Re: [NTG-context] Reorganization of the main page

2008-08-28 Thread Yue Wang
in fact i like the logo on the photo.
It's cool

On Wed, Aug 27, 2008 at 7:30 PM, Mojca Miklavec
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 Another request: can the photo please go to blog rather than being on
 the first page of the wiki? (It's been fun, but I feel that promoting
 Union on the first page is not the best idea :)

 Mojca
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Re: [NTG-context] Reorganization of the main page

2008-08-28 Thread Patrick Gundlach
Hi,

 But the wiki search really sucks. Search for example for 'my Way': no
 matches found.

Would it make sense to default to wiki search for the google
search? Mojca, can this be done?

Patrick

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Re: [NTG-context] Reorganization of the main page

2008-08-28 Thread Aditya Mahajan
On Tue, 26 Aug 2008, Aditya Mahajan wrote:
 http://wiki.contextgarden.net/Main_Page_New

 If everyone agrees with the new design, I will replace the current main
 page.

Since almost everyone liked the new design better, I have changed the main 
page.

Aditya
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Re: [NTG-context] Reorganization of the main page

2008-08-28 Thread Mojca Miklavec
On Thu, Aug 28, 2008 at 5:51 PM, Patrick Gundlach [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 Hi,

 But the wiki search really sucks. Search for example for 'my Way': no
 matches found.

 Would it make sense to default to wiki search for the google
 search? Mojca, can this be done?

It must be some very basic trick. I guess that you need to add a
hidden field with something like
input type=hidden name=q value=more:wiki /

In any case: search needs to look like:
q=bla+more:wiki

But I didn't figure out how to do refined searches at the beginning yet.

Mojca
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Re: [NTG-context] Reorganization of the main page

2008-08-28 Thread Marcin Borkowski
Dnia Thu, Aug 28, 2008 at 04:35:18PM -0400, Aditya Mahajan napisa#322;(a):
 On Tue, 26 Aug 2008, Aditya Mahajan wrote:
  http://wiki.contextgarden.net/Main_Page_New
 
  If everyone agrees with the new design, I will replace the current main
  page.
 
 Since almost everyone liked the new design better, I have changed the main 
 page.

That's great - now I don't have to bookmark the Main_Page_New!
Thanks!

 
 Aditya

-- 
Marcin Borkowski (http://mbork.faculty.fmcs.amu.edu.pl)

888
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Re: [NTG-context] Reorganization of the main page

2008-08-27 Thread Marcin Borkowski
Dnia Tue, Aug 26, 2008 at 06:19:59AM -0400, Aditya Mahajan napisa#322;(a):
 Hi,
 
 After the discussions at Bohinj, I have created a new first page of the 
 wiki. I am tried to keep things short and to the point, rather than 
 complete. As a result a lot of links that were present in the original 
 main page are missing. This is the first step in the effort to clean up 
 and reorganize the wiki so that it is easier to browse. Comments are 
 welcome

Very nice work!  The new page is way better.  I guess the only thing I'm
missing is the link to The ConTeXt Way; maybe at the beginning of
Specific Subjects... (which, btw, I'd rename to Subjects Specific to
ConTeXt)?

 
 http://wiki.contextgarden.net/Main_Page_New
 
 If everyone agrees with the new design, I will replace the current main 
 page.
 
 Aditya

Greets

-- 
Marcin Borkowski (http://mbork.faculty.fmcs.amu.edu.pl)

People can be divided into three groups: those who can count and those
who can't.
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Re: [NTG-context] Reorganization of the main page

2008-08-27 Thread Alan Stone
It has a much better structure indeed.

Missing the wiki-only search feature though.

Placing the texshow-web and mail archive links in a more relevant
section, instead of hidden in the wiki's left column, would be welcome
- especially for newbies.

Also, when a newbie reads texshow-web (s)he doesn't have a clue what
that means. It's geek talk. Better say something like ConTeXt
commands directory or something else that's meaningful, relevant and
useful for them.

Samewise:

- live context
- download
- download area

All these don't mean a thing to somebody who sees this page for the first time.

