Re: [openstack-dev] [Nova] Putting nova-network support into the V3 API
Hi Chris, Is it OK to postpone nova-network v3 APIs until Juno release? I guess that because some nova-network v3 API patches are abandoned today. I'd just like to make it clear. Thanks Ken'ichi Ohmichi --- -Original Message- From: Christopher Yeoh [mailto:cbky...@gmail.com] Sent: Tuesday, February 04, 2014 8:37 PM To: openstack-dev@lists.openstack.org Subject: Re: [openstack-dev] [Nova] Putting nova-network support into the V3 API On Tue, 04 Feb 2014 11:37:29 +0100 Thierry Carrez thie...@openstack.org wrote: Christopher Yeoh wrote: On Tue, Feb 4, 2014 at 12:03 PM, Joe Gordon joe.gord...@gmail.com mailto:joe.gord...@gmail.com wrote: John and I discussed a third possibility: nova-network v3 should be an extension, so the idea was to: Make nova-network API a subset of neturon (instead of them adopting our API we adopt theirs). And we could release v3 without nova network in Icehouse and add the nova-network extension in Juno. This would actually be my preferred approach if we can get consensus around this. It takes a lot of pressure off this late in the cycle and there's less risk around having to live with a nova-network API in V3 that still has some rough edges around it. I imagine it will be quite a while before we can deprecate the V2 API so IMO going one cycle without nova-network support is not a big thing. So user story would be, in icehouse release (nothing deprecated yet): v2 + nova-net: supported v2 + neutron: supported v3 + nova-net: n/a v3 + neutron: supported And for juno: v2 + nova-net: works, v2 could be deprecated v2 + neutron: works, v2 could be deprecated v3 + nova-net: works through extension, nova-net could be deprecated So to be clear the idea I think is that nova-net of v3 + nova-net would look like the neutron api. Eg nova-net API from v2 would look quite different to 'nova-net' API from v3. To minimise the transition pain for users on V3 moving to a neutron based cloud. Though those moving from v2 + nova-net to v3 + nova-net would have to cope with more changes. v3 + neutron: supported (encouraged future-proof combo) That doesn't sound too bad to me. Lets us finalize v3 core in icehouse and keeps a lot of simplification / deprecation options open for Juno, depending on how the nova-net vs. neutron story pans out then. ___ OpenStack-dev mailing list OpenStack-dev@lists.openstack.org http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/openstack-dev ___ OpenStack-dev mailing list OpenStack-dev@lists.openstack.org http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/openstack-dev
Re: [openstack-dev] [Nova] Putting nova-network support into the V3 API
Hi Kenichi, Ah yes, it was decided at the mid cycle meetup to delay the nova network changes until Juno. Sorry I should have told you sooner. Regards, Chris On Wed, Feb 12, 2014 at 1:35 AM, Kenichi Oomichi oomi...@mxs.nes.nec.co.jpwrote: Hi Chris, Is it OK to postpone nova-network v3 APIs until Juno release? I guess that because some nova-network v3 API patches are abandoned today. I'd just like to make it clear. Thanks Ken'ichi Ohmichi --- -Original Message- From: Christopher Yeoh [mailto:cbky...@gmail.com] Sent: Tuesday, February 04, 2014 8:37 PM To: openstack-dev@lists.openstack.org Subject: Re: [openstack-dev] [Nova] Putting nova-network support into the V3 API On Tue, 04 Feb 2014 11:37:29 +0100 Thierry Carrez thie...@openstack.org wrote: Christopher Yeoh wrote: On Tue, Feb 4, 2014 at 12:03 PM, Joe Gordon joe.gord...@gmail.com mailto:joe.gord...@gmail.com wrote: John and I discussed a third possibility: nova-network v3 should be an extension, so the idea was to: Make nova-network API a subset of neturon (instead of them adopting our API we adopt theirs). And we could release v3 without nova network in Icehouse and add the nova-network extension in Juno. This would actually be my preferred approach if we can get consensus around this. It takes a lot of pressure off this late in the cycle and there's less risk around having to live with a nova-network API in V3 that still has some rough edges around it. I imagine it will be quite a while before we can deprecate the V2 API so IMO going one cycle without nova-network support is not a big thing. So user story would be, in icehouse release (nothing deprecated yet): v2 + nova-net: supported v2 + neutron: supported v3 + nova-net: n/a v3 + neutron: supported And for juno: v2 + nova-net: works, v2 could be deprecated v2 + neutron: works, v2 could be deprecated v3 + nova-net: works through extension, nova-net could be deprecated So to be clear the idea I think is that nova-net of v3 + nova-net would look like the neutron api. Eg nova-net API from v2 would look quite different