Collective bargaining type models don't work well in progressive org's because the org shouldn't be using its powerful position as an employer in the bargaining process. Similarly, the social consciousness and personalized relationships of the org can be abused by employees. In one I was involved with one employee was pressured out because he refused to work unlimited hours on a part time contract in order to spend time with his family. Conversely another employee drew a substantial child allowance despite the fact that the child's mother had abducted the child years before and he had no idea even where the child was. These problems can be avoided as regards pay anyway by adopting benchmarks like some unions do, paying officials no more than the highest paid member. The national median wage/salary might be a reasonable upper limit for non-union constituency or issue type organizations. Employee unions would still be needed to bargain over working conditions. I had a good friend working for a national El Salvador solidarity organization who was forced to fill out time sheets accounting for his activities in five minute blocks! It seems Lenin wasn't the only left admirer of Taylorism. Terry McDonough