E. Morozov's long take is at
https://thebaffler.com/latest/capitalisms-new-clothes-morozov
Tl;Dr:
The Age of Surveillance Capitalism’s most pronounced shortcomings have to
do with the relationship it establishes between capitalism and surveillance
capitalism—as well as the way in which it
- Booking targeted advertising becomes illegal/impossible, so you
go back to do regular advertising.
- Since the whole industry does the same, your competitors have
no advantage over you.
- If your business model was profoundly unethical, you go out of
business. That is intentional.
Thanks for articulating your doubts, this is going to be interesting to
dig into.
On 01/27/19 09:48, Patrice Riemens wrote:
> James is right, I think, in believing Carlo's argument does not account
> for the rapid, 'liquid' change advertising, and the current economic
> dispensation in general
James is right, I think, in believing Carlo's argument does not account
for the rapid, 'liquid' change advertising, and the current economic
dispensation in general has undergone at an ever increasing speed over
the last decade. But what I liked most in his post is that it provides a
Hi Carlo,
I'd suggest that your response doesn't acknowledge the fluidity and
adaptability of capitalism, which is just one framework to manifest a
desire to gain advantage and control. If you ban targeted advertising,
that doesn't mean that advertisers will go back to "regular" advertising.
On 25/01/2019 13:09, carlo von lynX wrote:
> But there is a more urgent problem that grows on top of
> surveillance capitalism. It is our inability to exercise
> democracy properly, and therefore to soon lose the ability
> to make any such legislation. So we must stop to focus on
> surveillance
On Fri, Jan 25, 2019 at 09:00:33PM +0100, Patrice Riemens wrote:
> Well, as I understood Shoshana Z, the pb is that you cannot, in the
> current dispensation, legislate something that would destroy the
> very basis on which today's version of capitalism is based. Making
> data gathering illegal is
Well, as I understood Shoshana Z, the pb is that you cannot, in the
current dispensation, legislate something that would destroy the very
basis on which today's version of capitalism is based. Making data
gathering illegal is not a tweak, it's system(ic) change.
On 2019-01-25 19:39,
On Fri, Jan 25, 2019 at 07:06:39PM +, Geoffrey Goodell wrote:
> So it stands to reason that their money, and therefore capitalism itself,
> will build that mechanism to the fullest extent permitted by law, and until
> something changes, it is all legal.
That's why we were discussing to make
On 25/01/2019 12:39, Patrice Riemens wrote:
> John Naughton
> The Observer/Guardian, Sun 20 Jan 2019
>
> We’re living through the most profound transformation in our information
> environment since Johannes Gutenberg’s invention of printing in circa
> 1439.
cave paintings, grain as taxable
Hi Morlock
Say what you will about 'capitalism' but I'd like to suggest that the use of
the term 'capitalism' in this context refers to the unfortunate truth that in
recent years capitalism has come to be dominated by surveillance.
Specifically, the success of much of the Western (and perhaps
Right. Involving 'capitalism' into this is total bs., even an
intentional sabotage - to make it look inevitable (as no one can imagine
alternative for capitalism, surveillance must also be inevitable.)
Motherf*ckers. So many vacuous words just to avoid mentioning
possibility of simple
On Fri, Jan 25, 2019 at 06:39:54PM +0100, Patrice Riemens wrote:
> And the problem with living through a
> revolution is that it’s impossible to take the long view of what’s
> happening. Hindsight is the only exact science in this business, and
> in that long run we’re all
bwo Kiran Jonnalagadda & Frederick Noronha, with thanks
original to:
https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2019/jan/20/shoshana-zuboff-age-of-surveillance-capitalism-google-facebook
'The goal is to automate us': welcome to the age of surveillance
capitalism
Shoshana Zuboff’s new book is a
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