Re: [Mpls] Campaign finance question
-- Original Message - From: David Brauer [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sincere question for those who know more than I: Is there an individual-contributor limit to a Political Action Committee that might spend money in a Minneapolis race? [TB] The PAC can spend as much as it want (has) if it is not coordinated with the candidate or candidate's campaign. It needs to be a true independent expenditure. Its from a court decision based on free speech, the PAC has a constitutional right to make its opinions known. An individual is not limited in how much s/he contributes to the PAC (for a candidate, technically the limit is what a candidate can accept from an individual). That's essentially the same free speech thing, you can't regulate what I can give but you can limit what a candidate can accept. Terrell Brown Minneapolis (Loring Park), MN Should any political party attempt to abolish Social Security, unemployment insurance, and eliminate labor laws and farm programs, you would not hear of that party again in our political history. There is a tiny splinter group, of course, that believes that you can do these things. Among them are a few Texas oil millionaires, and an occasional politician or businessman from other areas. Their number is negligible and they are stupid. - President Dwight D. Eisenhower (R), 1954 REMINDERS: 1. Be civil! Please read the NEW RULES at http://www.e-democracy.org/rules. If you think a member is in violation, contact the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. For state and national discussions see: http://e-democracy.org/discuss.html For external forums, see: http://e-democracy.org/mninteract Minneapolis Issues Forum - A Civil City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:mpls@mnforum.org Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
Re: [Mpls] Early morning voter turnout.....
I was #325 in 7-8 just before noon. That's about 1/3 of the total turnout for that precinct in 2001. Terrell Brown Loring Park - Original Message - From: Barbara Lickness [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Keith Nybakke [EMAIL PROTECTED]; mpls@mnforum.org Sent: Tuesday, November 08, 2005 8:59 AM Subject: Re: [Mpls] Early morning voter turnout. 101st voter at 6-2 Barb Lickness Whittier Ward 6 REMINDERS: 1. Be civil! Please read the NEW RULES at http://www.e-democracy.org/rules. If you think a member is in violation, contact the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. For state and national discussions see: http://e-democracy.org/discuss.html For external forums, see: http://e-democracy.org/mninteract Minneapolis Issues Forum - A Civil City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:mpls@mnforum.org Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
[Mpls] Rad Fest speaker Betsy Hodges claims she is more conservative than LisaMcDonald?
- Original Message - From: Barbara Lickness [EMAIL PROTECTED] I have been making phone calls for Lisa McDonald during the last week to the more conservative faction of the 13th ward.. I am shocked at some of the responses I have been getting from voters. Apparently, Betsy is telling people whatever they need to hear in order to get a vote. People I talked to said she told them that she is by-far the most conservative candidate in this race, and that Lisa is the super-liberal. [TB] Interesting. Hodges spoke in 1999 on a panel moderated by Marv Davidov about left party building. The website says a tape was made of the presentation. What position did she take on left party building? http://www.radfest.org/archives/radfest00/program00.htm Ms. Hodges spoke to the National Lawyers Guild, Minnesota Chapter, in 2000 about the meaning of Seattle (WTO protests in 1999). Did she protest in Seattle in 1999? That was, after all a conservative group tearing up the town. http://www.nlgminnesota.org/newsletter/NLG%20News%2003-00a.pdf This is what Politics in Minnesota said about Hodges (at the bottom of the page) Politics In Minnesota: Setting The Record Straight We got some feedback on our report about the City Council race in Minneapolis's 13th Ward. We wrote that, if elected, DFL endorsee Betsy Hodges won't be as liberal as many others on the Council. We were reminded that Hodges has been endorsed by ACORN, National Organization for Women, Progressive Minnesota, and Democracy for Minnesota, some of the most liberal groups involved in Minnesota politics. As development director for Progressive Minnesota, Hodges spoke at gatherings such as Wisconsin RadFest on the same panel as Democratic Socialists and Green Party members. Sounds like she might be right at home on the left wing of the City Council. You can find that at: http://www.politicsinminnesota.com/pim-report.asp?section=PIMReportarticle=pim-report-10-06-2005 Barb asks the question and answers it well: How do you go from that ideal to being more conservative than Lisa McDonald? Truth is, you don't. It's a lie. (snip) Say whatever the voter wants to hear. Truth be damned. Trouble is, sooner or later people figure out they got lied to. Terrell Brown Loring Park REMINDERS: 1. Be civil! Please read the NEW RULES at http://www.e-democracy.org/rules. If you think a member is in violation, contact the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. For state and national discussions see: http://e-democracy.org/discuss.html For external forums, see: http://e-democracy.org/mninteract Minneapolis Issues Forum - A Civil City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:mpls@mnforum.org Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
Re: [Mpls] McLaughlin Clearly the Better Choice at MPR Forum
- Original Message - The posting by Commissioner McLaughlin regarding the MPR debate is a nice attempt at spin. Claiming victory doesn't make it true. McLaughlin's post claims the Commissioner clearly laid out his vision. What vision is that? Is it the vision that puts 150 cops on the street in three years? Wait, it's not 150 cops but 250 in five years. ... John Blackshaw Rybak Campaign Manager I attended the debate last night at Westminster. The Mayor was clearly on the defensive. He wanted us to think the number of cops has increased since he took office. Didn't get the chance to ask how many cops we had when SSB left office and how many we have today. Looks rather clear that the number has only gone down since Rybak moved into that office at City Hall. According to City Pages (June 30, 2004) http://citypages.com/databank/25/1230/article12258.asp In 2000, the number of total sworn personnel in the department was 917; currently that number is 762. In 2008, according the projected five-year plan, Minneapolis will have 641 sworn police officers on the payroll, staffing numbers not seen here since the early 1960s. The City of Hopkins website in comparing their department with Minneapolis lists sworn officers in Minneapolis as: 2004795 2003849 2002848 http://www.hopkinsmn.com/publicsafety/police/crimestatistics.html The Minneapolis Police Department 5 Year Business plan 2004-2008 says: While overall strength in the Police Department has declined over the past three years, MPD has seen an increase in the percentage of employees of color who make up the department. http://www.ci.minneapolis.mn.us/police/about/docs/ExecSummary.pdf Terrell Brown Loring Park REMINDERS: 1. Be civil! Please read the NEW RULES at http://www.e-democracy.org/rules. If you think a member is in violation, contact the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. For state and national discussions see: http://e-democracy.org/discuss.html For external forums, see: http://e-democracy.org/mninteract Minneapolis Issues Forum - A Civil City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:mpls@mnforum.org Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
Re: [Mpls] Park Board authority eliminated by staff
- Original Message - From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: mpls@mnforum.org Sent: Wednesday, October 26, 2005 7:44 AM Subject: [Mpls] Park Board authority eliminated by staff The Senior staff of the Park board has informed the Commissioners that they should not be looking at a line item budget and do not have the authority to set a detailed budget. A few years ago someone wrote the book How to Manage Your Boss. You can buy it on Amazon for $14.95 http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/156414139X/104-0769621-7579139?v=glancen=283155s=booksv=glance apparently the PB staff wants to add a chapter on I'm going to do no matter what you say Doesn't sound like a way to stay employeed to me, put then you are dealing with the Minneapolis Park Board. Terrell Brown Loring Park REMINDERS: 1. Be civil! Please read the NEW RULES at http://www.e-democracy.org/rules. If you think a member is in violation, contact the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. For state and national discussions see: http://e-democracy.org/discuss.html For external forums, see: http://e-democracy.org/mninteract Minneapolis Issues Forum - A Civil City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:mpls@mnforum.org Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
Re: [Mpls] Ryback Campaign Calls for Halt to Distortions
- Original Message - From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] “We’ve heard that Police Federation president John Delmonico is about to engage in a highly negative assault against Mayor Rybak,” said Blackshaw, (John Blackshaw Campaign Manager for Rybak) [TB] We heard someone might attack us. Isn't t that one of the sillier comments we've seen. First to halt something that hasn't even happened and then to be upset that someone might say something negative about someone running for public office, someone who has held the office for 4 years. Talk about the silly season, the election isn't even for a couple of more weeks. Terrell Brown Loring Park REMINDERS: 1. Be civil! Please read the NEW RULES at http://www.e-democracy.org/rules. If you think a member is in violation, contact the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. For state and national discussions see: http://e-democracy.org/discuss.html For external forums, see: http://e-democracy.org/mninteract Minneapolis Issues Forum - A Civil City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:mpls@mnforum.org Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
[Mpls] Rybak: Let's debate
RYBAK ISSUES CHALLENGE FOR PRE-ELECTION DEBATE Says debate with himself will bring out full range of ideas MINNEAPOLIS (NTO) - Minneapolis Mayor RT Rybak who is facing a tough re-election challenge demanded the opportunity to debate himself prior to the November 8th election. A mayoral spokesperson said the Mayor was still negotiating a time and place for the debate. We thought we had it nailed until an afternoon breeze changed from the west to the northwest while he still had his finger in the air on this one and he changed his mind again, she moaned, hopefully he can come to an agreement before the election. Like the Mayor's opinions, reaction at City Hall was mixed. Seventh Ward Councilmember Lisa Goodman, taking a break from raising more campaign funds than any other Council candidate in city history said, He's still my guy, as long as he keeps doing what he is told. Council President Paul Ostrow offered the Council Chambers as a debate site saying this may be the best entertainment since Cirque du Soleil left town after last weekend's performances, I want a front row seat. Views of other city hall insiders were as varied as thoughts going through the Mayor's ever changing mind. As recently as last week, Rybak was refusing to debate saying it just gives ammunition to my opponents. Reminded that there are only 2 names on the ballot his concern lessened. We just might be able to make this thing work he remarked. Listeners weren't sure if he meant pulling off the debate or winning the election. Asked to comment, challenger and Hennepin County Commissioner Peter McLaughlin laughed if he were on a TV game show he could buy a vowel, we're just not sure where he can buy a clue. McLaughlin agreed with Ostrow that there could be some good entertainment value especially if it were done in one of the slow news weeks leading up to the November sweeps. After that he's got no chance, 4,5, 9 and 11 are to busy hyping their own investigations and there's nothing in the Mayor's mind worth investigating were the words of one Councilmember who asked to remain anonymous. Since Rybak who has been promising 8% annual increases in the city's property taxes is now telling the Minneapolis StarTribune We have the seeds of a property tax rebellion in this state, Rybak vs. Rybak could be a good show. Terrell Brown Loring Park REMINDERS: 1. Be civil! Please read the NEW RULES at http://www.e-democracy.org/rules. If you think a member is in violation, contact the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. For state and national discussions see: http://e-democracy.org/discuss.html For external forums, see: http://e-democracy.org/mninteract Minneapolis Issues Forum - A Civil City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:mpls@mnforum.org Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
Re: [Mpls] Mayor Rybak and Chief McManus Report on Success of StrategicSafety Partnership
Meanwhile I hear that at a small neighborhood grocery store a block or so from where Rybak lives, where the clerk got rolled as he was leaving the store at closing time a couple of weeks ago, the Police will be endorsing McLaughlin. With what crime is doing in Minneapolis this year, that the Mayor is claiming credit for anything is a bit beyond belief. Terrell Brown Loring Park - Original Message - From: Jeremy Hanson [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Forum Mpls Issues mpls@mnforum.org Sent: Wednesday, October 12, 2005 11:07 AM Subject: [Mpls] Mayor Rybak and Chief McManus Report on Success of StrategicSafety Partnership OFFICE OF MAYOR R.T. RYBAK MEDIA ANNOUNCEMENT October 12th, 2005 Contact: Jeremy Hanson Phone: 612-673-2785 Mobile: 612-306-5274 Mayor Rybak and Chief McManus Report on Success of Minneapolis Strategic Safety Partnership 61-day summer initiative reduced homicides, shootings and gang activity Minneapolis Mayor R.T. Rybak and Police Chief William McManus today reported that the Minneapolis Strategic Safety Partnership successfully reduced the number of homicides and shootings in Minneapolis and increased the number of guns confiscated. As one of the Police Department's (MPD) primary 2005 public safety initiatives, the Partnership ran from July 1 - August 31 and coordinated numerous federal, state and regional resources to enhance Minneapolis' capacity to prevent and respond to violent crime, especially gang-related crime in key neighborhoods. REMINDERS: 1. Be civil! Please read the NEW RULES at http://www.e-democracy.org/rules. If you think a member is in violation, contact the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. For state and national discussions see: http://e-democracy.org/discuss.html For external forums, see: http://e-democracy.org/mninteract Minneapolis Issues Forum - A Civil City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:mpls@mnforum.org Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
Re: [Mpls] Mayor Rybak and panhandling
Under the leadership of Mayor Rybak, panhandling has become the city's leading growth industry. Now you can find downtown panhandlers at least as early as 6 in the morning, something that you would never see before Rybak assumed command at City Hall. While walking home from work a week or so ago, one younger panhandler had become a bit more original with his sign, it simply said in neatly printed letters on what looked to be fresh cardboard Will hold sign for money. At least he was a bit more origninal. Problem with the early morning panhandling (as opposed to when its daylight) is that it's more difficult to tell the panhandlers from the muggers. With all the additional permits to carry being handed out somebody is going to get shot. Then I guess the crime rate is well up and the promised new cops don't come on line until after the election. (Any bets on if the promise is kept?) Terrell Brown Loring Park REMINDERS: 1. Be civil! Please read the NEW RULES at http://www.e-democracy.org/rules. If you think a member is in violation, contact the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. For state and national discussions see: http://e-democracy.org/discuss.html For external forums, see: http://e-democracy.org/mninteract Minneapolis Issues Forum - A Civil City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:mpls@mnforum.org Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
Re: [Mpls] According to Marie Hauser, Tom Nordyke did not give his permission for her to use his photo onher lit piece
- Original Message - From: Elizabeth Wielinski [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [Mpls] According to Marie Hauser,Tom Nordyke did not give his permission for her to use his photo onher lit piece I do not know if this applies in Hennepin County, but when a group wanted to send out a flyer in a mailing that was being paid for by my senate district last year we were told it would be legal if they paid for whichever portion of the piece ( i.e. 1/3 if they had one page and we had two etc... ). I know that the City DFL when sending out a sample ballot has each campaign come up with their portion of the total cost. I'm not bringing this up to hurt any candidate as I am a supporter of Tom Nordyke's, but if Tom and Mary Merrill Anderson are named on this piece are they expected to each pick up a portion of the cost? And if yes, by law, should Ms. Hauser have let them know [TB] That is no quite accurate. A political party (or other group) can spend money on behalf without reimbursement if it is not coordinated with the candidate (ie the candidate doesn't know about it, doesn't write the piece ...) When a party coordinates with the candidate(s) it ceases to be an independent expenditure and contribution limits or spending limits may apply. No, being named on a piece does not obiligate you to part of the cost if it is not coordinated with the candidate. Terrell Brown Loring Park REMINDERS: 1. Be civil! Please read the NEW RULES at http://www.e-democracy.org/rules. If you think a member is in violation, contact the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. For state and national discussions see: http://e-democracy.org/discuss.html For external forums, see: http://e-democracy.org/mninteract Minneapolis Issues Forum - A Civil City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:mpls@mnforum.org Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
[Mpls] More murder in Minneapolis??
