Re: network distributed storage with windows?

[A Rossi]

 This has plenty to do with OpenBSD, the central server is OpenBSD and
getting it to play nice with windows has to do with it also.

Henning Brauer wrote:

  this has nothing to do with openbsd. please take it elsewhere.
  
  * Daniel A. Ramaley   [EMAIL PROTECTED]   [2006-02-21 03:42]:

On Thursday 16 February 2006 01:58, A Rossi wrote:

 My client didn't really like the idea of just making a windows
  partition and disallowing the users from accessing it with
  permissions, because then they'd know about something... And some
  might complain about it being broken - they have several older
  people on staff who aren't as computer literate.

It is possible to not only deny permissions to a drive, but also to 
completely hide the drive from the user interface. Hiding drives from 
the interface can be done through group policies (either local policies 
or via Active Directory). Take a look at Microsoft Knowledge Base 
article Q231289: Using Group Policy Objects to hide specified drives 
in My Computer for Windows 2000.

Since Windows administration is quite off-topic, if you need further 
help please e-mail me off list. I haven't hidden drives from users 
before, but i work with someone who administers Windows and does this 
so it would be easy for me to ask more questions on how it is done.


Dan RamaleyDial Center 118, Drake University
Network Programmer/Analyst 2407 Carpenter Ave
+1 515 271-4540Des Moines IA 50311 USA

Re: network distributed storage with windows?

[A Rossi]

 Thank you all and good night!

Chris Zakelj wrote:

  A Rossi wrote:

Hi,
I've been hired by a client to perform a number of network services
for him, most of which are completely unrelated to my topic.
Now, onto my topic:
He asked me if I could partition all of his workstation computers
(running windows XP Professional SP2) with a windows partition, and a
hidden partition which occupies most of the disk, that is accessible
over the network to OpenBSD (actually he asked for FreeBSD, but I will
change his mind...) to back up his server. He doesn't want his
employees to know about it or to be able to interact with this hidden
partition in any way. I told him that it is not possible, because
windows controls the hardware (being the OS on the system) and the
only way it would work was if he had *BSD on the system. But, because
he is paying me, I thought I should give him the benefit of the doubt,
and ask the pros in this area.
So, is it possible for OpenBSD to access a bunch of hidden (I put it
into quotes because it could be any non-windows compatible partition,
because it won't show it then) partitions on networked workgroup
computers and treat them like one big disk for backup?

My apologies for such a long post. I am new to OpenBSD, but I like
what I see.
Thanks,
A Rossi

  I'm certainly no guru, but I can tell you this:  If the OS in control of
  the system does not understand the file system of the partition, then no
  other system will be able to access it in any meaningful way.  That
  said, I think you could create a C partition, and house the user's
  Windows installation and applications on it.  Then create a second D
  partition, and lock the view/use rights for that partition to
  administrator accounts only.  Share that partition with the usual
  Windows file and printer sharing, then access it through SAMBA with
  administrator credentials.

Re: network distributed storage with windows?

[ober]

Once again, openafs would allow you to make every windows box a server 
hosting data in a flat named space setup.


There is now a port in current for setting up a master server.

-Ober

Richard Chesler: [Reading a piece of paper] The first rule of Fight Club is you 
don't talk about Fight Club?
Narrator: [Voice-over] I'm half asleep again; I must've left the original in 
the copy machine.
Richard Chesler: The second rule of Fight Club - is this yours?
Narrator: Huh?
Richard Chesler: Pretend you're me, make a managerial decision: you find this, 
what would you do?

On Thu, 23 Feb 2006, A Rossi wrote:


Date: Thu, 23 Feb 2006 10:53:09 -0800
From: A Rossi [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: misc@openbsd.org
Subject: Re: network distributed storage with windows?

Thank you all and good night!

