Re: DANE of SMTP Survey

2021-06-11 Thread John Levine
It appears that Tom Ivar Helbekkmo via NANOG said: >John Levine writes: > >> I have signed all 300 zones on my DNS servers, but only about half of >> them have working DNSSEC because there is no practical way to install >> the DS records. > >Sounds like ICANN, having told us for a very long time

Re: DANE of SMTP Survey

2021-06-11 Thread Tom Ivar Helbekkmo via NANOG
John Levine writes: > I have signed all 300 zones on my DNS servers, but only about half of > them have working DNSSEC because there is no practical way to install > the DS records. Sounds like ICANN, having told us for a very long time that they want DNSSEC everywhere, should attempt to get a

Re: DANE of SMTP Survey

2021-06-11 Thread John Levine
It appears that Tom Ivar Helbekkmo via NANOG said: >Jeroen Massar via NANOG writes: > >> No, not even kidding. For many organisations DNSSEC is 'scary' and a >> burden as it feels 'fragile' for them. > >Unfortunately, yes. And those of us who use it know that this is a >myth. With modern

Re: DANE of SMTP Survey

2021-06-11 Thread Tom Ivar Helbekkmo via NANOG
Jeroen Massar via NANOG writes: > No, not even kidding. For many organisations DNSSEC is 'scary' and a > burden as it feels 'fragile' for them. Unfortunately, yes. And those of us who use it know that this is a myth. With modern software, DNSSEC is quick and easy to set up, and works just

Re: DANE of SMTP Survey

2021-06-08 Thread Mark Tinka
On 6/3/21 23:41, babydr DBA James W. Laferriere wrote: The Signing of the 'Zone' ,  Can the 'Zone' be signed by a self-signed key ?  Or MUST I (and others) rely on a external certificate authority ? Mind you I notice in rfc6487 (note(s)) about self-signed certificates . So

Re: DANE of SMTP Survey

2021-06-04 Thread babydr DBA James W. Laferriere
Hello Mr. Tinka & Mr. Andrews , Please see below . On Thu, 3 Jun 2021, Mark Tinka wrote: On 6/3/21 00:25, babydr DBA James W. Laferriere wrote: The Below is to keep thread of thought accurate ... On Wed, 2 Jun 2021, Mark Tinka wrote: * Step 2 - take your time cluing up on

Re: DANE of SMTP Survey

2021-06-03 Thread Mark Andrews
DANE works with self generated CERTs. The TLSA record provides the cryptographic link back to the DNSSEC root. -- Mark Andrews > On 3 Jun 2021, at 22:32, babydr DBA James W. Laferriere > wrote: > > Hello Mark , > >> On Wed, 2 Jun 2021, Mark Tinka wrote: >>> On 6/2/21 11:07, Jeroen

Re: DANE of SMTP Survey

2021-06-03 Thread babydr DBA James W. Laferriere
Hello Mark , On Wed, 2 Jun 2021, Mark Tinka wrote: On 6/2/21 11:07, Jeroen Massar via NANOG wrote: As for solutions: better education, more improvements to the tools & making it easier. CDS records already help a lot. But we might also need to improve recovery mechanisms, as f-ups

Re: DANE of SMTP Survey

2021-06-03 Thread Mark Tinka
On 6/3/21 00:25, babydr DBA James W. Laferriere wrote: Again ,  Will this handle the case of self-signed only ? Not sure I understand your question, in both cases of recursion and authoritative. Mark.

Re: DANE of SMTP Survey

2021-06-03 Thread Mark Tinka
On 6/3/21 04:53, Jeroen Massar via NANOG wrote:  Jeroen   (who has the majority of domains under my control DNSSEC signed, but... not all; need to do the DANE part though still) You and me both, on the DANE bit :-). Mark.

Re: DANE of SMTP Survey

2021-06-02 Thread Jeroen Massar via NANOG
[ The kicker about DNSSEC is in the dnsviz links, enjoy ;) TLDR: As long as the very big providers don't demand DNSSEC / DANE, why bother as a small network (just, be prepared to deploy when it starts affecting spam scoring or your search rankings), but small networks do benefit unlike the

Re: DANE of SMTP Survey

2021-06-02 Thread Scott Morizot
On Wed, Jun 2, 2021 at 8:54 AM Bjørn Mork wrote: > Jeroen Massar via NANOG writes: > > > For many organisations DNSSEC is 'scary' and a burden as it feels > > 'fragile' for them. > > For "many"? Can you name one that doesn't feel like that? > >

Re: DANE of SMTP Survey

2021-06-02 Thread Jeroen Massar via NANOG
On 2021-06-02 15:47, Bjørn Mork wrote: Jeroen Massar via NANOG writes: For many organisations DNSSEC is 'scary' and a burden as it feels 'fragile' for them. For "many"? Can you name one that doesn't feel like that? Large organisations with 24/7 NOC teams where at least a few folks work

Re: DANE of SMTP Survey

2021-06-02 Thread Bjørn Mork
Jeroen Massar via NANOG writes: > For many organisations DNSSEC is 'scary' and a burden as it feels > 'fragile' for them. For "many"? Can you name one that doesn't feel like that? https://www.arin.net/vault/announcements/2019/20190204.html

Re: DANE of SMTP Survey

2021-06-02 Thread Mark Tinka
On 6/2/21 11:07, Jeroen Massar via NANOG wrote: As for solutions: better education, more improvements to the tools & making it easier. CDS records already help a lot. But we might also need to improve recovery mechanisms, as f-ups are made, and you don't want to be off this Internet thing

Re: DANE of SMTP Survey

2021-06-02 Thread Jeroen Massar via NANOG
> On 20210601, at 15:15, Moritz Müller via NANOG wrote: > > Hi, > > DANE for SMTP is not deployed on large scale. Together with researchers from > Seoul National University, Virginia Tech and the University of Twente, we > would like to understand which challenges operators face when

DANE of SMTP Survey

2021-06-01 Thread Moritz Müller via NANOG
Hi, DANE for SMTP is not deployed on large scale. Together with researchers from Seoul National University, Virginia Tech and the University of Twente, we would like to understand which challenges operators face when deploying DANE for SMTP. Also, we would like to understand how operators