on
move to Sun 15K (losing spindles)
Sent by: root
10/11/2002
12:14 PM
Please
respond to
ORACLE-L
I obviously left out a lot
Theoretically, if the activity of the database doesn't involve too much
disk writing, and the cache is large enough, etc., etc., you can use
parity. When disk drives cost a lot of money, there was some justification
for it. Now that drives are cheap, there really is no justification. To
I obviously left out a lot of information :).
We would be using server partitioning, with seperate ORACLE_HOMES for each
database (necessary since we have a variety of versions running).
The box would be running 1+0, the Sun reps suggest striping across all disks
(my first red flag).
I hadn't
I suggest reviewing James Morle's paper 'Sane SAN' at
http://www.oraperf.com/whitepapers.html.
- Kirti
-Original Message-
Sent: Friday, October 11, 2002 11:15 AM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
I obviously left out a lot of information :).
We would be using server
needed on move to Sun
15K (losing spindles)
Sent by: root
JayMiller To: Multiple recipients of list
ORACLE-L [EMAIL PROTECTED]
@TDWaterhousecc:
.comSubject: RE: Advice needed on
move to Sun 15K (losing spindles)
Sent by: root
Thanks Kirti!
I loved the line The first thing to do, regardless of platform or claims by
the vendor, is to completely forget the existence of a cache
Any similar references will be greatly appreciated. The more ammunition I
have the likelier I am to kill something :)
Jay
-Original
I've cussed and discussed the topic of one big stripe versus multiple small
stripes with different people and have yet to come across anyone who has
conducted a real test of various scenarios. If you stripe across all disks,
then you have the advantage of guaranteed, perfectly balance I/O --
Jay - Will your server partitioning protect the OLTP users from the DW
queries? In the normal situation, a company first adds their DW to an
existing system. Then they find that the DW doesn't make a good neighbor and
buy a separate server. The DW typically does a LOT of full-table scans, so
if
Title: RE: Advice needed on move to Sun 15K (losing spindles)
Lets say a guy only has one finger on each hand to tie his
shoe (mirroring). If he had five fingers (striping) he can
accomplish the job quite a bit faster. Now give him 1000
shoes to tie and listen to him bitch about how he could
Well, there are Gaja's papers : Proactive Storage Management - A Method to
Predictable System Performance, and Implementing RAID on Oracle systems
available at http://www.quest.com/whitepapers. Scan the page for Title and
for not Gaja's name.
- Kirti
-Original Message-
Sent: Friday,
Check out www.hotsos.com/dnloads/1.Littlefield2000.01.03-Specs.pdf,
written a couple of years ago by Jim Littlefield of Real Networks.
Cary Millsap
Hotsos Enterprises, Ltd.
http://www.hotsos.com
Upcoming events:
- Hotsos Clinic, Oct 15-17 Dallas, Dec 9-11 Honolulu
- 2003 Hotsos Symposium on
Yes, it's entirely separate CPUs and disks. If I can believe the Sun rep
(ehem) there should be no interference.
-Original Message-
Sent: Friday, October 11, 2002 3:30 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
Jay - Will your server partitioning protect the OLTP users from the DW
Thanks, I'm reading the first one now.
Jay
-Original Message-
Sent: Friday, October 11, 2002 3:19 PM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Well, there are Gaja's papers : Proactive Storage Management - A Method to
Predictable System Performance, and Implementing RAID on Oracle
One thing that should be made clear: Never, ever, stripe with parity (i.e.
RAID 5, etc.) unless you are force, at gunpoint, to do it. That is BAD.
Your database will run faster on an abacus ... well ... maybe a slide rule.
-Original Message-
Yes, it's entirely separate CPUs and
Thank you very much!
I can tell what I'll be reading this weekend :). With highlighter in
hand...
Jay
-Original Message-
Sent: Friday, October 11, 2002 4:31 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
Check out www.hotsos.com/dnloads/1.Littlefield2000.01.03-Specs.pdf,
written a
Fortunately my SA believes that so we were able to present a united front at
the presentation (and yes, the Sun rep said that with a large enough cache
RAID 5 works just as well as 1+0 - which is what we would be using).
Jay Miller
-Original Message-
Sent: Friday, October 11, 2002 4:54
More than separate ORACLE_HOMEs, you might also consider individual oracle
software owner accounts and dba and oper groups for each database...
Folks often install all Oracle distributions under a single account,
oracle, specifying a single SYSDBA group (dba) and a single SYSOPER
group (oper).
Jay - I share your concerns. Can you elaborate more on how heavily loaded
the system is? Is it somewhat I/O bound? Basically you're saying that it
would have a single RAID0 set? If you divided the disks differently to
create 2 or 4 RAID sets, would there be enough room for your application?
I've
This one is so easy that even a high school student could answer it. Use
the theory of constraints (book called The Goal) to this one.
When you reduce the number of resources to process a job, sequentially or
concurrently, you induce bottlenecks within the process. Thus, by reducing
the number
Jay,
You will hit performance problems because of not having I/O bandwidth.
Databases don't need storage, they need IO operations. Two important
pieces of info that are missing from your post:
- How many databases in total are going to run on this Sun 15K ?
- How many concurrent users on all
Others have addressed the performance issues.
What about the admin issues?
If consolidate to a single server, consider a separate
ORACLE_HOME for each database. You may need
to apply different patches to fix different problems in
various databases.
You have this ability now, but will lose it
I bet you Sun rep , while trying to unload some hardware on you,
has never heard of the term Logical I/O.Many times when upgrading,
one can make things worse , not better. If you are having performance
problems, then zero in on what those could be and fix it there. Take
some snapshots,
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L [EMAIL PROTECTED]
cc:
Subject:Re: Advice needed on move to Sun 15K (losing spindles)
Jay,
You will hit performance problems because of not having I/O bandwidth.
Databases don't need storage, they need IO operations. Two important
Stephen hit it right on the head !!
Buy your CEO a copy of 'The Goal' ! It will be very useful in this and all
future for such 'adventures'.
How big is this Cache?
And how big are all the databases that will be running on this big server?
If database size is cache, then cash goes to the
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