Re: [uf-discuss] Microformat for forms to post comments?

2006-02-23 Thread Ben Ward
On 2/23/06, Julien Couvreur [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi, Hi Julien! Most bloggers have the problem of following up on the comments they leave on other people's website. One of the challenges to solving this comment tracking problem is that comment forms come in many shapes. Would this be a

[uf-discuss] Microformats to interlink desparate services

2006-02-23 Thread Ben Ward
Hi all, I'd like to float an idea that I believe Microformats could play a large part in. A few weeks ago, I wrote a rather rough article on my blog [1] about a way for people to host personal 'profile' information as part of their own blog/webspace/etc. Any service or web application could

Re: [uf-discuss] Chat microformat/podcast transcript

2006-04-14 Thread Ben Ward
On 4/14/06, Chris Messina [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: At least with DT and DD there's a clear correlation for the speaker with her/his words: Chris, the one big problem I understand with DL for dialogue is that it does not describe order. Or at least, that's the interpretation/specification

Re: [uf-discuss] Chat microformat/podcast transcript

2006-04-19 Thread Ben Ward
On 4/19/06, Paul Bryson [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: One thing though, I use at least one chat program that has an option to condense all contiguous messages from a single author together so that it just displays the author once, but the timestamp of each message. A couple of responses come to

Re: validating microformats (was Re: [uf-discuss] Google Gdata new syndication protocol!)

2006-04-21 Thread Ben Ward
That's excellent Mark. I have a small additional suggestion for 'validator' feedback, that concerning common errors in naming conventions: Such as the use of a 'middle-name' classname when 'additional-names' was intended. Also 'locality', 'region', 'postal-code', 'country-name' can be misentered

[uf-discuss] RDFa

2006-05-19 Thread Ben Ward
A W3C Working Draft published on May 16th: http://www.w3.org/TR/2006/WD-xhtml-rdfa-primer-20060516/ For Embedding RDF in XHTML. Gives iCal and vCard examples. In practice, there's a bit mark-up involved than with µF (namespace declarations for a start) but seems to acheive much the same

Re: [uf-discuss] Addressing bits of information

2006-05-25 Thread Ben Ward
Tantek Çelik wrote: But discussions of extending URL/URI semantics for addressing bits of information? I'm not sure that actually has much bearing on parsing microformats. But like I said, perhaps I am missing something. I don't know if my interpretation brings this on topic or just

Re: [uf-discuss] RDFa and microformats

2006-05-30 Thread Ben Ward
Hi Evan, RDFa was discussed a week or so ago on this list, and dismissed as off-topic for this list for a number of very clear reason. You can find the discussion in the uf-discuss archives here: http:// microformats.org/discuss/mail/microformats-discuss/2006-May/004142.html The posts you

Re: [uf-discuss] Currency microformat

2006-07-20 Thread Ben Ward
On 20 Jul 2006, at 07:27, Ben Buchanan wrote: So... I think div class=currency USD$50/div would work as a shorthand. It defines a) we're talking about money - ISO standard implied, b) we're talking about the USD variety, c) we're talking fifty units of that money, d) a parser could work out

Re: [uf-discuss] origin of class attribute approach in microformats ?

2006-07-22 Thread Ben Ward
On 22 Jul 2006, at 03:15, Tantek Çelik wrote: should these all be in the FAQ? I think we should definitely have this covered on the Wiki; it seems in the same spirit as dispelling the /. misconceptions last week. Definitely worth getting this documented definitively, 'cause it seems to

Re: [uf-discuss] Media Metadata, Specifically Video Thumbnails

2006-08-16 Thread Ben Ward
On 16 Aug 2006, at 22:46, Steve Williams wrote: I don't want to do something that might influence a bunch of sites if it would hurt the Microformats effort. I wouldn't be too worried about that. The Microformats process (http://microformats.org/wiki/process) says that µf are built

Re: [uf-discuss] Media Metadata, Specifically Video Thumbnails

2006-08-16 Thread Ben Ward
On 16 Aug 2006, at 23:23, Steve Williams wrote: I'd think you'd need something more like link rel=thumbnail ... I thought of that, and I like it a lot. Is that a common pattern in new microformat proposals? @rel gets a lot of use where appropriate. The only thing here is that you must

Re: [uf-discuss] does hatom for comments make sense?

