Re: [meteorite-list] Murchison Price Difference
Twinstarwell know why he ask the % on paypal payments for ebayMurchins have prices go from $50 to 100-150/gr. depend on size, type of piece etc... Matteo --- Don Merchant [EMAIL PROTECTED] ha scritto: Hi List. If I am out of line here I sincerely apologize to any and all I may offend. Can some one explain why such a HUGE difference in auction price! I'm confused here. Check out both auctions and compare. Maybe there is something I'm missing here except my wallet! Sincerely Don Merchant http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItemih=011item=320021921340rd=1sspagename=STRK%3AMEWA%3AITrd=1 http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItemih=011item=320032119384rd=1sspagename=STRK%3AMEWA%3AITrd=1 __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list M come Meteorite - Matteo Chinellato Via Triestina 126/A - 30173 - TESSERA, VENEZIA, ITALY Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sale Site: http://www.mcomemeteorite.it Collection Site: http://www.mcomemeteorite.info MSN Messanger: spacerocks at hotmail.com EBAY.COM:http://members.ebay.com/aboutme/mcomemeteorite/ __ Do You Yahoo!? Poco spazio e tanto spam? Yahoo! Mail ti protegge dallo spam e ti da tanto spazio gratuito per i tuoi file e i messaggi http://mail.yahoo.it __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Murchison Price Difference
mah...for me depend on rarityI have just sold some pieces of italian historical falls impossible to find from Euro 200 to 400 for gram and all its go sold immediatly, and I have other 2 slices of Siena under the eyes of some collectorsto the face of who say the historical falls its the same ordinary material type the NWAbut I never have seen a slice of Ensisheim sold for $10/gr. ... Matteo --- MexicoDoug [EMAIL PROTECTED] ha scritto: Hi Martin, nice positive outlook! But, let's test these assumptions, just to temper it a little with an alternate economic scenario (Hi Doug of 2026, pleased to meet you and 2006 sends you a warm greeting not to forget! Can you believe that Art's archive's are still available on the Meteorites Disk #23 for $250 each on neXtBay on the exoNet?) There are market swings. The USA enthusiasts are buoying the price of a deluge of meteorites to nice levels today given the flooded market. Just ask the German collectors. The USA suffers booms and busts throughout its economic history. A vote on perpetually increasing meteorite pricing is a vote of confidence in the US economy being the driver of the world, without any dips in the road to eternity. That's a nice thought. Forever consuming 35% of the world's electricity, drowning in petroleum etc. At some point there will be a bust. Maybe when the US Congress realizes that it's debt to equity ratio is worse than a third world country, or maybe when an entire burgeoning generation of aging Americans asks, where is my medical care? Where is my Social Security, and then some responsible fiscal planning starts. Then, Americans will discover German eBay and dump their meteorites there to buy their medications in legions of can you help a brother sales. And suddenly charitable Germans will come to the rescue. Hmmm. 1000 collectors who would rather have an old piece of space rubble than a shining ingot of gold. That fall, ... hmmm ... two tons? Let's see. Each collector can have a couple of kilos. How much is a gram worth? Let German eBay figure it out. Unsatisfied, they will try to negotiate with the nouveau rich of a unified China. have you ever negotiated with them? They're a lot tougher than Germans... Oh yes, the locked up in museums defense. Maybe the Ensisheim Stone won't crack its shackles. Which other ones are so locked up...there must be a few less speculative investments no doubt, like that. But no guarantees...that's why its called business... Right now you can buy a gram of Eucrite for the price of a Big Mac hamburger. We can revisit that ratio when the US starts paying back $400 billion for Iraq and faces high oil prices despite best intentions. Then we can see is a gram of Lunar meteorites can fill my gas tank. (or maybe 10 grams a Russian's tank). Maybe Martians will be $10,000 per gram:) As long as gas isn't $200 per liter Then I'll send you some Dutch tulip bulbs to start a garden. Have a cup of Earl Grey and reminisce about when a good marketer could painfully break even buying and selling meteorites. Meteorites are not rarer than antiques. They are not rarer than anything that can be described as unique. There are a lot of unique things out there. They are rocks with a great story. And we do just love them. Money and love don't always mix well, though. Sometimes when it rains it pours and when it is dry, it's parched as a bone. Speculating about speculating is quite a spectacle, economists are never wrong! The problem is when they really start believing what they say...and convince everyone else that forward looking statements in 10-K's are sure things ... and that 8-K's don't happen... Best wishes, Doug Above is fictitious scenario. No claims are made nor is it the intention to create expectations of truth. The future is unpredictable. Scenario planning is simply a useful tool to understand and manage risks. - Original Message - From: Martin Altmann [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: 'David Weir' [EMAIL PROTECTED]; meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Thursday, October 05, 2006 6:44 AM Subject: AW: [meteorite-list] Murchison Price Difference Each meteorite has its time. Nowadays the usual price for Murchison is 60-100$/g. 7-5 years ago it was at 50-100$/g. A German collector told me, that shortly after the fall, he sent a letter to Murchison enquiring about the circumstances of this new fall. A while later a parcel came back, with nice wording and because in Murchison they were so delighted, that somebody from such a far country paid attention to that fall, they added a 50g stone for free as a little thank you. It is very simple. Meteorites are the rarest good on Earth. If from a locales the lion share is once distributed, the prices are getting higher. The pattern with new falls nowadays is always the same
