Re: [openstack-dev] Deprecation warnings considered harmful?
On 18 March 2015 at 05:22, Ihar Hrachyshka ihrac...@redhat.com wrote: -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 ... That relatively short-lived issue already resulted in multiple backports to stable branches with new namespaces being used. F.e. see: https://bugs.launchpad.net/nova/+bug/1432685 There is no safe way to communicate the issue to all parties involved, so if automation is good at catching those issues, it should be applied. It's wrong to rely on people when a hacking check is enough. +1 to automation. -1 to blocking forward progress on transient changes because our automation hasn't been updated. -Rob -- Robert Collins rbtcoll...@hp.com Distinguished Technologist HP Converged Cloud __ OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions) Unsubscribe: openstack-dev-requ...@lists.openstack.org?subject:unsubscribe http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/openstack-dev
Re: [openstack-dev] Deprecation warnings considered harmful?
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On 03/13/2015 04:36 PM, Doug Hellmann wrote: On Fri, Mar 13, 2015, at 07:25 AM, Ihar Hrachyshka wrote: On 03/13/2015 01:37 AM, Nikhil Manchanda wrote: Looking back at the meeting eavesdrop, the primary reasons why we deferred this work to Liberty was twofold: - It wasn't a set plan based on information available to us at the time. This being the case, we decided to wait until we had more information regarding the requirements around this from oslo. - We wanted to ensure that we had a corresponding hacking rule in place to prevent future patch-sets from using the deprecated module names. For hacking check, I have a patch in review for 'hacking' repo to add checks (both for stable branches where oslo.* namespace is used, and new branches where oslo_* is expected): - https://review.openstack.org/157894 Also, neutron has a (test covered) hacking check at: http://git.openstack.org/cgit/openstack/neutron/tree/neutron/hacking/checks.py#n119 Feel free to adopt. I wish we, as a community, were less obsessed with creating so many hacking rules. These are really minor changes and it's going to be a relatively short-lived issue that could just be fixed once. If there's a regression, fixing *that* won't be hard or take long. That relatively short-lived issue already resulted in multiple backports to stable branches with new namespaces being used. F.e. see: https://bugs.launchpad.net/nova/+bug/1432685 There is no safe way to communicate the issue to all parties involved, so if automation is good at catching those issues, it should be applied. It's wrong to rely on people when a hacking check is enough. As I said in the IRC snippet pasted into the meeting log linked elsewhere in the thread, I want to drop the oslo package during the next cycle. It's not clear that all projects will be ready for us to do that, and that's why it's not a definite plan, yet. We're trying to be cognizant of the fact that you all have other things you're trying to accomplish too, and that this work appears like code churn even though it is solving a problem many developers have had in their development environments. In any case, you should plan for all Oslo libraries to drop the namespace packages entirely *soon*. If not for Liberty then definitely for M. There's no sense at all in delaying the work needed in your projects beyond L-1, and landing the changes sooner is better than waiting. Doug We specifically didn't consider the impact of logging statements with deprecation warnings at the meeting. We now have a better picture of the actual status -- with the oslo decision that these namespace packages are definitely going away. I've added an agenda item to bring this up again at the next Trove weekly meeting [1] so that we can address this. [1] https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/TroveMeeting Thanks, Nikhil On Thu, Mar 12, 2015 at 4:05 PM, Robert Collins robe...@robertcollins.net mailto:robe...@robertcollins.net wrote: On 13 March 2015 at 09:43, Ihar Hrachyshka ihrac...@redhat.com mailto:ihrac...@redhat.com wrote: -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On 03/12/2015 09:35 PM, Robert Collins wrote: On 13 March 2015 at 08:09, Ihar Hrachyshka ihrac...@redhat.com mailto:ihrac...@redhat.com wrote: -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On 03/12/2015 11:38 AM, Boris Bobrov wrote: On Thursday 12 March 2015 12:59:10 Duncan Thomas wrote: So, assuming that all of the oslo depreciations aren't going to be fixed before release What makes you think that? In my opinion it's just one component's problem. These particular deprecation warnings are a result of still on-going migration from oslo.package to oslo_package. Ironically, all components except oslo have already moved to the new naming scheme. It's actually wrong. For example, Trove decided to stay on using the old namespace for Kilo. Why? -Rob http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/irclogs/%23openstack-meeting-alt/%23openstack-meeting-alt.2015-02-11.log starting from 2015-02-11T18:03:11. I guess the assumption was that there is immediate benefit, and they can just wait. Though I don't think the fact that it means deprecation warnings in their logs was appreciated at the time of decision. Thanks, reading that it looks like the actual status (oslo decided most definitely that namespace packages are going away, its just a matter of when) wasn't understood in that meeting. Is it possible to put it back on the agenda for the next Trove meeting? Cheers, Rob -- Robert Collins rbtcoll...@hp.com mailto:rbtcoll...@hp.com Distinguished Technologist HP Converged Cloud __ OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions) Unsubscribe:
Re: [openstack-dev] Deprecation warnings considered harmful?
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On 03/17/2015 05:22 PM, Ihar Hrachyshka wrote: On 03/13/2015 04:36 PM, Doug Hellmann wrote: On Fri, Mar 13, 2015, at 07:25 AM, Ihar Hrachyshka wrote: On 03/13/2015 01:37 AM, Nikhil Manchanda wrote: Looking back at the meeting eavesdrop, the primary reasons why we deferred this work to Liberty was twofold: - It wasn't a set plan based on information available to us at the time. This being the case, we decided to wait until we had more information regarding the requirements around this from oslo. - We wanted to ensure that we had a corresponding hacking rule in place to prevent future patch-sets from using the deprecated module names. For hacking check, I have a patch in review for 'hacking' repo to add checks (both for stable branches where oslo.* namespace is used, and new branches where oslo_* is expected): - https://review.openstack.org/157894 Also, neutron has a (test covered) hacking check at: http://git.openstack.org/cgit/openstack/neutron/tree/neutron/hacking/checks.py#n119 Feel free to adopt. I wish we, as a community, were less obsessed with creating so many hacking rules. These are really minor changes and it's going to be a relatively short-lived issue that could just be fixed once. If there's a regression, fixing *that* won't be hard or take long. That relatively short-lived issue already resulted in multiple backports to stable branches with new namespaces being used. F.e. see: https://bugs.launchpad.net/nova/+bug/1432685 There is no safe way to communicate the issue to all parties involved, so if automation is good at catching those issues, it should be applied. It's wrong to rely on people when a hacking check is enough. OK, that was a wrong example. Though we still had bugs before when a patch that used oslo_* namespace was backported to Juno (which is wrong). /Ihar -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1 iQEcBAEBAgAGBQJVCFgjAAoJEC5aWaUY1u57Hd4H/32X6Utp1aLm0KnF2HgW63ah DWk+PJj4Ku5TfZZ7IAXH/Rk6C4crCidfqEguwFuCkhlwQ+9bqsZ2INUjjGIfeY4B GJaG5lBIn8Pcvbtf3X2oU8ByE4/GTHNP91XRv2/mQ5+PnhFF57GW4b3qVBy/DQp8 7+CBUqKwxPVx0rgCcotRiGmJs6tjLtlm/8iFhkYzu9Xr5Ti1b+nAm7NP9HzK1279 sEbbv68zRdYhOAm06CAoy/WoEgftoFR6xSc9hhTkakf6t7zE5EMeMWdJATrILjsE pZjD39g8ye6ni3OiUUQtx8NosMJs+ORroNgeAn0WnFYW63kZoHvd2iJ/91CFNyg= =m5pk -END PGP SIGNATURE- __ OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions) Unsubscribe: openstack-dev-requ...@lists.openstack.org?subject:unsubscribe http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/openstack-dev
Re: [openstack-dev] Deprecation warnings considered harmful?