As I look at the window the MPD mobile crime lab, Medical Examiner and at least a couple of police cars are parked on the Loring Greenway. They just pulled a gurney out of the back of the Medical Examiner's van and took it to a place that is blocked from view by the trees. Terrell Brown Loring Park REMINDERS: 1. Be civil! Please read the NEW RULES at http://www.e-democracy.org/rules. If you think a member is in violation, contact the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. For state and national discussions see: http://e-democracy.org/discuss.html For external forums, see: http://e-democracy.org/mninteract Minneapolis Issues Forum - A Civil City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:mpls@mnforum.org Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
Re: [Mpls] Mayoral strategy
- Original Message - From: David Brauer [EMAIL PROTECTED] The Strib today highlights the post-primary war of words. http://www.startribune.com/stories/587/5615635.html A few things jumped out at me. McLaughlin, for the first time, criticizes Rybak for sending his kids to private schools. This was an issue Sharon supporters raised in 2001. Without commenting on the wisdom of going after Rybak's family decisions - I have to cover these guys, though once you open the door to the personal stuff, it's hard to close it if it comes back at you - it reflects something I expect Peter to do more of: talk up education. [TB] If you're a parent you want your kids to get the best education they can get and as I recall it from last time the Rybak kids get a good price deal at Blake or Breck as their grandmother works there. Apparently the Rybak's think Minneapolis Public Schools don't provide the level of education that the kids can get out in the 'burbs. Still when part of your job is to support and promote the city, no matter what you vocalize, what is the message you are sending when you send the kids to a pricy school out in the 'burbs. It does go a ways to support the claim that Rybak is all talk. When you're Mayor you can't always separate the personal stuff. How much did we hear about the school the Clinton's picked when they moved to Washington? In the same story, Rybak continues blasting away at the Police Federation's John Delmonico (who is giving it to Rybak pretty good). This, too, is smart on the candidate's part. Perhaps the best line in the Strib article was: Hennepin County Commissioner Mark Stenglein, who was known for his sense of humor while running a losing mayoral race in 2001, said of this year's contenders, They don't take lumps well. ... way to go Rochelle Olson, you've got that one right. Still Rybak isn't being completely honest about adding cops, he says we will have more cops sometime (maybe NEXT year), we still have fewer than we did 4 years ago when he was elected (fewer firefighters too). I got 3 pieces of mail from our environmentally friendly Mayor last Saturday, followed by another on Monday. Quit whining guys, nobody's mailed out the dishonest hit piece that went out in 13, less than a week before the election, against either of you yet. Terrell Brown Loring Park REMINDERS: 1. Be civil! Please read the NEW RULES at http://www.e-democracy.org/rules. If you think a member is in violation, contact the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. For state and national discussions see: http://e-democracy.org/discuss.html For external forums, see: http://e-democracy.org/mninteract Minneapolis Issues Forum - A Civil City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:mpls@mnforum.org Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
Re: [Mpls] Minneapolis is Responding to Hurricane Disaster
MAYOR R.T. RYBAK MEDIA ALERT September 2, 2005 The City of Minneapolis is responding to the aftermath of Hurricane Katrina by working through the Interstate Emergency Management Assistance Compact (EMAC) to send needed resources as requested. Because of the magnitude of this disaster it is important that Minneapolis coordinate our response through EMAC to have the strongest, most effective impact. EMAC has requested and I have authorized Chief McManus to work with other law enforcement agencies to deploy a coordinated strike team of trained officers, along with the food and supplies they need. Our people and resources are ready to go as needed. Comment: Apparently the reason we hired a few new cops was so that we could send them 4 or 5 states away to do the federal government's job. We pay federal taxes to, in part, respond to these disasters. I'm not sure that the residents of Minneapolis expect their local property taxes to be sent hundreds of miles away. They Mayor has cried poor throughout his term. He's made drastic cuts in fire and police services as the crime rate has increased. Just last week a clerk at a small grocery store just a couple of blocks from the Mayor's home was robbed at knife point as he was leaving the store at closing time. Murders are reaching a level not seen since the early SSB years. It is reasonable for our police and fire departments to assist nearby departments, St. Paul, Richfield, Brooklyn Center, even St. Cloud or Duluth. The sending of scarce police resources to Louisiana so that the Mayor can make a feel good statement days before an election is totally absurd. Terrell Brown Loring Park REMINDERS: 1. Be civil! Please read the NEW RULES at http://www.e-democracy.org/rules. If you think a member is in violation, contact the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. For state and national discussions see: http://e-democracy.org/discuss.html For external forums, see: http://e-democracy.org/mninteract Minneapolis Issues Forum - A Civil City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:mpls@mnforum.org Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
Re: [Mpls] Rybak: every new state dollar to the city for public safety
Press release from the mayor's office: Mayor Rybak to Budget New City Money for Public Safety, Cops snip State and federal governments have cut 120 cops from Minneapolis streets since 2000. [TB] More accurately: The Mayor and City Councils budgeting priorities have reduced the size of the Minneapolis Police Department by 120 officers since 2000. State and federal governments do not determine the strength of municipal police departments. The city had options available to avoid or reduce this reduction but the brain trust at City Hall found it politically expedient to cut the size of both the police and fire departments. In a move reminiscent to Gov. Carlson sending in the State Patrol a few years back when Minneapolis was experiencing a record high murder rate, this summer we see the Minneapolis Police Department being supplemented by Hennepin County Sheriff Deputies and Metro Transit Officers. Minneapolis is running out of cops, the Mayor and Council need to quit blaming others and take responsibility for their own decisions. Terrell Brown Loring Park REMINDERS: 1. Be civil! Please read the NEW RULES at http://www.e-democracy.org/rules. If you think a member is in violation, contact the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. For state and national discussions see: http://e-democracy.org/discuss.html For external forums, see: http://e-democracy.org/mninteract Minneapolis Issues Forum - A Civil City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:mpls@mnforum.org Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
Re: [Mpls] Building Height
- Original Message - From: md [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Madeline Douglass) The architect's drawings of the 48 and now the 39 story structures seems oddly out of proportion to reality...deliberately? [TB] Out of proportion with what? My neighbors include the Target Towers (2 blocks), US Bank/Piper Tower (4 blocks), IDS. The downtown skyway connects to the building next door. I was walking around Oak Grove and Groveland looking for the surviving buildings of architect Edward Somerby Stebbins...two (or perhaps more) of which have been devoured by condos or apartments and I wondered if Loring Park is the most condo/apartment intensive neighborhood in Minneapolis? [TB] Devoured by for the most part that is the way the neighborhood was built. It was before the time that the city had sprawled out past 31st Street. Loring has had apartments since the late 1800's, it is not a new trend. You can count the number of single family residential buildings in Loring on one hand, granted some that were originally have been converted to multi-unit or commercial. And then there's The Groveland which makes no sense at all... it looks like 7 floors, but it's spread all over the place like one of those squiddy things from The Matrix and it's hovering over the edge of 35W. Who would want to live there? [TB] Bets here are that the people buying into that building would rather live there than say, Kingfield. There was, or course, a somewhat serious proposal to have an architectural review commission to prevent additional ugly buildings downtown after City Center was built. Some are making the same comments about the expanded Walker Art Center. One was even heard asking a Walker security person where they could find the more traditional art. Perhaps CLPC said Yes! to the Eitel project because they are mostly condo/apartment dwellers and think another one is just fine...but do they realize just how TALL 39 stories is? [TB] Your point is? Look at the downtown skyline from a distance. It is a nice looking skyline. Loring is part of it. Is there some kind of greed-machine viagra fueled competition to build the tallest condo in Minneapolis? Why agree to that? [TB] Probably because it makes for a neat city. Even with this density, Minneapolis will never be as dense as many large cities. We have acres of parks, lakes and a river that will never be built on and provide both open spaces and recreational opportiunities. Neither Loring Park, Lowry Hill or Elliot Park need to be over-run with these monolithic skypollutin towers. These neighborhoods are the historic heart of Minneapolis. They should not be glassed and steeled and Starbucksed to oblivion. [TB] Elliot Park, by the way, has embraced Grant Park that was built in that neighborhood. Same with a couple of other buildings being built there. The reason these buildings are being built is that people want to live in them, they want to live in a vibrant neighborhood. Anyway...it's worth taking a moment to remember why Eitel hospital was built and the people who lived or worked there... http://www.mnmed.org/publications/MNMed2003/September/Holtan2.html [TB] Harmon was at one time the center for Minneapolis auto business. Key word being was. Welcome to the 21st century. Terrell Brown Loring Park (30th Floor for the past 9 years) REMINDERS: 1. Be civil! Please read the NEW RULES at http://www.e-democracy.org/rules. If you think a member is in violation, contact the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. For state and national discussions see: http://e-democracy.org/discuss.html For external forums, see: http://e-democracy.org/mninteract Minneapolis Issues Forum - A Civil City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:mpls@mnforum.org Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
Re: [Mpls] Council committee turns down Lagoon Project
- Original Message - From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Ed Kohler [EMAIL PROTECTED] BTW, David Greene has been suggesting that tons of people are going to be moving in in the near future. Is this really true? My impression is that, with exceptions in favored neighborhoods, the central cities are going to continue to go *DOWN* in population, while the further out suburbs are going to continue to grow. Rovian slip? Here are the facts. http://www.ci.minneapolis.mn.us/citywork/planning/Census2000/1990-to-2000-Population-Change-by-Race-and-Ethnicity-for-Minneapolis.asp City of Minneapolis population 1990 census 368,383 City of Minneapolis population 2000 census 382,618 Increase 1990 to 2000 14,235 Increase as percentage 3.9% Does this typify the accuracy of the information that project opponents presented to the Council committee? Terrell Brown Loring Park REMINDERS: 1. Be civil! Please read the NEW RULES at http://www.e-democracy.org/rules. If you think a member is in violation, contact the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. For state and national discussions see: http://e-democracy.org/discuss.html For external forums, see: http://e-democracy.org/mninteract Minneapolis Issues Forum - A Civil City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:mpls@mnforum.org Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
[Mpls] City of Minneapolis Help Needed: Apply July 5 - 19, 2005
City of Minneapolis seeks new Mayor and City Council members (13) for 4 year terms beginning January 2006. All positions pay livable wages. The annual rate of pay for Mayor is currently $92,376.42 The annual rate of pay for Council Members is currently $70,312.60, these rates are adjusted annually based on the increase in the Consumer Price Index. Apply at City Hall with $20 filing fee. Several incumbent council members are in severe need of opponents. Failure to have opponents has been found to lead to lazy council members who just plain don't do much. Do to the Minneapolis weak Mayor system, the Mayor isn't really expected to do much other than show up a occaisional parades and community celebrations. Join the party, file for your ballot position between July 5 and July 19. Terrell Brown Loring Park REMINDERS: 1. Be civil! Please read the NEW RULES at http://www.e-democracy.org/rules. If you think a member is in violation, contact the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. For state and national discussions see: http://e-democracy.org/discuss.html For external forums, see: http://e-democracy.org/mninteract Minneapolis Issues Forum - A Civil City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:mpls@mnforum.org Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
Re: [Mpls] Twin Cities GLBT Pride
- Original Message - From: Tim Bonham [EMAIL PROTECTED] Stop by Log Cabin Republicans and the Minneapolis Republican City Committee booth - booth number 3089 - near the tennis courts. Eva Young Near North Notice that Eva doesn't say anything about meeting Republican elected officials or endorsed candidates at their booth -- 'cause there won't be any there! They all run as fast and as far as they can from the Log Cabin group. Stop at the Stonewall DFL booth and you WILL see many elected endorsed DFL'ers there, at the party that actually supports human rights for GLBT people and all people. And has a long-time record of doing so, and continues to do so. During my wander thru the park this afternoon I did run into one elected official. He wasn't at either his booth or any party booth, however, he did say that he had stopped by the Log Cabin booth and told them that they were performing a needed service (I'm not claiming that is a direct quote, but it is close and certainly within the spirit of his statement). He's right, people should be encouraged to participate in the political process. Certainly no one expects to agree with all of them, then that is why we hold elections. I do know that over the past few years that I have seen endorsed candidates from the Independence, Green, Democratic and Republican parties at Pride. Jim Gibson practially began his campaign for US Senate at Pride. It seems as all of the positions on the ballot this year are non-partisan. Parade starts at 11, I'm walking with one of the Council candidates. Should be a good day for the final day of the Pride Fest. Terrell Brown (just a short walk from) Loring Park REMINDERS: 1. Be civil! Please read the NEW RULES at http://www.e-democracy.org/rules. If you think a member is in violation, contact the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. For state and national discussions see: http://e-democracy.org/discuss.html For external forums, see: http://e-democracy.org/mninteract Minneapolis Issues Forum - A Civil City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:mpls@mnforum.org Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
Re: [Mpls] Council committee turns down Lagoon Project
Thatcher Imboden: Or why don't we figure out a way to offer discounted bus passes to new renters/owners. If people in Uptown are _so_ concerned about traffic, then perhaps they should be more upset about all the new two-car garage construction that's taken place in the last year. A two-car garage makes it much more easy for people to have multiple cars, and thus drive more. [TB] You are being much to rational. And how many of those 2 (or 3) car garages require variances? The Planning Commission, a group that has a habit of evaluating projects without counting votes for the next election, approves the project. Then the council committee, a group that has a habit of making decisions on the basis of the politics of the moment, comes along and votes against the project. The Lake Calhoun area has many taller buildings. Lake Point is 20 stories (242 feet), Calhoun Towers is 21 stories (191 feet), Calhoun Beach Club 9 stories (118 feet), the new Calhoun Beach apartments come in at 12 stories as does 3141 Dean Court. The Council committee appears to be acting arbirarily in voting down this project. Perhaps the whole Council will not be so arbitrary. CM Gary Schiff: We were willing to do 10 stories. is the quote from the Strib. If you can accept 10, why not 11, 12 or 13? This is well set back from any street, it certainly isn't a canyon affect. NIMBY has lived again, too bad NIMBY isn't a cat, they only have 9 lives. Terrell Brown Loring Park REMINDERS: 1. Be civil! Please read the NEW RULES at http://www.e-democracy.org/rules. If you think a member is in violation, contact the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. For state and national discussions see: http://e-democracy.org/discuss.html For external forums, see: http://e-democracy.org/mninteract Minneapolis Issues Forum - A Civil City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:mpls@mnforum.org Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
Re: [Mpls] Council committee turns down Lagoon Project
Two lines in the Strib story that caught my attention: The council members and Mayor R.T. Rybak took pains to praise Ackerberg's work in the city and his vision, but they sent him away defeated and uncertain of his next step with the site he controls. and Rybak, who is seeking reelection, also recently came out against the proposal. Minneapolis may have the distinction of being the only city in the country with a mayor who is against development. Here we have a proposal that required no city subsidy and increase the tax base of the city. Then the Mayor, who likes to cry about how poor the city is and how it can't afford things like police services, coming out against more revenue coming into the city's coffers. What's wrong with this picture? It wasn't all that long ago that members of the Council would defer to the member in whose ward a project is located (yes, they all like to stick their fingers into the 7th ward), and yes the Councilmember from the 10th was a supporter of the projects. Looks like it's time to find some folks who might engage their brains to occupy some offices at City Hall. Terrell Brown Loring Park - Original Message - From: List manager [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: mpls@mnforum.org Sent: Thursday, June 23, 2005 1:56 PM Subject: [Mpls] Council committee turns down Lagoon Project Sez da Strib: Uptown won't be getting up-sized just yet. The Minneapolis City Council Zoning and Planning Committee said no today to a privately funded project in the trendy entertainment district by the Ackerberg Group and Clark Gassen. Their vision would have turned a 287-space surface parking lot behind the Lagoon Theater into a residential-office-commercial complex with a plaza, two towers, an expanded movie house and underground parking. http://www.startribune.com/stories/587/5472788.html David Brauer List manager Big news day! REMINDERS: 1. Be civil! Please read the NEW RULES at http://www.e-democracy.org/rules. If you think a member is in violation, contact the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. For state and national discussions see: http://e-democracy.org/discuss.html For external forums, see: http://e-democracy.org/mninteract Minneapolis Issues Forum - A Civil City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:mpls@mnforum.org Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls REMINDERS: 1. Be civil! Please read the NEW RULES at http://www.e-democracy.org/rules. If you think a member is in violation, contact the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. For state and national discussions see: http://e-democracy.org/discuss.html For external forums, see: http://e-democracy.org/mninteract Minneapolis Issues Forum - A Civil City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:mpls@mnforum.org Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
Re: [Mpls] Early-morning noise
- Original Message - From: David Brauer [EMAIL PROTECTED] ...I'm looking forward to the red-light cams (though I think the 30-day warning period before tickets are issued is an invitation to hot rodders to watch themselves speed on the web). That said ... construction on a SUNDAY? Why did crews have to pound pavement on a Sunday morning? [TB] The city is running short on cash and Mayor Rybak wants to get the project done so that Big Brother will start bringing in the cash a couple of days sooner? Terrell Brown Loring Park REMINDERS: 1. Be civil! Please read the NEW RULES at http://www.e-democracy.org/rules. If you think a member is in violation, contact the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. For state and national discussions see: http://e-democracy.org/discuss.html For external forums, see: http://e-democracy.org/mninteract Minneapolis Issues Forum - A Civil City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:mpls@mnforum.org Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
[Mpls] Uptown/Lagoon
Dorie Rae Gallagher said Getting back to Uptown...we have a Downtown...we don't need two. I can see some 3-4 stories but that is personal preference. I like to see sky, open spaces, unique buildings and not rubber stamped housing that's 12 stories creating shadows and mold on the neighbors. just am not into high density housing. Never lived in an apartment building where I needed to walk down a hallway to apartment such and such and become known by that number. Nick Responds: No one will cofuse Uptown for Downtown because of 12 a story building. What would be unique about more 3 and 4 story buildings? Tall buildings do not block out the sky especially at 12 stories. In fact a tall slender building can allow a developer to preserve more open space than a shorter, squatter building. Wouldn't a 12 story building be the epitomy of unique in Uptown at this point? [TB] The Lagoon project may bring back to Uptown the uniqueness that it has lost. A decade, even more, ago there were more of the one of a kind shops, shops that you wouldn't find anywhere else. Now Uptown has The Gap, Kinko's, McDonald's and Panera Bread as its largest fixtures. With the possible exception of McDonald's, each of those places does have some redeeming value, but they all have other locations that on a nice day many of us might even consider walking to. Instead of fighting change, embrace it. A few hundred day time workers who will not only shop places on their lunch break, but tell others of that special place they find will enable those one of a kind places to exist. Add a strong residential core and those places can even thrive. Minneapolis will never be Tokyo, we'll never even have the density of New York City. That doesn't mean that we can't be smart enough to mix uses. There is no rational reason to create retail/commercial space that doesn't have residential above it. While Uptown may currently be losing out to Northeast as a desirable developing area to live, it doesn't necessarily need to. It to has people interested in making improvements to the area and several sites that are prime for improvement. Rather than complain that property tax rates are increasing at to rapid of a rate, its time to support projects that not only make the city more desirable but increase that tax base at the same time. That is a way that the city may be able to afford the level of service that we seem to desire. Terrell Brown Loring Park REMINDERS: 1. Be civil! Please read the NEW RULES at http://www.e-democracy.org/rules. If you think a member is in violation, contact the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. For state and national discussions see: http://e-democracy.org/discuss.html For external forums, see: http://e-democracy.org/mninteract Minneapolis Issues Forum - A Civil City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:mpls@mnforum.org Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
[Mpls] RT: Can you be intellectually honest?
Just saw the Peter/RT piece on Almanac. The stadium question was asked, RT says I'd rather see what Denver did and have a multi-county tax What RT doesn't want us to remember that in Denver it is the City and County of Denver and as soon as you get outside the city limits of Denver you are also in another county. I'm starting to think that this act is getting just a little bit old. See you at least some of you tomorrow, Terrell Brown Loring Park REMINDERS: 1. Be civil! Please read the NEW RULES at http://www.e-democracy.org/rules. If you think a member is in violation, contact the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. For state and national discussions see: http://e-democracy.org/discuss.html For external forums, see: http://e-democracy.org/mninteract Minneapolis Issues Forum - A Civil City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:mpls@mnforum.org Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
[Mpls] Telephone call from the auto dialer
Just got a call from RT Rybaks auto dialer saying unfortunately my opponent is delivering some 'Republican style' smear attacks. Then he tells me that if I want the truth I can go to his website. It could be an interesting weekend. Terrell Brown Loring Park REMINDERS: 1. Be civil! Please read the NEW RULES at http://www.e-democracy.org/rules. If you think a member is in violation, contact the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. For state and national discussions see: http://e-democracy.org/discuss.html For external forums, see: http://e-democracy.org/mninteract Minneapolis Issues Forum - A Civil City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:mpls@mnforum.org Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
[Mpls] City Hall flag
I think it is inappropriate, even wrong, to lower the flag atop City Hall to honor a religious leader. First, in this country there is still allegedly a separation between church and state. Second, choosing this particular religious leader looks like a pandering for votes. In my memory this honor hasnt been given to the leader of Judaism, Buddhism, Hinduism, even Lutheranism. In this case you have chosen to honor someone who was leading in a direction that many in this city dont want to go. He was anti-choice (send your check to NARAL ProChoice America to fight on that one), anti-gay (Outfront MN will take your check to fight on that one) and anti-woman (Emilys list will help the more rational minded there). Lets stop the charade and put the flag back at the top of the pole where it belongs. Terrell Brown 110 West Grant Street (Loring Park) Minneapolis 55403 REMINDERS: 1. Be civil! Please read the NEW RULES at http://www.e-democracy.org/rules. If you think a member is in violation, contact the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. For state and national discussions see: http://e-democracy.org/discuss.html For external forums, see: http://e-democracy.org/mninteract Minneapolis Issues Forum - A Civil City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:mpls@mnforum.org Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
[Mpls] Planetarium in, Shubert and Lake of the Isles out.
