects in the first place possible? Because it was a win/win situation for both sides! Why then should we not publish in GeoArabia or in the Bulletin of the American Petroleum Geologists? By the way these projects were generally supported by Swiss grants. I have been invited to take part in the Rub' Al Khali Expedition because of my broad experience in different fields relating to arid lands. One of the main goals of the reconnaissance trip is to propose research projects. In addition to projects in my own fields I have represented the interests of the meteorite team of our Institute which is spearheaded by Dr. E. Gnos and Dr. B. Hofmann. Note that I myself have never ever worked on meteorites but I am well informed on meteorite research and problems related to it. My statement which is my personal view concerning robbing of natural heritage is based on following facts: 1) Omani meteorites have been out for sale already a few years ago (partly at horrendous prices) 2) The large iron meteorite from Wabar (=Al Hadeedah) was about to be smuggled out of Saudi Arabia. This action could be stopped virtually in the last minute by the Saudis. Now you can admire this meteorite in the new museum in Riyadh. 3) It took Dr. John Roobol a few minutes only to find in the internet the price list of Wabar meteorite rocks of different kinds on sale in the US. Try yourself! 4) A large number of meteorites have been collected from the Omani desert and will never return 5) Collecting of meteorites and of any other samples in Antarctica falls under the Antarctic Treaty and has to be approved by the mission leader. All samples must be listed and recorded. Despite of this the US legislators saw the need to pass a bill which declares unauthorized possession and trading of meteorites as illegal. Why do you think this action was necessary?? The meteorite research project of Drs Gnos and Hofmann is supported by a grant of the Swiss National Science Foundation, the main granting agency for basic research in Switzerland. As former vice-president of the National Research Council of Swiss NSF I can assure you that this project which is a Swiss-Omani Cooperation would not have been approved without authorization by the responsible Omani institution to collect meteorites. Why? Because Swiss NSF would have considered unauthorized collecting as unethical. Moreover, a contract regulates the problem of the storage of the samples. You measure the success of collecting in grams. Whether this is appropriate I would question; it is similar to measuring the publication record of a scientist in kilograms rather than by impact factor. Fact is that the Swiss-Omani Teams has so far collected more than 4500 pieces, of which more than 3000 from a single strewn field. More important however to me is the quality of the research carried out on the material. And there I think their Science paper is a highlight - and much more is to come. With regards to the webpage: Go to www.geo.unibe.ch where you can find under Publikationen the full list of all the members of our Institute, or search under the name of the author e.g. Gnos. You
AW: [meteorite-list] Clear Coat Iron Slices?
Hi Walter, how could you dare!! Only one meteorite related topic per week please :-) A coating is a better rust protection than keeping slices oiled. Nevertheless I use coatings only in cases, where oiling doesn't help, as the slices aren't looking so pretty after a coating. They get unnaturally shiny and fine details like Neumann lines are with the then different refraction of the light aren't so well visible anymore. And as a primitive, haptically oriented guy, I don't like, if smth is inbetween me and my meteorite. Any clear varnish will work, important is only, that it is soluble in acetone (most are), so that it can easily be removed, if the slice starts again to rust. A hint, if the coating is to glossy, just wipe it a little bit with a cloth soaked in acetone, it will get more dull. Second hint, let the varnish slowly harden. Don't use a hair-dryer as it will get hard first on the surface and the layers below will get little cracks, which doesn't look fine. Buckleboo! Martin -Ursprüngliche Nachricht- Von: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Im Auftrag von Walter Branch Gesendet: Montag, 13. März 2006 02:52 An: Meteorite List Betreff: [meteorite-list] Clear Coat Iron Slices? Hello Everyone, I was wondering if anyone had an opinion on coating iron slices with some type of clear coat to help prevent rust? Pros? Cons? Would driving off as much water as possible then applying the clear coat work? Are harmful gasses trapped by the process? Any discussion or opinions would be appreciated. -Walter Branch __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
AW: [meteorite-list] Empty quarter expedition
Hi Frederic, list I have to add, that I learned yesterday from a Suisse list member, that this Prof. Albert Matter was never a member of the Suisse meteorite expeditions. Nor could I find any publications by him about meteorites, he seems to be only a specialist for sediments. So probably a person, who has no idea what he's talking about (but why then he talks at all...). Buckleboo! Martin -Ursprüngliche Nachricht- Von: Meteoriteshow [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Gesendet: Montag, 13. März 2006 11:52 An: Martin Altmann; [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED]; meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Betreff: Re: [meteorite-list] Empty quarter expedition I 100% agree with you Martin. This is becoming almost impossible for meteorite hunters to find a place where it is now allowed to go hunting and even when finding a new strewnfield, it is getting forbidden as soon as we find some meteorites! And then the place becomes 'sterile' as no one else will take the risk to spend money in organising an expedition... Finally, reaching an agreement with an institution to go hunting seems to be some kind of dream for the moment... I do not really understand why as when offering such a possibility, we clearly show that most of us do not hunt meteorites in order to become millionnaires, but by passion. Anyway, let's hope that things may change one of these days... Best meteoritical wishes Frederic Beroud http://www.meteoriteshow.com IMCA member # 2491 (http://www.imca.cc/) __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
AW: [meteorite-list] OT/AD Meteoritecrime:??METEORITE-FUNNY-RABBIT-LAPIN-en-METEORITE
Hmmm, perhaps they should carve little busts of Chladni, Daubree, Brezina, Cohen, Nininger, Monnig, Haag. Or asteroid models - what happened to Rhett Bourland btw? Buckleboo -Ursprüngliche Nachricht- Von: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Im Auftrag von Rob Wesel Gesendet: Montag, 13. März 2006 01:33 An: drtanuki; meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Betreff: Re: [meteorite-list] OT/AD Meteoritecrime:??METEORITE-FUNNY-RABBIT-LAPIN-en-METEORITE This is just the sort of thing that is going to get institutions involved trying to impose regulations. Would you build a ladder out of dinosaur bones? Cultural artifacts fine, adds to the history, but turning them into rabbits or knives or bolts or hearts or Superman S's spells trouble. Silly Rabbit, kicks are for twids Rob Wesel http://www.nakhladogmeteorites.com -- We are the music makers... and we are the dreamers of the dreams. Willy Wonka, 1971 - Original Message - From: drtanuki [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Sunday, March 12, 2006 4:22 PM Subject: [meteorite-list] OT/AD Meteorite crime:??METEORITE-FUNNY-RABBIT-LAPIN-en-METEORITE Dear List, Here is a fine example of a waster of meteorites! Nyone who buys this Funny Bunny needs an exam. And yes he has more wasted material listed. Dirk...Tokyo http://cgi.ebay.com/METEORITE-FUNNY-RABBIT-LAPIN-en-METEORITE_W0QQitemZ72255 35114QQcategoryZ10893QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem '^Ó: fRffsf.[f^,ÌfEfCf __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Nantan wanted - no joke
Heia List, I have here a broken-hearted collector, who desperately is looking for a good sized chunk of Nantan, as it's his birthday meteorite. Since months he is buying Nantans from ebay (from various sellers, also an American one) and always the acquired specimen turned out to be a meteorwrong. Anybody here, who could help him? (I stock no Nantans, those ugly rusters are not allowed to enter my home..) Thanks. Martin __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
AW: [meteorite-list] Empty quarter expedition
Hi Joseph, List, I don't appreciate Professor Albert Matter's assertion about Oman: Collectors though, he said, had robbed the desert of its heritage simply for money and not for scientific research. Bad style. The collecors always did an excellent fieldwork there, meticulously recording and documenting all find data, different from the NWA-situation. With the retrieved coordinates strewnfields could be mapped (also that, where the Suisse team found their Mars later), innumerable samples of exotic and common types were made accessible to labs, and that at no costs, all in all an invaluable gain for research and science. The private hunting teams did all this without any financial support and with high financial risks. Until 2 years ago, the Omanis demonstrated no increased concern in their meteorites at all and issued export permits for the stones too. If Prof.Matter took exception to other teams hunting there, he should have earlier cared for the restrictions to become operative, which should have been possible as the Suisse universities are working together with the Omani for more than 30 years. Though, if this would have been a service rendered to science and research, I personally strongly doubt. I haven't the data of the Suisse finds (anywhere a list available?), but I read that all their expeditions from 2001-2003 resulted in a mere number of only 200 different meteorites. The parallely hunting private teams were ways more successful. If I take a look on the score card for lunaites from Oman, I find there the SaU 169 found by the Suisse expeditions with 206 grams, while the depredators recovered 11 different Moons in Oman with a total weight of 3956 grams, meaning that with the for the classification required deposit material, they made available for research 3 or 4 times more lunar material from much more different falls than the Suisse teams did and this again at no costs. The records for Martians: Suisse teams: 1 - 233g; Private teams: 3 - 12,084g (I chose MarsMoon as examples, because they were highlighted on the websites in Switzerland, but I guess with other rare types the ratios will be similar). Unfortunately the publications database of the University of Bern is out of order ( http://www.geo.unibe.ch/english/scientificworks.htm ), but in past they had there no remorse to carry out research and analysis on such robbed heritage like NWA-meteorites (e.g. NWA 031, NWA 773, NWA 176, DaG 262 or even stones from Oman found by commercial hunters like e.g. Dhofar 081.) Also in the collection of the Natural History Museum of Bern, are found several specimens fitting to Prof.Matter's accusation, as there are held samples of Acfers, NWAs, DaGs and from Oman SaU 005 and Dho 378, all not found by the Suisse teams. (Btw. Prof.Matters seems to have no concerns about commercialism, when he's publishing in the GeoArabia journal, which is sponsored by such corporations like BP, Shell, Chevron, ExxonMobil, Total, Saudi Aramco.) I can understand, that Prof.Matter is furious about the hunters, who nowadays don't respect the newer legal situation in Oman, but this justifies not to disavow and to criminalize the hunting teams, which were active before, with such an undifferentiated statement in public. He should rather demonstrate the respect, which is due to the other teams with their enormous quantity and quality of finds, which they made accessible for research. I don't want to impute petty jealousies to him, that the other teams were much more successful or that because of the long cooperation between Suisse and Omani institutions he might tend to think that all finds should have been researched by the university of Bern, really not, and I'm sure that if he looks a little bit back in the history of meteoritics and also to other countries than Oman in present, then he will recognise, that with exception of the Antarctic meteorites practically all meteorites where brought to light and were delivered to science almost solely by private individuals and initiatives. I thought that this hollow and artificial conflict about private hunting vs. institutional research was negotiated long ago, and I really wonder that this issue is rehashed again. But perhaps he was misquoted (I can't imagine, that a professional meteoricist with his knowledge and insights would launch such a silly statement)? In this case my mail here would be of course unfonded and meaningless. If I were in the place of Prof.Matter I gladly would invite professional hunters, who demonstrated in past, that they are better trained and skilled than the Suisse team members in finding and recognizing rare types in the field, to join the Suisse expeditions. This would be the most promising solution. The Suisse team's finding quota would raise remarkably, the found meteorites would be completely reserved to research and as the hunters should be remunerated by contracts, they wouldn't have to throw away their finds below costs as it happens
[meteorite-list] Back to meteorites
Hey the list is getting to self-referring, Let's have some fun with stones. Look what I found today! Medal ceremony. http://www.igsb.uiowa.edu/Browse/meteor/meteor.gif Miss California (Old Woman) http://siarchives.si.edu/history/exhibits/thisday/march/meteorite.jpg On the rocks - cheers! http://calgary.rasc.ca/photos/tagish_lake_1.jpg Historical toilet seat http://www.meteorite.fr/en/images/EnsisheimStone.jpg Spoiled collector's face http://uanews.ua.edu/anews2004/nov04/images/meteorite1_72.jpg Hansel Gretel.. http://www.westminsterastro.org/library/meteorite_kids.jpg Father... http://www.fieldmuseum.org/research_collections/library/library_sites/photo_ archives/geology/large_images/GEO79617_lg.jpg ...and Son http://www2.kinneret.ac.il/bloss/astrotour/meteors/images/obs14.jpg Jonny Depp as Willy Wonka http://www.meteoritearticles.com/files/me_and_display.jpg Mike at the day nursery http://www.hq.nasa.gov/office/pao/History/EP-177/i8-17.jpg The Postman Always Rings Twice http://www.eaae-astro.org/eaae/newsl2/l2_fig17.gif The dumbest farmers have the largest potatoes.(German saying for: Fortune favours fools) http://www.ucalgary.ca/oncampus/weekly/june25-04/meteorite1.jpg Scandalous meteoritewrong carving http://www.hmag.gla.ac.uk/John/Huntmin/hpphotos/High%20Possil%20monument.jpg where I will lay down: http://www.mnhs.org/places/historycenter/exhibits/territory/fortune/images/l s_ps04.gif Buckleboo! Martin -Ursprüngliche Nachricht- Von: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Im Auftrag von Adam Hupe Gesendet: Sonntag, 12. März 2006 19:07 An: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Betreff: [meteorite-list] Spamfest 2006 Dear List, Art carefully thought about the direction of this List and asked for a consensus before making the once a week advertisement rule. After asking for input from subscribers, he set the rule realizing the List would soon turn into a spamfest without it. If he thought it was important enough to make this rule, then users who post to this List should abide by it, after all, it is Art's creation. As members of this Forum, users agreed to post advertisements only once a week. Those who post ads more than once a week are going against something they agreed to, breaking a promise. How can people who break promises ever be trusted to do the right thing? Please show some respect to Art and those involved in the consensus. There are probably 20 different users posting ads once a week with a couple thinking they are above the rules posting two or more. If everybody posted three to seven times, then 60 to 140 ads would have to be waded through each week, a true spamfest! Over advertising in this type of environment will only serve to turn off the audience nullifying the affect. If those who break this rule think they are somehow special, are above everybody else and these rules do not apply to them, let them gain permission from Art otherwise they should be called on breaking a promise. Take Care, Adam - Original Message - From: Michael L Blood [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: M come Meteorite Meteorites [EMAIL PROTECTED]; Meteorite List meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Sunday, March 12, 2006 9:28 AM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] enough already on 3/12/06 8:22 AM, M come Meteorite Meteorites at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I am for 2 AD post for week, one its many few, seen for ebay auctions if ended in 3 days... Matteo -- You can be For whatever you like, Mateo. However, this is Art's list, not yours. He makes the rules. Michael __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
AW: [meteorite-list] MetBull, additions, synonyms, alternative names.
Hi Jeff, that's a good opportunity for the list to contribute smth. useful, as most will have a better knowledge about the geographical circumstances and the spelling of the names of their home-meteorites as the NomCom can have. Let's start! Perhaps one could change the only as synonym listed: Eichstätt into the main name of the meteorite officially known as Eichstädt, as it's the correct spelling in use for this town in all maps (and in former times I often was travelling through there, also on the city sign). And Mocs (say: motch) could need an additional synonym. It's a Hungarian name, the village now is named Mociu, which is already included as a synonym, but the Romanians if they refer to the meteorite, spell always Moci (with the silent i, the c is pronounced as tch.) The doubtful or lost meteorite Kloster Schefftlar, which has an own entry, is spelled today: Kloster Schäftlarn (- I don't know if you have the letters used in German for the diphtongs, else transcribe the a with the 2 dots above with ae.) This monastery is situated only 15 miles to the South from my home here in Munich. Freising as the closest larger reference town in the entry, should be replaced by Munich. Geographically Kloster Schäftlarn lies about 25km South of Munich, Freising is 40km to the North of Munich (Schäftlarn - Freising: 60kms) and also Schäftlarn is part of the administrative district Munich, not Freising. That Freising found its way into the entry can be explained as Freising was the first diocese (founded AD 739), so that in former times Munich and Schäftlarn belonged to the diocese Freising. Since 1821 this diocese is named Freising Munich, so no reason to carry on with Freising. Buckleboo! Martin -Ursprüngliche Nachricht- Von: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Im Auftrag von Jeff Grossman Gesendet: Samstag, 11. März 2006 00:52 An: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Betreff: Re: [meteorite-list] MetBull, additions, synonyms, alternative names. I add lots of things to the indices of the database that you never see. If you have an alternate spelling for a meteorite you think should be included, even if it is not recognized by the NomCom, by all means send it to me. This will allow a search to succeed, even though your spelling is not acknowledged as a synonym. For example, a search on Wolfe Creek now succeeds in finding Wolf Creek. jeff __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
AW: [meteorite-list] MetBull, additions, synonyms, alternative names.