2006-09-11 Thread Ben Ward
On 11 Sep 2006, at 23:17, Stephanie Booth (bunny) wrote: Does this way of using hatom on comments make sense to you? It does to me, yes. Although not using two separate hAtom feeds. I'd just have one with the original post as the first entry in the feed and comments following on

Re: [uf-discuss] a very early draft proposal hTagcloud

2006-09-20 Thread Ben Ward
On 20 Sep 2006, at 02:23, Chris Messina wrote: I think what you need to define are ways to express relativety -- and that strong, em, big and small can help in indicating those relationships with styles turned off. So for example, the very smallest size might always have em surrounding the small

Re: [uf-discuss] a very early draft proposal hTagcloud

2006-09-20 Thread Ben Ward
On 20 Sep 2006, at 10:45, Matthew Levine wrote: However, I'm not whether I like exploiting nesting order. It feels a bit hackish, and isn't as semantically unambiguous as Ben's initial example. Yeah, I considered EM STRONG and STRONG EM as well but as you say, it's very hackish and in

Re: [uf-discuss] Use of abbr (also object) and Accessibility

2006-09-21 Thread Ben Ward
On 21 Sep 2006, at 20:05, Andy Mabbett wrote: There're some interesting views about the use of Abbr by microformats, on the Accessify forum: ttp://www.accessifyforum.com/viewtopic.php?t=6167 also an interesting take on the non-use of object. I'm a little confused reading through

Re: [uf-discuss] basic include pattern question

2006-09-22 Thread Ben Ward
On 22 Sep 2006, at 02:26, Michael McCracken wrote: Should I just repeat the info that I want displayed? Yes. The include pattern (both the OBJECT and rel-include variants) allows you to point a microformat to some other piece of data published already in the page, for the purpose of *not*

Re: [uf-discuss] Microformat's Logos

2006-09-26 Thread Ben Ward
On 26 Sep 2006, at 01:13, Stephen Paul Weber wrote: Hello, I was wondering if there had every been any serious thought to giving individual microformats logos (for widgets and buttons and such, etc). I'm not sure whether it counts as serious thought, but the issue of icons for hCard and

Re: [uf-discuss] hidden microformats

2006-09-28 Thread Ben Ward
On 28 Sep 2006, at 01:15, Paolo Negri wrote: On some pages I have all the infos about these items and I can produce very complete uformats. On other pages I render let's say just the name and the email of someone and it doesn't make sense to provide a less complete hcard than in a different

[uf-discuss] Microformats in Form Fields

2006-09-28 Thread Ben Ward
Hello list, just a quick point for discussion: Lets say you have a personal registration form in your web app, for entering contact data which will later be output as an hCard in various places. What if I was to mark up the form (and fields) with hCard classes? Good idea? Bad idea? I

Re: [uf-discuss] Microformats in Form Fields

2006-09-28 Thread Ben Ward
Frances Berriman wrote: Did you see Drews demo of that with openID? It didn't require the forms to use the microformat class names or anything. Yeah, I've seen Drew's excellent auto-fill demo and had a couple of conversations with him about combining that with OpenID. This isn't so much

Re: [uf-discuss] Microformats in Form Fields

2006-09-29 Thread Ben Ward
On 28 Sep 2006, at 13:33, Stephen Paul Weber wrote: What about using the same markup as the appropriate uF, but a different root class name (such as 'form')? That's a possibility I guess, but thinking for a moment in the context of the DOM, with the form fields filled in (and an

Re: [uf-discuss] Microformats in Form Fields

2006-10-05 Thread Ben Ward
On 4 Oct 2006, at 19:37, Scott Reynen wrote: What is the benefit of using the same root class name for forms accepting a microformat as we use for the published microformat? The first that comes to mind: If the form is pre-filled then you have a valid vcard that could be parsed (with the

[uf-discuss] Advanced include pattern usage

2006-10-23 Thread Ben Ward
Good morning List, I have a quick question about include pattern usage and visible data. A while ago I was playing around with drafting something for the hChatLog effort (I haven't got anywhere yet, really) but will use it as an example, since I think the use of include-pattern is nicely

Re: [uf-discuss] Advanced include pattern usage

2006-10-23 Thread Ben Ward
On 23 Oct 2006, at 13:36, Brian Suda wrote: I'm not sure exactly what you mean by should it be documented, maybe we are talking about two different things? There is a section about using the 'a' element. http://microformats.org/wiki/include-pattern#hyperlink_include_example If it is unclear and

Re: [uf-discuss] Advanced include pattern usage

2006-10-24 Thread Ben Ward
On 24 Oct 2006, at 11:13, Colin Barrett wrote: snip Your example looks quite nice! As someone chiefly interested in hChat, I'd like it if you could put your work on the wiki. It hasn't been updated in a about a month. -Colin Colin, I intend to. I've had a file named ‘hLog Draft’ sitting

Re: [uf-discuss] Visible Data...a Microformat requirement?