Chris Zakelj wrote:

 A Rossi wrote:

   Hi,
   I've been hired by a client to perform a number of network services
   for him, most of which are completely unrelated to my topic.
   Now, onto my topic:
   He asked me if I could partition all of his workstation computers
   (running windows XP Professional SP2) with a windows partition, and a
   hidden partition which occupies most of the disk, that is accessible
   over the network to OpenBSD (actually he asked for FreeBSD, but I will
   change his mind...) to back up his server. He doesn't want his
   employees to know about it or to be able to interact with this hidden
   partition in any way. I told him that it is not possible, because
   windows controls the hardware (being the OS on the system) and the
   only way it would work was if he had *BSD on the system. But, because
   he is paying me, I thought I should give him the benefit of the doubt,
   and ask the pros in this area.
   So, is it possible for OpenBSD to access a bunch of hidden (I put it
   into quotes because it could be any non-windows compatible partition,
   because it won't show it then) partitions on networked workgroup
   computers and treat them like one big disk for backup?

   My apologies for such a long post. I am new to OpenBSD, but I like
   what I see.
   Thanks,
   A Rossi

 I'm certainly no guru, but I can tell you this:  If the OS in control of
 the system does not understand the file system of the partition, then no
 other system will be able to access it in any meaningful way.  That
 said, I think you could create a C partition, and house the user's
 Windows installation and applications on it.  Then create a second D
 partition, and lock the view/use rights for that partition to
 administrator accounts only.  Share that partition with the usual
 Windows file and printer sharing, then access it through SAMBA with
 administrator credentials.

Re: network distributed storage with windows?

[Steve Shockley]

A Rossi wrote:

I like this idea.
But one question:
is it possible for the OpenBSD box to access all these hidden 
partitions through SMB as one large storage space possibly with some 
kind of error protection?
This sound like it might be more of a Samba question... But I'll ask 
here anyways.


Sure, you should just be able to browse to \\server\e$ (or equivalent) 
and access the drive.


You may want to experiment with hiding the drives through GP, hidden 
might not fit your definition of can't access.

Re: network distributed storage with windows?

[A Rossi]

 You may want to experiment with hiding the drives through GP,
 hidden might not fit your definition of can't access.
I'd probably hide it and change permissions for no access. I can do 
both, right?



 Sure, you should just be able to browse to \\server\e$ (or
 equivalent) and access the drive.

Unfortunately, that doesn't really answer my question.
Pretty much what I'm going for is a distributed networked RAID 5 (or 1) 
between Windows and *BSD (hopefully OpenBSD) that the windows users 
cannot mess with.
This sounds like some fantastical crazy idea that does not yet exist. 
Someday when I learn to program, I'll write something that does 
explicitly this...


Thanks all!
A Rossi

Steve Shockley wrote:

 A Rossi wrote:
 I like this idea. But one question: is it possible for the OpenBSD
 box to access all these hidden partitions through SMB as one
 large storage space possibly with some kind of error protection?
 This sound like it might be more of a Samba question... But I'll
 ask here anyways.

 Sure, you should just be able to browse to \\server\e$ (or
 equivalent) and access the drive.

 You may want to experiment with hiding the drives through GP,
 hidden might not fit your definition of can't access.

Re: network distributed storage with windows?

[Graham Gower]

On 22/02/06, A Rossi [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
   You may want to experiment with hiding the drives through GP,
   hidden might not fit your definition of can't access.
 I'd probably hide it and change permissions for no access. I can do
 both, right?

   Sure, you should just be able to browse to \\server\e$ (or
   equivalent) and access the drive.
 Unfortunately, that doesn't really answer my question.
 Pretty much what I'm going for is a distributed networked RAID 5 (or 1)
 between Windows and *BSD (hopefully OpenBSD) that the windows users
 cannot mess with.
 This sounds like some fantastical crazy idea that does not yet exist.
 Someday when I learn to program, I'll write something that does
 explicitly this...


http://marc.theaimsgroup.com/?l=openbsd-miscm=105358689405500w=2
s/nfs/samba/

Re: network distributed storage with windows?

[A Rossi]

Very interesting.


 export all via nfs


But is NFS a requirement, or can I make do with windows XP's SMB 
implementation? Remember, the partitions are under windows, I want 
OpenBSD to be the computer that does the backing up onto those.


I will try this one. But it lacks the error-recovery I was hoping for. Alas.

But there should be enough storage that I could have a few computers 
making up one copy, and a few making up another.

