Re: Vixie warns: DNS Changer ‘blackouts’ inevitable
On Mon, May 28, 2012 at 2:56 PM, Florian Weimer f...@deneb.enyo.de wrote: [Dnschanger substitute server operations] One thing is clear, Paul is able to tell a great story. PR for ISC is somewhat limited, it's often attributed to the FBI: | The effort, scheduled to begin this afternoon, is designed to let | those people know that their Internet connections will stop working | on July 9, when temporary servers set up by the FBI to help | DNSChanger victims are due to be disconnected. http://news.cnet.com/8301-1009_3-57439407-83/google-will-alert-users-to-dnschanger-malware-infection/ | The FBI has now seized control of the malicious DNS servers, but | countless computers are still infected with the malware. http://www.h-online.com/security/news/item/Google-warns-DNSChanger-victims-1583037.html | The malware is so vicious — it can interfere with users' Web | browsing, steer them to fraudulent websites and make their computers | vulnerable to other malicious software — that the FBI has put a | safety net of sorts in place, using government computers to prevent | any Internet disruptions for users whose computers may be infected. http://www.technolog.msnbc.msn.com/technology/technolog/infected-users-get-legit-warning-about-july-9-internet-doomsday-751078 (I'm justing quoting what I found. Some of the linked articles contain bogus information.) In any case, this isn't what bugs me about the whole process. I don't like the way this is implemented—mainly the use of RPZ, but there are other concerns. The notification process has some issues as well, but it's certainly a great learning exercise for all folks involved with this. To me, it doesn't really matter that Dnschanger is fairly minor as far as such things go. Hopefully, the knowledge and the contacts established can be applied to other cases as well. Exactly how much can it cost to serve up those requests... I mean for 9$ a month I have a cpu that handles 2000 *Recursive* Queries a second. 900 bux could net me *200,000* a second if not more. The government overspends on a lot of things.. they need some one whos got the experience to use a bunch of cheap servers for the resolvers and a box that hosts the IPs used and then distributes the query packets.
Re: Vixie warns: DNS Changer ‘blackouts’ inevitable
On Thu, May 31, 2012 at 9:14 AM, cncr04s/Randy cncr...@gmail.com wrote: Exactly how much can it cost to serve up those requests... I mean for 9$ a month I have a cpu that handles 2000 *Recursive* Queries a network bandwidth people/monitoring router(s) redundancy geo-local copies you are asking the wrong question -chris
Re: Vixie warns: DNS Changer ‘blackouts’ inevitable
cncr04s/Randy wrote: Exactly how much can it cost to serve up those requests... I mean for 9$ a month I have a cpu that handles 2000 *Recursive* Queries a second. 900 bux could net me *200,000* a second if not more. The government overspends on a lot of things.. Looks like you just answered your own question: they need some one whos got the experience to use a bunch of cheap servers for the resolvers and a box that hosts the IPs used and then distributes the query packets. I expect part of what the FBI is paying for is the time of people with that expertise. -- In theory, there is no difference between theory and practice. In practice, there is. Yogi Berra
Re: Re: Vixie warns: DNS Changer ‘blackouts’ inevitable
On Thu, 31 May 2012 08:14:40 -0500, cncr04s/Randy said: Exactly how much can it cost to serve up those requests... I mean for 9$ a month I have a cpu that handles 2000 *Recursive* Queries a second. 900 bux could net me *200,000* a second if not more. The government overspends on a lot of things.. they need some one whos got the experience to use a bunch of cheap servers for the resolvers and a box that hosts the IPs used and then distributes the query packets. For $50/mo I can have a connection from Comcast. That doesn't mean that I could run my own cable to the nearest major exchange for anywhere near $50. Also, what's the failover if your $9/mo CPU develops a bad RAM card? Does your $9/mo CPU have sufficient geographic diversity to survive a backhoe? And about 4 zillion other things that people that actually have to run production services worry about... pgpKQqYBd9QFE.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: Vixie warns: DNS Changer ‘blackouts’ inevitable
On Thu, 31 May 2012, cncr04s/Randy wrote: Exactly how much can it cost to serve up those requests... I mean for 9$ a month I have a cpu that handles 2000 *Recursive* Queries a second. 900 bux could net me *200,000* a second if not more. The government overspends on a lot of things.. they need some one whos got the experience to use a bunch of cheap servers for the resolvers and a box that hosts the IPs used and then distributes the query packets. So you'd offer your expertise for $9 (or $900) a month 24/7? Since you imply server cost is the only cost in operating such a service.. -- david raistrickhttp://www.netmeister.org/news/learn2quote.html dr...@icantclick.org
