Re: External sanity checks

2011-02-05 Thread Siggi Bjarnason
I've been using Site24x7 for some time now and am very pleased with them, plus their pricing is very reasonable. Siggi Bjarnason si...@bjarnason.us In free countries, every man is entitled to express his opinions and every other man is entitled not to listen. - G. Norman Collie On Thu, Feb 3,

Re: quietly....

2011-02-05 Thread Jack Bates
On 2/5/2011 1:37 AM, Owen DeLong wrote: Not sure how I feel about a more adaptive version. Sounds like it would be better than the current state, but, I vastly prefer I pay, you route. If I want filtration, I'll tell you. I generally agree with you. However, I also believe that every network

Re: External sanity checks

2011-02-05 Thread Ghislain
Le 05/02/2011 08:59, Siggi Bjarnason a écrit : I've been using Site24x7 for some time now and am very pleased with them, plus their pricing is very reasonable. i am very pleased by serverguard24.com services. -- Cordialement, Ghislain smime.p7s Description: S/MIME Cryptographic Signature

Re: quietly....

2011-02-05 Thread Roland Perry
In article alpine.bsf.2.00.1102041723070.54...@murf.icantclick.org, david raistrick dr...@icantclick.org writes But NAT does have the useful (I think) side effect that I don't have to renumber my network when I change upstream providers - whether that's once But (what I keep being told) you

Re: quietly....

2011-02-05 Thread Roland Perry
In article 20110204225150.6fac49b2...@drugs.dv.isc.org, Mark Andrews ma...@isc.org writes But NAT does have the useful (I think) side effect that I don't have to renumber my network when I change upstream providers - whether that's once every five years like I just did with my ADSL, or once

Re: quietly....

2011-02-05 Thread Roland Perry
In article f432e474-9725-4159-870a-d5432fe6e...@delong.com, Owen DeLong o...@delong.com writes What is important with IPv6 is to teach the generation of hammer-wielding mechanics who have grown up rarely seeing a screw and never knowing that there were wrenches that there are new tools

Re: Leasing of space via non-connectivity providers (was: Re: And so it ends... )

2011-02-05 Thread bmanning
On Thu, Feb 03, 2011 at 04:54:42PM +, John Curran wrote: On Feb 3, 2011, at 11:32 AM, Jon Lewis wrote: My point being, the leasing of IP space to non-connectivity customers is already well established, whether it's technically permitted by the [ir]relevant RIRs. I fully expect this

Re: quietly....

2011-02-05 Thread Owen DeLong
On Feb 5, 2011, at 1:54 AM, Roland Perry wrote: In article alpine.bsf.2.00.1102041723070.54...@murf.icantclick.org, david raistrick dr...@icantclick.org writes But NAT does have the useful (I think) side effect that I don't have to renumber my network when I change upstream providers -

Re: Post-Exhaustion-phase punishment for early adopters

2011-02-05 Thread Ralph J.Mayer
Hi, If you are using your block, why would you worry? If not are not using your block, why would you need it? You may define using Hint: even IPs not pingable from the Internet are being used. Not everyone is an ISP/Webhoster ... with public services. -- Viele Grüße / Kind Regards /

Re: Leasing of space via non-connectivity providers

2011-02-05 Thread John Curran
On Feb 5, 2011, at 5:57 AM, bmann...@vacation.karoshi.com wrote: For the ARIN region, it would be nice to know how you'd like ARIN perform in the presence of such activity (leasing IP addresses by ISP not providing connectivity). It's possible that such is perfectly reasonable and to simply

Re: Using IPv6 with prefixes shorter than a /64 on a LAN

2011-02-05 Thread Mark Andrews
In message 4d4ca1b1.5060...@brightok.net, Jack Bates writes: On 2/4/2011 6:45 PM, Mark Andrews wrote: I used to work for CSIRO. Their /16's which were got back in the late 80's will now be /48's. That's why I didn't try doing any adjustments of X is the new /32. The whole paradigm

Re: quietly....

2011-02-05 Thread Mark Andrews
In message xq1vy4e3bstnf...@perry.co.uk, Roland Perry writes: In article 20110204225150.6fac49b2...@drugs.dv.isc.org, Mark Andrews ma...@isc.org writes But NAT does have the useful (I think) side effect that I don't have to renumber my network when I change upstream providers - whether

Re: quietly....