Re: [meteorite-list] Murchison Price Difference
Hi Don, Murchison is one of the most wildly varying priced meteorites I've seen. The old traditional price was $100/g but you usually stuggle to get that price nowadays. I've decent pieces sell many times below that. Cheers, Jeff - Original Message - From: Don Merchant To: Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, October 05, 2006 8:18 AM Subject: [meteorite-list] Murchison Price Difference Hi List. If I am out of line here I sincerely apologize to any and all I may offend. Can some one explain why such a HUGE difference in auction price! I'm confused here. Check out both auctions and compare. Maybe there is something I'm missing here except my wallet! Sincerely Don Merchant http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItemih=011item=320021921340rd=1; sspagename=STRK%3AMEWA%3AITrd=1 http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItemih=011item=320032119384rd=1; sspagename=STRK%3AMEWA%3AITrd=1 __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Murchison Price Difference
Don, Perhaps some people remember that Murchison typically sold for $30-40/g a dozen years ago and refuse to see the justification for such high pricing today, while others newer to the scene are content to buy high. David __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
AW: [meteorite-list] Murchison Price Difference
chondrites, cause they weren't worth a tinker's cuss and finally about 3 boyz from Germany, who augured this development years ago without being prophets. And the archives of this list will be like a far and very strange land of wonders and fairy tales. Enjoy these days in meteorite-paradise before it will be lost! Martin -Ursprüngliche Nachricht- Von: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Im Auftrag von David Weir Gesendet: Donnerstag, 5. Oktober 2006 11:52 An: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Betreff: Re: [meteorite-list] Murchison Price Difference Don, Perhaps some people remember that Murchison typically sold for $30-40/g a dozen years ago and refuse to see the justification for such high pricing today, while others newer to the scene are content to buy high. David __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Murchison Price Difference
Hi Martin, nice positive outlook! But, let's test these assumptions, just to temper it a little with an alternate economic scenario (Hi Doug of 2026, pleased to meet you and 2006 sends you a warm greeting not to forget! Can you believe that Art's archive's are still available on the Meteorites Disk #23 for $250 each on neXtBay on the exoNet?) There are market swings. The USA enthusiasts are buoying the price of a deluge of meteorites to nice levels today given the flooded market. Just ask the German collectors. The USA suffers booms and busts throughout its economic history. A vote on perpetually increasing meteorite pricing is a vote of confidence in the US economy being the driver of the world, without any dips in the road to eternity. That's a nice thought. Forever consuming 35% of the world's electricity, drowning in petroleum etc. At some point there will be a bust. Maybe when the US Congress realizes that it's debt to equity ratio is worse than a third world country, or maybe when an entire burgeoning generation of aging Americans asks, where is my medical care? Where is my Social Security, and then some responsible fiscal planning starts. Then, Americans will discover German eBay and dump their meteorites there to buy their medications in legions of can you help a brother sales. And suddenly charitable Germans will come to the rescue. Hmmm. 1000 collectors who would rather have an old piece of space rubble than a shining ingot of gold. That fall, ... hmmm ... two tons? Let's see. Each collector can have a couple of kilos. How much is a gram worth? Let German eBay figure it out. Unsatisfied, they will try to negotiate with the nouveau rich of a unified China. have you ever negotiated with them? They're a lot tougher than Germans... Oh yes, the locked up in museums defense. Maybe the Ensisheim Stone won't crack its shackles. Which other ones are so locked up...there must be a few less speculative investments no doubt, like that. But no guarantees...that's why its called business... Right now you can buy a gram of Eucrite for the price of a Big Mac hamburger. We can revisit that ratio when the US starts paying back $400 billion for Iraq and faces high oil prices despite best intentions. Then we can see is a gram of Lunar meteorites can fill my gas tank. (or maybe 10 grams a Russian's tank). Maybe Martians will be $10,000 per gram:) As long as gas isn't $200 per liter Then I'll send you some Dutch tulip bulbs to start a garden. Have a cup of Earl Grey and reminisce about when a good marketer could painfully break even buying and selling meteorites. Meteorites are not rarer than antiques. They