2006-10-26 Thread Ben Ward
On 26 Oct 2006, at 18:35, Colin Barrett wrote: On Oct 26, 2006, at 7:25 AM, Andy Mabbett wrote: In message [EMAIL PROTECTED], Ciaran McNulty [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes @rel=bookmark I've seen several people refer to such things with an opening @ - what does it mean? I'm not sure on the

Re: [uf-discuss] Visible Data...a Microformat requirement?

2006-10-26 Thread Ben Ward
On 27 Oct 2006, at 00:58, Colin Barrett wrote: @ represents an attribute, so @rel=tag means @rel tag with the value ‘tag’. The most advanced I've seen it get in general discussion is of the form [EMAIL PROTECTED], which means ‘element named foo with an attribute bar with value ‘sheep’.

Re: [uf-discuss] Apple adds support for hcard in dotmac webmail

2006-10-29 Thread Ben Ward
On 29 Oct 2006, at 21:45, Chris Messina wrote: if only URLs could be turned into IDs: Not sure what your intention would be Chris, but there's a fairly well established practice of converting 'http://microformats.org/ something.html to the form 'microformats-org-something-html' for page-

Re: [uf-discuss] Internet Explorer 8.0 will support microformats

2006-10-30 Thread Ben Ward
On 30 Oct 2006, at 13:48, Mike Schinkel wrote: I've got a question about this. To say IE8 will support Microsformats doesn't make sense to me, unless they means it will support the Microformats agreed to at the point IE8 is made feature complete. But what about those that come after?

Re: [uf-discuss] vote-for

2006-11-06 Thread Ben Ward
On 6 Nov 2006, at 21:25, Siegfried Gipp wrote: Indeed, this i do not understand.Why should a definition of rel=vote-for have any negative effect (or any effect at all) on the definition of rev=vote-for? These are two different attributes. It's because the microformat does not define the

Re: [uf-discuss] Microformats support in Flickr

2006-11-07 Thread Ben Ward
On 7 Nov 2006, at 13:25, Goix Laurent Walter wrote: I have tried to put some hCard in the description field of some picture to include the name of the people in the pic, as well as the address where the picture was taken, but each time the HTML was somehow modified by Flickr at the time of

Re: [uf-discuss] vote-for

2006-11-07 Thread Ben Ward
On 7 Nov 2006, at 17:03, Ciaran McNulty wrote: that makes rel=vote-for mean This url is a vote for the current page. Correct. However, this isn't mentioned in the spec or anywhere because it has an issue with authority. I could say 'That page over there is a vote for me'. That isn't

Re: [uf-discuss] class=url?

2006-11-07 Thread Ben Ward
On 7 Nov 2006, at 17:39, Tantek Çelik wrote: So if to apply the class=url to one of them, this means selecting that very special url to be the url for the VCARD URL Applying class=url means selecting that very special URL to be *a* URL for the hCard. Please re-read what I wrote above.

Re: [uf-discuss] hCard - Telephone types (cell, office etc)

2006-11-14 Thread Ben Ward
On 14 Nov 2006, at 15:48, Ian Lloyd wrote: I've had issues where by placing the span class=typeWork/span in the HTML, it imports that information into the hCard itself, so that in iCal on Mac it shows as : Cell: Mobile +44 (0) 7710 623044 I may also be suffering from end-of-day fatigue,

Re: [uf-discuss] Contextual link information using microformats

2006-11-17 Thread Ben Ward
On 17 Nov 2006, at 18:45, Andy Mabbett wrote: hreflang=en type=application/pdf I wonder how widely used those two are, in real life? I'd suggest that hreflang is close to minimal, not least because there's an assumed (though probably not specified) implication that link targets are going

Re: [uf-discuss] Comments from IBM/Lotus rep about Microformats

2006-12-05 Thread Ben Ward
On 5 Dec 2006, at 11:30, Mike Schinkel wrote: For those on this list who are not following [whatwg], here is an interesting thread about inability to use Microformats: http://listserver.dreamhost.com/pipermail/whatwg-whatwg.org/2006- December/00 8462.html I wonder if his issues can be

Re: Microformats *do* seek to change behaviour (was: XFN usage stats and Re: [uf-discuss] rel=muse implies romantic relationship?)

2006-12-13 Thread Ben Ward
On 13 Dec 2006, at 11:53, Ciaran McNulty wrote: so my pages don't validate correctly if I add address Actually, it's more severe than just not validating. Nesting block level elements within ADDRESS triggers error-handling in browsers, such that the DOM does not reflect your mark-up.

Re: professional relations (was: XFN usage stats and Re: [uf-discuss] rel=muse implies romantic relationship?)

2006-12-13 Thread Ben Ward
On 13 Dec 2006, at 18:29, Andy Mabbett wrote: I thought rev was in the process of being deprecated? I do hope not; I'm quite a fan of the little blighter. Do you have a URL for that? ___ microformats-discuss mailing list

Re: [uf-discuss] A microformat for relationship availability and preference?