to 'nova-net' API from v3. To minimise the transition pain for users on V3 moving to a neutron based cloud. Though those moving from v2 + nova-net to v3 + nova-net would have to cope with more changes. v3 + neutron: supported (encouraged future-proof combo) That doesn't sound too bad to me. Lets us finalize v3 core in icehouse and keeps a lot of simplification / deprecation options open for Juno, depending on how the nova-net vs. neutron story pans out then. ___ OpenStack-dev mailing list OpenStack-dev@lists.openstack.org http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/openstack-dev ___ OpenStack-dev mailing list OpenStack-dev@lists.openstack.org http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/openstack-dev ___ OpenStack-dev mailing list OpenStack-dev@lists.openstack.org http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/openstack-dev
Re: [openstack-dev] [Nova] Putting nova-network support into the V3 API
Hi Chris, Thanks for your info, I got it. That is a quick response and enough for me:-) Thanks Ken'ichi Ohmichi --- 2014-02-13 Christopher Yeoh cbky...@gmail.com: Hi Kenichi, Ah yes, it was decided at the mid cycle meetup to delay the nova network changes until Juno. Sorry I should have told you sooner. Regards, Chris On Wed, Feb 12, 2014 at 1:35 AM, Kenichi Oomichi oomi...@mxs.nes.nec.co.jp wrote: Hi Chris, Is it OK to postpone nova-network v3 APIs until Juno release? I guess that because some nova-network v3 API patches are abandoned today. I'd just like to make it clear. Thanks Ken'ichi Ohmichi --- -Original Message- From: Christopher Yeoh [mailto:cbky...@gmail.com] Sent: Tuesday, February 04, 2014 8:37 PM To: openstack-dev@lists.openstack.org Subject: Re: [openstack-dev] [Nova] Putting nova-network support into the V3 API On Tue, 04 Feb 2014 11:37:29 +0100 Thierry Carrez thie...@openstack.org wrote: Christopher Yeoh wrote: On Tue, Feb 4, 2014 at 12:03 PM, Joe Gordon joe.gord...@gmail.com mailto:joe.gord...@gmail.com wrote: John and I discussed a third possibility: nova-network v3 should be an extension, so the idea was to: Make nova-network API a subset of neturon (instead of them adopting our API we adopt theirs). And we could release v3 without nova network in Icehouse and add the nova-network extension in Juno. This would actually be my preferred approach if we can get consensus around this. It takes a lot of pressure off this late in the cycle and there's less risk around having to live with a nova-network API in V3 that still has some rough edges around it. I imagine it will be quite a while before we can deprecate the V2 API so IMO going one cycle without nova-network support is not a big thing. So user story would be, in icehouse release (nothing deprecated yet): v2 + nova-net: supported v2 + neutron: supported v3 + nova-net: n/a v3 + neutron: supported And for juno: v2 + nova-net: works, v2 could be deprecated v2 + neutron: works, v2 could be deprecated v3 + nova-net: works through extension, nova-net could be deprecated So to be clear the idea I think is that nova-net of v3 + nova-net would look like the neutron api. Eg nova-net API from v2 would look quite different to 'nova-net' API from v3. To minimise the transition pain for users on V3 moving to a neutron based cloud. Though those moving from v2 + nova-net to v3 + nova-net would have to cope with more changes. v3 + neutron: supported (encouraged future-proof combo) That doesn't sound too bad to me. Lets us finalize v3 core in icehouse and keeps a lot of simplification / deprecation options open for Juno, depending on how the nova-net vs. neutron story pans out then. ___ OpenStack-dev mailing list OpenStack-dev@lists.openstack.org http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/openstack-dev ___ OpenStack-dev mailing list OpenStack-dev@lists.openstack.org http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/openstack-dev ___ OpenStack-dev mailing list OpenStack-dev@lists.openstack.org http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/openstack-dev ___ OpenStack-dev mailing list OpenStack-dev@lists.openstack.org http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/openstack-dev
Re: [openstack-dev] [Nova] Putting nova-network support into the V3 API
