Re: [nysbirds-l] Photographer problem at Breezy Point

[Nadine Scarpa]

Scotty - Your statement is beyond ridiculous.



On Mon, Feb 6, 2012 at 12:25 PM, scotty...@aol.com wrote:

> If your a good birder,  then u should know your locations for finding
> birds. Hiking is supposed to be part of the fun but its lost with the
> public. Posting rare birds locations online is stupid. Everyone will want
> to see and word will be spread.  Keep it secret, keep it sacred and keep
> the unwanted away from these locations. People ate coming from put of state
> now. You are all to blame.
>
> Sent from my HTC on the Now Network from Sprint!
>
> - Reply message -
> From: "Nadine Scarpa" 
> Date: Mon, Feb 6, 2012 10:56 am
> Subject: [nysbirds-l] Photographer problem at Breezy Point
> To: 
>
> I was just about to post the same question about purpose, since the group
> rules state:
>
>
> "The primary purpose of the List is to disseminate information about wild
> bird sightings in and around New York State in a timely manner and to
> provide an effective electronic forum for New York State area birders."
>
>
>
> Instead of having respectful and ethical birders miss the opportunity to
> see rare birds, we apparently need to police our own.
>
>
>
> I also know that the ethics of birding also calls for using discretion
> when revealing locations of rarities.  It would be unwise to post location
> information to a generic website, but isn't that what this list is really
> for?
>
>
>
> I have seen as many "birders" as other clueless folks get too close to
> birds, or cross onto private property, or just behave badly when trying to
> see a rarity.
>
>
>
> I treasure this list, and others like it, that allow folks to see birds
> they wouldn't normally know about, or get to see in their lifetime!  I've
> also done my share of reporting the folks who either break rules or laws in
> the course of trying to see a bird.  I will continue to do that, and I hope
> to also continue learning about the rarities and other information from
> this list.
>
>
>
> I hope the location posts continue.  It would be sad to deprive the "good"
> birders of this information.
>
>
>
> Nadine
>
> On Mon, Feb 6, 2012 at 12:09 AM, Jim Osterlund wrote:
>
>> I wonder, then;  what purpose does this list serve?
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>>
>> NYSbirds-L List Info:
>> http://www.NortheastBirding.**com/NYSbirdsWELCOME<http://www.northeastbirding.com/NYSbirdsWELCOME>
>> http://www.NortheastBirding.**com/NYSbirdsRULES<http://www.northeastbirding.com/NYSbirdsRULES>
>> http://www.NortheastBirding.**com/**NYSbirdsSubscribeConfiguration**
>> Leave.htm<http://www.northeastbirding.com/NYSbirdsSubscribeConfigurationLeave.htm>
>>
>> ARCHIVES:
>> 1) 
>> http://www.mail-archive.com/**nysbirds-l@cornell.edu/**maillist.html<http://www.mail-archive.com/nysbirds-l@cornell.edu/maillist.html>
>> 2) 
>> http://www.surfbirds.com/**birdingmail/Group/NYSBirds-L<http://www.surfbirds.com/birdingmail/Group/NYSBirds-L>
>> 3) 
>> http://birdingonthe.net/**mailinglists/NYSB.html<http://birdingonthe.net/mailinglists/NYSB.html>
>>
>> Please submit your observations to eBird:
>> http://ebird.org/content/**ebird/ <http://ebird.org/content/ebird/>
>>
>> --
>>
>
> --
> *NYSbirds-L List Info:*
> Welcome and Basics <http://www.northeastbirding.com/NYSbirdsWELCOME>
> Rules and Information <http://www.northeastbirding.com/NYSbirdsRULES>
> Subscribe, Configuration and 
> Leave<http://www.northeastbirding.com/NYSbirdsSubscribeConfigurationLeave.htm>
> *Archives:*
> The Mail 
> Archive<http://www.mail-archive.com/nysbirds-l@cornell.edu/maillist.html>
> Surfbirds <http://www.surfbirds.com/birdingmail/Group/NYSBirds-L>
> BirdingOnThe.Net <http://birdingonthe.net/mailinglists/NYSB.html>
> *Please submit your observations to **eBird*<http://ebird.org/content/ebird/>
> *!*
> http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsWELCOME
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsRULES
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsSubscribeConfigurationLeave.htm

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Please submit your observations to eBird:
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Fwd: [nysbirds-l] Photographer problem at Breezy Point

[Jim Osterlund]

Sent to me directly, by mistake;

Begin forwarded message:

From: scotty...@aol.com 
Date: February 6, 2012 7:12:36 AM EST
To: Jim Osterlund 
Subject: Re: [nysbirds-l] Photographer problem at Breezy Point

It serves the ignorant, the lazy, and the the followers that have  
nothing better to do with there lives but annoy the professionals.  
This is the 1st year I had to endure women talking about car payments  
and mortgages out on wildlife walks. And the 1st year I have watched  
people yell across the dunes to get the birds attention. All I hear  
these days is talking when I should hear silence with wind and the  
waves crashing. This list has ruined the experience for many. And it's  
not worth it!
Sorry for the reality check.

Sent from my HTC on the Now Network from Sprint!

- Reply message -
From: "Jim Osterlund" 
Date: Mon, Feb 6, 2012 12:09 am
Subject: [nysbirds-l] Photographer problem at Breezy Point
To: 

I wonder, then;  what purpose does this list serve?


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Please submit your observations to eBird:
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Re: [nysbirds-l] Photographer problem at Breezy Point

[Nadine Scarpa]

I was just about to post the same question about purpose, since the group
rules state:


"The primary purpose of the List is to disseminate information about wild
bird sightings in and around New York State in a timely manner and to
provide an effective electronic forum for New York State area birders."



Instead of having respectful and ethical birders miss the opportunity to
see rare birds, we apparently need to police our own.



I also know that the ethics of birding also calls for using discretion when
revealing locations of rarities.  It would be unwise to post location
information to a generic website, but isn't that what this list is really
for?



I have seen as many "birders" as other clueless folks get too close to
birds, or cross onto private property, or just behave badly when trying to
see a rarity.



I treasure this list, and others like it, that allow folks to see birds
they wouldn't normally know about, or get to see in their lifetime!  I've
also done my share of reporting the folks who either break rules or laws in
the course of trying to see a bird.  I will continue to do that, and I hope
to also continue learning about the rarities and other information from
this list.



I hope the location posts continue.  It would be sad to deprive the "good"
birders of this information.



Nadine

On Mon, Feb 6, 2012 at 12:09 AM, Jim Osterlund wrote:

> I wonder, then;  what purpose does this list serve?
>
>
>
> --
>
> NYSbirds-L List Info:
> http://www.NortheastBirding.**com/NYSbirdsWELCOME
> http://www.NortheastBirding.**com/NYSbirdsRULES
> http://www.NortheastBirding.**com/**NYSbirdsSubscribeConfiguration**
> Leave.htm
>
> ARCHIVES:
> 1) 
> http://www.mail-archive.com/**nysbirds-l@cornell.edu/**maillist.html
> 2) 
> http://www.surfbirds.com/**birdingmail/Group/NYSBirds-L
> 3) 
> http://birdingonthe.net/**mailinglists/NYSB.html
>
> Please submit your observations to eBird:
> http://ebird.org/content/**ebird/ 
>
> --
>

--

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ARCHIVES:
1) http://www.mail-archive.com/nysbirds-l@cornell.edu/maillist.html
2) http://www.surfbirds.com/birdingmail/Group/NYSBirds-L
3) http://birdingonthe.net/mailinglists/NYSB.html

Please submit your observations to eBird:
http://ebird.org/content/ebird/

--

Re: [nysbirds-l] Photographer problem at Breezy Point

[Nadine Scarpa]

I was just about to post the same question about purpose, since the group
rules state:


The primary purpose of the List is to disseminate information about wild
bird sightings in and around New York State in a timely manner and to
provide an effective electronic forum for New York State area birders.