2011-02-05 Thread Mark Andrews
In message eqde49gvpstnf...@perry.co.uk, Roland Perry writes: In article f432e474-9725-4159-870a-d5432fe6e...@delong.com, Owen DeLong o...@delong.com writes What is important with IPv6 is to teach the generation of hammer-wielding mechanics who have grown up rarely seeing a screw and never

Random Port Blocking at Hotels (was: Re: quietly....)

2011-02-05 Thread Joel M Snyder
If they don't document partial internet access blockage in the contract and the contract says they are providing internet access, then, they are in breach and you are free to depart without a termination fee and in most cases, demand a refund for service to date. (Yes, I have successfully

Re: Using IPv6 with prefixes shorter than a /64 on a LAN

2011-02-05 Thread Jack Bates
On 2/5/2011 6:47 AM, Mark Andrews wrote: So why the ~!#! are you insisting on comparing IPv4 allocations with IPv6 alocations. Because that is where the comparison must be made, at the RIR allocation size/rate level. There are two sizes. Those that fit into a /32 and those that don't. The

Re: Random Port Blocking at Hotels (was: Re: quietly....)

2011-02-05 Thread John Levine
and saying by God, this Owen character is right, we're in breach of contract and his definition of the purity of Internet ports has so stunned us with its symmetry and loveliness that we shall bow down and sin no more! Thank you Mr. DeLong from making the blind see again! More likely uh, oh,

Re: Using IPv6 with prefixes shorter than a /64 on a LAN

2011-02-05 Thread bmanning
On Sat, Feb 05, 2011 at 11:47:10PM +1100, Mark Andrews wrote: In message 4d4ca1b1.5060...@brightok.net, Jack Bates writes: On 2/4/2011 6:45 PM, Mark Andrews wrote: I used to work for CSIRO. Their /16's which were got back in the late 80's will now be /48's. That's why I didn't

Re: Leasing of space via non-connectivity providers

2011-02-05 Thread bmanning
On Sat, Feb 05, 2011 at 12:40:44PM +, John Curran wrote: On Feb 5, 2011, at 5:57 AM, bmann...@vacation.karoshi.com wrote: For the ARIN region, it would be nice to know how you'd like ARIN perform in the presence of such activity (leasing IP addresses by ISP not providing

Re: Leasing of space via non-connectivity providers

2011-02-05 Thread John Curran
On Feb 5, 2011, at 11:22 AM, bmann...@vacation.karoshi.com wrote: as you pointed out back in oh, IETF-29, actual network operators don't participate much in the standards setting process so its no wonder RFC 2050 has (several) blind-spots when it comes to operational reality.

Re: Leasing of space via non-connectivity providers

2011-02-05 Thread Patrick W. Gilmore
On Feb 5, 2011, at 12:24 PM, John Curran wrote: On Feb 5, 2011, at 11:22 AM, bmann...@vacation.karoshi.com wrote: as you pointed out back in oh, IETF-29, actual network operators don't participate much in the standards setting process so its no wonder RFC 2050 has (several)

Re: Leasing of space via non-connectivity providers (was: Re: And so it ends... )

2011-02-05 Thread Joel Jaeggli
the practice predates ARIN by many years... FWIW... No reason to play coy... (ep.net) --bill

Re: Leasing of space via non-connectivity providers

2011-02-05 Thread Bill Woodcock
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On Feb 5, 2011, at 11:22 AM, bmann...@vacation.karoshi.com wrote: ARIN's community certinly is dominated by a particular type of network operator. It's dominated by the type of network operator who shows up and participates. Generally, I hear

Re: Leasing of space via non-connectivity providers

2011-02-05 Thread bmanning
On Sat, Feb 05, 2011 at 12:24:01PM -0500, John Curran wrote: On Feb 5, 2011, at 11:22 AM, bmann...@vacation.karoshi.com wrote: as you pointed out back in oh, IETF-29, actual network operators don't participate much in the standards setting process so its no wonder RFC 2050 has

Re: Leasing of space via non-connectivity providers

2011-02-05 Thread bmanning
On Sat, Feb 05, 2011 at 10:17:29AM -0800, Bill Woodcock wrote: -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On Feb 5, 2011, at 11:22 AM, bmann...@vacation.karoshi.com wrote: ARIN's community certinly is dominated by a particular type of network operator. It's dominated by the type of

