In a message dated 10/3/04 3:14:47 AM Pacific Daylight Time, Roy Lee writes:
> "Les &Ann, you are on the right track. Sarc hartmannii x hartmannii > remains a species, as does Soph coccinea x coccinea. Any species crossed with > itself or two different clones of the SAME species are mated, continue to be > species. One may question this to remain so when you look at the difference in > flower quality in Odm crispum of today and a plant from the wild. The genuine > plant from the wild is one of the worst flowers you could see for an Odont > whereas the clones of today have the equal or better shape than some of the best > hybrids. > This of course is done by selective breeding over a long period of time. > As suggested by many, ' we are improving on nature rather than wait for > nature to do it.' I always ask how far we can go before we have actually created > a hybrid? > ROY" > It can also be said that both are hybrids. I have seen a distinction made between "Intraspecific hybrids" and "Interspecific Hybrids" (and been chided when I made the distinction that Roy does). The former would involve say, two clones of Sarc. hartmannii from different grexes, the latter two different species. As regards "superior" forms of Odm. crispum: if old RHS paintings, catalogue descriptions, and botanical magazines are to be believed, the fact that wild clones of crispum exhibit comparatively "poor" flowers has more to do with depauperization of the gene pool from collection to near extinction, than it does with line breeding. Just my two cents, Dennis
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