Re: CenturyLink/Level 3 combined AS

[Mark Tinka]

On 8/Jun/19 17:23, John Kristoff wrote:

> bps pricing is rarely apples to apples, Cogent will happily tell you
> that.  However, you may want more than just apples.  I've seen at least
> three serious providers offer as good or better deals in the last year
> or so.  At one time they were unbeatable from a sheer price perspective,
> but in my more recent experience, this is no longer true.

Price is so low right now (especially if you are willing to settle on
the large providers) that it's six and half-a-dozen if you want to use
that as a decision factor.

Mark.

Re: CenturyLink/Level 3 combined AS

[Mark Tinka]

On 8/Jun/19 15:08, Darin Steffl wrote:
> Ok just so simplify things.
>
> Is Cogent or CenturyLink/L3 better for transit?

Generally, I'd say hook up to more than one "transit-free" provider if
you must use any of them.

Mark.

Re: CenturyLink/Level 3 combined AS

[Scott Weeks]

Just for fun...  :)

--- c...@cmadams.net wrote:
From: Chris Adams 

"...old Savvis (aka Cable & Wireless aka InternetMCI) 
AS 3561, and untold more Internet history... :)
-

hosting services (global reach)
digital island -> cable & wireless -> savvis -> level3 -> centurylink? (got 
complcated)

-

cdn (akamai and sp/di waged legal war over who invented the cdn technologies
http://www.centurylink.com/business/networx/products/ipbased/cdns.html)

sandpiper -> digital island -> cable & wireless -> savvis -> level3 -> 
centurylink

-

I went to look for where AS6553 is now days, but it looks like it has been 
given back to ARIN and reused.

scott

Re: CenturyLink/Level 3 combined AS

[John Kristoff]

On Sat, 8 Jun 2019 14:40:23 +
Filip Hruska  wrote:

> their pricing is (if you push hard enough) simply unbeatable.

bps pricing is rarely apples to apples, Cogent will happily tell you
that.  However, you may want more than just apples.  I've seen at least
three serious providers offer as good or better deals in the last year
or so.  At one time they were unbeatable from a sheer price perspective,
but in my more recent experience, this is no longer true.

John

Re: CenturyLink/Level 3 combined AS

[Filip Hruska]

Cogent and "great" don't belong in one sentence in my opinion. It's usable 
though and their pricing is (if you push hard enough) simply unbeatable.

I would pick L3 any day over Cogent if the pricing was the same. 

Kind Regards,
Filip Hruska

On 8 June 2019 3:36:26 pm GMT+02:00, David Hubbard 
 wrote:
>Cogent is great, or worthless, depending on whether you like talking to
>Google via IPv6.
>
>From: NANOG  on behalf of Darin Steffl
>
>Date: Saturday, June 8, 2019 at 9:10 AM
>To: Brielle Bruns 
>Cc: North American Network Operators' Group 
>Subject: Re: CenturyLink/Level 3 combined AS
>
>Ok just so simplify things.
>
>Is Cogent or CenturyLink/L3 better for transit?
>
>On Fri, Jun 7, 2019, 3:00 PM Brielle Bruns
>mailto:br...@2mbit.com>> wrote:
>On 6/7/2019 11:03 AM, Romeo Czumbil wrote:
>> All new CL Internet get's provisioned on AS3356
>> You would need a strong case for them to put you on AS209
>
>
>Got provisioned last year on AS209 when they turned up my ent Fiber
>with
>BGP.
>
>Could depend heavily on what services and where.
>
>--
>Brielle Bruns
>The Summit Open Source Development Group
>http://www.sosdg.org/ http://www.ahbl.org

-- 
Sent from my Android device with K-9 Mail. Please excuse my brevity.

Re: CenturyLink/Level 3 combined AS

[David Hubbard]

Cogent is great, or worthless, depending on whether you like talking to Google 
via IPv6.

From: NANOG  on behalf of Darin Steffl 

Date: Saturday, June 8, 2019 at 9:10 AM
To: Brielle Bruns 
Cc: North American Network Operators' Group 
Subject: Re: CenturyLink/Level 3 combined AS

Ok just so simplify things.

Is Cogent or CenturyLink/L3 better for transit?

On Fri, Jun 7, 2019, 3:00 PM Brielle Bruns 
mailto:br...@2mbit.com>> wrote:
On 6/7/2019 11:03 AM, Romeo Czumbil wrote:
> All new CL Internet get's provisioned on AS3356
> You would need a strong case for them to put you on AS209


Got provisioned last year on AS209 when they turned up my ent Fiber with
BGP.

Could depend heavily on what services and where.

--
Brielle Bruns
The Summit Open Source Development Group
http://www.sosdg.org/ http://www.ahbl.org

Re: CenturyLink/Level 3 combined AS

[Mike Bolitho]

As usual, that depends. Gotta give us a lot more information than that.