Re: Leasing of space via non-connectivity providers

2011-02-05 Thread John Curran
On Feb 5, 2011, at 1:18 PM, bmann...@vacation.karoshi.com wrote: this report suggests that the question is not RIR specific. http://ciara.fiu.edu/publications/Rubi%20-%20Property%20Rights%20in%20IP%20Numbers.pdf but thats just me. FYI - Also remember to consider the

Re: Leasing of space via non-connectivity providers

2011-02-05 Thread John Curran
On Feb 5, 2011, at 1:27 PM, bmann...@vacation.karoshi.com wrote: On Sat, Feb 05, 2011 at 10:17:29AM -0800, Bill Woodcock wrote: ... It's dominated by the type of network operator who shows up and participates. Generally, I hear what you're saying and don't disagree, but this is one of

Re: And so it ends...

2011-02-05 Thread James P. Ashton
John, It seams that by stating Note that ARIN can't allow transfers contrary to the community-developed policy that you intend to say that ARIN, based on your current policies and processes, will not actively update whois information for legacy block holders that either sub-assign or Transfer

Re: Leasing of space via non-connectivity providers

2011-02-05 Thread Bill Woodcock
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On Feb 5, 2011, at 10:27 AM, bmann...@vacation.karoshi.com wrote: If I justified an allocation 20 years ago, under the then current policy, it's presumptuous to presume the power of expropriation. No one presumes it, and a lot of us are in the

Re: And so it ends...

2011-02-05 Thread John Curran
James - ARIN allows legacy holders to update their registration information, in fact, we even allow such via ARIN Online. No agreement is required with ARIN; we provide this service as well as WHOIS and reverse DNS without charge. If you no longer want to use your address space, you

Re: Leasing of space via non-connectivity providers

2011-02-05 Thread bmanning
On Sat, Feb 05, 2011 at 11:01:00AM -0800, Bill Woodcock wrote: -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On Feb 5, 2011, at 10:27 AM, bmann...@vacation.karoshi.com wrote: If I justified an allocation 20 years ago, under the then current policy, it's presumptuous to presume the

Re: Leasing of space via non-connectivity providers

2011-02-05 Thread Owen DeLong
On Feb 5, 2011, at 10:27 AM, bmann...@vacation.karoshi.com wrote: On Sat, Feb 05, 2011 at 10:17:29AM -0800, Bill Woodcock wrote: -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On Feb 5, 2011, at 11:22 AM, bmann...@vacation.karoshi.com wrote: ARIN's community certinly is dominated by a

Re: Leasing of space via non-connectivity providers

2011-02-05 Thread Jack Bates
On 2/5/2011 2:25 PM, Owen DeLong wrote: Your right to use a particular set of addresses on a particular network is not granted by any RIR. It is granted by the people who run the routers on that network. It is up to the operators of each individual network to choose which network numbers they

Re: And so it ends...

2011-02-05 Thread Jimmy Hess
On Sat, Feb 5, 2011 at 1:24 PM, John Curran jcur...@arin.net wrote:    ARIN allows legacy holders to update their registration information, in fact, we even allow such via ARIN Online.  No agreement is required with ARIN; we provide this service as well as WHOIS and reverse DNS without

Re: Leasing of space via non-connectivity providers

2011-02-05 Thread John Levine
Your right to use a particular set of addresses on a particular network is not granted by any RIR. As far as I know, there's no case law about address space assignments. There's been a bunch of cases where someone stole address space by pretending to be the original assignee, like the SF Bay

Re: And so it ends...

2011-02-05 Thread Jack Bates
On 2/5/2011 4:53 PM, Jimmy Hess wrote: *Since ARIN policy at the current time requires specified transfers be made through ARIN, and the recipient of address has to meet a utilization criterion. No ad-hoc transfers would seem to be allowed by current ARIN policies, except non-permanent

Re: Leasing of space via non-connectivity providers

2011-02-05 Thread Jack Bates
On 2/5/2011 5:06 PM, John Levine wrote: If there have been cases with a willing seller and a willing buyer where ARIN has refused to update WHOIS or rDNS, I'd be interested to hear about them. Isn't it moot when you can reallocate the entire block to the other party? Contractual agreements of