Re: Vixie warns: DNS Changer ‘blackouts’ inevitable
In a message written on Thu, May 31, 2012 at 08:14:40AM -0500, cncr04s/Randy wrote: Exactly how much can it cost to serve up those requests... I mean for 9$ a month I have a cpu that handles 2000 *Recursive* Queries a second. 900 bux could net me *200,000* a second if not more. The government overspends on a lot of things.. they need some one whos got the experience to use a bunch of cheap servers for the resolvers and a box that hosts the IPs used and then distributes the query packets. The interesting bit with DNSChanger isn't serving up the requests, but the engineering to do it in place. Remember, all of the clients are pointed to specific IP addresses by the malware. The FBI comes in and takes all the servers because they are going to be used in the court case, and then has to pay someone to figure out how to stand a service back up at the exact same IP's serving those infected clients in a way they won't notice. This includes include working with the providers of the IP Routing, IP Address blocks, colocation space and so on to keep providing the service. In this case it was also pre-planned to be nearly seamless so that end users would not see any down time, and the servers had to be fully instrumented to capture all of the infected client IP addresses and report them to various parties for remediation, including further evidence to the court for the legal proceedings. The FBI also had to convince a judge this was the right thing to do, so I'm sure someone had to pay some experts to explain all of this to a judge to make it happen. I suspect the cost of the hardware to handle the queries is neglegable, I doubt of all the money spent more than a few thousand dollars went to the hardware. It seems like the engineering and coordination was rather significant here, and I'll bet that's where all the money was spent. -- Leo Bicknell - bickn...@ufp.org - CCIE 3440 PGP keys at http://www.ufp.org/~bicknell/ pgpkAb1qwXgzp.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: Re: Vixie warns: DNS Changer ‘blackouts’ inevitable
On Thu, May 31, 2012 at 10:39 AM, valdis.kletni...@vt.edu wrote: On Thu, 31 May 2012 08:14:40 -0500, cncr04s/Randy said: Exactly how much can it cost to serve up those requests... I mean for 9$ a month I have a cpu that handles 2000 *Recursive* Queries a second. 900 bux could net me *200,000* a second if not more. The government overspends on a lot of things.. they need some one whos got the experience to use a bunch of cheap servers for the resolvers and a box that hosts the IPs used and then distributes the query packets. For $50/mo I can have a connection from Comcast. That doesn't mean that I could run my own cable to the nearest major exchange for anywhere near $50. Also, what's the failover if your $9/mo CPU develops a bad RAM card? Does your $9/mo CPU have sufficient geographic diversity to survive a backhoe? And about 4 zillion other things that people that actually have to run production services worry about... My comment was directed at government spending... no need to have such a angry tone about the comment. I was only comparing to what I spend on my large volumes of queries and what this so called expensive stuff the government is running... And I have never developed a bad ram card, even if I did, replacements are easy as i'm talking about distributed vps in this case.
RE: Re: Vixie warns: DNS Changer 'blackouts' inevitable
Exactly how much can it cost to serve up those requests... I mean for 9$ a month I have a cpu that handles 2000 *Recursive* Queries a second. 900 bux could net me *200,000* a second if not more. The government overspends on a lot of things.. they need some one whos got the experience to use a bunch of cheap servers for the resolvers and a box that hosts the IPs used and then distributes the query packets. For $50/mo I can have a connection from Comcast. That doesn't mean that I could run my own cable to the nearest major exchange for anywhere near $50. Also, what's the failover if your $9/mo CPU develops a bad RAM card? Does your $9/mo CPU have sufficient geographic diversity to survive a backhoe? And about 4 zillion other things that people that actually have to run production services worry about... Why should the taxpayers pay for geographic diversity or any of those 4 zillion other things required to keep these DNS servers up so infected computers can continue to reach the Internet? I don't really mind paying $9/300 millionths per month to help folks make a smooth transition back to proper DNS, but I wouldn't want to pay much more. The FBI should have just pulled the plug and let the folks who can't connect inundate their ISPs with support calls, which might encourage the ISPs to be a little more proactive about shutting down the botnets they host.
