RE: Falling for address collection (Was: Evil Bit and Spread Spectrum IP Addressing - NANOG Source Address Shaping)

2012-03-05 Thread Leigh Porter
I'm sorry but I have failed to understand the grammar of these bizarre posts. Is it just me or do they actually make very little sense? What is perhaps scary is that I know somebody who talks just like that (i.e. makes little sense) and I really thought it may be them... It isn't because they

Re: Falling for address collection (Was: Evil Bit and Spread Spectrum IP Addressing - NANOG Source Address Shaping)

2012-03-05 Thread Jay Ashworth
- Original Message - From: Leigh Porter leigh.por...@ukbroadband.com I'm sorry but I have failed to understand the grammar of these bizarre posts. Is it just me or do they actually make very little sense? UNaltered REPRODUCTION and DISSEMINATION of this IMPORTANT information is

Re: Programmers with network engineering skills

2012-03-05 Thread Carlos Martinez-Cagnazzo
Never said it was *perfect*. But you probably haven't a good (in CV terms at least) prorgrammer assigned to you but didn't know the difference between a TCP port and an IP protocol number. Or the difference between an Ethernet and an IP address. For me at least (and I grant you that everyone's

IBM/BNT G8264, VMready, and OpenFlow

2012-03-05 Thread Dan Weeks
My organization is looking into various software-defined switches for some dynamic firewall and virtualization applications. Can anyone here speak about experience with IBM/BNT VMready or OpenFlow or specifically about the BNT G8264? Any feedback would be greatly appreciated. -- Daniel M.

Re: Programmers with network engineering skills

2012-03-05 Thread Scott Helms
I've played on both sides of the fence of this one, but I think the key piece is that you have to get enough software engineering for your tool to fit the life cycle it needs to follow and enough domain specific knowledge to for the tool to do what it exists to do. If you lack *either* of

Global Naps?

2012-03-05 Thread Mark Stevens
Global NAPs seemingly shutdown all tandem services last week and it is causing major congestion issues with routing calls. Anyone have more information on this mess as it seems to be in it's 4th day? Thanks Mark Stevens

Re: Global Naps?

2012-03-05 Thread Alex Rubenstein
Bankruptcy liquidation. - Original Message - From: Mark Stevens mana...@monmouth.com To: nanog@nanog.org nanog@nanog.org Sent: Mon Mar 05 13:46:15 2012 Subject: Global Naps? Global NAPs seemingly shutdown all tandem services last week and it is causing major congestion issues with

Re: Programmers with network engineering skills

2012-03-05 Thread Carlos Martinez-Cagnazzo
Scott, I fully agree with you. In fact, I was just commenting on *my* experiences and never implied that they would / should apply the same for everyone. cheers! Carlos On 3/5/12 3:53 PM, Scott Helms wrote: I've played on both sides of the fence of this one, but I think the key piece is that

Re: Global Naps?

2012-03-05 Thread Mark Stevens
Seems some carriers ignored the fact GNAPs was shutting down and are still trying route calls to them which then causes a serious post dial delay while route advancing is taking place. I hope some carriers read this thread and check their routing. Mark On 3/5/2012 1:56 PM, Bill Woodcock

Re: Programmers with network engineering skills

2012-03-05 Thread Owen DeLong
Given my experience to date with the assumptions made by programers about networking in the following: Apps (iOS apps, Droid apps, etc.) Consumer Electronics Microcontrollers Home Routers I have to say that the strategy being used to date, whichever one it is, is

Re: Programmers with network engineering skills

2012-03-05 Thread Keegan Holley
2012/3/2 Randy Bush ra...@psg.com In my experience the path of least resistance is to get a junior network engineer and mentor he/she into improving his/hers programming skills than go the other way around. and then the organization pays forever to maintain the crap code while the

Re: Programmers with network engineering skills

2012-03-05 Thread Keegan Holley
2012/3/5 Owen DeLong o...@delong.com Given my experience to date with the assumptions made by programers about networking in the following: Apps (iOS apps, Droid apps, etc.) Consumer Electronics Microcontrollers Home Routers I have to say that the strategy

Re: Programmers with network engineering skills

2012-03-05 Thread Scott Helms
Owen, I'd say that everyone's PoV on this is going to be experience driven. I've seen both approaches work (and both fail) and IMO the determining factor was matching the right approach with the project. I don't believe that you can develop a large scale project (large scale being a

Clueful road runner contact?

