On Fri, Jul 11, 2014 at 09:50:22AM -0700, Owen DeLong wrote:
[...]
> I'm always surprised that folks at smaller exchanges don't form
> consortiums to build a mutually beneficial transit AS that connects to
> a larger remote exchange.
In my experience, the price of buying transit from established p
On Jul 11, 2014, at 8:18 PM, Randy Bush wrote:
>>> And, for the record, it's pretty widely acknowledge that "The World"
>>> (Barry Shein) was the world's first commercial ISP - offering shell
>>> access in 1989, and at some point started offering PPP dial-up
>>> services. As I recall, they w
I was speaking specifically of the cases where they are already grouped at a
central location such as the 9 in Salt Lake City or the 19 in Denver mentioned
in the example to which I responded.
I’m pretty sure that in the case where they are already grouped into a less
populous exchange point, t
I think we should paint the garden shed blue...
> On Jul 11, 2014, at 7:37 PM, Randy Bush wrote:
>
> of course i received one "don't do that, you should not be painting a
> bikeshed at all, but building a doghouse." i figure that only one is
> not a bad noise level.
>> And, for the record, it's pretty widely acknowledge that "The World"
>> (Barry Shein) was the world's first commercial ISP - offering shell
>> access in 1989, and at some point started offering PPP dial-up
>> services. As I recall, they were a UUnet POP.
> yep. and uunet and psi were halluc
> And, for the record, it's pretty widely acknowledge that "The World"
> (Barry Shein) was the world's first commercial ISP - offering shell
> access in 1989, and at some point started offering PPP dial-up
> services. As I recall, they were a UUnet POP.
yep. and uunet and psi were hallucinati
Matthew Petach wrote:
*sigh*
Fine, fine, y'all are super-attached to your
business-y definitions of ISP.
I'll clarify my earlier point to eliminate this
confusion.
To the core of the internet, if you do not have
an AS number, you do not exist. If your business
does not have an AS number *as f
> need to put a usr everything modem, yes a modem, using inbound ppp on a
> freebsd 10 box and a pots line.
>
> anyone have the hacks for
> o modem switch settings and
> o /etc/ppp/ppp.conf
i have received a few really good looking detailed answers which i will
test when next in the colo and
On Fri, Jul 11, 2014 at 3:58 PM, Jimmy Hess wrote:
> On Fri, Jul 11, 2014 at 5:05 PM, Naslund, Steve
> wrote:
> > Here we go down the rabbit hole again. This is not difficult. An
> Internet Service Provider is an entity that provides Internet connectivity
> to its customers for some considerat
On Fri, Jul 11, 2014 at 5:05 PM, Naslund, Steve wrote:
> Here we go down the rabbit hole again. This is not difficult. An Internet
> Service Provider is an entity that provides Internet connectivity to its
> customers for some consideration.
> If you are looking for a legal definition of an I
On 7/11/14 2:01 PM, Christopher Morrow wrote:
> On Fri, Jul 11, 2014 at 3:07 PM, Blake Hudson wrote:
>> joel jaeggli wrote the following on 7/11/2014 1:39 PM:
>>
>>> CDN's choose which exit the use all the time, it's kinda the raison de
>>> etré.
> they do this with DNS changes for client requests
Does the CIDR report have a 510K prefix limit and crashed or something?
:)
--
TTFN,
patrick
On Jul 11, 2014, at 18:00 , cidr-rep...@potaroo.net wrote:
> This report has been generated at Fri Jul 11 21:10:32 2014 AEST.
> The report analyses the BGP Routing Table of AS2.0 router
> and generates
Here we go down the rabbit hole again. This is not difficult. An Internet
Service Provider is an entity that provides Internet connectivity to its
customers for some consideration.
If you are looking for a legal definition of an ISP you are not going to find
(a satisfactory) one. The FCC d
BGP Update Report
Interval: 03-Jul-14 -to- 10-Jul-14 (7 days)
Observation Point: BGP Peering with AS131072
TOP 20 Unstable Origin AS
Rank ASNUpds % Upds/PfxAS-Name
1 - AS3292 148349 5.8% 321.8 -- TDC TDC A/S,DK
2 - AS12858 87308 3.4%5135.8 -
This report has been generated at Fri Jul 11 21:10:32 2014 AEST.