-Mike Bolitho

On Sat, Jun 8, 2019, 6:10 AM Darin Steffl wrote:

> Ok just so simplify things.
>
> Is Cogent or CenturyLink/L3 better for transit?
>
> On Fri, Jun 7, 2019, 3:00 PM Brielle Bruns  wrote:
>
>> On 6/7/2019 11:03 AM, Romeo Czumbil wrote:
>> > All new CL Internet get's provisioned on AS3356
>> > You would need a strong case for them to put you on AS209
>>
>>
>> Got provisioned last year on AS209 when they turned up my ent Fiber with
>> BGP.
>>
>> Could depend heavily on what services and where.
>>
>> --
>> Brielle Bruns
>> The Summit Open Source Development Group
>> http://www.sosdg.org/ http://www.ahbl.org
>>
>

Re: CenturyLink/Level 3 combined AS

[Darin Steffl]

Ok just so simplify things.

Is Cogent or CenturyLink/L3 better for transit?

On Fri, Jun 7, 2019, 3:00 PM Brielle Bruns  wrote:

> On 6/7/2019 11:03 AM, Romeo Czumbil wrote:
> > All new CL Internet get's provisioned on AS3356
> > You would need a strong case for them to put you on AS209
>
>
> Got provisioned last year on AS209 when they turned up my ent Fiber with
> BGP.
>
> Could depend heavily on what services and where.
>
> --
> Brielle Bruns
> The Summit Open Source Development Group
> http://www.sosdg.org/ http://www.ahbl.org
>

Re: CenturyLink/Level 3 combined AS

[Brielle Bruns]

On 6/7/2019 11:03 AM, Romeo Czumbil wrote:

All new CL Internet get's provisioned on AS3356
You would need a strong case for them to put you on AS209



Got provisioned last year on AS209 when they turned up my ent Fiber with 
BGP.


Could depend heavily on what services and where.

--
Brielle Bruns
The Summit Open Source Development Group
http://www.sosdg.org/ http://www.ahbl.org

Re: CenturyLink/Level 3 combined AS

[Eric Flanery (eric)]

On Fri, Jun 7, 2019 at 10:03 AM Romeo Czumbil 
wrote:

> All new CL Internet get's provisioned on AS3356
> You would need a strong case for them to put you on AS209
>
> At this time they are not merging the two AS's
> And also define "quality" ;-)
>
> -Romeo
>

That isn't true in my recent experience. We just replaced an older L3
transit with a new CL one on different floors of the same building, and
doing so involved moving from 3356 to 209.

Interestingly, the CFA for the new circuit's attachment suggests it came
out of the "L3" suite, not the "Qwest" suite (both on the same floor); so
it seems that 209 is provision-able at former L3 facilities.

Other recent entirely new CL turn-ups with us, out of rural COs belonging
to Frontier, have also been with 209.

--Eric

RE: CenturyLink/Level 3 combined AS

[Romeo Czumbil]

All new CL Internet get's provisioned on AS3356
You would need a strong case for them to put you on AS209

At this time they are not merging the two AS's
And also define "quality" ;-)

-Romeo

From: NANOG  On Behalf Of Darin Steffl
Sent: Friday, June 7, 2019 12:02 PM
To: North American Network Operators' Group 
Subject: CenturyLink/Level 3 combined AS

Hey all,

Are there plans for CL and Level3 to combine AS's into one network? 

If not, do they actively peer and route traffic through each other's networks 
at least?

Basically we're looking at picking up 1G of CL and wondering if it's near the 
same quality as Level3 in terms of latency and packet loss.

Thanks


-- 
Darin Steffl
Minnesota WiFi
https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.mnwifi.com_=DwMFaQ=QbKJOwLIrSFJ6b5qo-Piqw=7c7AjRoUVcwQLzf0TJlbpkDj0XZUiEY9edXj7_CVNLE=B9x15ZQ8isrQ6IfUsWLNMps3Fxkm9knEK_q5EDIUVEU=cOxvX4Mpm1zNu7Y2hWKKzjTiR12MNhBseyGKijwODv4=
507-634-WiFi
 
https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.facebook.com_minnesotawifi=DwMFaQ=QbKJOwLIrSFJ6b5qo-Piqw=7c7AjRoUVcwQLzf0TJlbpkDj0XZUiEY9edXj7_CVNLE=B9x15ZQ8isrQ6IfUsWLNMps3Fxkm9knEK_q5EDIUVEU=mWRM-1yVsEZInKW4u3DeFnLdPW_gwkA7GbTvFdccydI=

Re: CenturyLink/Level 3 combined AS

[Tom Beecher]

That '2000 peer ASN's' value is likely very, very inflated. I have prefixes
that would look like I am peering with 3549 directly in many places that I
do not.