On Mar 15, 2015, at 7:35 AM, Duncan Thomas duncan.tho...@gmail.com wrote: On 13 March 2015 at 17:36, Doug Hellmann d...@doughellmann.com mailto:d...@doughellmann.com wrote: I wish we, as a community, were less obsessed with creating so many hacking rules. These are really minor changes and it's going to be a relatively short-lived issue that could just be fixed once. If there's a regression, fixing *that* won't be hard or take long. Ok, this comment has peaked my interest again, since I hold pretty much the exact opposite view and am a well known fan of hacking checks. My logic is: - Hacking checks point out the error for most submitters before review, saving reviewer time and CI cycles, and increasing the comfort level of the submitter (for most people, a -1 feels harsh/negative) - Hacking checks don't slip up and miss one because they are reviewing at 1am the night before the deadline - Regressions hurt, and not all of our code is covered by unit tests / CI - Debugging the output of a hacking check is many times faster than debugging a unit test, even for simple failures (and work is underway to may this even faster) - Hacking checks that are left around for migrations like this even a few cycles longer than they are needed have zero cost. As long as nobody type 'oslo.foo' then they never need even know of their existence. We can be really lazy about removing them with no harm at all. My comment was based on the observation that we have gone farther than I think is helpful with the checks, because we’ve started holding up other work until new checks can be implemented. That means we’re placing a higher priority on building our own tools than on building the thing we set out to build in the first place. When I updated tempest to use the graduated libraries instead of incubated code I did most of the work with a few calls to “sed -i”. I also didn’t have to wait for the hacking check to be implemented before I could start the cleanup/graduation work, which means now the work in tempest is *done* and I can move on to other work. Sometimes adding automation helps because of the need for an ongoing check, but in this case I don’t think it is warranted because of the nature of the change. If we successfully remove the namespace package next cycle and a regression is introduced before then, then broken imports just won’t work and the reason will be clearly stated in the error message Python gives. The problem is both easy to diagnose and easy to fix. We don’t need another check for that. Doug Am I missing something? I am a general proponent of 'write hacking checks for any mechanical code change'. We've seen definite benefits from this approach and few to no downsides that I'm aware of. __ OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions) Unsubscribe: openstack-dev-requ...@lists.openstack.org?subject:unsubscribe http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/openstack-dev __ OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions) Unsubscribe: openstack-dev-requ...@lists.openstack.org?subject:unsubscribe http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/openstack-dev
Re: [openstack-dev] Deprecation warnings considered harmful?
On 13 March 2015 at 17:36, Doug Hellmann d...@doughellmann.com wrote: I wish we, as a community, were less obsessed with creating so many hacking rules. These are really minor changes and it's going to be a relatively short-lived issue that could just be fixed once. If there's a regression, fixing *that* won't be hard or take long. Ok, this comment has peaked my interest again, since I hold pretty much the exact opposite view and am a well known fan of hacking checks. My logic is: - Hacking checks point out the error for most submitters before review, saving reviewer time and CI cycles, and increasing the comfort level of the submitter (for most people, a -1 feels harsh/negative) - Hacking checks don't slip up and miss one because they are reviewing at 1am the night before the deadline - Regressions hurt, and not all of our code is covered by unit tests / CI - Debugging the output of a hacking check is many times faster than debugging a unit test, even for simple failures (and work is underway to may this even faster) - Hacking checks that are left around for migrations like this even a few cycles longer than they are needed have zero cost. As long as nobody type 'oslo.foo' then they never need even know of their existence. We can be really lazy about removing them with no harm at all. Am I missing something? I am a general proponent of 'write hacking checks for any mechanical code change'. We've seen definite benefits from this approach and few to no downsides that I'm aware of. __ OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions) Unsubscribe: openstack-dev-requ...@lists.openstack.org?subject:unsubscribe http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/openstack-dev
Re: [openstack-dev] Deprecation warnings considered harmful?
+2. I think the having checks are helpful. If they aren't removed it does Leelee harm. Jay On Mar 15, 2015 6:39 AM, Duncan Thomas duncan.tho...@gmail.com wrote: On 13 March 2015 at 17:36, Doug Hellmann d...@doughellmann.com wrote: I wish we, as a community, were less obsessed with creating so many hacking rules. These are really minor changes and it's going to be a relatively short-lived issue that could just be fixed once. If there's a regression, fixing *that* won't be hard or take long. Ok, this comment has peaked my interest again, since I hold pretty much the exact opposite view and am a well known fan of hacking checks. My logic is: - Hacking checks point out the error for most submitters before review, saving reviewer time and CI cycles, and increasing the comfort level of the submitter (for most people, a -1 feels harsh/negative) - Hacking checks don't slip up and miss one because they are reviewing at 1am the night before the deadline - Regressions hurt, and not all of our code is covered by unit tests / CI - Debugging the output of a hacking check is many times faster than debugging a unit test, even for simple failures (and work is underway to may this even faster) - Hacking checks that are left around for migrations like this even a few cycles longer than they are needed have zero cost. As long as nobody type 'oslo.foo' then they never need even know of their existence. We can be really lazy about removing them with no harm at all. Am I missing something? I am a general proponent of 'write hacking checks for any mechanical code change'. We've seen definite benefits from this approach and few to no downsides that I'm aware of. __ OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions) Unsubscribe: openstack-dev-requ...@lists.openstack.org?subject:unsubscribe http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/openstack-dev __ OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions) Unsubscribe: openstack-dev-requ...@lists.openstack.org?subject:unsubscribe http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/openstack-dev
Re: [openstack-dev] Deprecation warnings considered harmful?
On 13 March 2015 at 02:37, Nikhil Manchanda nik...@manchanda.me wrote: - We wanted to ensure that we had a corresponding hacking rule in place to prevent future patch-sets from using the deprecated module names. There's one in cinder that Jay wrote, please do feel free to copy (and point out any flaws with it; I'm not aware of any) __ OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions) Unsubscribe: openstack-dev-requ...@lists.openstack.org?subject:unsubscribe http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/openstack-dev
Re: [openstack-dev] Deprecation warnings considered harmful?
On 12 March 2015 at 18:48, Doug Hellmann d...@doughellmann.com wrote: On Thu, Mar 12, 2015, at 05:24 AM, Duncan Thomas wrote: Yay, the system is working as designed! Good to hear What are normal, none developer users supposed to do with such warnings, other than: a) panic or b) Assume openstack is beta quality and then panic Next time, please try to be less snide. It makes it difficult to take you seriously. Fair point, I apologise, it was the end of a long day. I was aiming for humorous rather than snide, and clearly missed by a significant amount. __ OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions) Unsubscribe: openstack-dev-requ...@lists.openstack.org?subject:unsubscribe http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/openstack-dev
Re: [openstack-dev] Deprecation warnings considered harmful?
Doug Hellmann wrote: Yay, the system is working as designed! Oslo froze early to prepare releases to integrate with the downstream projects. You found an issue and reported it. Dims and others worked on patches, and we're releasing new versions. All before your feature freeze, so you can adopt them. Also that would likely be considered a bug fix, so I'd say this could also be fixed after Feature Freeze (before RC1). -- Thierry Carrez (ttx) __ OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions) Unsubscribe: openstack-dev-requ...@lists.openstack.org?subject:unsubscribe http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/openstack-dev
Re: [openstack-dev] Deprecation warnings considered harmful?