2006-12-21 Thread Ben Ward
On 21 Dec 2006, at 10:10, Ciaran McNulty wrote: Inherent in the Microformats movement is the desire to make information easier to publish and aggregate, but people need to consider carefully what parts they want to make available about themselves and their relationships to others. In my day

Re: [uf-discuss] SPAN, DIV and Rich Examples

2006-12-22 Thread Ben Ward
On 22 Dec 2006, at 17:08, Andy Mabbett wrote: That sounds like a good idea; but I wonder if we should not break it down further, and have each example on a separate page, not on the wiki, but elsewhere, so they can be viewed using any of the available parsers. Not sure. I'd see the purpose

Re: [uf-discuss] Useful to have multiple links that provide the same tag?

2006-12-24 Thread Ben Ward
On 24 Dec 2006, at 14:04, Costello, Roger L. wrote: a href=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/juicer; rel=tagWikipedia entry for juicer/a a href=http://www.technorati.com/tag/juicer; rel=tagOther web pages with a juicer tag/a a href=http://www.xfront.com/juicer; rel=tagCostello's pithy web page on

[uf-discuss] Tagging Tag-spaces

2006-12-24 Thread Ben Ward
On my blog, all tagged entries link to my own local tag-space (e.g. / journal/tags/nutcracker). What if, on the page for each tags, I were to include: a href=http://technorati.com/tags/nutcracker; rel=tag…/a a href=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/nutcracker; rel=tag…/a So my tag space is now

Re: [uf-discuss] rel=pavatar

2006-12-30 Thread Ben Ward
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Is there no interrest in such a microformat like rel=pavatar? /Jeena Without getting into the technicalities of ‘what makes a microformat’ at this stage, I think another reason for lack of interest is that really, the hCard microformat can already provide the

[uf-discuss] What is ‘post-office-box’?

2007-01-14 Thread Ben Ward
Just a quick one. VCard defines ‘post office box’ as part of ADR. The spec [1] says that it comes before ‘extended address’ in sequence, but then fails to provide an example for it. As such hcard-examples also doesn't provide an example. What's the expected content in this field? Is it

Re: [uf-discuss] Microformat to describe a broadcast

2007-01-15 Thread Ben Ward
On 15 Jan 2007, at 09:41, Michael Smethurst wrote: I was thinking of something like li class=vevent vbroadcast [as per hCalendar] /li Of course we wouldn't do this without your input; if you disagree we'll stick to hCalendar only What you're trying to do, it seems, is to categorise

Re: [uf-discuss] Microformat to describe a broadcast

2007-01-15 Thread Ben Ward
On 15 Jan 2007, at 13:29, Michael Smethurst wrote: Anyone for hyperlinking to http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Broadcasting ? That would be absolutely fine. Or any other tag space (Technorati et al). My BBC domain suggestion was based on the thinking that linking externally mightn't be

Re: [uf-discuss] Vote Links: rel=voted-for

2007-01-18 Thread Ben Ward
On 18 Jan 2007, at 15:49, Frances Berriman wrote: Could Sites of the Month not just use rev=vote-for? As in - this site voted for me. Wrong way around Frances, I think. • rev=vote-for — ‘this site is a vote for the href’ • rel=vote-for — ‘href is a vote for this site’ Your concept is

Re: [uf-discuss] Vote Links: rel=voted-for

2007-01-19 Thread Ben Ward
On 18 Jan 2007, at 21:23, Ara Pehlivanian wrote: I don't agree that you can simply use rel=vote-for because it incorrectly gives the impression that you're voting for when really you were voted for, It doesn't give the impression that you're ‘voting for’ though — the use of rev or rel

Re: [uf-discuss] This Week in Microformats

2007-01-29 Thread Ben Ward
Hi Andy, On 28 Jan 2007, at 12:27, Andy Mabbett wrote: The last This Week in Microformats was dated 17 December 2006 (over a month ago). Yes it was. I'm somewhat embarrassed by the loss of regularity. Will there be another? Is some assistance in compiling it needed? There definitely

Re: [uf-discuss] WikiProject Microformats

2007-01-29 Thread Ben Ward
On 29 Jan 2007, at 13:45, Costello, Roger L. wrote: How is a microformat added to a wiki page's markup? The MediaWiki software allows you to directly type in HTML as well as using the Wiki shorthand language. It also has a reusable templating system, allowing you to enter data into more

Re: [uf-discuss] Authoritative hCards [was RE: Canonical hCards (was: Search on CSS element)]

2007-01-29 Thread Ben Ward
On 24 Jan 2007, at 14:51, Ara Pehlivanian wrote: Just a shot in the dark here, but couldn't the a class=url ... be assumed to be pointing to the hCard owner's site where it could be further assumed that the authoritative hCard would reside? What's more, if the href in the a class=url...

