Re: [uf-discuss] marking up table rows - carrying id through rows to create multiple unique .ics exports

2007-09-13 Thread Ryan King

On Sep 12, 2007, at 9:43 PM, Matt Warnock wrote:

Hello - I have a question of how to create an id that carries  
through several cell elements and then links to the X2V service to  
create the .ics file.


I am hoping to have multiple events on one page and want to give  
the user one option to download the class they want to attend and  
not all the classes. Do you create and id in the first element,  
then reference this in the headers="" attribute?  I can't seem to  
get it going and populating the ics file correctly. I had it going  
but it would add the location, now it's just shooting blanks.  I  
don't mean to run to this discussion board every time I can't  
figure stuff out, but it's been a long day on this. My cards keep  
coming up empty.


I am giving the first element (cell) of the row time th an id, then  
referencing that id in the following td classes through the headers  
attribute.
I'm using the clues in the Allsopp book of naming the axis  
attribute the same as the th column id, and then stating the scope  
of row but it's getting me confused. I'm using a fragmented URL  
with an escaped %23 for the button to ping the conversion service  
at Suda's X2V address.


If someone could take a peek at the code I would be really  
appreciate it.


Its the first table, the today's upcoming classes table
http://exhale.daisyinteractive.com/locations/santa-monica/


put class='vevent' and id='foo' on the  and it should work fine.

-ryan
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RE: [uf-discuss] marking up table rows - carrying id through rows tocreate multiple unique .ics exports

2007-09-13 Thread j...@eatyourgreens.org.uk
Hello,

This is more an accessibility issue, but I couldn't help noticing that
you've marked up the event times as the row headings for each row. So the
headings for 'santa monica' in the first row are 'location' and '0700 -
0800'. I think it would make more sense, particularly to assistive
technology, if the event names were marked up as the row headings instead.

Cheers
Jim O'Donnell

Original Message:
-
From: Matt Warnock [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Wed, 12 Sep 2007 21:43:39 -0700
To: microformats-discuss@microformats.org
Subject: [uf-discuss] marking up table rows - carrying id through rows
tocreate multiple unique .ics exports


Hello - I have a question of how to create an id that carries through 
several cell elements and then links to the X2V service to create the 
.ics file.

I am hoping to have multiple events on one page and want to give the 
user one option to download the class they want to attend and not all 
the classes. Do you create and id in the first element, then reference 
this in the headers="" attribute?  I can't seem to get it going and 
populating the ics file correctly. I had it going but it would add the 
location, now it's just shooting blanks.  I don't mean to run to this 
discussion board every time I can't figure stuff out, but it's been a 
long day on this. My cards keep coming up empty.

I am giving the first element (cell) of the row time th an id, then 
referencing that id in the following td classes through the headers 
attribute.
I'm using the clues in the Allsopp book of naming the axis attribute 
the same as the th column id, and then stating the scope of row but 
it's getting me confused. I'm using a fragmented URL with an escaped 
%23 for the button to ping the conversion service at Suda's X2V 
address.

If someone could take a peek at the code I would be really appreciate 
it.

Its the first table, the today's upcoming classes table
http://exhale.daisyinteractive.com/locations/santa-monica/

Thanks for any help on this.
...
Matt Warnock

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Re: [uf-discuss] marking up table rows - carrying id through rows to create multiple unique .ics exports

2007-09-13 Thread Scott Reynen

On Sep 12, 2007, at 10:43 PM, Matt Warnock wrote:

I am giving the first element (cell) of the row time th an id, then  
referencing that id in the following td classes through the headers  
attribute.
I'm using the clues in the Allsopp book of naming the axis  
attribute the same as the th column id, and then stating the scope  
of row but it's getting me confused. I'm using a fragmented URL  
with an escaped %23 for the button to ping the conversion service  
at Suda's X2V address.


If someone could take a peek at the code I would be really  
appreciate it.


Its the first table, the today's upcoming classes table
http://exhale.daisyinteractive.com/locations/santa-monica/


I'm not very familiar with table column semantics, but I'm not sure  
they're necessary in this case.  It looks like you could just move  
the class="vevent" to the  and use standard nesting (i.e. put the  
event properties within the event element).  Maybe I'm missing  
something?


Peace,
Scott

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Re: [uf-discuss] Marking up table rows

2007-09-04 Thread Scott Reynen

On Sep 4, 2007, at 12:26 PM, Charles Iliya Krempeaux wrote:




or is that naughty? :-)


I actually do stuff like that all the time... for things like
signatures... it makes it very compact... for example...