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On 03/13/2015 01:37 AM, Nikhil Manchanda wrote: Looking back at the meeting eavesdrop, the primary reasons why we deferred this work to Liberty was twofold: - It wasn't a set plan based on information available to us at the time. This being the case, we decided to wait until we had more information regarding the requirements around this from oslo. - We wanted to ensure that we had a corresponding hacking rule in place to prevent future patch-sets from using the deprecated module names. For hacking check, I have a patch in review for 'hacking' repo to add checks (both for stable branches where oslo.* namespace is used, and new branches where oslo_* is expected): - - https://review.openstack.org/157894 Also, neutron has a (test covered) hacking check at: http://git.openstack.org/cgit/openstack/neutron/tree/neutron/hacking/checks.py#n119 Feel free to adopt. We specifically didn't consider the impact of logging statements with deprecation warnings at the meeting. We now have a better picture of the actual status -- with the oslo decision that these namespace packages are definitely going away. I've added an agenda item to bring this up again at the next Trove weekly meeting [1] so that we can address this. [1] https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/TroveMeeting Thanks, Nikhil On Thu, Mar 12, 2015 at 4:05 PM, Robert Collins robe...@robertcollins.net mailto:robe...@robertcollins.net wrote: On 13 March 2015 at 09:43, Ihar Hrachyshka ihrac...@redhat.com mailto:ihrac...@redhat.com wrote: -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On 03/12/2015 09:35 PM, Robert Collins wrote: On 13 March 2015 at 08:09, Ihar Hrachyshka ihrac...@redhat.com mailto:ihrac...@redhat.com wrote: -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On 03/12/2015 11:38 AM, Boris Bobrov wrote: On Thursday 12 March 2015 12:59:10 Duncan Thomas wrote: So, assuming that all of the oslo depreciations aren't going to be fixed before release What makes you think that? In my opinion it's just one component's problem. These particular deprecation warnings are a result of still on-going migration from oslo.package to oslo_package. Ironically, all components except oslo have already moved to the new naming scheme. It's actually wrong. For example, Trove decided to stay on using the old namespace for Kilo. Why? -Rob http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/irclogs/%23openstack-meeting-alt/%23openstack-meeting-alt.2015-02-11.log starting from 2015-02-11T18:03:11. I guess the assumption was that there is immediate benefit, and they can just wait. Though I don't think the fact that it means deprecation warnings in their logs was appreciated at the time of decision. Thanks, reading that it looks like the actual status (oslo decided most definitely that namespace packages are going away, its just a matter of when) wasn't understood in that meeting. Is it possible to put it back on the agenda for the next Trove meeting? Cheers, Rob -- Robert Collins rbtcoll...@hp.com mailto:rbtcoll...@hp.com Distinguished Technologist HP Converged Cloud __ OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions) Unsubscribe: openstack-dev-requ...@lists.openstack.org?subject:unsubscribe http://openstack-dev-requ...@lists.openstack.org?subject:unsubscribe http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/openstack-dev __ OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions) Unsubscribe: openstack-dev-requ...@lists.openstack.org?subject:unsubscribe http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/openstack-dev -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1 iQEcBAEBAgAGBQJVAskYAAoJEC5aWaUY1u57xD0H/13+RPI3IKDu//5FSKoENIwb 26cVv00Kd3KIAXWPVSFCzTgNjuRzhHtG0PHc4T18unbtS47zSOZGVE8J0dLlXhQV AV9Q3p/qXbjPvGMuUCYDIDI8XGErMXkbZbKRsoEQKKrp2aXupiDJ7u0UoxKNlKOs cwIVPYDX7cmRebdb25nYhs3X0L/oHyem6sHtWQCcElLpmIeYoTD/VdAoCy7hQhZc s9t5f6xJev0N7/134qh1OhVDTP0UKhgR7N2r8TLUwNN9B1k6RcHxU0Fem6cbE5kZ WytbX78LOWY6PDaJ00vfdtgQo+FVvLOfzP2O6BArF8MSQT9kp2QH/GD2EyZ6i7M= =RXO/ -END PGP SIGNATURE- __ OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions) Unsubscribe: openstack-dev-requ...@lists.openstack.org?subject:unsubscribe http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/openstack-dev
Re: [openstack-dev] Deprecation warnings considered harmful?
On Fri, Mar 13, 2015, at 07:05 AM, Thierry Carrez wrote: Doug Hellmann wrote: Yay, the system is working as designed! Oslo froze early to prepare releases to integrate with the downstream projects. You found an issue and reported it. Dims and others worked on patches, and we're releasing new versions. All before your feature freeze, so you can adopt them. Also that would likely be considered a bug fix, so I'd say this could also be fixed after Feature Freeze (before RC1). Sure, I was just pointing out Dims' quick turn-around time on the fixes. Doug -- Thierry Carrez (ttx) __ OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions) Unsubscribe: openstack-dev-requ...@lists.openstack.org?subject:unsubscribe http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/openstack-dev __ OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions) Unsubscribe: openstack-dev-requ...@lists.openstack.org?subject:unsubscribe http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/openstack-dev
Re: [openstack-dev] Deprecation warnings considered harmful?
On Fri, Mar 13, 2015, at 06:52 AM, Duncan Thomas wrote: On 12 March 2015 at 18:48, Doug Hellmann d...@doughellmann.com wrote: On Thu, Mar 12, 2015, at 05:24 AM, Duncan Thomas wrote: Yay, the system is working as designed! Good to hear What are normal, none developer users supposed to do with such warnings, other than: a) panic or b) Assume openstack is beta quality and then panic Next time, please try to be less snide. It makes it difficult to take you seriously. Fair point, I apologise, it was the end of a long day. I was aiming for humorous rather than snide, and clearly missed by a significant amount. Thank you. I definitely know the effects of long days. :-) Doug __ OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions) Unsubscribe: openstack-dev-requ...@lists.openstack.org?subject:unsubscribe http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/openstack-dev __ OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions) Unsubscribe: openstack-dev-requ...@lists.openstack.org?subject:unsubscribe http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/openstack-dev
Re: [openstack-dev] Deprecation warnings considered harmful?