Thanks
A Rossi


Graham Gower wrote:

 On 22/02/06, A Rossi [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 You may want to experiment with hiding the drives through GP,
 hidden might not fit your definition of can't access.
 I'd probably hide it and change permissions for no access. I can do
  both, right?

 Sure, you should just be able to browse to \\server\e$ (or
 equivalent) and access the drive.
 Unfortunately, that doesn't really answer my question. Pretty much
 what I'm going for is a distributed networked RAID 5 (or 1) between
 Windows and *BSD (hopefully OpenBSD) that the windows users cannot
 mess with. This sounds like some fantastical crazy idea that does
 not yet exist. Someday when I learn to program, I'll write
 something that does explicitly this...


 http://marc.theaimsgroup.com/?l=openbsd-miscm=105358689405500w=2
 s/nfs/samba/

Re: network distributed storage with windows?

[Graham Gower]

On 22/02/06, A Rossi [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 Very interesting.

   export all via nfs

 But is NFS a requirement, or can I make do with windows XP's SMB
 implementation? Remember, the partitions are under windows, I want
 OpenBSD to be the computer that does the backing up onto those.


I had put
s/nfs/samba/
under the url, but gmail is stupid and appended it to the url.

 I will try this one. But it lacks the error-recovery I was hoping for. Alas.
A CCD mirror is about as good as you'll get.

Graham

Re: network distributed storage with windows?

[Daniel A. Ramaley]

On Thursday 16 February 2006 01:58, A Rossi wrote:
My client didn't really like the idea of just making a windows
partition and disallowing the users from accessing it with
 permissions, because then they'd know about something... And some
 might complain about it being broken - they have several older
 people on staff who aren't as computer literate.

It is possible to not only deny permissions to a drive, but also to 
completely hide the drive from the user interface. Hiding drives from 
the interface can be done through group policies (either local policies 
or via Active Directory). Take a look at Microsoft Knowledge Base 
article Q231289: Using Group Policy Objects to hide specified drives 
in My Computer for Windows 2000.

Since Windows administration is quite off-topic, if you need further 
help please e-mail me off list. I haven't hidden drives from users 
before, but i work with someone who administers Windows and does this 
so it would be easy for me to ask more questions on how it is done.


Dan RamaleyDial Center 118, Drake University
Network Programmer/Analyst 2407 Carpenter Ave
+1 515 271-4540Des Moines IA 50311 USA

Re: network distributed storage with windows?

[A Rossi]

I like this idea.
But one question:
is it possible for the OpenBSD box to access all these hidden 
partitions through SMB as one large storage space possibly with some 
kind of error protection?
This sound like it might be more of a Samba question... But I'll ask 
here anyways.

thanks

Daniel A. Ramaley wrote:

On Thursday 16 February 2006 01:58, A Rossi wrote:
  

   My client didn't really like the idea of just making a windows
partition and disallowing the users from accessing it with
permissions, because then they'd know about something... And some
might complain about it being broken - they have several older
people on staff who aren't as computer literate.



It is possible to not only deny permissions to a drive, but also to 
completely hide the drive from the user interface. Hiding drives from 
the interface can be done through group policies (either local policies 
or via Active Directory). Take a look at Microsoft Knowledge Base 
article Q231289: Using Group Policy Objects to hide specified drives 
in My Computer for Windows 2000.


Since Windows administration is quite off-topic, if you need further 
help please e-mail me off list. I haven't hidden drives from users 
before, but i work with someone who administers Windows and does this 
so it would be easy for me to ask more questions on how it is done.



Dan RamaleyDial Center 118, Drake University
Network Programmer/Analyst 2407 Carpenter Ave
+1 515 271-4540Des Moines IA 50311 USA

Re: network distributed storage with windows?

[Eric Johnson]

On Wed, 15 Feb 2006 23:58:32 -0800
A Rossi [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 What a multitude of options I have! I'll probably end up not reporting
  these solutions to my client, so that he'll use a more traditional 
 backup method.
 The OpenAFS solution would be nice, if I could find it in package 
 form for OpenBSD, or a port for FreeBSD, but I can find neither. Also,
  if it weren't for some of the reasons below, it would be a decent 
 solution, except for hiding the process from the users.