RE: Leasing of space via non-connectivity providers

2011-02-05 Thread Aaron Wendel
How can someone steal something from you that you don’t own? From: John Levine [mailto:jo...@iecc.com] Sent: Saturday, February 05, 2011 5:06 PM To: nanog@nanog.org Subject: Re: Leasing of space via non-connectivity providers Your right to use a particular set of addresses on a

Re: Leasing of space via non-connectivity providers

2011-02-05 Thread John R. Levine
If there have been cases with a willing seller and a willing buyer where ARIN has refused to update WHOIS or rDNS, I'd be interested to hear about them. Isn't it moot when you can reallocate the entire block to the other party? Contractual agreements of the sale would enforce the inability to

Re: Leasing of space via non-connectivity providers

2011-02-05 Thread John Levine
In article 0d7e01cbc58a$340347a0$9c09d6e0$@net you write: How can someone steal something from you that you don’t own? Here in the US, until there is statutory or case law, the question of whether the people with legacy IP space assignments own that space is entirely a matter of opinion. I

Re: Leasing of space via non-connectivity providers

2011-02-05 Thread Jack Bates
On 2/5/2011 5:25 PM, John R. Levine wrote: Isn't it moot when you can reallocate the entire block to the other party? Contractual agreements of the sale would enforce the inability to reclaim or remove the reallocation. If the user doesn't match what's in WHOIS, a lot of people will assume

Re: Leasing of space via non-connectivity providers

2011-02-05 Thread William Pitcock
Hi, On Sat, 5 Feb 2011 17:12:40 -0600 Aaron Wendel aa...@wholesaleinternet.net wrote: How can someone steal something from you that you don’t own? Legacy space. The best example I can think of was Choopa's hijacking of Erie Forge and Steel's legacy space. In this case, it was theft as it

Re: Leasing of space via non-connectivity providers

2011-02-05 Thread Ernie Rubi
Good question: Depends on what kind of address space assignment - if you mean legacy IP space, then no there is no case law. Kremen v. ARIN (Northern District of CA) is the only case law out there, but it is on point only as to 'current' IP space. In Kremen, the district court went only

Re: External sanity checks

2011-02-05 Thread Zaid Ali
On Feb 4, 2011, at 1:36 PM, Franck Martin wrote: - Original Message - From: Paul Graydon p...@paulgraydon.co.uk To: nanog@nanog.org Sent: Friday, 4 February, 2011 8:39:09 AM Subject: Re: External sanity checks On 02/03/2011 08:04 AM, Philip Lavine wrote: To all, Does any one

Re: Leasing of space via non-connectivity providers

2011-02-05 Thread Jon Lewis
On Sat, 5 Feb 2011, Jack Bates wrote: That's my point. If a legacy holder can update WHOIS, I presume they can also just allocate the entire block to someone else. It would reflect that in WHOIS, no one would consider it hijacked. Does ARIN accept SWIP requests for IPs within legacy space

Re: Using IPv6 with prefixes shorter than a /64 on a LAN

2011-02-05 Thread Mark Andrews
In message 4d4d5ffc.6020...@brightok.net, Jack Bates writes: On 2/5/2011 6:47 AM, Mark Andrews wrote: So why the ~!#! are you insisting on comparing IPv4 allocations with IPv6 alocations. Because that is where the comparison must be made, at the RIR allocation size/rate level. There

Re: Random Port Blocking at Hotels (was: Re: quietly....)

2011-02-05 Thread Mark Andrews
In message 20110205150005.40621.qm...@joyce.lan, John Levine writes: and saying by God, this Owen character is right, we're in breach of contract and his definition of the purity of Internet ports has so stunned us with its symmetry and loveliness that we shall bow down and sin no more!

Re: Weekend Gedankenexperiment - The Kill Switch

2011-02-05 Thread Fred Baker
On Feb 4, 2011, at 9:49 PM, Hayden Katzenellenbogen wrote: Not sure if it has been said already but wasn't one of the key point for the creation of the internet to create and infrastructure that would survive in the case of all out war and massive destruction. (strategic nuclear strikes)

Re: Random Port Blocking at Hotels (was: Re: quietly....)