are not rarer than anything that can be described as unique. There are a lot of unique things out there. They are rocks with a great story. And we do just love them. Money and love don't always mix well, though. Sometimes when it rains it pours and when it is dry, it's parched as a bone. Speculating about speculating is quite a spectacle, economists are never wrong! The problem is when they really start believing what they say...and convince everyone else that forward looking statements in 10-K's are sure things ... and that 8-K's don't happen... Best wishes, Doug Above is fictitious scenario. No claims are made nor is it the intention to create expectations of truth. The future is unpredictable. Scenario planning is simply a useful tool to understand and manage risks. - Original Message - From: Martin Altmann [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: 'David Weir' [EMAIL PROTECTED]; meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Thursday, October 05, 2006 6:44 AM Subject: AW: [meteorite-list] Murchison Price Difference Each meteorite has its time. Nowadays the usual price for Murchison is 60-100$/g. 7-5 years ago it was at 50-100$/g. A German collector told me, that shortly after the fall, he sent a letter to Murchison enquiring about the circumstances of this new fall. A while later a parcel came back, with nice wording and because in Murchison they were so delighted, that somebody from such a far country paid attention to that fall, they added a 50g stone for free as a little thank you. It is very simple. Meteorites are the rarest good on Earth. If from a locales the lion share is once distributed, the prices are getting higher. The pattern with new falls nowadays is always the same. First there is a hype, many fear to miss out, the first one or two offerers make the price. Depending on the quantity available and the number of additional offerors getting access to the material, the price will fall. After a while, when most of the material is gone, the prices will raise again, not so seldom transcending the initial prices. To expect a meteorite offeror to give away his goodies at the all-time lowest price, is silly. In acquiring material, he has to bear also often the same price fluctuations as the collector too and anyway they are working with lower profit than your next
AW: [meteorite-list] Murchison Price Difference
Little addendum: in remembering the prices from past days, we always forget about the inflation. I just found that nice tool: http://www.westegg.com/inflation/ According this calculator, USA had an inflation of roughly 50% from 1990 to 2005. And 150% from 1980 to 2005. Sniff, I paid 2$/g 1986 for Chinga at Carion. Would be 3.50$/g today... Uuuh, Buehler asked 8 years ago 7.43$/g for the first Udei Stations! Would be now: 8.7$/g. Hey, we have a slice left: 5.5$/g + 3$ ship. Buckleboo! Martin -Ursprüngliche Nachricht- Von: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Im Auftrag von David Weir Gesendet: Donnerstag, 5. Oktober 2006 11:52 An: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Betreff: Re: [meteorite-list] Murchison Price Difference Don, Perhaps some people remember that Murchison typically sold for $30-40/g a dozen years ago and refuse to see the justification for such high pricing today, while others newer to the scene are content to buy high. David __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
AW: [meteorite-list] Murchison Price Difference
Hi Doug, Then, Americans will discover German eBay and dump their meteorites Not a good perspective, Germans tend to be notoriously pessimistic, when the famous German angst seizes them, they will store each penny under the mattress. I guess they should rather list the stuff then in Chinese ebay. (also as a revenge for the endless Nantan fakes today). Nice that you will send me tulip bulbs, will give me the opportunity to explain the difference between tulips and meteorites. The tulipomania in 17th century was quite the most exalted episode in the history of collecting. Tulip bulbs were paid with the same weight in gold and were objects of speculation; options for tulips were dealt. The summit of this race was in 1637, when for 3 bulbs of a rare kind of tulips the price of 3 houses in Amsterdam was paid. The Dutch government finally fixed the tulip prices by a law, subsequently the prices collapsed and this event is known as the first stock exchange crash in history. So far the analogy with meteorites. The crash in meteorite market we all observed, but, Doug, tulips you can grow and multiply. Meteorites you can't cultivate - and where in future shall such amounts of meteorites grow again, when Sahara and Oman will be over? Franconia? Gobi? Atacama? Can't you see, that within the only last 5 years the number of meteorites quite sudden exploded to a 50times larger quantity as the 200 years before? Take a look in the previous Blue Book of 1986. There we have aside the Antarctics only 3000 meteorites at all! Where are we currently in numbering the NWAs from 2001 - I guess we are scratching on the NWA 5000 figure, with the Dhofars, help me, 1500-2000 ?? SaU, SAH, DaG, and so on. And I guess quite a pile waits to be classified. Man Doug! That is an unique meteoritical peak in history. The number of collectors perhaps tripled, the number of meteorites available increased 50fold. The prices went u n d e r g r o u n d !!! The desert rush had ist culmination 2-3 years ago, since then the supply drastically shortened - if you don't believe the sound of the prayer wheels of the dealers