Christopher Yeoh wrote: On Tue, Feb 4, 2014 at 12:03 PM, Joe Gordon joe.gord...@gmail.com mailto:joe.gord...@gmail.com wrote: John and I discussed a third possibility: nova-network v3 should be an extension, so the idea was to: Make nova-network API a subset of neturon (instead of them adopting our API we adopt theirs). And we could release v3 without nova network in Icehouse and add the nova-network extension in Juno. This would actually be my preferred approach if we can get consensus around this. It takes a lot of pressure off this late in the cycle and there's less risk around having to live with a nova-network API in V3 that still has some rough edges around it. I imagine it will be quite a while before we can deprecate the V2 API so IMO going one cycle without nova-network support is not a big thing. So user story would be, in icehouse release (nothing deprecated yet): v2 + nova-net: supported v2 + neutron: supported v3 + nova-net: n/a v3 + neutron: supported And for juno: v2 + nova-net: works, v2 could be deprecated v2 + neutron: works, v2 could be deprecated v3 + nova-net: works through extension, nova-net could be deprecated v3 + neutron: supported (encouraged future-proof combo) That doesn't sound too bad to me. Lets us finalize v3 core in icehouse and keeps a lot of simplification / deprecation options open for Juno, depending on how the nova-net vs. neutron story pans out then. -- Thierry Carrez (ttx) ___ OpenStack-dev mailing list OpenStack-dev@lists.openstack.org http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/openstack-dev
Re: [openstack-dev] [Nova] Putting nova-network support into the V3 API
On Tue, 04 Feb 2014 11:37:29 +0100 Thierry Carrez thie...@openstack.org wrote: Christopher Yeoh wrote: On Tue, Feb 4, 2014 at 12:03 PM, Joe Gordon joe.gord...@gmail.com mailto:joe.gord...@gmail.com wrote: John and I discussed a third possibility: nova-network v3 should be an extension, so the idea was to: Make nova-network API a subset of neturon (instead of them adopting our API we adopt theirs). And we could release v3 without nova network in Icehouse and add the nova-network extension in Juno. This would actually be my preferred approach if we can get consensus around this. It takes a lot of pressure off this late in the cycle and there's less risk around having to live with a nova-network API in V3 that still has some rough edges around it. I imagine it will be quite a while before we can deprecate the V2 API so IMO going one cycle without nova-network support is not a big thing. So user story would be, in icehouse release (nothing deprecated yet): v2 + nova-net: supported v2 + neutron: supported v3 + nova-net: n/a v3 + neutron: supported And for juno: v2 + nova-net: works, v2 could be deprecated v2 + neutron: works, v2 could be deprecated v3 + nova-net: works through extension, nova-net could be deprecated So to be clear the idea I think is that nova-net of v3 + nova-net would look like the neutron api. Eg nova-net API from v2 would look quite different to 'nova-net' API from v3. To minimise the transition pain for users on V3 moving to a neutron based cloud. Though those moving from v2 + nova-net to v3 + nova-net would have to cope with more changes. v3 + neutron: supported (encouraged future-proof combo) That doesn't sound too bad to me. Lets us finalize v3 core in icehouse and keeps a lot of simplification / deprecation options open for Juno, depending on how the nova-net vs. neutron story pans out then. ___ OpenStack-dev mailing list OpenStack-dev@lists.openstack.org http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/openstack-dev
Re: [openstack-dev] [Nova] Putting nova-network support into the V3 API
On 2014年02月04日 19:36, Christopher Yeoh wrote: On Tue, 04 Feb 2014 11:37:29 +0100 Thierry Carrez thie...@openstack.org wrote: Christopher Yeoh wrote: On Tue, Feb 4, 2014 at 12:03 PM, Joe Gordon joe.gord...@gmail.com mailto:joe.gord...@gmail.com wrote: John and I discussed a third possibility: nova-network v3 should be an extension, so the idea was to: Make nova-network API a subset of neturon (instead of them adopting our API we adopt theirs). And we could release v3 without nova network in Icehouse and add the nova-network extension in Juno. This would actually be my preferred approach if we can get consensus around this. It takes a lot of pressure off this late in the cycle and there's less risk around having to live with a nova-network API in V3 that still has some rough edges around it. I imagine it will be quite a while before we can deprecate the V2 API so IMO going one cycle without nova-network support is not a big thing. So user story would be, in icehouse release (nothing deprecated yet): v2 + nova-net: supported v2 + neutron: supported v3 + nova-net: n/a v3 + neutron: supported And for juno: v2 + nova-net: works, v2 could be deprecated v2 + neutron: works, v2 could be deprecated v3 + nova-net: works through extension, nova-net could be deprecated So to be clear the idea I think is that nova-net of v3 + nova-net would look like the neutron api. Eg nova-net API from v2 would look quite different to 'nova-net' API from v3. To minimise the transition pain for users on V3 moving to a neutron based cloud. Though those moving from