Vote on this: rel=me self to indicate an authoritative hCard {was: Re: [uf-discuss] Authoritative hCards [was RE: Canonical hCards (was: Search on CSS element)]}

2007-01-30 Thread Ben Ward
Chris Messina: div class=vcard id=vcard addressa href=http://factoryjoe.com/blog/hcard/#hcard; class=fn url rel=me selfChris Messina/a/address div class=orgCitizen Agency/a ... /div John Allsopp: The definition of the self attribute value in Atom is self: the feed itself. The term the

Re: Vote on this: rel=me self to indicate an authoritative hCard {was: Re: [uf-discuss] Authoritative hCards [was RE: Canonical hCards (was: Search on CSS element)]}

2007-01-31 Thread Ben Ward
On 31 Jan 2007, at 12:08, Colin Barrett wrote: Can I get a clearer idea of what exactly is people are +1-ing? I +1 @rel=self me, but am not willing to give my vote yet on using address, as it's not entirely clear if we're talking about mandating it, recommending it, etc. FWIW I'm not

[uf-discuss] Authenticity of Authoritative hCard (was: Re: Vote on this: rel=me self to indicate an authoritative hCard)

2007-01-31 Thread Ben Ward
On 31 Jan 2007, at 14:49, Ara Pehlivanian wrote: Just to stir the pot a little, and maybe it's a good idea to consider authenticity in the whole discussion of authoritative cards. What guarantees that when someone creates an hCard and puts rel=me self that they are giving the correct URL and

Re: [uf-discuss] Authenticity of Authoritative hCard (was: Re: Vote on this: rel=me self to indicate an authoritative hCard)

2007-01-31 Thread Ben Ward
On 31 Jan 2007, at 15:50, Ara Pehlivanian wrote: Yes, but what if someone registers ben-ward.net and puts up a fake card on that site. Then he goes and publishes a partial hCard on myspace and points to ben-ward.net/about with rel=self me. He's effectively hijacked your identity and/or caused

Re: Vote on this: rel=me self to indicate an authoritative hCard {was: Re: [uf-discuss] Authoritative hCards [was RE: Canonical hCards (was: Search on CSS element)]}

2007-01-31 Thread Ben Ward
On 31 Jan 2007, at 16:15, Ryan Cannon wrote: It's definition is A link to yourself at a different URL[1]. Correct. Which is still valid in the rel=me self case. According to the spec, rel=self me is invalid *unless* you do not include the XFN profile on your Web site. Sorry, I've got

Re: [uf-discuss] Authenticity of Authoritative hCard (was: Re: Vote on this: rel=me self to indicate an authoritative hCard)

2007-01-31 Thread Ben Ward
On 31 Jan 2007, at 17:03, Ben Ward wrote: The owner of Ben-Ward.net could have his own personal network of sites too, but they would not be linked to from my own authoritative hCard at ben-ward.co.uk/about. Nothing stops him add rel=me to his hcard pointing to my site, but that takes us

Re: Vote on this: rel=me self to indicate an authoritative hCard {was: Re: [uf-discuss] Authoritative hCards [was RE: Canonical hCards (was: Search on CSS element)]}

2007-01-31 Thread Ben Ward
On 31 Jan 2007, at 17:24, Ara Pehlivanian wrote: Ben, Don't you think he has a point though? If you think of it, rel=me could suffice in that it refers to yourself at another URL (in line with the idea of an authoritative hCard) and once you get there and read that hCard and discover that it

Re: [uf-discuss] Microformats, WebApps 1.0 and UI widgets in browsers

2007-02-01 Thread Ben Ward
Hi Karl On 1 Feb 2007, at 15:09, Karl Dubost wrote: hCalendar: description, summary, category, location, status, last-modified hCard: adr, street-address, email, geo, etc. and plenty others. You seem to have missed the bit where I was saying that any mechanisms for switching being a

Re: [uf-discuss] mime types and microformats

2007-02-01 Thread Ben Ward
On 1 Feb 2007, at 15:37, Rob O'Rourke wrote: If (x)HTML documents when served as text/html are treated as HTML how are the microformats still working? Does this mean microformats will work under an HTML 4.01 doctype? Microformats are generally parsed absolutely fine in both XHTML and

Re: [uf-discuss] hMood/hPresence?