and Morocco pilgrims, listen at least to the reports from the big mineral shows, told by collectors. On the other hands, itineri-itinera check the overall quantities of meteorites in the Bulletin database, there simply never were, are, will be ominous hundreds of tons of meteorites from Sahara, because they simply never existed! If the supply runs out, the collectors will have gnawed off the largest part of the backlock, and there you can have as much as economical recessions in US as you want, with this price level today, there is no other way, that the prices will raise, if not an asteroid collision will wipe out all mammals from our planet. Hstory, can please someone write an article about meteorite collecting from the 20ies to the 60ies, after the big national races in 19th century and a little bit later too, the establishing of the large collections of the worlds, I feel always such a large gap in the history of meteorite collecting until in the 60ies, 70ies one can read again more about meteorites. From the time inbetween I have no ideas. Only sporadical episodes, that poor Nininger was forced to tinker funny stars from Canyon spherules in his museum for not having to starve. Thanks Martin -Ursprüngliche Nachricht- Von: MexicoDoug [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Gesendet: Donnerstag, 5. Oktober 2006 14:53 An: Martin Altmann; meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Betreff: Re: [meteorite-list] Murchison Price Difference Hi Martin, nice positive outlook! But, let's test these assumptions, just to temper it a little with an alternate economic scenario (Hi Doug of 2026, pleased to meet you and 2006 sends you a warm greeting not to forget! Can you believe that Art's archive's are still available on the Meteorites Disk #23 for $250 each on neXtBay on the exoNet?) There are market swings. The USA enthusiasts are buoying the price of a deluge of meteorites to nice levels today given the flooded market. Just ask the German collectors. The USA suffers booms and busts throughout its economic history. A vote on perpetually increasing meteorite pricing is a vote of confidence in the US economy being the driver of the world, without any dips in the road to eternity. That's a nice thought. Forever consuming 35% of the world's electricity, drowning in petroleum etc. At some point there will be a bust. Maybe when the US Congress realizes that it's debt to equity ratio is worse than a third world country, or maybe when an entire burgeoning generation of aging Americans asks, where is my medical care? Where is my Social Security, and then some responsible fiscal planning starts. Then, Americans will discover German eBay and dump their meteorites there to buy their medications in legions of can you help a brother sales. And suddenly charitable Germans will come to the rescue. Hmmm. 1000 collectors who would rather
Re: [meteorite-list] Murchison Price Difference
Hello list, Martin Altmann wrote: Then, Americans will discover German eBay and dump their meteorites (quoting Doug) Not a good perspective, Germans tend to be notoriously pessimistic, when the famous German angst seizes them, they will store each penny under the mattress. Well, I would be able to help out with at least 3 or 4 fearless and notoriously optimistic addresses even here, if wanted. Martin Altmann also wrote: If the supply runs out, the collectors will have gnawed off the largest part of the backlock, and there you can have as much as economical recessions in US as you want, with this price level today, there is no other way, that the prices will raise, if not an asteroid collision [will wipe out all mammals from our planet] will provide us with thousands of tons of breathtakingly (!) fresh, beautiful and probably totally unknown material. Look: if that's not optimistic and fearless, I don't know ... Greets, Matthias __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Murchison Price Difference
Martin wrote: ...Doug, tulips you can grow and multiply.(snip)...Meteorites you can't cultivate - and where in future shall such amounts of meteorites grow again, when Sahara and Oman will be over? Hello again, Martin (and also Matthias:)), Well, maybe under the sea? There's still an untapped 70-75% of the world. Then there is strewn field some collectors have between their meteorite showcases and their mailboxes. Not to mention that storehouse of all my unmatched socks and the meteorites lost by postal services worldwide. Maybe we won't be so lucky there., but: Meteorites are a recyclable resource ... you can cultivate and prune and they do multiply... Meteorites don't die, at worst they just whittle away... Collectors, they do die, and their meteorites are the seed and bulbs of new generations...They are the new strewn fields of the future...along with tons of meteorites hoarded in garbage cans in the garages of speculative hunters ... Today meteorites are a link to Solar system. Tomorrow Richard Branson will have expeditions to see the orchestrated performances of meteoroid streams, where you can dip a special ladle into the flow and catch a flying star and put it in your pocket and save it for a stormy day. In 20 years a Moon Colony will be established...The Japanese will jump start Asteroid mining activities...Asteroid Slag will become a collectable, and the miners on the asteroids will give you a ton of material for an attempted sniff or gaze upon a tulip. There is no choice. All resources are limited on earth. The only outlet is out there. Over the long haul all of us are only renting