Instead of having respectful and ethical birders miss the opportunity to
see rare birds, we apparently need to police our own.



I also know that the ethics of birding also calls for using discretion when
revealing locations of rarities.  It would be unwise to post location
information to a generic website, but isn't that what this list is really
for?



I have seen as many birders as other clueless folks get too close to
birds, or cross onto private property, or just behave badly when trying to
see a rarity.



I treasure this list, and others like it, that allow folks to see birds
they wouldn't normally know about, or get to see in their lifetime!  I've
also done my share of reporting the folks who either break rules or laws in
the course of trying to see a bird.  I will continue to do that, and I hope
to also continue learning about the rarities and other information from
this list.



I hope the location posts continue.  It would be sad to deprive the good
birders of this information.



Nadine

On Mon, Feb 6, 2012 at 12:09 AM, Jim Osterlund james...@optonline.netwrote:

 I wonder, then;  what purpose does this list serve?



 --

 NYSbirds-L List Info:
 http://www.NortheastBirding.**com/NYSbirdsWELCOMEhttp://www.northeastbirding.com/NYSbirdsWELCOME
 http://www.NortheastBirding.**com/NYSbirdsRULEShttp://www.northeastbirding.com/NYSbirdsRULES
 http://www.NortheastBirding.**com/**NYSbirdsSubscribeConfiguration**
 Leave.htmhttp://www.northeastbirding.com/NYSbirdsSubscribeConfigurationLeave.htm

 ARCHIVES:
 1) 
 http://www.mail-archive.com/**nysbirds-l@cornell.edu/**maillist.htmlhttp://www.mail-archive.com/nysbirds-l@cornell.edu/maillist.html
 2) 
 http://www.surfbirds.com/**birdingmail/Group/NYSBirds-Lhttp://www.surfbirds.com/birdingmail/Group/NYSBirds-L
 3) 
 http://birdingonthe.net/**mailinglists/NYSB.htmlhttp://birdingonthe.net/mailinglists/NYSB.html

 Please submit your observations to eBird:
 http://ebird.org/content/**ebird/ http://ebird.org/content/ebird/

 --


--

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ARCHIVES:
1) http://www.mail-archive.com/nysbirds-l@cornell.edu/maillist.html
2) http://www.surfbirds.com/birdingmail/Group/NYSBirds-L
3) http://birdingonthe.net/mailinglists/NYSB.html

Please submit your observations to eBird:
http://ebird.org/content/ebird/

--

Fwd: [nysbirds-l] Photographer problem at Breezy Point

[Jim Osterlund]

Sent to me directly, by mistake;

Begin forwarded message:

From: scotty...@aol.com scotty...@aol.com
Date: February 6, 2012 7:12:36 AM EST
To: Jim Osterlund james...@optonline.net
Subject: Re: [nysbirds-l] Photographer problem at Breezy Point

It serves the ignorant, the lazy, and the the followers that have  
nothing better to do with there lives but annoy the professionals.  
This is the 1st year I had to endure women talking about car payments  
and mortgages out on wildlife walks. And the 1st year I have watched  
people yell across the dunes to get the birds attention. All I hear  
these days is talking when I should hear silence with wind and the  
waves crashing. This list has ruined the experience for many. And it's  
not worth it!
Sorry for the reality check.

Sent from my HTC on the Now Network from Sprint!

- Reply message -
From: Jim Osterlund james...@optonline.net
Date: Mon, Feb 6, 2012 12:09 am
Subject: [nysbirds-l] Photographer problem at Breezy Point
To: NYSBIRDS-L@cornell.edu

I wonder, then;  what purpose does this list serve?