Ooops, I forgot. Schönenberg lost an n Today it's: Schöneberg (as synonym only Schoneberg is given). and Mässing, is today only: Massing (without ae or ä, the today's spelling Massing is not found among the synonyms or as main name in the Catalogue). Unter-Mässing Is spelled nowadays without hyphen: Untermässing In the entry is missing a town nearby, it's only written: Bayern, Germany. I suggest Greding as Untermässing was incorporated by Greding and Greding is an exit of one of the most important highways in Germany. (The mentioned Oesterberg is written Österberg). Neuschwanstein will be more than correct, thanks Dieter et.al. And those where the Bavarian meteorites. (To Inningen I have my own opinion, it has the same trace element data as Sikhote-Alin, same Ni content, IIAB - and from people, who know it better than me, I heard that it was a shrapnel (that's the reason too, why no structural type could be determined. That a single iron felt as a shrapnel, I never heard before :-) ) Buckleboo! Martin __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
AW: Re: AW: Re: [meteorite-list] Re: Possible meteorite fall inNortheast Brazil (forwarded message from Wilton Caravalho)
Hi Svend, If that is true I will abort the discussion at this point. With that assumption, I fear, you're wrong. It is simply the lack of self control Matteo suffers from. As one is asked to back one's statements with facts and I accused Matteo in my last mail of permanent misbehaving, I had to make some stats. (So maybe it's more perspicuous, what I meant, when I spoke of a privilege, as by far noone else on the list is allowed to abuse this forum so often like Matteo). Here the stats obtained from Matteo's list-postings from the last fourteen months. First of all, for you Svend, to see, that it's not about him not getting pieces of your Brazilian meteorite: Doubts Matteo had about the authenticity of the material of following people or finds/falls too: - Mike Farmer - Stefan Ralew - Steve Arnold IMB - Adam Hupe - John Birdsell - Christian Angerer - Carsten Giessler - Greg Hupe - Rob Wesel - Vincent Jaques - Lautaro Correia - Barcis - The meteorite found on Mars - Benguerir - DeRusse - F.Badalotti - Göran Lindfors - Ebay: 34 different auctions - Venus-meteorite - Odessa - Italian Museums - Pascal Fardin - Aziz Habibi - Peter Marmet - Svend Buhl Exaggerated prices had according Matteo: - Mike Farmer (8 times) - Steve Arnold Chicago (4x) - Ebay (fees) - Ivan Koutyriev - Michael Blood - Dave Schultz - Martin Altmann (2x) - Marcin Cimala (3x) - Carsten Giessler - Adam Hupe - Stan Turecki - Ebay-sellers: (4x) - Slava - Ken Regelman - Aziz Habibi - Ryan Pawelski But on the other hand, responsible for Prices in ruin: - Göran Axelsson - Michael Farmer - All, who sell Moon at 1000$/g - Ebay - Morrocans in general - All who sell Acap at 40$ - the collectors - Oscar Turone Betrayed he felt or was from: - Michael Cottingham - Marcin Cimala - Michael Casper Whit those cheaters in his eyes he had problems: - Brad Sampson - Michael Casper - Ouattara Dramane - Habibata Bamogo - Mario Castellani - Gregor Pacer - Mark Bostick - An anonymous Italian - Rob Elliott Not content he was with for various reasons: - the staff in the Met.Bulletin - Fra Consolmagno - John Gwilliam - Sara Russell - Devon Slater - Michael Blood - Rob Wesel - Rubin - Steve Arnold Chicago - The Meteoritical Bulletin itself - E.L.Jones - Anne Black - Ebay bidders (3x) - Ebay sellers (2x) - George Bush - An idiot from the Italian ebay forum Persons not telling the truth for him were: - Mike Farmer (12 times) - Marcin Cimala - Eric Olson - Moroccans in general (2x) - Steve Arnold Chicago - Ominous dealers in Munich - Lautaro Côrreia - Dr.Zucolotto - The real finder of Santa Vitoria do Palmar Doubting in assertions of, he was: - Jan Bartels - Eric Olson - Mike Farmer - Michael Cottingham - Martin Altmann - Ted Bunch Attributes he used: - Aziz Habibi: drunk, and say adieu to your hotel take with the money of the meteorites - Michael Blood: idiocy - Proud Tom: idiot - Mike Farmer: Gasato, jealous, ruiner of market, (is his fault that he lost his girlfriend), idiocies, threats, lucky that you are not a IMCa member, probably you like the Italian jail, little child, cry baby, have drunk, boiling spirits , lunatic, the Holy, Fifone, spammer, racism against italian people and Europeans,. - Various implicit idiots, who dared to doubt his own finds: Mike Farmer, Ryan Pawelski, Dieter Heinlein, Martin Altmann, Mark Bostick and several more. - Stan Turecki: poor idiot That all excerpted from Matteo's very own emails, not counted answers from many others to his emails. Of course there are some doubtful persons among this list, but all in all it is almost unbelievable. No further comment is necessary. I recommend Matteo to be more calm and civilized in future, else we should ask the moderator to remove him from the list. Martin so why did you refer in your post to the event in Northeast Brazil? Santa Vitoria do Palmar is situated in Southeast Brazil, the completely other end? And as I said, three individuals of SVP have been found by different people. If you are talking to some other person involved in this issue and this person does not want to sell you any of his material, well this makes sense, at least it sounds comprehensible to me. I arrived to the point that the reason for your continuing struggle to declare the non-existance of the SVP meteorite is simply motivated by the fact, that noone wants to sell it to you. If that is true I will abort the discussion at this point. Svend tired of getting the facts straight for you __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
AW: Re-2: [meteorite-list] Possible meteorite fall in Northeast Brazil
Matteo, Nobody said, that it's a Pultusk, But because of the lack of the short-living isotopes, which are produced by cosmic rays while a stone travels through space and which aren't refilled anylonger, when the stone lies shielded by the atmosphere and the terrestrial magnetic field on the ground, one can measure the terrestrial age from meteorites, the time how long they were lying here on Earth. First: Your Tessera was measured in Cologne. The result was, that it neither didn't originated from the bolide, you said you had observed 2 weeks ago nor that it is a fresh fall - as it has a terrestrial age not of weeks or months, but of many years or decades. That is a hard fact. Secondly your Tessera showed good black crust, no rust. The climate in your region maybe hot in Summer, but arid it is not. Tessera didn't saw much rain, dew, frost, humidity. How can it thus be, that a stone, which lies for many years in the Italian soil, can be so fresh? Conclusio: It stems from an old fall (see its terrrestial age), but must have been picked up shortly after the fall as it isn't oxidized. So it was said as an example, that it is something LIKE Pultusk, not Pultusk itself. Thirdly: The 9 stones were found so close to each other as it is only the case with huge showers of stones. (Fourthly: The stones were found just 500m away from your house.) (Fifthly: You found those stone 3 years after you got your first meteorites and when you had obviously not the knowledge yet, that you should have considered point First - Thirdly before your made your finds) (Sixthly: You found by your own within a few years only not less than 5 different meteorites in your small home region Veneto, which is highly populated, has a rich vegetation, agriculture, wet climate - the most unsuitable place for finding meteorites and the Veneto has a surface of 18,264 sqkm. It is 38 times smaller than Texas, 16 times smaller than Nevada or Arizona or Colorado - so despite your lack of experience you are, congratulations, a much better hunter than Nininger Monnig were together, gimme a break!! A meteorite on the beach. Put a chondrite for a year in saltwater...). Point one to three are the FACTS - and no insinuations- Four to Six are speculations, which immediately comes to the mind of a meteorite collector with experience and for which you are gladly invited to call me an idiot, who should shut up. Each one is free to come to his own conclusions.. Regards, Martin PS: We all are still waiting for the trace element data of your Umbria iron. -Ursprüngliche Nachricht- Von: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Im Auftrag von M come Meteorite Meteorites Gesendet: Mittwoch, 8. März 2006 08:21 An: Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Betreff: Re: Re-2: [meteorite-list] Possible meteorite fall in Northeast Brazil and for who continue to broken on this fact, this is the result of the magnetic susceptibility take from prof. Rochette in the 2001 Tessera H4 LogX 5.29 Pultusk H5 LogX 4.74 Pultusk H5 LogX 4.57 Pultusk H5 LogX 5.42 Pultusk H5 LogX 5.40 etc... etc... Matteo --- [EMAIL PROTECTED] ha scritto: No, not from the beach, but perhaps 550 yards away from a meteorite passionate's house in Tessera ... Oh, c'mon folks, prove it or leave it !!! Bernd __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list M come Meteorite - Matteo Chinellato Via Triestina 126/A - 30030 - TESSERA, VENEZIA, ITALY Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sale Site: http://www.mcomemeteorite.it Collection Site: http://www.mcomemeteorite.info MSN Messanger: spacerocks at hotmail.com EBAY.COM:http://members.ebay.com/aboutme/mcomemeteorite/ ___ Yahoo! Mail: gratis 1GB per i messaggi e allegati da 10MB http://mail.yahoo.it __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
AW: [meteorite-list] Henbury - Wabar history
Bur Susan, The Bavarian Pope would suggest an exorcism first, before he would do so. Someone offered a bet, that Matteo the Mouth, wouldn't answer to the Tessera mail, lucky me that I didn't accept... Buckleboo! Martin -Ursprüngliche Nachricht- Von: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Im Auftrag von batkol Gesendet: Mittwoch, 8. März 2006 18:24 An: M come Meteorite Meteorites; meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Betreff: Re: [meteorite-list] Henbury - Wabar history what does this mean I am already a holy one? has the Pope made you a saint already? i'm obviously missing something here . . . . susan - Original Message - From: M come Meteorite Meteorites [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Wednesday, March 08, 2006 10:51 AM Subject: RE: [meteorite-list] Henbury - Wabar history Farmer, you seen the negativity in all messaggesI am already a holy one, look the 21 Septemberand with this I close, the unique time I not fight with you, you see what you want seebye bye Matteo --- Michael Farmer [EMAIL PROTECTED] ha scritto: No Matteo, it was in my collection, I sold it. You are the man, the shiznit, da bomb, you are the top collector in the world. Maybe the Pope will make you a saint? Give me a break Matteo, 2.5 kilo Henbury? Why don't you come to Tucson show next year. Your head would explode with more than 2 kilos of moon in my room, 1 TON pallasites sitting around etc. I congratulated you, and you harass me. What else is new? Mike -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of M come Meteorite Meteorites Sent: Wednesday, March 08, 2006 9:04 AM To: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Subject: RE: [meteorite-list] Henbury - Wabar history mm its write Mike Farmer collection.. Matteo --- Michael Farmer [EMAIL PROTECTED] ha scritto: I jut sold an individual of 10 kilos to a list member. So I am not that envious Matteo. Congrats though. Mike -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of M come Meteorite Meteorites Sent: Wednesday, March 08, 2006 8:52 AM To: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Subject: RE: [meteorite-list] Henbury - Wabar history to much fewI need a history with informations on th found of the crater and of the meteorites.Farmer, if you only seen what piece of Henbury its under arrive to me uhauhauhaI say only its a end piece of 2.14 kg.. Matteo --- Michael Farmer [EMAIL PROTECTED] ha scritto: Buy the Catalog of Meteorites or the Handbook of Meteorites. Mike Farmer -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of M come Meteorite Meteorites Sent: Wednesday, March 08, 2006 5:49 AM To: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Subject: [meteorite-list] Henbury - Wabar history Hello I need a short history of the Henbury and Wabar meteorites. Thanks Matteo M come Meteorite - Matteo Chinellato Via Triestina 126/A - 30030 - TESSERA, VENEZIA, ITALY Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sale Site: http://www.mcomemeteorite.it Collection Site: http://www.mcomemeteorite.info MSN Messanger: spacerocks at hotmail.com EBAY.COM:http://members.ebay.com/aboutme/mcomemeteorite/ ___ Yahoo! Messenger with Voice: chiama da PC a telefono a tariffe esclusive http://it.messenger.yahoo.com __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list M come Meteorite - Matteo Chinellato Via Triestina 126/A - 30030 - TESSERA, VENEZIA, ITALY Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sale Site: http://www.mcomemeteorite.it Collection Site: http://www.mcomemeteorite.info MSN Messanger: spacerocks at hotmail.com EBAY.COM:http://members.ebay.com/aboutme/mcomemeteorite/ ___ Yahoo! Mail: gratis 1GB per i messaggi e allegati da 10MB http://mail.yahoo.it __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list M come Meteorite - Matteo Chinellato Via Triestina 126/A - 30030 - TESSERA, VENEZIA, ITALY Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sale Site: http://www.mcomemeteorite.it Collection Site: http://www.mcomemeteorite.info MSN Messanger: spacerocks at hotmail.com EBAY.COM:http://members.ebay.com/aboutme/mcomemeteorite/ ___ Yahoo! Mail: gratis 1GB per i messaggi e allegati da 10MB http://mail.yahoo.it __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com
[meteorite-list] OT: to Bernd
Hello Bernd, reread my email and look a little bit further back. First of all Matteo, to say it friendly doubted the new announced Barzilian meteorite - beside that his dictionary or his automatic translator may spit out defamations, backstabbing, humiliation and perhaps some unpleasant expressions, he was also putting the integrity of other persons in question, additionally claiming (the meanwhile analyzed) meteorite to be a fake and called a list member poor idiot. For you this behaviour may be tolerable, for me Matteo's outbursts are not the salt in the soup but rather a hair. When other members adumbrated that he might be not exactly in the position to call meteorites from others in question for certain reasons, we all were asked for a dance by Matteo to tell the facts about Tessera, I want the proves or shut up and close the mouths!, else we belong to that category, which he calls idiots. Nothing else I did in my mail. I told the 3 known facts, which clearly exclude, that Tessera was that, what Matteo claimed it should be. The other 3 points I set in brackets and marked them clearly as my own speculations, for what he could call me, what he wants, but which in my eyes come automatically to a mind of any logically talented person and which do not even increase the plausibility of the authenticity of Tessera. In this mail I avoided nasty names, nor did I use direct accusations, but asked the reader to come to his/her own conclusions. In my eyes this post had not the character of an insinuation, but was - for my temperament - objective. It was btw not posted with the title concerning Wabar and Henbury. The mail I sent you last night wasn't an especially secret one, imediately after I sent it, I posted the link to Mark's Tessera site on the list too, where also the qualified statement of Dieter Heinlein is to be found (and, Bernd, don't forget, that according Matteo's emails right here on the list, we would have to call Dieter and the expert of the lab in Cologne idiots), and where Mark collected a lot of opinions and qualified statements about Tessera in one place. Well, and who says, that I wouldn't have won the bet? Still Matteo can answer. But I have to chip in, that the discussion about Tessera is not new and we had it a time ago on the list, if you'll take a look in the archives. Matteo the Mouth was a recurrence on his own email, where he summoned the list members to come up with facts (as I did) or to shut up and close the mouths. Now we wait for his facts... Darren's History of Earth I found stringent and funny. My reply on Susan's email was perhaps a little bit tasteless, but maybe I can calm you, when I'm telling you that if you were baptized according the rites of the 2 christian main denominations here in Germany, you already had to abide an exorcism, as the wordings for baptizing, the priest tells, contain an exorcism formula (all boys in Bavaria were altar servers, me too, so I know that). So, now to the beef, why I felt compelled at all to answer to Matteo's emails on the list? First of all I can't reply privately, as he said, he had blocked my address. But the main reason is, that Matteo has an affection to misbehave here on the list, I guess several of the members observed it too. I'm very patient, but after sume years, I lost the comprehension, why he should have the privilege to do so - for some it may be entertaining, for most, I guess, it isn't. Well, now remember last year. Matteo was frequently disturbing the sales of collectors and dealers here on the list, in blaming them to ask exaggerated prices, telling how much cheaper he acquired the same localities, but never he was able to offer the same locality more affordable. So I once demonstrated on the list (I think in November), going over a part of his assortment, that in many cases he was ways more expensive then others and that to each of his piece a much cheaper alternative could be found at other dealers. As explosive he is, he learned! It helped and since then, as far as I followed the list, only once since then, he complained again and he was all in all very well behaving in that respect. Thus I was confident, that with my posting now, he could be prompted not to continue to disregard other members or meteoriticist without backing with facts at least. If he achieves that, then he will be a respected and agreeable member of the list, and we don't mind if he rides from time to time a tournament with Farmer, do we? Martin, why does a man of your intelligence..., well, if that was a compliment, don't be so sure about. From those lines you can read that I'm more arrogant than intelligent and if I would be intelligent, I never would try to be a meteorite dealer But to fully please you, I will try to use that list in future only if I have smth essential to contribute, which really didn't happen so often and perhaps sporadically for ads. Buckleboo. Martin -Ursprüngliche Nachricht- Von: [EMAIL
