Re: electricity/water comparisons

2004-08-14 Thread Patrick Bond
- Original Message - From: Chris Doss [EMAIL PROTECTED] Wow. A water Chubais. If they did that in Russia, they would have mass opposition rallies. The very idea of paying bills is a novelty here. What are water costs like in South Africa? Water is free here (two things Russia is not

Re: Economics and law

2004-08-14 Thread Chris Doss
The majority of cars sold in Russia are Russian-made, or imports of used cars from the West. Not many people are going to be able to afford a brand-new Volvo. --- Michael Perelman [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Obviously, someone who is very poor needs transportation will be unlikely to purchase a

Re: economics, law and the old soviet economy

2004-08-14 Thread Chris Doss
--- Charles Brown [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: CB: Are you saying that the Soviet people knew they were really just trying to catch up with the West again ,and just used the Communist terminology to cover it up or that they didn't realize what they were really, pragmatically doing ( simply trying to

Re: economics, law and the old soviet economy

2004-08-14 Thread Chris Doss
--- Charles Brown [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: CB: If they hadn't been doing something that was building socialism some kind of threat to capitalism , they wouldn't have been in such imminent danger of being defeated again. The reason imperialism was especially focussed on invading and conquering the

economics, law and the old soviet economy/the big quote

2004-08-14 Thread Charles Brown
by Waistline2 -clip- We have arrived at the very beginning of this process that abolishes property . . . and not simply allows for a change in the form of property . . . based on the revolution in the technological regime. ^^ CB: When you say abolish property instead of abolish private

Re: Economics and law

2004-08-14 Thread andie nachgeborenen
Do we really know at all what a socialist society would do about transportation safety? I think trying to predict from the hostory of Stalinist societies is a very shaky guide. A socialist society, as most conceive it in this list, would be one where there would be a lot more democratic input into

Re: Economics and law

2004-08-14 Thread andie nachgeborenen
Where did you get it? It's not like there is a Lada dealership on every corner . . . jksDaniel Davies [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I drove a Lada for five years. It was fourteen years old when I got it andwas still going just fine when I gave it away last month. They were builtoff the plans of old

Re: Economics and law

2004-08-14 Thread Bill Lear
On Saturday, August 14, 2004 at 07:18:13 (-0700) andie nachgeborenen writes: Do we really know at all what a socialist society would do about transportation safety? I think trying to predict from the hostory of Stalinist societies is a very shaky guide. A socialist society, as most conceive it in

Economics and law

2004-08-14 Thread Charles Brown
by andie nachgeborenen Do we really know at all what a socialist society would do about transportation safety? I think trying to predict from the hostory of Stalinist societies is a very shaky guide. A socialist society, as most conceive it in this list, would be one where there would be a lot

Re: Economics and law

2004-08-14 Thread Chris Doss
--- Charles Brown [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: CB: It is not quite clear that because there was a Gulag, show trials of Party members and other acts of state repression on specific occasions, that there was no or little democratic process in decisions on other matters in Soviet society during Stalin's

Re: Economics and law

2004-08-14 Thread Chris Doss
The distinction between Stalinist societies that appropriated the name socialist and those based upon real democratic input is absolutely spot-on. Bill -- What would you call the USSR when it had free elections in 1990? __ Do you Yahoo!? New and Improved Yahoo!

Re: Economics and law

2004-08-14 Thread Chris Doss
--- andie nachgeborenen [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Where did you get it? It's not like there is a Lada dealership on every corner . . . jks There is here. :) __ Do you Yahoo!? New and Improved Yahoo! Mail - 100MB free storage!