meteorites anyway We will run out of land to buy before we run out of meteorites to exchange. And then you will want a plot of land for your family, not a pound of space rubble. Just a few thoughts on the future from our snapshot in time. And before ideologies change and we catch up to it... Best wishes, Doug - Original Message - From: Martin Altmann [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: 'MexicoDoug' [EMAIL PROTECTED]; meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Thursday, October 05, 2006 8:55 AM Subject: AW: [meteorite-list] Murchison Price Difference Hi Doug, Then, Americans will discover German eBay and dump their meteorites Not a good perspective, Germans tend to be notoriously pessimistic, when the famous German angst seizes them, they will store each penny under the mattress. I guess they should rather list the stuff then in Chinese ebay. (also as a revenge for the endless Nantan fakes today). Nice that you will send me tulip bulbs, will give me the opportunity to explain the difference between tulips and meteorites. The tulipomania in 17th century was quite the most exalted episode in the history of collecting. Tulip bulbs were paid with the same weight in gold and were objects of speculation; options for tulips were dealt. The summit of this race was in 1637, when for 3 bulbs of a rare kind of tulips the price of 3 houses in Amsterdam was paid. The Dutch government finally fixed the tulip prices by a law, subsequently the prices collapsed and this event is known as the first stock exchange crash in history. So far the analogy with meteorites. The crash in meteorite market we all observed, but, Doug, tulips you can grow and multiply. Meteorites you can't cultivate - and where in future shall such amounts of meteorites grow again, when Sahara and Oman will be over? Franconia? Gobi? Atacama? Can't you see, that within the only last 5 years the number of meteorites quite sudden exploded to a 50times larger quantity as the 200 years before? Take a look in the previous Blue Book of 1986. There we have aside the Antarctics only 3000 meteorites at all! Where are we currently in numbering the NWAs from 2001 - I guess we are scratching on the NWA 5000 figure, with the Dhofars, help me, 1500-2000 ?? SaU, SAH, DaG, and so on. And I guess quite a pile waits to be classified. Man Doug! That is an unique meteoritical peak in history. The number of collectors perhaps tripled, the number of meteorites available increased 50fold. The prices went u n d e r g r o u n d !!! The desert rush had ist culmination 2-3 years ago, since then the supply drastically shortened - if you don't believe the sound of the prayer wheels of the dealers and Morocco pilgrims, listen at least to the reports from the big mineral shows, told by collectors. On the other hands, itineri-itinera check the overall quantities of meteorites in the Bulletin database, there simply never were, are, will be ominous hundreds of tons of meteorites from Sahara, because they simply never existed! If the supply runs out, the collectors will have gnawed off the largest part of the backlock, and there you can have as much as economical recessions in US as you want, with this price level today, there is no other way, that the prices will raise, if not an asteroid collision will wipe out all mammals from our planet. Hstory, can please someone
AW: [meteorite-list] Murchison Price Difference
Doug wrote: In 20 years a Moon Colony will be established... Hi Doug, and All, 20 years ago a lot of people believed: In 20 years a Mars Colony will be established... In Kubrick's 2001 we even made it to Jupiter, and its moon Europa in a shorter period of time. And look at where we are now - they (ESA, NASA, etc.) are even having big troubles in getting the ISS ready until 2010, not to speak about returning to the Moon :-( Don't get me wrong, I'd be the first to book a room in the Luna Hilton, and I perfectly agree that our future is out there... I'm just trying to be a bit more realistic ,-) Just a few thoughts on the future from our snapshot in time. And before ideologies change and we catch up to it... Yeap, ideologies and paradigms change pretty fast, these days... But, to come back to meteorites, I believe Martin is right - meteorites are a non-renewable resource. Maybe they might be recycleable up to some point, as you say, but just imagine that the number of collectors might double in a few years, and then again double in a few years more, etc., and all those tiny stocks we have now will be a drop lost in an ocean. Exponentially yours, Norbert __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Murchison Price Difference
but just imagine that the number of collectors might double in a few years, and then again double in a few years more, etc., and all those tiny stocks we have now will be a drop lost in an ocean. Hi Norbert, Martin oweh and friends, The only objection to that scenario is that meteorites have extremely elastic demand. I really believe that some combination of all of our scenarios and much more will shake out during the evolution we are all shaping. Not trying to be negative - and not rejecting Martin's scenarios, just rounding them out from the typical hype we love to share with each other. I just try to look at the big picture, even though I don't have a Harvard degree. To keep in mind that as meteorites get more expensive, they plummet after smashing against a demand wall. Collecting just isn't as widespread when new collectors need microscopes to see many of their pieces and can't put them