AW: [meteorite-list] Red Rain
Hi Pete, Mark I'm not a lepidopterologist, but butterflies after hatching secrete a red liquid, called meconium, and there are contemporary reports of red rains caused by butterflies, as well I found a report from 17th century, where a large Blood rain was explained of being not of supranatural nature, but caused by flies and worms. Insects also tend to appear in larger numbers than bats May someone check this possibility in web? (I have to work...). Buckleboo! Martin -Ursprüngliche Nachricht- Von: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Im Auftrag von mark ford Gesendet: Dienstag, 7. März 2006 14:10 An: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Betreff: RE: [meteorite-list] Red Rain Thanks pete, This is an interesting comparison: Here is an electron pic of genuine red blood cells : http://www.oulu.fi/electronoptics/kuvat/arkisto/punasolu.jpg And take a look at the micrograph of the Red rain on page 11, figure 11 in Louis's paper at: http://arxiv.org/PS_cache/astro-ph/pdf/0601/0601022.pdf How similar are they!?, I'd say we are looking at red blood cells probably mammalian, even the size matches. And in fact, I notice that one theory the New Scientist article puts forward is for it being 'bat blood', bats migrate in BIG numbers in India, and if something hit a flock at high speed it could shower the whole area with blood. (Similar events with flocks of Birds have happened in the past, avian blood (and in fact body parts have been identified as falling from the sky in the past) - sorry hope no one is eating their lunch :) If the estimation of total quantity was off by an order of magnitude then it would all fit Best Mark Ford -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Pete Pete Sent: Tuesday, March 07, 2006 11:26 AM To: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Subject: [meteorite-list] Red Rain Morning, all, If you're interested, here's the home page for Dr L. Godfrey's (or is it G Louis? It's 50/50 on his home page) study of the red rain, including a picture of the particles: http://education.vsnl.com/godfrey/ http://education.vsnl.com/godfrey/ Cheers, Pete __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Red Rain - the SOLUTION
http://www.strangemag.com/bloodandbutterflies.html Hey, I'm good! Read this - the Red Rains in India were accompagnied by black swarms of insects!! Read: http://www.100megsfree4.com/farshores/nkerala.htm Do I get an award? Sherlock Buckleboo. __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
AW: [meteorite-list] Possible meteorite fall in Northeast Brazil
No, not from the beach, but perhaps 550 yards away from a meteorite passionate's house in Tessera... -Ursprüngliche Nachricht- Von: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Im Auftrag von stan . Gesendet: Dienstag, 7. März 2006 22:53 An: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Betreff: RE: [meteorite-list] Possible meteorite fall in Northeast Brazil its a fake for a recent fall have say the seller, the crust its brown, many similar to the desert vernish of NWA meteorites, not black of a recent fall. maybe it came out of someone's garden in venice... __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
AW: Re-2: [meteorite-list] Possible meteorite fall in Northeast Brazil
Voilá: http://www.meteoritearticles.com/coltessera.html Nothing to say, If someone has doubts about a new fall, but some should be more cautions than others to express their doubts. Svend is absolutely right. Meow -Ursprüngliche Nachricht- Von: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Im Auftrag von [EMAIL PROTECTED] Gesendet: Dienstag, 7. März 2006 23:19 An: Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Betreff: Re-2: [meteorite-list] Possible meteorite fall in Northeast Brazil No, not from the beach, but perhaps 550 yards away from a meteorite passionate's house in Tessera ... Oh, c'mon folks, prove it or leave it !!! Bernd __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
AW: AW: [meteorite-list] Red Rain
Wow Doug, you jack-of-all-trades, when will you finally join IMCA for us to elect you as the still missing director for Middle- and Southamerica? A million of Aporia crataegi caused also some years ago here in Germany a local Red Rain near Karlsruhe. But especially striking was that microscopic view of meconium Mark found, well it's human, but I guess, as we are all made of the same stuff and have similar processes running in our intestines, that from insects will look similar... http://www.humpath.com/IMG/jpg/fetal_colon_meconium_23w_02-2.jpg which shows striking similarities to those putative cosmogenic cellular structures found in the Red Rain in India. For me it's funny, that such a phenomenon made it up into serious scientific journals and congresses - it's a little bit similar with the circulation of such stories in medieaval and early modern times, well now not as a horrible harbinger of numinous punishments, but as a possible extraterrestrial sensation. I forgot to outline, why people then were also panicked by red rains. Of course it has a biblical reference, it's one of the 10 plagues Moses demonstrates to the Pharao in Exodus Chap 7, when he turns the water of the Nile into blood (3 of the plagues are insects). In the late medieval Europe and the following times people lived in a permanent awaiting of the soon to come apocalypse. The wars, the recurring disastrous contagions, the threatening and occupations of the Mongols, Arabs, Turks, the fall of Jerusalem and Constantinople, religious wars, pogroms, schismata, prosecutions of heretics and so on lead to that hysteria, which was obviously so strongly pronounced, that even very common natural phenomenons like e.g. sundogs or even strange shaped clouds were taken as a bad omen. It's very characeristical that in, as far as I know, most cultures meteorites where warshipped or in ritual use or at least used as material to craft tools - only in medieavel occident not, there they were something negative. Take Ensisheim, there exist also a pamphlet, where the fall is pictured with the sky full of the typical miraculous bad signs. And with the new media of print numerous broadsides and chapbooks, the forerunners of newspaper, were printed reporting those natural phenomenons. Would be an interesting source for meteorite falls, perhaps Joern could give us some examples? Hah, and that I like most on the list, that in only one evening such riddles like this Red Rain, which is waiting for a solutions since several years can be solved (at least I give that meconium theory a much better chance than that cometary thing) by the members with their different interdisciplinary backrounds or like in my case with my smattering... So we saw, that Red Rains aren't new, that hey can be caused by insects - and Dr.Louis forgot to tell that those rains coincided with swarms of insects, the fauna of butterflies is rich especially in Kerala, see link below, in human meconium there are similar pseudo-cells like found in the red rain, So Louis and team only have to ask a specialist to compare some meconium from insects with that red rain samples, and then they will have most probably the explanation. Here for you Doug. Kerala has 330 species of butterflies and so many, that they are a tourists' magnet - one can book a Butterfly Week or even a 15-days-butterfly-trip in Kerala! http://www.butterflieskerala.com/html/bker.htm Buckleboo! Martin -Ursprüngliche Nachricht- Von: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Im Auftrag von [EMAIL PROTECTED] Gesendet: Dienstag, 7. März 2006 19:51 An: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED]; meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Betreff: Re: AW: [meteorite-list] Red Rain Martin A. writes: I'm not a lepidopterologist, Hola Martin believe it or not, I am an Lepidopterist, well at least an amateur for many years ! Your suggestion is also what I immediately thought when I saw the subject in my emails. I don't have time at the moment to look into this, but if anyone has some time, during peaks in the population of Painted Lady butterflies (_Vanessa cardui_) red rains have appeared and been harbingers of things to come in the typical scaring peasants routine like comets, in history on several ocassions, as a matter of fact...so wherever this red rain has appeared (I haven't been following the thread),it would be easy to check to see if it coincides with a population spike and new brood of cardui's. The Painted Lady is one of the few butterflies with nearly a worldwide distribution and seemingly migration runs en masse. For this reason, in the US it has been used in releases in weddings (instead of throwing rice:)). The is a contingent of ecologists that oppose this due to claimed changes in local gene pools (mostly for Monarchs). Since the butterfly farming industry for weddings (and funerals) took off a few years back and most people don't hear the scientists' bellyaching that experimental designs
AW: [meteorite-list] Red Rain From Comets?
Hiho Sterling, Mark, List, Blood rain belong to the broad repertoire of natural phenomenons (comets, halos, strange clouds, animalic monstrosities, earthquakes, rains of frogs, corn, sulphur and and and) as bad omens as they were plentifully reported, printed and spread in somewhat hysterical Europe of the end of 15th century until Age of Enlightenment. Here I chose an example analogous to the comet-blood-rain in India, with some better details :-) It's from a pamphlet (HAB Wolfenbüttel. 38.25 Aug. 2°, fol. 802): ...auch wie zwo Meilwegs von Bamberg in einem Flecken Radelsdorff genant / diß 1518 Jahrs den 10. Mertz / dreymal Fewr vom Himmel gefallen / Häuser angezünd / auch ein Weib sampt ihrem Hauß verbrand / vnd zu nacht / ein Feuriger Besem vnd Stralen / so wol etliche Helleparten vnd Spiesse an den Wolcken deß Himmels gesehen worden / darauß Blutstropffen gefallen / auch was sich sonsten zugetragen. Mit consens der Obrigkeit allda beschrieben. Freely translated: ...also two miles away from Bamberg in a village called Radelsdorf on 10th of March 1518 felt three times fire from the sky, igniting houses - a woman was burnt together with her house - and at night fiery besoms and rays, as well as several halberds and spears were observed at the clouds in the sky, from which drops of blood felt. And other observations all in agree with the local officials described. Wow and here a meteorite shower with blood rain! (BSB München. Res/4 p.o.germ. 234,34) ...inn der Statt Dantzig vnd vmbher / vnd wie ein Fewer wolcken sich / inn derselbigen Statt hat nider gelassen. Auch wie es Blut geregnet / vnnd Stein zu fünff pfunden geworffen / daruon vil Volcks auff den Strassen todt blieben ist. 1579. jar. ...in the city of Gdansk (hurry up Mr.Marcin Polandmet!!) and sourroundings was settling a fiery cloud in that town. Also it rained blood and stones with a weight of 5 pounds where thrown down, wherefrom a lot of people were left dead in the streets. AD 1579 -Ursprüngliche Nachricht- Von: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Im Auftrag von Sterling K. Webb Gesendet: Montag, 6. März 2006 21:52 An: mark ford; meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Betreff: Re: [meteorite-list] Red Rain From Comets? Hi, If these were algae or their spores, they would grow, bloom, or whatever it is algae do. They would also give you a big positive in the kind of DNA test that was performed on the funny cells. The fellow at Sheffield interviewed by the BBC talked about this particular test being done on a jar of algae and how positive it was. He's going to duplicate Louis' test, and he said he didn't really doubt that the outcome would be the same, because the test was so straightforward. As far as Louis' hypothesis about the cells being delivered by a meteor airburst, I ignore it completely. Nothing is more fruitless than endlessly arguing about an unobserved delivery system hypothesis. One should not waste a second on how these guys got here until and if we have determined what these things are. The notion that one airburst could rain down weird particles in the same location for days or weeks is utterly silly, as if the atmosphere had no horizontal transport, like, maybe, wind? I don't think delivery is a problem. Stuff falls into the ocean, small particles are transpired upwards (like algal spores), and rain out over Kerala for days, weeks, months. No big deal. The only question that matters is WHAT, not how. Naively, since it's neither my job nor my field of study, I can't imagine that, after more than a century of microbiology and the (apparently) incredible sophistication of the field, somebody can't tell us whether this thing that looks like a cell IS a cell or not. It would seem like the most simple and obvious of questions. I hadn't found that bit about how Louis had tried culturing them in weird substances (mentioned in your subsequent post). Using Cedarwood oil may seem a strange choice, but it is used as a preservative because it kills all microbial life dead, dead, dead. The fact that it was at 300 C. suggests that whatever these things are, they don't contain (much) water, else they'd pop. Excuse me, lyse. Me, I would have tried: a) ammonia, water, with methane and a bit of hydrogen, weak light, and coolish (Titan) b) low pressure CO2, argon, a bit of water vapor, more light, less cool (Mars) c) high pressure CO2 and sulfurous stuff, plenty hot (Venus) Well, all the Solar System environments. You get the idea. Since CO2 seems to be so ubiquitous, I'd try warm CO2, straight up, barkeep. Then, there's the other possible regimes. Maybe they have thick walls and are quiescent because of all this nasty oxygen everywhere. Would they like a taste of chlorine? A dash of fluorine, perhaps? A pick-me-up of bromine? Iodine? I mean, we swim in this deadly poisonous oxygen constantly and we actually seem to enjoy it! That's very strange.
AW: [meteorite-list] Red Rain From Comets?
Here a picture of red rain (AD 1503, Jakob Mennel). http://www.aeiou.at/aeiou.history.data.jpg/008751.jpg Buckleboo Martin __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] AD: the race is on OT: Where are you all?