I just skimmed through the bonding bill. Yes the planetarium is in, the Shubert Theatre and Lake of the Isles projects are out. Cedar Avenue bus corridor is in. Terrell Brown Loring Park -Original Message- 1. Tracking sheet, Capital Investment Conference Committee agreement. An 8-page spreadsheet showing how much is allocated in the 2005 Capital Investment bill for various projects: http://www.house.leg.state.mn.us/fiscal/files/bond05.pdf REMINDERS: 1. Be civil! Please read the NEW RULES at http://www.e-democracy.org/rules. If you think a member is in violation, contact the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. For state and national discussions see: http://e-democracy.org/discuss.html For external forums, see: http://e-democracy.org/mninteract Minneapolis Issues Forum - A Civil City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:mpls@mnforum.org Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
RE: [Mpls] Ballot Box: Rybak endorsed by Sierra Club
-Original Message- From: Craig Cox Mayor R.T. Rybak picked up his first major organizational endorsement today, when the North Star Chapter of the Sierra Club endorsed him for re-election. [TB] When looking at who is endorsed by what organizations, we need to remember that most organizations have a policy of endorsing supportive incumbents no matter how good the challenger is. More telling is to look at the answers each candidate gave to the organization's screening questionnaires and in any interviews they may conduct. It may be that an endorse the incumbent policy may result in endorsement of the candidate that isn't best on the issues. Terrell Brown Loring Park REMINDERS: 1. Be civil! Please read the NEW RULES at http://www.e-democracy.org/rules. If you think a member is in violation, contact the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. For state and national discussions see: http://e-democracy.org/discuss.html For external forums, see: http://e-democracy.org/mninteract Minneapolis Issues Forum - A Civil City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:mpls@mnforum.org Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
Re: [Mpls] Campaign law questions
Take a look at the voter registration card, it's at: http://www.sos.state.mn.us/election/MNVRCard.pdf One piece of information it asks for is phone number, no idea why it's collected and it is optional. Voter registration lists are available to anyone campaigning for public office. Most candidates do buy the list from the Secretary of State's office. Phone numbers are easy to get. Terrell Brown Loring Park Third, I have an unlisted phone number. I simply never give it out. I am a DFL delegate but never gave my phone number to the DFL. Now I did call the Mayor's Office to ask about Rybak's mailing that he did back in January. That is the only place I can think his campaign could have gotten my phone number. Is it legal for the Mayor to harvest phone numbers from people who call him for legitimate city purposes and use them for campaign purposes? . . . Corinne Becker Phone numbers are easily available online. Published numbers are very easy, unlisted are a bit harder to find, and often are not free. But still available. Searching on your name, the second site I visited told me there was an unpublished one for Corrine Becker at your address, which was available if I would pay for it. So it's not hard to find. Political campaigns, like commercial businesses, often hire someone to clean their address list, including verifying/updating phone numbers. It's a pretty standard process; I'd expect the Rybak campaign did this. Harvesting them one-by-one from calls to City Hall would take way too much manual effort to be cost effective. And saving the numbers of people who called to complain about the Mayor's action, as you did, would be especially conter-effective. So it's quite likely that the Rybak campaign just had a mailing firm do a standard cleanup update on their list, and got your phone number that way. REMINDERS: 1. Be civil! Please read the NEW RULES at http://www.e-democracy.org/rules. If you think a member is in violation, contact the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. For state and national discussions see: http://e-democracy.org/discuss.html For external forums, see: http://e-democracy.org/mninteract Minneapolis Issues Forum - A Civil City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:mpls@mnforum.org Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
[Mpls] FW: SESSION DAILY: News from the House - Campaigning in apartment and condo buildings
The Legislature is considering making it easier to campaign in the apartment, condo and townhouse buildings that comprise much of Minneapolis. The House bill would allow campaign workers for a candidate access to these buildings (assuming that they can find someone to grant access), the Senate bill (sponsored by Higgins, Scheid and others) was amended in committee to include ballot issues and get out the vote drives. Given the objections some have found from those living in some of these buildings to people campaigning in these buildings it will be interesting to see their reactions to increased door knocking and lit drops (it's a lot easier and quicker to lit drop a 300 unit building than 300 houses in south Minneapolis) Terrell Brown Loring Park -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, March 14, 2005 5:26 PM To: Session Daily Listserv Subject: MPA: SESSION DAILY: News from the House SESSION DAILY http://www.house.mn/hinfo/sdaily.asp News from the House Elections A bill would permit campaign workers access to multiple-unit dwellings without the candidate. http://www.house.leg.state.mn.us/hinfo/sessiondaily.asp?yearid=2005storyid= 416 Published 3/14/05 REMINDERS: 1. Be civil! Please read the NEW RULES at http://www.e-democracy.org/rules. If you think a member is in violation, contact the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. For state and national discussions see: http://e-democracy.org/discuss.html For external forums, see: http://e-democracy.org/mninteract Minneapolis Issues Forum - A Civil City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:mpls@mnforum.org Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
RE: [Mpls] Smoking Ban
-Original Message- From Michael Atherton Sent: Tuesday, March 08, 2005 2:48 PM The problem here is when it is acceptable to limit others' choices. The Nazis (and many others) thought it was acceptable to limit the choices of Jews by restricting them to ghettos. The Puritans limited all kinds of acceptable behaviors. My position is that when someone else's behavior has no effect on you, then you have no right to restrict their choices. [TB] Now you're comparing smoking bans to the behavior of the Nazis? Get real. The behavior (smoking) does affect others. Breathing smoke, be it second hand or inhaled is a known health hazard. There is no way to safely smoke. For years it has been public policy in this country (a good policy in my opinion) to promote safe work places. Auto body shops have special rooms for painting to protect workers from inhaling dangerous fumes. Workers wear ear protection to avoid injury to their hearing. The smoking ban is merely an extension of this good public policy in an area that has been ignored for many years. Then there is another way that smoking by others affects us. Economically. When people insist on smoking, I am forced to spend money to clean the stuff out of my clothing. Probably instead of the mere smoking ban that we've passed, we should put tobacco in the same class as other drugs such as cocaine and heroin. Terrell Brown Loring Park REMINDERS: 1. Be civil! Please read the NEW RULES at http://www.e-democracy.org/rules. If you think a member is in violation, contact the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. For state and national discussions see: http://e-democracy.org/discuss.html For external forums, see: http://e-democracy.org/mninteract Minneapolis Issues Forum - A Civil City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:mpls@mnforum.org Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
RE: [Mpls] Robot calls for McLaughlin: If only robots could vote...
As a point of information at 2:15 this afternoon, I received an automated call featuring the voice or RT Rybak. According to the voice of the Mayor, if I can't make the caucus I can send a letter Looks like both of them have raised enough money to work on increasing caucus turnout. Terrell Brown Loring Park -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Dyna Sent: Monday, February 28, 2005 12:38 PM To: mpls@mnforum.org Subject: [Mpls] Robot calls for McLaughlin: If only robots could vote... First, my humblest apologies for my previous insinuation that the McLaughlin for Mayor Campaign was capable of pulling off anything even remotely resembling a conspiracy. True to form, today I received a robocall (automated message) from the McLauglin campaign denegrating fellow DFLer RT and suggesting I attend the caucuses tomorrow to support Mr. McLaughlin. REMINDERS: 1. Be civil! Please read the NEW RULES at http://www.e-democracy.org/rules. If you think a member is in violation, contact the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. For state and national discussions see: http://e-democracy.org/discuss.html For external forums, see: http://e-democracy.org/mninteract Minneapolis Issues Forum - A Civil City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:mpls@mnforum.org Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
[Mpls] Red Lights, Little Brother, and other assorted titles this thread has taken
-Original Message- From: Dorie Rae Gallagher I used to travel all over the US 50/60 thousand miles a year...never worried about drivers. As soon as I would hit the Minnesota border...tension stiffen my back along with the thought *just get me home!* We have some of the worst drivers in the Republic in this state and city and our naivity comes from the fact..we let these people drive! [TB] Granted driving habits are different in various places. I'm not sure that necessarily means on set of habits is better or worse than another. If you know the local customs, you get along just fine. In parts of the world, lane markers are considered advisory, maybe even decorative. When you don't consider them restrictive, you can get more lines of traffic moving on the same road and you don't need to build a wider road to move more traffic. Perhaps we should think outside the box, quit save some paint and get another line of traffic moving on 35W, that way we might not need to rebuild the Crosstown Commons. We let these people drive? Other than the fact that this city has a horrible public transportation system which encourages people to drive, it is rather well established that you don't stop people from driving. Look at the number of people who drive without licenses, either because they haven't bothered to get one, it has been taken away, or some short sighted bureaucrat has determined that they shouldn't be able to get one because of where they were born. (Gallagher again) Dan asks what's next...cell phones! Would love to see those ban when driving. [TB] It's difficult to favor banning telephone conversations while driving without supporting a ban on all other forms of distraction for drivers. How do you justify banning phone conversation when you have a zoning code which allows people to get something to put in their mouth at McDonalds? Is ketchup dropping in your lap any less distracting than engaging in conversation? Why ban a conversation on a telephone but allow conversation with a person (or perhaps a golden retriever) sitting next to you or in the back seat? Perhaps we should disallow multi-occupancy vehicles because the driver might get distracted by a conversation. Get real. Terrell Brown Loring Park REMINDERS: 1. Be civil! Please read the NEW RULES at http://www.e-democracy.org/rules. If you think a member is in violation, contact the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. For state and national discussions see: http://e-democracy.org/discuss.html For external forums, see: http://e-democracy.org/mninteract Minneapolis Issues Forum - A Civil City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:mpls@mnforum.org Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
RE: [Mpls] Red Light Cameras CAUSE Injuries
-Original Message- From: Leurquin, Ronald As for causing more accidents, the use of 'accidents' is very wrong. These are not accidental in any way, its poor driving habits that need to stop. [TB] No its not, Accidents is a very appropriate term. ac.ci.dent ((ks-dnt, -dnt) n. An unexpected and undesirable event, especially one resulting in damage or harm: car accidents on icy roads. ac.ci.dent Function: noun : an unexpected usually sudden event that occurs without intent or volition although sometimes through carelessness, unawareness, ignorance, or a combination of causes and that produces an unfortunate result (as an injury) for which the affected party may be entitled to relief under the law or to compensation under an insurance policy -see also UNAVOIDABLE http://dictionary.reference.com/legal/search?db=mwlawnq=unavoidableacciden t ACCIDENT Unless, of course, you are suggesting that people are intentionally running their cars into other vehicles. I'm not a fan of the photo cop systems. The assumption that the registered owner of the vehicle is the driver is flawed (if the vehicle is registered to dual owners, do they both get a ticket?). The system takes a single photo; it won't catch the 3rd car through the intersection after the light changes. If you believe the spam emails that I receive, you can defeat the system by merely painting some stuff on your plates that prevents reading the plate number. Or be creative like some of the folks in London and change on of the digits on your plate so that the tag goes to someone else. Terrell Brown Loring Park REMINDERS: 1. Be civil! Please read the NEW RULES at http://www.e-democracy.org/rules. If you think a member is in violation, contact the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. For state and national discussions see: http://e-democracy.org/discuss.html For external forums, see: http://e-democracy.org/mninteract Minneapolis Issues Forum - A Civil City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:mpls@mnforum.org Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
RE: [Mpls] A Real Minneapolis Problem
-Original Message- From: Dorothy Titus Sent: Tuesday, February 22, 2005 4:43 PM I agree with you, Michael. My car was totaled just four weeks ago by an egregious red light runner. -Original Message- From: Michael Thompson Red light running is a serious problem in this city. Serious. I've lived in many U.S. cities, to include Portland, Madison and New York City. I've driven in Europe, Central America, and in Africa. I know drivers. And nowhere I've ever driven, anywhere, have drivers been worse for red light running than here in Minneapolis. No where. ... Red lights are merely a suggestion to many drivers in this city. Apparently drivers stop at red lights if they feel like it or if it suits their timetable. ... [TB] The long established local custom in Minneapolis is that you can get 3 cars through after the light turns red. That is likely why there is a delay from the light turning red until the cross street turns green; it protects those who are not familiar with local custom from entering a dangerous intersection. The custom is so well established that MTCO busses will drop off passengers at the bus stop, then start thru come off their stop and start moving after the light turns red. Occasionally they will utilize their horn before entering the intersection. Stand for a few minutes at the corner of 9th and Marquette between 7:30 and 8:00 AM and watch the southbound busses that are well rehearsed in this maneuver. Unlike Cairo, where traffic lights are advisory unless there is a uniformed officer standing in the intersection (in Egypt the officer will record your plate number and you pay your recorded fines when you go to renew your plates), drivers in Minneapolis do stop after the light has been red for a few seconds (presumably they have then drawn the conclusion that the light will be staying red, not changing to an alternative color). The problem isn't that many drivers have a delayed reaction to the change in the lights, the problem is that some drivers what to react immediately to the change to green. When in Rome (or Minneapolis) do as the Romans (or Minneapolitans) and you will avoid all the problems. Terrell Brown Loring Park REMINDERS: 1. Be civil! Please read the NEW RULES at http://www.e-democracy.org/rules. If you think a member is in violation, contact the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. For state and national discussions see: http://e-democracy.org/discuss.html For external forums, see: http://e-democracy.org/mninteract Minneapolis Issues Forum - A Civil City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:mpls@mnforum.org Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
Re: [Mpls] Taxing Downtown Drivers
Bill Dooley Kenny - Ward 13 First it's London and now a San Francisco proposal. Does a downtown drivers tax have merit in Minneapolis? Here is the link to the SF story. (http://sfexaminer.com/articles/2005/02/15/news/20050215_ne01_toll.txt) then: Dan McGrath People live downtown these days. Alot of them. Are we to penalize them if they decide to drive out of town? Pay to leave your home? [TB] Perfect timing Bill. February 17th is the 2nd anniversary of the London congestion fee (which I wrote about back then). Its not just London, similar charges exist in Oslo, Bergan And Trondheim, Norway (since 1991 in Trondheim), Singapore, Rome (since 2001), Edinburgh, Melbourne, Australia, Dunham, England and possibly some other places that I don't know about. In London, the Mayor was the person who got the plan implemented (can anyone imagine either Rybak or McLaughlin having the guts to back such a plan?) The Mayor of London isn't a dumb guy, London discounts the fee for residents of the zone. The discount is 90% (see: http://www.cclondon.com). Oh, by the way, London not only has a Mayor with guts, it has a real mass transit system. Terrell Brown Loring Park I hate cars. If I ever get power again, I'd ban the lot - Ken Liningstone, June 1989 Maybe I can find what I wrote 2 years ago and put it in the campaign blog g REMINDERS: 1. Be civil! Please read the NEW RULES at http://www.e-democracy.org/rules. If you think a member is in violation, contact the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. For state and national discussions see: http://e-democracy.org/discuss.html For external forums, see: http://e-democracy.org/mninteract Minneapolis Issues Forum - A Civil City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:mpls@mnforum.org Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
Re: [Mpls] Stonewall Endorsements
- Original Message - From: Eva Young [EMAIL PROTECTED] In the mayor's race Rybak was not found acceptable by SDFL (snip). An acceptable rating by the caucus is perquisite to endorsement. McLaughlin was found acceptable and endorsed. I assume Rybak did not make an abide by DFL endorsement pledge this time. Did McLaughlin make that pledge? [TB] Is there a difference between not found 'acceptable' and being found not acceptable? Why should any incumbent be expected to make an abide by the endorsement pledge? Yes, I understand it with an open seat or when the incumbent is a member of another party. Rybak is an incumbent, we expect him to be on the ballot of he so desires. Generally parties support their incumbents. What has this guy done that would lead the party to support someone else? Are they not happy with the what he has done to improve the city's budget mess? Terrell Brown Loring Park REMINDERS: 1. Be civil! Please read the NEW RULES at http://www.e-democracy.org/rules. If you think a member is in violation, contact the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. For state and national discussions see: http://e-democracy.org/discuss.html For external forums, see: http://e-democracy.org/mninteract Minneapolis Issues Forum - A Civil City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:mpls@mnforum.org Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
Re: [Mpls] Translations for election year mumbo-jumbo....