2011-02-05 Thread Derek J. Balling
On Feb 5, 2011, at 8:14 PM, Mark Andrews wrote: I have told a hotel they need to install equipment that supports RA guard as I've checked out. This was a hotel that only offered IPv4. Wow... Could that be any more of a waste of yours and their time? This is like telling the cashier at the

Re: Leasing of space via non-connectivity providers

2011-02-05 Thread bmanning
On Sat, Feb 05, 2011 at 09:12:53PM +, John Curran wrote: On Feb 5, 2011, at 2:33 PM, bmann...@vacation.karoshi.com wrote: decides current policy. when current policy directly contridicts the policies under which old address space was allocated, which policy trumps? Bill -

Re: Random Port Blocking at Hotels (was: Re: quietly....)

2011-02-05 Thread John R. Levine
I have told a hotel they need to install equipment that supports RA guard as I've checked out. This was a hotel that only offered IPv4. Hotels ask for feedback on their services. If you see a fault report it in writing. Sure. Bet you ten bucks that no hotel in North America offers IPv6 this

Re: Weekend Gedankenexperiment - The Kill Switch

2011-02-05 Thread Dave CROCKER
On 2/5/2011 6:43 AM, Fred Baker wrote: On Feb 4, 2011, at 9:49 PM, Hayden Katzenellenbogen wrote: Not sure if it has been said already but wasn't one of the key point for the creation of the internet to create and infrastructure that would survive in the case of all out war and massive

RE: Using IPv6 with prefixes shorter than a /64 on a LAN

2011-02-05 Thread Nathan Eisenberg
Still, that is a considerable number of bits we'll have left when the dust settles and the RIR allocation rate drastically slows. Like it did for IPv4? ;) -Nathan

Re: Using IPv6 with prefixes shorter than a /64 on a LAN

2011-02-05 Thread Mark Andrews
In message 4d4df75e.1040...@brightok.net, Jack Bates writes: On 2/5/2011 7:01 PM, Mark Andrews wrote: And did you change the amount of growth space you allowed for each pop? Were you already constrained in your IPv4 growth space and just restored your desired growth margins? Growth rate

RE: Random Port Blocking at Hotels (was: Re: quietly....)

2011-02-05 Thread Nathan Eisenberg
Sure. Bet you ten bucks that no hotel in North America offers IPv6 this year in the wifi they provide to customers. (Conference networks don't count.) John - I happen to know with absolute certainty that the above statement is false. But I'd be happy to take your money! :-) Nathan

Re: Random Port Blocking at Hotels (was: Re: quietly....)

2011-02-05 Thread Mark Andrews
In message alpine.bsf.2.00.1102052106001.53...@joyce.lan, John R. Levine wr ites: I have told a hotel they need to install equipment that supports RA guard as I've checked out. This was a hotel that only offered IPv4. Hotels ask for feedback on their services. If you see a fault report

Re: Random Port Blocking at Hotels (was: Re: quietly....)

2011-02-05 Thread Mark Andrews
In message bc81acea-8dea-4380-8a57-a4f570e3c...@megacity.org, Derek J. Balli ng writes: On Feb 5, 2011, at 8:14 PM, Mark Andrews wrote: I have told a hotel they need to install equipment that supports RA guard as I've checked out. This was a hotel that only offered IPv4. Wow... Could

Re: Random Port Blocking at Hotels (was: Re: quietly....)

2011-02-05 Thread Jima
On 2/5/2011 8:06 PM, John R. Levine wrote: Sure. Bet you ten bucks that no hotel in North America offers IPv6 this year in the wifi they provide to customers. (Conference networks don't count.) http://twitter.com/unquietwiki/status/449593712050176 springs to mind -- it was even *last* year.

Re: Random Port Blocking at Hotels (was: Re: quietly....)

2011-02-05 Thread Owen DeLong
On Feb 5, 2011, at 5:14 PM, Mark Andrews wrote: In message 20110205150005.40621.qm...@joyce.lan, John Levine writes: and saying by God, this Owen character is right, we're in breach of contract and his definition of the purity of Internet ports has so stunned us with its symmetry and

Re: Using IPv6 with prefixes shorter than a /64 on a LAN

2011-02-05 Thread Owen DeLong
On Feb 5, 2011, at 5:20 PM, Jack Bates wrote: On 2/5/2011 7:01 PM, Mark Andrews wrote: And did you change the amount of growth space you allowed for each pop? Were you already constrained in your IPv4 growth space and just restored your desired growth margins? Growth rate has nothing to