--

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ARCHIVES:
1) http://www.mail-archive.com/nysbirds-l@cornell.edu/maillist.html
2) http://www.surfbirds.com/birdingmail/Group/NYSBirds-L
3) http://birdingonthe.net/mailinglists/NYSB.html

Please submit your observations to eBird:
http://ebird.org/content/ebird/

--




--

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ARCHIVES:
1) http://www.mail-archive.com/nysbirds-l@cornell.edu/maillist.html
2) http://www.surfbirds.com/birdingmail/Group/NYSBirds-L
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Please submit your observations to eBird:
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--

Re: [nysbirds-l] Photographer problem at Breezy Point

[Nadine Scarpa]

Scotty - Your statement is beyond ridiculous.



On Mon, Feb 6, 2012 at 12:25 PM, scotty...@aol.com scotty...@aol.comwrote:

 If your a good birder,  then u should know your locations for finding
 birds. Hiking is supposed to be part of the fun but its lost with the
 public. Posting rare birds locations online is stupid. Everyone will want
 to see and word will be spread.  Keep it secret, keep it sacred and keep
 the unwanted away from these locations. People ate coming from put of state
 now. You are all to blame.

 Sent from my HTC on the Now Network from Sprint!

 - Reply message -
 From: Nadine Scarpa nadinescarpaho...@gmail.com
 Date: Mon, Feb 6, 2012 10:56 am
 Subject: [nysbirds-l] Photographer problem at Breezy Point
 To: NYSBIRDS-L@cornell.edu

 I was just about to post the same question about purpose, since the group
 rules state:


 The primary purpose of the List is to disseminate information about wild
 bird sightings in and around New York State in a timely manner and to
 provide an effective electronic forum for New York State area birders.



 Instead of having respectful and ethical birders miss the opportunity to
 see rare birds, we apparently need to police our own.



 I also know that the ethics of birding also calls for using discretion
 when revealing locations of rarities.  It would be unwise to post location
 information to a generic website, but isn't that what this list is really
 for?



 I have seen as many birders as other clueless folks get too close to
 birds, or cross onto private property, or just behave badly when trying to
 see a rarity.



 I treasure this list, and others like it, that allow folks to see birds
 they wouldn't normally know about, or get to see in their lifetime!  I've
 also done my share of reporting the folks who either break rules or laws in
 the course of trying to see a bird.  I will continue to do that, and I hope
 to also continue learning about the rarities and other information from
 this list.



 I hope the location posts continue.  It would be sad to deprive the good
 birders of this information.



 Nadine

 On Mon, Feb 6, 2012 at 12:09 AM, Jim Osterlund james...@optonline.netwrote:

 I wonder, then;  what purpose does this list serve?



 --

 NYSbirds-L List Info:
 http://www.NortheastBirding.**com/NYSbirdsWELCOMEhttp://www.northeastbirding.com/NYSbirdsWELCOME
 http://www.NortheastBirding.**com/NYSbirdsRULEShttp://www.northeastbirding.com/NYSbirdsRULES
 http://www.NortheastBirding.**com/**NYSbirdsSubscribeConfiguration**
 Leave.htmhttp://www.northeastbirding.com/NYSbirdsSubscribeConfigurationLeave.htm

 ARCHIVES:
 1) 
 http://www.mail-archive.com/**nysbirds-l@cornell.edu/**maillist.htmlhttp://www.mail-archive.com/nysbirds-l@cornell.edu/maillist.html
 2) 
 http://www.surfbirds.com/**birdingmail/Group/NYSBirds-Lhttp://www.surfbirds.com/birdingmail/Group/NYSBirds-L
 3) 
 http://birdingonthe.net/**mailinglists/NYSB.htmlhttp://birdingonthe.net/mailinglists/NYSB.html

 Please submit your observations to eBird:
 http://ebird.org/content/**ebird/ http://ebird.org/content/ebird/

 --


 --
 *NYSbirds-L List Info:*
 Welcome and Basics http://www.northeastbirding.com/NYSbirdsWELCOME
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 *Archives:*
 The Mail 
 Archivehttp://www.mail-archive.com/nysbirds-l@cornell.edu/maillist.html
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 *Please submit your observations to **eBird*http://ebird.org/content/ebird/
 *!*
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Please submit your observations to eBird:
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Re: [nysbirds-l] Photographer problem at Breezy Point

[Jim Osterlund]

I wonder, then;  what purpose does this list serve?