--- Victoria Heller [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: TIF (Tax Increment Financing) - Private entity gets the cash, taxpayers get the debt, plus interest. Taxpayers also FORFEIT property tax revenue from the TIF district for 10 to 40 years. Cedar-Riverside TIF district is in year 35. Minneapolis now has 103 TIF districts, and is FORFEITING $69 MILLION ANNUALLY. [TB] Levels of distortion only seen on Wednesday night television need to be rebutted: We should remember that in Minneapolis the TIF tap has been pretty much cut off. Gone are the days when every downtown project had a subsidy. A good part of the reason is that those responsible for The Great TIF Grab were voted out of office (remember SSB, Cherryhomes, Campbell), a couple of others took up temporary residence in a federal housing program. By way of example, the recently announced Lund's store includes no subsidy. For years we had heard that a downtown grocery store would require a subsidy, something that apparently was not true. The current crop of council members has been reasonably responsible in the use of TIF. In some cases TIF is an appropriate development tool. The assumption that we would get $69 million were it not for TIF is flawed. Much of that development would not have taken place. In some cases TIF lead to other neighboring development that added to the tax base. In no case does the city get less money because of TIF than it got before the district was established. Taxpayers don't forfeit tax revenue in a TIF district. The reality is that they dedicate the additional revenue that comes as a result of the development to an economic development project while cities, counties, etc. continue to get the revenue they have always received from those properties. Terrell Brown Loring Park REMINDERS: 1. Be civil! Please read the NEW RULES at http://www.e-democracy.org/rules. If you think a member is in violation, contact the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. For state and national discussions see: http://e-democracy.org/discuss.html For external forums, see: http://e-democracy.org/mninteract Minneapolis Issues Forum - A Civil City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:mpls@mnforum.org Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
[Mpls] Allina Jobs in West Phillips
- Original Message - From: Constance Nompelis [EMAIL PROTECTED] Yes but the Allina jobs (which have people attached to them) are coming from Golden Valley, as I recall. These people are not going to move in, they're just going to commute. They're not going to switch banks or schools for their kids. I would even be willing to bet that (by and large) they won't leave the building for lunch since they'll have the little food-court thing right inside. [TB] Actually they are coming from a number of locations around the metro area, some from Loring Park (the old hospital site). Allina wanted to consolitate into one location. I'd rather have it in Minneapolis than somewhere else. The jobs leaving Loring Park leave an area of approximately 2 city blocks (one just a surface parking lot) to be redeveloped. Planning is already in process for what should be a positive addition for this neighborhood. Phillips isn't the only winner here. Terrell Brown Loring Park (blog coming soon) REMINDERS: 1. Be civil! Please read the NEW RULES at http://www.e-democracy.org/rules. If you think a member is in violation, contact the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. For state and national discussions see: http://e-democracy.org/discuss.html For external forums, see: http://e-democracy.org/mninteract Minneapolis Issues Forum - A Civil City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:mpls@mnforum.org Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
[Mpls] Rybak's blog
If all it takes to run for Mayor is a blog and maybe a website (plus a
$15 filing fee), well This could be fun.
A couple of remarks in today's Strib article:
http://www.startribune.com/stories/462/5213290.html
He said he had delivered on his pledge to be a visible, reform-minded
mayor who was both a cheerleader and fierce defender for the city
and its residents.
Comment: I'll give him visible and cheerleader
And from Peter McLaughlin:
The issues facing the city are critical. We really can't afford four
more years of lack of attention to the public schools, public safety
and four more years of hostility to the neighborhoods. That's what this
campaign is going to be about, and actual achievements, McLaughlin
said.
Comment: If you want to fix the schools, run for school board. The
Mayor has no responsibility for the Minneapolis Public Schools, the
only connection is the name Minneapolis. By the way, the Minnesota
state constitution declares that education is a state responsibility,
the management of which has been delegated to independent school
districts. How well the state has been keeping up its end of the
bargain is open to debate, the Mayor's office doesn't have a seat at
the table.
The Mayor's blog:
http://rtrybakformayor.blogspot.com/2005/01/welcome-to-rts-blog.html#comments
At present there are 5 comments, 3 have been removed by the blog
administrator. The other 2 say nice things. Rosemary Woods died
recently, so we know she isn't responsible for the missing information.
The Mayor's links page:
http://www.rtrybak.com/index.asp?Type=B_BASICSEC={4455EC11-BE24-40F9-9A11-7E8EC2E24DAA}
has these links:
City of Minneapolis- Mayor's Office
www.ci.minneapolis.mn.us/mayor
Star Tribune
www.startribune.com
Minneapolis Observer
www.mplsobserver.com
City Pages
www.citypages.com
... and only those.
David. Did you publish something that the Mayor didn't like? Does he
think you might?
Terrell Brown
Equal opportunity cynic in Loring Park
terrell at terrellbrown dot org
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[Mpls] North Oaks Babble
--- Victoria Heller [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: [Jim Mork] I hereby inaugurate a Quit Minneapolis Now. [Vicky Heller] You are ten years behind. The exodus began some time ago. [TB] Perhaps that explains why the population of Minneapolis increased in the last decade (US Gov't census data). Or is that an inodus Maybe it explains the hundreds, make that couple of thousand, housing units underconstruction and planned for downtown Minneapolis. http://www.skywaynews.net/content/current/front/condo_map.pdf Maybe it explains the major office complex, retail and residential development recently announced for the Uptown area. http://www.swjournal.com/articles/2005/01/25/news/news01.txt To add to what was recently added, is currently under construction and was proposed since that article was written for the south of Lake Street part of that area. To repeat an earlier comment, you can have your own opinion, you can't have your own facts. --- Lee R Eklund [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Jim Mork (Resist America) writes: I hereby inaugurate a Quit Minneapolis Now. And don't try to partition the 13th Ward into a separate Republican city,e either. I wouldnt be at all surprised to see state Republicans do such a thing! Lee responds: Jim did not attend the most recent meeting where it was decided to make the 7th ward a Republican utopia, a land of milk and honey. [TB] As a resident of the 7th ward for what is getting close to a decade, I object to the extraction plan. Why fix what isn't broken (my list of things that don't need to be fixed probably extends well beyond the boundaries of Minneapolis). It should be noted that we don't produce milk (and probably not honey either, although there may be a hive somewhere) in the 7th. Even when the animals were roaming one end of Nicollet Island, that wasn't in the 7th. What may be now: u·to·pi·an. often Utopia An ideally perfect place, especially in its social, political, and moral aspects. http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=utopia What is being suggested (by both Lee and Vicky): u·to·pi·an. An impractical, idealistic scheme for social and political reform. (same source) I can't think of any better place to live (and work) in this metro area than the 7th Ward of Minneapolis. Please keep the silly ideas way out in the 'burbs. Terrell Brown Loring Park REMINDERS: 1. Be civil! Please read the NEW RULES at http://www.e-democracy.org/rules. If you think a member is in violation, contact the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. For state and national discussions see: http://e-democracy.org/discuss.html For external forums, see: http://e-democracy.org/mninteract Minneapolis Issues Forum - A Civil City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:mpls@mnforum.org Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
Re: [Mpls] Politicking and the NRP...Wake up and smell the deficits!
--- Victoria Heller [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: They are supposed to deal with Potholes, Police, Parks, and Pyrofighters. That's it. [Note: Hennepin County provides libraries] [TB] Where did you find your list? I always thought it was a bit longer and included such things as snow plowing, garbage collection, libraries, maybe even rescue of the Mayor's car from snow banks. Nor should they be giving FREE garages to Listmembers [TB] Names please. Who got the free garages? The daily unsubstantiated charges are getting old. How many Republicans got a taste of the $200+ million NRP pie? If all of that money was sucked up by local Democrats, Minneapolis has committed a huge violation of Constitutional law: Using public money to fund a political party! [TB] Where does the Constitution say anything about a political party, any political party? Let's have an audit. Had one. Every neighborhood group getting NRP money is audited. In Loring Park its by the State Auditor. Last time I checked, the State Auditor was a Republican. Last I checked she'd changed her name to Anderson but hadn't changed political parties. Remember the line from the old TV show just the facts mam, just the facts. Real facts please, I'll get my fiction at Borders or Amazon. Terrell Brown Loring Park REMINDERS: 1. Be civil! Please read the NEW RULES at http://www.e-democracy.org/rules. If you think a member is in violation, contact the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. For state and national discussions see: http://e-democracy.org/discuss.html For external forums, see: http://e-democracy.org/mninteract Minneapolis Issues Forum - A Civil City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:mpls@mnforum.org Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
Re: [Mpls] RE: Street Sign Colors
- Original Message - From: Jennifer L. Rubenzer [EMAIL PROTECTED] Because I work with relocation buyers coming to the Minneapolis area, I have this information in their welcome packet... Street Signs are color coded: o Blue sign - an arterial street with heavy traffic. o Green sign - a street running north and south. o Brown sign - a street running east to west. I sited www.tholt.com as the source. -J Jennifer Rubenzer Plymouth [TB] Somedays I think people just make stuff up and post it. A quick look at the City of Minneapolis web site reveals: Snow Emergency routes are marked in two ways: RED Snow Emergency signs BLUE street name signs. Streets that are NOT Snow Emergency routes have green or brown street name signs. http://www.ci.minneapolis.mn.us/snow/FAQ/snowemergencyroute.asp also (toward the bottom of page 1) http://www.ci.minneapolis.mn.us/events-management/Block-event-ordn-6-03.pdf Perhaps Plymouth uses a different system. Terrell Brown Loring Park REMINDERS: 1. Be civil! Please read the NEW RULES at http://www.e-democracy.org/rules. If you think a member is in violation, contact the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. For state and national discussions see: http://e-democracy.org/discuss.html For external forums, see: http://e-democracy.org/mninteract Minneapolis Issues Forum - A Civil City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:mpls@mnforum.org Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
Re: [Mpls] traffic violations
--- Leurquin, Ronald [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Does anyone know the status of the much discussed camera cops for ticketing persons running red lights? I personally am hoping we get them sooner rather than later. I was privileged to watch two different semi run the light at 50th and Hiawatha this morning. [TB] Come downtown to the corner of 12th and the Mall some morning and watch the east bound MTCO buses run the light. It's not even close, they start through the intersection several seconds after the light turns. For some reason, afternoon bus drivers seem to be better behaved. I'm not a big fan of the lights, it seems to be a guilty until proven innocent arrangement. There appear to be some abuses in cities that have installed them, camera vendors work on a commission basis which is a disincentive to do things right. Terrell Brown Loring Park REMINDERS: 1. Be civil! Please read the NEW RULES at http://www.e-democracy.org/rules. If you think a member is in violation, contact the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. For state and national discussions see: http://e-democracy.org/discuss.html For external forums, see: http://e-democracy.org/mninteract Minneapolis Issues Forum - A Civil City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:mpls@mnforum.org Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
Re: [Mpls] Turbocharged Truth-in-Taxation: NO!
--- Nathan Hunstad [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: What exactly is the point of Turbocharged Truth-in-Taxation? Since the Governor's budget plans include so many property tax increases, it sounds like this is a way for him to propose new programs while allowing conservatives to prevent coming up with any funding for them, letting him get the credit for at least trying. I'm sorry, I'm not buying it. These kind of reverse referenda are completely unnecessary. I fully trust our school board members and the city council to make the right decisions with regards to property taxes. If they make what I consider to be the wrong choices, then I can vote them out of office. No need for any postcards. [TB] There is some evidence that Minneapolis voters are willing to accept higher taxes. We have approved both additional levies for schools and $400 (?) million for a new library. In recent elections, taxation hasn't been a major issue. Some of the areas where money has been spent (ie subsidies for Target Corp.) yes, but not the general level of taxation. There are some arguements supporting money being spent at the local level (or any level for that matter) being raised by taxes at that level. It makes it clear where the money is going rather than the city spending money that comes from local taxes, the feds, the state and who knows where else. The counter arguement is that the feds and state are more efficient in collecting money since they collect it from so many more taxpayers. Paying for Minneapolis schools clearly isn't solely a Minneapolis expense. The state constitution states that education is a responsibility of the state, the state having assigned the work of actually managing the process to its independent school districts. MPS receives $x per student to pay for that education, the problem is that $x may not be enough to adequately educate the kids. (I say may not as I make no claim in being an expert in education finance or education efficiency, I don't know what the appropriate amount is). Minneapolis voters have still been willing to kick in extra money to fund its schools. Minneapolis isn't an island. City services are used by many that don't live here, that don't pay taxes here. It is appropriate that they pay for these services either via money from the state or a tax (likely sales and/or income) that covers people who don't live in the city. The Pawlenty claim that taxes haven't been increased is bogus. Then you cut state money coming to Minneapolis such that Minneapolis (and other cities and towns) needs to raise property tax revenues by 8%, that is a tax increase. There was no compensating decrease. Forcing referendums on taxes is a bad idea. California has already tried that resulting in a financial situation that makes ours look good by comparision. Sure, adopt someone else's good ideas, but don't copy their mistakes. Terrell Brown Loring Park REMINDERS: 1. Be civil! Please read the NEW RULES at http://www.e-democracy.org/rules. If you think a member is in violation, contact the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. For state and national discussions see: http://e-democracy.org/discuss.html For external forums, see: http://e-democracy.org/mninteract Minneapolis Issues Forum - A Civil City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:mpls@mnforum.org Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
Re: [Mpls] Jim Bernstein
--- Jennifer L. Rubenzer [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I've observed through your posts your loathing of conservative people and principles and I wonder if someone who can't control their hate speech on a board such as this can be effective in a government situation. [TB] Having known Jim Bernstein for a decade or so, I know he's not a person who spews hate speech. Sure he disagrees with the neocons on social issues, but its a disagreement, not hate of any group. And, yes by the way, he is willing to share his opinion. He is afterall a person who was respected enough by a Governor of Minnesota that he was appointed Commissioner of the Dept. of Commerce (and confirmed by the state Senate) then respected enough by the Chief Judge of District Court to be appointed a member of the city charter commission, then respected enough by the members of that commission to be elected its Chair. Interesting that the attacks on Jim Bernstein are coming from North Oaks and Plymouth, not anyone in Minneapolis. Terrell Brown Loring Park REMINDERS: 1. Think a member has violated the rules? Email the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. For state and national discussions see: http://e-democracy.org/discuss.html For external forums, see: http://e-democracy.org/mninteract Minneapolis Issues Forum - A City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:mpls@mnforum.org Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
Re: [MPLS] Observer link to stadium contoversy...it's the MPRB and PARADE
--- Elizabeth Wielinski [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Jon Gurban was at the legislature (with I am sure the legislative committee chair Walt Dziedzic and lobbyist Brian Rice) asking for money to rebuild Parade Stadium. Thank you Councilperson Goodman for asking if they had approached the community. [TB] Last time I looked at the City's bonding priorities, I didn't see anything about Parade Stadium (or any stadium for that matter) What I did see was: (at http://www.ci.minneapolis.mn.us/legislativeaffairs/ ) 1. Minnesota Planetarium and Space Discovery Center: $24 million to complete design, construct, furnish and equip the planetarium 2. University Research Park, in cooperation with the University of Minnesota: Funding for the Bioscience Development Fund so that infrastructure improvements of $13 million to the University Research Park can proceed in a timely manner 3. Former Sears store Project: $5 million to be used at the site of the former Sears store near Chicago and Lake Streets to pre-design, design, acquire, construct public infrastructure, and support development 4. Minnesota Shubert Performing Arts and Education Center: $10 million to construction, furnishing and equip the center I'd certainly rate any of those above Parade Stadium. Even the Shubert would eliminate a public eyesore although we might do just as well to simply take a wrecking ball to the thing. We certainly aren't going to see it in a bonding bill. These conflicting priorities are one reason in favor of having a single elected body in the city. Fortunately the Library Board is filled with qualified people, the Park Board is a few members short of being able to make that same claim. Terrell Brown Loring Park REMINDERS: 1. Think a member has violated the rules? Email the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. For state and national discussions see: http://e-democracy.org/discuss.html For external forums, see: http://e-democracy.org/mninteract Minneapolis Issues Forum - A City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:mpls@mnforum.org Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
RE: [Mpls] Sales Tax Increase for Police
--- Tifft, Dennis S. [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: ... The idea of raising the sales tax is an interesting idea and is worth taking a look at, not sure if I could support that at this moment. Overall, we need to take a look at the overall budget and decide what vital works is important. For vital works we need police, fire protection, clean streets, parks, etc. The questions is what our we willing to pay for. [TB] Generally I don't like the idea of dedicated taxes. In this case its a proposal to impose a new tax because the Mayor and Council don't have the political guts to use the taxing authority that the city already has to pay for what are generally considered to be needed services. The folks over at City Hall figure we'll notice an increase in our property tax, but that my co-workers and I won't notice an increase in the sales tax on lunch (which is already 10%, 6 1/2% of the state, 1/2% city wide sales tax and the bonus 3% tax because we happen to work downtown and the city thinks we should chip in extra to pay for the Convention Center). The choice that our city leaders should be making is what services we should provide at what cost, not how we should have people pay for those services that they are least likely to notice. Problem may be that everyone at City Hall knows Walter Mondale and knows what happened to him when he said that a tax increase was necessary. Walter Mondale had the guts to tell the truth, a trait not found in some of our local office holders. Terrell Brown Loring Park REMINDERS: 1. Think a member has violated the rules? Email the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. For state and national discussions see: http://e-democracy.org/discuss.html For external forums, see: http://e-democracy.org/mninteract Minneapolis Issues Forum - A City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:mpls@mnforum.org Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
Re: [Mpls] Media types continue to spread false information
Looks to me that David is correct (as usual). The legislative website shows bonding approved by the 1998 Legislature as $87,145,000 for the Minneapolis Convention Center. see: http://www.senate.leg.state.mn.us/departments/scr/freview/1998/98capexp.pdf also see: http://www.senate.leg.state.mn.us/departments/scr/freview/1998/DEBT.HTM The Senates publication Senate Briefly tells us of the bonding bill: The largest items in the capital budget bill are appropriations of $87 million for the Minneapolis convention center, $70 million for a molecular and cellular biology building at the University of Minnesota, $40 million for light rail transit in the Hiawatha Avenue corridor from downtown Minneapolis to the airport and beyond, see: http://www.senate.leg.state.mn.us/briefly/1998/brf306.pdf Looks like the ill informed is Ms. Heller or given some of the postings on this list, perhaps a prolific writer of fiction. Terrell Brown Loring Park --- Victoria Heller [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Brauer: The state approved $87 million in 1998 for the Convention Center's expansion - but that was two governors ago (remember Arne Carlson?). Heller: Wrong again David. Finance Director Patrick Born should be your source. A few months ago, I posted to this List about a mystery donor of $80 million who Minneapolitans should be thanking. The next day, Mr. Born sent me an e-mail explaining that the $80 million came from the State - for the Convention Center debt. Look it up, or better yet, call Mr. Born. No apologies necessary. Now we all know why the citizens are confused and ill-informed. REMINDERS: 1. Think a member has violated the rules? Email the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. For state and national discussions see: http://e-democracy.org/discuss.html For external forums, see: http://e-democracy.org/mninteract Minneapolis Issues Forum - A City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:mpls@mnforum.org Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
Re: [Mpls] Green Party vs DFL, or fusion (ward lines)
--- [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: After the DFL's naked power play in trying to dispose of what they consider these upstart Greens who took two of THEIR Council seats away, do you really think they're likely to make a friendly exception to their usual policy of endorsing only their own candidates for us? If you remember the gerrymandering, you remember that one day the STAR TRIBUNE reported an agreement on ward boundaries that were acceptable to Greens. The VERY NEXT DAY, the STAR TRIBUNE reported the new gerrymandered boundaries! In a maneuver worthy of the most corrupt, ward healing political bosses, the DFL had moved OVERNIGHT to crush the upstart Greens. They certainly weren't going to let the peon voters kic k over the traces and start electing NEW PARTIES! AND DEMOCRACY BE DAMNED!! èTBè Given the makeup of the Redistricting Commission (2 DFL, 2 Republican, 2 Independence, the majority and minority caucus reps appointed by the council and the chair selected by those 8) its difficult to see how the DFL gerrymandered the thing. To the contrary, they would have needed to be rather creative with their lines not to have paired any incumbent council members into the same new ward. Zimmerman could well win in his new ward, if they tryed to gerrymander him out, they could have drawn a less favorable ward. Johnson-Lee may have been the §anybody but Jackie§ candidate similar to what Rybak was in the Mayor's race. They both may have their work cut out for them to win in '05 Terrell Brown Loring Park (sorry about the funky symbols, I haven't figured out this internet shop's funky keyboard.) REMINDERS: 1. Think a member has violated the rules? Email the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. For state and national discussions see: http://e-democracy.org/discuss.html For external forums, see: http://e-democracy.org/mninteract Minneapolis Issues Forum - A City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
Re: [Mpls] City Pages story on assessments
--- Victoria Heller [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: [Vicky Heller]and who do you think represents the City in court? Hint: The Minneapolis assessors! It seems to me that they are not doing a very good job; either assessing in the first place, or defending their calculations. §TB§ Can you provide the name of ANY city assessor who has the license to practice law that would be needed to represent the city in court? And what council member or Mayor would let the city be represented by someone not licensed to practice law? All of our guys/gals are sharper than that. Terrell Brown Loring Park REMINDERS: 1. Think a member has violated the rules? Email the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. For state and national discussions see: http://e-democracy.org/discuss.html For external forums, see: http://e-democracy.org/mninteract Minneapolis Issues Forum - A City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
Re: [Mpls] Strib: McLaughlin running
--- Dean Carlson [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Strib says McLaughlin will announce run for mayor this week. Frankly since he's part of the old SSB crowd that RT trounced last time, I'm not sure what kind of a shot he has. But it should be fun. [TB] I think it would be tough to pin SSB on McLaughlin. The 2 of them never did serve together. McLaughlin has never been part of Minneapolis city government. Rybak may have had more than just a little bit of luck getting out of a rather crowded primary. With over a dozen on the ballot, including at least 4 credible candidates, it doesn't take a big vote percentage to make it to the general election. While Rybak doesn't have the negatives that SSB (and several departed members of the council) had, what has he done that he can point to as reasons he should be reelected? He probably hasn't done anything really bad, however, someone could certainly try to pin the rise in residential real estate taxes on him. We'll hear more than one person telling how much increase they have seen since he took office. We're going to hear about cuts in police and fire. It may not be his fault, it happened on his watch. Terrell Brown Loring Park REMINDERS: 1. Think a member has violated the rules? Email the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. For state and national discussions see: http://e-democracy.org/discuss.html For external forums, see: http://e-democracy.org/mninteract Minneapolis Issues Forum - A City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
Re: [Mpls] Disappearing Middle Class?