L3 has for some time had a partial as-merge community that you can set so
that if you announce a prefix to 3356, they'll mirror it over to 3549 in
the same location and strip 3356 from the as-path. The reverse also works
for an announcement to 3549 mirrored over to 3356. They're doing some
inter-as option c juju to make all that work.

Doesn't change the point that 3549 is still around 8 years later and likely
will be for 8 more, but yeah. :) I'm sure efforts to make that happen have
a plethora of roadblocks such that it would cost 10x more to get rid of it
than it would to just leave it as is and just shrink it when possible.

On Fri, Jun 7, 2019 at 12:11 PM Mike Hammett  wrote:

> I wouldn't expect them to be integrated for at least another decade.
> Global Crossing AS3549 still exists with over 2,000 peer ASNs, yet Level 3
> acquired them in 2011. Time Warner Telecom was acquired in 2014 and it
> still has 89 peer ASNs.
>
> Centurylink bought Digital Teleport in 2003 and their ASN is still out
> there.
>
>
>
> -
> Mike Hammett
> Intelligent Computing Solutions <http://www.ics-il.com/>
> <https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL>
> <https://plus.google.com/+IntelligentComputingSolutionsDeKalb>
> <https://www.linkedin.com/company/intelligent-computing-solutions>
> <https://twitter.com/ICSIL>
> Midwest Internet Exchange <http://www.midwest-ix.com/>
> <https://www.facebook.com/mdwestix>
> <https://www.linkedin.com/company/midwest-internet-exchange>
> <https://twitter.com/mdwestix>
> The Brothers WISP <http://www.thebrotherswisp.com/>
> <https://www.facebook.com/thebrotherswisp>
> <https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCXSdfxQv7SpoRQYNyLwntZg>
> ------
> *From: *"Darin Steffl" 
> *To: *"North American Network Operators' Group" 
> *Sent: *Friday, June 7, 2019 11:01:46 AM
> *Subject: *CenturyLink/Level 3 combined AS
>
> Hey all,
>
> Are there plans for CL and Level3 to combine AS's into one network?
>
> If not, do they actively peer and route traffic through each other's
> networks at least?
>
> Basically we're looking at picking up 1G of CL and wondering if it's near
> the same quality as Level3 in terms of latency and packet loss.
>
> Thanks
>
> --
> Darin Steffl
> Minnesota WiFi
> www.mnwifi.com
> 507-634-WiFi
> <http://www.facebook.com/minnesotawifi> Like us on Facebook
> <http://www.facebook.com/minnesotawifi>
>
>

Re: CenturyLink/Level 3 combined AS

[Chris Adams]

Once upon a time, Darin Steffl  said:
> Are there plans for CL and Level3 to combine AS's into one network?

We have CenturyLink transit from old Qwest (AS 209) and old Level3 (AS
3356) in Chicago... when we ordered the more recent circuit, both sales
and tech said that there's no plan to merge the ASes together at this
time.  They already had peering, so I assume that just expanded.  We
haven't had any issues with either.

And BTW: when you say "CL" - those are just two of the large family of
ASes that CL has bought.  There's also old Savvis AS 6347, and other old
Savvis (aka Cable & Wireless aka InternetMCI) AS 3561, and untold more
Internet history... :)

-- 
Chris Adams 

Re: CenturyLink/Level 3 combined AS

[Mike Hammett]

I wouldn't expect them to be integrated for at least another decade. Global 
Crossing AS3549 still exists with over 2,000 peer ASNs, yet Level 3 acquired 
them in 2011. Time Warner Telecom was acquired in 2014 and it still has 89 peer 
ASNs. 


Centurylink bought Digital Teleport in 2003 and their ASN is still out there. 




- 
Mike Hammett 
Intelligent Computing Solutions 

Midwest Internet Exchange 

The Brothers WISP 

- Original Message -

From: "Darin Steffl"  
To: "North American Network Operators' Group"  
Sent: Friday, June 7, 2019 11:01:46 AM 
Subject: CenturyLink/Level 3 combined AS 


Hey all, 


Are there plans for CL and Level3 to combine AS's into one network? 


If not, do they actively peer and route traffic through each other's networks 
at least? 


Basically we're looking at picking up 1G of CL and wondering if it's near the 
same quality as Level3 in terms of latency and packet loss. 


Thanks 


-- 


Darin Steffl 
Minnesota WiFi 
www.mnwifi.com 
507-634-WiFi 
Like us on Facebook 

CenturyLink/Level 3 combined AS

[Darin Steffl]

Hey all,

Are there plans for CL and Level3 to combine AS's into one network?

If not, do they actively peer and route traffic through each other's
networks at least?

Basically we're looking at picking up 1G of CL and wondering if it's near
the same quality as Level3 in terms of latency and packet loss.

Thanks

-- 
Darin Steffl
Minnesota WiFi
www.mnwifi.com
507-634-WiFi
 Like us on Facebook