--

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ARCHIVES:
1) http://www.mail-archive.com/nysbirds-l@cornell.edu/maillist.html
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3) http://birdingonthe.net/mailinglists/NYSB.html

Please submit your observations to eBird:
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Re: [nysbirds-l] Photographer problem at Breezy Point

[Seth Ausubel]

I have been birding the Long Island barrier beaches for over 20 years.  It is 
clear that human activity of all types has increased dramatically in that time. 
 This of course leads to more disturbance of wildlife.  There are many more 
photographers and birders now then there were back then, and information 
rapidly gets out to all.  Of course there are some bad actors in every group.  
While I have occasionally posted publicly about owl locations, I will no 
longer.  I think it is wise for all of us to refrain entirely from such 
posting.  We will probably not eliminate disturbance, but we should not in any 
way contribute to it.  This may be inconvenient for those respectful 
photographers and birders who would like to see an owl, but I believe is the 
best course. Here, again is ABA's Principles of Birding Ethics: 
http://www.aba.org/about/ethics.html

On Feb 5, 2012, at 9:03 PM, Phil Jeffrey wrote:

> The photographers shown in Rob's video were not the only instances.
> This photographer:
> http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-BqOGEhoql4A/Ty8zKetR49I/BLo/NhfyRUrXTrE/s1600/BozoBirdPhotographer_W5G7596.jpg
> was walking all over the dune area too in pursuit of the owls as of
> 8:30am.  One of the owls may have flushed as a result, although they
> were also observed moving independently.  I also have a photograph of
> this guy's SUV and NY license plate.
> 
> Birders need to understand that bird photographers are parasitic of
> the sightings on this list (this particular photographer was aware of
> the original NYSBirds-L post).
> 
> Phil Jeffrey
> 
> 
> On Sun, Feb 5, 2012 at 6:33 PM, Rob Jett  wrote:
>> I really hate to have to post this note, but ...
>> 
>> Today at Breezy Point two photographers decided to ignore common sense, 
>> birding ethics and clearly posted NPS signs to get close to the reported 
>> owls. They had walked a long distance into the protected dune habitat and 
>> stationed themselves close to the bird to take photos. I've uploaded a video 
>> of the two geniuses here:
> 
> --
> 
> NYSbirds-L List Info:
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> 
> ARCHIVES:
> 1) http://www.mail-archive.com/nysbirds-l@cornell.edu/maillist.html
> 2) http://www.surfbirds.com/birdingmail/Group/NYSBirds-L
> 3) http://birdingonthe.net/mailinglists/NYSB.html
> 
> Please submit your observations to eBird:
> http://ebird.org/content/ebird/
> 
> --
> 

Seth Ausubel
Forest Hills, NY




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Re: [nysbirds-l] Photographer problem at Breezy Point

[Matt Bango]

I completely agree with Rob and Mardi. I just want to add what I witnessed
today - there were several birders as far out as the second dune and a
walker with a dog off of the leash within 50-75 meters of one of the owls
(it appeared that the walker had no idea the owl was there). My trip to
Breezy Point today was my first time being there and I did not notice the
'dunes closed' sign until I was on my way out. Perhaps the photographers
did not know the dunes were closed? I find that statement hard to believe
with the two time offender, but possibly the other two individuals were
just not properly informed? I think that it is a bit unfair to single out
photographers as problem individuals when both birders and other
individuals in the field for other reasons are equally as problematic. If
any of the photographers identified earlier are reading this thread -
simply bird (and photograph) ethically and these issues won't come about.

Also, thank you to the original poster of the Breezy Point owls as it was
one of my most memorable sightings as a birder in NYC.