-- http://changelog.ca/";>Charles Iliya
Krempeaux

(It makes it so I don't have to add any extra tags... like 's...
and adding hCards is as simple as just adding classes.)

I've heard some people complain because... my impression was... that
they weren't sure how to style it... but, for example, if you wanted
to style the url of an hCard, you could with...


Styling is only one practical problem (IE 6, still the most popular  
browser, doesn't support multi-class selectors).  More importantly,  
I'd say, is the theoretical problem of hierarchy semantics.  HTML  
defines hierarchy by nesting of elements, so that's what microformats  
do.  Putting several classes together in a single element identifies  
the content of that element as belonging to each class, but it  
doesn't tell us anything about the hierarchy of those elements.  With  
the markup above, how do we know if FN is a property of vCard or  
vCard is a property of URL?  As the number of atomic microformats and  
the ways in which they might be nested in each other expands, this  
will move from a theoretical to a practical problem.


We could certainly define our own method of establishing hierarchy,  
e.g. order of classes, but HTML already has a method that generally  
works well.  In the above example, only one extra  is needed to  
clarify that vCard is the container for the other properties.  With  
tables (and lists) HTML's hierarchy method doesn't work as well  
because there are nesting limits imposed (e.g. nothing is allowed  
between  and ), but I think we should more thoroughly  
investigate alternative solutions to this problem (e.g. colgroups),  
before reinventing the wheel on hierarchy semantics.


Peace,
Scott
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RE: [uf-discuss] Marking up table rows

2007-09-04 Thread Nick Fitzsimons
> > 
> >
> > or is that naughty? :-)
> 
> I actually do stuff like that all the time... for things like
> signatures... it makes it very compact... for example...
> 
> -- http://changelog.ca/";>Charles Iliya
> Krempeaux
> 

Strictly speaking it actually isn't correct according to the hCard spec:

"The basic format of hCard is to use vCard object/property names in
lower-case for class names, and to map the nesting of vCard objects directly
into nested XHTML elements"


The explicit statment that nesting is to be achieved by the use of nested
(X)HTML elements makes it clear that assigning the properties at the same
level as the vcard "declaration" (for want of a better word) is not correct.
This is confirmed by such statements in the following subsection as "The
properties of an hCard are represented by *elements inside* the hCard" and
"Some properties have sub-properties, and those are represented by *elements
inside* the elements for properties" (my emphasis).

On the other hand, is it necessarily a bad thing to use a construct such as 



if it doesn't lead to ambiguity? After all, the spec isn't written in stone
(it's written in a Wiki, which is pretty much the opposite of being written
in stone...) so maybe this restriction could be relaxed?

Without giving it the extensive consideration that other, doubtless wiser,
heads have already given it I can't be certain that such constructs might
not lead to ambiguity to the extent of making it difficult if not impossible
for parsers to correctly interpret the structure of an hCard.

But if in fact the mimicking  of the nested structure of the vCard format
need only be represented by a kind of "virtual" nesting within HTML, where
the presence of a property name at the same level as its container is taken
as implying containment, rather than containment depending on an actual
nesting of elements, then perhaps the spec could be relaxed to make it
permissible.

Something to think about down the pub ;-)

Regards,

Nick.
-- 
Nick Fitzsimons
http://www.nickfitz.co.uk/

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Re: [uf-discuss] Marking up table rows

2007-09-04 Thread Ryan King

On Sep 4, 2007, at 8:39 AM, Nick Fitzsimons wrote:

I suspect it's the fact the lon/lat need a @class="geo" wrapper.   
that

would have to go on the TR meaning the vcard gets pushed up a level.




or is that naughty? :-)


It's not naughty, but it just doesn't mean what you hope it means. :)

-ryan
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Re: [uf-discuss] Marking up table rows

2007-09-04 Thread Charles Iliya Krempeaux
Hello Nick,

On 9/4/07, Nick Fitzsimons <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > I suspect it's the fact the lon/lat need a @class="geo" wrapper.  that
> > would have to go on the TR meaning the vcard gets pushed up a level.
>
> 
>
> or is that naughty? :-)

I actually do stuff like that all the time... for things like
signatures... it makes it very compact... for example...

-- http://changelog.ca/";>Charles Iliya
Krempeaux

(It makes it so I don't have to add any extra tags... like 's...
and adding hCards is as simple as just adding classes.)

I've heard some people complain because... my impression was... that
they weren't sure how to style it... but, for example, if you wanted
to style the url of an hCard, you could with...