--- Scott McGerik [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The middle class may be shrinking but that is because they are moving up and out of the middle class. That's right, the upper class is getting bigger because more people are moving into it. Bruce Bartlett lays this out in the Washington Times at http://www.washingtontimes.com/commentary/20040831-101020-1546r.htm [TB] Give me a break. The Washington Times as an honest or reliable news source? According the the article in 1980 middle class was income between $25,000 and $75,000 and in 2003 middle class was income between (ya, you guessed it) $25 and $75 thousand. Does anyone other than the Washington Times really believe you can use the same absolute standards for 1980 and then again after 23 years of inflation? McGerik again: How can the political leadership of Minneapolis help the poor? It can reduce spending and, thus, taxes. Taxes take from those who are striving to move up the economic ladder. Property taxes are particularly onerous because they are levied regardless of income. In the case of rental property, which is taxed at a rate higher than homesteads, the taxes are passed onto the renters, many of which are poorer than homeowners. Sure, some of these renters qualify for property tax rebates, but, until that rebate check arrives, we have deprived them of their income. Better to reduce taxes and never have to give rebates than to take too much and then give it back later. [TB] You can blame the city for a number of things. The property tax structure in Minnesota isn't one of them. The city can do absolutely nothing to correct the fact that rental residences are taxed at a much higher rate than homesteaded ones. The only way you can solve problems is to go to those that can really fix them. Throwing blame at others gets no where. Terrell Brown Loring Park REMINDERS: 1. Think a member has violated the rules? Email the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. For state and national discussions see: http://e-democracy.org/discuss.html For external forums, see: http://e-democracy.org/mninteract Minneapolis Issues Forum - A City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
[Mpls] Minneapolis developer guilty of bribery
Minneapolis developer Basim Sabri was found guilty on three counts of bribery Tuesday by a federal jury in St. Paul. http://www.startribune.com/stories/462/5124730.html Terrell Brown Loring Park REMINDERS: 1. Think a member has violated the rules? Email the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. For state and national discussions see: http://e-democracy.org/discuss.html For external forums, see: http://e-democracy.org/mninteract Minneapolis Issues Forum - A City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
Re: [Mpls] Riverfront Whitney Hotel value drops like a rock
--- Victoria Heller [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Two of my own properties, which are side by side and attached by a common wall, are another example. One building went up by 29% for next year while the other dropped by 5%. Presumably you will appeal the drop. I'm sure someone here can help you find the forms. Terrell Brown Loring Park REMINDERS: 1. Think a member has violated the rules? Email the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. For state and national discussions see: http://e-democracy.org/discuss.html For external forums, see: http://e-democracy.org/mninteract Minneapolis Issues Forum - A City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
[Mpls] Finally: Downtown gets groceries.
Strib: Lunds announced plans to open two stores in 2006, one in the spring at 313 Central Av. SE in the larger Eastgate development and the other in the fall at 1201 Hennepin Av. S. in Loring Park. Lunds plans a 15,000- to 18,000-square-foot store at the first site and a 12,000-square-foot store at the second one, down from the traditional 20,000-square-foot store. http://www.startribune.com/stories/535/5110046.html Comment: Only 2 more years and I'll be walking to the grocery store again. Terrell Brown Loring Park REMINDERS: 1. Think a member has violated the rules? Email the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. For state and national discussions see: http://e-democracy.org/discuss.html For external forums, see: http://e-democracy.org/mninteract Minneapolis Issues Forum - A City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
RE: [Mpls] Re:Smoking
--- Michael Atherton [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I believe that it should be the purview of each individual to make such decisions as long as do not forcibly intrude on the rights of others to do the same. [TB] Problem is you are intruding on the rights of others to have a healthy life. You don't have the right to do damage to another person, that is the reason that a deer hunter from St. Paul is sitting in a Wisconsin jail. It's the same concept, one is just a little quicker. Terrell Brown Loring Park REMINDERS: 1. Think a member has violated the rules? Email the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. For state and national discussions see: http://e-democracy.org/discuss.html For external forums, see: http://e-democracy.org/mninteract Minneapolis Issues Forum - A City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
Re: [Mpls] Theatre Study Committee Recommendations
--- Jordan S. Kushner [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Any information on contributions to council members from interested parties? [TB] In Minneapolis campaign finance reports only need to list contributors who give over $100 in a calander year. In non-election years the limit on contributions that can be accepted is $100 per person meaning that there haven't been any reported contributions since the last election year or 2001. (Election year limits are $500 for city wide race (Mayor, Park Board at large), $300 for Council Members) That being said, at least some of the principals have been seen at fundraisers, they likely gave the 100 bucks. I don't think you're buying any of these folks for a $100 campaign contribution ... even a $300 contribution. Until Minneapolis has public financing of campaigns, we're going to have to live with the contributions. Terrell Brown Loring Park REMINDERS: 1. Think a member has violated the rules? Email the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. For state and national discussions see: http://e-democracy.org/discuss.html For external forums, see: http://e-democracy.org/mninteract Minneapolis Issues Forum - A City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
RE: [Mpls] City Council and GLBT rights
-Original Message- Don Jorovsky I have always been proud that Minneapolis was one of the first cities in the nation to adopt a gay rights ordinance -- I think it was in 1973. Since then, the city has been supportive of gay, lesbian and transgender rights in many ways, and I hope that trend continues and grows. So you can imagine my surprise to read the following op-ed piece in yesterday's Pioneer Press: http://www.twincities.com/mld/twincities/news/opinion/10207397.htm .leaders such as Minneapolis 5th Ward Council Member Natalie Johnson Lee.have added their voices of support for biblical marriage. [TB] She doesn't believe in the principals of her party does she? 5. Sexual Orientation and Gender Identity In keeping with the Green Key Values of diversity, social justice and feminism, we support full legal and political equality for all persons, regardless of sex, gender, or sexual orientation. a. The Green Party affirms the rights of all individuals to freely choose intimate partners, regardless of their sex, gender, or sexual orientation. http://www.gp.org/platform/2004/socjustice.html#999077 Or as David Cobb said: He noted that the Green Party has included support for same-sex marriage in its party platform for the past decade. The Green Party has been providing that leadership for a long time, and not because it's the politically correct thing to do, but because, damn it all, it's the right thing to do, Cobb said. http://www.washblade.com/2004/10-15/news/national/green.cfm Now, coming into the year where she is up for reelection, she shows her true beliefs. Not as a Green, but as a true right-winger promoting discrimination. This Councilmember needs to go. Terrell Brown Loring Park REMINDERS: 1. Think a member has violated the rules? Email the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. For state and national discussions see: http://e-democracy.org/discuss.html For external forums, see: http://e-democracy.org/mninteract Minneapolis Issues Forum - A City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
[Mpls] It ain't no giveaway (Minneapolis theatres)
--- Roxana Orrell [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Sorry, there's no misunderstanding. Accuracy counts, and thanks for the technical correction, but there's one thing that's clear - Clear Channel would be running our theaters. [TB] That's not what I've understood from reading a couple of articles. It's been my understanding that the local company owned/run by Tom Hoch, Fred Krone and Lee Lynch would run the theatres (as they do now), with a non profit taking ownership of the buildings. The articles were very clear that the contract provides that Clear Channel will NOT own the buildings. Clear Channel would be involved in booking SOME of the shows that appear in the theatre (as it does now), the local group would continue to book SOME shows into the theatres (as they do now). It seems that the current arrangement is working rather well. I see no advantage in letting the Ordway monopolize the Twin Cities theatre market. Competition is generally a good thing. Why let the lower quality product take over? Terrell Brown Loring Park REMINDERS: 1. Think a member has violated the rules? Email the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. For state and national discussions see: http://e-democracy.org/discuss.html For external forums, see: http://e-democracy.org/mninteract Minneapolis Issues Forum - A City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
[Mpls] Fwd: [clpc] Is Panhandling a Problem in Your Neighborhood?
From Stevens Square: As you may know, Minneapolis' panhandling ordinance has been revised; now the emphasis is on aggressive panhandling, but it's taking awhile for citizens to learn about this. A common misunderstanding is that, in general, panhandling is no longer a crime. The Stevens Square Community Organization has established a work group to explore the issue; its mission is to: Educate neighborhood residents about the new aggressive solicitation ordinance, helping them distinguish between behavior which is legal and that which is a crime; Educate the public about the impact of panhandling and aggressive solicitation on the community; Teach people how to deal with and prevent panhandling and aggressive solicitation. Until a recent KSTP Investigative Report on the subject, we thought the problem was pretty much an urban, inner city one. See http://www.kstp.com/article/stories/S4133.html?cat=5 Would you and/or your neighborhood group like to join us in our effort? If so, please contact: Dave Delvoye, SSCO Safety Coordinator 1905 3rd Ave. S., 2nd floor Minneapolis, MN 55404 (612) 871-7307 [EMAIL PROTECTED] Terrell Brown Loring Park REMINDERS: 1. Think a member has violated the rules? Email the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. For state and national discussions see: http://e-democracy.org/discuss.html For external forums, see: http://e-democracy.org/mninteract Minneapolis Issues Forum - A City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
[Mpls] John Olson: How come Minneapolis doesn't clean itself up?