Re: Vixie warns: DNS Changer ‘blackouts’ inevitable
On 31/05/2012 17:11, cncr04s/Randy wrote: My comment was directed at government spending... no need to have such a angry tone about the comment. I was only comparing to what I spend on my large volumes of queries and what this so called expensive stuff the government is running... And I have never developed a bad ram card, even if I did, replacements are easy as i'm talking about distributed vps in this case. I'm getting the impression that the ISC involvement with the FBI on this issue went well beyond the notion of sticking a couple of noddy DNS servers on the Internet and well into the realm of engineering consultancy, court appearances, engineering and management all-nighters, providing a level of trustworthy service that could be justified to a court of criminal law and so on. All for $87k? Personally, I don't have a problem with that level of expenditure. Nick
Re: Vixie warns: DNS Changer ‘blackouts’ inevitable
Is it time to drop this yet? Three weeks old. Let's move on. Richard Golodner
Re: Vixie warns: DNS Changer ‘blackouts’ inevitable
[Dnschanger substitute server operations] One thing is clear, Paul is able to tell a great story. PR for ISC is somewhat limited, it's often attributed to the FBI: | The effort, scheduled to begin this afternoon, is designed to let | those people know that their Internet connections will stop working | on July 9, when temporary servers set up by the FBI to help | DNSChanger victims are due to be disconnected. http://news.cnet.com/8301-1009_3-57439407-83/google-will-alert-users-to-dnschanger-malware-infection/ | The FBI has now seized control of the malicious DNS servers, but | countless computers are still infected with the malware. http://www.h-online.com/security/news/item/Google-warns-DNSChanger-victims-1583037.html | The malware is so vicious — it can interfere with users' Web | browsing, steer them to fraudulent websites and make their computers | vulnerable to other malicious software — that the FBI has put a | safety net of sorts in place, using government computers to prevent | any Internet disruptions for users whose computers may be infected. http://www.technolog.msnbc.msn.com/technology/technolog/infected-users-get-legit-warning-about-july-9-internet-doomsday-751078 (I'm justing quoting what I found. Some of the linked articles contain bogus information.) In any case, this isn't what bugs me about the whole process. I don't like the way this is implemented—mainly the use of RPZ, but there are other concerns. The notification process has some issues as well, but it's certainly a great learning exercise for all folks involved with this. To me, it doesn't really matter that Dnschanger is fairly minor as far as such things go. Hopefully, the knowledge and the contacts established can be applied to other cases as well.
Re: Vixie warns: DNS Changer ‘blackouts’ inevitable
Save the good scotch for lmhosts :) On May 23, 2012, at 9:27 PM, George Herbert george.herb...@gmail.com wrote: On Wed, May 23, 2012 at 5:42 PM, valdis.kletni...@vt.edu wrote: On Wed, 23 May 2012 13:09:09 -0700, Leo Bicknell said: In 1988, while employed by DEC, he started working on the popular internet domain name server BIND, of which he was the primary author and architect, until release 8. ISC has spent some effort on properly documenting the history of BIND, and the result of that effort is located at: http://www.isc.org/software/bind/history You'll note there are two full paragraphs and a dozen folks involved before Paul had anything to do with BIND. One could make the case that the releases before Paul got there weren't exactly popular - how many DNS servers were in production in 1986? ;) Please don't make me remember hosts.txt before I've had a chance to wrap up work, go home, and get some Scotch in... -- -george william herbert george.herb...@gmail.com
Re: Vixie warns: DNS Changer ‘blackouts’ inevitable
On 23/05/2012 22:00, bmann...@vacation.karoshi.com wrote: One thing is clear, Paul is able to tell a great story. Bill, can you please take your snide remarks about Paul Vixie offline? Nick
Re: Vixie warns: DNS Changer ‘blackouts’ inevitable