v2 + nova-net to v3 + nova-net would have to cope with more changes. I have another idea is: move all nova-net API from v2 to v3 as sub-resources of 'os-nova-network' (maybe other name: os-legacy-network?) So nova-net v3 api will look like as: '/v3/os-nova-network/os-floating-ips', '/v3/os-nova-network/os-networks' Except prefix 'os-nova-network', nova-net v3 is same with nova-net v2. Then user needn't cope with a lot of changes, and we needn't redesign an extension for nova-net v3. Also if we can move all those nova-net v3 extensions into a sub-directory 'nova/api/openstack/compute/plugins/v3/os-nova-network/' that will be great. v3 + neutron: supported (encouraged future-proof combo) That doesn't sound too bad to me. Lets us finalize v3 core in icehouse and keeps a lot of simplification / deprecation options open for Juno, depending on how the nova-net vs. neutron story pans out then. ___ OpenStack-dev mailing list OpenStack-dev@lists.openstack.org http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/openstack-dev ___ OpenStack-dev mailing list OpenStack-dev@lists.openstack.org http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/openstack-dev
Re: [openstack-dev] [Nova] Putting nova-network support into the V3 API
On Thu, Jan 30, 2014 at 10:45 PM, Christopher Yeoh cbky...@gmail.com wrote: So with it now looking like nova-network won't go away for the forseable future, it looks like we'll want nova-network support in the Nova V3 API after all. I've created a blueprint for this work here: https://blueprints.launchpad.net/nova/+spec/v3-api-restore-nova-network And there is a first pass of what needs to be done here: https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/NovaV3APINovaNetworkExtensions From the etherpad: Some of the API only every supported nova-network and not neutron, others supported both. I think as a first pass because of limited time we just port them from V2 as-is. Longer term I think we should probably remove neutron back-end functionality as we shouldn't be proxying, but can decide that later. While I like the idea of not proxying neutron, since we are taking the time to create a new API we should make it clear that this API won't work when neutron is being used. There have been some nova network commands that pretend to work even when running neutron (quotas etc). Perhaps this should be treated as a V3 extension since we don't expect all deployments to run this API. The user befit to proxying neutron is an API that works for both nova-network and neutron. So a cloud can disable the nova-network API after the neutron migration instead of being forced to do so lockstep with the migration. To continue supporting this perhaps we should see if we can get neutron to implement its own copy of nova-network v3 API. There's a lot to be done in a rather short period of time so any help with patches/reviews would be very welcome. Also I'd appreciate any feedback on what might be considered a reasonable minimal subset of nova-network API support for icehouse so we can better prioritise what gets done first. Regards, Chris ___ OpenStack-dev mailing list OpenStack-dev@lists.openstack.org http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/openstack-dev ___ OpenStack-dev mailing list OpenStack-dev@lists.openstack.org http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/openstack-dev
Re: [openstack-dev] [Nova] Putting nova-network support into the V3 API
On Mon, Feb 3, 2014 at 10:02 AM, Joe Gordon joe.gord...@gmail.com wrote: On Thu, Jan 30, 2014 at 10:45 PM, Christopher Yeoh cbky...@gmail.com wrote: So with it now looking like nova-network won't go away for the forseable future, it looks like we'll want nova-network support in the Nova V3 API after all. I've created a blueprint for this work here: https://blueprints.launchpad.net/nova/+spec/v3-api-restore-nova-network And there is a first pass of what needs to be done here: https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/NovaV3APINovaNetworkExtensions From the etherpad: Some of the API only every supported nova-network and not neutron, others supported both. I think as a first pass because of limited time we just port them from V2 as-is. Longer term I think we should probably remove neutron back-end functionality as we shouldn't be proxying, but can decide that later. While I like the idea of not proxying neutron, since we are taking the time to create a new API we should make it clear that this API won't work when neutron is being used. There have been some nova network commands that pretend to work even when running neutron (quotas etc). Perhaps this should be treated as a V3 extension since we don't expect all deployments to run this API. The user befit to proxying