Live ConTeXt ? What's that ? A live recording of a band named ConTeXt
? (joking ;O)

Download and download area? What's the difference ? As a newbie I
don't want to have waste my time and click on every link to find out
what's behind it. Tell me from the link itself what it means, what's
behind it so I can find what I'm looking for and get up to speed asap.

As for the logo...

Who cares ?

Logo's don't enable people to figure out how to use software and be
productive with it.

The proof is in the pudding, not in the logo.

Hope that helps.

Best,
Alan
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Re: [NTG-context] Reorganization of the main page

2008-08-27 Thread Patrick Gundlach
Hi,

 but where is the original search buttom? I don't like the google
 special search here:(

I've removed it in favour of the google one. I thought two search
areas could be confusing.

What do the others think?


@Mojca: could you update the custom google search to the new logo?

Patrick

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Re: [NTG-context] Reorganization of the main page

2008-08-27 Thread Patrick Gundlach
Hi,

 Missing the wiki-only search feature though.

OK, you're number two. I'll think about it.

 Also, when a newbie reads texshow-web (s)he doesn't have a clue what
 that means.

Jano Kula suggested to rename it to reference or sth. like that.
I'll do so.

 - live context
 - download
 - download area

Could you suggest some other names? I always have a hard time thinking
of some.

 All these don't mean a thing to somebody who sees this page for the
 first time.

You're right.

 As for the logo...

 Who cares ?

 Logo's don't enable people to figure out how to use software and be
 productive with it.

 The proof is in the pudding, not in the logo.

Right, but presenting ConTeXt in a more professional way could be
worth an effort. A new logo is one step forward, even it will
disappear again in some day.

Patrick
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Re: [NTG-context] Reorganization of the main page

2008-08-27 Thread Marcin Borkowski
Dnia Wed, Aug 27, 2008 at 11:26:38AM +0200, Flavien Lambert napisa#322;(a):
 2008/8/27 Patrick Gundlach [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 
 
   - live context
   - download
   - download area
 
 
  Could you suggest some other names? I always have a hard time thinking
  of some.
 
 
 Hello guys, what about In-line ConTeXt for live context ?

Or maybe:

ConTeXt online

or

ConTeXt in your web browser?

Greets

-- 
Marcin Borkowski (http://mbork.faculty.fmcs.amu.edu.pl)

- Why vim users don't use the ESC key?
- It's too far on the keyboard.  It's faster to type ctrl-[.
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Re: [NTG-context] Reorganization of the main page

2008-08-27 Thread Eric DÉTREZ

Le 27 août 08 à 11:20, Marcin Borkowski a écrit :


 As you said: a professional-looking logo is a good thing.

 BTW: the current logo looks like this:

O
  C   N
E
  T   X
T

 I don't like the order;


I didn't like it neither

  what about
O
  C   N
T
  T   X
E
 ?

I rather suggest

   O
C   N
E
TT
X




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Re: [NTG-context] Reorganization of the main page

2008-08-27 Thread Flavien Lambert
2008/8/27 Patrick Gundlach [EMAIL PROTECTED]


  - live context
  - download
  - download area


 Could you suggest some other names? I always have a hard time thinking
 of some.


Hello guys, what about In-line ConTeXt for live context ?

-- 
Flavien.

Quantum objects are completely crazy but, at least, they are all crazy in
the same way. R.P. Feynman.
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Re: [NTG-context] Reorganization of the main page

2008-08-27 Thread Marcin Borkowski
Dnia Wed, Aug 27, 2008 at 11:14:10AM +0200, Patrick Gundlach napisa#322;(a):
  As for the logo...
 
  Who cares ?
 
  Logo's don't enable people to figure out how to use software and be
  productive with it.
 
  The proof is in the pudding, not in the logo.
 
 Right, but presenting ConTeXt in a more professional way could be
 worth an effort. A new logo is one step forward, even it will
 disappear again in some day.

On my personal webpage, I'm using a small wiki engine called oddmuse.
It's maunal says in one place:
Logos and little icons (usually smilies) are eye candy and therefore of
utmost importance.

As you said: a professional-looking logo is a good thing.

