G'day Penners,
Chas writes:
It would be difficult to prove which culture and tradition definitely has
the best practice regarding living and using the earth in North America
and elsewhere in the long run of the future. But overall, in the historical
larger picture, the
methods of the
From: Bill Burgess [EMAIL PROTECTED]
BTW, I thought the related thread on the contradiction of academic writing
and politics is worth discussing more in a forum like Pen-L. My take on
this is to try to remind myself every day to not confuse my academic
activities with advancing
Patrick Bond wrote:
I came
to the conclusion that "there should be no geographical or
locational grounds for Johannesburg to continue as South
Africa's economic heartland over coming decades and
centuries." Is this "urbicide"? Maybe. But look around this
city and you'll agree there is very
Thursday May 27 1999 South China Morning Post
Indian jets bomb Kashmir rebels
AGENCIES in Dras and Srinagar, India
Indian air force jets and helicopters fired on
Pakistan-backed guerillas in disputed Kashmir
yesterday.
This is a good companion piece to go with the Gee article.
http://www.wsws.org/articles/1999/may1999/yugo-m26.shtml
HTML
HEAD
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Let me put in a good word for COMMUNITAS by Paul Goodman and his brother
Perceval. Interesting utopian urbanism.
Peter
From: Doug Henwood [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Of course Johannesburg is the metropolis of one of the most polarized
countries on earth, on the most ravaged continent on earth. Johannesburg as
we know it is a product of an abominable set of social relations, so I
don't know how you can make a
Introduction to the Jul-Aug '98 Monthly Review special issue on agriculture:
Historical Turning Point
There can no longer be any doubt today, on the brink of the twenty-first
century, that we are in the midst of an unusually rapid change in all
aspects of the world's agriculture-food system.
BLS DAILY REPORT, WEDNESDAY, MAY 26, 1999:
The "traditional family" in which only the husband worked comprised only
19.2 percent of all married-couple families in 1998. This was about the
same as in the previous year, but far short of the nearly 50 percent 30
years ago, according to data
Peter,
Thanks for the response. As far as I know, except for Chomsky, this
question of alternatives has received little analysiswell, who
knows I may have deleted too many Kosovo exchanges.
This issue of alternatives is extremely important, and doesn't always
get the respect it
On Wednesday, May 26, 1999 at 19:35:41 (-0500) Yoshie Furuhashi writes:
Bill:
On Tuesday, May 25, 1999 at 21:11:10 (-0500) Yoshie Furuhashi writes:
...
While I am sympathetic to David Harvey's pro-urban + anti-primitivist
strain of thought (and distrustful of the rhetoric of the "noble savage"),
Michael Perelman wrote:
While it is true that even our whole planet is not a self-contained system
and so might not be a true ecosystem, the idea of an ecosystem is that it is
a place that has a certain degree of coherence. My skin or my gut forms an
ecosystem for various microorganisms. A rain
Comparisons of 1999 to 1929 are superficial and unfounded.
There are
few if any similarities to the period leading up to the Great
Depression.
I'd love to hear any contrasting views!
The list fails to mention the most important item as far as the
1930's goes: pro-cyclical fiscal/monetary
When was the last time the Federal Reserve raised reserve requirements?
Could reserve requirements be raised for SL's and not for commercial
banks?
Would raising reserve requirements cool off an over-heated real
estate/development sector without crimping general economic growth.
Your email
How convenient for the descendent beneficiaries of the slaveowners. Yes, this would
require an extraordinary legal step of compensating the descendants of the slaves.
This can be done by extrapolation of legal principles and common sense.
Charles Brown
"Rod Hay" [EMAIL PROTECTED] 05/27/99
Ken Hanly wrote:
In some respects modern industrial type farmers are more conscious of the
environment than earlier farmers and certainly
the quality of food and its safety has increased rather than decreased. Surely
as farms have modernised
and industrialised the average life expectancy has
from www.jubilee2000uk.org
Jubilee 2000 Coalition condemns
stalling tactics of G8 and calls for
British Government to be ready to
go it alone
5/22/99
(...)