On Fri, Mar 13, 2015, at 07:25 AM, Ihar Hrachyshka wrote: -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On 03/13/2015 01:37 AM, Nikhil Manchanda wrote: Looking back at the meeting eavesdrop, the primary reasons why we deferred this work to Liberty was twofold: - It wasn't a set plan based on information available to us at the time. This being the case, we decided to wait until we had more information regarding the requirements around this from oslo. - We wanted to ensure that we had a corresponding hacking rule in place to prevent future patch-sets from using the deprecated module names. For hacking check, I have a patch in review for 'hacking' repo to add checks (both for stable branches where oslo.* namespace is used, and new branches where oslo_* is expected): - - https://review.openstack.org/157894 Also, neutron has a (test covered) hacking check at: http://git.openstack.org/cgit/openstack/neutron/tree/neutron/hacking/checks.py#n119 Feel free to adopt. I wish we, as a community, were less obsessed with creating so many hacking rules. These are really minor changes and it's going to be a relatively short-lived issue that could just be fixed once. If there's a regression, fixing *that* won't be hard or take long. As I said in the IRC snippet pasted into the meeting log linked elsewhere in the thread, I want to drop the oslo package during the next cycle. It's not clear that all projects will be ready for us to do that, and that's why it's not a definite plan, yet. We're trying to be cognizant of the fact that you all have other things you're trying to accomplish too, and that this work appears like code churn even though it is solving a problem many developers have had in their development environments. In any case, you should plan for all Oslo libraries to drop the namespace packages entirely *soon*. If not for Liberty then definitely for M. There's no sense at all in delaying the work needed in your projects beyond L-1, and landing the changes sooner is better than waiting. Doug We specifically didn't consider the impact of logging statements with deprecation warnings at the meeting. We now have a better picture of the actual status -- with the oslo decision that these namespace packages are definitely going away. I've added an agenda item to bring this up again at the next Trove weekly meeting [1] so that we can address this. [1] https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/TroveMeeting Thanks, Nikhil On Thu, Mar 12, 2015 at 4:05 PM, Robert Collins robe...@robertcollins.net mailto:robe...@robertcollins.net wrote: On 13 March 2015 at 09:43, Ihar Hrachyshka ihrac...@redhat.com mailto:ihrac...@redhat.com wrote: -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On 03/12/2015 09:35 PM, Robert Collins wrote: On 13 March 2015 at 08:09, Ihar Hrachyshka ihrac...@redhat.com mailto:ihrac...@redhat.com wrote: -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On 03/12/2015 11:38 AM, Boris Bobrov wrote: On Thursday 12 March 2015 12:59:10 Duncan Thomas wrote: So, assuming that all of the oslo depreciations aren't going to be fixed before release What makes you think that? In my opinion it's just one component's problem. These particular deprecation warnings are a result of still on-going migration from oslo.package to oslo_package. Ironically, all components except oslo have already moved to the new naming scheme. It's actually wrong. For example, Trove decided to stay on using the old namespace for Kilo. Why? -Rob http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/irclogs/%23openstack-meeting-alt/%23openstack-meeting-alt.2015-02-11.log starting from 2015-02-11T18:03:11. I guess the assumption was that there is immediate benefit, and they can just wait. Though I don't think the fact that it means deprecation warnings in their logs was appreciated at the time of decision. Thanks, reading that it looks like the actual status (oslo decided most definitely that namespace packages are going away, its just a matter of when) wasn't understood in that meeting. Is it possible to put it back on the agenda for the next Trove meeting? Cheers, Rob -- Robert Collins rbtcoll...@hp.com mailto:rbtcoll...@hp.com Distinguished Technologist HP Converged Cloud __ OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions) Unsubscribe: openstack-dev-requ...@lists.openstack.org?subject:unsubscribe http://openstack-dev-requ...@lists.openstack.org?subject:unsubscribe http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/openstack-dev __ OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions) Unsubscribe:
Re: [openstack-dev] Deprecation warnings considered harmful?
On Thursday 12 March 2015 12:24:57 Duncan Thomas wrote: ubuntu@devstack-multiattach:~/devstack$ cinder-manage db sync /usr/local/lib/python2.7/dist-packages/oslo_db/_i18n.py:19: DeprecationWarning: The oslo namespace package is deprecated. Please use oslo_i18n instead. from oslo import i18n /opt/stack/cinder/cinder/openstack/common/policy.py:98: DeprecationWarning: The oslo namespace package is deprecated. Please use oslo_config instead. from oslo.config import cfg /opt/stack/cinder/cinder/openstack/common/policy.py:99: DeprecationWarning: The oslo namespace package is deprecated. Please use oslo_serialization instead. from oslo.serialization import jsonutils /opt/stack/cinder/cinder/objects/base.py:25: DeprecationWarning: The oslo namespace package is deprecated. Please use oslo_messaging instead. from oslo import messaging /usr/local/lib/python2.7/dist-packages/oslo_concurrency/openstack/common/fi leutils.py:22: DeprecationWarning: The oslo namespace package is deprecated. Please use oslo_utils instead. from oslo.utils import excutils What are normal, none developer users supposed to do with such warnings, other than: a) panic or b) Assume openstack is beta quality and then panic Non developer users are supposed to file a bug, leave installation and usage to professional devops who know how to handle logs or and stop using non- stable branch. -- С наилучшими пожеланиями, Boris __ OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions) Unsubscribe: openstack-dev-requ...@lists.openstack.org?subject:unsubscribe http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/openstack-dev
Re: [openstack-dev] Deprecation warnings considered harmful?
On Thu, Mar 12, 2015 at 3:41 AM, Boris Bobrov bbob...@mirantis.com wrote: On Thursday 12 March 2015 12:24:57 Duncan Thomas wrote: ubuntu@devstack-multiattach:~/devstack$ cinder-manage db sync /usr/local/lib/python2.7/dist-packages/oslo_db/_i18n.py:19: DeprecationWarning: The oslo namespace package is deprecated. Please use oslo_i18n instead. from oslo import i18n /opt/stack/cinder/cinder/openstack/common/policy.py:98: DeprecationWarning: The oslo namespace package is deprecated. Please use oslo_config instead. from oslo.config import cfg /opt/stack/cinder/cinder/openstack/common/policy.py:99: DeprecationWarning: The oslo namespace package is deprecated. Please use oslo_serialization instead. from oslo.serialization import jsonutils /opt/stack/cinder/cinder/objects/base.py:25: DeprecationWarning: The oslo namespace package is deprecated. Please use oslo_messaging instead. from oslo import messaging /usr/local/lib/python2.7/dist-packages/oslo_concurrency/openstack/common/fi leutils.py:22: DeprecationWarning: The oslo namespace package is deprecated. Please use oslo_utils instead. from oslo.utils import excutils What are normal, none developer users supposed to do with such warnings, other than: a) panic or b) Assume openstack is beta quality and then panic Non developer users are supposed to file a bug, leave installation and usage to professional devops who know how to handle logs or and stop using non- stable branch. I think the problem is that in some cases (particularly those being emitted from oslo libs) this doesn't really make sense for anybody outside of project dev team. In other words, packaged and released but the message is there; there's nothing the Operator or anybody at that point is going to do about it. This may or may not have anything to do with stable branch. I think it's a valid point that some messages like the one pointed out by Duncan are perhaps not really great to have in the release code. Whether it could/should be tied to something like the existing debug or verbose flags in the conf files, or even a new item like dev level logging? Maybe not a terribly big deal, but I can see the point being made with respect to the impression it gives etc. -- С наилучшими пожеланиями, Boris __ OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions) Unsubscribe: openstack-dev-requ...@lists.openstack.org?subject:unsubscribe http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/openstack-dev __ OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions) Unsubscribe: openstack-dev-requ...@lists.openstack.org?subject:unsubscribe http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/openstack-dev
Re: [openstack-dev] Deprecation warnings considered harmful?
So, assuming that all of the oslo depreciations aren't going to be fixed before release, we want every user out there to file a bug, for something we know about at release time? This seems to be a very broken model... On 12 March 2015 at 11:41, Boris Bobrov bbob...@mirantis.com wrote: On Thursday 12 March 2015 12:24:57 Duncan Thomas wrote: ubuntu@devstack-multiattach:~/devstack$ cinder-manage db sync /usr/local/lib/python2.7/dist-packages/oslo_db/_i18n.py:19: DeprecationWarning: The oslo namespace package is deprecated. Please use oslo_i18n instead. from oslo import i18n /opt/stack/cinder/cinder/openstack/common/policy.py:98: DeprecationWarning: The oslo namespace package is deprecated. Please use oslo_config instead. from oslo.config import cfg /opt/stack/cinder/cinder/openstack/common/policy.py:99: DeprecationWarning: The oslo namespace package is deprecated. Please use oslo_serialization instead. from oslo.serialization import jsonutils /opt/stack/cinder/cinder/objects/base.py:25: DeprecationWarning: The oslo namespace package is deprecated. Please use oslo_messaging instead. from oslo import messaging /usr/local/lib/python2.7/dist-packages/oslo_concurrency/openstack/common/fi leutils.py:22: DeprecationWarning: The oslo namespace package is deprecated. Please use oslo_utils instead. from oslo.utils import excutils What are normal, none developer users supposed to do with such warnings, other than: a) panic or b) Assume openstack is beta quality and then panic Non developer users are supposed to file a bug, leave installation and usage to professional devops who know how to handle logs or and stop using non- stable branch. -- С наилучшими пожеланиями, Boris __ OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions) Unsubscribe: openstack-dev-requ...@lists.openstack.org?subject:unsubscribe http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/openstack-dev -- Duncan Thomas __ OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions) Unsubscribe: openstack-dev-requ...@lists.openstack.org?subject:unsubscribe http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/openstack-dev
Re: [openstack-dev] Deprecation warnings considered harmful?