Actually, AFS if real easy on OpenBSD.  It's already there on the recent
versions.  Just edit rc.conf to start it up.  You may have to create a
root level /afs directory as well.

 Having the machines auto-boot and load a hidden OS sounds like a 
 great idea... if I had the hardware to carry it out. I do not believe 
 that the motherboards support that feature. Shane also points out the 
 excellent fact that this is a little dangerous. Although, I didn't 
 mention it, I was secretly hoping for a solution that could implement
 a  sort of parity, similar to that of RAID5, where if one of the
 computers  died, the backup would still be useable. I also did not
 mention that  there was another backup solution in development, but
 these seemed  irrelevant at the time of posting.
 My client didn't really like the idea of just making a windows 
 partition and disallowing the users from accessing it with
 permissions,  because then they'd know about something... And some
 might complain  about it being broken - they have several older
 people on staff who  aren't as computer literate.

On the latest versions of windows, a partition does not have to have a
drive letter.  It can appear as a subdirectory instead.  So one could
hide a subdirectory where noone would look for it or think anything
about it.  How many people would think twice about a directory called
\windows\system32\drivers\etc\fs?  I bet that very few windows users
would ever wonder about that, much less try to see what was in the fs
directory and so they'd never discover they didn't have access.  And if
they didn't have access, they'd think it was like that out of the box.

 And, honestly, I did not know that windows even has daemons. I thought
  that was a Unix concept.

On windows, they call it services with yet another programming interface
to use them.

Eric Johnson

Re: network distributed storage with windows?

[Shane J Pearson]

Hi,

On 2006.02.16, at 6:58 PM, A Rossi wrote:


My apologies to those of you who use console-based mail clients. I'm
still trying to figure out how to get Thunderbird to wrap my text  
at 72

characters. Yes, I know about the setting under Tools  Options, but
that doesn't seem to be working correctly...


I use this marker in my sig and newline manually in Apple Mail because
I haven't found out how to make Apple Mail wrap at 72.

Shane J Pearsonshanejp netspace net au   -|

Re: network distributed storage with windows?

[Shane J Pearson]

On 2006.02.17, at 1:37 AM, Shane J Pearson wrote:


I use this marker in my sig and newline manually in Apple Mail because
I haven't found out how to make Apple Mail wrap at 72.


For any OSX Mail and OpenBSD users who I might have led astray here,  
forget I said this. Someone pointed out to me off list that OSX Mail  
supports x-flow and thus manually wrapping is not needed.



Shane

network distributed storage with windows?

[A Rossi]

Hi,
I've been hired by a client to perform a number of network services for 
him, most of which are completely unrelated to my topic.

Now, onto my topic:
He asked me if I could partition all of his workstation computers 
(running windows XP Professional SP2) with a windows partition, and a 
hidden partition which occupies most of the disk, that is accessible 
over the network to OpenBSD (actually he asked for FreeBSD, but I will 
change his mind...) to back up his server. He doesn't want his employees 
to know about it or to be able to interact with this hidden partition 
in any way. I told him that it is not possible, because windows controls 
the hardware (being the OS on the system) and the only way it would work 
was if he had *BSD on the system. But, because he is paying me, I 
thought I should give him the benefit of the doubt, and ask the pros in 
this area.
So, is it possible for OpenBSD to access a bunch of hidden (I put it 
into quotes because it could be any non-windows compatible partition, 
because it won't show it then) partitions on networked workgroup 
computers and treat them like one big disk for backup?


My apologies for such a long post. I am new to OpenBSD, but I like what 
I see.

Thanks,
A Rossi

Re: network distributed storage with windows?