Hi list, 1) I need Killgore, Rodrigo, Reves, Kroth and Harlan from you pix please. Have clients for you for multiple Kilo$, but get no replies. Like this I can't work. 2) Unbelievable but true, here in Germany is broad daylight, I posted those beauties to the German list, but all seem to sleep, as after 1 hour, they aren't gone yet. http://de.pg.photos.yahoo.com/ph/metmartinde/album?.dir=/4f68 So, for 60cents/g + ship they're yours. Trembling Buckleboo, who fights to stop smoking. Martin __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
AW: [meteorite-list] Whole individual
Everything, what obtained its shape during and from flight, is an individual. Everything what obtained its rough shape on ground (break-off while impact, wheathering, wind blast)is a fragment. Exception: Break-off in low altitudes (Tatahouine, Some Sikhotes, ect..). Exception 2: Irons. Everything, which is not a shrapnel or has a cut surface, people call individual. Common use today: All stones are called individuals, as long as they have no larger fresh fractured portions (that means: broke off yesterday) of the surface. See ebay. -Ursprüngliche Nachricht- Von: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Im Auftrag von Marcin Cimala Gesendet: Mittwoch, 1. März 2006 20:42 An: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Betreff: Re: [meteorite-list] Whole individual Hi all, What is the exact definition of a whole individual? Is it considered whole as long as it hasn't been altered by man? To me any stone that was found is a whole individual or at least an indivdual even though it may have fragmented in flight. What are the parameters? Thanks, Bill Good question. What about specimen that was broken on desert by weathering to many pieces. They are fragments or whole individuals ? Im asking becouse I have some piesces that comes from different falls and they are very weathered (something like Dean selling now). I cant say that this 4 pieces or other are broken fragments from one specimen, becouse every piece propably comes from different fall or from the same. -[ MARCIN CIMALA ]-[ I.M.C.A.#3667 ]- http://www.Meteoryt.net [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.PolandMET.com [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.Gao-Guenie.com GSM +48(607)535 195 [ Member of Polish Meteoritical Society ] __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
AW: [meteorite-list] Prospectors, Scientists Vie for Rocks More Precious Than Gold (Meteorites)
Hi Ron, The solution was (and still is) evident. A single space shuttle start costs 400-500 million $. With only 1 or 2 percent of that sum, the institutions could have bought easily all meteorites from Morocco, which appeared during the last 5 years completely. (+ hiring Da Boyz Stefan, Martin, Andi to be the agents). If the meteoricists weren't able to point out to the budgetary accounting institutions, that the scientifical benefit of acquiring all those stones is much higher or even equivalent to one of the 114 space shuttle missions, but that it can be achieved at only a hundredth of the costs, then I think that they are not in the position to run down private persons, because they possess meteorites or that they purchase meteorites. I could imagine, that there might be some legal obstacles, which could afford a cooperation with the Sahara states, which might be politically undesirable with the hysteria at present, but that it would be all about the money is implausible. I'm googling around but can't find anywhere the annual budget of ANSMET ? Only sporadically some figures. In 2003 the expedition's costs for a 6 week hunting period of a single person is given with $ 120,000. Hence 6 weeks on ice of a single team costs 0.7 Mio$. (for that sum our Dean Bessey would deliver 15 metric tons of chondrites right to the door, wouldn't you Dean?). So it's not about the money. Buckleboo! Martin -Ursprüngliche Nachricht- Von: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Im Auftrag von R. N. Hartman Gesendet: Montag, 27. Februar 2006 23:26 An: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com; Adam Hupe Betreff: Re: [meteorite-list] Prospectors,Scientists Vie for Rocks More Precious Than Gold (Meteorites) They wonder how many new finds they'll get access to before the space rocks are sliced into collectible fragments and disappear into private collectionsThis is something that has always bothered me. That goes for any rare meteorite, or even a nice common one. But if the museums and researchers can't come up with money to buy them from collectors, and researchers won't go out and find them themselves (or finance hunting groups), I don't know whether there is a solution. Maybe Canada does have the answer! Ron - Original Message - From: Adam Hupe [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Sunday, February 26, 2006 11:46 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Prospectors,Scientists Vie for Rocks More Precious Than Gold (Meteorites) Article quoted the following: . I think 20% or 20 grams is pretty generous. Some dealers exceed this expectation and others don't. The ones that don't should be forced to adhere or lose official status on their stones. My Question: Isn't this same thing happening with Fukang?, a rare meteorite sliced into ever smaller pieces and put on the market. Some were falsely claiming Fukang as being a new type of ungrouped Pallasite. Donors to the Southwest Meteorite Center get a nice little slice of Fukang presented in acrylic if they provide enough capitol to the organization. Why isn't Fukang being preserved as a main mass for presentation and study? Is something wrong with this philosophy or I am missing something here? Adam __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.375 / Virus Database: 268.1.0/269 - Release Date: 2/24/2006 -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.375 / Virus Database: 268.1.0/269 - Release Date: 2/24/2006 __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Wanted: Coahuila, entire Imilac or Glorieta
Hiho, 2 collectors are looking for a slice of Coahuila and either an Imilac fragment with olivines in the 200-300g range or a nice entire Glorieta Mountain with some olivines for around 1000 bucks. Please gimme a note, Martin __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Clarification? ...Prospectors, Scientists Vie for Rocks More Precious Than Gold (Meteorites)
Hiho list, Hola As so often Slow Brain Martin has difficulties to understand the whole thing. Perhaps the Killgores may explain us, what this new Center is all about, to avoid misunderstandings or deformation by media or wrong quotations. On 1st of February Ron Baalke posted to the list an announcement and the introduction of that new Center, written by Lori Stiles UA Scientist and Private Collector Form Center to Save Meteorites There the aims of the Center were defined: They want to preserve meteorites for being cut and for science, they want to classify, to document, to curate them and they want to control the market situation and to buy them. The whole point of what we're doing is to prevent people from cutting every rare meteorite into tiny, little pieces, said Marvin Killgore SWMC will offer collectors, dealers, owners and amateur enthusiasts a fair price for part of the vanishing meteorite legacy. And after UA buys some, or all, of the meteorite for the public repository, everybody in the market will know just how much of the material is still left for sale. -- Before on 20th of January Dolores Hill forwarded a clarification of Lauretta/Killgore, because Killgore was attacked because of a possible conflict of a commercial dealer being employed by a non-commercial scientific institution. There they state as goals: Education, preservation, classification, to become one of the largest collections. -- They have also a homepage: http://www.lpl.arizona.edu/swmc/ The most bold set assertion there reads: The preservation of these treasures from outer space requires an organization with the financial resources to acquire and preserve this material while it is still available. The before quotes aims are found there + the goal of raising a fund of ten million $. -- (those statements of an enmity between science and commerce, the heritage of million of years accumulated meteorites, and that science hadn't the means to buy all the stuff - we don't have to discuss, take it for a legitimate dramatisation for reaching the goals of the Center faster). Well, I thought: Great! They want to preserve meteorites from cutting. They want to preserve rare types for science and they want to purchase meteorites at fair prices. So to support those aims, I offered them the world largest entire ureilite stone (according to the Bulletin-Database and Kenna was cut) with 8.4kgs (the largest Shisr 007 stone was only half as big), to prevent it from the fate of being destroyed by cutting and I offered it at 2.5$ per gram - at least for them that should be a fair price. I never received an aswer. -- And finally now, we read the article by Joshua Brownt, where the before mentioned aims of the Center seem to have changed or at least were strongly reduced: In exchange for getting a piece of a dealer's meteorite to study and add to their lending library, the center's scientists will verify and classify the dealer's rock so customers will know what they are buying. and The center promises to cut that verification time down by hiring staff whose only job is meteorite identification. That would mean nothing so remarkable, in my eyes, not worth to make such a noise and it wouldn't be a new approach. The only difference to the situation before would be, that the University of Arizona will add on its capacity to classify meteorites. And that from now on, if someone wants to have classified his/her meteorite in only a few weeks, it will be for free. That's an improvement. In general classifications in other places are free too, but take quite a while, and for a classification in all cases everywhere a deposit for science of 20g or 20% of a stone must be supplied, so I can't see here a New Deal. If Joshua Brownt is right, then the SWMC would be nothing else as a place for classification, and the big words spread would be not adequate, as all what would be left is: We do classification faster than others (which is a good thing), bring your stones to us, so that the university collection can grow with the type specimens. --- So I think a clarification should be necessary, as I suppose, that some of those articles maybe are incomplete. Thanks Martin -Ursprüngliche Nachricht- Von: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Im Auftrag von stan . Gesendet: Montag, 27. Februar 2006 08:17 An: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Betreff: RE: [meteorite-list] Prospectors,Scientists Vie for Rocks More Precious Than Gold (Meteorites) Wichtigkeit: Hoch This worries some scientists who study meteorites for clues about the early life of our solar system. They wonder how many new finds they'll get access to before the space rocks are sliced into collectible fragments and disappear into private collections. *snip* ''I don't think of them as my competition, Lauretta said, ''because they're out there pounding the hot desert ground, making new discoveries, when I don't
AW: [meteorite-list] Clarification? ...Prospectors, Scientists Vie for Rocks More Precious Than Gold (Meteorites)
Hmmm, so where is the beef? If one will have to pay for classification, I can't see any new advantage for a dealer at all, as at other institutions they get the classification for free or, if they don't want to wait many months or a year, they already do have a place, where it can be done in a few weeks for a fee - and for a collector, who wants to get his NWA or Franconia classified, it would be a worsening. Hence just another place for classification and not a new link between researchers and dealers? But let's wait, what Killgore will hopefully tell us. Buckleboo! Martin -Ursprüngliche Nachricht- Von: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Im Auftrag von MARK BOSTICK Gesendet: Montag, 27. Februar 2006 14:16 An: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Betreff: RE: [meteorite-list] Clarification? ...Prospectors,Scientists Vie for Rocks More Precious Than Gold (Meteorites) Hello Martin and list, Martin wrote, trying to figure out what the Center is: The only difference to the situation before would be, that the University of Arizona will add on its capacity to classify meteorites. And that from now on, if someone wants to have classified his/her meteorite in only a few weeks, it will be for free. That's an improvement. During Killgore's talk at the Micheal Blood auction, he mentioned there would be classification opportunities. So after the talk, I asked Dante and Marvin, What does classification opportunities mean? From their answer, to get meteorites classified through the center, you will have to join a subscription like service. That you would pay a certain fee and it would allow you to get so many stones classified. Numbers were not worked out at the time. Clear Skies, Mark Bostick www.meteoritearticles.com __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
AW: [meteorite-list] ADD delete: Meteorite Dealer's Morroccan TapDancing Shoes
Do they have an integrated maskelynite detector in the beaked tips too?? If yes, I take 2 pairs, as a camel has four feet. -Ursprüngliche Nachricht- Von: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Im Auftrag von Dave Freeman mjwy Gesendet: Samstag, 25. Februar 2006 12:55 An: Meteorite-list Betreff: [meteorite-list] ADD delete: Meteorite Dealer's Morroccan TapDancing Shoes For sale as an investment in your future, Moroccan Meteorite Dealers tap dancing shoes. Find out what's really changed in Afrcia. Let these shoes tell you the path to prosperity. More bizzar by the minute! Top Secret notion in the soles...makes them rare, hard to find, and planetary that no one else has! Geeze! Spooky or spoofy? DF __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
AW: [meteorite-list] If I can choose.....!
I didn't get the question, What Aubrites would be worth? Most of them are available, look at the dealers pages. I guess, cheapest should be Mt.Egerton, tataaah let's start discussion why it's an AUB and not a mesosiderite. Egerton should be obtainable at 15$/g in small pieces (at least I am selling them at this price), with Egerton it's the same as with Tatahouine, the larger the specimen, the higher the gram price. No desert Aub? What about Killgores NWA 2736 ? Clueless Martin -Ursprüngliche Nachricht- Von: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Im Auftrag von [EMAIL PROTECTED] Gesendet: Samstag, 25. Februar 2006 18:33 An: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Betreff: Re: [meteorite-list] If I can choose.! In a message dated 2/24/2006 10:28:45 A.M. Central Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: An aubrite would be a great choice I think since they are so rare. I am curious to see what collectors would think they are worth per gram, known falls, finds, any locality, including NWA (if a confirmed one were to be found). List, I too am curious what Aubrites would be worth, especially Norton County, now that years of discovery in the hot deserts have yet to find a new one? Obviously UNM has a big Norton County, but how much of that is actually out side of their main mass and in private collections? Steve Arnold IMB __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
AW: [meteorite-list] Name game
Ballinoo Buckleboo __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
AW: [meteorite-list] Name game
Kaaba Denmark, both doubtful. -Ursprüngliche Nachricht- Von: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Im Auftrag von Jeff Grossman Gesendet: Samstag, 25. Februar 2006 23:09 An: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Betreff: [meteorite-list] Name game I see way too many meteorite names and sometimes the mind wanders. OK, who can find the best meteorites that really belong together in collections. Here are some: Roy and Rogers (both from New Mexico!); Ski and Park City; Spade and Marlow; Ulysses and Grant; Washington County, Lincoln County, Roosevelt County, and Jefferson County (the Mount Rushmore set); and let's not forget, Faith, Hope, and Chassigny (groan). jeff Dr. Jeffrey N. Grossman phone: (703) 648-6184 US Geological Survey fax: (703) 648-6383 954 National Center Reston, VA 20192, USA __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
AW: [meteorite-list] NAME GAME
Fukang Brainard Coronel Arnold Colton! Rifle. Duel Hill Rembang !! Felt. Credo Espiritu Santu Happy Los Martinez Lider -Ursprüngliche Nachricht- Von: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Im Auftrag von Steve Arnold, Chicago!! Gesendet: Sonntag, 26. Februar 2006 01:01 An: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Betreff: [meteorite-list] NAME GAME Of course to walk the GOLDEN MILE,you first have to follow the GOLDEN RULE! STEVE ARNOLD,CHICAGO Steve R.Arnold, Chicago, IL, 60120 Illinois Meteorites,Ltd! website url http://stormbringer60120.tripod.com __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
AW: [meteorite-list] Poll : Online Encyclopedia of Meteorites
-Ursprüngliche Nachricht- Von: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Im Auftrag von Pelé Pierre-Marie Gesendet: Freitag, 24. Februar 2006 07:37 An: MeteoriteList Betreff: [meteorite-list] Poll : Online Encyclopedia of Meteorites Hi Pierre-Marie, my suggestions: Work together with David Weir, his page about the systematics is simply the best on web and better than all books, so you'll save a lot of work. Tell the list, what the morons from the Museum in Paris asked for a simple photo from a single meteorite there, when you were writing your standard work about French meteorites, a book, which they obviously never could accomplish by there own. So my suggestion for the fees are: - institutional collections and their members. 500$ per year. - dealers 250$ per annum - Metsoc members 100$ per year - Collectors 20$ per year - IMCA members (as long as they are no dealers), students, pupils, pensioners, kids, animals: free BUT!! : The fee is reduced with 1$ with each meteorite or meteorite related photo handed in, 3$ when it shows a main mass/main piece. Buckleboo! Martin Hello to the List, I need your advice. I'm starting a mad project. I'm building an Encyclopedia of Meteorites online. 1 All meteorites from the world, with classification, picture(s), circumstances of find/fall 2 A free mode (you can just look at each meteorite file) 3 Subscription system which allows to view at the database, make multi-query searches, print reports, and the best, allows you to manage your collection online 4 It's your encyclopedia. You can send pictures, texts, add-on to improve the database 5 Advertising system which allows dealer to put on advertising for low prices I need your ideas to improve the system, I would like also the price you are ready to pay for an annual fee... Best regards, Pierre-Marie PELE ___ Nouveau : téléphonez moins cher avec Yahoo! Messenger ! Découvez les tarifs exceptionnels pour appeler la France et l'international. Téléchargez sur http://fr.messenger.yahoo.com __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
AW: [meteorite-list] If I can choose.....!
But Andi, you'll have to repair the roof and when it is an iron most probably the ceiling too. On the other hand, as you're living in Germany, the type wouldn't matter as German meteorites belong to the most expensive on Earth. But to the others, if they don't want the rain come in, I can only recommend, that they should let fall a Martian on their houses. Moon is to costy per gram, we haven't such many collectors like in the fields of fossils, antiquities, fine arts so you would have several wet winters until you would have sold so many crumbs of your lunaite until it will be sufficient to pay the repair. Other similar rare types sell at lower prices and are not so asked for like Mars. Sounds strange, but it is true. Buckleboo! Martin PS: My preferred fall would be a CI - they are so crumbly, that they wouldn't cause a damage, I could comfortably scratch the crumbs out of the eaves gutter and it's rare, valuable and a pars pro toto for our solar system. But with my luck, I'm sure during the fall there will be strong rain and all the pieces and crumbs will be flushed to Orcus. -Ursprüngliche Nachricht- Von: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Im Auftrag von Andreas Gren Gesendet: Freitag, 24. Februar 2006 10:22 An: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Betreff: AW: [meteorite-list] If I can choose.! IIF iron for me, please, thanks. Andi If I can choose Would you please make mine an aubrite? They are so pretty, so delicate-looking, hard to believe they can survive the impact. And there is only 16 of them! Anyone else? Anne M. Black www.IMPACTIKA.com [EMAIL PROTECTED] President, I.M.C.A. Inc. www.IMCA.cc __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
AW: [meteorite-list] Poll : Online Encyclopedia of Meteorites
Yep Mike, But such a huge aim, a work of decades, strongly depends on our support, especially as far as pictures are concerned (that's why I made the suggestion of enormous fees, which could deducted by each pic handed in). Also I know that many collectors like to document their specimens with secondary material as comprehensive as possible. Would be great if they could contribute too. I hope that with Pierre's effort we all would be not so phlegmatic, as we were with similar projects. Remember Bernhard Rems' world of meteorites, which had to shut down, because almost nobody was interested in. (Btw where is he? He doesn't answer on Emails anymore, but I saw that he has running a blog). And hey David, don't bother, I thought only, if that work will be encyclopaedic, then sooner or later a chapter about the systematics of meteorites would be necessary. Thus for Pierre not torturing himself, and who could best your Studies, I think one could link them there. And finally, as you are always up to date with the recent publications, you could help him from time to time to update the NWA-pairings Just ideas. Martin -Ursprüngliche Nachricht- Von: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Im Auftrag von Michael Farmer Gesendet: Freitag, 24. Februar 2006 16:20 An: MeteoriteList; Pelé Pierre-Marie Betreff: Re: [meteorite-list] Poll : Online Encyclopedia of Meteorites I would chip in $25.00 year. This is a great idea! People could send in photos of the masses or meteorites in museums that no-one ever gets to see. Mike Farmer - Original Message - From: Pelé Pierre-Marie [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: MeteoriteList meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Thursday, February 23, 2006 11:37 PM Subject: [meteorite-list] Poll : Online Encyclopedia of Meteorites Hello to the List, I need your advice. I'm starting a mad project. I'm building an Encyclopedia of Meteorites online. 1 All meteorites from the world, with classification, picture(s), circumstances of find/fall 2 A free mode (you can just look at each meteorite file) 3 Subscription system which allows to view at the database, make multi-query searches, print reports, and the best, allows you to manage your collection online 4 It's your encyclopedia. You can send pictures, texts, add-on to improve the database 5 Advertising system which allows dealer to put on advertising for low prices I need your ideas to improve the system, I would like also the price you are ready to pay for an annual fee... Best regards, Pierre-Marie PELE ___ Nouveau : téléphonez moins cher avec Yahoo! Messenger ! Découvez les tarifs exceptionnels pour appeler la France et l'international. Téléchargez sur http://fr.messenger.yahoo.com __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
AW: [meteorite-list] A reply to all involved ...
