check the agreed maintenance windows as defined in the (SLA)section Maintenance
Plans - etc
- Original Message
From: Joel Jaeggli joe...@bogus.com
To: valdis.kletni...@vt.edu
Cc: nanog@nanog.org
Sent: Fri, December 10, 2010 6:48:41 PM
Subject: Re: [Operational] Internet Police
On Thu, Dec 9, 2010 at 1:12 PM, Randy Bush ra...@psg.com wrote:
And if I ever find the genius who came up with the we are not the
internet police meme ...
he died over a decade ago
He also said The Internet works because a lot of people cooperate to
do things together
Remove the together and
On Thursday, December 09, 2010 01:26:30 pm Dobbins, Roland wrote:
On Dec 10, 2010, at 1:19 AM, Michael Smith wrote:
front lines of this cyberwar?
Warfare isn't the correct metaphor.
Espionage/covert action is the correct metaphor.
In reality DoS threats/execution of those threats/ 'pwning'
On 12/10/2010 11:08 AM, Lamar Owen wrote:
In reality DoS threats/execution of those threats/ 'pwning' / website
vandalism are all forms of terrorism. An easily pronounceable version with a
'net-' 'e-' or even 'cyber-' prefix. is difficult.
I thought e-* was so yesterday, wouldn't
On Fri, Dec 10, 2010 at 10:08 AM, Lamar Owen lo...@pari.edu wrote:
On Thursday, December 09, 2010 01:26:30 pm Dobbins, Roland wrote:
On Dec 10, 2010, at 1:19 AM, Michael Smith wrote:
front lines of this cyberwar?
Warfare isn't the correct metaphor.
Espionage/covert action is the correct
On 10/12/10 8:08 AM, Lamar Owen wrote:
On Thursday, December 09, 2010 01:26:30 pm Dobbins, Roland wrote:
On Dec 10, 2010, at 1:19 AM, Michael Smith wrote:
front lines of this cyberwar?
Warfare isn't the correct metaphor.
Espionage/covert action is the correct metaphor.
In reality DoS
On 12/10/2010 10:44 AM, William McCall wrote:
To the folks out there that presently work for an SP, if someone
called you (or the relevant department) and gave you a list of
end-user IPs that were DDoSing this person/entity, how long would you
take to verify and stop the end user's stream of
On Fri, Dec 10, 2010 at 11:46 AM, JC Dill jcdill.li...@gmail.com
We *really* don't need Homeland Security and TSA deciding that
cyber-vandalism falls into the realm of terrorism and thus comes under their
purview to protect us against. Their security theater at the airport is
too much
On Fri, 10 Dec 2010 11:08:00 EST, Lamar Owen said:
In reality DoS threats/execution of those threats/ 'pwning' / website
vandalism are all forms of terrorism.
Let's not dilute the meaning of terrorism to the point where graffiti, cyber
or otherwise, is classifed as terrorism.
The USA Patriot
On Friday, December 10, 2010 11:46:43 am JC Dill wrote:
On 10/12/10 8:08 AM, Lamar Owen wrote:
In reality DoS threats/execution of those threats/ 'pwning' / website
vandalism are all forms of terrorism.
No one was terrorized because they couldn't reach MasterCard or
because
On 12/10/2010 11:06 AM, valdis.kletni...@vt.edu wrote:
The USA Patriot act says: activities that (A) involve acts dangerous to human
life that are a violation of the criminal laws of the U.S. or of any state,
that (B) appear to be intended (i) to intimidate or coerce a civilian
population,
On Fri, 10 Dec 2010 12:14:20 EST, Lamar Owen said:
Identity theft can cause loss of life due to the stress of mopping up
afterwards.
Oh, give me a *break*. This is well off the end of the slippery slope.
My car got totaled in a rear-end collision a few weeks ago. If I get so
stressed dealing
From: William McCall
Sent: Friday, December 10, 2010 8:45 AM
To: Lamar Owen
Cc: nanog@nanog.org
Subject: Re: [Operational] Internet Police
To the folks out there that presently work for an SP, if someone
called you (or the relevant department) and gave you a list of
end-user IPs
On 12/10/2010 11:45 AM, George Bonser wrote:
If
an ISP were to actively disconnect clients who were infected with a bot
(intentionally infected or not), the end users themselves might be a
little more vigilant at keeping their systems free of them.*But* any
ISP doing that would also have to be
On 12/10/2010 07:45 AM, George Bonser wrote:
From: William McCall
Sent: Friday, December 10, 2010 8:45 AM
To: Lamar Owen
Cc: nanog@nanog.org
Subject: Re: [Operational] Internet Police
To the folks out there that presently work for an SP, if someone
called you (or the relevant department
Not to mention the risk of lost business for customers that just can't
be bothered to fix broken machines.
Paul
That supposes that another ISP would accept their bot-infected machine.
It would require some cooperation among the providers. And should some
ISP get the reputation of being a
On 12/10/2010 07:59 AM, George Bonser wrote:
Not to mention the risk of lost business for customers that just can't
be bothered to fix broken machines.
Paul
That supposes that another ISP would accept their bot-infected machine.