Reports of recent negotiations preparing for the Cologne communiqué
have revealed a disturbing lack of progress
Patrick Bond wrote:
From: Doug Henwood [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Of course Johannesburg is the metropolis of one of the most polarized
countries on earth, on the most ravaged continent on earth. Johannesburg as
we know it is a product of an abominable set of social relations, so I
don't
Doug Henwood wrote:
For all the Mayans old reputation of pacifism -
derived from pre-1950s archeology, which studied only the upper classes and
their mythmaking - they were furious warriors.
No doubt they were fighting for peace and humanitarianism. As the motto of
the Stratgic Air Command has
* Sponsored by Jubilee 2000/USA.
Help make a CHAIN-GE for impoverished countries burdened by unpayable debt!
Join the Human Chain on June 18th, at the Treasury Building in Washington DC.
WE NEED YOUR PARTICIPATION! COME ON YOUR LUNCH HOUR!
Washington, DC, Friday, June 18, 12-1pm. "Break the
--- Forwarded Message Follows ---
Date sent: Wed, 26 May 1999 15:45:41 -0700
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
From: Sid Shniad [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject:WHAT THIS WAR IS REALLY ABOUT - By Marcus Gee, The Globe and
Mail
The
--- Forwarded Message Follows ---
Date sent: Wed, 26 May 1999 16:50:47 -0700
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
From: Sid Shniad [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject:REPORT FROM THE WAR ZONE - Yugoslavs resolute as bombs fall
everywhere
--- Forwarded Message Follows ---
Date sent: Wed, 26 May 1999 16:51:18 -0700
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
From: Sid Shniad [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject:Stop This Horrible Slaughter now!
Marin Independent Journal
--- Forwarded Message Follows ---
Date sent: Wed, 26 May 1999 15:45:25 -0700
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
From: Sid Shniad [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject:NEW COMPUTER VIRUS THREATENS CORPORATE AMERICA
The Washington Post
--- Forwarded Message Follows ---
Date sent: Wed, 26 May 1999 16:57:04 -0700
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
From: Sid Shniad [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject:French soldier of fortune fights alongside KLA - AFP
Agence France Presse
Note the striking Jamie Shea quote: NATO will not be charged with war crimes, because
it pays for the Tribunal.
--
Institute for Public Accuracy
915 National Press Building, Washington, D.C. 20045
(202) 347-0020 * http://www.accuracy.org * [EMAIL PROTECTED]
I think that an important point here that should be emphasized is that if you have
good reason to believe that the government of country X has a plan to attack some part
of its civilian population, then there is a strong argument that attacking that
country militarily may be the *last* thing
At 06:24 PM 5/27/99 +0100, Suggestions wrote:
Thanks for your message. We don't have any immediate plans for a Forum, but
we shall probably have one on the site next year some time.
In the meanwhile, I have forwarded your message to our Economics Editor.
Yours,
Anthony Gottlieb
Anthony Gottlieb
Doug Henwood:
There's a very interesting article by J. Donald Hughes on the Mayan
collapse in the March 1999 issue of Capitalism Nature Socialism. (For a
journal edited by a "confused old man," CNS is pretty damn sharp.) Well
before the arrival of the Europeans, the Mayans were living in cities
From a review of Schama's "Landscape And Memory" in the Toronto Star, 4/8/95
PROPONENTS of "deep ecology" believe that Western civilization holds a
warped attitude toward the natural world, regarding it as a realm simply to
be exploited by mankind.
Somewhere in history, these proponents
Hey, that's why Schama has a big-ticket multimedia deal with Tina Brown for
a history of Britain. You think Cronon or Hughes will be hearing from Tina
too?
Doug
I don't understand why these sort of things are of interest to you. I can't
forget how you obsessed [and jealous?] you were over the
At 06:12 AM 27/05/99 +, Patrick B. wrote:
Bill is right on with his argument on Harvey's agenda and
approach... except perhaps this last line which suggests we
can't find a site of praxis in linking our worlds and
thought processes with those of working-class and poor
constituencies.
Pen-L
Paul,
Not so minor detail. The claim in this article
that it was the Serbians who first suffered ethnic
cleansing at the hands of the Croatians is baloney.