The report analyses the BGP Routing Table of AS2.0 router
and generates a report on aggregation potential within the table.
Check http://www.cidr-report.org/2.0 for a current version of this report.
Recent Table History
Date
Hi Richard,
You may be confusing Idaho for Portland, but either way we are constantly
adding new POPs and Portland is a great example of us bearing the cost that
ISPs were bearing before to haul traffic from Seattle or San Jose. I would
consider that a great success.
Regarding Comcast in SF, they
William Herrin wrote:
On Fri, Jul 11, 2014 at 11:38 AM, Miles Fidelman
wrote:
Then again, I've often argued that the "universal service fund" used to
subsidize rural carriers - which the large telcos always scream about - is
legitimate, because when we pick up the phone and "dial," we're paying
Actually, there are some examples of this, and I'm surprised Mr. Temkin
didn't point them out. I've been told by rural telcos (RLECs) that
there's a consolidated mini-exchange in Idaho that was originally built
with some support from the state in order exchange phone calls within
Idaho that wou
On Fri, Jul 11, 2014 at 12:52 PM, Scott Helms wrote:
> Matt,
>
> No one said anything of the sort and now you're trying to redirect. You
> said, "There *are* some fundamental basics that are necessary to function
> as an ISP; having an AS number and being able to speak BGP are pretty
> much at t
On Fri, Jul 11, 2014 at 3:07 PM, Blake Hudson wrote:
>
> joel jaeggli wrote the following on 7/11/2014 1:39 PM:
>
>> CDN's choose which exit the use all the time, it's kinda the raison de
>> etré.
they do this with DNS changes for client requests... pushing a
customer to an endpoint reachable acr
Matt,
No one said anything of the sort and now you're trying to redirect. You
said, "There *are* some fundamental basics that are necessary to function
as an ISP; having an AS number and being able to speak BGP are pretty much
at the top of the list." This is false, that's all I said nothing les
I'm sorry. This is a networking mailing list, not a
feel-good-about-yourself mailing list. From the perspective of the
internet routing table, if you don't have your own AS number, you are
completely indistinguishable from your upstream. Period. As far as BGP
is concerned, you don't exist. On
Matt,
They're providing DSL, cable modem, BWA, or FTTx access to residential and
business customers. They belong to various service provider associations
and they're generally the only ISPs in the areas they serve. They're ISPs
by every definition including the FCC's. Having an ASN does _not_ m
Miles Fidelman writes:
> Either way, if one is a customer of both, one will end up paying for
> the infrastructure - it's more about gorillas fighting, which bill it
> shows up on, who ends up pocketing more of the profits, and how many
> negative side-effects result.
In this case, though, this
joel jaeggli wrote the following on 7/11/2014 1:39 PM:
On 7/11/14 11:20 AM, Blake Hudson wrote:
Verizon Policy Blog wrote:
There was, however, congestion at the interconnection link to the
edge of our network (the border router) used by the transit providers
chosen by Netflix to deliver video
Sure. We call those companies "resellers". Or, if they actually do bring
some additional value to the table, they're VARs. Not ISPs.
Matt
On Jul 11, 2014 10:37 AM, "Scott Helms" wrote:
> Matt,
>
> That's simply not true, if it were then several million US subscribers
> wouldn't have access to
On Fri, Jul 11, 2014 at 01:20:21PM -0500, Blake Hudson wrote:
>
> Verizon Policy Blog wrote:
>
> >There was, however, congestion at the interconnection link to the edge of
> >our network (the border router) used by the transit providers chosen by
> >Netflix to deliver video traffic to Verizon’s n
On 7/11/14 11:20 AM, Blake Hudson wrote:
>
> Verizon Policy Blog wrote:
>
>> There was, however, congestion at the interconnection link to the
>> edge of our network (the border router) used by the transit providers
>> chosen by Netflix to deliver video traffic to Verizon’s network.