[Chris Zakelj]

A Rossi wrote:
 Hi,
 I've been hired by a client to perform a number of network services
 for him, most of which are completely unrelated to my topic.
 Now, onto my topic:
 He asked me if I could partition all of his workstation computers
 (running windows XP Professional SP2) with a windows partition, and a
 hidden partition which occupies most of the disk, that is accessible
 over the network to OpenBSD (actually he asked for FreeBSD, but I will
 change his mind...) to back up his server. He doesn't want his
 employees to know about it or to be able to interact with this hidden
 partition in any way. I told him that it is not possible, because
 windows controls the hardware (being the OS on the system) and the
 only way it would work was if he had *BSD on the system. But, because
 he is paying me, I thought I should give him the benefit of the doubt,
 and ask the pros in this area.
 So, is it possible for OpenBSD to access a bunch of hidden (I put it
 into quotes because it could be any non-windows compatible partition,
 because it won't show it then) partitions on networked workgroup
 computers and treat them like one big disk for backup?

 My apologies for such a long post. I am new to OpenBSD, but I like
 what I see.
 Thanks,
 A Rossi
I'm certainly no guru, but I can tell you this:  If the OS in control of
the system does not understand the file system of the partition, then no
other system will be able to access it in any meaningful way.  That
said, I think you could create a C partition, and house the user's
Windows installation and applications on it.  Then create a second D
partition, and lock the view/use rights for that partition to
administrator accounts only.  Share that partition with the usual
Windows file and printer sharing, then access it through SAMBA with
administrator credentials.

Re: network distributed storage with windows?

[A Rossi]

As I though. That is what I told my client. Thank you for verifying my 
knowledge.


Chris Zakelj wrote:

A Rossi wrote:
  

Hi,
I've been hired by a client to perform a number of network services
for him, most of which are completely unrelated to my topic.
Now, onto my topic:
He asked me if I could partition all of his workstation computers
(running windows XP Professional SP2) with a windows partition, and a
hidden partition which occupies most of the disk, that is accessible
over the network to OpenBSD (actually he asked for FreeBSD, but I will
change his mind...) to back up his server. He doesn't want his
employees to know about it or to be able to interact with this hidden
partition in any way. I told him that it is not possible, because
windows controls the hardware (being the OS on the system) and the
only way it would work was if he had *BSD on the system. But, because
he is paying me, I thought I should give him the benefit of the doubt,
and ask the pros in this area.
So, is it possible for OpenBSD to access a bunch of hidden (I put it
into quotes because it could be any non-windows compatible partition,
because it won't show it then) partitions on networked workgroup
computers and treat them like one big disk for backup?

My apologies for such a long post. I am new to OpenBSD, but I like
what I see.
Thanks,
A Rossi


I'm certainly no guru, but I can tell you this:  If the OS in control of
the system does not understand the file system of the partition, then no
other system will be able to access it in any meaningful way.  That
said, I think you could create a C partition, and house the user's
Windows installation and applications on it.  Then create a second D
partition, and lock the view/use rights for that partition to
administrator accounts only.  Share that partition with the usual
Windows file and printer sharing, then access it through SAMBA with
administrator credentials.

Re: network distributed storage with windows?

[ober]

I would install OpenAFS on all the windows boxes, then use one of many 
methods to hide those processes.


Then you could have each drive mounted/hosting different logical volumes.
And they would all be available from any OS with a afs client, which 
almost all are supported.


-Ober

Richard Chesler: [Reading a piece of paper] The first rule of Fight Club is you 
don't talk about Fight Club?
Narrator: [Voice-over] I'm half asleep again; I must've left the original in 
the copy machine.
Richard Chesler: The second rule of Fight Club - is this yours?
Narrator: Huh?
Richard Chesler: Pretend you're me, make a managerial decision: you find this, 
what would you do?

On Wed, 15 Feb 2006, A Rossi wrote:


Date: Wed, 15 Feb 2006 17:53:14 -0800
From: A Rossi [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: misc@openbsd.org
Subject: network distributed storage with windows?

Hi,
I've been hired by a client to perform a number of network services for him, 
most of which are completely unrelated to my topic.