Re: Economics and law

2004-08-14 Thread andie nachgeborenen
Well, I don't want to get into this distraction on the Russian question, but you could call the system bureaucratic collectivism (Schachtman's term) or the command-administrative system (the perestroichiki's term), or totalitarianism, or lots of things, but the fact is we don't really havea good

Re: economics, law and the old soviet economy/the big quote

2004-08-14 Thread Waistline2
In a message dated 8/14/2004 8:18:31 AM Central Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: CB: When you say "abolish property" instead of "abolish private property" are you putting forth a different concept than the one that Marx , Engels and Marxists use ? Or just shorthand for what Marxists

naming that system

2004-08-14 Thread michael a. lebowitz
Date Index Re: Economics and law by andie nachgeborenen 14 August 2004 16:07 UTC Thread Index Well, I don't want to get into this distraction on the Russian question, but you could call the system bureaucratic collectivism (Schachtman's term) or the command-administrative system

Palast report

2004-08-14 Thread Dan Scanlan
Title: Palast report Johnnie Be Good Greg Palast, July 29, 2004 [Boston] The millionaires are dancing now. The balloons are falling on John Kerry, John Edwards and their nuclear families. They're playing Johnnie B. Goode over the loudspeakers. Democrats are hopping up and down like JFK never

Socialist candidate's view

2004-08-14 Thread Dan Scanlan
Title: Socialist candidate's view http://www.wsws.org/articles/2004/aug2004/kerr-a14.shtml Kerry and the Democratic campaign: a descent into farce By Bill Van Auken, SEP presidential candidate 14 August 2004 The presidential campaign of John Kerry has in the two brief weeks since the

Re: naming that system

2004-08-14 Thread Shane Mage
Michael A. Lebowitz wrote: [Justin]: Well, I don't want to get into this distraction on the Russian question, but you could call the system bureaucratic collectivism (Schachtman's term) or the command-administrative system (the perestroichiki's term), or totalitarianism, or lots of things, but the

This methinks

2004-08-14 Thread Dan Scanlan
Among us commonfolk A vote for Kerry is a vote for corporatism based on fear of Bush. A vote for Bush is a vote for corporatism based on fear, period. A vote for Nader is a fearless vote: against corporatism and based on a want to better the world. The first two options provide the voter with

¡Chávez No Se Va! ¡VOTA NO!

2004-08-14 Thread Yoshie Furuhashi
¡Chávez No Se Va! ¡VOTA NO!: http://montages.blogspot.com/2004/08/chvez-no-se-va-vota-no.html -- Yoshie * Critical Montages: http://montages.blogspot.com/ * Greens for Nader: http://greensfornader.net/ * Bring Them Home Now! http://www.bringthemhomenow.org/ * Calendars of Events in Columbus:

Re: naming that system

2004-08-14 Thread Waistline2
In a message dated 8/14/2004 2:47:45 PM Central Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: The reason that Schachtman was dead wrong was that the Stalinist bureaucracy, which he fantasized as a historically new *ruling class*, had no ability (or desire) to inaugurate a new mode of

Najaf

2004-08-14 Thread Marvin Gandall
(The US says the talks have broken down, and are again threatening an assault on the Imam Ali mosque. Why the assault has been repeatedly delayed is outlined below. The Sadrists have used the ceasefire during the past 24 hours to encourage and welcome supporters to Najaf, strengthening their

Re: Najaf

2004-08-14 Thread Carrol Cox
Marvin Gandall wrote: A spokesman for Al Sadr meanwhile told Agence France Presse early today that UN troops should be brought into Iraq to replace US forces, an unrealizable demand indicating the Mehdi Army is anticipating a fight. Debate on demands of the anti-war movement has been

Re: Najaf

2004-08-14 Thread Marvin Gandall
Unrealizable in the present circumstances, for sure, Carrol, so long as the US thinks it stll has a chance of building an effective puppet army to help it crush the resistance, and knows that an invitation to have the UN come in would be interpreted worldwide as a serious defeat. But if things

Shleifer update

2004-08-14 Thread Perelman, Michael
I picked this up off the Economic Principles site. A conference on damages in the government's suit against Harvard University and one of its star economists, originally slated for July 19, has been rescheduled for September 9. US District Court Judge Douglas Woodlock presumably will ask all