Best,
Matt





On Sun, Feb 5, 2012 at 10:06 PM, Rob Jett  wrote:

> I concur with Mardi, my postings were never meant to imply that ALL
> photographers are a problem. Like every endeavor, amateur or professional,
> there are people who play by the rules and those whom think the rules don't
> apply. Let's not condemn a whole group of people just because there are a
> few bad apples out there.
>
> Rob
>
>
>
>
> --
>
> NYSbirds-L List Info:
> http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsWELCOME
> http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsRULES
> http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsSubscribeConfigurationLeave.htm
>
> ARCHIVES:
> 1) http://www.mail-archive.com/nysbirds-l@cornell.edu/maillist.html
> 2) http://www.surfbirds.com/birdingmail/Group/NYSBirds-L
> 3) http://birdingonthe.net/mailinglists/NYSB.html
>
> Please submit your observations to eBird:
> http://ebird.org/content/ebird/
>
> --
>
>

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Re:[nysbirds-l] Photographer problem at Breezy Point

[Rob Jett]

I concur with Mardi, my postings were never meant to imply that ALL 
photographers are a problem. Like every endeavor, amateur or professional, 
there are people who play by the rules and those whom think the rules don't 
apply. Let's not condemn a whole group of people just because there are a few 
bad apples out there.

Rob




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Re: [nysbirds-l] Photographer problem at Breezy Point

[Mardi Dickinson]

Phil et al,

Lets be VERY careful & clear NOT to put ALL Bird photographers or any 
photographers for that fact in this  quote you made below please!

> "Birders need to understand that bird photographers are parasitic of
> the sightings on this list"

I have been a pro photographer for 40 years and would NEVER do what the 2 time 
offender or more has done PERIOD!  I would also be mindful of NOT posting exact 
locations of such birds. Lets all remember to think of the birds before posting 
questionable sightings. It is the right thing to do!

Cheers,
Mardi W. Dickinson
Norwalk CT
http://kymry.wordpress.com
http://twitter.com/MardiWD

On Feb 5, 2012, at 9:03 PM, Phil Jeffrey  wrote:

> The photographers shown in Rob's video were not the only instances.
> This photographer:
> http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-BqOGEhoql4A/Ty8zKetR49I/BLo/NhfyRUrXTrE/s1600/BozoBirdPhotographer_W5G7596.jpg
> was walking all over the dune area too in pursuit of the owls as of
> 8:30am.  One of the owls may have flushed as a result, although they
> were also observed moving independently.  I also have a photograph of
> this guy's SUV and NY license plate.
> 
> Birders need to understand that bird photographers are parasitic of
> the sightings on this list (this particular photographer was aware of
> the original NYSBirds-L post).
> 
> Phil Jeffrey
> 
> 
> On Sun, Feb 5, 2012 at 6:33 PM, Rob Jett  wrote:
>> I really hate to have to post this note, but ...
>> 
>> Today at Breezy Point two photographers decided to ignore common sense, 
>> birding ethics and clearly posted NPS signs to get close to the reported 
>> owls. They had walked a long distance into the protected dune habitat and 
>> stationed themselves close to the bird to take photos. I've uploaded a video 
>> of the two geniuses here:
> 
> --
> 
> NYSbirds-L List Info:
> http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsWELCOME
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> 
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> 
> Please submit your observations to eBird:
> http://ebird.org/content/ebird/
> 
> --
> 

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Re: [nysbirds-l] Photographer problem at Breezy Point

[Phil Jeffrey]

The photographers shown in Rob's video were not the only instances.
This photographer:
http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-BqOGEhoql4A/Ty8zKetR49I/BLo/NhfyRUrXTrE/s1600/BozoBirdPhotographer_W5G7596.jpg
was walking all over the dune area too in pursuit of the owls as of
8:30am.  One of the owls may have flushed as a result, although they
were also observed moving independently.  I also have a photograph of
this guy's SUV and NY license plate.

Birders need to understand that bird photographers are parasitic of
the sightings on this list (this particular photographer was aware of
the original NYSBirds-L post).