From today's Strib http://www.startribune.com/stories/1519/5077456.html Possible taking a blame it on the city page from a resident of North Oaks, Olson claims: But here on this side of town, we've found another obstacle course: angry drunks and meth heads who beg in traffic and trail our female coworkers to their cars. The City Council also voted to protect this activity, citing that other amendment that promises angry drunks and meth heads the right to trail female office workers to their cars. [TB] Seems it was a District Court, not the Council that said begging is protected speech. What the Council actually did was propose a new ordinance to ban aggressive begging. The effectiveness of an aggessive begging ordinance might be open for debate, however, it is an issue that the Council has attempted to deal with. To a certain extent I needed to smile and admire the honesty of a guy whose sign said need money for beer, honesty he learned neither from an advertising guy or a politician. Terrell Brown Loring Park REMINDERS: 1. Think a member has violated the rules? Email the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. For state and national discussions see: http://e-democracy.org/discuss.html For external forums, see: http://e-democracy.org/mninteract Minneapolis Issues Forum - A City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
Re: [Mpls] Nicollet Hotel Block
--- Victoria Heller [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Vicky Heller asks: In 2003, the Minneapolis financial reports showed over $7 billion of non-taxable real estate in the City. Minneapolis could balance its budget by getting rid of this stuff. Why not just sell it to the highest bidder and let the experts put their OWN money at risk? [TB] Is this a suggestion that we privatize the University of Minnesota? I've got to admit, I'm not sure how we get the Catholic Church to privatize the University of St. Thomas or the Basilica of St. Mary's. And do we really want to privatize Fire Station #17? Or Southwest High School? I remember when a national news magazine featured Governor Goofy and no it wasn't the former wrestler. Thanks for the laughs. Terrell Brown Loring Park REMINDERS: 1. Think a member has violated the rules? Email the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. For state and national discussions see: http://e-democracy.org/discuss.html For external forums, see: http://e-democracy.org/mninteract Minneapolis Issues Forum - A City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
Re: [Mpls] List, Minneapolis Voting
--- Gregory Luce [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Some notes on Wards:With the exception of just one precinct (Ward 7, Precinct 10), Bush lost every precinct in the city to Kerry, [TB] In the last 20 years anyway, that precinct has probably never voted for anyone who didn't have an R after their name. It's a combination of a senior citizen high rise (Augustana) and Northwestern College. They also don't caucus, and the R's don't have any good way of identifying who they are. Terrell Brown Loring Park REMINDERS: 1. Think a member has violated the rules? Email the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. For state and national discussions see: http://e-democracy.org/discuss.html For external forums, see: http://e-democracy.org/mninteract Minneapolis Issues Forum - A City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
Re: [Mpls] Ward 1:7 (Tuttle School)
On Nov 3, 2004, at 12:31 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The surprising thing in the results, though, was that Amanda Hutchings - The Republican candidate for State Rep in 59B - got 20 pct of the vote. Near as I could tell, she didn't even campaign. Every election guide I saw had a note under her name saying did not respond. This is clear evidence that people voting in National elections just vote the party line if they've not paid attention to their local races. [TB] 'Cept in this state candidates are grouped by office and not by party. A person needs to make a decision to vote for a candidate for any office, there is no lever to pull for a straight party line vote. Yes there is a certain base in any district that will vote by party label and nothing else. In that district it may be around 20% on the Republican side. That is also a district where the DFL incumbent has some negatives and there is at least some anybody but Kahn vote some of which is an overlap of the vote Republican base. --- David Brauer [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I'm just guessing here, but some more conservative Republicans have a beef with the Strib over alleged bias, particularly the Minnesota Poll's Presidential findings (which was closer to the final mark than the PiPress poll this year, BTW). Perhaps the refusal to be in the Strib's Voter's Guide was something of a boycott? Counterproductive, if true, IMHO. [TB] At one point there were people in the Republican Party who recommended that action (or inaction). It is rather dumb but there is a part of that crowd that views the Strib as evil. Funny they do read it enough to find what they don't like. Now that this election is over, who's running for Mayor? Terrell Brown Loring Park REMINDERS: 1. Think a member has violated the rules? Email the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. For state and national discussions see: http://e-democracy.org/discuss.html For external forums, see: http://e-democracy.org/mninteract Minneapolis Issues Forum - A City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
RE: [Mpls] Now: Fundraisers to pay bills the city should pay
Jordan S. Kushner writes: I believe that the city council's decision not to pay the full $350 per hour in charged legal fees was reasonable. This is frankly an excessive fee in the Twin Cities market. The decision to reduce payment by about 25% still comes out to about $260. This is still generous. [TB] The City, via its recently hired Police Chief, attacked her career. She deserves the best representation she can get. In a politically charged case, it seems reasonable to hire an attorney with political connections. In my limited experience in dealing with attorney fees, David Lillehaug's fee seems in line, $300 is not a rare fee in this town. He is, after all, a former US District Attorney. If the City is going to challenge her career, it doesn't also have the right to force her to accept Wal-mart level representation. This is about a Chief of Police who is out to get a female who has the guts to think that she is qualified to be Chief of Police in the City of Minneapolis. A Chief of Police who it has been reported didn't even bother to become a licensed police officer in the state of his former employment. A Chief that was hired over more than one well qualified internal candidate. Perhaps he doesn't like the idea of being challenged by such well qualified individuals? Especially if they are female? Why isn't it that Lucy Gerold should get the best representation possible? Had she not prevailed she would not only been out of a job, she wouldn't have ever gotten a police job anywhere in the country. Gerold is also the only one of the 3 who were investigated where the Chief was reported to say that he would take her out. It was a targeted attack. The City (or the Police Chief) should pay the bill. Terrell Brown Loring Park REMINDERS: 1. Think a member has violated the rules? Email the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. For state and national discussions see: http://e-democracy.org/discuss.html For external forums, see: http://e-democracy.org/mninteract Minneapolis Issues Forum - A City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
[Mpls] Now: Fundraisers to pay bills the city should pay
From the Strib: Benefit to help deputy chief pay legal fees Howie Padilla, Star Tribune October 31, 2004 LUCY1031 Armed with a Greek vacation getaway, a motor scooter and a two-carat diamond tennis bracelet, a handful of supporters for Minneapolis Deputy Police Chief Lucy Gerold are on a mission to finish work they think city officials left undone. (article) http://www.startribune.com/stories/462/5060082.html [TB] The Chief was reported to have said that he'd take her out, he apparently wasn't happy that he was interested in the same job he was. He launches an investigation and she gets stuck with the bill. The Council should have done the right thing here, and they paid the entire legal fees for the 2 men who the Chief included in the investigation. Looks like the problems with the Police Department continue. Terrell Brown Loring Park REMINDERS: 1. Think a member has violated the rules? Email the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. For state and national discussions see: http://e-democracy.org/discuss.html For external forums, see: http://e-democracy.org/mninteract Minneapolis Issues Forum - A City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
Re: [Mpls] Samuels endorsement
--- Loki Anderson [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Don Samuels doesn't respect the DFL endorsement process, what a suprise. I assume this means that he won't be seeking the endorsement should he run for re-election next year. What's the big deal about a guy that beats the guy the party endorses going out and endorsing a person running against the party endorsee? It's not like the party was responsible for Samuels getting elected, they did their best to keep it from happening. Terrell Brown Loring Park REMINDERS: 1. Think a member has violated the rules? Email the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. For state and national discussions see: http://e-democracy.org/discuss.html For external forums, see: http://e-democracy.org/mninteract Minneapolis Issues Forum - A City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
RE: [Mpls] City pension task force releases recommendations
--- David Brauer [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Interesting you should mention this. The returns, by fund, are actually quite decent. They are managed mostly be pensioner-elected boards - even though, when the market-driven returns dip too low to fulfill the funding formulas, the taxpayers have to make up the difference. (In the case of one city pension fund, the moment an employee retires, the city has to contribute the actuarially necessary funds for that person's pensions in a lump sum - instead of 'paying as you go.' If Social Security or any given corporation had to do this, they'd be broke.) [TB] I think the implication that corporate pension plans are underfunded is unfair to many of them. Many are fully funded, meaning that they have the assets to fund the benefits of retired AND current employees. Back in the market boom, some plans were so overfunded that not only were employers not needing to contribute money, but they were taking out some of the overfunding (yes this is allowed, plan participants don't have the right to more than is due them under the plan). It's the underfunded plans that make the headlines. One of the problems with the city plans is that they have paid bonuses to retirees, the famed 13th checks. That is one of the reasons the plans have problems, you can't plan on certain average investment returns but when you get more than that give it away. The plans need to be managed by professional managers, not a board of plan participants. Here's a question to ponder (you can answer in your own head or on the list): What do you consider a fair yearly pension for a cop or firefighter who's worked a full career? No peeking at the report, and if you already know the answer, remain on the sidelines. [TB] There isn't a single answer to that question, there is a range of answers. First lets say that a full career is 30, even 35, years. Do you pay the same retirement benefit to a 55 year old who retires after 30 years as to a 65 year old who retires after 30 years? The 55 year old would be expected to receive benefits for about 10 more years than the 65 year old making his/her benefit much more valuable. Do you intergrate the plan with Social Security? The city, as employer, has contributed toward a retirees Social Security benefits. Should the benefit be such that the total equals a specific amount. This integration is common with private sector plans although not present in all of them. Generally, I'd say that a benefit that provides a combined income from the pension plus Social Security of around 2/3 of income (pre-overtime) earned toward the end of the career would be appropriate. Terrell Brown Loring Park REMINDERS: 1. Think a member has violated the rules? Email the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. For state and national discussions see: http://e-democracy.org/discuss.html For external forums, see: http://e-democracy.org/mninteract Minneapolis Issues Forum - A City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
Re: [Mpls] Strib endorses Henry-Blythe, Lee, Miller
--- Dorie Rae Gallagher [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: No, the Strib can never be figured out for reason since they have their own agenda...just don't let them influence ones own judgement! [TB] Out of curiosity, what is their agenda. If I decide I like it, I might let it influence my judgment. Vote for anyone who isn't an incumbent, you can't go wrong. Terrell Brown Loring Park REMINDERS: 1. Think a member has violated the rules? Email the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. For state and national discussions see: http://e-democracy.org/discuss.html For external forums, see: http://e-democracy.org/mninteract Minneapolis Issues Forum - A City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
Re: [Mpls] Interesting fact
--- David Brauer [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: But according to Reinhardt's report, the number of city households is amazingly constant. Check it out: 1950: 159,110 households 1960: 165,791 (peak) 1970: 161,141 1980: 161,858 1990: 160,682 2000: 162,352 In other words, in 50 years, the number of Mpls households has varied by no more than 4 percent, and in 30 years, has varied by less than 1 percent. Bottom line: city population is completely about household size. No other big point, just the stats geek in me. [TB] Actually there is a big point here if you happen to be running a school district. Since 1950 the average household size has decreased from about 3 to about 2 and a huge percentage of that decrease is school aged kids. That decline in household size is the reason that we are closing (or at least should be closing) schools. In my neighborhood, Loring Park, the 2000 census found 7,500 people and the number under the age of 18 is something around a hundred or so. Of course most of the students at Emerson arrive by big yellow bus. I wasn't around when Emerson was built, but expect that most of the students lived within walking distance. I wouldn't expect the average household size to decrease much more and as the number of households increases as we continue to build up, I question the estimates that the city population is decreasing. Terrell Brown Loring Park REMINDERS: 1. Think a member has violated the rules? Email the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. For state and national discussions see: http://e-democracy.org/discuss.html For external forums, see: http://e-democracy.org/mninteract Minneapolis Issues Forum - A City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
Re: [Mpls] lawnsigns
--- Linda Higgins [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Then there were the Barbara Carlson lawnsigns that were a 7-color screenprint of her face -- no words. They were stolen nightly, by people who wanted to display the pretty art in their homes. They probably cost the campaign more than $10 a piece. I'll admit mine hangs inside my garage. [TB] Probably the most memorable lawn sign in Minneapolis, a decade later and they still occaisionally show up at garage sales. And when it shows up at the garage sale someone will buy it. Seems like someone had a (very) large version of it hanging on a house along Kenwood Parkway that could be seen while driving along the now deceased Hwy 12. With local candidates, one of the major reasons for the sign is to establish name recognition. Generally you're not going to get someone to vote for you if they don't know your name. In Barbara's case, I don't think she lacked name recognition, even back then. Terrell Brown Loring Park REMINDERS: 1. Think a member has violated the rules? Email the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. For state and national discussions see: http://e-democracy.org/discuss.html For external forums, see: http://e-democracy.org/mninteract Minneapolis Issues Forum - A City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
Re: [Mpls] Why are early elections anti-Green
--- Mark Snyder [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I think the anti-Green is mostly coming from people who are aware of how entrenched the DFL is in Minneapolis and how much greater the access to campaign resources are for DFLers when compared to Greens, which puts them at a significant advantage if early elections were held. [TB] I think its more from paranoid Greens who think they might lose an election. Part of the claims of partisanship are due, I think, to the fact that both the Green council members, if I recall correctly, get the choice of either moving from their current homes or facing another incumbent council member who now shares a ward with them under the new boundaries. If I also recall correctly, there are no instances where any two other incumbents on council face that situation. Is that simply a coincidence? [TB] Actually there are 2 DFL members of the Council who would face another incumbent should all of the current councilmembers run for re-election. In at least on of those cases the DFL incumbent probably wouldn't be the strongest candidate. Any time you redraw lines there is a good chance that some incumbents will end up in the same district/ward. Look at the state legislative elections in 2002 where incumbents faced each other and numerous congressional districts around the country. Another part of the claims of partisanship are due, I think, to who's behind the push for early elections. From what I've seen, it's pretty much all hardcore DFL party activists or elected officials that are crying disenfranchisement as opposed to regular citizens, who, going by this forum, are wondering what the fuss is all about. [TB] In general its activists who start the push for any major change. I don't think the DFL had a monopoly in supporting timely elections based on the new ward boundaries. With apologies to Wizard and Rep. Kahn, nobody is really being disenfranchised in any meaningful way right now, but all of us who voted in 2001 for city council members did so with the expectation that those terms would be four years. [TB] Constitutionally the reason we have a census every 10 years is for reapportionment. Is it reasonable to have a census in 2000, draw new lines in 2002 and wait until 2005 to use them to elect office holders who won't take office until 2006? I think not. That is precisely the reason that the MN Senate is elected to a term of only 2 years each census year (2000 election), so that Senators can be elected from new districts after the lines are drawn (the 2002 election). Regardless of how long you thought a person might serve when they were elected, if the term is longer than the Constitution allows, it needs to be fixed. The ballot doesn't ask the question, how long should this person serve? although that might be an interesting idea. You can't reward Councilmembers who could have fixed the problem with a longer term although it is approaching the point where an election before Nov. 2005 isn't very meaningful. Terrell Brown Loring Park REMINDERS: 1. Think a member has violated the rules? Email the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. For state and national discussions see: http://e-democracy.org/discuss.html For external forums, see: http://e-democracy.org/mninteract Minneapolis Issues Forum - A City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
RE: [Mpls] Kiffmeyer Claims she was at Twin Cities Gay Pride Events
Madeline Douglass writes: Two years ago a badly planned highly political redistricting of Minneapolis precincts resulted in overcrowded voting places where most of us waited two hours or more to vote. Kiffmeyer did not respond to the problems except to put an unbelievably positive spin on all of it. It's time for regime change in the MN Secretary of States' Office. [TB] Ms. Douglas is being dishonest here. The MN Sec of State has absolutely nothing to do with the drawing of ward and precinct lines in the City of Minneapolis. Ward lines were drawn by a Redistricting Commission appointed by the Minneapolis Charter Commission (which is appointed by the Chief Judge of Hennepin County District Court) and precints are drawn within those wards by the Minneapolis City Council. The elections in Minneapolis are managed by the City Elections office, that place in City Hall where you can register to vote of file for city office should you decide to run next year. Douglas demonstrates the highly partisan dishonesty that turns many people away from participating in the political process. When you talk about someones record, its best to use real facts, not stuff you make up to prove your point. Terrell Brown Loring Park REMINDERS: 1. Think a member has violated the rules? Email the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. For state and national discussions see: http://e-democracy.org/discuss.html For external forums, see: http://e-democracy.org/mninteract Minneapolis Issues Forum - A City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
RE: [Mpls] sex offenders in mpls
The ordinance, to me, looks like red lining. Generally red lining is a violation of all kinds of fair housing laws. This proposal is discrimination against a specific class of persons. Are we next going to see a proposal that the same restrictions should apply to workplaces? News flash: Those with criminal convictions have to live someplace. Terrell Brown Loring Park --- Leurquin, Ronald [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: This ordinance sounds good for the sound bite it offers, but how does it really fix any of the problems? Booker wrote: Now that all the hoopla about sex offenders has worn off, the H.I.T (Hodges Investigative Team) decided to publish the results and inform the community about our efforts to prevent sex offenders from being disproportionably placed in certain areas. The topic of sex offenders has been virtually ignored by the Black press, so I am going to change that. Ron writes: When is it the hoopla wore off? Booker wrote: Proposed Ordinance: Any person registered as a convicted level 2 or level 3 [sex offender] with the Minnesota Department of Corrections living within the limits of the City of Minneapolis shall not live within 1,000 feet of any of the following: 1. School and any auxiliary fields that youth frequent. 2. Community center that youth frequent. 3. Community organization that serves youth. 4. Battered women's shelter, or place that provide counseling services to victims of sexual abuse. 5. Library. 6. Church that youth frequent. 7. Park or swimming area that youth frequent. 8. Corner store that youth frequent. 9. Nursing home, or any other facility that provides services to vulnerable adults. 10. Mental health center, or place that provides services to people with mental disabilities. Sub A. No more than two registered sex offenders shall live on any one city block at any given time. Sub B. No more than 10 percent of the total registered sex offenders living in Minneapolis shall live in any one given neighborhood. Sub C. Terms Youth: Anyone that is between the ages of 0-18. Vulnerable Adult: Is defined in Minnesota State Statues 609.232 subdivision 11. Ron writes: Not much space left within Mpls for them to live, but that is probably the point of this stringent list of moving objects. Booker wrote: Not only are sex offenders dumped into minority communities, but they are allowed to roam freely around our neighborhoods. These offenders are allowed to drive multiple vehicles and hold multiple addresses. Who checks up on these people in Hennepin County? When someone finds out, please let me know. Ron writes: Where did the sex offenders come from before they committed the crimes your upset about? Are they minorities returning to their communities? How many sex offenders started out in Mayor Rybak's hood compared to the 55411 zip code? Give me all the facts, not just the ones that suit your argument. Booker wrote: I have a sex offender who lives on my block. His name is James Vanwyhe. He seems to be a pretty nice guy, but nonetheless, he was convicted of raping adult women he had known, forcing them to comply by using some sort of weapon. So at the community notification meeting, everyone seemed really mad about him moving to the neighborhood, and for good reason. But I must say to you, what a difference a few months make. A lot of people who attended the community meeting now allow their children to play at James' house with James' kids. As a matter of fact, he has the most popular hangout for kids in the neighborhood. Only in the Black neighborhood would the most popular hangout for kids be at the sex offender's house. We must not care that much about sex crimes as a people. Ron writes: Where did James live before conviction? Why should his children not have friends over? Are these children at risk if his crime was against adult women? Isn't it a good thing the parents know, rather than not? Booker wrote: I personally feel that the vast majority of sex offenders cannot be rehabilitated and thus must be kept under constant watch. People won't pay attention to this issue until it affects their households, and that's sad. Ron writes: I'm glad you admit it to be your opinion, rather than some sort of fact. It has been shown that sex offenders quite frequently recommit, but not all of them. Its also been shown that they have repletion's in the type of victim they go after, so that would lead to a need to deal with each one on a case by case basis. A generic ordinance will not work for all cases. To those of you that have read this far, I know this is a touchy subject for many people and for many reasons. I don't think there are any simple answers or solutions to this problem. I also don't think Bookers proposed ordinance will actually help matters any, just make for more
[Mpls] Leaf Blowers, ... Mpls Noise/Pollution Ordinance
--- Tracy [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: 1) More people are using blowers to clean up their yards. Mostly I think the blowers are operated by maintenance companies who neither know nor care about honoring our city's noise ordinance. Some of my neighbors even have their snow removal people using blowers to clean off their sidewalks after light snows; a company across the street even blew one night after midnight! On a daily basis, if I'm home early from work (before 4 or 5) there are 1 or 2 of my neighbors having their maintenance people blowing/mowing at the same time. Talk about a noise nightmare. [TB] Wow, usually its people complaining that people DON'T mow their lawns or clean their sidewalks after a snowfall. Especially when 1 or the neighbors is doing it at the same time. And doing it during the day (4 or 5), oh my! I heard a dozen or so sirens last night when I had the windows open. Should we write the Mayor demanding that those things be turned off too? Then maybe I'm not interpreting her demands properly. Perhaps she wants people to be shoveling and mowing by hand. More heart attacks that way, it keeps the doctors and hospitals in business. If the docs aren't successful, it keeps the population down, although I think there are likely better methods of population control. Maybe I need to go back to San Francisco, they seem more rational out there. Terrell Brown Loring Park REMINDERS: 1. Think a member has violated the rules? Email the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. For state and national discussions see: http://e-democracy.org/discuss.html For external forums, see: http://e-democracy.org/mninteract Minneapolis Issues Forum - A City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
[Mpls] Question on the Mayor's veto
On Behalf Of Rybak, R.T. This is to inform you that I have vetoed two actions by the Council: the denial to add the Industrial Living Overlay District to permit a mixed-use, light industrial development with retail, restaurant, dwelling units above and below grade parking at 206 Elroy Street and 2920 - 28 Pillsbury Avenue; and ... [TB] Is an overlay district automatic unless the Council rejects it? I'm trying to understand what Mayor Rybak vetoed. How do you veto the Council _not_ doing something? If the Mayor wants an ordinance and the Council votes it down, does the Mayor just veto it and make it law? Seems as there is something missing in the reporting on this. Terrell Brown Loring Park REMINDERS: 1. Think a member has violated the rules? Email the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. For state and national discussions see: http://e-democracy.org/discuss.html For external forums, see: http://e-democracy.org/mninteract Minneapolis Issues Forum - A City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
[Mpls] Red light photo cops. Editorial from The Philadelphia Inquirer
The Philadelphia Inquirer take is a bit different than the Strib (follow the link for the entire editorial). Editorial | Red-Light Cameras Don't change to green just yet When traffic-enforcement cameras go up at key Philadelphia intersections later this year, drivers who blow through red lights will be hit with hefty, $100 fines. ... http://www.philly.com/mld/inquirer/news/editorial/9597817.htm?1c Terrell Brown Loring Park REMINDERS: 1. Think a member has violated the rules? Email the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. For state and national discussions see: http://e-democracy.org/discuss.html For external forums, see: http://e-democracy.org/mninteract Minneapolis Issues Forum - A City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
Re: [Mpls] Neat idea - post neighborhood maps on signal boxes
Uptown painted some of their signal boxes with a big light switch. It was part of the area art fair theme. The graffic certainly looks better than a yellow box. Apparently someone (big surprise here) complained which resulted in a few more hoops to jump thru. Good idea, other than some of the Nic. Mall kiosks and some skyway maps in the skyway, good directions are hard to find. Terrell Brown Loring Park --- John McClellan [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Here's a link to a neat project being done in Victoria, BC. They are posting color maps on the traffic signal boxes around town.Provides a nice service, cheaply, and also may help reduce graffiti problems on the boxes. http://www.darrenbarefoot.com/archives/000950.html I could see this being done here, not only Downtown, but also along the LRT corridor and near some of the more heavily foot trafficed/touristy areas like by the Lakes, Uptown, 50th/France, etc. Should be fairly cheap to do, maybe even request a donation to defray costs from local business in exchange for a larger font or a small advert box? REMINDERS: 1. Think a member has violated the rules? Email the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. For state and national discussions see: http://e-democracy.org/discuss.html For external forums, see: http://e-democracy.org/mninteract Minneapolis Issues Forum - A City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
Re: [Mpls] SUVs Banned on Minneapolis Streets?