2007-02-01 Thread Ben Ward
Hi Sam, On 31 Jan 2007, at 17:26, Sam Sethi wrote: Just wondering does presence and mood really apply to a microformat? What I want is federated presence across applications and devices. Personally I hope XMPP becomes the interoperable standard for presence and then we an build apps on

Re: [uf-discuss] adr should be address

2007-02-25 Thread Ben Ward
On 25 Feb 2007, at 23:19, Thom Shannon wrote: Brian Suda made a point at barcamp about the documentation using only divs and spans, so people don't get confused and think that the element types matter. Obviously people should use the most suitable elements in the context they're using

[uf-discuss] [hListing][hReview] 'Description' conflict

2007-04-24 Thread Ben Ward
I was recently trying to implement mark-up with both hListing (draft) and hReview combined. For the most part the properties align except in the case of 'DESCRIPTION'. hListing: According to the schema, description is REQUIRED, makes no assertion about detail or completeness of content marked

[uf-discuss] Regarding POSH and misuse of the microformats logo

2007-05-03 Thread Ben Ward
Hi all, I've obviously been following the recent push to have POSH adopted as a buzzword to discourage people from mis-using the term ‘microformat’ in their semantic endeavours. Now the whole point of this is to differentiate semantic HTML from microformats, discourage the further

Re: [uf-discuss] Regarding POSH and misuse of the microformats logo

2007-05-04 Thread Ben Ward
Right, I've set up a vote for this on the Wiki. As explained in my Wiki commit comment, with the POSH page being something of a reference rather than a page of active microformat development, I judge it to be inappropriate to tack the vote on to the article itself and have created a

Re: [uf-discuss] Yahoo introduces no-search microformat like function

2007-05-04 Thread Ben Ward
On 4 May 2007, at 22:19, Ted Drake wrote: What’s the traction for something like this and “no-follow” to get integrated into the microformat platform? Well, robots-nocontent is not part of the the robots-exclusion draft, which in itself has not been updated for over 18 months. I contacted

Re: [uf-discuss] uF Tools for Internet Explorer?

2007-05-08 Thread Ben Ward
On 9 May 2007, at 00:22, Charles Iliya Krempeaux wrote: The rumor is that IE8 will have native support for Microformats. Please correct me if I'm wrong, but I'm not sure those rumours have ever been supported by anything out of Microsoft. There's a lot of circumstantial reasoning

Re: [uf-discuss] microformats for normal people, like my mum

2007-06-28 Thread Ben Ward
On 27 Jun 2007, at 23:09, Thom Shannon wrote: I know this topic comes up a lot and we'd all like to see Microformats change the lives of millions of ordinary internet users, that's why we're all here! My friend just asked me an interesting question, is Microformats the right name for it?

Re: [uf-discuss] Date of Death in hCard

2007-06-28 Thread Ben Ward
On 27 Jun 2007, at 20:33, Andy Mabbett wrote: There having been no comments, much less objections, I intend to proceed with this, using died as the property name, in five days from the time of posting. I have no objections to this. It's a useful extension to hCard as a ‘profile’ format;

Re: [uf-discuss] Re: Generating valid unique IDs for hAtom

2007-06-28 Thread Ben Ward
On 22 Jun 2007, at 07:07, Toby A Inkster wrote: What's wrong with using Permalinks as an id? If you need to make several entries onto the hAtom feed referencing the same URL, then you can just add #ref-20070722, #ref-20070723 and so on to the end of the URL to make it unique. The best

Re: [uf-discuss] microformats for normal people, like my mum

2007-06-28 Thread Ben Ward
On 28 Jun 2007, at 14:40, Thom Shannon wrote: I get your point, but as Alex pointed out people are interested in this microformats thing but dont want to call it that, journos are refusing to talk about it because the term 'microformats' would only appeal to developers, and not the average

Re: [uf-discuss] microformats for normal people, like my mum

2007-06-28 Thread Ben Ward
On 28 Jun 2007, at 15:59, Thom Shannon wrote: yes, it's a thing, it's different. FF3 can't just add any address you see to your address book, its a specific kind of address that just looks the same, and you need a browser or plugin or something that understands that specific thing So

Re: [uf-discuss] hCard multiple locations

2007-08-27 Thread Ben Ward
On 27 Aug 2007, at 14:54, Jason Karns wrote: Although not relevant to the discussion, I believe I will continue to mark up each physical address with its own GEO and let the parsers extract what they will. Unless, of course, a more appealing solution or convincing argument is proposed. This

Re: [uf-discuss] Re: Need for plain-language intros for each microformat

2007-09-05 Thread Ben Ward
On 5 Sep 2007, at 20:18, Toby A Inkster wrote: Syntactically the URI would still work, however, semantically it would have been broken, that is, it is bad to not only change URIs so that they 404 and just plain don't work, but it is also bad to change the *meaning* of that URI. As long