Now, onto my topic:
He asked me if I could partition all of his workstation computers (running 
windows XP Professional SP2) with a windows partition, and a hidden partition 
which occupies most of the disk, that is accessible over the network to 
OpenBSD (actually he asked for FreeBSD, but I will change his mind...) to 
back up his server. He doesn't want his employees to know about it or to be 
able to interact with this hidden partition in any way. I told him that it 
is not possible, because windows controls the hardware (being the OS on the 
system) and the only way it would work was if he had *BSD on the system. But, 
because he is paying me, I thought I should give him the benefit of the 
doubt, and ask the pros in this area.
So, is it possible for OpenBSD to access a bunch of hidden (I put it into 
quotes because it could be any non-windows compatible partition, because it 
won't show it then) partitions on networked workgroup computers and treat 
them like one big disk for backup?


My apologies for such a long post. I am new to OpenBSD, but I like what I 
see.

Thanks,
A Rossi

Re: network distributed storage with windows?

[Shane J Pearson]

Hi,

On 2006.02.16, at 12:53 PM, A Rossi wrote:


He asked me if I could partition all of his workstation computers
(running windows XP Professional SP2) with a windows partition, and a
hidden partition which occupies most of the disk, that is accessible
over the network to OpenBSD (actually he asked for FreeBSD, but I will
change his mind...) to back up his server.


Years ago while working for an educational institution, I cobbled
together some programs to allow some classroom machines to be brought
back to SOE automatically every night after classes, as long as the
machines were switched off at the end of the day.

I used the automatic power ON feature on the PC's to switch them ON
automatically at 11pm, and then Smart Boot Manager, which has boot
schedule features which could be configured to automatically boot a
hidden DOS partition if the PC's were booted at around that time. That
hidden DOS partition would then run Ghost to restore the WinNT partition
to SOE. Once that was done I had a small util power the machines OFF.
Smart Boot Manager can be configured with a boot delay of zero seconds,
so the staff should never see it.

One thing you might be able to do, is if those PC's have the auto power
ON feature, use smart boot manager to do much the same, but boot OpenBSD
instead and maybe run Samba to receive those backups. Then have OpenBSD
power those PC's off before work begins the next morning. Maybe rsync
or Unison would be better.


Having said all that, you really should be convincing him that a real
backup scheme should be employed. That is dodgy. The backups could be
corrupted through a multitude of ways or copied by a savvy malicious
staff member. What if there is a fire?


Shane J Pearsonshanejp netspace net au   -|

Re: network distributed storage with windows?

[Eric Johnson]

On Wed, 15 Feb 2006 17:53:14 -0800
A Rossi [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 Hi,
 I've been hired by a client to perform a number of network services
 for  him, most of which are completely unrelated to my topic.
 Now, onto my topic:
 He asked me if I could partition all of his workstation computers 
 (running windows XP Professional SP2) with a windows partition, and a 
 hidden partition which occupies most of the disk, that is accessible 
 over the network to OpenBSD (actually he asked for FreeBSD, but I will
  change his mind...) to back up his server. He doesn't want his
  employees 
 to know about it or to be able to interact with this hidden
 partition  in any way. I told him that it is not possible, because
 windows controls  the hardware (being the OS on the system) and the
 only way it would work  was if he had *BSD on the system. But, because
 he is paying me, I  thought I should give him the benefit of the
 doubt, and ask the pros in  this area.
 So, is it possible for OpenBSD to access a bunch of hidden (I put it
  into quotes because it could be any non-windows compatible partition,
  
 because it won't show it then) partitions on networked workgroup 
 computers and treat them like one big disk for backup?

It might be possible to do something similar by setting the permissions
on the partition to disallow all access from the normal user.  The users
would be able to see the existence of the partition but not be able to
access it if they can't change the permissions.

Then if you can find a windows NFS server that runs as a daemon and
allow the partition to be accessed over the network only from the
BSD server.

Or if you could find a ssh daemon for windows, you could use that to
allow the server to use scp to transfer files back and forth.

Eric Johnson

Re: network distributed storage with windows?