neutron is an API that works for both nova-network and neutron. So a cloud can disable the nova-network API after the neutron migration instead of being forced to do so lockstep with the migration. To continue supporting this perhaps we should see if we can get neutron to implement its own copy of nova-network v3 API. To clarify a bit, the goal here is: a network API that works with both nova and neutron without the user knowing which he is using There's a lot to be done in a rather short period of time so any help with patches/reviews would be very welcome. Also I'd appreciate any feedback on what might be considered a reasonable minimal subset of nova-network API support for icehouse so we can better prioritise what gets done first. Regards, Chris ___ OpenStack-dev mailing list OpenStack-dev@lists.openstack.org http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/openstack-dev ___ OpenStack-dev mailing list OpenStack-dev@lists.openstack.org http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/openstack-dev
Re: [openstack-dev] [Nova] Putting nova-network support into the V3 API
On Tue, Feb 4, 2014 at 4:32 AM, Joe Gordon joe.gord...@gmail.com wrote: On Thu, Jan 30, 2014 at 10:45 PM, Christopher Yeoh cbky...@gmail.com wrote: So with it now looking like nova-network won't go away for the forseable future, it looks like we'll want nova-network support in the Nova V3 API after all. I've created a blueprint for this work here: https://blueprints.launchpad.net/nova/+spec/v3-api-restore-nova-network And there is a first pass of what needs to be done here: https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/NovaV3APINovaNetworkExtensions From the etherpad: Some of the API only every supported nova-network and not neutron, others supported both. I think as a first pass because of limited time we just port them from V2 as-is. Longer term I think we should probably remove neutron back-end functionality as we shouldn't be proxying, but can decide that later. While I like the idea of not proxying neutron, since we are taking the time to create a new API we should make it clear that this API won't work when neutron is being used. There have been some nova network commands that pretend to work even when running neutron (quotas etc). Perhaps this should be treated as a V3 extension since we don't expect all deployments to run this API. The user befit to proxying neutron is an API that works for both nova-network and neutron. So a cloud can disable the nova-network API after the neutron migration instead of being forced to do so lockstep with the migration. To continue supporting this perhaps we should see if we can get neutron to implement its own copy of nova-network v3 API. So I suspect that asking neutron to support the nova-network API is a bit of a big ask. Although I guess it could be done fairly independently from the rest of the neutron code (it could I would guess sit on top of their api as a translation layer. But the much simpler solution would be just to proxy for the neutron service only which as you say gives a better transition for user. Fully implementing either of these would be Juno timeframe sort of thing though. I did read a bit of the irc log history discussion on #openstack-nova related to this. If I understand what was being said correctly, I do want to push back as hard as I can against further delaying the release of the V3 API in order to design a new nova-network api for the V3 API. I think there's always going to be something extra we could wait just one more cycle and at some point (which I think is now) we have to go with what we have. For big API rewrites I think we can wait for V4 :-) For the moment I'm just going ahead with doing the V2 nova-network port to V3 because if I wait any longer for further discussion there simply won't be enough time to get the patches submitted before the feature proposal deadline. Chris ___ OpenStack-dev mailing list OpenStack-dev@lists.openstack.org http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/openstack-dev
Re: [openstack-dev] [Nova] Putting nova-network support into the V3 API
On 4 February 2014 14:33, Joe Gordon joe.gord...@gmail.com wrote: John and I discussed a third possibility: nova-network v3 should be an extension, so the idea was to: Make nova-network API a subset of neturon (instead of them adopting our API we adopt theirs). And we could release v3 without nova network in Icehouse and add the nova-network extension in Juno. +1, also off by default perhaps ;) -rob -- Robert Collins rbtcoll...@hp.com Distinguished Technologist HP Converged Cloud ___ OpenStack-dev mailing list OpenStack-dev@lists.openstack.org http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/openstack-dev