Phil Jeffrey


On Sun, Feb 5, 2012 at 6:33 PM, Rob Jett  wrote:
> I really hate to have to post this note, but ...
>
> Today at Breezy Point two photographers decided to ignore common sense, 
> birding ethics and clearly posted NPS signs to get close to the reported 
> owls. They had walked a long distance into the protected dune habitat and 
> stationed themselves close to the bird to take photos. I've uploaded a video 
> of the two geniuses here:

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[nysbirds-l] Photographer problem at Breezy Point

[Rob Jett]

I really hate to have to post this note, but ... 

Today at Breezy Point two photographers decided to ignore common sense, birding 
ethics and clearly posted NPS signs to get close to the reported owls. They had 
walked a long distance into the protected dune habitat and stationed themselves 
close to the bird to take photos. I've uploaded a video of the two geniuses 
here:

http://youtu.be/Q-f8AzNn-F8

One of the guys was the same person that I posted about a couple months ago 
because he was walking around on the protected grassland at Floyd Bennett 
Field. If videos and photos aren't enough to shame these two into ethical 
behavior, perhaps posting their names might. In addition, I called the NPS and 
they said that they were dispatching the park police, however I don't know if 
they ever arrived.

Several other people were present at the time and were able to easily view the 
birds from a respectable distance without stressing them or encroaching on the 
sensitive dune habitat.

Good and ethical birding,

Rob
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[nysbirds-l] Photographer problem at Breezy Point

[Rob Jett]

I really hate to have to post this note, but ... 

Today at Breezy Point two photographers decided to ignore common sense, birding 
ethics and clearly posted NPS signs to get close to the reported owls. They had 
walked a long distance into the protected dune habitat and stationed themselves 
close to the bird to take photos. I've uploaded a video of the two geniuses 
here:

http://youtu.be/Q-f8AzNn-F8

One of the guys was the same person that I posted about a couple months ago 
because he was walking around on the protected grassland at Floyd Bennett 
Field. If videos and photos aren't enough to shame these two into ethical 
behavior, perhaps posting their names might. In addition, I called the NPS and 
they said that they were dispatching the park police, however I don't know if 
they ever arrived.

Several other people were present at the time and were able to easily view the 
birds from a respectable distance without stressing them or encroaching on the 
sensitive dune habitat.

Good and ethical birding,

Rob
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Please submit your observations to eBird:
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Re: [nysbirds-l] Photographer problem at Breezy Point

[Phil Jeffrey]

The photographers shown in Rob's video were not the only instances.
This photographer:
http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-BqOGEhoql4A/Ty8zKetR49I/BLo/NhfyRUrXTrE/s1600/BozoBirdPhotographer_W5G7596.jpg
was walking all over the dune area too in pursuit of the owls as of
8:30am.  One of the owls may have flushed as a result, although they
were also observed moving independently.  I also have a photograph of
this guy's SUV and NY license plate.

Birders need to understand that bird photographers are parasitic of
the sightings on this list (this particular photographer was aware of
the original NYSBirds-L post).

Phil Jeffrey


On Sun, Feb 5, 2012 at 6:33 PM, Rob Jett citybir...@earthlink.net wrote:
 I really hate to have to post this note, but ...

 Today at Breezy Point two photographers decided to ignore common sense, 
 birding ethics and clearly posted NPS signs to get close to the reported 
 owls. They had walked a long distance into the protected dune habitat and 
 stationed themselves close to the bird to take photos. I've uploaded a video 
 of the two geniuses here:

--

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http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsWELCOME
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ARCHIVES:
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2) http://www.surfbirds.com/birdingmail/Group/NYSBirds-L
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Please submit your observations to eBird:
http://ebird.org/content/ebird/

--

Re:[nysbirds-l] Photographer problem at Breezy Point

[Rob Jett]

I concur with Mardi, my postings were never meant to imply that ALL 
photographers are a problem. Like every endeavor, amateur or professional, 
there are people who play by the rules and those whom think the rules don't 
apply. Let's not condemn a whole group of people just because there are a few 
bad apples out there.