[Eric Johnson]

On Wed, 15 Feb 2006 17:53:14 -0800
A Rossi [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 Hi,
 I've been hired by a client to perform a number of network services
 for  him, most of which are completely unrelated to my topic.
 Now, onto my topic:
 He asked me if I could partition all of his workstation computers 
 (running windows XP Professional SP2) with a windows partition, and a 
 hidden partition which occupies most of the disk, that is accessible 
 over the network to OpenBSD (actually he asked for FreeBSD, but I will
  change his mind...) to back up his server. He doesn't want his
  employees 
 to know about it or to be able to interact with this hidden
 partition  in any way. I told him that it is not possible, because
 windows controls  the hardware (being the OS on the system) and the
 only way it would work  was if he had *BSD on the system. But, because
 he is paying me, I  thought I should give him the benefit of the
 doubt, and ask the pros in  this area.
 So, is it possible for OpenBSD to access a bunch of hidden (I put it
  into quotes because it could be any non-windows compatible partition,
  
 because it won't show it then) partitions on networked workgroup 
 computers and treat them like one big disk for backup?

It might be possible to do something similar by setting the permissions
on the partition to disallow all access from the normal user.  The users
would be able to see the existence of the partition but not be able to
access it if they can't change the permissions.

Then if you can find a windows NFS server that runs as a daemon and
allow the partition to be accessed over the network only from the
BSD server.

Or if you could find a ssh daemon for windows, you could use that to
allow the server to use scp to transfer files back and forth.

Eric Johnson

Re: network distributed storage with windows?

[A Rossi]

What a multitude of options I have! I'll probably end up not reporting 
these solutions to my client, so that he'll use a more traditional 
backup method.
   The OpenAFS solution would be nice, if I could find it in package 
form for OpenBSD, or a port for FreeBSD, but I can find neither. Also, 
if it weren't for some of the reasons below, it would be a decent 
solution, except for hiding the process from the users.
   Having the machines auto-boot and load a hidden OS sounds like a 
great idea... if I had the hardware to carry it out. I do not believe 
that the motherboards support that feature. Shane also points out the 
excellent fact that this is a little dangerous. Although, I didn't 
mention it, I was secretly hoping for a solution that could implement a 
sort of parity, similar to that of RAID5, where if one of the computers 
died, the backup would still be useable. I also did not mention that 
there was another backup solution in development, but these seemed 
irrelevant at the time of posting.
   My client didn't really like the idea of just making a windows 
partition and disallowing the users from accessing it with permissions, 
because then they'd know about something... And some might complain 
about it being broken - they have several older people on staff who 
aren't as computer literate.
And, honestly, I did not know that windows even has daemons. I thought 
that was a Unix concept.
Anyways, thanks for the input, and don't stop! One idea might spark a 
thought in the right direction (as is the case with me, usually).

A Rossi

P.S.
My apologies to those of you who use console-based mail clients. I'm 
still trying to figure out how to get Thunderbird to wrap my text at 72 
characters. Yes, I know about the setting under Tools  Options, but 
that doesn't seem to be working correctly...



Eric Johnson wrote:

 On Wed, 15 Feb 2006 17:53:14 -0800 A Rossi [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 wrote:

 Hi, I've been hired by a client to perform a number of network
 services for  him, most of which are completely unrelated to my
 topic. Now, onto my topic: He asked me if I could partition all of
 his workstation computers (running windows XP Professional SP2)
 with a windows partition, and a hidden partition which occupies
 most of the disk, that is accessible over the network to OpenBSD
 (actually he asked for FreeBSD, but I will change his mind...) to
 back up his server. He doesn't want his employees to know about it
 or to be able to interact with this hidden partition  in any way.
 I told him that it is not possible, because windows controls the
 hardware (being the OS on the system) and the only way it would
 work  was if he had *BSD on the system. But, because he is paying
 me, I  thought I should give him the benefit of the doubt, and ask
 the pros in  this area. So, is it possible for OpenBSD to access a
 bunch of hidden (I put it into quotes because it could be any
 non-windows compatible partition,

 because it won't show it then) partitions on networked workgroup
 computers and treat them like one big disk for backup?

 It might be possible to do something similar by setting the
 permissions on the partition to disallow all access from the normal
 user.  The users would be able to see the existence of the partition
 but not be able to access it if they can't change the permissions.

 Then if you can find a windows NFS server that runs as a daemon and
 allow the partition to be accessed over the network only from the BSD
 server.

 Or if you could find a ssh daemon for windows, you could use that to
 allow the server to use scp to transfer files back and forth.

 Eric Johnson