And Walter, not to forget, that we poor Europeans and others, who couldn't attend the show, wouldn't know, how it was there, as until now I can find only his report and no others else. And not to forget, that eucrites can be sometimes very tricky. I remembered last year a person showing around in Ensisheim a new lunaite, which actually turned out later to be an eucrite, but I think, I forgot, who it was... Buckleboo! Martin At least the argueing shows, that all returned healthy from Tucson and full of energy! -Ursprüngliche Nachricht- Von: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Im Auftrag von Walter Branch Gesendet: Donnerstag, 23. Februar 2006 22:27 An: Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Betreff: Re: [meteorite-list] A reply to all involved ... Hi Bernd, Yes, I agree and I am glad you brought this up. I feel ashamed that I did not bring this to the attention of the list yesterday. Mark loves meteorites and he loves interacting with meteorite people. His work cataloging and posting popular press and newspapaer articles is nothing short of amazing and is a real contribution. He really did not deserve to be placed in a bad light yesterday. He was duped only because of his enthusiasm for meteorites and his desire to communicate with others who could not be there (like me). There are many meteorite people I would like to personally meet some day from this list and Mark and others are at the top of my list. -Walter Branch - - Original Message - From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Thursday, February 23, 2006 4:11 PM Subject: [meteorite-list] A reply to all involved ... .. in this ploy if it was one at all! I do hope all of you gentlemen do not forget the beer(s) you owe Mark Bostick. Mark is definitely not the evil-doer but the victim of whatever happened or did not happen in E.T.'s room. He comes home from Tucson, writes a thorough, detailed, in-depth report of what he saw to let those who did not make it to Tucson, who could not see (and touch) the Brenham main mass in person, and enjoy the joyous company at the annual birthday bash, participate in the goings-on there, well, he comes home to get his ears slapped. I'd say this deserves quite a few beers to compensate for the uncalled-for attack on him! My two Euros, Bernd __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
AW: [meteorite-list] A reply to all involved ...
And that's why I think that Ensisheim and Munich are the more pleasant fairs. There all is concentrated in 1 and 3 halls and the dealers aren't scattered through a whole town, so that such an occurrence never could happen, nor would a dealer have an idea to tell stories to lure some audience to his stall. If there would be a doubtable stone, all would take a look and especially in Ensisheim, where after 7 o'clock only meteorite people are on the streets, they would discuss it in the only 2-3 places, to stay in the evening, at a good beer and some ciche... Huh, can't wait the summer! Got so sentimental today, that I bought an engraving of the Ensisheim town hall on ebay... Zelimir, we still need your confirmation! Martin -Ursprüngliche Nachricht- Von: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Im Auftrag von Michael Farmer Gesendet: Donnerstag, 23. Februar 2006 23:30 An: Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com; Martin Altmann; [EMAIL PROTECTED]; 'Walter Branch' Betreff: Re: [meteorite-list] A reply to all involved ... Indeed, but the story goes deeper, Edwin had been told by myself and others (including scientists) that the 2.5 kilo stone was a Diogenite, I have some of the same stone sitting in my office and have seen many kilos of it in Morocco and some at the show in other dealers rooms. That did not stop Edwin from still saying it was a Martian meteorite. The Lunar piece is not even a meteorite. He had numerous pieces in that case, a lot of NWA 1929. It was Edwin's first or second trip to Morocco, so I understand if he does not know the dynamics there of just how many stones are out there. Again, this started as a joke, and you see Edwin did not deny that, of course I can get Ted Bunch in on it since he helped play the joke on Jim Strope and I. He knew those stones were not planetary, but decided to keep saying it afterwards. That is a huge difference. Mike Farmer - Original Message - From: Martin Altmann [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com; [EMAIL PROTECTED]; 'Walter Branch' [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, February 23, 2006 3:18 PM Subject: AW: [meteorite-list] A reply to all involved ... And Walter, not to forget, that we poor Europeans and others, who couldn't attend the show, wouldn't know, how it was there, as until now I can find only his report and no others else. And not to forget, that eucrites can be sometimes very tricky. I remembered last year a person showing around in Ensisheim a new lunaite, which actually turned out later to be an eucrite, but I think, I forgot, who it was... Buckleboo! Martin At least the argueing shows, that all returned healthy from Tucson and full of energy! -Ursprüngliche Nachricht- Von: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Im Auftrag von Walter Branch Gesendet: Donnerstag, 23. Februar 2006 22:27 An: Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Betreff: Re: [meteorite-list] A reply to all involved ... Hi Bernd, Yes, I agree and I am glad you brought this up. I feel ashamed that I did not bring this to the attention of the list yesterday. Mark loves meteorites and he loves interacting with meteorite people. His work cataloging and posting popular press and newspapaer articles is nothing short of amazing and is a real contribution. He really did not deserve to be placed in a bad light yesterday. He was duped only because of his enthusiasm for meteorites and his desire to communicate with others who could not be there (like me). There are many meteorite people I would like to personally meet some day from this list and Mark and others are at the top of my list. -Walter Branch - - Original Message - From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Thursday, February 23, 2006 4:11 PM Subject: [meteorite-list] A reply to all involved ... .. in this ploy if it was one at all! I do hope all of you gentlemen do not forget the beer(s) you owe Mark Bostick. Mark is definitely not the evil-doer but the victim of whatever happened or did not happen in E.T.'s room. He comes home from Tucson, writes a thorough, detailed, in-depth report of what he saw to let those who did not make it to Tucson, who could not see (and touch) the Brenham main mass in person, and enjoy the joyous company at the annual birthday bash, participate in the goings-on there, well, he comes home to get his ears slapped. I'd say this deserves quite a few beers to compensate for the uncalled-for attack on him! My two Euros, Bernd __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing
AW: [meteorite-list] AD: (good offer, Matteo sucks) FRESH ESTHERVILLE PART-SLICE
List! Seems that I should continue with comparing the prices on McomeMeteorites homepage to remarkably cheaper offers, shall I? I think last time I stopped at letter L To help Ryan against Matteo's intervention trying to disturb his sale: 6$/g which he asks lies on the lowest edge of all prices found at all Etherville offerors on the web. Check it out: http://www.meteorite.com/dealer_list.htm There you find at present those prices for Estherville: 9$/g 6-10$/g (+ 17.5% VaT for Europeans), + a 15lb. slice at 4.3$/g, + a 1kg block a 4$/g 15.34$/g 8.6 - 12$/g 15$/g 5.67$-10.15$/g (fragments) 70-75$/g (individuals) 8$/g 7.46$/g And those are the complete Estherville-offers visible today on the dealers_list. Matteo removed his Estherville prices, but if I look back, only 3 months ago, he asked 17.6$ - 50$/g (!!!), so look, who is talking there!! Conclusion: Ryan's offer is the cheapest for slices on the web at the moment, nothing wrong with his price. 2 days ago I sold a slice at 5Eur/g = 6$/g too and I nor the buyer had the feeling, that this would be an exaggerated price. And now we have only a 1.15kg-fragment left, seen the cut loss and the work, we would again ask 6$/g, if we would cut slices. - As we are lazy, maybe s.o. want to have it at 3000$? So Matteo, do us all a favour and don't disturb others, when they advertise their material at good conditions, with your absolutely unqualified comments as long as you aren't able to beat their prices or I have to continue to pick your prices L-Z to pieces. Be warned! Buckleboo! Martin -Ursprüngliche Nachricht- Von: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Im Auftrag von M come Meteorite Meteorites Gesendet: Mittwoch, 22. Februar 2006 07:01 An: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Betreff: Re: [meteorite-list] AD: FRESH ESTHERVILLE PART-SLICE Time ago probably you sale for $6/gr., now Estherville big pieces its available for $3-4/gr. I have pay my Estherville slice years ago $7/gr. from British Museum. Matteo --- RYAN PAWELSKI [EMAIL PROTECTED] ha scritto: Anyone care to make an offer on my slice of Estherville? This particular slice has some large metal blebs and nice crystals as well. I was originally looking for $750, but can be a little flexible on this one. Sorry for posting this to the list, but I don't have a website; this is the best that I can do. Please ask for a photo and we'll work something out. Best Wishes, Ryan -Original Message- From: RYAN PAWELSKI [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Feb 13, 2006 6:51 PM To: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Subject: [meteorite-list] AD: ESTHERVILLE PART-SLICE Good Evening Everyone... Might anyone be interested in purchasing a 125g part-slice of the Estherville meso? It's a very fresh slice from the interior of a very large individual; no oxidation whatsoever, and it has some large metal blebs. I can let it go for six bucks a gram if anyone wants it. Please email off list for a photo. Thanks. Ryan __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list M come Meteorite - Matteo Chinellato Via Triestina 126/A - 30030 - TESSERA, VENEZIA, ITALY Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sale Site: http://www.mcomemeteorite.it Collection Site: http://www.mcomemeteorite.info MSN Messanger: spacerocks at hotmail.com EBAY.COM:http://members.ebay.com/aboutme/mcomemeteorite/ ___ Yahoo! Messenger with Voice: chiama da PC a telefono a tariffe esclusive http://it.messenger.yahoo.com __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
AW: [meteorite-list] Pultusk total mass
2 tons, but only 200-250kg left. -Ursprüngliche Nachricht- Von: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Im Auftrag von M come Meteorite Meteorites Gesendet: Montag, 20. Februar 2006 14:32 An: Meteorite List Betreff: [meteorite-list] Pultusk total mass Hello One question on Pultusk total mass, in the Catalogue its write 200 kg. in Marcin site 250kg. in meteorite to A-Z 999 kg. what is it the right total mass? Matteo M come Meteorite - Matteo Chinellato Via Triestina 126/A - 30030 - TESSERA, VENEZIA, ITALY Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sale Site: http://www.mcomemeteorite.it Collection Site: http://www.mcomemeteorite.info MSN Messanger: spacerocks at hotmail.com EBAY.COM:http://members.ebay.com/aboutme/mcomemeteorite/ ___ Yahoo! Mail: gratis 1GB per i messaggi e allegati da 10MB http://mail.yahoo.it __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
AW: [meteorite-list] Best ALH84001 Meteorite Book
May I ask a hypothetical question? It would be interesting to know, how collectors dealers would estimate a gram price for ALH84001 if it would be available. Buckleboo! Martin -Ursprüngliche Nachricht- Von: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Im Auftrag von MARK BOSTICK Gesendet: Montag, 20. Februar 2006 16:32 An: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Betreff: [meteorite-list] Best ALH84001 Meteorite Book Hello List, I have not read that many of the dozen or more books on ALH84001. Having noted that, the better I have read is The Hunt For Life on Mars, where the writer uses a playful court like setting to defend and argue against the case for life in ALH84001. However, since I have not read many of them I feel my opinion is very limited and therefore I asked NASA scientist Everett Gibson, one of the many people involved with this meteorite that last 10 years, and perhaps the second most involved person with this meteorite, what he thought the best book on ALH84001 is, and if I could share his thoughts, which are presented below. The best book on the ALH84001 meteorite was published February 14, 2006 and is officially released tomorrow, Feb. 21, 2006. The book is written by Kathy Sawyer, Senior Science writer for the Washington Post. Our team assisted Kathy with the book but withheld some of the more interesting information. The title, is THE ROCK FROM MARS: A Detective Story from Two Planets. (I believe that is the title. ) The book is published by Random House. It is over 400 pages long and I believe it sells for around $29.95. The book is available in most of the Barnes and Noble along with Borders book stores because of its recent release. The book is not the final story (that must wait until I write my book) but it comes very close to telling what went on during our research and the unbelievable things occurring behind the scenes at the White House and with the Journal SCIENCE. We were simply carried along and had zero control of the actions going on after we had the manuscript accepted by SCIENCE. Everett On a background notes on who Everett Gibson is. It was from Gibsons safe that the lunar rock was stolen from a few years ago (actually they took the whole safe) and he is the person that brought the Monohans meteorite to NASA after it fell. That is kind of brief, but both have been former list topics. Clear Skies, Mark Bostick www.meteoritearticles.com __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
AW: [meteorite-list] Rust on iron meteorites : new method ?
Ask in your next bakery. Why the Bavarian Pretzels are so tasty? Because of the dunking in NaOH ! Buckleboo! Martin -Ursprüngliche Nachricht- Von: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Im Auftrag von M come Meteorite Meteorites Gesendet: Samstag, 18. Februar 2006 18:33 An: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Betreff: Re: [meteorite-list] Rust on iron meteorites : new method ? where is possible found NaOH? Here in Italy the prices its exaggerated, want 100 Euro for a 50g bottle... Matteo __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
AW: [meteorite-list] Rust on iron meteorites : new method ?
But Göran, NaOH for Pretzels is absolutely normally, they always were made like that, in former times with lye from ashes, was the preferred method to preserve bakery products, I'm sure also in Sweden. First mentioned was a pretzel by the way at the council of Leptinae AD 743. The Bretzel is dipped for a few seconds in a cold watery solution of NaOH of 3-5% (ph 13-14) and then it will be baked. With the CO2 from air, we will recieve natron on the pretzel's surface. 2NaOH(aq) + CO2(g) − − − Na2CO3(s) + H2O(g) Tasty. That's also why Pretzels help against heartburn and together with the salt on his surface it's a good food if you suffer from diarrhea. Meteorites with their nickel don't help half as much! And a large stein of beer, how could it work without a pretzel! Come to Munich to the Mineralientage and I'll convince you, like the Dalai Lama was convinced. When he comes to Munich, he always buys a pretzel. Now, I have to work again, selling off small Marses and putting some more pretzels in then oven... Buckleboo! Martin -Ursprüngliche Nachricht- Von: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Im Auftrag von Göran Axelsson Gesendet: Samstag, 18. Februar 2006 20:14 An: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Betreff: Re: [meteorite-list] Rust on iron meteorites : new method ? Hello list, I'm writing this as a collective answer to this thread and some other earlier threads and contains one half replies, one half ideas and one half ramblings I'm a physicist, not a mathematician. I'm always surprised whenever a new recip for protecting meteorites from rust appears and it contains chlorine ions. Why do you propose to use salt? That is usually a short road to rust in cars just as in meteorites (lawrencite). The NaOH method has nothing to do with neutralising acids. It is a way to heightening the PH value in the solution and to passivate the surface of the iron to prevent rusting. Usually Iron resists rusting very good at higher PH values. Chloride ions works as a catalyst for the reaction of turning iron, water and oxygen into iron hydroxides and oxides and isn't consumed in the process. If you remove the chlorine ions then you have slowed down the process a great deal and if you remove water then it will move at a geological timescale. If you only remove the water then it will also be a very slow process as the chlorine ions is locked up as a salt whenever it dries up. But ferrous chloride (I've heard about people using it to etch meteorites, sounds stupid to me) as a salt is very attracted to water. In an atmosphere with just a bit higher humidity it will start absorbing water and soon you have a drop of rusty water instead of a grain of ferrous chloride. This is what I guess the drops of red water on Marcin Cimalas Nantan contains together with iron hydroxides. The only method that I really believe in for meteorite protection in the long run is to remove the chlorine. By lookin on a similar area where chlorine ions is a big problem we can learn a trick or two. Archeologists are recovering iron artefacts that have been lying in salt water for hundreds of years without any major damage. This is the case if there is no oxygen present, but once recovered the rusting process starts. The way marine archeological finds are treated sounds to me the right way to go. Basically they use electrolytical treatment to drive the chlorine ions out of fractures in the metal. The bath is a waterbath in deionised water with NaOH added. This water is changed a number of times and the levels of chlorine ions are measured. In the beginning it isn't important to use deionised water but in the end it affects the end result. A complete treatment usually takes from a month to half a year and longer for bigger artifacts. A simpler method used is sometimes just to do the same process but without any electricity. This works on the principle that all ions moves randomly in a liquid so eventually most chloride ions will end up in the liquid. Without the electricity to push the ions in the right direction this will take a much longer time. This method is the one that I think sounds most like the alcohole and NaOH method used on meteorites. I have a really rusty Nantan that I plan to test the electrolytical method on but I haven't started yet. As a side note, I've heard about silica gel used for keeping the air dry inside cabinets. This is a good idea but with a warning. The silica gel consists of a mineral called zeolite, it's the mineral worlds sponge and absorbs water inside holes in the crystal structure. The water is not chemically bound to the zeolite which means that if any part of it touches a meteorite, the water is free to use for chemical reactions (rust). Well, as I promised, not so much coherence, more or less free ramblings. Please, correct me if I'm wrong as this is a discussion list. Disclaimer, I'm no chemist, I'm a physicist. And in the end,
[meteorite-list] Cybexx Meteorite-watches Con
Hola list, wanna laugh? http://cgi.ebay.de/NEU-Cybexx-Meteoritenuhr-als-Digitaluhr-empf-VK-169-00_W0 QQitemZ8902289212QQcategoryZ55219QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem (item 8902289212) German ebay at present is flooded with those watches (and I fear soon US-ebay too). The CYBEXX METEORA ! Text says: Accuracy from another star With meteorite quartz. The new dimension of horology: The CYBEXX Meteora receives its impulses from an authentic meteorite-quartz. Nasa-researchers discovered in the desert of Arizona the exceptional physical properties of meteoritic matter. Crystals from inside (sic!)show not only an incredibly perfect symmetry, but also an up to now unknown accurate clock pulse. Rejoice in the unique precision from another star and wear this watch with the sensation to be in contact with the universe. Wow and you even will get a certificate of authenticity!! Never heard of that firm Cybexx, will be Chinese stuff. Buckleboo! Martin PS: Perhaps I should say for the rookies, that quartz in a stone is a bad sign. A criterion to exclude, that a stone is a meteorite. (yaya I know, in some enstatites, shergottites and in some eucrites, there might be quartz, but in such minor amounts, that if you see a shiny quartz with your bare eyes in a stone, one can say: hands off!) __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] OT: MATTEO money for you!!