Re: [uf-discuss] Correct way to use the key property of hCard

2007-09-17 Thread Ben Ward
I don't know the answer to this particular problem, but: On 17 Sep 2007, at 22:23, Scott Reynen wrote: abbr class=type title=PGPpublic key/abbr ‘PGP’ is not an abbreviation of ‘public key’. Assuming the rest of the example is correct, you'd need to do something like: span class=key

[uf-discuss] [hListing] Listing

2007-09-27 Thread Ben Ward
Hi, On the subject of reviving µf development, I've been doing a lot of implementation work with the hListing draft and over the next few weeks will be hoping to document what we've been able to do with it. In the follow up to that I'd like to see about moving the draft along, tightening

Re: [uf-discuss] hreview using include pattern

2007-10-09 Thread Ben Ward
On 9 Oct 2007, at 00:57, Brian Miller wrote: In looking at the hreview examples (apple, readandtravel) who have a similar structure, they usually repeat the item information in each review and use css to hide it. This seems messy from a semantic and accessibility point of view. Most

[uf-discuss] OBJECT include pattern and excess HTTP requests

2007-10-09 Thread Ben Ward
Hey hey, Quick question for people publishing hReview. Long ago when the OBJECT-include pattern was first raised, there was a bug in Safari that made it unworkable. That bug got fixed. However, there appears to be a separate, very serious browser issue whereby browsers are making

Re: [uf-discuss] hreview using include pattern

2007-10-09 Thread Ben Ward
On 9 Oct 2007, at 18:39, Brian Miller wrote: Great, so I can use the object. So back to the original question: Can the item information be separate from the first review and just included in the first review using object? If yes, then does that item information need to be wrapped in

[uf-discuss] Cross-Page Includes (was: OBJECT include pattern and excess HTTP requests)

2007-10-10 Thread Ben Ward
In the interests of tidy administration, I'm splitting this thread. The originally raised and the proposal for including remote content within microformats are very different issues and it's important that the original thread stay on track. Thanks. On 10 Oct 2007, at 02:59, Michael MD

Re: [uf-discuss] How to handle empty lists ?

2007-10-30 Thread Ben Ward
On 30 Oct 2007, at 17:09, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I'm new to microformats. Welcome! I'm trying to use microformat style xhtml to represent some data. OK. Howeber, what you're using is really semantic HTML, it's precisely what the class attribute was designed for. Call it a pattern

Re: [uf-discuss] How to handle empty lists ?

2007-10-30 Thread Ben Ward
On 30 Oct 2007, at 18:03, Phillip Hofmeyr wrote: Is this the XOXO format? Can anyone send me some urls for sites that use XOXO? We've marked up the new category trees and sitemaps on Kelkoo using XOXO: • http://www.kelkoo.co.uk/sm_site-map.html Ben

[uf-discuss] OBJECT Pattern Page Updated

2007-11-06 Thread Ben Ward
Hi everyone, Following on somewhat from the messages last month regarding the OBJECT pattern I've updated the Wiki page (http://microformats.org/ wiki/include-pattern) quite substantially. The old page was a mess, especially with the later addition of the hyperlink include pattern. I've

[uf-discuss] OBJECT Pattern Page Updated

2007-11-06 Thread Ben Ward
Hi everyone, Following on somewhat from the messages last month regarding the OBJECT pattern I've updated the Wiki page (http://microformats.org/ wiki/include-pattern) quite substantially. The old page was a mess, especially with the later addition of the hyperlink include pattern. I've

Re: [uf-discuss] using microschema

2007-11-25 Thread Ben Ward
On 25 Nov 2007, at 11:34, Philip Tellis wrote: On 25/11/2007, Tatsuya Noyori [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I changed link to a. Is this correct? AFAIK, a tags need some text inside. Well, to be valid an Anchor needs to be explicitly closed, since self- closing cannot be used in HTML. Inner

Re: [uf-discuss] using microschema

2007-11-26 Thread Ben Ward
On 26 Nov 2007, at 13:07, Tatsuya Noyori wrote: Is this correct? a style=visibility:hidden rel=microschema href=http://microformats.org/2007/hcard.rng;hcard microschema/a That would be valid, but of course you now have unwelcome content added to the page. I urge you to step back, take in

[uf-discuss] ‘XHTML’ references to ‘HTML ’

2007-11-26 Thread Ben Ward
Since microformats are published in both HTML and XHTML, I think we need to tidy up our references on the Wiki. Again this week we've had an — admittedly premature — suggestion of new syntax which is XHTML only (a /). That proposal has a few problems as have been discussed, but I think we

Re: [uf-discuss] ‘XHTML’ references to ‘H TML’