Clearly this ordinance needs to be enforced. When you see a Hummer driving down a non truck route, call 911 and report a crime in progress. Terrell Brown Loring Park --- David Brauer [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Aug 5, 2004, at 8:13 AM, Charles Gimon wrote My question is: does this mean that SUVs have been illegal to drive on Minneapolis residential streets all along? Is this ordinance in effect, or does Slate have it wrong? If the ordinance is valid, how has enforcement of this been approached, if at all? Here's the ordinance. Looks bad for SUV-ers, but you tell me. (Note: one pertinent section is between asterisks. Let's hope it's the longest run-on sentence in city code, but probably not.) 474.790. Definition. As used in this article, the word truck shall include trucks, trailers and semitrailers. (Code 1960, As Amend., § 441.010) ...474.810. Marking of routes. Truck routes shall be identified by appropriate signs erected and maintained by the city engineer. Further, the city engineer shall post at the city limits, upon all main traffic routes entering the city, signs notifying users of highways that trucks are only permitted to be driven on marked truck routes. (Code 1960, As Amend., § 441.030) 474.820. Duty to use routes. ***When any such truck route has been established and identified, any person driving a truck having a gross weight of three (3) tons or more shall drive such truck on such route or routes and none other, except when it is impracticable to do so or where necessary to traverse another street or streets to a destination for the purpose of loading or unloading commodities or for the purpose of towing a disabled or damaged motor vehicle to or from public or private property, and then only by such deviation from the nearest truck route as is reasonably necessary.*** A truck arriving at the end of any designated truck route may be driven over the most direct course to the nearest truck route which extends in the same general direction. (Code 1960, As Amend., § 414.020) 474.830. Permits for use of other routes. The city engineer shall have the authority, for cause or upon request, to issue temporary permits for trucks to operate over routes not established as truck routes by the city council, or to otherwise deviate from the provisions of the traffic code. Such action by the city engineer shall be subject to review and modification, or cancellation, by the city council. (Code 1960, As Amend., § 414.030) 474.840. Vehicles excepted. The provisions of this article shall not apply to emergency vehicles of the police department, fire department or health department, nor to any public utility vehicles where actually engaged in the performance of emergency duties necessary to be performed by said public departments or public utilities, nor to any vehicle owned by or performing work for the United States of America, the State of Minnesota, the University of Minnesota, or the City of Minneapolis. (Code 1960, As Amend., § 441.080) 474.850. Conflict with other provisions. No designation of a truck route which consists in whole or in part of any state trunk highway, federal highway or parkway shall be construed as permitting use of said route in violation of any order or rule of the commissioner of highways or any ordinance or rule of the park board. Further, no designation of any truck route shall be construed to permit violation of any state law or provision of this Code regulating the size, weight, capacity, height, length or speed of trucks or other vehicles. (Code 1960, As Amend., § 441.040) 474.860. Trucks following each other. The driver of any truck or truck-tractor when traveling upon a highway outside of the congested zone shall not follow another truck or truck-tractor within one hundred (100) feet, but this shall not be construed to prevent one truck or tractor overtaking and passing another. (Code 1960, As Amend., § 414.060) David Brauer Kingfield REMINDERS: 1. Think a member has violated the rules? Email the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. For state and national discussions see: http://e-democracy.org/discuss.html For external forums, see: http://e-democracy.org/mninteract Minneapolis Issues Forum - A City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls REMINDERS: 1. Think a member has violated the rules? Email the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. For state and national discussions see: http://e-democracy.org/discuss.html For external forums, see: http://e-democracy.org/mninteract
[Mpls] City Council flushes a few more million dollars down the toilet
--- Victoria Heller [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Minneapolitans might read a lot, but I wonder how much they retain. Too bad that surveys can't measure information processing and retention. [TB] Information processing and retention CAN be measured. It's been done for years. More making up facts when the real thing isn't on your side? Terrell Brown Loring Park REMINDERS: 1. Think a member has violated the rules? Email the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. For state and national discussions see: http://e-democracy.org/discuss.html For external forums, see: http://e-democracy.org/mninteract Minneapolis Issues Forum - A City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
Re: [Mpls] City Council Size
I'm not sure that it would save much, if any, money. There are, however, some studies of what size groups are most effective. According to these studies our council is to big to be most effective. These studies would suggest that the most effective Council size would have a single digit number of members, probably 7 or 9. If the ward offices didn't change in size the salary and benefits savings would probably be about $150,000 per eliminated ward. Other cities are all over the map when it comes to size of their councils so you can make comparisions to justify virtually any number you want. At one time Minneapolis had 26 aldermen, 2 from each of 13 wards. If we're going to look at governing body size, we should include the number of governing bodies. In addition to the council, do we need a Library Board, a Park Board and a Board of Estimate and Taxation? Terrell Brown Loring Park --- Jim Bernstein [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I have heard quite a few people suggest that the size of the Minneapolis city council be trimmed from 13 to a smaller number. The usual justifications are that a smaller city council would save money (mostly from council member and aide salary and benefits)or make government more streamlined (fewer members equals less squabbling and debating with speedier resolution of issues) or less parochial (larger, more diverse districts in theory) or more accountable (no longer would 13 members share the responsibility, the buck would stop on fewer desks). None of these justifications has ever been particularly compelling to me but perhaps there are others! Mr. Graetz suggests several advantages better left to another conversation so I am proposing to start that conversation - what do you think are the advantages of a smaller city council and, how would a smaller city council lead to a better/more effective/ city council process? Jim Bernstein Fulton REMINDERS: 1. Think a member has violated the rules? Email the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. For state and national discussions see: http://e-democracy.org/discuss.html For external forums, see: http://e-democracy.org/mninteract Minneapolis Issues Forum - A City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
Re: [Mpls] Minneapolis taxpayers - sharpen your pencils
--- Victoria Heller [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The big guys are bailing out of Minneapolis with big losses! [TB] Looks to me that someone is making an investment in downtown Minneapolis. No taxpayer subsidy, they see value in buying property in Minneapolis. A new investor in downtown seems like good news. Selling property for less than one pays for it may not even be a loss. We don't know how much depreciation the prior owners may have taken on the property to reduce their basis going into the sale. The view of downtown office buildings as I look out my living room window looks much different today than it did 6 or 7 years ago. There is a significant amount of office space that didn't exist then. Perhaps a better measure of the health of Minneapolis is the amount of occupied office space. When Target, for example, builds a new building so that it can consolidate some of its functions that's a healthy situation even if it takes some time until the previously occupied space fills up. The Minneapolis is Bad arguement just doesn't hold up. Terrell Brown Loring Park REMINDERS: 1. Think a member has violated the rules? Email the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. For state and national discussions see: http://e-democracy.org/discuss.html For external forums, see: http://e-democracy.org/mninteract Minneapolis Issues Forum - A City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
[Mpls] Minneapolis news from Pravda
It's often we make Pravda. http://english.pravda.ru/world/20/91/368/13590_shooting.html And another shooting in the Minneapolis, Minnesota, area 07/29/2004 15:49 For the second time this week, crimers broke into a house while the occupants were sleeping, and shots were fired. The shots were not made by the house occupants, but by the crimers themselves. This morning at approximately 02:00 CST, 28 July 2004, three crimers broke into a Minneapolis suburb home and demanded money. The crimers then shot a 19 year old boy, a resident of the house, in the arm and crimers fled. ... Terrell Brown Loring Park REMINDERS: 1. Think a member has violated the rules? Email the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. For state and national discussions see: http://e-democracy.org/discuss.html For external forums, see: http://e-democracy.org/mninteract Minneapolis Issues Forum - A City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
RE: [Mpls] Smoking Ban: What to do now?
Dan McGrath The simple point here that everyone seems to overlook, is that both smoking, and being exposed to second hand smoke are personal choices. ... We have a City Council which now wants to make our personal decisions for us. [TB] Amazing the number of people that don't realize that a civilized society requires certain rules with which its members are expected to comply. If anyone is actually looking to DO something about this new ban, visit http://www.smokeoutgary.org Omitted disclosure: Domain ID:D104668513-LROR Domain Name:SMOKEOUTGARY.ORG Created On:24-Jul-2004 07:49:48 UTC Last Updated On:25-Jul-2004 05:00:12 UTC Expiration Date:24-Jul-2005 07:49:48 UTC Sponsoring Registrar:R39-LROR Status:TRANSFER PROHIBITED Registrant ID:334CD5FF788F415A Registrant Name:Dan McGrath Registrant Organization:Smoke Out Gary Registrant Street1:3429 Snelling Ave S Registrant City:Mpls Registrant State/Province:MN Registrant Postal Code:55406 Registrant Country:US Registrant Phone:+1.6127025649 Registrant Email:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Admin ID:334CD5FF788F415A Admin Name:Dan McGrath Admin Organization:Smoke Out Gary Admin Street1:3429 Snelling Ave S Admin City:Mpls Admin State/Province:MN Admin Postal Code:55406 Admin Country:US Admin Phone:+1.6127025649 Admin Email:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Tech ID:334CD5FF788F415A Tech Name:Dan McGrath Tech Organization:Smoke Out Gary Tech Street1:3429 Snelling Ave S Tech City:Mpls Tech State/Province:MN Tech Postal Code:55406 Tech Country:US Tech Phone:+1.6127025649 Tech Email:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Name Server:NS1.GUESSHOST.COM Name Server:NS2.GUESSHOST.COM Terrell Brown Loring Park REMINDERS: 1. Think a member has violated the rules? Email the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. For state and national discussions see: http://e-democracy.org/discuss.html For external forums, see: http://e-democracy.org/mninteract Minneapolis Issues Forum - A City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
[Mpls] Smoking Ban and anonymous attacks
Dan McGrath My my, Terrell, it's so amazing and impressive that you were able to find that (public) information on my site, and myself, and post it here. Is that supposed to be some sort of threat? I took a look at the web site for Smoke Out Gary dot org. It's an attack piece, an anonymous attack piece. A quick look didn't find Smoke Out Gary registered as a political committee. Anonymous attack pieces are ugly. You bet, if I see an anonymous attack piece and find out who put it out, I'm going to disclose that. For the most part political campaigns in this city are relatively clean. I hope they stay that way. When I look at the downloadable window sign, at this point it doesn't contain a disclaimer telling who prepared it (see http://www.smokeoutgary.org/images/smoke-out-gary.jpg ) Given that the Council vote was 12-1 and that Schiff wasn't the origial proposer of the ordinance, this appears to be a personal attack on this particular Councilmember. I hope this is not a sign of what to expect in next year's election campaign. Terrell Brown Loring Park REMINDERS: 1. Think a member has violated the rules? Email the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. For state and national discussions see: http://e-democracy.org/discuss.html For external forums, see: http://e-democracy.org/mninteract Minneapolis Issues Forum - A City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
[Mpls] Smoking Ban
Dennis Plante Well, it would be in the public health's best interest for government (us) to ban ALL handguns, yet they choose not to. It would indeed be in the public health's best interest to ban the sale of alcohol, the sale of tobacco, the sale of sexually demeaning material. Yet they choose not to. [TB] While I don't favor handguns, they can be used safely and without causing death and injury to those nearby. To date, no one has figured out a way to smoke tobacco without causing a health hazard to those who are nearby. Michael Atherton Maybe the next time that we want to intern Japanese citizens we should just take a poll to see how many people are in favor. [TB] What most people are in favor of is creating safe work places. Auto body shops have spray booths to keep paint fumes contained. We don't allow open containers of benzene in the offices of American Express, US Bank or Target Corp. That we should allow employees of specific industries to suffer a known, and easily eliminated, health hazard because it is convenient for a few is absurd. Dorie Rae Gallagher wrote: Would someone please tell me why government needs to be involved with telling private citizens, owning a business, whether to allow smoking or not. [TB] Public health. The same reason we have sanitation rules for restaurants and on occasion close them down when they don't comply. Do opponents of eating and drinking establishments being healthy work places also oppose all other workplace safety rules? Yes there is a move in this country to dismantle government. I hope the folks that are cutting back on schools, libraries, parks, etc. don't make eliminating workplace safety rules their next crusade. By a vote of 12-1 the Council did the proper thing. Why wait until March 31? It doesn't 8 months to remove ash trays and matches. Terrell Brown Loring Park REMINDERS: 1. Think a member has violated the rules? Email the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. For state and national discussions see: http://e-democracy.org/discuss.html For external forums, see: http://e-democracy.org/mninteract Minneapolis Issues Forum - A City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
[Mpls] Phyllis Kahn picking up lit
Steve Sumner Phyllis Kahn has demonstrated two things this week: ?The first is that she has taken her constituency for granted. She has been spending her summer campaigning in another part of the city, while being absent from local events in her home community. [TB] Having had some political involvement for something on the order of 3 decades, I don't find it all unusual that an incumbent office holder in a safe district is spending some time campaigning for others who seek to join their caucus in the Legislature. Given the short shift that the Legislature has given Minneapolis in the past few years, its applaudable that she is campaigning for someone who might be supportive of Minneapolis rather than trashing the city. Absent events in her home community? How long ago was it that she was getting trashed on this list for doing just that. Seems she thought that council members should represent disticts drawn based on the 2000 census before 2006 as the current council seems to prefer. Sumner again: The Republican Party in Senate District 59B is confident that when the voters are given all of the facts, they will choose Amanda Hutchins to unseat Phyllis Kahn this fall. ### [TB] Okay, in 2002 she got 94.5% of the vote, in 2000 when she had an opponent who was campaigning hard she got 63%. I think that confidence is just a bit misplaced. I'll certainly be surprised if she polls less than 60%. I'll forecast the results in 59B (1) Kahn, (2) Smith (Green) she and Kahn are the only ones with web sites (3) Licheid (Independence), (4) Hutchins. Kahn has done a good job, she deserves to be re-elected. Terrell Brown Loring Park (tonight's fireworks display looks rather good) REMINDERS: 1. Think a member has violated the rules? Email the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. For state and national discussions see: http://e-democracy.org/discuss.html For external forums, see: http://e-democracy.org/mninteract Minneapolis Issues Forum - A City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
Re: [Mpls] Task force smoking-ban ordinance
The ordinance http://www.ci.minneapolis.mn.us/council/2004-meetings/20040723/docs/Task-Force-Smoking-Ordinance.pdf I don't see any 60/40 exemption. Didn't see such an expemption in either the PP or Strib story. By Zimmermann, Johnson Lee, Niziolek, Samuels, Schiff, Zerby Amending Title 11 of the Minneapolis Code of Ordinances relating to Health and Sanitation by adding a new Chapter 234 relating to Indoor Smoking. The City Council of The City of Minneapolis do ordain as follows: Section 1. That the Minneapolis Code of Ordinances be amended by adding thereto a new Chapter 234 to read as follows: CHAPTER 234. INDOOR SMOKING 234.10. Definitions. As used in this ordinance: Bowling alleys and pool and billiard halls means those establishments licensed pursuant to Chapter 267, Articles IV and XII of this Code, whether or not they are also licensed as a liquor establishment. Food establishment means those establishments licensed pursuant to Title 10 of this Code. Liquor establishment means those establishments licensed pursuant to Title 14 of this Code. Other person in charge has the meaning specified in the Minnesota Clean Indoor Air Act Rules, Minnesota Rules, part 4620.0100, subpart 10, as amended from time to time. Proprietor has the meaning specified by the Minnesota Clean Indoor Air Act Rules, Minnesota Rules, part 4620.0100, subpart 13, as amended from time to time. Smoking means the inhaling, exhaling or combustion of any cigar, cigarette, pipe, tobacco product, weed, plant or any other similar article. Smoking includes possessing or carrying a lighted cigar, cigarette, pipe or any other lighted smoking equipment. 234.20. Prohibitions. (1) Smoking is prohibited in bowling alleys and pool and billiard halls and liquor and food establishments. (2) General exceptions. The prohibitions of this section do not apply to: a. Guest rooms of a hotel or motel; b. Outdoor spaces; c. Locations where smoking is expressly authorized by state or federal law or rule; or d. The use of tobacco as part of a recognized religious ritual or activity. 234.30. Responsibilities of proprietors. The proprietor or other person in charge of a bowling alley, pool and billiard hall, or liquor or food establishment shall: (1) Post No Smoking signs that comply with the Minnesota Clean Indoor Air Act Rules, Minnesota Rules, part 4620.0500, as amended from time to time; (2) Ensure that ashtrays, lighters, and matchbooks are not provided in any area where smoking is prohibited; and (3) Ask any person who smokes in an area where smoking is prohibited to refrain from smoking and, if the person does not refrain from smoking after being asked to do so, take the appropriate action to remove the person from the premises. 234.40. Additional private prohibitions. Nothing in this ordinance prevents the proprietor or other person in charge of any place, including, without limitation, any residence, motor vehicle or outdoor space, from prohibiting smoking in any such place. 234.50. Retaliation prohibited. No person or employer shall discharge, refuse to hire, or in any manner retaliate against, any employee, applicant for employment, or customer because the employee, applicant or customer exercises any right to a smoke-free environment afforded by this ordinance or other law. 234.60. Employees rights preserved. An employee who consents to work in a setting where an employer allows smoking does not waive or otherwise surrender any legal rights the employee may have against the employer or any other party. 234.70. Other applicable laws. This ordinance is intended to complement the Minnesota Clean Indoor Air Act, Minnesota Statutes, Sections144.411 to 144.417, as amended from time to time. Nothing in this ordinance authorizes smoking in any location where smoking is prohibited or restricted by other laws. 234.80. Violation and penalties. (1) Proprietors. It is a violation of this ordinance for the proprietor or other person in charge of any premises subject to this ordinance to fail to comply with the requirements of 234.30, or to retaliate against an employee, applicant for employment or customer, as prohibited by 234.50. (2) Civil fines. Violations of this chapter may be enforced administratively pursuant to Chapter 2 of this Code. Each day of violation constitutes a separate offense. (3) Adverse license action. Violation of any provision of this chapter by a licensee shall be adequate grounds for the denial, refusal to renew, revocation or suspension of said license. (4) Enforcement. The provisions of this ordinance shall be enforced by the department of operations and regulatory services, the police department and fire department. (5) Injunctive relief. The city attorney may bring a civil action against the proprietor or other person in charge of a public place or place of work to enjoin repeated or continuing violations of this chapter. 234.90. Severability. If any portion of this chapter, or its application to any circumstances, is held
[Mpls] Re: MACs broken promises
Mayor Rybak says the Metropolitan Airports Commission is breaking its promises. People were expecting noise mitigation improvements to their homes. Interesting comment coming from the leader of the city. Minneapolis residents were expecting a number of things that this Mayor and the current Council havent provided. The Uptown library comes to mind, the voters approved the bonds for needed renovations, the powers that be have declined to issue the bonds to finance the renovations promised to the voters when the bonding authority was requested. Numerous other services that city residents have expected have been cut back or eliminated by Mayor Rybak due to economic considerations. Apparently Mayor Rybak doesnt think that other units of government can do exactly what the one he leads is doing, reacting to their current economic situation. Mayor Rybak needs to remember that like mayors and city councils, members of the MAC cannot bind future holders of those positions to appropriate money for specific projects. Elections result in changes, which result in shifting of priorities. A change in priorities is likely on of the biggest reasons that Mayor Rybak has that 3rd floor office in City Hall. How long can MSP remain the primary airport in the metro area? Sure, its convenient. It wont be long until you can even take a train to the terminal building. The problem is it cant continue to expand, for one thing theres a river in the way. A river and a couple of major highways. We should have started land banking for the inevitable new airport long ago. We were well on our way to selecting a site for that new airport a decade ago when Ted Mondale lead the charge in the Legislature to stop the study before it was completed. Unfortunately when Ted Mondale lead the Met Council he refused to admit that mistake, a refusal that shaped current regional transportation policy. Does it make sense to invest in noise mitigation for marginally effected homes (the serious problems having already been addressed) when that money could be spent on the development of a new airport? Im not sure it does. Given the limits of available money, Id rather spend it on a permanent solution than a stopgap measure. Terrell Brown Loring Park REMINDERS: 1. Think a member has violated the rules? Email the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. For state and national discussions see: http://e-democracy.org/discuss.html For external forums, see: http://e-democracy.org/mninteract Minneapolis Issues Forum - A City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
Re: [Mpls] Just say NO to spending: 2003 financial reports are out!