Re: Using IPv6 with prefixes shorter than a /64 on a LAN

2011-02-05 Thread Owen DeLong
On Feb 5, 2011, at 6:38 PM, Nathan Eisenberg wrote: Still, that is a considerable number of bits we'll have left when the dust settles and the RIR allocation rate drastically slows. Like it did for IPv4? ;) -Nathan It long since would have if ISPs didn't have to come back annually (or

Re: Using IPv6 with prefixes shorter than a /64 on a LAN

2011-02-05 Thread Jack Bates
On 2/5/2011 8:40 PM, Mark Andrews wrote: A IPv4 /16 supports 64000 potential customers. A IPv6 /32 supports 64000 potential customers. Either you have changed the customer estimates or changed the growth space allowances or were using NAT or You don't suddenly need 256 times the amount of

Re: Using IPv6 with prefixes shorter than a /64 on a LAN

2011-02-05 Thread Jack Bates
On 2/5/2011 9:44 PM, Owen DeLong wrote: In IPv6, we should be looking to do 5 or 10 year allocations. We can afford to be fairly speculative in our allocations in order to preserve greater aggregation. And even if networks were only getting an 8 bit slide, that's 256 trips back to the RIR

Re: Random Port Blocking at Hotels (was: Re: quietly....)

2011-02-05 Thread Paul Timmins
John R. Levine wrote: I have told a hotel they need to install equipment that supports RA guard as I've checked out. This was a hotel that only offered IPv4. Hotels ask for feedback on their services. If you see a fault report it in writing. Sure. Bet you ten bucks that no hotel in North

Re: Weekend Gedankenexperiment - The Kill Switch

2011-02-05 Thread Fred Baker
On Feb 5, 2011, at 6:11 PM, Dave CROCKER wrote: On 2/5/2011 6:43 AM, Fred Baker wrote: On Feb 4, 2011, at 9:49 PM, Hayden Katzenellenbogen wrote: Not sure if it has been said already but wasn't one of the key point for the creation of the internet to create and infrastructure that would

Re: Random Port Blocking at Hotels (was: Re: quietly....)

2011-02-05 Thread Matthew Kaufman
On 2/5/2011 8:15 PM, Paul Timmins wrote: OR just upgrade your gear, and while you're at it, you can now safely enable IPv6 anyway. Well, enable IPv6. Safely? I don't see how upgrading your gear magically makes the various security threats -- including the current topic of rogue RAs -- go

Re: Leasing of space via non-connectivity providers

2011-02-05 Thread Benson Schliesser
On Feb 5, 2011, at 1:01 PM, Bill Woodcock wrote: On Feb 5, 2011, at 10:27 AM, bmann...@vacation.karoshi.com wrote: If I justified an allocation 20 years ago, under the then current policy, it's presumptuous to presume the power of expropriation. No one presumes it, and a lot of us are in

Re: Random Port Blocking at Hotels

2011-02-05 Thread Paul Timmins
Matthew Kaufman wrote: On 2/5/2011 8:15 PM, Paul Timmins wrote: OR just upgrade your gear, and while you're at it, you can now safely enable IPv6 anyway. Well, enable IPv6. Safely? I don't see how upgrading your gear magically makes the various security threats -- including the current

Re: Weekend Gedankenexperiment - The Kill Switch

2011-02-05 Thread Fred Baker
On Feb 5, 2011, at 7:00 PM, Jay Ashworth wrote: - Original Message - From: Fred Baker f...@cisco.com You mean, like drop a couple of trade towers and take out three class five switches, causing communication outages throughout New England and New Jersey, and affecting places as

Re: Random Port Blocking at Hotels (was: Re: quietly....)

2011-02-05 Thread Derek J. Balling
On Feb 5, 2011, at 11:15 PM, Paul Timmins wrote: I know a hospital in Metro Detroit that was offering it on their patient and guest WiFi in 2009. Of course, neither they, nor the individual running the rogue IPv6 router knew that, but as a person running an IPv6 enabled OS, it was really

Re: Random Port Blocking at Hotels (was: Re: quietly....)

2011-02-05 Thread Owen DeLong
On Feb 5, 2011, at 8:30 PM, Matthew Kaufman wrote: On 2/5/2011 8:15 PM, Paul Timmins wrote: OR just upgrade your gear, and while you're at it, you can now safely enable IPv6 anyway. Well, enable IPv6. Safely? I don't see how upgrading your gear magically makes the various security

Re: Random Port Blocking at Hotels (was: Re: quietly....)