On Thursday 12 March 2015 12:59:10 Duncan Thomas wrote: So, assuming that all of the oslo depreciations aren't going to be fixed before release What makes you think that? In my opinion it's just one component's problem. These particular deprecation warnings are a result of still on-going migration from oslo.package to oslo_package. Ironically, all components except oslo have already moved to the new naming scheme. I think that these warnings are just a single, not systemic problem. for something we know about at release time? For bugs we know about at release time we have bugreports. Filing a bug is pretty easy ;) https://bugs.launchpad.net/oslo.db/+bug/1431268 On 12 March 2015 at 11:41, Boris Bobrov bbob...@mirantis.com wrote: On Thursday 12 March 2015 12:24:57 Duncan Thomas wrote: ubuntu@devstack-multiattach:~/devstack$ cinder-manage db sync /usr/local/lib/python2.7/dist-packages/oslo_db/_i18n.py:19: DeprecationWarning: The oslo namespace package is deprecated. Please use oslo_i18n instead. from oslo import i18n /opt/stack/cinder/cinder/openstack/common/policy.py:98: DeprecationWarning: The oslo namespace package is deprecated. Please use oslo_config instead. from oslo.config import cfg /opt/stack/cinder/cinder/openstack/common/policy.py:99: DeprecationWarning: The oslo namespace package is deprecated. Please use oslo_serialization instead. from oslo.serialization import jsonutils /opt/stack/cinder/cinder/objects/base.py:25: DeprecationWarning: The oslo namespace package is deprecated. Please use oslo_messaging instead. from oslo import messaging /usr/local/lib/python2.7/dist-packages/oslo_concurrency/openstack/common/ fi leutils.py:22: DeprecationWarning: The oslo namespace package is deprecated. Please use oslo_utils instead. from oslo.utils import excutils What are normal, none developer users supposed to do with such warnings, other than: a) panic or b) Assume openstack is beta quality and then panic Non developer users are supposed to file a bug, leave installation and usage to professional devops who know how to handle logs or and stop using non- stable branch. -- С наилучшими пожеланиями, Boris _ _ OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions) Unsubscribe: openstack-dev-requ...@lists.openstack.org?subject:unsubscribe http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/openstack-dev -- С наилучшими пожеланиями, Boris __ OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions) Unsubscribe: openstack-dev-requ...@lists.openstack.org?subject:unsubscribe http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/openstack-dev
Re: [openstack-dev] Deprecation warnings considered harmful?
On Thu, Mar 12, 2015 at 10:48 AM, Doug Hellmann d...@doughellmann.com wrote: On Thu, Mar 12, 2015, at 05:24 AM, Duncan Thomas wrote: ubuntu@devstack-multiattach:~/devstack$ cinder-manage db sync /usr/local/lib/python2.7/dist-packages/oslo_db/_i18n.py:19: DeprecationWarning: The oslo namespace package is deprecated. Please use oslo_i18n instead. from oslo import i18n /opt/stack/cinder/cinder/openstack/common/policy.py:98: DeprecationWarning: The oslo namespace package is deprecated. Please use oslo_config instead. from oslo.config import cfg /opt/stack/cinder/cinder/openstack/common/policy.py:99: DeprecationWarning: The oslo namespace package is deprecated. Please use oslo_serialization instead. from oslo.serialization import jsonutils /opt/stack/cinder/cinder/objects/base.py:25: DeprecationWarning: The oslo namespace package is deprecated. Please use oslo_messaging instead. from oslo import messaging /usr/local/lib/python2.7/dist-packages/oslo_concurrency/openstack/common/fileutils.py:22: DeprecationWarning: The oslo namespace package is deprecated. Please use oslo_utils instead. from oslo.utils import excutils Yay, the system is working as designed! Oslo froze early to prepare releases to integrate with the downstream projects. You found an issue and reported it. Dims and others worked on patches, and we're releasing new versions. All before your feature freeze, so you can adopt them. What are normal, none developer users supposed to do with such warnings, other than: a) panic or b) Assume openstack is beta quality and then panic Next time, please try to be less snide. It makes it difficult to take you seriously. Doug -- Duncan Thomas __ OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions) Unsubscribe: openstack-dev-requ...@lists.openstack.org?subject:unsubscribe http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/openstack-dev __ OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions) Unsubscribe: openstack-dev-requ...@lists.openstack.org?subject:unsubscribe http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/openstack-dev Very cool!! I think there may have been some misunderstanding here on how this would all shake out, but yes as Doug and Dims pointed out this worked great. Thanks everyone!! __ OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions) Unsubscribe: openstack-dev-requ...@lists.openstack.org?subject:unsubscribe http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/openstack-dev
Re: [openstack-dev] Deprecation warnings considered harmful?
On Thu, Mar 12, 2015, at 05:24 AM, Duncan Thomas wrote: ubuntu@devstack-multiattach:~/devstack$ cinder-manage db sync /usr/local/lib/python2.7/dist-packages/oslo_db/_i18n.py:19: DeprecationWarning: The oslo namespace package is deprecated. Please use oslo_i18n instead. from oslo import i18n /opt/stack/cinder/cinder/openstack/common/policy.py:98: DeprecationWarning: The oslo namespace package is deprecated. Please use oslo_config instead. from oslo.config import cfg /opt/stack/cinder/cinder/openstack/common/policy.py:99: DeprecationWarning: The oslo namespace package is deprecated. Please use oslo_serialization instead. from oslo.serialization import jsonutils /opt/stack/cinder/cinder/objects/base.py:25: DeprecationWarning: The oslo namespace package is deprecated. Please use oslo_messaging instead. from oslo import messaging /usr/local/lib/python2.7/dist-packages/oslo_concurrency/openstack/common/fileutils.py:22: DeprecationWarning: The oslo namespace package is deprecated. Please use oslo_utils instead. from oslo.utils import excutils Yay, the system is working as designed! Oslo froze early to prepare releases to integrate with the downstream projects. You found an issue and reported it. Dims and others worked on patches, and we're releasing new versions. All before your feature freeze, so you can adopt them. What are normal, none developer users supposed to do with such warnings, other than: a) panic or b) Assume openstack is beta quality and then panic Next time, please try to be less snide. It makes it difficult to take you seriously. Doug -- Duncan Thomas __ OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions) Unsubscribe: openstack-dev-requ...@lists.openstack.org?subject:unsubscribe http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/openstack-dev __ OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions) Unsubscribe: openstack-dev-requ...@lists.openstack.org?subject:unsubscribe http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/openstack-dev
Re: [openstack-dev] Deprecation warnings considered harmful?