The Serbs did it to the Croats and the Bosniaks,
first in Slavonia and Krajina and then in Bosnia. Then
later the Croats did it back
I'm beginning to think that the key feature of the 1920s that
foreshadowed the Depression was the structural problem associated with
highly uneven income distribution and the reliance on very high levels
of investment to sustain aggregate demand. The investment share of GNP
hit 25% or so, an
Thanks to Robert Naiman for posting these. "Jubilee" is a fascinating and
venerable concept, at least as worthy of analysis as capitalism or
socialism. Essentially, what it refers to (going back to Leviticus 25) is
the SYSTEMATIC and PERIODIC cancellation of debts and freeing of debt-slaves.
A
Lou,
Hmmm.
Well, there is a serious question about when
capitalism really began. As near as I can tell, this
problem of the separation of the city from the countryside
(and the ecological destruction arising therefrom) dates
back to the initial emergence of true cities about
5,000
Ah, but the issue was the French versus the US
system, not that of the Indians versus the Europeans.
An interesting account, albeit fictional, of this conflict
between the "organically geographical" Indian approach
to land use organization and the "rectilinear" European
(and specifically
Barkley:
Well, there is a serious question about when
capitalism really began. As near as I can tell, this
problem of the separation of the city from the countryside
(and the ecological destruction arising therefrom) dates
back to the initial emergence of true cities about
5,000 years ago.
Lou,
Haven't got any of the books on this in my office,
although the one by Dusko Doder (an ethnic Serb,
I believe) would probably contain the essential data.
Forget the title and have to go get my kid in a minute.
However, and I think you can verify this pretty easily
from multiple
Ok, let me ascend from the gossip pages and put my point in plain English.
Simon Schama is a right-wing scholar in the pay of the ruling class. The
other people we've been talking about aren't. Your bringing in quotes by
and about Schama is irrelevant and can only be meant as a caricature of or
a
"J. Barkley Rosser, Jr." [EMAIL PROTECTED] 05/27/99 03:09PM
Ah, but the issue was the French versus the US
system, not that of the Indians versus the Europeans.
I was moving on to a different point ( as on a number line), after you supplied me
with a little vignette of
Definition of Ethnic Cleansing: _ taking a bath.
Your email pal,
Tom L.
The debate on Harvey is both interesting and infuriating. At the same time that
I am learning, I also read labels, such as appalling and jealous, bandied
about. Such personal disputes can be handled off the list.
--
Michael Perelman
Economics Department
California State University
[EMAIL
OK, Lou, fess up: you didn't read Cronon. You're a smart guy. There is
absolutely no way you could read either CHANGES IN THE LAND or NATURE'S
METROPOLIS and make this profoundly mistaken remark:
Louis Proyect wrote:
The ideological message of Hughes, Cronon and
Schama is that these problems
At 01:20 PM 5/27/99 -0700, you wrote:
OK, Lou, fess up: you didn't read Cronon. You're a smart guy. There is
absolutely no way you could read either CHANGES IN THE LAND or NATURE'S
METROPOLIS and make this profoundly mistaken remark:
Yes, that was a copy and paste slip. I meant to group Hughes
Doug:
I read Hughes, Cronon, and Harvey as saying that humans have always had and
always will have complicated and difficult relations with their natural
environment, and that every society shapes and reshapes its physical
environment in distinctive ways.
Then I suppose all the debates within
[These are some comments from him that I received a while back that I doubt
he'd mind being made public]
Dear Mr. Proyect,
Thanks for you message and generous words about my book. The book
Cockburn apparently was citing is my *An Unsettled Country: Changing
Landscapes of the American West*,
The issue of compensated the descendants is ludicrous. Am I going to be
compensated by the British government for the clearance of the Highlands?
The list of wrong parties is endless. Compensate the living for wrongs but
dragging out every historical exploitation and compensating the
Compensate the living for wrongs but
dragging out every historical exploitation and compensating the descendants
is not possible or a reasonable political goal.
