Re: vixie out
>Indeed. If you're still associated with the navy, you're certainly >feeling the same pain, as the requirements come from the NIST, I think. I have more than a passing familiarity with those NIST requirements, and there are a LOT of them so I can't claim to be an expert. But here's what I believe to be true: - There is no requirement to use Office 365 - There is no prohibition on using IMAP Now I have seen stuff about requiring smart card authentication. I believe that at work we can legitimately claim we have implemented "smart card authentication" and that it works fine with the shipping version of nmh today. Email signing ... well, I know the pieces are all there, and I've done it manually with various command-line utilities. I just need to figure out a good way to handle integration. I believe what is happening is that the IT staff look at a whole pile of NIST requirements, throw up their hands and say, "Hey, what did everyone else do? Office 365? Ok, we'll do that". And to paraphrase the old adage about IBM, no one ever got fired for buying Office 365 (and to extend that further, if Office 365 gets broken into you're not going to get fired because they'd have to fire everyone). And if it screws over a small subset of users ... well, too bad. I don't particularly like this state of affairs, but it's not like any of this is surprising. It's another reason I would like to get IMAP support into nmh; so many projects, so little time. --Ken
Re: vixie out
Ken Hornstein wrote: > >The new system is Office 365 and all employees are *required* to use > >Lookout on their Windows and Mac systems as an MUA using a badge for > >authentication. Given that, I'm pessimistic there is an open way to > >access NASA email. Linux users currently have a waiver to continue using > >IMAP, but that will go away once NASA IT finds a solution. It is likely > >to be a dictated MUA (as with the Mac and Windows) rather than a general > >mechanism. > > Geez, you really should be more up-to-date on the mailing list :-) We're in agreement there! > I can't promise this will work for you, but this message might be > helpful: > > https://lists.nongnu.org/archive/html/nmh-workers/2019-05/msg00029.html Indeed. If you're still associated with the navy, you're certainly feeling the same pain, as the requirements come from the NIST, I think. I'll look forward to trying it when I return to the office. Thanks for pointing out the thread as I clearly missed it during my skim. > --Ken -- Bill Wohler aka http://www.newt.com/wohler/, GnuPG ID:610BD9AD
Re: vixie out
>The new system is Office 365 and all employees are *required* to use >Lookout on their Windows and Mac systems as an MUA using a badge for >authentication. Given that, I'm pessimistic there is an open way to >access NASA email. Linux users currently have a waiver to continue using >IMAP, but that will go away once NASA IT finds a solution. It is likely >to be a dictated MUA (as with the Mac and Windows) rather than a general >mechanism. Geez, you really should be more up-to-date on the mailing list :-) I can't promise this will work for you, but this message might be helpful: https://lists.nongnu.org/archive/html/nmh-workers/2019-05/msg00029.html --Ken
Re: vixie out
Ken Hornstein wrote: > Geez, Bill, you HAVE been out of it for a little while, haven't you? :-) > > >Dovecot is a server and Maildir is mail storage format. What are you > >using as a UI? > > Paul has mentioned this before, but to fill you in ... I forget which > MUA he uses (I want to say Thunderbird, maybe?) but the key point here > is Dovecot stores it's messages in Maildir folders. So he was interested > in tools that could work directly on Maildir folders. This is a _BIT_ > challenging. Thanks for that. My mail to p...@vix.com bounced. > As a larger note ... I always thought the use of Maildir as a message > folder format was a bit weird. I have no objections if people want to > add that support for Maildir folders, but there are some challenges, and > I think the number of people who would find that useful is small compared > to the number of people who would find IMAP useful, so it wasn't something > I was going to work on (we do, today, have support in inc(1) for Maildir). > > >Yeah, with all of the security that NASA is adding, my days of fetchmail > >and procmail are numbered at work, and with it, MH and MH-E, unless I > >can find a way to bridge the gap between the NASA Linux email UI > >(Evolution?) and the MH mail store. > > I can't speak for exactly what you guys are doing, but I believe we > support all of the relevant security protocols with regards to POP > and SMTP. So if you guys have a POP server and a SMTP server you point > Evolution to, I don't think there's a reason you couldn't use nmh with it. The new system is Office 365 and all employees are *required* to use Lookout on their Windows and Mac systems as an MUA using a badge for authentication. Given that, I'm pessimistic there is an open way to access NASA email. Linux users currently have a waiver to continue using IMAP, but that will go away once NASA IT finds a solution. It is likely to be a dictated MUA (as with the Mac and Windows) rather than a general mechanism. > --Ken -- Bill Wohler aka http://www.newt.com/wohler/, GnuPG ID:610BD9AD
Re: vixie out
Geez, Bill, you HAVE been out of it for a little while, haven't you? :-) >Dovecot is a server and Maildir is mail storage format. What are you >using as a UI? Paul has mentioned this before, but to fill you in ... I forget which MUA he uses (I want to say Thunderbird, maybe?) but the key point here is Dovecot stores it's messages in Maildir folders. So he was interested in tools that could work directly on Maildir folders. This is a _BIT_ challenging. As a larger note ... I always thought the use of Maildir as a message folder format was a bit weird. I have no objections if people want to add that support for Maildir folders, but there are some challenges, and I think the number of people who would find that useful is small compared to the number of people who would find IMAP useful, so it wasn't something I was going to work on (we do, today, have support in inc(1) for Maildir). >Yeah, with all of the security that NASA is adding, my days of fetchmail >and procmail are numbered at work, and with it, MH and MH-E, unless I >can find a way to bridge the gap between the NASA Linux email UI >(Evolution?) and the MH mail store. I can't speak for exactly what you guys are doing, but I believe we support all of the relevant security protocols with regards to POP and SMTP. So if you guys have a POP server and a SMTP server you point Evolution to, I don't think there's a reason you couldn't use nmh with it. --Ken
Re: vixie out
Paul Vixie writes: > folks, it's been a blast. i used MH from 1985 to 2005 exclusively, > then from 2005 to 2015 in parallel with uw-imapd, and not at all since > mark crispen's death when i moved to dovecot and Maildir. Dovecot is a server and Maildir is mail storage format. What are you using as a UI? > i've helped find and fix bugs in the MH library, i regularly tested > and patched the MH (and Kerberos) parts of uw-imap, i even wrote some > hooks (thanks, jon!) for maintaining and using a BDB index for NMH's > folders. > > i've operated a 32-bit NMH build server back when i had 32-bit > servers, and i've started a few and joined many discussions as to > software portability and system architecture here. > > but i think it's time i admitted that IMAP and MIME are my future, and > that i will probably never use NMH or MH-E again. Yeah, with all of the security that NASA is adding, my days of fetchmail and procmail are numbered at work, and with it, MH and MH-E, unless I can find a way to bridge the gap between the NASA Linux email UI (Evolution?) and the MH mail store. > you are a great team but it's time i said goodbye. i'm about to answer > the unsubscribe-verify e-mail; i don't see any non-cc'd followups. And all the best to you. > goodbye all! > > -- > P Vixie -- Bill Wohler aka http://www.newt.com/wohler/, GnuPG ID:610BD9AD