2011-02-05 Thread Paul Timmins
Derek J. Balling wrote: On Feb 5, 2011, at 11:15 PM, Paul Timmins wrote: I know a hospital in Metro Detroit that was offering it on their patient and guest WiFi in 2009. Of course, neither they, nor the individual running the rogue IPv6 router knew that, but as a person running an IPv6

Re: Leasing of space via non-connectivity providers

2011-02-05 Thread John Curran
On Feb 5, 2011, at 11:31 PM, Benson Schliesser wrote: ... The ARIN community decides ARIN policy. That policy doesn't inherently reflect community standards in the broader sense, or inherently align with the law for that matter. If the ARIN community were to instruct ARIN to operate in

Re: Leasing of space via non-connectivity providers

2011-02-05 Thread Owen DeLong
On Feb 5, 2011, at 8:31 PM, Benson Schliesser wrote: On Feb 5, 2011, at 1:01 PM, Bill Woodcock wrote: On Feb 5, 2011, at 10:27 AM, bmann...@vacation.karoshi.com wrote: If I justified an allocation 20 years ago, under the then current policy, it's presumptuous to presume the power of

RE: Weekend Gedankenexperiment - The Kill Switch

2011-02-05 Thread George Bonser
Back in the '70s, I always heard survive hostile battlefield conditions and never heard anyone talk about comms survival of a nuclear event, but I wasn't in any interesting conversations, such as in front of funding agencies... To survive an EMP, electronics needs some fancy circuitry.

Re: Weekend Gedankenexperiment - The Kill Switch

2011-02-05 Thread bmanning
On Sat, Feb 05, 2011 at 08:29:44PM -0800, Fred Baker wrote: On Feb 5, 2011, at 6:11 PM, Dave CROCKER wrote: On 2/5/2011 6:43 AM, Fred Baker wrote: On Feb 4, 2011, at 9:49 PM, Hayden Katzenellenbogen wrote: Not sure if it has been said already but wasn't one of the key point for

US Warships jamming Lebanon Internet

2011-02-05 Thread Joly MacFie
Lebanon's Telecom minister is claiming that US Navy radar is blocking the country's Internet.. http://www.naharnet.com/domino/tn/NewsDesk.nsf/0/93A95CA1A4E42178C225782E007371AF The problem, however, is due to a coordination error related to waves, Nahhas told OTV, adding that an investigation

Re: US Warships jamming Lebanon Internet

2011-02-05 Thread Joel Jaeggli
On 2/5/11 9:00 PM, Joly MacFie wrote: Lebanon's Telecom minister is claiming that US Navy radar is blocking the country's Internet.. http://www.naharnet.com/domino/tn/NewsDesk.nsf/0/93A95CA1A4E42178C225782E007371AF Those repeaterless submarine optical systems are really impacted by

Re: Leasing of space via non-connectivity providers

2011-02-05 Thread Benson Schliesser
On Feb 5, 2011, at 2:25 PM, Owen DeLong wrote: The fact that a very large number of network operators use the data contained in the RIR system in a cooperative manner is convenient and makes the internet substantially more useful than I can imagine it would be under alternative scenarios.

Re: Leasing of space via non-connectivity providers

2011-02-05 Thread Benson Schliesser
On Feb 5, 2011, at 10:48 PM, John Curran wrote: You are correct that consensus doesn't assure legality; hence all draft policies receive a specific staff and legal review during the development process. Thanks, John. I'm aware of the legal review, as well as the AC and board gateways

Re: Leasing of space via non-connectivity providers

2011-02-05 Thread John Curran
On Feb 5, 2011, at 8:40 PM, bmann...@vacation.karoshi.com wrote: On Sat, Feb 05, 2011 at 09:12:53PM +, John Curran wrote: RFC 2050 is the document which provides the registry system framework. Jon Postel is an author of same, as well as a founder of ARIN. yup.. i was there when

nlayer contact

2011-02-05 Thread William Pitcock
Hi, Could an nLayer network engineer contact me offlist regarding a service or core router at I'm guessing One Wilshire that is having serious problems? Thanks. William

Re: Leasing of space via non-connectivity providers

2011-02-05 Thread Owen DeLong
On Feb 5, 2011, at 9:24 PM, Benson Schliesser wrote: On Feb 5, 2011, at 2:25 PM, Owen DeLong wrote: The fact that a very large number of network operators use the data contained in the RIR system in a cooperative manner is convenient and makes the internet substantially more useful than