OK. But I had a conversation with a black Ghanaian poet friend not long
ago; we were picking apart Amistad, the movie. One point he
http://www.drudgereport.com/flash1.htm
titlex x x x /title
bodybgcolor="#ff" text="#00"
ttb
Thu May 27 1999 18:44:41 UTC
brbr
NATO strikes send dioxins, furans, uranium over Europe
brbr
MOSCOW, May 27 (Itar-Tass) - NATO's air strikes on Yugoslavia have environmental
Contradiction is polysemous and I am more than comfortable with it's usage
in all things human.
However, I think that while capitalism and socialism have contradictions, we
perpetuate a self misunderstanding of ourselves as organic beings when we
state we are in conflict with nature. It is the
Any of the Canadians on Pen-L want to enlighten us about Louise Arbour.
There is an interesting Canadian report from February when impartial
Arbour called for ground troops to be sent in. I'll post it if anyone is
interested.
Just the facts.
Your email pal,
Tom L.
Max wrote:
I want to be compensated by the descendants of Pharoah.
Think of the compound interest.
Pure Rush Limbaugh.
Louis Proyect
Author, "How to Win Friends and Influence People"
(http://www.panic.com/~lnp3/schmarxism.html)
Oh Louie you old fool,
Live a little. Laugh a little.
quoth the Motley Fool:
Articles like this crack me up:
http://www.cnnfn.com/markets/9905/26/marketwrap
In this article, a market gooroo is quoted on how our economy and
market today is similar to the market of 1929. This claim is
unsubstantiated. The mass media is always looking for the Big
At 11:16 AM 5/27/99 -0400, you wrote:
When was the last time the Federal Reserve raised reserve requirements?
I don't know. Maybe during the late 1970s?
Could reserve requirements be raised for SL's and not for commercial
banks?
I doubt it. Why would anyone want to do that? These days, the
Date: Thu, 27 May 1999 20:03:38 -0700
To: Zdravko Maravic [EMAIL PROTECTED]
From: Jim Devine [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: Serbia
I would recommend Noam Chomsky's recent writings on the New World Order,
along with the recent volume of the SOCIALIST REGISTER on globalization. I
am also
note my correction:
I would recommend Noam Chomsky's recent writings on the New World Order,
along with the recent volume of the SOCIALIST REGISTER on globalization. I
am also forwarding this message to other socialist political economists who
might be able to help. I wish apologizing to you
Look, we do not need to keep sniping at each other. I don't think that
such exchanges will do much to further any worthwhile processes.
--
Michael Perelman
Economics Department
California State University
Chico, CA 95929
Tel. 530-898-5321
E-Mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[Just as I suspected, J. Donald Hughes's CNS article "The Classic Maya
Collapse" was based on dated scholarship. Actually, Hughes's article turns
out to be impressions of his vacation in Mexico, not much more substantial
than my "London Calling" post. More recent scholarship has refuted this
Max wrote:
I want to be compensated by the descendants of Pharoah.
Think of the compound interest.
Pure Rush Limbaugh.
Louis Proyect
(http://www.panix.com/~lnp3/marxism.html)
I want to be compensated by the descendants of Pharoah.
Think of the compound interest.
mbs
And in English, beef got a French name, and cows a Germanic one. Sort of
tells you who served whom in merrie olde England.
This linguistic convention (along with pork vs. pig, etc.) arose because
the Normans (Frenchified Vikings to you) conquered the Anglo-Saxons, who
were basically Germanic.
Louis Proyect wrote:
Sigh. I am afraid you don't get it. There is no conspiracy afoot to promote
right-wing ideas through bribery. "A right-wing scholar in the pay of the
ruling class" is vulgar Marxism. I wish you would acquaint yourself with
the more refined version before deploying the vulgar
I want to strongly endorse this statement. I too have strong feelings
about the "holocaust" issue. I get angry when I hear this word (and
"genocide") tossed about casually in the context of Serbia/Kosovo -- not
only because, as obscene as the killing and expulsion is, it does not
compare to the
Louis Proyect wrote:
Hey, that's why Schama has a big-ticket multimedia deal with Tina Brown for
a history of Britain. You think Cronon or Hughes will be hearing from Tina
too?