On 5/23/2012 6:27 PM, George Herbert wrote: On Wed, May 23, 2012 at 5:42 PM,valdis.kletni...@vt.edu wrote: One could make the case that the releases before Paul got there weren't exactly popular - how many DNS servers were in production in 1986? ;) Please don't make me remember hosts.txt before I've had a chance to wrap up work, go home, and get some Scotch in... When I was in the US Army in Augsburg, GE, I was a dial-up customer of our local Army internet node. I'm not sure what the Micro was (Sperry? Unisys?) but it took up a good portion of a small room. hosts.txt was what it used - if I wanted to e-mail someone, I had to get the IP address of their e-mail server and have the sysadmin add it to the file. I, through my aunt, had the hardest time getting the IP address of the Oregon State University e-mail server out of them because they couldn't believe that there was someone out there who wasn't running DNS yet. I just wanted to be able to send e-mail to my aunt, who was one of my few family members who had e-mail at the time. This was 94-95. The system was due to be replaced at some point by a 486 PC... that would do DNS. Base closed in 1998... I wonder if they ever got their new system? Oy... I just remembered trying (and occasionally succeeding) to find Anonymous FTP sites via the nearly random typing of IP addresses on that system. Okay, time to go hug my DNS server. -- Jeff Shultz
Re: Vixie warns: DNS Changer ‘blackouts’ inevitable
On May 22, 2012, at 10:47 PM, Randy Bush wrote: When those servers are turned off, Customer Support folks at many ISPs will prolly want to take their accrued vacation. Amen. And there will be thousands more of them when the court order expires than existed when the Feds called him in. they could extend the court order, or prolong the do-gooder hack longer under some other pretext, increasing the underlying problem further. more infected machines and more job creation for front line support when the whitewash finally stops. According to the pretty graphs, the number of machines querying the aforementioned infrastructure is going down. Just not as fast as pretty much everyone would prefer… and the DOJ is footing the bill, and grows tired of it. So at some point, the lights are gonna be turned off. It's a shame the ISPs who have the infected users have done less to mitigate the issue. And many solutions were suggested, but all of them ended up being … perceived to be worse than just shutting it down. Or so I recall the presentation that Paul gave to a bunch of us in San Francisco back in February. Aloha, Michael. -- Please have your Internet License and Usenet Registration handy...
Re: Vixie warns: DNS Changer ‘blackouts’ inevitable
On 5/23/12 1:40 AM, bmann...@vacation.karoshi.com wrote: In a modestly favorable light, ISC looks like an arms dealer (DNS redirection) to the bad guys my thought looks like a reasonably successful alternate root operator. i mention kevin dunlap as well as bill's mention of phil almquist, and there's another 4th floor of evans hall name i nay recall when caffinated. -e
Re: Vixie warns: DNS Changer ‘blackouts’ inevitable
Hi, dnschanger gonna be a mess? that's not news. Is there anywhere a page where one can type an ASN or a CIDR block and then the whois contacts get a list of IPs that still contact the unintended servers? (I had done ACL with log on borders, and resolvers did show up too. So maybe some NS pointing towards those bad blocks?) Thanks, Frank
Re: Vixie warns: DNS Changer ?blackouts? inevitable
On Wed, May 23, 2012 at 03:10:38PM +0300, Frank Habicht ge...@geier.ne.tz wrote a message of 13 lines which said: Is there anywhere a page where one can type an ASN or a CIDR block and then the whois contacts get a list of IPs that still contact the unintended servers? See http://www.dcwg.org/isps/
Re: Re: Vixie warns: DNS Changer ‘blackouts’ inevitable
On Tue, 22 May 2012, Michael J Wise wrote: So at some point, the lights are gonna be turned off. It's a shame the ISPs who have the infected users have done less to mitigate the issue. To be fair, and take issue with this, it's not all on the ISPs, is it? I've been seeing our counts decrease for months, but there are some who will not/cannot get it. I am sadistically looking forward to the shutdown, admittedly.