Re: Using IPv6 with prefixes shorter than a /64 on a LAN

2011-02-05 Thread Mark Andrews
In message 4d4e1c5d.20...@brightok.net, Jack Bates writes: On 2/5/2011 8:40 PM, Mark Andrews wrote: A IPv4 /16 supports 64000 potential customers. A IPv6 /32 supports 64000 potential customers. Either you have changed the customer estimates or changed the growth space allowances or were

Re: Leasing of space via non-connectivity providers

2011-02-05 Thread David Conrad
John, On Feb 5, 2011, at 7:33 PM, John Curran wrote: It does not talk to address space allocated to entities from the IANA or other registries prior to the RIRs existance. Is it your belief that Jon did not intend RFC 2050 to apply to the existing allocations maintained by the three

Re: US Warships jamming Lebanon Internet

2011-02-05 Thread Andrew Kirch
On 2/6/2011 12:00 AM, Joly MacFie wrote: Lebanon's Telecom minister is claiming that US Navy radar is blocking the country's Internet.. http://www.naharnet.com/domino/tn/NewsDesk.nsf/0/93A95CA1A4E42178C225782E007371AF The problem, however, is due to a coordination error related to waves,

RE: My upstream ISP does not support IPv6

2011-02-05 Thread Frank Bulk
Here's a chart: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comparison_of_IPv6_support_by_major_transit_providers Frank -Original Message- From: Seth Mattinen [mailto:se...@rollernet.us] Sent: Friday, February 04, 2011 12:16 PM To: nanog@nanog.org Subject: Re: My upstream ISP does not support IPv6 On

Re: US Warships jamming Lebanon Internet

2011-02-05 Thread Mike Lyon
No, it's those Radar Sharks with Frickin' lasers on their heads: http://pokerterms.com/images/sharks-with-lasers-2.jpg -Mike On Sat, Feb 5, 2011 at 10:33 PM, Andrew Kirch trel...@trelane.net wrote: On 2/6/2011 12:00 AM, Joly MacFie wrote: Lebanon's Telecom minister is claiming that US Navy

Re: Leasing of space via non-connectivity providers

2011-02-05 Thread John Curran
On Feb 6, 2011, at 1:25 AM, David Conrad wrote: Last I checked, the other four authors of RFC 2050 are still alive. Why not ask them? Bill indicated he was there when it was written in reference to Jon being an author, and I was inquiring to whether he had any knowledge of Jon's intent

Re: US Warships jamming Lebanon Internet

2011-02-05 Thread Martin Millnert
On Sun, Feb 6, 2011 at 12:00 AM, Joly MacFie j...@punkcast.com wrote: Lebanon's Telecom minister is claiming that US Navy radar is blocking the country's Internet.. http://www.naharnet.com/domino/tn/NewsDesk.nsf/0/93A95CA1A4E42178C225782E007371AF The problem, however, is due to a

Re: US Warships jamming Lebanon Internet

2011-02-05 Thread Chad Dailey
I used to work on some of this gear. The transmitters do indeed go to 11. If they want to talk, you won't. On Sun, Feb 6, 2011 at 1:20 AM, Martin Millnert milln...@gmail.com wrote: On Sun, Feb 6, 2011 at 12:00 AM, Joly MacFie j...@punkcast.com wrote: Lebanon's Telecom minister is claiming

Re: US Warships jamming Lebanon Internet

2011-02-05 Thread Michael Painter
Martin Millnert wrote: On Sun, Feb 6, 2011 at 12:00 AM, Joly MacFie j...@punkcast.com wrote: Lebanon's Telecom minister is claiming that US Navy radar is blocking the country's Internet.. http://www.naharnet.com/domino/tn/NewsDesk.nsf/0/93A95CA1A4E42178C225782E007371AF The problem, however,

RE: Weekend Gedankenexperiment - The Kill Switch

2011-02-05 Thread Ryan Finnesey
Does anyone know when they took down connectivity in Egypt did they also bring down the MPLS networks global companies use? Cheers Ryan -Original Message- From: Fred Baker [mailto:f...@cisco.com] Sent: Saturday, February 05, 2011 9:43 AM To: Hayden Katzenellenbogen Cc: NANOG list