Doug
I don't understand why these sort of things are of interest to you. I can't
forget how you obsessed [and
Barkley wrote:
Not so minor detail. The claim in this article
that it was the Serbians who first suffered ethnic
cleansing at the hands of the Croatians is baloney.
The Serbs did it to the Croats and the Bosniaks,
first in Slavonia and Krajina and then in Bosnia. Then
later the Croats did
Lou notes:
I believe that the key to unraveling this question is in the use
value/exchange value dichotomy. Before the introduction of large-scale
commodity production, cities were much more woven into their natural
environment. It is interesting to note--as Ellen Wood does in her article
in the
You are right; I took a shortcut here. The long lots in the new world were
not inherently feudal, but they did reproduce an old world feudal pattern
when dividing up the seignerial land grants. There was more to it than an
equal access to river routes. For example, once the land adjacent to the
Louis Proyect wrote:
From a review of Schama's "Landscape And Memory" in the Toronto Star, 4/8/95
PROPONENTS of "deep ecology" believe that Western civilization holds a
warped attitude toward the natural world, regarding it as a realm simply to
be exploited by mankind.
[etc]
Hey, that's why
Rectilinearity or Cartesian coordinates as the abstract real property grid across all
of North America (lots and sublots, quarter sections on plats) is a specific way in
which European conception of land differed from many indigenous peoples'conceptions of
land thereby becoming an obstacle to
Doug Henwood [EMAIL PROTECTED] 05/27/99 12:02PM
There's a very interesting article by J. Donald Hughes on the Mayan
collapse in the March 1999 issue of Capitalism Nature Socialism. (For a
journal edited by a "confused old man," CNS is pretty damn sharp.) Well
before the arrival of the
--- Forwarded Message Follows ---
Date sent: Wed, 26 May 1999 17:03:20 -0700
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
From: Sid Shniad [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject:S.O.S.: MAI AND WTO PREPARATIONS ADVANCE IN MEXICO AND OTHER
COUNTRIES.
Charles Brown wrote:
Interesting how the "bourgeoisie" got a French name.
And in English, beef got a French name, and cows a Germanic one. Sort of
tells you who served whom in merrie olde England.
Doug
This may be of interest to journalists. Note Ann's fiery comments at the end.
from www.jubilee2000uk.org
Jubilee 2000 Coalition condemns
stalling tactics of G8 and calls for
British Government to be ready to
go it alone
5/22/99
(...)
Reports of recent negotiations
French long lots are "feudal" and square-grids are
"capitalistic"? Give me a break.
The French long lots simply guarantee that everybody
has access to the main transportation route, which was
rivers in French North America. The idea is that people
would be trading. Pretty
Louis Proyect [EMAIL PROTECTED] 05/27/99 10:16AM I believe that the key to
unraveling this question is in the use
value/exchange value dichotomy. Before the introduction of large-scale
commodity production, cities were much more woven into their natural
environment. It is interesting to
We have three temporary teaching posts. I'd be happy to discuss them
informally with anyone interested.
Best,
Terry McDonough
National University of Ireland, Galway
Temporary Teaching Posts (3) in Economics
The Department of Economics wishes to invite applications for the
above temporary
please forward where appropriate:
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Below is an article from the Motley Fool, discussing the differences
between 1929 and 1999. Much of it is I think misleading and reaching,
but the topics raised I think are important, and might make a good
starting point for discussion.
The author touches on 9 topics contrasting the state of
Patrick Bond
Right now, I am terribly behind schedule with lots of
deadlines and the fuss associated with the SA election next
Wednesday, so can't say anything original. But this debate
is very inspiring. When it emerged last year and Louis was
raving against "brown Marxists" I was moved to try
Doug
And go ahead and forward this to your list as yet another example of "the
continuing regression of Doug Henwood," even though I'm not there to answer
the charge.
That's what you get for calling my RRPE article an "embarrassment". As far
as arguing socialism with you, I went through that
Not only do cattle poison their water source they also suffer from diseases as
a result of wading
into the polluted water. There is an increasing trend to keep cattle away from
streams and dugouts by fencing and pumping water to water troughs. Of course
there was always a considerable amount of
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