Sorry list. La principessa sui piselli - has blocked my address, told you, Matteo. There is a client for you, for whom I should paypal you some bucks. Gimme your paypal-address or I take the money and run. Martin Il Principe vero dei meteoriti __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Acapulcoites are the third most common meteorite type.
Ayyy!!! No, such strings are as old as the mountains - it's always the same tkw-, number-salad-, pairing issue. The old crux of all NWA-material, of which really each collector should be aware. And if a collector or a seller can't cope with that situation, he should switch to the names or to the documented Oman finds. We simply have to wait until or whether the pairings of the rare types will onve be put together again. Unfortunately there are so few collectors, imagine the IMCA had 40.000 paying members, then one could easily employ an experienced person to compare thin sections ect, to lift the fog. Easier would be, if, and that was new here, the sellers would more often confess, as far as they know, that they took the quite same material from the same source or from the same chain of sources, then one would had less work in future. To contribute smth constructive: I feel this discussion, whether that a purchase find has 100grams or 10kg with that rare type obsolete. Old MacMartin dances the timewarp: Do you know, what you had to spend in the period of 2000/2001, (that time, when the first NWA-OCs came to market with 1.5$/g) for an acapulcoite? For Acapulco you paid 1000-1200$/g And for Monument Draw 650-1000$/g. Ask Arnold, ask Elliott, ask Cintron. Dhofar 125 wasn't out yet, no Acap was found among the SAHs, nor among the early Libyan finds, so if you wanted to have that type, you hadn't a choice. So where the heck is the problem, when the Hupes offer it at 40$/g? Does it really matters, whether the stone was fist sized or football sized? Do you think you will have in 3 years still the chance to get that stuff so dirt cheap? Again, why you don't use the fine Meteoritical Database, it's free! http://tin.er.usgs.gov/meteor/metbull.php We have always to be aware of what we talking about! There you'll find 22,3kg nonantarctic acapulcoites and 0.5kg antarctic acapulcoites. From the 22.3kg There we have 9 NWA-numbers + now that number 2989, you are argueing about, and here in the discussion we heard, that paired could be 2656-2699-2714-2866-2871-2989 and 1052-1054, so we may reduce the 10 NWA-numbers to 4 falls only or less, if someone would check NWA 3008, 2627, - 725 is an own one. 4 Dhofars, where Dho 125 and 312 are paired. The other 2 I would have to look. 1 Superior Valley bogey of 1.7grams Acapulco as single fall Monument Draw AND THAT'S ALL, folks! The weights are also distributed quite unequal. The supposedly paired NWA 2656 - 2699 - 2871 have alone 7.5kg - 1.294 - 3.47 together 12kg = more than half of all Acap-material on Earth. NWA 725 has 3.8kg Dho 125 7.5kg Acapulco 1.9kg and all the rest are small, down to tiny stones. So with my best will I can't understand, how someone seriously could attack the Hupes, cause they sell their Acap as Ultra rare! We have perhaps only a dozen (I'm to lazy to sort out the antactic pairings) different ACAP falls in history and on Earth, the weight of all material together is 23kg. Why you all loose always sight of the greater context? Well, back to comparing the stuff with diamonds (Yhaaa Doug). We have estimated 680,000kg of diamonds worth to be worked on, And 23kg of acapulcoites. The Hupes are selling at 40-50$/g and for a mediocre quality diamond, brilliant cut smth around 100.000$+/g or so, I'm not a specialist. And at least to the dealers involved in that discussion I have to say, how can you be so incredible stupid!!! You're throwing around with numbers, blaming each other to have same stuff or not, telling this could be paired and this not, all this without giving to the new collectors a frame, which would make the ACAP-thing transparent. Do you know, what Larry, Garry, Darry and Harry are thinking now after this very discussion (indepently from the impressions of the individual posters they got)? They think, that acapulcoites aren't that special, they think the offerors in general aren't honest, they think that acapulcoites must be common and not rare and they are thinking, that in Morocco there is waiting a diffuse amount of ACAP of certainly some hundredweights waiting to enter the market. Consequently they wont buy, even not at 40$, and in a few years, when they will have more experience, then it will be to late, the rare types will be much more expensive again, thus they simply miss that opportunity now. (and many thanks, that when we, da boyz, will have soon ready the classification of our ACAP and we will offer them at 40$ for minute slices, that then again only the veteran and experienced collectors will buy and not the relatively new collectors, because they think, there is no hurry, the stuff isn't rare and the price is to high and the Altmann want to convince me, to buy unattractive crap and that I'll have to spend many days with fighting against windmills). Advice to the newer collectors: Meteorites are not growing like mushrooms out of the ground. Even with the desert rush, there weren't, there
[meteorite-list] OT: Martin's Poll
Hola list, dunno whether it's impolite or correct to address to the list with this personal concern... Some weeks ago my old computer said Goodbye, now I'm building up a new one (Kill Bill, have you ever tried to import an address-book from an old Outlook Express version to a new full version of Outlook? Nearly impossible, what for brain-dead programmers must have been at work). I lost some informations about the marked preferences of my collectors (and I think some addresses too), Can't remember all, are many hundreds. As you know, I like rather to distribute my most special pieces and offers directly to those collectors, in whose focus the locality or type is fitting, than to use ebay (and my homepage, until I'll have renewed it, to keep it updated, who knows, when this will be). So if you like, please give me a note with your preferences, of course I keep them strictly confidential, if you like to continue to receive my offers. Some collect geographically, some historically, some systematically, some only a few types, some only desert, some only endcuts, some everything, some prefer large specimens, some micromounts and so on. Of course those, with whom I hadn't the pleasure yet, but who want to be in my address book too, are cordially invited to do the same. Sorry for this somewhat selfish post, but everyone, who once lost his data, knows what for chaos the loss creates and to reconstruct them, in trying to email each collector in person, would take some months and finally perhaps it may be profitable for you, at least I had no single complaint about my pieces I sold and swapped during the last 5 years. Many thanks Buckleboo, From Chaos-Martin __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
AW: [meteorite-list] Oriented or not?
Not. A fragment. -Ursprüngliche Nachricht- Von: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Im Auftrag von Gary K. Foote Gesendet: Dienstag, 14. Februar 2006 18:09 An: Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Betreff: [meteorite-list] Oriented or not? Campo iron. Three views. Oriented or not? I can't make up my mind. http://www.meteorite-dealers.com/images/campo-840g-regmaglypts.jpg http://www.meteorite-dealers.com/images/campo-840-back.jpg http://www.meteorite-dealers.com/images/campo-840-edge.jpg Gary __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
AW: [meteorite-list] Elementary school presentation tips?
5. Take little samples with you (small Gaos, Canyon Diablos, Henburies) and distribute them as little presents, for them exitedly showing them to their parents and friends. Buckleboo! Martin -Ursprüngliche Nachricht- Von: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Im Auftrag von Larry Lebofsky Gesendet: Dienstag, 14. Februar 2006 16:43 An: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Betreff: Re: [meteorite-list] Elementary school presentation tips? Gary: I have been doing this with kids from elementary school up through college for some time. Everyone does this differently since we all have different backgrounds and expertise. Don't be afraid to say that you do not know the answer. This is better than giving them bad information. I am an asteroid scientist so I know a lot (but not everything) about asteroids and a lot less about meteorites. That is a part of why we do what we do: to learn more. 1. Keep it fairly simple (but be prepared for some good questions). You might start out by asking them simple questions about what is in the Solar System. Good chance to feel them out. At this age they may know about Cassini and other recent missions or they might not know there are nine (or 10) planets. 2. Make connections: show pictures of asteroids and meteors. Explain asteroid, meteoroid, meteor, meteorite. 3. LET THEM HOLD THE STUFF (if not too fragile or valuable). If you have an iron (best because it is different), hand it around with an equal-sized meteorwrong. It makes a point. Most other meteorites look like rocks so it is difficult for young kids to relate to these coming from space. 4. Have fun, get excited: you may get a few converts to science (or at least an interest in meteorites). Hope this helps. Larry Quoting Gary K. Foote [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Hi Everyone, Ron Wesel has been gracious to offer some samples of NWS to me for a couple of class presentations I will make on meteorites this coming month. I've been reading all the books and think I know it all now [HA!] Ron and a few others had some good advice [thanks everyone], but I wonder if anyone else can offer me some tips on making a good, lasting impression on 8 year olds. __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list -- Dr. Larry A. Lebofsky Senior Research Scientist Co-editor, Meteorite If you give a man a fish, Lunar and Planetary Laboratory you feed him for a day. 1541 East University If you teach a man to fish, University of Arizonayou feed him for a lifetime. Tucson, AZ 85721-0063 ~Chinese Proverb Phone: 520-621-6947 FAX:520-621-8364 e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
AW: AW: [meteorite-list] Oriented or not?
Definetely, but I'm extremely conservative. For me a stone is oriented, when I clearly can see were the front and where the back is, flight marks, who indicate a direction would be helpful too. Sometimes there exist e.g. little Sikhotes with flattened ends with bulges on the opposite ends od the piece and the flattened ends each show radial flowlines. Oriented? For me not :-) Why? Because the piece has two fronts, but no back!! -Ursprüngliche Nachricht- Von: Gary K. Foote [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Gesendet: Dienstag, 14. Februar 2006 18:40 An: Martin Altmann Cc: Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Betreff: Re: AW: [meteorite-list] Oriented or not? Definitively? Not challenging, just curious. Gary On 14 Feb 2006 at 18:17, Martin Altmann wrote: Not. A fragment. -Ursprüngliche Nachricht- Von: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Im Auftrag von Gary K. Foote Gesendet: Dienstag, 14. Februar 2006 18:09 An: Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Betreff: [meteorite-list] Oriented or not? Campo iron. Three views. Oriented or not? I can't make up my mind. http://www.meteorite-dealers.com/images/campo-840g-regmaglypts.jpg http://www.meteorite-dealers.com/images/campo-840-back.jpg http://www.meteorite-dealers.com/images/campo-840-edge.jpg Gary __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
AW: [meteorite-list] oriented meteorites
Humm, I don't know, in which direction this discussion is turning, but I have a ungood feeling. My English is bad. I thought always oriented is an elliptic or short form of flight oriented. Of course one can state that everything (except a ball) is oriented. My finger is oriented in a geometrical space, my chair I'm sitting on, my cat too, at least when she's sleeping... For me orientation means, that a piece was shaped during flight, where at least one axis of the specimen was quite stable parallely to the flight direction, or else expressed, that it was not randomly tumbling. That axis I want to recognize on a specimen, I want to see were the apex and where back is, only then I call it oriented. If the regmaglyptes and pits have different sizes and are not elongated in a more or less directional manner than it doesn't help, nor if a a stone has flow lines, here and there, and on each edge in a different direction, as you can find on fresh stones. Or take a pristine good Sikhote, where you find on many edges also of the pits, many flow lines poiting here and there. Call the specimen to have flight marks, but don't call it oriented! Take a look at the oriented Sikhote now from the Hupes on ebay. Here we see radial flow lines and I see where the apex is. It is oriented. If you want to see an oriented Campo, Go on Peter Marmet's page http://www.marmet-meteorites.com/id9.html And take a look at that large Campo (above the pic of Ali Hmani). There you see, that it is not only shield shape, but that the regmaglyptes are elongated to the edges and roughly pointing to the tip of the shield. Did I misunderstand the term orientation for 25 years now, am I alone with my opinion, has orientation nothing to do with flight? Sniff. Martin -Ursprüngliche Nachricht- Von: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Im Auftrag von Steve Arnold, Chicago!! Gesendet: Mittwoch, 15. Februar 2006 00:44 An: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Betreff: [meteorite-list] oriented meteorites Anyone of you can go to my website and look under my museum page and look at my 5 kilo campo.I'd say not only sculpted,but very oriented.The shape of an L.It also has it's own purch to sit very nicely. steve arnold,chicago Steve R.Arnold, Chicago, IL, 60120 Illinois Meteorites,Ltd! website url http://stormbringer60120.tripod.com __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Membrane Boxes
And very important is, how they are packed for shipping! From one supplier I once ordered, they came loose in a plastic bag, so a third of them had scratches. Best martin - Original Message - From: Darren Garrison [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Saturday, February 11, 2006 6:44 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Membrane Boxes On Sat, 11 Feb 2006 11:42:43 -0500, you wrote: Hello list, I'm looking for some small membrane boxes and a jewlers loop. Can anybody refer me to good source for these items at fair prices? Those membrane boxes are great, but good luck finding good prices. Concidering how little plastic goes into making them, they are much, much more expensive (from all sources) than they have any reasonable right to be. You could almost end up paying more for the membrane box than some of the specimens that go in them! I wish that they were a popular enough item to have cheap Chinese knockoffs. __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: Re: [meteorite-list] Membrane Boxes
Huh, where is the problem? Hartman is taking for 100 microboxes 1.3$ each. Seen the weak $, they cost here in Europe quite the same. Don't tell me that you collect only 1$-pieces! Wouldn't you make photos of those persons you love, because the albums to keep the photos are to expensive? For large pieces Andi Gren recommends you to take transparent plastic boxes, to span some cling film (but not the thinnest quality) over the open side and to fix it with Scotch tape, ready is your cheap one-sided membrane box. Marcin, what about your experiments with, now my English leaves me, that device for kitchen, a vacuum sealer? There you would have a membrane box, without any box but 100% membrane! (and you could nail your whole collection on the walls!). Buckleboo! Martin (Sniff the Buckleboo farm has no sign) - Original Message - From: Darren Garrison [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Greg Hupe [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Saturday, February 11, 2006 9:36 PM Subject: Re: Re: [meteorite-list] Membrane Boxes On Sat, 11 Feb 2006 13:15:53 -0500, you wrote: I find Ron Hartman's pricing very reasonable. Try to beat that by buying from the source in Europe and having them shipped to the US. The prices are reasonable-- if you are displaying pieces worth a sizable multiple of the price of the membrane box. For instance, a $800 lunar in a $2 membrane box is no big deal. I tend to collect micromounts, both for economic and for space reasons. I thought about putting all of mine into membrane boxes, but I just could not justify paying the price per membrane box when you could get a gem jar of about the same size for a small fraction of the price. The gem jars are about the same size, about the same amount of material, and about the same complexity to manufacture, but because only one company is making the membrane boxes, there is no competition for them, and therefore inflated, monopoly prices. You can't tell me that stretching that membrane across the plastic is so much more difficult than sticking a piece of round foam in a jar that it costs 3-4 times as much to make? I only go with a membrane box for the pieces with great interest on both size. My other micro pieces go into gem jars. Also, I have one of the boxes like this one, and am really annoyed by the mold mark in the middle of it-- exactly where a mold mark should NOT be on a display case: http://home.earthlink.net/~capricorn89/box23.jpg (irrelevant side note-- I worked in a plastics plant running injection molding machines one summer during school, some of the machines the size of rooms. It gives an interesting perspecitive on how plastic objects are made). __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: Re: Re: [meteorite-list] Membrane Boxes