Re: Vixie warns: DNS Changer ‘blackouts’ inevitable
- Original Message - From: bmann...@vacation.karoshi.com On Tue, May 22, 2012 at 07:14:16PM -0700, Henry Linneweh wrote: http://www.theregister.co.uk/2012/05/17/dns_changer_blackouts/ Paul certainly knows how to manipulate the press. You don't know journalists very well, do you? Paul almost certainly (p 0.995) had nothing to do with the writer's chosen appellation, and wouldn't have been able to change it if he had. Cheers, -- jra -- Jay R. Ashworth Baylink j...@baylink.com Designer The Things I Think RFC 2100 Ashworth Associates http://baylink.pitas.com 2000 Land Rover DII St Petersburg FL USA http://photo.imageinc.us +1 727 647 1274
Re: Vixie warns: DNS Changer ‘blackouts’ inevitable
It makes for a more sensational story. On Wed, May 23, 2012 at 12:24 PM, Jay Ashworth j...@baylink.com wrote: - Original Message - From: bmann...@vacation.karoshi.com On Tue, May 22, 2012 at 07:14:16PM -0700, Henry Linneweh wrote: http://www.theregister.co.uk/2012/05/17/dns_changer_blackouts/ Paul certainly knows how to manipulate the press. You don't know journalists very well, do you? Paul almost certainly (p 0.995) had nothing to do with the writer's chosen appellation, and wouldn't have been able to change it if he had. Cheers, -- jra -- Jay R. Ashworth Baylink j...@baylink.com Designer The Things I Think RFC 2100 Ashworth Associates http://baylink.pitas.com 2000 Land Rover DII St Petersburg FL USA http://photo.imageinc.us +1 727 647 1274 -- Kyle Creyts Information Assurance Professional BSidesDetroit Organizer
Re: Vixie warns: DNS Changer ‘blackouts’ inevitable
On 2012-05-23, at 00:10, bmann...@vacation.karoshi.com wrote: BIND - The Berkeley Internet Naming Daemon. Berkeley Internet Name Domain, in fact. http://www.eecs.berkeley.edu/Pubs/TechRpts/1984/CSD-84-182.pdf Joe
Re: Vixie warns: DNS Changer ‘blackouts’ inevitable
In a message written on Wed, May 23, 2012 at 12:35:05PM +0900, Randy Bush wrote: father of bind? that's news. I believe the error is in Paul Vixie's Wikipedia page, and I don't do Wikipedia editing so I won't be fixing it. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paul_Vixie In 1988, while employed by DEC, he started working on the popular internet domain name server BIND, of which he was the primary author and architect, until release 8. ISC has spent some effort on properly documenting the history of BIND, and the result of that effort is located at: http://www.isc.org/software/bind/history You'll note there are two full paragraphs and a dozen folks involved before Paul had anything to do with BIND. ISC is always interested in updating the history if folks have any additional information. Feel free to e-mail me if you think you have something important to add. -- Leo Bicknell - bickn...@ufp.org - CCIE 3440 PGP keys at http://www.ufp.org/~bicknell/ pgpJ1lMQZ5bkZ.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: Vixie warns: DNS Changer ‘blackouts’ inevitable
On May 23, 2012, at 8:22 AM, na...@namor.ca wrote: On Tue, 22 May 2012, Michael J Wise wrote: So at some point, the lights are gonna be turned off. It's a shame the ISPs who have the infected users have done less to mitigate the issue. To be fair, and take issue with this, it's not all on the ISPs, is it? Agreed. By definition, the numbers have been falling. So somewhere, someone is doing something to lessen the coming /facepalm I've been seeing our counts decrease for months, but there are some who will not/cannot get it. I am sadistically looking forward to the shutdown, admittedly. You have your time off approved I trust? :) Aloha, Michael. -- Please have your Internet License and Usenet Registration handy...
Re: Vixie warns: DNS Changer ‘blackouts’ inevitable
On Wed, May 23, 2012 at 1:40 AM, bmann...@vacation.karoshi.com wrote: Paul will be there to turn things off when they no longer make money for his company. is the dns changer thingy making money for isc?