Also note that the following is supposed to be true (or should be?): From: https://docs.python.org/2/library/warnings.html#warning-categories DeprecationWarning: Base category for warnings about deprecated features (ignored by default). Changed in version 2.7: DeprecationWarning is ignored by default. So by default these should be off/ignored: Now projects can change that as they wish (and maybe we should have it be set to 'once' during development, and 'ignore' at release?), where these levels are at: https://docs.python.org/2/library/warnings.html#the-warnings-filter I believe I put the 'once' into cinder code: https://github.com/openstack/cinder/blob/master/cinder/cmd/all.py#L34 But feel free to change it (this seems like it should be something consistent across projects)... -Josh John Griffith wrote: On Thu, Mar 12, 2015 at 10:48 AM, Doug Hellmann d...@doughellmann.com mailto:d...@doughellmann.com wrote: On Thu, Mar 12, 2015, at 05:24 AM, Duncan Thomas wrote: ubuntu@devstack-multiattach:~/devstack$ cinder-manage db sync /usr/local/lib/python2.7/dist-packages/oslo_db/_i18n.py:19: DeprecationWarning: The oslo namespace package is deprecated. Please use oslo_i18n instead. from oslo import i18n /opt/stack/cinder/cinder/openstack/common/policy.py:98: DeprecationWarning: The oslo namespace package is deprecated. Please use oslo_config instead. from oslo.config import cfg /opt/stack/cinder/cinder/openstack/common/policy.py:99: DeprecationWarning: The oslo namespace package is deprecated. Please use oslo_serialization instead. from oslo.serialization import jsonutils /opt/stack/cinder/cinder/objects/base.py:25: DeprecationWarning: The oslo namespace package is deprecated. Please use oslo_messaging instead. from oslo import messaging /usr/local/lib/python2.7/dist-packages/oslo_concurrency/openstack/common/fileutils.py:22: DeprecationWarning: The oslo namespace package is deprecated. Please use oslo_utils instead. from oslo.utils import excutils Yay, the system is working as designed! Oslo froze early to prepare releases to integrate with the downstream projects. You found an issue and reported it. Dims and others worked on patches, and we're releasing new versions. All before your feature freeze, so you can adopt them. What are normal, none developer users supposed to do with such warnings, other than: a) panic or b) Assume openstack is beta quality and then panic Next time, please try to be less snide. It makes it difficult to take you seriously. Doug -- Duncan Thomas __ OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions) Unsubscribe: openstack-dev-requ...@lists.openstack.org?subject:unsubscribe http://openstack-dev-requ...@lists.openstack.org?subject:unsubscribe http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/openstack-dev __ OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions) Unsubscribe: openstack-dev-requ...@lists.openstack.org?subject:unsubscribe http://openstack-dev-requ...@lists.openstack.org?subject:unsubscribe http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/openstack-dev Very cool!! I think there may have been some misunderstanding here on how this would all shake out, but yes as Doug and Dims pointed out this worked great. Thanks everyone!! __ OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions) Unsubscribe: openstack-dev-requ...@lists.openstack.org?subject:unsubscribe http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/openstack-dev __ OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions) Unsubscribe: openstack-dev-requ...@lists.openstack.org?subject:unsubscribe http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/openstack-dev
Re: [openstack-dev] Deprecation warnings considered harmful?
On 13 March 2015 at 08:09, Ihar Hrachyshka ihrac...@redhat.com wrote: -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On 03/12/2015 11:38 AM, Boris Bobrov wrote: On Thursday 12 March 2015 12:59:10 Duncan Thomas wrote: So, assuming that all of the oslo depreciations aren't going to be fixed before release What makes you think that? In my opinion it's just one component's problem. These particular deprecation warnings are a result of still on-going migration from oslo.package to oslo_package. Ironically, all components except oslo have already moved to the new naming scheme. It's actually wrong. For example, Trove decided to stay on using the old namespace for Kilo. Why? -Rob -- Robert Collins rbtcoll...@hp.com Distinguished Technologist HP Converged Cloud __ OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions) Unsubscribe: openstack-dev-requ...@lists.openstack.org?subject:unsubscribe http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/openstack-dev
Re: [openstack-dev] Deprecation warnings considered harmful?
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On 03/12/2015 09:35 PM, Robert Collins wrote: On 13 March 2015 at 08:09, Ihar Hrachyshka ihrac...@redhat.com wrote: -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On 03/12/2015 11:38 AM, Boris Bobrov wrote: On Thursday 12 March 2015 12:59:10 Duncan Thomas wrote: So, assuming that all of the oslo depreciations aren't going to be fixed before release What makes you think that? In my opinion it's just one component's problem. These particular deprecation warnings are a result of still on-going migration from oslo.package to oslo_package. Ironically, all components except oslo have already moved to the new naming scheme. It's actually wrong. For example, Trove decided to stay on using the old namespace for Kilo. Why? -Rob http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/irclogs/%23openstack-meeting-alt/%23openstack-meeting-alt.2015-02-11.log starting from 2015-02-11T18:03:11. I guess the assumption was that there is immediate benefit, and they can just wait. Though I don't think the fact that it means deprecation warnings in their logs was appreciated at the time of decision. /Ihar -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1 iQEcBAEBAgAGBQJVAfplAAoJEC5aWaUY1u579TgIAMfCaH3SEHNXg5D0gHSyA6xd ScQEcD9L7pL7C70ZW8ZVH4sneVEoFZAxu1hGx8Vzi3YoPXrnoQbtjWgpiscIwHC9 wrj4b1kjDmnI0z5fu+S0doq8Rzp0VarIRe4gIpzqfkZilmsPgKD8My3Fewf9ee5N Or5ulSvP5URut+9fSClUmk0jjHUgHsRz4n0dBvhKrpbBAM/kEIlvQ9hcbg+jYgM7 JOKwTJRRMq7boqPpMAq+OhYXenZ9gDTvSJAovGveUw6G4i6wdz/99M595mnQ7bIJ /Fj0iizZU0jo8NW/6dr6+aUgKHPw8MMpqt/DcinTp+0oYSHhU8Yvb/vo5DvFL28= =Oqbc -END PGP SIGNATURE- __ OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions) Unsubscribe: openstack-dev-requ...@lists.openstack.org?subject:unsubscribe http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/openstack-dev
Re: [openstack-dev] Deprecation warnings considered harmful?
Duncan, If you see any of these coming out of Cinder (not oslo) please get a bug to me. I think I have them all removed but need to know if I have missed anything. Thanks! Jay On 03/12/2015 04:24 AM, Duncan Thomas wrote: ubuntu@devstack-multiattach:~/devstack$ cinder-manage db sync /usr/local/lib/python2.7/dist-packages/oslo_db/_i18n.py:19: DeprecationWarning: The oslo namespace package is deprecated. Please use oslo_i18n instead. from oslo import i18n /opt/stack/cinder/cinder/openstack/common/policy.py:98: DeprecationWarning: The oslo namespace package is deprecated. Please use oslo_config instead. from oslo.config import cfg /opt/stack/cinder/cinder/openstack/common/policy.py:99: DeprecationWarning: The oslo namespace package is deprecated. Please use oslo_serialization instead. from oslo.serialization import jsonutils /opt/stack/cinder/cinder/objects/base.py:25: DeprecationWarning: The oslo namespace package is deprecated. Please use oslo_messaging instead. from oslo import messaging /usr/local/lib/python2.7/dist-packages/oslo_concurrency/openstack/common/fileutils.py:22: DeprecationWarning: The oslo namespace package is deprecated. Please use oslo_utils instead. from oslo.utils import excutils What are normal, none developer users supposed to do with such warnings, other than: a) panic or b) Assume openstack is beta quality and then panic -- Duncan Thomas __ OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions) Unsubscribe: openstack-dev-requ...@lists.openstack.org?subject:unsubscribe http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/openstack-dev __ OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions) Unsubscribe: openstack-dev-requ...@lists.openstack.org?subject:unsubscribe http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/openstack-dev
Re: [openstack-dev] Deprecation warnings considered harmful?
