Re: [Openstack] [Openstack-operators] Mailing-list split
hi Everett, On Mon 30 Apr 2012 09:12:24 AM PDT, Everett Toews wrote: It's strange to me that we would take the existing mailing list openstack-operators and move the Ops people on it to the openstack list and repurpose the openstack-operators for DevOps people. I'm lost here, I don't understand what you're proposing to do. Let's summarize: Thierry framed the problem: The traffic on the openstack@lists.launchpad.net list doubled in the last 4 months [3], with more users and deployers asking for information on OpenStack projects. And he made a proposa to split between: 1/ Usage, deployment, Essex / current-stable discussions 2/ Development, contribution, Folsom / forward-looking discussions A new list will be created for (2) and existing contributors will be asked to subscribe to that new list He said nothing about point 1. I assumed that openstack-operators is one of the place for discussions around usage, deployment and such (another place for that is the forum). It seems to me there there is consensus to keep openstack-operators and forums running therefore I'll ask Todd to review the openstack.org/community pages (and the top navigation bar) in order to make these landing destinations more prominent. Cheers, stef ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~openstack Post to : openstack@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~openstack More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Openstack] [Openstack-operators] Mailing-list split
Hi Stefano, I was replying to Duncan's email, not Thierry's. I'm all for the new openstack-dev list. It was Duncan's proposal that the other lists be split as so. 1. openstack-dev = Dev 2. openstack = Ops 3. openstack-operators = DevOps I am questioning the necessity to have both lists 2 and 3. My proposal boils down to the question, does the DevOps community really need its own list? I'm willing to wait until the next Summit to see what the traffic numbers are like on the openstack and openstack-operators lists before any decisions are made around merging them or keeping them separate. However, I still think it's worthwhile to ask the question above. Regards, Everett On Mon, Apr 30, 2012 at 11:08 AM, Stefano Maffulli stef...@openstack.orgwrote: hi Everett, On Mon 30 Apr 2012 09:12:24 AM PDT, Everett Toews wrote: It's strange to me that we would take the existing mailing list openstack-operators and move the Ops people on it to the openstack list and repurpose the openstack-operators for DevOps people. I'm lost here, I don't understand what you're proposing to do. Let's summarize: Thierry framed the problem: The traffic on the openstack@lists.launchpad.net list doubled in the last 4 months [3], with more users and deployers asking for information on OpenStack projects. And he made a proposa to split between: 1/ Usage, deployment, Essex / current-stable discussions 2/ Development, contribution, Folsom / forward-looking discussions A new list will be created for (2) and existing contributors will be asked to subscribe to that new list He said nothing about point 1. I assumed that openstack-operators is one of the place for discussions around usage, deployment and such (another place for that is the forum). It seems to me there there is consensus to keep openstack-operators and forums running therefore I'll ask Todd to review the openstack.org/community pages (and the top navigation bar) in order to make these landing destinations more prominent. Cheers, stef ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~openstack Post to : openstack@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~openstack More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Openstack] [Openstack-operators] Mailing-list split
On Mon, Apr 30, 2012 at 2:01 PM, Everett Toews everett.to...@cybera.ca wrote: Hi Stefano, I was replying to Duncan's email, not Thierry's. I'm all for the new openstack-dev list. It was Duncan's proposal that the other lists be split as so. 1. openstack-dev = Dev 2. openstack = Ops 3. openstack-operators = DevOps To be clear, my proposal is to see how the devops community feels about this, before deciding it's a good idea, without their input. I am questioning the necessity to have both lists 2 and 3. My proposal boils down to the question, does the DevOps community really need its own list? As soon as it's clear that *everyone* feels this way, we should do it. Until then, we should not make decisions that impact the community (e.g., taking something away that may be valueable to some) without getting their feedback and finding some way transition in a way that keeps everyone happy. I'm willing to wait until the next Summit to see what the traffic numbers are like on the openstack and openstack-operators lists before any decisions are made around merging them or keeping them separate. Agreed. However, I still think it's worthwhile to ask the question above. Agreed. d ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~openstack Post to : openstack@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~openstack More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Openstack] [Openstack-operators] Mailing-list split
On Mon, Apr 30, 2012 at 1:07 PM, Duncan McGreggor dun...@dreamhost.com wrote: On Mon, Apr 30, 2012 at 2:01 PM, Everett Toews everett.to...@cybera.ca wrote: Hi Stefano, I was replying to Duncan's email, not Thierry's. I'm all for the new openstack-dev list. It was Duncan's proposal that the other lists be split as so. 1. openstack-dev = Dev 2. openstack = Ops 3. openstack-operators = DevOps snip I think adding the openstack-dev list will help alleviate traffic on openstack, but we should keep 3 mailing lists. The openstack one will probably continue to be a mix of traffic, and as new community members become more familiar with the mailing list landscape they'll move to the proper lists (with gentle encouragement as well). With more visibility and encouragement, more focused operations questions will get to the proper openstack-operators list in the future (likewise -dev). I don't expect mailing list traffic to decrease in the future, so reducing the number of mailing lists seems unnecessary. Thanks, Matt Ray Senior Technical Evangelist | Opscode Inc. m...@opscode.com | (512) 731-2218 Twitter, IRC, GitHub: mattray To be clear, my proposal is to see how the devops community feels about this, before deciding it's a good idea, without their input. I am questioning the necessity to have both lists 2 and 3. My proposal boils down to the question, does the DevOps community really need its own list? As soon as it's clear that *everyone* feels this way, we should do it. Until then, we should not make decisions that impact the community (e.g., taking something away that may be valueable to some) without getting their feedback and finding some way transition in a way that keeps everyone happy. I'm willing to wait until the next Summit to see what the traffic numbers are like on the openstack and openstack-operators lists before any decisions are made around merging them or keeping them separate. Agreed. However, I still think it's worthwhile to ask the question above. Agreed. d ___ Openstack-operators mailing list openstack-operat...@lists.openstack.org http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/openstack-operators ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~openstack Post to : openstack@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~openstack More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Openstack] [Openstack-operators] Mailing-list split
On Fri 27 Apr 2012 02:43:14 PM PDT, Duncan McGreggor wrote: But if openstack-operators has become a property valuable to community members, we shouldn't just get rid of it because it doesn't make logical sense. We should make sure that folks are ready to transition to another location for their DevOps needs. I agree with this approach: let's cross that bridge when we come to it. We should make one small change at the time, measure/evaluate and keep changing as needed. thanks, stef ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~openstack Post to : openstack@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~openstack More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