Re: Vixie warns: DNS Changer ‘blackouts’ inevitable
On Wed, May 23, 2012 at 04:33:28PM -0400, Christopher Morrow wrote: On Wed, May 23, 2012 at 1:40 AM, bmann...@vacation.karoshi.com wrote: Paul will be there to turn things off when they no longer make money for his company. is the dns changer thingy making money for isc? pretty sure. a contract w/ the Feds, outsouring contracts w/ affected ISPs when the Fed deal runs out, development funding to code these kinds of fixes into future versions of software, any number of second and third order fallout. No telling how effective constent self-promotion is. One thing is clear, Paul is able to tell a great story. but its all speculation from here. ISC is well positioned to extract value from both ends of the spectrum. They have a great business model. The optics look pretty odd from here, at lesat to me however - I am very glad for: )open source )other vendors of DNS SW. /bill
Re: Vixie warns: DNS Changer ‘blackouts’ inevitable
On Wed, 23 May 2012 13:09:09 -0700, Leo Bicknell said: In 1988, while employed by DEC, he started working on the popular internet domain name server BIND, of which he was the primary author and architect, until release 8. ISC has spent some effort on properly documenting the history of BIND, and the result of that effort is located at: http://www.isc.org/software/bind/history You'll note there are two full paragraphs and a dozen folks involved before Paul had anything to do with BIND. One could make the case that the releases before Paul got there weren't exactly popular - how many DNS servers were in production in 1986? ;) pgpuj3fJYBq3D.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: Vixie warns: DNS Changer ‘blackouts’ inevitable
On Wed, May 23, 2012 at 5:42 PM, valdis.kletni...@vt.edu wrote: On Wed, 23 May 2012 13:09:09 -0700, Leo Bicknell said: In 1988, while employed by DEC, he started working on the popular internet domain name server BIND, of which he was the primary author and architect, until release 8. ISC has spent some effort on properly documenting the history of BIND, and the result of that effort is located at: http://www.isc.org/software/bind/history You'll note there are two full paragraphs and a dozen folks involved before Paul had anything to do with BIND. One could make the case that the releases before Paul got there weren't exactly popular - how many DNS servers were in production in 1986? ;) Please don't make me remember hosts.txt before I've had a chance to wrap up work, go home, and get some Scotch in... -- -george william herbert george.herb...@gmail.com
Re: Vixie warns: DNS Changer ‘blackouts’ inevitable
On May 23, 2012, at 18:27, George Herbert george.herb...@gmail.com wrote: Please don't make me remember hosts.txt before I've had a chance to wrap up work, go home, and get some Scotch in... Come on George, hosts.txt was the good old days :) -b
Re: Vixie warns: DNS Changer ‘blackouts’ inevitable
On 5/23/2012 6:35 PM, Brett Watson wrote: On May 23, 2012, at 18:27, George Herbertgeorge.herb...@gmail.com wrote: Please don't make me remember hosts.txt before I've had a chance to wrap up work, go home, and get some Scotch in... Come on George, hosts.txt was the good old days :) I still have a copy (from around 1992, so one of the very last), although much edited (and NOT 10,000 hosts, thanks). -- A picture is worth 10K words -- but only those to describe the picture. Hardly any sets of 10K words can be adequately described with pictures.
Re: Vixie warns: DNS Changer ‘blackouts’ inevitable
On Wed, May 23, 2012 at 6:35 PM, Brett Watson br...@the-watsons.org wrote: On May 23, 2012, at 18:27, George Herbert george.herb...@gmail.com wrote: Please don't make me remember hosts.txt before I've had a chance to wrap up work, go home, and get some Scotch in... Come on George, hosts.txt was the good old days :) An elegant weapon, for a more civilized age? -- -george william herbert george.herb...@gmail.com
Re: Vixie warns: DNS Changer ‘blackouts’ inevitable
On Wed, May 23, 2012 at 06:42:34PM -0700, Lynda wrote: On 5/23/2012 6:35 PM, Brett Watson wrote: On May 23, 2012, at 18:27, George Herbertgeorge.herb...@gmail.com wrote: Please don't make me remember hosts.txt before I've had a chance to wrap up work, go home, and get some Scotch in... Come on George, hosts.txt was the good old days :) I still have a copy (from around 1992, so one of the very last), although much edited (and NOT 10,000 hosts, thanks). ftp://ftp.math.ethz.ch/pub/doc/hosts.txt Leftovers! -- - (2^(N-1))
Re: Vixie warns: DNS Changer ‘blackouts’ inevitable