Hi Darren, as far as I know, membrane boxes were developped for the use of savely keeping the products of dental labs and were never intended to serve as display boxes for us few crazy meteoriticists. So you are comparing apples with oranges. Perhaps it's cheaper to produce gem jars, perhaps membrane boxes have high piece costs, cause there are less quantities produced. I could imagine that a membrane box is somewhat more difficult to produce as the membranes are thin and will teat appart more easy than the massive plastic gem jars. Membrane boxes are quite special and there exist no cheaper producer, so I can't help you, sorry. Would have to look on my old computer, which is not working anymore. I'm buying them from a firm called Schmelzer and all comparable cheap offerors ask the same or more. And as told, with shipping to US, the weak USD and with bad luck some tax at customs - it wouldn't be cheaper than those from Hartman. (or shall I look for offerors where they cost much more than at Hartman's for feeling you better?) Meow. Martin - Original Message - From: Darren Garrison [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Martin Altmann [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Sunday, February 12, 2006 12:09 AM Subject: Re: Re: Re: [meteorite-list] Membrane Boxes On Sat, 11 Feb 2006 23:17:54 +0100, you wrote: Huh, where is the problem? Hartman is taking for 100 microboxes 1.3$ each. Meanwhile, I can buy gem jars for around 20 cents each. It's a matter of scale. I wouldn't worry about a $1 difference in price for something that cost $1000, or $100. But at $10, it starts to be a factor, and the difference between something that cost $1.30 and something that cost $0.20 and serves virtually the same purpose IS going to make a difference in my opinion. I'm not judging the price that the reseller has to charge, I'm judging the price the manufacturer charges. With gem jars, you have something that costs a few cents to make and sells for around 20 cents. With membrane boxes, you have something that costs a few cents to make and sells for over a dollar. That's my point-- price gouging by a monopoly single source. Wouldn't you make photos of those persons you love, because the albums to keep the photos are to expensive? Not a good analogy. A better one is, would I buy a frame for the picture from company X at one price, or buy a frame made from the virtually the same amount of virtually the same materials a different company for 5 or 6 times the price. You might do that. I wouldn't. (And I haven't made a film-based photo in over 3 years-- I've taken maybe 15,000 with my digital camera since then, and at least 90 percent of them have never seen paper). __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: Re: Re: [meteorite-list] Membrane Boxes
Right! I know an collector, who spend most probably a higher amount on the displays than on his collection. An NWA 869 enthusiast. Made some illuminated display cabinets, with asteroid photos in the back, decorated a real strewnfield with desert landscape, sand and unclassified chondrites. Crafted special stands ect. Looks better than anything I saw in a public exhibition and the expenses were well worth as they give the pieces the right glamour! Not to forget, that to a good collection also some good books are incumbement to a collector, as with the knowledge about a specimen the value for oneself is growing. So don't spend all you budget for stones only! Same in amateur astronomy, the largest telescope is useless without a proper mount. Buckleboo! Martin - Original Message - From: Dave Carothers [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Sunday, February 12, 2006 12:23 AM Subject: Re: Re: Re: [meteorite-list] Membrane Boxes I think it all comes down to a matter of personal preference. While I think all meteorites are beautiful, I have some meteorites that I think are more beautiful than others. Those that are extra special, are in membrane boxes so I can better see the entire specimen. Some of these meteorites are VERY inexpensive and others not. The actual cost of the meteorite is not a consideration so much as the actual beauty of the specimen and the ability to see it. For what it is worth. my $0.02 Dave - Original Message - From: Darren Garrison [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Martin Altmann [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Saturday, February 11, 2006 6:09 PM Subject: Re: Re: Re: [meteorite-list] Membrane Boxes On Sat, 11 Feb 2006 23:17:54 +0100, you wrote: Huh, where is the problem? Hartman is taking for 100 microboxes 1.3$ each. Meanwhile, I can buy gem jars for around 20 cents each. It's a matter of scale. I wouldn't worry about a $1 difference in price for something that cost $1000, or $100. But at $10, it starts to be a factor, and the difference between something that cost $1.30 and something that cost $0.20 and serves virtually the same purpose IS going to make a difference in my opinion. I'm not judging the price that the reseller has to charge, I'm judging the price the manufacturer charges. With gem jars, you have something that costs a few cents to make and sells for around 20 cents. With membrane boxes, you have something that costs a few cents to make and sells for over a dollar. That's my point-- price gouging by a monopoly single source. Wouldn't you make photos of those persons you love, because the albums to keep the photos are to expensive? Not a good analogy. A better one is, would I buy a frame for the picture from company X at one price, or buy a frame made from the virtually the same amount of virtually the same materials a different company for 5 or 6 times the price. You might do that. I wouldn't. (And I haven't made a film-based photo in over 3 years-- I've taken maybe 15,000 with my digital camera since then, and at least 90 percent of them have never seen paper). __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.375 / Virus Database: 267.15.6/257 - Release Date: 2/10/2006 __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] fukang meteorite
Ho Steevey, it's very simple. Not the tkw makes the price, the availability does. Read your Kichinka! (Don't tell me, you haven't bought his book yet!) Why Esquel is still the king? Because of its beauty? Or its stability? No. Because it's mainly a single large mass and the owner was clever enough to sell it slowly. Is Brahin or Seymchan crap? No. It is as good or bad as many of the other pallasites in the 20-40$/g range and they are going only at half of the price of an horrible old Gold Basin, because the Russians are the collectors' best friends and the prices are only so low, because they pumped 4 times more specimens into market in only a few years as there are collectors. If they would have listed only the twentieth part of the material they sold on ebay and on shows, they'd have had more lifetime and the same revenues, and Steve Chicago would have to pay for Brahin or Seymchan 15$/g or more. Fukang is one single large mass (I saw a pic, impressive!!) and if the owner won't be so altruistic like the Russians, Steve, than you never will get it at a Brahin or even at a Brenham price. Time to celebrate our heroes! A toast on Serge Afanasjev, a toast on Ivan Koutyriev, a toast on Andrei Andrejewitch Anderson Andreew!! And more respect from the collectors for them as they achieved to make available with their ebay orgies the fanciest stuff even to the collector with the lowest budget. They brought there down the price of - Richfield from 25-40$/g to 1$ - Kainsaz from 45-150$/g to 2.5$ - Dronino from 4$ to 0.1 - Vengerovo would have been good for 20-25$/g -- 2.5$ - Dho 007 from 25-40$ to 1.5$ - Moon from 3500-5000$ to 500$ and three times they achieved the historical world record with 100$-150$ for 1g- slices - Brahin from 6-10$ (and before 20$) to 0.3$ - Seymchan from unavailable to 0.3$ - Chinga from 2.5$ to 0.3$ - Dho-Mars, where you have to pay now 500$/g+, they got 100$ - Tsarev from 2.5$ to 0.4$ - Markovka from 3$ to 0.6$ - Polujamki from 3$ to 0.4$ - Classified Dho-OCs with all find data 100$/kg, hence lower than many unclassified NWA-orphans. - Ghubara from 1.5$ to 0.2$ - Muonionalusta from 6$ (after the new finds, before - better not ask) to 0.3$ - Morasko from 2.5$ to 0.4$ - Sikhote-Alin! Without their help you'd pay 5$ and more. - and currently they work hard to bring for you the unavailable Budulan MES under the level of an old Vaca Muerta! I can understand, that many US-dealers on this list recieve rare reviews and are ehthusiastically praised, what I don't understand, is ,that I never heard a paean of praise here for the Russians, who should be the true heroes of each collector! Buckleboo! Martin - Original Message - From: Steve Arnold, Chicago!! [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Thursday, February 09, 2006 11:30 PM Subject: [meteorite-list] fukang meteorite Well after all the emails.After all the mention of looking for a piece of this meteorite,I came home with none.There were 4 meteorite dealers who had it forsale.They were selling it for between $12 and $20 a gram.And after hearing all the stories about it,there is ALOT of this stuff to go around.Bud eisler,mike farmer,Ann black,all had some forsale.But like I also heard,after a few months it will be lower than $10 a gram.The market will be flooded with this meteorite.But if you have not seen it,it is beautiful.It has the largest olivine crystals I have even seen.Esquel is still the king.Some fukang someday.But not today.I will just enjoy my new haag pieces. Steve Arnold,Chicago Steve R.Arnold, Chicago, IL, 60120 Illinois Meteorites,Ltd! website url http://stormbringer60120.tripod.com __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] fukang meteorite
Brenham has problems with rust too, is it also not worth 1$? Admire is a ruster. Mount Vernon. Singhur and Zaisho I don't know, but if they are rusters and you're be able to get some of them, I will offer you not 1$ but 3$ !! Conservation and preservation is a duty of the collector. Value also strongly depends on the rareness of a class. Homework: Check the Bulletin database and find out how many meteorites are there and how many of them are pallasites!! Meow! Martin PS: There were 4 meteorite dealers who had it forsale I'm not sure, whether Madam Anne did the long journey to China thus They are all trying to recoup their investment. would be another reason, that they won't dump it like Brahin. Let's see, if Koutyriev won't get it in his finger, I see no way, that it will be drop to 1-5$/g. PPS: For humid climate I recommend Imilac as pallasite. (no add, I haven't any for sale at the moment). - Original Message - From: Mark Rexburg [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Friday, February 10, 2006 7:14 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] fukang meteorite Brahin is a ruster and is not even worth $1- per gram if you live in a humid climate. Re-read Steve's email. Fukang is owned by several people, not just one. Main mass is at U of A. The rest is on the market by numerous individuals. That is why Steve saw so much in Tucson. They are all trying to recoup their investment. Mark __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] World-Wide Meteorite Signs Project-You Can Help!
Hi Martin, Project B, buy a meteorite hunter cap from Cottingham Picture-project: http://www.pics.kaybee.org:81/Vacations/Europe1997/Germany/Neuschwanstein/.thumbs/med-castle_snow.jpg Neuschwanstein EL6, my homeland meteorite... who can top this? Buckleboo! Martin - Original Message - From: Martin Horejsi [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Meteorite List meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Wednesday, February 08, 2006 8:35 PM Subject: [meteorite-list] World-Wide Meteorite Signs Project-You Can Help! Hi All, I needed another project like I needed another hole in my head. But while at the Tucson show I was combing my hair and noticed a nice little hole. So it must be time for another Meteorite Project. Everyone can help with this one, and it should be fun. We are collecting road signs, city signs etc. with meteorite names. And not just the name, but also some of the background or surrounding area along with the sign. The purpose is to be able to see what the place is like where the meteorite came from. Was it a dense jungle or a dry desert; a mountainous landscape or a car-clogged city? Anyway, please view this webisite for more details, and send in your pictures! http://www.geocities.com/planetwhy/signs.html Updates will follow as the project progresses. Until then... Cheers, Martin __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] 2003 UB313 Reignites a Planet-Sized Debate
But Doug, you're irresponsible! Can you imagine, what could happened if CIA is monitoring your mail? Soon your president would announce a plan for a mission to Ceres for for for mining Cereals Before the Chinese will do so. ...I believe that this nation should commit itself to achieving the goal, before this decade is out, of landing a man on Ceres and returning him safely to the Earth. No single space project in this period will be more impressive to mankind, or more important in the long-range exploration of space; and none will be so difficult or expensive to accomplish. We choose to go to Ceres in this decade and do the other things, not because they are easy, but because they are CRISPY! Buckleboo the axis of knevil. Hola Sterling, List, All of this talk about planets is making me hungry. I am sure some rapidly rotating stars out there would be tasty pancakes too, and next time Halley's snow-cone comes by I think I'll have a scoop (please hold the aerogel). Now, who has actually seen Ceres with their buff eye? Please tell me, names dates, facts...especially if they are alive, I want to meet this Cererian eagle-eye, and maybe see if a pinch of Kryptonite to taste in their diet ranks with sprouts. Now, wasn't Ceres actually a distinctly Sicilian AND Neopolitan flavor when it was first named? So I guess any Piazzi planet couldn't be a real planet, and only if it were made of green cheese, could it even be a moon? I'd settle for a theoretically stringy basil mozzarella fabric with oregano, and munch at it comfortably on Vesta, the national capital of the Asteroid confederation, where lots more wanderers are certainly visible than from the supposedly named third rock. Yes, the visible from Earth criterion is precisely as foolish as a geocentric theory for the Universe, in my opinion... Saludos, Doug __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] AD: Secret Ad
Hola list, I have today my lazy day, so here a little strange ad. If there's a HED-fanatic, looking for smth very special at a bargain price and willing to spend 190$, I have left a single fullslice of a stone wherefrom these days I sold 12 of 13 pieces within shortest time and with this slice it will be sold out. Please email. Buckleboo! Martin PS: Had also once a strange experience on the airport. At the x-raying at the baggage check, the agent stated with a knowing mien: Aaaah, you have stones in your case! Well, then he wrapped with a wink the passed label around the handle, so I decided not to tell him, that this was one of the few occasions, when Meteorite-Martin was travelling without any meteorite and that the suspected stones were only chocolates in a box. __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] The incredible blob (Secret Ad)
Voilá, I tried that yahoo-photo thing and loaded up some photos of the ominous inclusion in NWA 4019. http://de.pg.photos.yahoo.com/ph/metmartinde/my_photos (I hope it works). NWA 4019 in general is a truely uncommon eucrite. It comes in the familiar polymict Millbillillie guise, but has very much pure iron inside, sometimes in large needle-shaped inclusions in the matrix. Must be the most metal-rich HED found until now. While cutting we found this incredible inclusion, iron mantleing some cores of troilite. Don't ask me, how that came into an eucrite like that. I could understand such an inclusion in a surface breccia, like in a howardite or in these howardite like eucrite breccias, but in such an eucrite? For me a riddle. I guess the remaining slice will be gone now (I'm still waiting on the confirmation), So Hanno Strufe will be the only person, who has some NWA 4019 left for sale. http://www.strufe.net/special_eucrite.htm So hurry up, he has also some smaller cuts, before they are gone. His email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] It's absolute amazing material and we should stay tuned, what NWA 4019 will give for results in future! Buckleboo! Martin - Original Message - From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com; [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, February 06, 2006 11:15 PM Subject: [meteorite-list] Secret Ad David wrote: Well Bernd, I only know of the exotic inclusion you showed me. Go ahead and share this with everyone! Well, I am talking about NWA 4019, a eucrite known to be as rich in metallic iron (conspicuous iron needles in NWA 4019) as Binda and Camel Donga. The latter was considered unique as it contains about 2% metallic iron. The special thing about my new slice is that it features a triple FeNi-troilite aggregate measuring a full 10 mm in longest dimension with the FeS embedded within a rim of metallic iron - something I have never seen so far nor heard of in a eucrite Best regards, Bernd To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com [EMAIL PROTECTED] __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] The incredible blob in NWA 4019 (was Secret Ad)
Voilá, I tried that yahoo-photo thing and loaded up some photos of the ominous inclusion in NWA 4019. http://de.pg.photos.yahoo.com/ph/metmartinde/my_photos (I hope it works). NWA 4019 in general is a truely uncommon eucrite. It comes in the familiar polymict Millbillillie guise, but has very much pure iron inside, sometimes in large needle-shaped inclusions in the matrix. Must be the most metal-rich HED found until now. While cutting Stefan Ralew found this incredible inclusion, iron mantleing some cores of troilite. Don't ask me, how that came into an eucrite like that. I could understand such an inclusion in a surface breccia, like in a howardite or in these howardite like eucrite breccias, but in such an eucrite? For me a riddle. I guess the remaining slice will be gone now (I'm still waiting on the confirmation), So Hanno Strufe will be the only person, who has some NWA 4019 left for sale. http://www.strufe.net/special_eucrite.htm So hurry up, he has also some smaller cuts, before they are gone. His email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] It's absolute amazing material and we should stay tuned, what NWA 4019 will give for results in future! Buckleboo! Martin __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Montprais ? meteorite fall ?