in big cabinets and displays. So, rather than pick up those collectors on the margin, you just as well can lose them. There is a finite amount of material available - it works both ways. People loose interest as well ... as the economies that go bust. I don't think any number of German Buyers on eBay will remedy their perceptions which just seem to breed familiarity with the drill ... As for behavior and thought that a Moonbase is just a pipe dream far off...you did mention the ISS. Human psyche is so adaptable...sometimes sadly. The ISS is an incredible project, but has a fallen image, victimized by politicians, war, and beaurocracy. If only the world could take a moment out of its busy rotating schedule and revel a bit on the magnitude of this accomplishment, misguided as it may seem to some. The ISS is truly our first Castle in the Sky. That's not in the writing, though. But do look at the situation. Familiarity - taking the technology for granted - and it is on the back burner. That is a stark parallel to people's behavior toward meteorites as the h-AAAhhh effect cools off. Then functionally is sought. The ISS really is more than the half way point of difficulty and is what 10 years in the making? How easy this will be from the ISS to the Moon... Japan's Hayabusa mission was no random event for an island strapped for resources and hungry for advancement. Now behemoth Orion rocket contracts are awarded and private industry doesn't joke when it designs the Spaceport in New Mexico. Here is where we are in different thoughts. I have every intention of seeing you at the Luna Hilton, within 25 years, or in my case at the Luna Youth Hostel, on the lunar floor in my high tech sleeping bag. I'll be willing to give up meteorite collecting and all of my investment into it in a heartbeat, for that opportunity. If I have a weight limit, I'll just not eat while I am there, and on the way back, I'll leave my 2kg of disposable clothing there and come back in a Speedo or diapers packed with Moondust if I can. All of such samples thus returned will be essentially free - fronted-err... piggybacked, and returned after journeys serving a higher purpose. Plenty of this material will eventually make it to eBay, fakes, reals and all. The technology wasn't here when Kennedy set priorities and twelve years later enough round trips were made to have built a Moonbase by 1972. China is here to stay and hungry for her strategic place on the Moon. That will remind Europe and the USA, not to mention India and Russia, that they USA's Apollo program is yesterday's news and yesterday's crowning dominance. The secrets to defense and resources are their future. It is no longer a science fiction scenario alone ... it is an issue of strategic initiative by the have nots and desire to have the glory we've seen squandered by able nations. Just wait until China demonstrates she has the technology to put her first man on the Moon. I assure you the Orion rockets and ISS will have their work cut out for them within 20 years, if private industry don't surpass them in the meantime - which it increasingly positioning itself to do... Hasta la Luna, Doug - Original Message - From: Norbert Classen [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Thursday, October 05, 2006 3:40 PM Subject: AW: [meteorite-list] Murchison Price Difference Doug wrote: In 20 years a Moon Colony will be established... Hi Doug, and All, 20 years ago a lot of people believed: In 20 years a Mars Colony will be established... In Kubrick's 2001 we even made it to Jupiter, and its moon Europa in a shorter period of time. And look at where we are now - they (ESA, NASA, etc.) are even having big troubles in getting the ISS ready until 2010, not to speak about returning to the Moon :-( Don't get me wrong, I'd be the first to book a room in the Luna Hilton, and I perfectly agree that our future is out there... I'm just trying to be a bit more realistic ,-) Just a few thoughts on the future from our snapshot
Re: [meteorite-list] Murchison Price Difference
Hello Doug , - You wrote: Meteorites are a recyclable resource ... you can cultivate and prune and they do multiply... That's a nice concept indeed. With my inner eyes I can see a pretty garden with meteorite-beds. In springtime you only have to put the little micromounts in the earth, give them a few dips for developing regmaglypts, yes, do some pruning work (for orientation) and, not to forget: they need a good amount of water each day, early in the morning and in the late afternoon. Especially the irons. The result? You also wrote: Meteorites don't die I'm sure: they will be as dead as mutton in a few weeks, at least months. With other words: it may not be a main aspect, but we must not neglect the loss of meteoritical material through rust (not only the irons), erosion, wrong treatment etc. Each slice one cuts, each process of abrading, (re-)polishing,(re-)etching etc. means to loose material. Not so much in the single case. But in addition? Anyway, we have to book it under debit. By the way: Cultivating the meteorite-garden would be a perfect subject for comic-artist Mark Bostick (I remember with pleasure his Hunting Meteorites in a Perfect World :-) ... Kind regards, Matthias - Original Message - From: MexicoDoug [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Martin Altmann [EMAIL PROTECTED]; meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Thursday, October 05, 2006 7:19 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Murchison Price Difference Martin wrote: ...Doug, tulips you can grow and multiply.