2007-11-26 Thread Ben Ward
On 26 Nov 2007, at 15:55, Ciaran McNulty wrote: Is (X)HTML too unwieldy to be the global replacement? I feel that ‘(X)HTML’ or ‘X/HTML’ in every instance would read clumsily and uglify the text. It would be irritating to read an entire document where every instance of a familiar and

Re: [uf-discuss] ‘XHTML’ references to ‘H TML’

2007-11-26 Thread Ben Ward
On 26 Nov 2007, at 16:02, Brian Suda wrote: 2007/11/26, Ben Ward [EMAIL PROTECTED]: This is about making clear that microformats are an HTML technology, not an exclusively XHTML technology. 'HTML' implies compatibility with XHTML, 'XHTML' does not imply compatibility with HTML. --- i'm

Re: [uf-discuss] Re: ‘XHTML’ references to ‘HTML’

2007-11-26 Thread Ben Ward
On 26 Nov 2007, at 19:49, Paul Wilkins wrote: On Nov 27, 2007 8:28 AM, Edward O'Connor [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Ben Ward wrote: I'd like us to update the wiki to make all references to 'XHTML' and 'X/HTML' or '(X)HTML' into clear 'HTML'[...] Does this seem worthwhile? I'm all for it. I'd

Re: [uf-discuss] Re: ‘XHTML’ references to ‘HTML’

2007-11-26 Thread Ben Ward
On 26 Nov 2007, at 21:21, André Luís wrote: Here's an idea... since that would involve altering every page with xhtml in them anyway, why not go one step further and in the first reference to XHTML change it to HTML or XHTML with a link to an explanatory page? Stating that ufs work on both

Re: [uf-discuss] Re: ‘XHTML’ references to ‘HTML’

2007-11-27 Thread Ben Ward
Right, I'll put this on my to-do list. I don't know how much work it's going to be yet, but let's say I'll plan to start updating pages on Friday. That's the rest of the week for anyone else to object to the change. The change I propose is: • Update the first mention of ‘HTML’ or

Re: [uf-discuss] hCalendar, geo Operator extension

2007-12-03 Thread Ben Ward
No immediate theories on your parsing problem I'm afraid, although I would flag this as an issue: On 3 Dec 2007, at 16:34, Premasagar Rose wrote: abbr class=geo point-20 title=+22.31119; +89.86145 Rayenda, Bangladesh /abbr

Re: [uf-discuss] hCalendar, geo Operator extension

2007-12-03 Thread Ben Ward
On 3 Dec 2007, at 18:58, Scott Reynen wrote: On Dec 3, 2007, at 11:18 AM, Ben Ward wrote: abbr class=geo point-20 title=+22.31119; +89.86145 Rayenda, Bangladesh /abbr There's no way that ‘+22.31119;+89.86145’ is an abbreviation

[uf-discuss] Avoiding Premature Optimisation in ‘The Process’

2007-12-04 Thread Ben Ward
As some of my recent messages will clearly suggest, I'm concerned that we are becoming too quick during development of new formats to leap on some of the optimisation patterns established for other formats (abbr-pattern, include-pattern). We're starting to see situations — such as

Re: [uf-discuss] Re: ‘XHTML’ references to ‘HTML’

2007-12-09 Thread Ben Ward
are appreciated. Regards, Ben On 27 Nov 2007, at 10:01, Ben Ward wrote: Right, I'll put this on my to-do list. I don't know how much work it's going to be yet, but let's say I'll plan to start updating pages on Friday. That's the rest of the week for anyone else to object to the change

Precise Expansion Patterns (was: Re: [uf-discuss] Hcalendar in bbc.co.uk/programmes)

2007-12-14 Thread Ben Ward
On 14 Dec 2007, at 14:06, Benjamin Hawkes-Lewis wrote: I think all of the following would be misuses of ABBR and TITLE: | Combien d'œufs ai-je vendre? J'ai vendu abbr title=quarante-cinq | 45/abbr aujourd'hui. | Combien d'œufs ai-je vendre? J'ai vendu abbr title=45 | œufs45/abbr aujourd'hui.

Re: [uf-discuss] Re: Precise Expansion Patterns

2007-12-16 Thread Ben Ward
On 16 Dec 2007, at 20:09, Manu Sporny wrote: It is important for us to focus on the reason this discussion started in the first place: http://microformats.org/discuss/mail/microformats-discuss/2007- December/011035.html The issue was accessibility, specifically, how accessible is the ABBR

[uf-discuss] [ADMIN] Split Thread: Precise Expansion Patterns

2007-12-16 Thread Ben Ward
Hi, The current ‘Precise Expansion Patterns’ thread is now spreading into multiple discussions, and also discussions which in fact should not be on the uf-discuss list. Please continue discussion concerning identification of the places where microformats require a precision/expansion

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