Re: [openstack-dev] [Rally][all] Gitter as an alternative way for communication

[Andrey Kurilin]

Hi Thierry,

On Fri, Nov 25, 2016 at 12:51 PM, Thierry Carrez 
wrote:

> Andrey Kurilin wrote:
> > I'm happy to announce our new chats at gitter.im  :
> > [...]
>
> While I understand where you're coming from, I would like to remind you
> that the OpenStack community standardized on IRC for community
> communication. Maintaining alternate communication channels might make
> it slightly easier for your team members, but it makes it more difficult
> for others in the OpenStack community to follow what is happening, and
> participate to Rally development.


As I said before, we do not plan to abandon our regular IRC channel and we
have a bot for synchronisation messages between gitter and irc channels, so
users from Gitter can participate in IRC discussions, and vice versa users
from IRC
can ping guys from our Gitter channel. It is just an extension of rally
communication
workflow, not replacement of IRC at all.



> This is why as part of the official
> OpenStack project team requirements we have usage of IRC baked in.
>
> IRC is a standard protocol, implemented in a lot of open source clients.
> Alternatives like Slack or Gitter are closed-source services with terms
> of use (and future decisions on openness and pricing) that may or may
> not be acceptable by our community members -- using them creates
> fragmentation within the OpenStack community.
>
> That is not saying that IRC is perfect and that we will never move to
> something else. But when we do, it will be as a community (and after an
> open community discussion) and not project per project.


I can believe that OpenStack community will move from Freenode to another
IRC service (if Freenode dies) someday, but moving to another protocol is
unbelievable
thing for me. OpenStack community will never do it. :) We'd rather maintain
IRC protocol by ourself...

That is why Rally-community decided to use "not-irc tool" without
cross-project
discussion. BUT, as I said before, we did it without breaking compatibility
with
other OpenStack projects and we will not do it..


> It is also
> likely to be toward an open protocol supported by open source software,
> rather than one specific third-party proprietary web service.
>

Why? Why we can not use convenient free for opensource projects things?
Why not enjoy all the advantages of the modern world?:) It is out of
current topic, but
why we use inconvenient launchpad instead of bitbucket and so on?


> Regards,
>
> --
> Thierry Carrez (ttx)
>
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-- 
Best regards,
Andrey Kurilin.
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Re: [openstack-dev] [Rally][all] Gitter as an alternative way for communication

[Thierry Carrez]

Andrey Kurilin wrote:
> I'm happy to announce our new chats at gitter.im  :
> [...]

While I understand where you're coming from, I would like to remind you
that the OpenStack community standardized on IRC for community
communication. Maintaining alternate communication channels might make
it slightly easier for your team members, but it makes it more difficult
for others in the OpenStack community to follow what is happening, and
participate to Rally development. This is why as part of the official
OpenStack project team requirements we have usage of IRC baked in.

IRC is a standard protocol, implemented in a lot of open source clients.
Alternatives like Slack or Gitter are closed-source services with terms
of use (and future decisions on openness and pricing) that may or may
not be acceptable by our community members -- using them creates
fragmentation within the OpenStack community.

That is not saying that IRC is perfect and that we will never move to
something else. But when we do, it will be as a community (and after an
open community discussion) and not project per project. It is also
likely to be toward an open protocol supported by open source software,
rather than one specific third-party proprietary web service.

Regards,

-- 
Thierry Carrez (ttx)

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Re: [openstack-dev] [Rally][all] Gitter as an alternative way for communication

[Luigi Toscano]

On Thursday, 24 November 2016 16:20:32 CET Andrey Kurilin wrote:
> Hi folks!
> 
> I'm happy to announce our new chats at gitter.im :
> 
> - https://gitter.im/rally-dev/Lobby  # main chat for regular
> communication
> - https://gitter.im/rally-dev/statuses  # chat for gerrit notifications
> 
> These chats are configured with a simple bot which syncs messages between
> Gitter and IRC, so we do not plan to abandon our #openstack-rally Freenode
> channel and you can choose the best messenger for yourself.
> 
> Long story:
> I had a talk with several guys some time ago and they mentioned that IRC is
> not convenient for them enough, even with modern clients like IRCCloud (it
> is not an advertisement:) ). Also, this topic was raised at Rally work
> session at Barcelona and we discussed it at our weekly meetings too.

Do you know that matrix.org allows you to access all freenode channels? (see 
also the riot.im client)

-- 
Luigi

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[openstack-dev] [Rally][all] Gitter as an alternative way for communication

[Andrey Kurilin]

Hi folks!

I'm happy to announce our new chats at gitter.im :

- https://gitter.im/rally-dev/Lobby  # main chat for regular
communication
- https://gitter.im/rally-dev/statuses  # chat for gerrit notifications

These chats are configured with a simple bot which syncs messages between
Gitter and IRC, so we do not plan to abandon our #openstack-rally Freenode
channel and you can choose the best messenger for yourself.

Long story:
I had a talk with several guys some time ago and they mentioned that IRC is
not convenient for them enough, even with modern clients like IRCCloud (it
is not an advertisement:) ). Also, this topic was raised at Rally work
session at Barcelona and we discussed it at our weekly meetings too.

Why Gitter?
Gitter is a free service from GitHub, so you can use you GitHub account for
authentication (everyone has GitHub account) or you can use your twitter
account. It provides convenient chats with avatars, quoting, markdown and
etc. You do not need an invitation for join us - just go to
https://gitter.im/rally-dev/Lobby and push "join room" button.
Also, if you want, you can use Gitter IRC tunnel (actually, you do not need
it, you can continue use #openstack-rally Freenode channel).

Why not slack?
Slack is good enough and it is used by another big community - Kubernetes,
but, imho, it has at least several limitations: you need to be invited for
joining "organization"; the way of switching between organizations are not
good enough.

-- 
Best regards,
Andrey Kurilin.
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