BTW: the current logo looks like this:

O
  C   N
E
  T   X
T

I don't like the order; what about 
O   
  C   N 
T   
  T   X 
E
?

This way, we emphasize the TeX logo inside the ConTeXt one. 
  
 Patrick

Greets

-- 
Marcin Borkowski (http://mbork.faculty.fmcs.amu.edu.pl)

- Why did a mathematician call his dog Cauchy?
- Because it left a residue at every pole.
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Re: [NTG-context] Reorganization of the main page

2008-08-27 Thread Taco Hoekwater

Hi,

Eric DÉTREZ wrote:
 I rather suggest
 
O
 C   N
 E
 TT
 X

I just noticed that at some point, Patrick emailed me a
file that went like this:

 O
   C   N
   T   T
 EX

I'll try to mock something up using that layout,
it should work out pretty well

Best wishes,
Taco

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Re: [NTG-context] Reorganization of the main page

2008-08-27 Thread Alan Stone
On Wed, Aug 27, 2008 at 11:14 AM, Patrick Gundlach [EMAIL PROTECTED]
wrote:
 Hi,

 Missing the wiki-only search feature though.

 OK, you're number two. I'll think about it.

Here's why Patrick: a wiki being a source of documentation, that's where I
look for next
when not finding something in the paper manuals and texshow. If I don't find
it there,
digging deeper through the mailing archive is useful. Having everything
mixed up through
one google search blurb is oftentimes confusing due to the lack of
structure.

 Also, when a newbie reads texshow-web (s)he doesn't have a clue what
 that means.

 Jano Kula suggested to rename it to reference or sth. like that.
 I'll do so.

Reference of what ?

 Could you suggest some other names? I always have a hard time thinking
 of some.

 - live context  - Try out ConTeXt online
 - download - Download the ConTeXt application
 - download area   -  Download examples, 3rd party modules, articles,
MyWay reports, ...

Some other ideas...

- A clearly visible (colored ?) banner or link on top of the main page
saying something like If you're new to ConTeXt, click here to get started
fast... which redirects to the main page Getting Started section might be
useful.

- http://wiki.contextgarden.net/ConTeXt_Minimals
The Minimals are an attempt to provide the same functionality as the current
Pragma's minimal ConTeXt distributions in the zip files. Etc...

This is quite confusing for a newbie: If I install the ConTeXt Minimals,
what will I be missing what's in the Pragma's minimal distribution ?

Better might be to say something like: In order to provide you the easiest
and most current ConTeXt installation and updates, the ConTeXt Minimals are
the recommended installation, or whatever else is currently most relevant.

Best,
Alan
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Re: [NTG-context] Reorganization of the main page

2008-08-27 Thread Jörg Hagmann
Another vote for keeping the original wiki search
Jörg


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Re: [NTG-context] Reorganization of the main page

2008-08-27 Thread Mojca Miklavec
On Wed, Aug 27, 2008 at 10:48 AM, Patrick Gundlach wrote:
 Hi,

 but where is the original search buttom? I don't like the google
 special search here:(

I also agree that wiki search is missing, and I would put a search
button somewhere on the top.

 I've removed it in favour of the google one. I thought two search
 areas could be confusing.

 What do the others think?


 @Mojca: could you update the custom google search to the new logo?

Done, but please delete the gray line below the logo.

(slightly more than 12 hours since I finally came home, still didn't
catch for the lack of sleep :)

Mojca
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Re: [NTG-context] Reorganization of the main page

2008-08-27 Thread Mojca Miklavec
On Wed, Aug 27, 2008 at 12:33 PM, Alan Stone
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 On Wed, Aug 27, 2008 at 11:14 AM, Patrick Gundlach [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 wrote:
 Hi,

 Missing the wiki-only search feature though.

 OK, you're number two. I'll think about it.

 Here's why Patrick: a wiki being a source of documentation, that's where I
 look for next
 when not finding something in the paper manuals and texshow. If I don't find
 it there,
 digging deeper through the mailing archive is useful. Having everything
 mixed up through
 one google search blurb is oftentimes confusing due to the lack of
 structure.