(snip)...Meteorites you can't cultivate - and where in future shall such amounts of meteorites grow again, when Sahara and Oman will be over? Hello again, Martin (and also Matthias:)), Well, maybe under the sea? There's still an untapped 70-75% of the world. Then there is strewn field some collectors have between their meteorite showcases and their mailboxes. Not to mention that storehouse of all my unmatched socks and the meteorites lost by postal services worldwide. Maybe we won't be so lucky there., but: Meteorites are a recyclable resource ... you can cultivate and prune and they do multiply... Meteorites don't die, at worst they just whittle away... Collectors, they do die, and their meteorites are the seed and bulbs of new generations...They are the new strewn fields of the future...along with tons of meteorites hoarded in garbage cans in the garages of speculative hunters ... Today meteorites are a link to Solar system. Tomorrow Richard Branson will have expeditions to see the orchestrated performances of meteoroid streams, where you can dip a special ladle into the flow and catch a flying star and put it in your pocket and save it for a stormy day. In 20 years a Moon Colony will be established...The Japanese will jump start Asteroid mining activities...Asteroid Slag will become a collectable, and the miners on the asteroids will give you a ton of material for an attempted sniff or gaze upon a tulip. There is no choice. All resources are limited on earth. The only outlet is out there. Over the long haul all of us are only renting meteorites anyway We will run out of land to buy before we run out of meteorites to exchange. And then you will want a plot of land for your family, not a pound of space rubble. Just a few thoughts on the future from our snapshot in time. And before ideologies change and we catch up to it... Best wishes, Doug __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Murchison Price Difference
Hi Matthias!
Yes to all you say, I can see you're not a big fan of mitosis and meiowsis,
including cut loss and rusting, I'll only whisper {Bessey specks}...
Oh, here'd be my exception:
Please don't forget that every decade a few good witnessed falls in fact are
responsible for the birth of the finest collectable meteorites! As a matter
of fact they are getting (recovered) more common every year as people put up
parking lots, streets and industrial complexes everywhere!
Now on to see Rob's Comet tonight (to use my finder chart posted just turn
it upside down for the evening vs. morning), though there will be a bright
Moon adding to the difficulties tonight, hopefully now is the time!
And finally, A wonderful Happy Birthday to Monze! That great fall of 1950
born on this special day in history!
Mitotically yours,
Doug
- Original Message -
From: Matthias Bärmann [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: MexicoDoug [EMAIL PROTECTED]; meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com
Sent: Thursday, October 05, 2006 6:51 PM
Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Murchison Price Difference
Hello Doug , -
You wrote: Meteorites are a recyclable resource ... you can cultivate and
prune and they do multiply...
That's a nice concept indeed. With my inner eyes I can see a pretty garden
with meteorite-beds. In springtime you only have to put the little
micromounts in the earth, give them a few dips for developing regmaglypts,
yes, do some pruning work (for orientation) and, not to forget: they need
a
good amount of water each day, early in the morning and in the late
afternoon. Especially the irons. The result?
You also wrote: Meteorites don't die
I'm sure: they will be as dead as mutton in a few weeks, at least months.
With other words: it may not be a main aspect, but we must not neglect the
loss of meteoritical material through rust (not only the irons), erosion,
wrong treatment etc. Each slice one cuts, each process of abrading,
(re-)polishing,(re-)etching etc. means to loose material. Not so much in
the single case. But in addition? Anyway, we have to book it under
debit.
By the way: Cultivating the meteorite-garden would be a perfect subject
for comic-artist Mark Bostick (I remember with pleasure his Hunting
Meteorites in a Perfect World :-) ...
Kind regards,
Matthias
- Original Message -
From: MexicoDoug [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: Martin Altmann [EMAIL PROTECTED];
meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com
Sent: Thursday, October 05, 2006 7:19 PM
Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Murchison Price Difference
Martin wrote:
...Doug, tulips you can grow and multiply.(snip)...Meteorites you can't
cultivate - and where in future shall such amounts of meteorites grow
again,
when Sahara and Oman will be over?
Hello again, Martin (and also Matthias:)),
Well, maybe under the sea? There's still an untapped 70-75% of the world.
Then there is strewn field some collectors have between their meteorite
showcases and their mailboxes. Not to mention that storehouse of all my
unmatched socks and the meteorites lost by postal services worldwide.
Maybe
we won't be so lucky there., but:
Meteorites are a recyclable resource ... you can cultivate and prune and
they do multiply... Meteorites don't die, at worst they just whittle
away...
Collectors, they do die, and their meteorites are the seed and bulbs of
new
generations...They are the new strewn fields of the future...along with
tons
of meteorites hoarded in garbage cans in the garages of speculative
hunters
...