On Thu, Mar 12, 2015, at 01:13 PM, John Griffith wrote: On Thu, Mar 12, 2015 at 10:48 AM, Doug Hellmann d...@doughellmann.com wrote: On Thu, Mar 12, 2015, at 05:24 AM, Duncan Thomas wrote: ubuntu@devstack-multiattach:~/devstack$ cinder-manage db sync /usr/local/lib/python2.7/dist-packages/oslo_db/_i18n.py:19: DeprecationWarning: The oslo namespace package is deprecated. Please use oslo_i18n instead. from oslo import i18n /opt/stack/cinder/cinder/openstack/common/policy.py:98: DeprecationWarning: The oslo namespace package is deprecated. Please use oslo_config instead. from oslo.config import cfg /opt/stack/cinder/cinder/openstack/common/policy.py:99: DeprecationWarning: The oslo namespace package is deprecated. Please use oslo_serialization instead. from oslo.serialization import jsonutils /opt/stack/cinder/cinder/objects/base.py:25: DeprecationWarning: The oslo namespace package is deprecated. Please use oslo_messaging instead. from oslo import messaging /usr/local/lib/python2.7/dist-packages/oslo_concurrency/openstack/common/fileutils.py:22: DeprecationWarning: The oslo namespace package is deprecated. Please use oslo_utils instead. from oslo.utils import excutils Yay, the system is working as designed! Oslo froze early to prepare releases to integrate with the downstream projects. You found an issue and reported it. Dims and others worked on patches, and we're releasing new versions. All before your feature freeze, so you can adopt them. What are normal, none developer users supposed to do with such warnings, other than: a) panic or b) Assume openstack is beta quality and then panic Next time, please try to be less snide. It makes it difficult to take you seriously. Doug -- Duncan Thomas __ OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions) Unsubscribe: openstack-dev-requ...@lists.openstack.org?subject:unsubscribe http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/openstack-dev __ OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions) Unsubscribe: openstack-dev-requ...@lists.openstack.org?subject:unsubscribe http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/openstack-dev Very cool!! I think there may have been some misunderstanding here on how this would all shake out, but yes as Doug and Dims pointed out this worked great. Thanks everyone!! Yep, I realize not everyone remembers the way we did it for Juno, but this is standard operating procedure for Oslo now. Doug __ OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions) Unsubscribe: openstack-dev-requ...@lists.openstack.org?subject:unsubscribe http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/openstack-dev __ OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions) Unsubscribe: openstack-dev-requ...@lists.openstack.org?subject:unsubscribe http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/openstack-dev
Re: [openstack-dev] Deprecation warnings considered harmful?
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On 03/12/2015 11:38 AM, Boris Bobrov wrote: On Thursday 12 March 2015 12:59:10 Duncan Thomas wrote: So, assuming that all of the oslo depreciations aren't going to be fixed before release What makes you think that? In my opinion it's just one component's problem. These particular deprecation warnings are a result of still on-going migration from oslo.package to oslo_package. Ironically, all components except oslo have already moved to the new naming scheme. It's actually wrong. For example, Trove decided to stay on using the old namespace for Kilo. I think that these warnings are just a single, not systemic problem. for something we know about at release time? For bugs we know about at release time we have bugreports. Filing a bug is pretty easy ;) https://bugs.launchpad.net/oslo.db/+bug/1431268 On 12 March 2015 at 11:41, Boris Bobrov bbob...@mirantis.com wrote: On Thursday 12 March 2015 12:24:57 Duncan Thomas wrote: ubuntu@devstack-multiattach:~/devstack$ cinder-manage db sync /usr/local/lib/python2.7/dist-packages/oslo_db/_i18n.py:19: DeprecationWarning: The oslo namespace package is deprecated. Please use oslo_i18n instead. from oslo import i18n /opt/stack/cinder/cinder/openstack/common/policy.py:98: DeprecationWarning: The oslo namespace package is deprecated. Please use oslo_config instead. from oslo.config import cfg /opt/stack/cinder/cinder/openstack/common/policy.py:99: DeprecationWarning: The oslo namespace package is deprecated. Please use oslo_serialization instead. from oslo.serialization import jsonutils /opt/stack/cinder/cinder/objects/base.py:25: DeprecationWarning: The oslo namespace package is deprecated. Please use oslo_messaging instead. from oslo import messaging /usr/local/lib/python2.7/dist-packages/oslo_concurrency/openstack/common/ fi leutils.py:22: DeprecationWarning: The oslo namespace package is deprecated. Please use oslo_utils instead. from oslo.utils import excutils What are normal, none developer users supposed to do with such warnings, other than: a) panic or b) Assume openstack is beta quality and then panic Non developer users are supposed to file a bug, leave installation and usage to professional devops who know how to handle logs or and stop using non- stable branch. -- С наилучшими пожеланиями, Boris _ _ OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions) Unsubscribe: openstack-dev-requ...@lists.openstack.org?subject:unsubscribe http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/openstack-dev -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1 iQEcBAEBAgAGBQJVAeRiAAoJEC5aWaUY1u57aysH/0Ho+FQDuFmjrA/5bgESgJST O71arqvVJN54OoQBIgY3wpFSi8GRLfYxYilZK8/6PJzOzJ+0FvEsz8wyT3Chh2/p x8g7GNBXhtVnDTCY86BctvgMyYdvSAkbrn7PZNz4b9sEJ3ocHCzq4okz5YkRyztt fzm4c6Nwva5tifRxXtZa1Ag581Pvzpp+UYQpllZ1If1hJaV7wsFrb7THzi42r3pR 4rwvuWoQJRunrgLRFGEeUElWYtIZjdlxqA2YlqyXyokw3pHaI8ctIFSudG8Pmkon C4H8Lc81AmNvWVHmHe0xcjS7zWivPg3jJumCrVKaMbb2fcOG87zg3R3AzF09kQA= =gwZa -END PGP SIGNATURE- __ OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions) Unsubscribe: openstack-dev-requ...@lists.openstack.org?subject:unsubscribe http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/openstack-dev
Re: [openstack-dev] Deprecation warnings considered harmful?
Looking back at the meeting eavesdrop, the primary reasons why we deferred this work to Liberty was twofold: - It wasn't a set plan based on information available to us at the time. This being the case, we decided to wait until we had more information regarding the requirements around this from oslo. - We wanted to ensure that we had a corresponding hacking rule in place to prevent future patch-sets from using the deprecated module names. We specifically didn't consider the impact of logging statements with deprecation warnings at the meeting. We now have a better picture of the actual status -- with the oslo decision that these namespace packages are definitely going away. I've added an agenda item to bring this up again at the next Trove weekly meeting [1] so that we can address this. [1] https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/TroveMeeting Thanks, Nikhil On Thu, Mar 12, 2015 at 4:05 PM, Robert Collins robe...@robertcollins.net wrote: On 13 March 2015 at 09:43, Ihar Hrachyshka ihrac...@redhat.com wrote: -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On 03/12/2015 09:35 PM, Robert Collins wrote: On 13 March 2015 at 08:09, Ihar Hrachyshka ihrac...@redhat.com wrote: -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On 03/12/2015 11:38 AM, Boris Bobrov wrote: On Thursday 12 March 2015 12:59:10 Duncan Thomas wrote: So, assuming that all of the oslo depreciations aren't going to be fixed before release What makes you think that? In my opinion it's just one component's problem. These particular deprecation warnings are a result of still on-going migration from oslo.package to oslo_package. Ironically, all components except oslo have already moved to the new naming scheme. It's actually wrong. For example, Trove decided to stay on using the old namespace for Kilo. Why? -Rob http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/irclogs/%23openstack-meeting-alt/%23openstack-meeting-alt.2015-02-11.log starting from 2015-02-11T18:03:11. I guess the assumption was that there is immediate benefit, and they can just wait. Though I don't think the fact that it means deprecation warnings in their logs was appreciated at the time of decision. Thanks, reading that it looks like the actual status (oslo decided most definitely that namespace packages are going away, its just a matter of when) wasn't understood in that meeting. Is it possible to put it back on the agenda for the next Trove meeting? Cheers, Rob -- Robert Collins rbtcoll...@hp.com Distinguished Technologist HP Converged Cloud __ OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions) Unsubscribe: openstack-dev-requ...@lists.openstack.org?subject:unsubscribe http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/openstack-dev __ OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions) Unsubscribe: openstack-dev-requ...@lists.openstack.org?subject:unsubscribe http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/openstack-dev
Re: [openstack-dev] Deprecation warnings considered harmful?