You can choose to only search the wiki pages with google.

 - A clearly visible (colored ?) banner or link on top of the main page
 saying something like If you're new to ConTeXt, click here to get started
 fast... which redirects to the main page Getting Started section might be
 useful.

 - http://wiki.contextgarden.net/ConTeXt_Minimals
 The Minimals are an attempt to provide the same functionality as the current
 Pragma's minimal ConTeXt distributions in the zip files. Etc...

 This is quite confusing for a newbie: If I install the ConTeXt Minimals,
 what will I be missing what's in the Pragma's minimal distribution ?

Hans has updated the zips on Pragma recently, so I'm not so sure any
more what's still missing.

 Better might be to say something like: In order to provide you the easiest
 and most current ConTeXt installation and updates, the ConTeXt Minimals are
 the recommended installation, or whatever else is currently most relevant.

They still don't work quite the way I would like them to work.

Mojca
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Re: [NTG-context] Reorganization of the main page

2008-08-27 Thread Mojca Miklavec
Another request: can the photo please go to blog rather than being on
the first page of the wiki? (It's been fun, but I feel that promoting
Union on the first page is not the best idea :)

Mojca
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Re: [NTG-context] Reorganization of the main page

2008-08-27 Thread Mohamed Bana
Aditya Mahajan adityam at umich.edu writes:

 
 http://wiki.contextgarden.net/Main_Page_New
 
 If everyone agrees with the new design, I will replace the current main 
 page.
 
 Aditya
 

Hi,

I like it.

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Re: [NTG-context] Reorganization of the main page

2008-08-27 Thread Patrick Gundlach
Hi,

 Missing the wiki-only search feature though.

 OK, you're number two. I'll think about it.

 Here's why Patrick: a wiki being a source of documentation, that's where I
 look for next
 when not finding something in the paper manuals and texshow. If I don't find
 it there,
 digging deeper through the mailing archive is useful. Having everything
 mixed up through
 one google search blurb is oftentimes confusing due to the lack of
 structure.

But the wiki search really sucks. Search for example for 'my Way': no
matches found.

I'd like to have a solution where we only have one search box (google)
which only searches the wiki by default. @Mojca: can this be done?

 Also, when a newbie reads texshow-web (s)he doesn't have a clue what
 that means.

 Jano Kula suggested to rename it to reference or sth. like that.
 I'll do so.

 Reference of what ?

of all commands. It is better then texshow(-web). Other suggestions?

 - live context  - Try out ConTeXt online
 - download - Download the ConTeXt application
 - download area   -  Download examples, 3rd party modules, articles,
 MyWay reports, ...

Way too long to fit into the left box!

 Some other ideas...

 - A clearly visible (colored ?) banner or link on top of the main page
 saying something like If you're new to ConTeXt, click here to get started
 fast... which redirects to the main page Getting Started section might be
 useful.

See Aditya's suggestion. Would this be OK?

 - http://wiki.contextgarden.net/ConTeXt_Minimals
 The Minimals are an attempt to provide the same functionality as the current
 Pragma's minimal ConTeXt distributions in the zip files. Etc...

They will be renamed to either distribution or official
distribution and the only supported way of installing context.

 This is quite confusing for a newbie: If I install the ConTeXt Minimals,
 what will I be missing what's in the Pragma's minimal distribution
 ?

This is absolutely true. Because of this we will remove the part
minimals from the name.

Thanks a lot for your suggestions!


Patrick

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Re: [NTG-context] Reorganization of the main page

2008-08-27 Thread Alan Stone
On Wed, Aug 27, 2008 at 6:25 PM, Patrick Gundlach [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:


  Reference of what ?

 of all commands. It is better then texshow(-web). Other suggestions?


Then commands reference, instead of reference.

 - live context  - Try out ConTeXt online
  - download - Download the ConTeXt application
  - download area   -  Download examples, 3rd party modules, articles,
  MyWay reports, ...

 Way too long to fit into the left box!


Make the box wider and/or spread the text over more than one line.

If impossible, wiki also sucks regarding this feature.  ;O)

  Some other ideas...
 