The best policy, sometimes, when one sees something questionable on Wikipedia, is to point it out on the talk page, and trust that others will do the dirty work.. as in http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:Paul_Vixie#.22Father_of_BIND.22 j On Wed, May 23, 2012 at 4:09 PM, Leo Bicknell bickn...@ufp.org wrote: In a message written on Wed, May 23, 2012 at 12:35:05PM +0900, Randy Bush wrote: father of bind? that's news. I believe the error is in Paul Vixie's Wikipedia page, and I don't do Wikipedia editing so I won't be fixing it. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paul_Vixie In 1988, while employed by DEC, he started working on the popular internet domain name server BIND, of which he was the primary author and architect, until release 8. ISC has spent some effort on properly documenting the history of BIND, and the result of that effort is located at: http://www.isc.org/software/bind/history You'll note there are two full paragraphs and a dozen folks involved before Paul had anything to do with BIND. ISC is always interested in updating the history if folks have any additional information. Feel free to e-mail me if you think you have something important to add. -- Leo Bicknell - bickn...@ufp.org - CCIE 3440 PGP keys at http://www.ufp.org/~bicknell/ -- --- Joly MacFie 218 565 9365 Skype:punkcast WWWhatsup NYC - http://wwwhatsup.com http://pinstand.com - http://punkcast.com VP (Admin) - ISOC-NY - http://isoc-ny.org -- -
Vixie warns: DNS Changer ‘blackouts’ inevitable
http://www.theregister.co.uk/2012/05/17/dns_changer_blackouts/ -Henry
Re: Vixie warns: DNS Changer ‘blackouts’ inevitable
father of bind? that's news. dnschanger gonna be a mess? that's not news. randy
Re: Vixie warns: DNS Changer ‘blackouts’ inevitable
On Tue, May 22, 2012 at 07:14:16PM -0700, Henry Linneweh wrote: http://www.theregister.co.uk/2012/05/17/dns_changer_blackouts/ -Henry Paul certainly knows how to manipulate the press. /bill
Re: Vixie warns: DNS Changer ‘blackouts’ inevitable
On May 22, 2012, at 8:35 PM, Randy Bush wrote: father of bind? that's news. http://boingboing.net/2012/03/29/paul-vixies-firsthand-accoun.html He was there, and Put The Fix In, to down the network. I gather he's the one pulling it out on the appointed day as well. dnschanger gonna be a mess? that's not news. Agreed. Aloha, Michael. -- Please have your Internet License and Usenet Registration handy...
Re: Vixie warns: DNS Changer ‘blackouts’ inevitable
On Tue, May 22, 2012 at 08:52:52PM -0700, Michael J Wise wrote: On May 22, 2012, at 8:35 PM, Randy Bush wrote: father of bind? that's news. http://boingboing.net/2012/03/29/paul-vixies-firsthand-accoun.html He was there, and Put The Fix In, to down the network. Certainly news to Phil Almquist and the entire BIND development team at UCB. Paul was at DECWRL and cut his teeth on pre-existing code. While he (and ISC) have since revised, gutted, tossed all the orginal code, rebuilt it twice - and others have done similar for their DNS software, based on the BIND code base, implementation assumptions, and with little or no ISC code, and they call it BIND as well, it would be a HUGE leap of faith to call Paul Vixie the father of BIND - The Berkeley Internet Naming Daemon. As for being there and Put The Fix In... Makes for great PR but in actual fact, its a bandaid that is not going to stem the tide. An actual fix would really need to change the nature of the creaky 1980's implementation artifacts that this community loves so well. /bill
Re: Vixie warns: DNS Changer ‘blackouts’ inevitable
As for being there and Put The Fix In... Makes for great PR but in actual fact, its a bandaid that is not going to stem the tide. maybe we could wad up the sensationalist and self-aggrandizing newspaper articles and use them to plug the dike? randy
Re: Vixie warns: DNS Changer ‘blackouts’ inevitable
On May 22, 2012, at 9:10 PM, bmann...@vacation.karoshi.com wrote: On Tue, May 22, 2012 at 08:52:52PM -0700, Michael J Wise wrote: On May 22, 2012, at 8:35 PM, Randy Bush wrote: father of bind? that's news. http://boingboing.net/2012/03/29/paul-vixies-firsthand-accoun.html He was there, and Put The Fix In, to down the network. Certainly news to Phil Almquist and the entire BIND development team at UCB. Paul was at DECWRL and cut his teeth on pre-existing code. While he (and ISC) have since revised, gutted, tossed all the orginal code, rebuilt it twice - and others have done similar for their DNS software, based on the BIND code base, implementation assumptions, and with little or no ISC code, and they call it BIND as well, it would be a HUGE leap of faith to call Paul Vixie the father of BIND - The Berkeley Internet Naming Daemon. Methinks we're talking at cross purposes. As for being there and Put The Fix In... Makes for great PR but in actual fact, its a bandaid that is not going to stem the tide. An actual fix would really need to change the nature of the creaky 1980's implementation artifacts that this community loves so well. I don't think we're talking about the same thing at all. Paul was there to shut down the DNS changer system and replace it with something that restored functionality to the infected machines. And I gather Paul will be one of the people who will turn the lights out on it. Your other comments are non-sequitur to the main issue. When those servers are turned off, Customer Support folks at many ISPs will prolly want to take their accrued vacation. Aloha, Michael. -- Please have your Internet License and Usenet Registration handy...