Must be Montpreis not Montprais The handball club of Montpreis is on 2nd place in 2nd league: http://www.sentjur.info/index.php?kat=novicaid=105 The Montpreis were an old noble family, In the former Untersteiermark there is a ruin of a castle Montpreis, ask Christian Anger, he knows perhaps better. Hmm the castle is now called Planina, and there sooo many planinas..., I guess, it should be Planina pri Sevnici in Slovenia. http://www.mapquest.com/maps/map.adp?formtype=addresscountry=SIaddtohistory=city=Planina+pri+Sevnici+ Buckleboo! Martin - Original Message - From: Pelé Pierre-Marie [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: MeteoriteList meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Saturday, February 04, 2006 9:46 PM Subject: [meteorite-list] Montprais ? meteorite fall ? Hello, I've found a mention of a meteorite fall in 1859 in a town (?) called Montprais. Here are the reference to this : HAIDINGER,W. Der Meteorsteinfall zu Montprais am 31. Juli 1859. From: Sitzber. Akad. Wiss. math.-naturw. Kl. Wien 44, No. 2, 1861, pp.373-378 Does anyone know where is located this location ? Thanks for your help. Best regards, Pierre-Marie PELE www.meteor-center.com ___ Nouveau : téléphonez moins cher avec Yahoo! Messenger ! Découvez les tarifs exceptionnels pour appeler la France et l'international. Téléchargez sur http://fr.messenger.yahoo.com __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: Re: [meteorite-list] CONTEST
I suppose, that the main purpose of the contest wasn't to win a little slice of Wagon Mound, but to read the poem.. Buckleboo Martin - Original Message - From: Darren Garrison [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Martin Horejsi [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Wednesday, February 01, 2006 4:20 AM Subject: Re: Re: [meteorite-list] CONTEST On Tue, 31 Jan 2006 19:04:54 -0700, you wrote: First, I replied to the entire group which was a no-no (excuse coming later) and that I am headed to Tucson and the contest is for those lucky folks who won't have to brave the crowds at the show, nor feel bad about dropping the kid's future college tuition on some rocks. Well, these types of contests are pretty much moot in these days anyway. Years ago, you might have needed extensive knowledge of esoteric items to answer such quizes. These days, though, anybody willing to spend a few minutes plugging key words into Google should be able to answer just about any quiz. __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] UA Scientist and Private Collector Form Centerto Save Meteorites
Huh Darren, seems that the time for oPods is coming... I must say, though, it's sad to see all of those scientist buying up all of the 5 to 10 cent But where are they, scientist aren't buying that much But you're right, some statements in this article are strange: The world's meteorites are vanishing. If something isn't done soon, most of Earth's rare space rocks could be gone in a lifetime. No, they don't. That stuff lies in Sahara and Oman for 30.000 years, 1000 years more wouldn't impress a meteorite. Specimens that have fallen over millions of years are being harvested No desert find survives a million of years. And why they suddenly should stop to fall? Commercial dealers are buying these space rocks at prices the scientific community can't match Rubbish. The scientific community spends a lot of money to hunt in Antarctica since decades. Antarctica is a costy place to reach and to stay and to work there. With a minute ammount of the money spend there, the scientific community could have bought all available meteorites from Oman and from Sahara (and hopefully from me) without any problems, and we even didn't talk about e.g. of the 320 Mio$ spent for the failed Hayabusa mission. and cutting them into small pieces for sale to bidders in a flooded market. I want to see that scientist, who manages to get a 10kg stone entirely in a microprobe or under a microscope. We don't have to start the debate again commercialism vs. science, because it's a fact, that if there haven't been comercial interested people, who had the idea to hunt in the desert, 10, 20 years ago, the stones would peacefully still lie there and nobody would have a clue, that the deserts are larded with meteorites. And here Killgore's approach could be very interesting as it could unify both sides, although it seems not to be consequent yet, if I read: That benefits the seller because it's easier to get top dollar for the rest of the meteorite when people know exactly what it is and how much of it is still on the market,... What now, do they want to buy the stones entirely to preserve them and beware them for their fate to be cut? Or do they make the classification only, which makes it for the owner even more desirable to slice the stuff down, as with a proper classification the value and the price is much higher, so that in this tiny meteorite world with it's handfull of collectors, he has to produce smaller pieces to keep them affordable and to get rid of his stuff. Quite a discrepancy. One has not to be a genius and we all could be happy, that obviously there aren't any wealthy private persons interested in meteorites, nor, and that's also a disaccord with the tenor of the article, had science ever a hurry or showed an increased interest in saving meteorites from the desert, that it is a simple, but realistic idea, just to take 3-5 Mio$ and to buy Morocco completely empty + the Oman material + all meteorites from the Russians + most of the stuff of the few dealers, who exist. Simple and cost-effective and seen in regard to the general budgets of all fields of science and of space flight a tiny Flea's Poo Why no private person did so? Because meteorites in general are totally unknown, nor would it be a short time invest, as to sell that stuff again in ten life times is almost impossible, as there exist no collectors for meteorites, see ebay and the prices there. So hats off to the Killgores, I'll be happy not to be forced anylonger to sell stones in minute servings, but to have one constant purchaser more for large and entire stones at fair prices. My simplest thoughts. Buckleboo! Martin - Original Message - From: Darren Garrison [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Meteorite Mailing List meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Wednesday, February 01, 2006 11:49 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] UA Scientist and Private Collector Form Centerto Save Meteorites On Wed, 1 Feb 2006 11:03:45 -0800 (PST), you wrote: Part of the problem is that meteorites are being collected at a record pace. snip center's efforts. His collection is valued at about $5 million, weighs 3,328 kilograms (about 7,340 pounds), and comes from about 900 locations in 37 countries. Yep, the supply of meteorites to science is severly damaged by the people who buy small slices of them (cutting them into small pieces for sale to bidders in a flooded market) says the guy with 8 friggin tons in his private collection. Being an atheist, it's kind of ironic for me to use this quote: http://bible.cc/matthew/7-5.htm I must say, though, it's sad to see all of those scientist buying up all of the 5 to 10 cent bulk amounts of unclassified meteorites before the mere collectors can get to them. Oh, wait. They aren't. They are selling by the tons (or NOT selling, even) to collectors because those distressed scientists are NOT buying them. You know, all of those tons that would rot away in the deserts of Africa if COLLECTORS didn't go there to get
Re: [meteorite-list] CONTEST
And I would say that Poems was edited by Walter Hooper - Original Message - From: Dave Mouat [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Martin Horejsi [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: Thomas Webb [EMAIL PROTECTED]; meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Wednesday, February 01, 2006 1:30 AM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] CONTEST It was a no brainer, but Martin's computer obviously failed to crash in the process of answering as mine did!! Dave Martin Horejsi wrote: Title: The Meteortie Author: C.S. Lewis Book: Poems Books: Of Other Worlds: Essays and Stories and Till We Have Faces: A Myth Retold Movie: The Chronicles of Narnia: The Lion, The Witch, and The Wardrobe Cheers, Martin On 1/31/06, Thomas Webb [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- Thomas Webb [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Date: Tue, 31 Jan 2006 12:47:26 -0800 (PST) From: Thomas Webb [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: CONTEST To: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Hello List Members, As some of us are sitting at home wishing we were at the Tucson show I thought it might be interesting to have a little contest to work on. For the first person to send me the answers to the following five questions pertaining to this poem, I will send a 7.1g polished slice of the Wagon Mound meteorite. Among the hills a meteorite Lies huge; and moss has overgrown, And wind and rain with touches light Made soft, the contours of the stone. Thus easily can earth digest A cinder of sidereal fire, And make her translunary guest The native of an English shire. Nor is it strange these wanderers Find in her lap their fitting place, For every particle that's hers Came at the first from outer space. All that is Earth has once been sky; Down from the sun of old she came, Or from some star that travelled by Too close to his entangling flame. Hence, if belated drops yet fall From heaven, on these her plastic power Still works as once it worked on all The glad rush of the golden shower. 1. What is the name of the poem? 2. Name the author of the poem. 3. Which of this author's books uses this poem as an introduction? 4. Name two other books this author wrote. 5. What current movie was based on this author's writings? Be certain that you spell everything correctly in your answers as this may make the difference in a correct or incorrect answer. Reply to me offlist and I will post the answers and the winner of the contest on the list. The first person with correct answers for all 5 questions wins. My best and good luck, Thomas - Bring words and photos together (easily) with PhotoMail - it's free and works with Yahoo! Mail. __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: Re-2: [meteorite-list] NWA 2995 - Mike and Jim's newest Lunarmeteorite
And a pic of a cut surface of MikeJim's New Moon? - Original Message - From: Göran Axelsson [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Sunday, January 29, 2006 1:05 PM Subject: Re: Re-2: [meteorite-list] NWA 2995 - Mike and Jim's newest Lunarmeteorite The picture is up now and could be found at http://www.meteorite.neab.net/pictures/Berndt/DHO%20910x16-01a.jpg /Göran [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Martin wrote: A speciality of Dho 910 is, that it has a lot of vesicles and bubbles, also quite large ones. The matrix is almost foamy. As it is so fresh, the included gases were pumped out - let's see what the results will be. How bubbly is yours? Have you perhaps a pic of a cut surface for us? Hello Martin and List, Have you perhaps a pic of a cut surface for us? Not quite sure whether you are talking to Mike and Jim or to me. I don't have a website so I can't upload any pictures. But, of course, I do have pictures of my two specimens that I can either send to anyone interested or to someone who can upload it for all of us to view. I have a 16x magnification JPEG I took of my 0.93-gram slice that shows these abundant vesicles, several white anorthite clasts, and some white, meandering veins [(pre-) terrestrial ?]. Bernd __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] NWA 2995 - Mike and Jim's newest Lunar meteorite
Ooops, I saw that I sent this earlier message to myself: Yes the pics remind me strong to 910 too. The almost black matrix, the brecciation, the anorthites not with that ivory luster, like they have in the more weathered Moons, but fresh like white chalk! Yep, Dho 910 is a Moon for achromates. Black, white, grey - (I call it Apollo style - if one remmebers the Apollo pics. The black sky, the white spacesuits, the grey soil..). A speciality of Dho 910 is, that it has a lot of vesicles and bubbles, also quite large ones. The matrix is almost foamy. As it is so fresh, the included gases were pumped out - let's see what the results will be. How bubbly is yours? Have you perhaps a pic of a cut surface for us? Really stunning piece, must be a highlight of this year's Tucson! Martin - Original Message - From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Saturday, January 28, 2006 10:43 PM Subject: [meteorite-list] NWA 2995 - Mike and Jim's newest Lunar meteorite Mike wrote: Martin, we were discussing Dho 910 yesterday, this one to me is almost identical, just different colors in the mixed matrix, while 910 is grey/blue and white, this one is white, black, yellow, green, and about all the other colors in between. One of the noteworthy characteristics of Dhofar 910 is that it has abundant vesicles. Does NWA 2995 also have such a significant amount of vesicles? Vesicles: the interesting thing about my two little Dho 910 slices (0.25 + 0.93 grams) is that they are peppered with such vesicles (large and small) but that they are absent in the anorthosites and the other clasts. Regards, Bernd __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Re: But its start a nigerian meteorite scam?
I recieved it too, but - and this is an general advice - I principially ignore emails, where the recipient's field is empty or contains not my exact address. Mew! PS: Quick, we have a few still some Cohenite-Canyons left! - Original Message - From: RYAN PAWELSKI [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Thursday, January 26, 2006 12:46 PM Subject: [meteorite-list] Re: But its start a nigerian meteorite scam? Got that one also. Infact, I just read it and I was going to be a smart-ass and ask Ms. Ashley King if she is a member of the IMCA. These people are absolutley crazy... I get 15-20 of these emails a day, but only in my new email account. (??) Ryan -Original Message- From: Walter Branch [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Jan 26, 2006 5:39 AM To: M come Meteorite Meteorites [EMAIL PROTECTED], Meteorite List meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] But its start a nigerian meteorite scam? I received the same one yesterday. Since I don't have a website from which I sell meteorites, I would say it is a scam email, like 50% of the email I receive. -Walter Branch - Original Message - From: M come Meteorite Meteorites [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Meteorite List meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Thursday, January 26, 2006 1:11 AM Subject: [meteorite-list] But its start a nigerian meteorite scam? Hello another strange email from a person want buy a meteorite: Hello Saller, Thanks for reading my mail.. This is Ashley king from Ontario,CANADA and i will like to place an Order from your store,And i will like to know the shipp charge to Ontario,canada, Payment Terms: Credit Card Shipping courier: TNT Door to Door Needed your Website so that i can pick the items that i need for you. looking forward to hear soon from you... My Best Regard. Ashley king a meteorite nigerian scam? Matteo M come Meteorite - Matteo Chinellato Via Triestina 126/A - 30030 - TESSERA, VENEZIA, ITALY Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sale Site: http://www.mcomemeteorite.it Collection Site: http://www.mcomemeteorite.info MSN Messanger: spacerocks at hotmail.com EBAY.COM:http://members.ebay.com/aboutme/mcomemeteorite/ ___ Yahoo! Messenger with Voice: chiama da PC a telefono a tariffe esclusive http://it.messenger.yahoo.com __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Georgetown --I knew it = Milly Milly
And the old unit gran (has the same roots like grain) had about 0.05grams. Buckleboo - Original Message - From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Thursday, January 26, 2006 5:54 PM Subject: [meteorite-list] Georgetown --I knew it = Milly Milly Matteo wrote: Et voilà, another victim: No need to worry, Matteo, it's not the real thing, it's only a 17 *g r a n * kind of Milly Milly mock-up :-) Bernd __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Meteorite for $7.1 billion per gram!
Hi Martin, make the same math for the lunar NASA samples and ask then the collectors, why they think that 1500$ per gram for a fresh Moon is expensive. (Not to think about the failed Hayabusa and an ordinary chondrite...). Buckleboo! Martin I accept Paypal. - Original Message - From: Martin Horejsi [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Meteorite Mailing List meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Thursday, January 26, 2006 10:07 PM Subject: [meteorite-list] Meteorite for $7.1 billion per gram! Hi All, Someone check my math, but I figure that if the Stardust sample return is priced per gram given a cost of $200,000,000 for 0.028g of material (based upon the website, and might be rather generous), the price per gram topped $7 billion! $7,142,857,143/g to be exact. Think NASA accepts credit cards? Anyone out there bored enough to calculate ebay's service charge on a one gram sale? Cheers, Martin __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] tucdson 2006
yes, yes but don't drink and write. - Original Message - From: Steve Arnold, Chicago!! [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Thursday, January 26, 2006 11:52 PM Subject: [meteorite-list] tucdson 2006 Hello and good evening list.You have to agree with what mark says about Tucson.It is simply the best to go to in the middle of the winter.METEORITES,METEORITES,and more METEORITES.The mecca of attention is the INN SUITES.You have the biggest known dealers there.You got the REED boys and MIKE MARTINEZ together at another place.BOB HA AG and AL LANG at the westward look.You have IVAN and SERGE at smugglers inn.You have the fashion plate,ERICH at another locale.AL LANG is also at the best western.The temperature for most of next week is supposed to be in mid to upper 70's all week.I will be taking lots of pics with my new Fuji camera.I really look forward to seeing the BREN AM main mass.Also you have the EISLER family at another fine place.This will be my 4Th Tucson,so I guess I fall in the group of old timers.I do know alot of the list members have alot of seniority on me when it comes to Tucson.To me this is the most anticipated Tucson ever,and I think it will just get better.See everyone on the 31st. Tucson bound Steve Arnold,Chicago Steve R.Arnold, Chicago, IL, 60120 Illinois Meteorites,Ltd! website url http://stormbringer60120.tripod.com __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
