Re: [opencog-dev] Re: ImplicationLink?

[Linas Vepstas]

Shortly after sending this message, I decided that it was a bad idea to let
a sleeping bug lie. I am totally and completly confused by ImplicationLink.
  I flat out do not understand it, at all, not one whit.

Consider this:

(ImplicationLink  (VariableNode "$X")   (PredicateNode "is-human"))

In C++ I can cast this to a ScopeLink, and then as the ScopeLink "what are
your variables?"  and I get back the answer "None".

That's it, game over. My brain no longer functions.   What does it mean, to
have a link that has variables, to not have variables in it???

My knee-jerk reaction is that the code is buggy, that it is a mistake to
have ImplicationLink inherit from ScopeLink, that some chain of accidents
lead to this point.   The wikipage is utterly incomprehensible: I don't
understand it either.  What is Implication?  Can we fix this so it makes
sense in some way?

--linas








On Sat, Oct 15, 2016 at 10:11 PM, Linas Vepstas 
wrote:

> OK, I'll defer the conversation. Sooner or later, Amen will open another
> bug report once again titled "question: feature or bug?" and I guess we can
> deal with it then.
>
> --linas
>
> On Thu, Oct 13, 2016 at 12:56 AM, 'Nil Geisweiller' via opencog <
> opencog@googlegroups.com> wrote:
>
>> On 10/13/2016 02:38 AM, Ben Goertzel wrote:
>>
>>> Wait ... we can have nested ScopeLinks, so that a variable embedded in
>>> two ScopeLInks can be bound by the outer one or the inner one... no?
>>>
>>
>> Yes, no problem, if a variable is scoped by both then the inner one will
>> cover the outer one.
>>
>> Anyway, I don't see a problem with having a C++ ImplicationLink class
>> inherit the ScopeLink class. The only think to take care of is to have no
>> variable extracted when there are 2 arguments, that is when using the non
>> sugar for of the ImplicationLink
>>
>> ImplicationLink
>>   P
>>   Q
>>
>> I think that is what the code does, but if it doesn't or its buggy it
>> should be fixed, I'm happy to fix it as soon as unit test fails because of
>> it.
>>
>> Nil
>>
>>
>>
>>> On Wed, Oct 12, 2016 at 4:08 PM, Linas Vepstas 
>>> wrote:
>>>


 On Wed, Oct 12, 2016 at 12:53 PM, Nil Geisweiller <
 ngeis...@googlemail.com>
 wrote:

>
>
>
> On 10/12/2016 06:55 PM, Linas Vepstas wrote:
>
>>
>> Well, yes, but Nil,, look at the core issue: the variable X in the
>> Implication link is bound, but the unit test is pretending that its
>> free.  My question is: are you *sure* you really want the
>> implicationLink to inherit from Scope Link (and thus, always bind it's
>> variables)?
>>
>
>
> X is supposed to be free in the ImplicationLink,
>


 Really?  The C++ code has ImplicationLink inheriting from ScopeLink,
 thus
 making it bound.  Perhaps ImplicationLink should not inherit from
 ScopeLink?

 ?


> bound to the PutLink. Yes I am sure I want it free in the
> ImplicationLink.
> Having ImplicationLink inherit Scope should not prevent that. The
> syntax
> itself is ambiguity free, if there are ambiguities in the code it's a
> bug
> and it should be fixed.
>
> Again, I'm happy to fix anything related to that once the issue
> reappears.
>
> Nil
>
>
>> --linas
>>
>>
>> On Wed, Oct 12, 2016 at 10:39 AM, Nil Geisweiller
>> > wrote:
>>
>>  OK, when they fail again I guess you might feel free to push to
>> the
>>  master, as we're apparently using as a dev branch, and then I'll
>> fix
>>  that.
>>
>>  Nil
>>
>>  On 10/12/2016 06:17 PM, Linas Vepstas wrote:
>>
>>  No, actually, I worked around that.
>>
>>  The only reason that PutLinkUTest currently passes is because
>>  PutLink
>>  fails to treat ScopeLinks correctly.  When that gets fixed,
>> the
>> unit
>>  test will fail ... the issue remains the same.
>>
>>  --linas
>>
>>  On Tue, Oct 11, 2016 at 11:57 PM, Nil Geisweiller
>>  
>>  >  >> wrote:
>>
>>   Are these unit tests still failing?
>>
>>   Nil
>>
>>
>>   On 10/11/2016 08:36 PM, Linas Vepstas wrote:
>>
>>   47 unit tests fail ... I'm not sure if they all fail
>>  for the same
>>   reason, though.
>>
>>   For example PutLink
>>
>>   (PutLink
>>   (LambdaLink
>> (VariableList
>>   (TypedVariableLink
>> 

Re: [opencog-dev] About Attention Values and Truth Values

[Linas Vepstas]

On Wed, Oct 12, 2016 at 9:48 AM, vishnu  wrote:
>
>
> With attention values, i thought i could do the following:
> I have 24x7 tweets coming. So i thought,  I can send them to NLP pipeline
> and get Atoms. Let's say most of the people tweet about Presidential
> Election.  I assumed that,  when feeding these atoms into atomspace,
> somehow atoms related to "Election" will get High STI?. Since they occur
> more often now-a-days. Say, there will be a lot of Trump and Hilary Clinton
> atoms. Somehow they get high STI  (?!!) and i can retrieve those top ranked
> atoms and its related atoms (since STI is also diffused to similar atoms).
>

Well, a very olde-fshioned idea (olde in "internet time") is to PageRank
algorithm -- https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PageRank -- and so you would
take something like STI, and diffuse it to other atoms, based on how many
incoming and outgoing links there are.

ECAN does something like PageRank, but different, I don't recall what the
differences are.  If you don't like how it distributes the STI, you could
create a different variant-- e.g. a PageRankImportanceDiffussionAgent and
it would use the pagerank algo, instead of the ECAN algo.  I don't know
which would give better results for you.

--linas


>
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