  - A clearly visible (colored ?) banner or link on top of the main page
  saying something like If you're new to ConTeXt, click here to get
 started
  fast... which redirects to the main page Getting Started section might
 be
  useful.

 See Aditya's suggestion. Would this be OK?


The only way to know is to test it and observe whether newbies ask questions
or complain,
then adapt if required.

Best,
Alan
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Re: [NTG-context] Reorganization of the main page

2008-08-27 Thread Henning Hraban Ramm
Am 2008-08-27 um 11:26 schrieb Flavien Lambert:

  - live context
  - download
  - download area


 Could you suggest some other names? I always have a hard time thinking
 of some.

 Hello guys, what about In-line ConTeXt for live context ?


I'd stay with Live ConTeXt (or ConTeXt live) - the live idiom is  
very common, e.g. for Linux CDs.
Maybe a newbie expects a CD for trying, but it says try me.


Greetlings from Lake Constance!
Hraban
---
http://www.fiee.net/texnique/
http://wiki.contextgarden.net
https://www.cacert.org (I'm an assurer)

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Re: [NTG-context] Reorganization of the main page

2008-08-27 Thread Henning Hraban Ramm
Am 2008-08-27 um 10:48 schrieb Patrick Gundlach:

 but where is the original search buttom? I don't like the google
 special search here:(

 I've removed it in favour of the google one. I thought two search
 areas could be confusing.

 What do the others think?

Mostly I only want to search the wiki and not everything about ConTeXt.


Greetlings from Lake Constance!
Hraban
---
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[NTG-context] Reorganization of the main page

2008-08-26 Thread Aditya Mahajan
Hi,

After the discussions at Bohinj, I have created a new first page of the 
wiki. I am tried to keep things short and to the point, rather than 
complete. As a result a lot of links that were present in the original 
main page are missing. This is the first step in the effort to clean up 
and reorganize the wiki so that it is easier to browse. Comments are 
welcome

http://wiki.contextgarden.net/Main_Page_New

If everyone agrees with the new design, I will replace the current main 
page.

Aditya
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Re: [NTG-context] Reorganization of the main page

2008-08-26 Thread Andrea Valle

I like it a lot

So, new logo from Bohinj?

-a-

On 26 Aug 2008, at 12:19, Aditya Mahajan wrote:


Hi,

After the discussions at Bohinj, I have created a new first page of  
the

wiki. I am tried to keep things short and to the point, rather than
complete. As a result a lot of links that were present in the original
main page are missing. This is the first step in the effort to  
clean up

and reorganize the wiki so that it is easier to browse. Comments are
welcome

http://wiki.contextgarden.net/Main_Page_New

If everyone agrees with the new design, I will replace the current  
main

page.

Aditya
__ 
_
If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an  
entry to the Wiki!


maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ 
ntg-context

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archive  : https://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/
wiki : http://contextgarden.net
__ 
_


--
Andrea Valle
--
CIRMA - DAMS
Università degli Studi di Torino
-- http://www.cirma.unito.it/andrea/
-- http://www.myspace.com/andreavalle
-- [EMAIL PROTECTED]
--



Think of it as seasoning
. noise [salt] is boring
. F(blah) [food without salt] can be boring
. F(noise, blah) can be really tasty

(Ken Perlin on noise)





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Re: [NTG-context] Reorganization of the main page

2008-08-26 Thread Yue Wang
but where is the original search buttom? I don't like the google
special search here:(

On Tue, Aug 26, 2008 at 6:19 PM, Aditya Mahajan [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 Hi,

 After the discussions at Bohinj, I have created a new first page of the
 wiki. I am tried to keep things short and to the point, rather than
 complete. As a result a lot of links that were present in the original
 main page are missing. This is the first step in the effort to clean up
 and reorganize the wiki so that it is easier to browse. Comments are
 welcome

 http://wiki.contextgarden.net/Main_Page_New

 If everyone agrees with the new design, I will replace the current main
 page.

 Aditya
 ___
 If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the 
 Wiki!

 maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
 webpage  : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net
 archive  : https://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/
 wiki : http://contextgarden.net
 ___

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