Once again Vicky throws up numbers without context, apparently hoping they will turn into mud and stick somewhere: --- Victoria Heller [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: 2003 Revenues were DOWN by $65.6 million (Table 2) However $90 million of this was due to a decrease in Operating Grants and Contributions which spiked in 2002 and returned to their 2001 level in 2003. 2003 Tax capacity lower than 1994, despite market values more than doubling (Table 6) Which has nothing to do with the management of the city but reflects changes in tax law at made by the State of Minnesota. 2003 Bank deposits DROPPED $36 BILLION (Table 15) Which probably has more to do with banks merging than anything that resembles management of the city. Of course the same thing would happen if people spent money they had saved on plant equipment or buildings or contributed to other economic activity in the city. Rather than thinking of ways to spend more money, I think the Mayor and Council could use your help in finding ways to CUT spending and attract new taxpayers. Am I the only one who remembers the budget cutting that went on when the current budget was approved. Has nobody noticed, for example, that libraries now are open fewer hours and that there are fewer lifeguards on city beaches? Sorry, but the numbers presented aren't going to stick anywhere. Terrell Brown Loring Park REMINDERS: 1. Think a member has violated the rules? Email the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. For state and national discussions see: http://e-democracy.org/discuss.html For external forums, see: http://e-democracy.org/mninteract Minneapolis Issues Forum - A City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
Re: [Mpls] Smoking: What IS the regional solution?
--- Victoria Heller [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Vicky responds: The smoking ban controversy IS a property rights issue. It boils down to a conflict between the Nanny State and Private Property Rights. This is absurd. It suggests we can't have zoning, any type of business license requirements and that a property owner can do whatever damage they wish to anyone else as long as they own the property on which the activity takes place. We clearly can and do have safety and health regulations. To suggest that a resturant can leave food out, not prevent flies and pests, and have peeling lead paint in food prepartion areas all because that's the way the property owner wants it is equally absurd. When that resturant gets shut down, most here would think that is a good thing. Why someone should be denied workplace protection from health hazards solely because they work in a bar or resturant is discriminatory at best. Is the reason that the free market hasn't come up with a device that will prevent smoke from getting into other's lungs because those using the product just don't care about those around them? Maybe we could allow smoking in bars and other public places if the cigarette user was using a sealed device that would prevent the smoke from escaping into the room. That would eliminate the need for St. Paul's sealed rooms. Terrell Brown Loring Park REMINDERS: 1. Think a member has violated the rules? Email the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. For state and national discussions see: http://e-democracy.org/discuss.html For external forums, see: http://e-democracy.org/mninteract Minneapolis Issues Forum - A City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
[Mpls] Record settlement reached in brutality suit
Today's StarTribune Record settlement reached in brutality suit Howie Padilla, Rochelle Olson and David Chanen, Star Tribune June 24, 2004 SUIT0624 Minneapolis will pay nearly $1 million to a man who lost his colon and part of his small intestine after what he claims was a beating administered by police responding to a domestic dispute at his south Minneapolis home. http://www.startribune.com/stories/467/4844214.html I'm going to ask again. Why, if the behavior of the police officers was so bad that the city is paying out a $995,000 settlement, are the 2 police officers involved still employed as police officers by the City of Minneapolis. And why wasn't an internal investigation opened? If the city is going to approve the settlement shouldn't the Council motion be to pay the settlement AND terminate the employment of the officers involved? Or am I to believe that the city threshold for paying settlements is so low that they will pay without any evidence? Either the settlement should not have been paid or the officers should be fired. Haven't we already paid out enough due to the behavior of rouge cops? The quote from Mayor RT Rybak is a real gem, But it does not necessarily say anything about guilt,. So, we just payout the money? Can't the Mayor come up with a better comment than that? Terrell Brown Loring Park REMINDERS: 1. Think a member has violated the rules? Email the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. For state and national discussions see: http://e-democracy.org/discuss.html For external forums, see: http://e-democracy.org/mninteract Minneapolis Issues Forum - A City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
Re: [Mpls] Mayor Rybak's honest assessment of budget issues
--- Victoria Heller [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I maintain that if Minneapolis voters had been told the truth about the mountains of debt they faced, they would have lived with the old library for a while longer. Clear thinking people would never have funded the NRP with borrowed money. Most people have good sense - but that doesn't help if they are being lied to. Full disclosure is the goal - just ask the guys who are being sent to prison for deceiving the public. [TB] I'm not sure where we were lied to about the library. I recall seeing both costs of paying the bonds including breakdowns by various types of property and side by side comparisions of operating costs of both the new and old libraries. It should be noted that the bond referendum included money to rehab some of the other libraries. The City Council recently refused to issue the portion of the bonds to finance the rehab of the Walker Library, one of the most used libraries in the system. Not responsible? NRP has generally been good for the city. It morphed a bit from its housing goals and probably provided to much money to some of the stable neighborhoods (is East Isles, Cedar Isles Dean and any neighborhood that borders on Richfield or Edina), its done better as the program has matured. Overall this city is in better shape than most cities of similar size. Terrell Brown Loring Park REMINDERS: 1. Think a member has violated the rules? Email the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. For state and national discussions see: http://e-democracy.org/discuss.html For external forums, see: http://e-democracy.org/mninteract Minneapolis Issues Forum - A City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
RE: [Mpls] My last words on the subject
--- Michael Atherton [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I could always find similar statistics and references that show the dangers of motor vehicles to drivers, passengers, pedestrians, and small children, but no one is proposing that we ban automobiles (although they probably should). Things that _can_ be used safely, without causing harm to the user or others (partial list): Handguns Assault rifles Automobiles Alcohol Trampolines Swimming Pools Motorcycles Things that can't be used without causing harm to the user and/or those around him/her (partial list): Cigarettes Crack cocaine Crystal meth Hope that helps, Terrell Brown Loring Park REMINDERS: 1. Think a member has violated the rules? Email the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. For state and national discussions see: http://e-democracy.org/discuss.html For external forums, see: http://e-democracy.org/mninteract Minneapolis Issues Forum - A City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
Re: [Mpls] 137 Minneapolis cops to lose jobs through 2008
--- Victoria Heller [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Commentary: Essential services will continue to disappear and property taxes will continue to increase UNTIL MINNEAPOLIS VOTERS pay attention to the cash hemorrhage being perpetuated downtown at City Hall. Weren't we told that all of this new publicly financed development (more than $500 million worth over the past several years) was going to increase our tax base? What happened to all of the new tax revenue? Minneapolis can't even fund its pensions. [TB] I think Minneapolis voters have paid attention to what is referred to as the cash hemorrhage being perpetuated downtown at City Hall That is a big part of why Sharon Sayles Belton, Jackie Cherryhomes and Joan Campbell no longer have offices in City Hall. When RT Rybak ran for Mayor he made a big issue of that, as you may recall the election for Mayor that year wasn't particularly close, most of the members of the Council would have liked to have won by the margin that he did. To his credit, Rybak developed a long term financial plan. While projects, such as Target, may have added to the tax base the added taxes don't go into the general fund until the bonds are paid off. You may remember that discussion from the last Mayor's race. As for the pensions, that predates SSB, it likely predates Don Fraser. All the current folks at City Hall are doing is paying for it, they certainly didn't create it. Terrell Brown Loring Park REMINDERS: 1. Think a member has violated the rules? Email the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. For state and national discussions see: http://e-democracy.org/discuss.html For external forums, see: http://e-democracy.org/mninteract Minneapolis Issues Forum - A City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
Re: [Mpls] Thoughts on neighorhood smoking issues
As someone said, it's probably a seasonal issue. For half of the year, most people in Minneapolis keep their windows closed and don't hear most of what is happening in their neighborhood anyway. At that same time of year, its cold enough to discourage people from standing around outside and smoking anyway. When spring comes and people open their windows, police calls go up. People hear things that they haven't been hearing, such a stuff blowing in the wind, and call the cops. Its just like people who forget how to drive in the snow and make the first snowfall of the year a traffic mess. I thought we were encouraging people to get out and enjoy the night time venues that this community has to offer. A stroll down the street in my neighborhood suggests that people are doing just that. Now we don't want people to go outside? Huh? If its litter, put out a trash can, or a large ornamental ash tray. I think most business owners try to keep the area outside their business reasonably clean. Littering is illegal. If it becomes a problem outside some establishments there are a number of existing ways to deal with it. Personally I'm not convinced that banning smoking in bars and resturants will lead to a big increase in littering. Being outside is not illegal. Being outside does not harm anyone. It seems as there are a few people who are getting to worked up about nothing. Terrell Brown Loring Park REMINDERS: 1. Think a member has violated the rules? Email the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. For state and national discussions see: http://e-democracy.org/discuss.html For external forums, see: http://e-democracy.org/mninteract Minneapolis Issues Forum - A City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
Re: [Mpls] some more smoking....and a 3 dollar turn-a-round fee!!!!!!
--- Robert Yorga [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Why can't all our buses run on electricity or something that does not significantly pollute? How about what they do in London? Charge 8 bucks to come in and out of the city? How about that? they haven't rolled up the sidewalks there, London is still moving and shaking and will be the better for it. So let's c'mon.. let's do it, even three dollars will slow some traffic coming into Mpls..that money could be earmarked for clean air projects...Which right should we protect, your right to pollute or my right to breathe clean air? [TB] Today's Strib reported that, to their credit, Metro Transit will begin using much cleaner burning fuel in about half of their bus fleet later this year. The cleaner fuel cuts out about 2/3 of the emissions. They've also got some non-disel busses running routes. Then there's the London thing. It's a congestion charge for Central London, not the entire city. London has a Mayor, a guy by the name of Ken Livingstone, who is much more willing to take political risks than the Mayor of Minneapolis. Reduced polution may have been an outcome, the target was to reduce congestion, to move people to public transit. The London fee applies only to certain parts of the day, starting before the morning rush hour and ending in the evening. Clearly there is a correlation between increasing use of public transit and reducing polution. I doubt that the City of Minneapolis has the legal authority to impose a fee to drive in downtown. However, since the city owns most of the parking spaces and most of the cars driving to downtown park there, the city could probably accomplish the same thing by increasing parking fees. Charge more to park at times when traffic is congested. The parking fee changes would be much easier to implement than the London system which relies on cameras and a call in system to pay the fee along with permits and maybe an online payment method. Triple parking fees between 7 AM and 5 PM and more people will take the bus (or in 11 more days the Ventura Express). If it doesn't the city gets a bunch more bucks. Terrell Brown Loring Park REMINDERS: 1. Think a member has violated the rules? Email the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. For state and national discussions see: http://e-democracy.org/discuss.html For external forums, see: http://e-democracy.org/mninteract Minneapolis Issues Forum - A City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
[Mpls] Smoking Ban
When a politician doesnt want to make a decision, what does s/he do? Calls for a task force to study the issue. Yesterdays Minneapolis City Council Health and Human Service Committee meeting: One alternative that has emerged is a task force to look at the issue, something Council President Paul Ostrow said he could support. We need to look at this issue to the greatest extent possible. It's something we need to spend time talking about, he said. (Strib: http://www.startribune.com/stories/462/4817052.html ) English translation: I need to stand outside with my finger in the air to find out which way the political winds are blowing. Note to City Council: Take a look at the medical facts. People are suffering unneeded early death. You dont allow it in the Council Chambers, why should anyone else need to accept it in their workplace? Terrell Brown Loring Park __ Do you Yahoo!? Friends. Fun. Try the all-new Yahoo! Messenger. http://messenger.yahoo.com/ REMINDERS: 1. Think a member has violated the rules? Email the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. For state and national discussions see: http://e-democracy.org/discuss.html For external forums, see: http://e-democracy.org/mninteract Minneapolis Issues Forum - A City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
Re: [Mpls] Those damned statistics - ask and ye shall receive
Maybe we should avoid the use of misleading words like toxic when it's clear that no one is dying from a simple exposure to smoke (aside from people with existing conditions, allergies, etc). Apparently the problem for smokers is long term, repeated, daily, frequent exposure to this smoke. Perhaps a look at a dictionary is appropriate: http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=toxic I don't think there is any question that this stuff is capable of causing injury or death tox·ic( P ) Pronunciation Key (tksk) adj. 1. Of, relating to, or caused by a toxin or other poison: a toxic condition; toxic hepatitis. 2. Capable of causing injury or death, especially by chemical means; poisonous: food preservatives that are toxic in concentrated amounts; a dump for toxic industrial wastes. See Synonyms at poisonous. n. A toxic chemical or other substance. toxic \Toxic\, Toxical \Toxic*al\, a. [L. toxicum poison, originally, a poison in which arrows were dipped, Gr. toxiko`n (sc. ?) poison for smearing arrows with, fr. toxiko`s of or for the bow, from to`xon bow, arrow. Cf. Intoxicate.] Of or pertaining to poison; poisonous; as, toxic medicines. toxic adj : of or relating to or caused by a toxin or poison; suffering from exposure to toxic substances [ant: nontoxic] Terrell Brown LoringPark __ Do you Yahoo!? Friends. Fun. Try the all-new Yahoo! Messenger. http://messenger.yahoo.com/ REMINDERS: 1. Think a member has violated the rules? Email the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. For state and national discussions see: http://e-democracy.org/discuss.html For external forums, see: http://e-democracy.org/mninteract Minneapolis Issues Forum - A City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
RE: [Mpls] smoking ban
--- Michael Atherton [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Ed Felien wrote: Your freedom to swing your foot ends with my butt. Does this imply that my foot is resting on your butt? An unpleasant thought, but maybe an apt metaphor. Maybe you should move your butt out of range of my foot. [TB] I'm not sure why someone should be expected to change their life because someone insists on doing something stupid, dangerous, or in the case of the kick in the ass is probably a felony. It's not just the other customers. Employers are expected to provide a safe workplace, thus various methods of keeping air clean in manufacturing plants and auto body repair shops. We recall children's toys if a single individual is killed or injured, yet no one has ever figured out a safe way to use tobacco and thousands are killed each year. Don't those working in a business serving food or alcohol deserve the same safe workplace that everyone else does? Terrell Brown Loring Park __ Do you Yahoo!? Friends. Fun. Try the all-new Yahoo! Messenger. http://messenger.yahoo.com/ REMINDERS: 1. Think a member has violated the rules? Email the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. For state and national discussions see: http://e-democracy.org/discuss.html For external forums, see: http://e-democracy.org/mninteract Minneapolis Issues Forum - A City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