Thanks for shining the light everyone, https://review.openstack.org/#/c/163756/ Please if you see more let us know (#openstack-oslo or launchpad) ASAP. -- dims On Thu, Mar 12, 2015 at 6:38 AM, Boris Bobrov bbob...@mirantis.com wrote: On Thursday 12 March 2015 12:59:10 Duncan Thomas wrote: So, assuming that all of the oslo depreciations aren't going to be fixed before release What makes you think that? In my opinion it's just one component's problem. These particular deprecation warnings are a result of still on-going migration from oslo.package to oslo_package. Ironically, all components except oslo have already moved to the new naming scheme. I think that these warnings are just a single, not systemic problem. for something we know about at release time? For bugs we know about at release time we have bugreports. Filing a bug is pretty easy ;) https://bugs.launchpad.net/oslo.db/+bug/1431268 On 12 March 2015 at 11:41, Boris Bobrov bbob...@mirantis.com wrote: On Thursday 12 March 2015 12:24:57 Duncan Thomas wrote: ubuntu@devstack-multiattach:~/devstack$ cinder-manage db sync /usr/local/lib/python2.7/dist-packages/oslo_db/_i18n.py:19: DeprecationWarning: The oslo namespace package is deprecated. Please use oslo_i18n instead. from oslo import i18n /opt/stack/cinder/cinder/openstack/common/policy.py:98: DeprecationWarning: The oslo namespace package is deprecated. Please use oslo_config instead. from oslo.config import cfg /opt/stack/cinder/cinder/openstack/common/policy.py:99: DeprecationWarning: The oslo namespace package is deprecated. Please use oslo_serialization instead. from oslo.serialization import jsonutils /opt/stack/cinder/cinder/objects/base.py:25: DeprecationWarning: The oslo namespace package is deprecated. Please use oslo_messaging instead. from oslo import messaging /usr/local/lib/python2.7/dist-packages/oslo_concurrency/openstack/common/ fi leutils.py:22: DeprecationWarning: The oslo namespace package is deprecated. Please use oslo_utils instead. from oslo.utils import excutils What are normal, none developer users supposed to do with such warnings, other than: a) panic or b) Assume openstack is beta quality and then panic Non developer users are supposed to file a bug, leave installation and usage to professional devops who know how to handle logs or and stop using non- stable branch. -- С наилучшими пожеланиями, Boris _ _ OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions) Unsubscribe: openstack-dev-requ...@lists.openstack.org?subject:unsubscribe http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/openstack-dev -- С наилучшими пожеланиями, Boris __ OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions) Unsubscribe: openstack-dev-requ...@lists.openstack.org?subject:unsubscribe http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/openstack-dev -- Davanum Srinivas :: https://twitter.com/dims __ OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions) Unsubscribe: openstack-dev-requ...@lists.openstack.org?subject:unsubscribe http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/openstack-dev
Re: [openstack-dev] Deprecation warnings considered harmful?
On 13 March 2015 at 09:43, Ihar Hrachyshka ihrac...@redhat.com wrote: -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On 03/12/2015 09:35 PM, Robert Collins wrote: On 13 March 2015 at 08:09, Ihar Hrachyshka ihrac...@redhat.com wrote: -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On 03/12/2015 11:38 AM, Boris Bobrov wrote: On Thursday 12 March 2015 12:59:10 Duncan Thomas wrote: So, assuming that all of the oslo depreciations aren't going to be fixed before release What makes you think that? In my opinion it's just one component's problem. These particular deprecation warnings are a result of still on-going migration from oslo.package to oslo_package. Ironically, all components except oslo have already moved to the new naming scheme. It's actually wrong. For example, Trove decided to stay on using the old namespace for Kilo. Why? -Rob http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/irclogs/%23openstack-meeting-alt/%23openstack-meeting-alt.2015-02-11.log starting from 2015-02-11T18:03:11. I guess the assumption was that there is immediate benefit, and they can just wait. Though I don't think the fact that it means deprecation warnings in their logs was appreciated at the time of decision. Thanks, reading that it looks like the actual status (oslo decided most definitely that namespace packages are going away, its just a matter of when) wasn't understood in that meeting. Is it possible to put it back on the agenda for the next Trove meeting? Cheers, Rob -- Robert Collins rbtcoll...@hp.com Distinguished Technologist HP Converged Cloud __ OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions) Unsubscribe: openstack-dev-requ...@lists.openstack.org?subject:unsubscribe http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/openstack-dev
Re: [openstack-dev] Deprecation warnings considered harmful?
On 13/03/15 12:05 +1300, Robert Collins wrote: On 13 March 2015 at 09:43, Ihar Hrachyshka ihrac...@redhat.com wrote: -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On 03/12/2015 09:35 PM, Robert Collins wrote: On 13 March 2015 at 08:09, Ihar Hrachyshka ihrac...@redhat.com wrote: -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On 03/12/2015 11:38 AM, Boris Bobrov wrote: On Thursday 12 March 2015 12:59:10 Duncan Thomas wrote: So, assuming that all of the oslo depreciations aren't going to be fixed before release What makes you think that? In my opinion it's just one component's problem. These particular deprecation warnings are a result of still on-going migration from oslo.package to oslo_package. Ironically, all components except oslo have already moved to the new naming scheme. It's actually wrong. For example, Trove decided to stay on using the old namespace for Kilo. Why? -Rob http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/irclogs/%23openstack-meeting-alt/%23openstack-meeting-alt.2015-02-11.log starting from 2015-02-11T18:03:11. I guess the assumption was that there is immediate benefit, and they can just wait. Though I don't think the fact that it means deprecation warnings in their logs was appreciated at the time of decision. Thanks, reading that it looks like the actual status (oslo decided most definitely that namespace packages are going away, its just a matter of when) wasn't understood in that meeting. Is it possible to put it back on the agenda for the next Trove meeting? I had the same feeling after reading the log of the meeting and I'd appreciate if the Trove team could dedicate another meeting space to discuss this better. It's important to have projects as aligned as possible to reduce the impact of this deprecation. Flavio Cheers, Rob -- Robert Collins rbtcoll...@hp.com Distinguished Technologist HP Converged Cloud __ OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions) Unsubscribe: openstack-dev-requ...@lists.openstack.org?subject:unsubscribe http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/openstack-dev -- @flaper87 Flavio Percoco pgpSefOGbzWVl.pgp Description: PGP signature __ OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions) Unsubscribe: openstack-dev-requ...@lists.openstack.org?subject:unsubscribe http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/openstack-dev