Rob




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Please submit your observations to eBird:
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Re: [nysbirds-l] Photographer problem at Breezy Point

[Matt Bango]

I completely agree with Rob and Mardi. I just want to add what I witnessed
today - there were several birders as far out as the second dune and a
walker with a dog off of the leash within 50-75 meters of one of the owls
(it appeared that the walker had no idea the owl was there). My trip to
Breezy Point today was my first time being there and I did not notice the
'dunes closed' sign until I was on my way out. Perhaps the photographers
did not know the dunes were closed? I find that statement hard to believe
with the two time offender, but possibly the other two individuals were
just not properly informed? I think that it is a bit unfair to single out
photographers as problem individuals when both birders and other
individuals in the field for other reasons are equally as problematic. If
any of the photographers identified earlier are reading this thread -
simply bird (and photograph) ethically and these issues won't come about.

Also, thank you to the original poster of the Breezy Point owls as it was
one of my most memorable sightings as a birder in NYC.

Best,
Matt





On Sun, Feb 5, 2012 at 10:06 PM, Rob Jett citybir...@earthlink.net wrote:

 I concur with Mardi, my postings were never meant to imply that ALL
 photographers are a problem. Like every endeavor, amateur or professional,
 there are people who play by the rules and those whom think the rules don't
 apply. Let's not condemn a whole group of people just because there are a
 few bad apples out there.

 Rob




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 --



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Re: [nysbirds-l] Photographer problem at Breezy Point

[Seth Ausubel]

I have been birding the Long Island barrier beaches for over 20 years.  It is 
clear that human activity of all types has increased dramatically in that time. 
 This of course leads to more disturbance of wildlife.  There are many more 
photographers and birders now then there were back then, and information 
rapidly gets out to all.  Of course there are some bad actors in every group.  
While I have occasionally posted publicly about owl locations, I will no 
longer.  I think it is wise for all of us to refrain entirely from such 
posting.  We will probably not eliminate disturbance, but we should not in any 
way contribute to it.  This may be inconvenient for those respectful 
photographers and birders who would like to see an owl, but I believe is the 
best course. Here, again is ABA's Principles of Birding Ethics: 
http://www.aba.org/about/ethics.html

On Feb 5, 2012, at 9:03 PM, Phil Jeffrey wrote:

 The photographers shown in Rob's video were not the only instances.
 This photographer:
 http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-BqOGEhoql4A/Ty8zKetR49I/BLo/NhfyRUrXTrE/s1600/BozoBirdPhotographer_W5G7596.jpg
 was walking all over the dune area too in pursuit of the owls as of
 8:30am.  One of the owls may have flushed as a result, although they
 were also observed moving independently.  I also have a photograph of
 this guy's SUV and NY license plate.
 
 Birders need to understand that bird photographers are parasitic of
 the sightings on this list (this particular photographer was aware of
 the original NYSBirds-L post).
 
 Phil Jeffrey
 
 
 On Sun, Feb 5, 2012 at 6:33 PM, Rob Jett citybir...@earthlink.net wrote:
 I really hate to have to post this note, but ...
 
 Today at Breezy Point two photographers decided to ignore common sense, 
 birding ethics and clearly posted NPS signs to get close to the reported 
 owls. They had walked a long distance into the protected dune habitat and 
 stationed themselves close to the bird to take photos. I've uploaded a video 
 of the two geniuses here:
 
 --
 
 NYSbirds-L List Info:
 http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsWELCOME
 http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsRULES
 http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsSubscribeConfigurationLeave.htm
 
 ARCHIVES:
 1) http://www.mail-archive.com/nysbirds-l@cornell.edu/maillist.html
 2) http://www.surfbirds.com/birdingmail/Group/NYSBirds-L
 3) http://birdingonthe.net/mailinglists/NYSB.html
 
 Please submit your observations to eBird:
 http://ebird.org/content/ebird/
 
 --
 

Seth Ausubel
Forest Hills, NY




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Re: [nysbirds-l] Photographer problem at Breezy Point

[Jim Osterlund]

I wonder, then;  what purpose does this list serve?


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