Today meteorites are a link to Solar system. Tomorrow Richard Branson
will
have expeditions to see the orchestrated performances of meteoroid
streams,
where you can dip a special ladle into the flow and catch a flying star
and
put it in your pocket and save it for a stormy day. In 20 years a Moon
Colony will be established...The Japanese will jump start Asteroid mining
activities...Asteroid Slag will become a collectable, and the miners on
the
asteroids will give you a ton of material for an attempted sniff or gaze
upon a tulip.
There is no choice. All resources are limited on earth. The only outlet
is
out there. Over the long haul all of us are only renting meteorites
anyway
We will run out of land to buy before we run out of meteorites to
exchange. And then you will want a plot of land for your family, not a
pound of space rubble.
Just a few thoughts on the future from our snapshot in time.
And before ideologies change and we catch up to it...
Best wishes, Doug
__
Meteorite-list mailing list
Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com
http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Murchison Price Difference
Hi List. If I am out of line here I sincerely apologize to any and all I may offend. Can some one explain why such a HUGE difference in auction price! I'm confused here. Check out both auctions and compare. Maybe there is something I'm missing here except my wallet! Sincerely Don Merchant http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItemih=011item=320021921340rd=1sspagename=STRK%3AMEWA%3AITrd=1 http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItemih=011item=320032119384rd=1sspagename=STRK%3AMEWA%3AITrd=1 __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Murchison Price Difference
Hi List. If I am out of line here I sincerely apologize to any and all I may offend. Can some one explain why such a HUGE difference in auction price! I'm confused here. Check out both auctions and compare. Maybe there is something I'm missing here except my wallet! Sincerely Don Merchant There is nothing to say. Its just eBay ! One day u lose on auctions and the next day You have 300% profit. -[ MARCIN CIMALA ]-[ I.M.C.A.#3667 ]- http://www.Meteoryt.net [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.PolandMET.com [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.Gao-Guenie.com GSM +48(607)535 195 [ Member of Polish Meteoritical Society ] __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Murchison Price Difference
Don, A trip to Times Square in New York City ... There's some character and a crowd oo-ing around him while three upside-down coconut shells he melodically shuffles. One of them has a pop cap under it. You watch. It's the one on the right. Some apparently innocent bystander steps up to gleefully shout That One! pointing to your same coconut shell. The dealer lifts it up ... and there's the pop top. The bystander snatches a twenty dollar greenback from the dealer and both sport Garfield rodent eaten grins. So you decide to match wits with such a meteoric dealer. The crowd opens up and steps aside... and there you are, through the gauntlet. Abracadabra! Whi You gasp for your hypnotic moment, and you can't even grapple for a grumbled guess. That One! you meekly offer, as your heart thrashes in your chest. Oh! For some enlightenment as your time expressedly expired. Before you finish aspirating your ...One, the $20 is slipped from your hand and you're done. You didn't even feel Jackson's crispy creases tickle your tingling fingers. Back to penny stocks and microchip meteorites; even though that, 'tis always that man in that yellow hat:-( Best wishes, Doug - Original Message - From: Don Merchant [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, October 04, 2006 5:18 PM Subject: [meteorite-list] Murchison Price Difference Hi List. If I am out of line here I sincerely apologize to any and all I may offend. Can some one explain why such a HUGE difference in auction price! I'm confused here. Check out both auctions and compare. Maybe there is something I'm missing here except my wallet! Sincerely Don Merchant http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItemih=011item=320021921340rd=1; sspagename=STRK%3AMEWA%3AITrd=1 http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItemih=011item=320032119384rd=1; sspagename=STRK%3AMEWA%3AITrd=1 __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
AW: [meteorite-list] Murchison Price Difference
Hi Don, although the difference is astounding and the seller decided to hide his feedback and to make anonymous the bid history - (I ask myself, why any seller is doing that in a branch, where a dealer essentially lives from his/her reputation??), I can assure you that it was no shill bidding, as I know the seller in person. He had also enormous defeats to bear on ebay before... Most ebay-meteorite-sellers will be able to explain, how such differences between prices for the very same stuff happen, but they won't do, because it would mean to judge the abilities of their clients on ebay Buckleboo! Martin -Ursprüngliche Nachricht- Von: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Im Auftrag von Don Merchant Gesendet: Donnerstag, 5. Oktober 2006 00:18 An: Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Betreff: [meteorite-list] Murchison Price Difference Hi List. If I am out of line here I sincerely apologize to any and all I may offend. Can some one explain why such a HUGE difference in auction price! I'm confused here. Check out both auctions and compare. Maybe there is something I'm missing here except my wallet! Sincerely Don Merchant http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItemih=011item=320021921340rd=1; sspagename=STRK%3AMEWA%3AITrd=1 http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItemih=011item=320032119384rd=1; sspagename=STRK%3AMEWA%3AITrd=1 __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