It would require some cooperation among the providers. And
On 12/10/2010 12:07 PM, Paul Graydon wrote:
Unless you can get every company to sign up to an agreement it will
never work. Even then you'll still find unscrupulous companies that are
far more interested in revenue than reputation. There are a number of
hosting companies I'm sure most network
On 12/10/10 9:06 AM, valdis.kletni...@vt.edu wrote:
On Fri, 10 Dec 2010 11:08:00 EST, Lamar Owen said:
I believe the word you wanted was hooliganism. And we have a legal system
that has about 3,000 years of experience in dealing with *that*, thank you
very
much.
The code of hamurabi or
My question is what architectural recommendations will you make to your
employer if/when the US Govt compels our employers to accept our role as the
front lines of this cyberwar?
I figure once someone with a relevant degree of influence in the govts
realizes that the cyberwar is between
On 12/9/2010 12:19 PM, Michael Smith wrote:
So... if/when our
employers are unable to resist the US Govt's demand that we join in the
national defense, wouldn't this community be the ones asked to guard the
border?
CALEA
done
On Dec 10, 2010, at 1:19 AM, Michael Smith wrote:
front lines of this cyberwar?
Warfare isn't the correct metaphor.
Espionage/covert action is the correct metaphor.
---
Roland Dobbins rdobb...@arbor.net //
How is what to block identified? ...by content key words? ..traffic
profiles / signatures? Deny all, unless flow (addresses/protocol/port) is
pre-approved / registered?
What does the technical solution look like?
Any solutions to maintain some semblance of freedom?
On Thu, Dec 9, 2010 at
On 12/9/2010 12:31 PM, Michael Smith wrote:
How is what to block identified? ...by content key words? ..traffic
profiles / signatures? Deny all, unless flow (addresses/protocol/port)
is pre-approved / registered?
CALEA doesn't provide block. It provides full data dumps to the
authorities.
Let's put it this way.
1. If you host government agencies, provide connectivity to say a
nuclear power plant or an army base, or a bank or .. .. - you'd
certainly work with your customers to meet their security
requirements.
2. If you are a service provider serving up DSL - why then, there are
And if I ever find the genius who came up with the we are not the
internet police meme ...
On Fri, Dec 10, 2010 at 12:19 AM, Suresh Ramasubramanian
ops.li...@gmail.com wrote:
Let's put it this way.
1. If you host government agencies, provide connectivity to say a
nuclear power plant or an
Obviously the environment is created by layers 8/9, but I'm interested in
the layer 1-7 solutions that the community would consider/recommend.
BGP blackhole communities is a good way to push the problem upstream,
assuming your provider will agree to it. In theory, that could also work
on
And if I ever find the genius who came up with the we are not the
internet police meme ...
he died over a decade ago
Was it the original IANA?
- Original Message -
From: Randy Bush ra...@psg.com
To: Suresh Ramasubramanian ops.li...@gmail.com
Cc: North American Network Operators Group nanog@nanog.org
Sent: Thu Dec 09 14:12:41 2010
Subject: Re: [Operational] Internet Police
And if I ever find
On Dec 9, 2010, at 10:19 AM, Michael Smith wrote:
My question is what architectural recommendations will you make to your
employer if/when the US Govt compels our employers to accept our role as the
front lines of this cyberwar?
I figure once someone with a relevant degree of influence in
On Thu, Dec 09, 2010 at 06:26:30PM +, Dobbins, Roland wrote:
On Dec 10, 2010, at 1:19 AM, Michael Smith wrote:
front lines of this cyberwar?
Warfare isn't the correct metaphor.
Espionage/covert action is the correct metaphor.
Low intensity conflict may be more correct.
--
Mike
Once upon a time, Fred Baker f...@cisco.com said:
did you know that DSLRs are illegal in Kuwait unless one is a registered
journalist?
Did you know that they are not?
http://thenextweb.com/me/2010/11/30/kuwait-dslr-ban-does-not-exist-after-all/
This is like the people attacking EasyDNS
On Dec 9, 2010, at 10:44 AM, Jack Bates wrote:
[CALEA] is designed to track down and prosecute people, not stop malicious
activity.
Right.
In order for the law to try and stop malicious activities (digital or real),
it must place constraints on our freedoms. See TSA/Airport Security.
Or,
On Fri, Dec 10, 2010 at 12:42 AM, Randy Bush ra...@psg.com wrote:
And if I ever find the genius who came up with the we are not the
internet police meme ...
he died over a decade ago
All due respect to him, but I didnt want to kick his teeth in or
anything, merely ask if he'd like to
mikea mi...@mikea.ath.cx writes:
On Thu, Dec 09, 2010 at 06:26:30PM +, Dobbins, Roland wrote:
On Dec 10, 2010, at 1:19 AM, Michael Smith wrote:
front lines of this cyberwar?
Warfare isn't the correct metaphor.
Espionage/covert action is the correct metaphor.
Low intensity
On Dec 10, 2010, at 10:01 AM, Robert E. Seastrom wrote:
cyber-intifada was the proper trope, but so far it has failed to grow legs.
The problem is that non-ironic use of the appellation 'cyber-' is generally
inversely proportional to actual clue, so it should be avoided at all costs.
;
Butlerian Jihad.
-Bill
On Dec 9, 2010, at 19:02, Robert E. Seastrom r...@seastrom.com wrote:
mikea mi...@mikea.ath.cx writes:
On Thu, Dec 09, 2010 at 06:26:30PM +, Dobbins, Roland wrote:
On Dec 10, 2010, at 1:19 AM, Michael Smith wrote:
front lines of this
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