>
> In what wor
Verizon Policy Blog wrote:
There was, however, congestion at the interconnection link to the edge
of our network (the border router) used by the transit providers
chosen by Netflix to deliver video traffic to Verizon’s network.
In what world does Netflix choose a transit provider into someon
This is an automated weekly mailing describing the state of the Internet
Routing Table as seen from APNIC's router in Japan.
The posting is sent to APOPS, NANOG, AfNOG, AusNOG, SANOG, PacNOG, LacNOG,
TRNOG, CaribNOG and the RIPE Routing Working Group.
Daily listings are sent to bgp-st...@lists.ap
Owen,
That's because you're not thinking about the geography involved. Where
possible the smaller operators often do form groups and partnerships, but
creating networks that serve more than a 3-4 operators often means covering
more distance than if the operators simply go directly to the tier 1 I
Matt,
That's simply not true, if it were then several million US subscribers
wouldn't have access to the Internet at all. There are _lots_ of small
providers that serve rural America (and Canada) that have gotten their IPs
from their transit provider rather than ARIN, are single homed, and have
n
On Fri, Jul 11, 2014 at 11:38 AM, Miles Fidelman
wrote:
> Then again, I've often argued that the "universal service fund" used to
> subsidize rural carriers - which the large telcos always scream about - is
> legitimate, because when we pick up the phone and "dial," we're paying for
> the ability
On Fri, Jul 11, 2014 at 11:38 AM, Miles Fidelman
wrote:
> Well... if you make a phone call to a rural area, or a 3rd world country,
> with a horrible system, is it your telco's responsibility to go out there
> and fix it?
Hi Miles,
The telephone companies offer a remarkably apt case study in how
> Well... if you make a phone call to a rural area, or a 3rd world country,
> with a horrible system, is it your telco's responsibility to go out there and
> fix it?
>
> One might answer, "of course not." It’s a legitimate position, and by this
> argument, Netflix should be paying for bigger p
- Original Message -
> From: "Miles Fidelman"
> Either way, if one is a customer of both, one will end up paying for
> the infrastructure - it's more about gorillas fighting, which bill it
> shows up on, who ends up pocketing more of the profits, and how many
> negative side-effects resul
- Original Message -
> From: "Owen DeLong"
> Would it really be plausible for a small ISP to host caching clusters
> for every streaming content supplier out there?
No, it wouldn't.
But it also wouldn't be necessary. Netflix is the 900 pound gorilla in
that market, and -- if nothing e
On Jul 11, 2014, at 1:32 AM, Vitkovský Adam wrote:
>
>> -Original Message-
>> From: NANOG [mailto:nanog-boun...@nanog.org] On Behalf Of Matthew
>> Petach
>> Sent: Friday, July 11, 2014 3:35 AM
>>
>>
>> So, if Netflix had to pay additional money to get direct links to Verizon,
>> you'
> On Jul 11, 2014, at 9:44 AM, Owen DeLong wrote:
>
> Would it really be plausible for a small ISP to host caching clusters for
> every streaming content supplier out there?
No, but if you have typical internet user streaming uptake, Netflix and Akamai
and then...
Short list, most of the
On Jul 10, 2014, at 8:46 PM, Jima wrote:
> On 2014-07-10 19:40, Miles Fidelman wrote:
>> From another list, I think this puts it nicely (for those of you who
>> don't know Brett, he's been running a small ISP for years
>> http://www.lariat.net/)
>
> While trying to substantiate Mr. Glass' griev
>> in an attempt to force them to host their servers for free
>
> These are the OpenConnect caching boxes, I assume? If that's the case, it's
> incorrect to say that Netflix "refuses to allow [...] caching", simply that
> they prefer to provide caching their way. As it stands, I don't see the
>
*puts on trolling hat*
Maybe the solution can be to have the Netflix client support the
torrent protocol, so the upload from netflix is minimal. Maybe
pre-distribute files encripted, then distribute the de-crypt key once
the medias are distributed enough in different nodes. So netflix would
be d
On Thu, Jul 10, 2014 at 8:46 PM, Jima wrote:
> [...]