.vcard a.url, a.vcard.url {
/* style goes here */
}

So I'd say do it that way.  (Others may disagree though.)

See ya

-- 
Charles Iliya Krempeaux, B.Sc. 


 Vlog Razor... Vlogging News
http://vlograzor.com/
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Re: [uf-discuss] Marking up table rows

2007-09-04 Thread Benjamin Hawkes-Lewis

Ciaran McNulty wrote:


The lack of anything to wrap table columns in is quite a frustration.


Current microformat parsers may not be able to grok it, but that's 
precisely what COLGROUP is for:


http://www.w3.org/TR/html4/struct/tables.html#h-11.2.4

Admittedly, you can't change column grouping on a TBODY-by-TBODY basis. 
I wonder if that's worth suggesting for HTML-next.


--
Benjamin Hawkes-Lewis
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Re: [uf-discuss] Marking up table rows

2007-09-04 Thread Ciaran McNulty
On 9/4/07, Nick Fitzsimons <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > I suspect it's the fact the lon/lat need a @class="geo" wrapper.  that
> > would have to go on the TR meaning the vcard gets pushed up a level.
>
> 
>
> or is that naughty? :-)

I believe that vcard child properties have to be on child HTML nodes.

-Ciaran McNulty
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RE: [uf-discuss] Marking up table rows

2007-09-04 Thread Andy Mabbett
On Tue, September 4, 2007 16:16, Montgomery, Mike wrote:
>

>> How would I mark-up the second table row (based on a real-world
>> advocacy example):
>>
>> LongitudeLatitudeHeightFooobar
>> Place
>>
>> 16.3061.07140zzzWidgetsville
>> 
>>
>> with both hCard and geo?
>>
>> The real example has ~50 rows. Is it feasible to wrap each in:
>>
>> ?
>>
>> is there an alternative?
>
> Would it be feasible to add the class="vcard" to the  instead?

Then what would you wrap with "geo"?

> Also, just out of curiosity, why you would mark this information as an
> hcard?

Geo on its own has no label. By using hCard, and applying class="fn org"
to the place-name, the Geo is, in effect, labelled.

-- 
Andy Mabbett
** via webmail **

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RE: [uf-discuss] Marking up table rows

2007-09-04 Thread Nick Fitzsimons
> I suspect it's the fact the lon/lat need a @class="geo" wrapper.  that
> would have to go on the TR meaning the vcard gets pushed up a level.



or is that naughty? :-)

Regards,

Nick.
-- 
Nick Fitzsimons
http://www.nickfitz.co.uk/

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RE: [uf-discuss] Marking up table rows

2007-09-04 Thread Montgomery, Mike
 
> How would I mark-up the second table row (based on a real-world
advocacy
> example):
> 
>
LongitudeLatitudeHeightFooobar
> Place
> 
>
16.3061.07140zzzWidgetsville
 td>
> 
> with both hCard and geo?
> 
> The real example has ~50 rows. Is it feasible to wrap each in:
> 
>?
> 
> is there an alternative?


Would it be feasible to add the class="vcard" to the  instead?

Also, just out of curiosity, why you would mark this information as an
hcard?  I assume that one of the columns would contain a name, email,
phone number, etc. and that would be the reason.  Otherwise, I'm not
sure why you would use class="vcard" instead of just class="geo".  If
there is a reason, I would like to know for my own reference.

Thanks,
Mike

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Re: [uf-discuss] Marking up table rows

2007-09-04 Thread Ciaran McNulty
On 9/4/07, Nick Fitzsimons <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > LongitudeLatitudeHeightFooo
> > barPlace
> > 16.3061.07140zzzWi
> > dgetsville
> >
> > with both hCard and geo?
> Maybe I'm missing something, but what's the problem with
>
> 

I suspect it's the fact the lon/lat need a @class="geo" wrapper.  that
would have to go on the TR meaning the vcard gets pushed up a level.

The lack of anything to wrap table columns in is quite a frustration.

-Ciaran McNulty
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RE: [uf-discuss] Marking up table rows

2007-09-04 Thread Nick Fitzsimons
> How would I mark-up the second table row (based on a 
> real-world advocacy
> example):
> 
> LongitudeLatitudeHeightFooo
> barPlace
> 
> 16.3061.07140zzzWi
> dgetsville
> 
> with both hCard and geo?
> 
> The real example has ~50 rows. Is it feasible to wrap each in:
> 
>?
> 
> is there an alternative?

Maybe I'm missing something, but what's the problem with



?

Regards,

Nick.
-- 
Nick Fitzsimons
http://www.nickfitz.co.uk/

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