Re: Vixie warns: DNS Changer ‘blackouts’ inevitable
On Tue, May 22, 2012 at 10:07:52PM -0700, Michael J Wise wrote: On May 22, 2012, at 9:10 PM, bmann...@vacation.karoshi.com wrote: On Tue, May 22, 2012 at 08:52:52PM -0700, Michael J Wise wrote: On May 22, 2012, at 8:35 PM, Randy Bush wrote: father of bind? that's news. http://boingboing.net/2012/03/29/paul-vixies-firsthand-accoun.html He was there, and Put The Fix In, to down the network. Certainly news to Phil Almquist and the entire BIND development team at UCB. Paul was at DECWRL and cut his teeth on pre-existing code. While he (and ISC) have since revised, gutted, tossed all the orginal code, rebuilt it twice - and others have done similar for their DNS software, based on the BIND code base, implementation assumptions, and with little or no ISC code, and they call it BIND as well, it would be a HUGE leap of faith to call Paul Vixie the father of BIND - The Berkeley Internet Naming Daemon. Methinks we're talking at cross purposes. maybe... :) my comment was refering to the father of bind statement. As for being there and Put The Fix In... Makes for great PR but in actual fact, its a bandaid that is not going to stem the tide. An actual fix would really need to change the nature of the creaky 1980's implementation artifacts that this community loves so well. I don't think we're talking about the same thing at all. Paul was there to shut down the DNS changer system and replace it with something that restored functionality to the infected machines. And I gather Paul will be one of the people who will turn the lights out on it. He didn't shut down DNS Changer, he put up an equivalent system to hijack DNS traffic and direct it to the right place... SO folks didn't see any problem and the DNS Changer infection grew and got worse. When he is legally required to take his bandaide out of service, then the problem will resolve by folks who will have to clean their systems. As for turning the lights out - that will only happen when the value of DNS hijacking drops. As it is now, ISC has placed DNS hijacking code into their mainstream code base... because DNS hijacking is so valuable to folks. In a modestly favorable light, ISC looks like an arms dealer (DNS redirection) to the bad guys -AND- (via DNSSEC) the good guys. Either way, they make money. And yes, I think I agree with you. Paul will be there to turn things off when they no longer make money for his company. Your other comments are non-sequitur to the main issue. Perhaps I am not a member of the Paul Vixie cult of personality. When those servers are turned off, Customer Support folks at many ISPs will prolly want to take their accrued vacation. Amen. And there will be thousands more of them when the court order expires than existed when the Feds called him in. /bill Aloha, Michael. -- Please have your Internet License and Usenet Registration handy...
Re: Vixie warns: DNS Changer ‘blackouts’ inevitable
When those servers are turned off, Customer Support folks at many ISPs will prolly want to take their accrued vacation. Amen. And there will be thousands more of them when the court order expires than existed when the Feds called him in. they could extend the court order, or prolong the do-gooder hack longer under some other pretext, increasing the underlying problem further. more infected machines and more job creation for front line support when the whitewash finally stops. randy