> I guess I'm just glad that my home ISP can justify anteing up for a pipe
> to SIX, resources for hosting OpenConnect nodes, and, for that matter, an
> ASN. Indeed, not everyone can.
>
> Jima
>
>
I'm sorry.
If your ISP doesn't have an A
On Fri, Jul 11, 2014 at 11:38 AM, Miles Fidelman
wrote:
>
> Methinks all of the arguments and finger-pointing need to be recognized as
> being mostly posturing for position.
.. at the expense of the customer.
-Jim P.
On Fri, 11 Jul 2014 11:38:03 -0400
Miles Fidelman wrote:
Ahad Aboss wrote:
Interesting point.
The truth is, the ISP is responsible for the quality of experience
for their
end customers regardless of what content the customers consume or
what time
they consume it. They pay a monthly subscri
It’s been a very long time, but I remember that &D3 (or possibly &D2 depending
on particular firmware) and S0=1 were important. I think &C, &R, S6 and
possibly S7 were also important, but don’t remember the required values.
A quick peek at the documentation for those switches should provide obvi
Ahad Aboss wrote:
Interesting point.
The truth is, the ISP is responsible for the quality of experience for their
end customers regardless of what content the customers consume or what time
they consume it. They pay a monthly subscription / access fee and that is
where it stops. ISPs can chose
- Original Message -
> From: "Matthew Petach"
> He rants about Netflix generating huge amounts of traffic
> and refusing to allow ISPs to cache it; and then goes on to
> grumble that Netflix is trying to force them to host caching
> boxes. Does he love caching, or hate caching? I really
>
Interesting point.
The truth is, the ISP is responsible for the quality of experience for their
end customers regardless of what content the customers consume or what time
they consume it. They pay a monthly subscription / access fee and that is
where it stops. ISPs can chose to blame Netflix unt
It strikes me that there are lots of legitimate, but conflicting, views
on this topic - all of which come down to there being no clearly
established principles for peering, traffic exchange, or settlements
(either de facto or imposed by law or regulation and different
player are coming fr
On Thu, 10 Jul 2014 03:14:40 -0400 Kraig wrote:
KB> Anyone in the SE seeing and/or hearing of any massive Comcast outages
KB> regionally?
KB>
KB> (Fiber, Voice & DOCSIS modems from Atlanta, GA to Tallahassee, FL and in
KB> some select areas Jacksonville, FL...)
My comcast business service in Atla
Hi,
In brief, I have a VRF configured on a PE router which is a 7200-G2
router running 12.2(31)SB18, I import two route targets, one of them
belongs to another VRF.
Now, when I receive two default routes from both VRFs, and my question
is, why did the PE router preferred the default route fr
CALL FOR PAPERS
Ninth Workshop on Secure Network Protocols (NPSec 2014)
Raleigh, North Carolina, USA
October 21, 2014
In conjunction with the 22nd IEEE International Conference on Network Protocols
(ICNP 2014)
Web page: http://netsec.cs.uoregon.edu/npsec2014
Important Dates
Submission Dea
Last I checked, it is eyeball network responsibility to adequately
provision their transit capacity to support the demand of their
customers, or find alternate solutions for the customers to be able to
receive the service they are paying for (internet bandwidth to/from
the sites they choose to visi
On Thu, Jul 10, 2014 at 9:12 PM, Miles Fidelman
wrote:
> Now I write a check every month to both Verizon and Netflix - and clearly it
> would be nice if some of that went to provisioning better service between
> the two. But I can as easily point to Netflix, as to Verizon, when it comes
> to whic
> Would it be right if Netflix comes to You and says we see you've got a lot of
> our customers hooked up to your backbone so to serve better service we'd like
> to connect to your network directly.
Yes. As an eyeball network operator I pay my transit provider to get
the packets my customers wan
> -Original Message-
> From: NANOG [mailto:nanog-boun...@nanog.org] On Behalf Of Matthew
> Petach
> Sent: Friday, July 11, 2014 3:35 AM
>
>
> So, if Netflix had to pay additional money to get direct links to Verizon,
> you'd
> be OK paying an additional 50cents/month to cover those additi
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