2012-03-05 Thread goemon
Anyone have a clueful road runner contact? -Dan

POLL: Network and Service Status Pages

2012-03-05 Thread Jay Ashworth
Every six months or so, I poll the mailing list for links to your favorite status pages for carriers, web services, and the like, to add to the Dashboard page at http://www.outages.org If you have any you like, which you know are still working, and are publicly accessible, that you'd like

Re: Clueful road runner contact?

2012-03-05 Thread -Hammer-
Wile E Coyote knows all about him. Sorry, couldn't resist. -Hammer- I was a normal American nerd -Jack Herer On 3/5/2012 3:26 PM, goe...@anime.net wrote: Anyone have a clueful road runner contact? -Dan

Re: Global Naps?

2012-03-05 Thread Doug Barton
FYI, picking an existing message, hitting reply, and then changing the subject line is not a good way to start a new thread. It causes your message to appear in an odd location for those of us who use threaded mail readers, and may cause your message to be ignored altogether. hth, Doug

Re: Programmers with network engineering skills

2012-03-05 Thread Owen DeLong
On Mar 5, 2012, at 12:51 PM, Scott Helms wrote: Owen, I'd say that everyone's PoV on this is going to be experience driven. I've seen both approaches work (and both fail) and IMO the determining factor was matching the right approach with the project. I don't believe that you can

Re: Programmers with network engineering skills

2012-03-05 Thread William Herrin
On Mon, Mar 5, 2012 at 6:46 PM, Owen DeLong o...@delong.com wrote: However, the bigger problem (from my experience-driven POV) is that it is not so intuitively obvious that developing a network-based product using a team consisting entirely of developers who view the network as an unnecessarily

Re: Programmers with network engineering skills

2012-03-05 Thread Michael Thomas
On 03/05/2012 03:46 PM, Owen DeLong wrote: However, the bigger problem (from my experience-driven POV) is that it is not so intuitively obvious that developing a network-based product using a team consisting entirely of developers who view the network as an unnecessarily complicated serial

Re: Programmers with network engineering skills

2012-03-05 Thread Justin M. Streiner
On Mon, 5 Mar 2012, Owen DeLong wrote: However, the bigger problem (from my experience-driven POV) is that it is not so intuitively obvious that developing a network-based product using a team consisting entirely of developers who view the network as an unnecessarily complicated serial port

Re: Programmers with network engineering skills

2012-03-05 Thread Jimmy Hess
On Mon, Mar 5, 2012 at 6:09 PM, Justin M. Streiner strei...@cluebyfour.org wrote: Admittedly we (the 'network guys') don't always make it easy for them. RFCs get obsoleted by newer RFCs, but the newer RFCs might still reference items from the original RFC, etc.  This can turn into developing

Re: Programmers with network engineering skills

2012-03-05 Thread Alain Hebert
About (5 thru 6) Hard to keep a straight face in front of a customer when, after assigning him a IP in our 192.172.250.0 range... ... He ask why are we NATing using private IP's. We also had plenty of experience with ppl getting confused about 16, 17. Your could add L2

Re: Programmers with network engineering skills

2012-03-05 Thread Mark Andrews
In message CAAAwwbXPpNEU_aKgUe=9si2zayn30+nmrhosv2t4ag5fuet...@mail.gmail.com , Jimmy Hess writes: On Mon, Mar 5, 2012 at 6:09 PM, Justin M. Streiner strei...@cluebyfour.org wrote: Admittedly we (the 'network guys') don't always make it easy for them. RF= Cs get obsoleted by newer RFCs,

Re: Programmers with network engineering skills

2012-03-05 Thread Randy
if I may chime in - It is the nature of the corporate-beast which has changed. When I was starting out in the 80's and even through the early 90's network eng and sys eng went hand in hand. Today it is far more silo'd. NetEng, SysEng are very *distinct* and as a result different groups today