Re: [CVS ci] multiarray

2002-10-29 Thread Josef Hook
On Sat, 26 Oct 2002, Leopold Toetsch wrote: I committed a new multiarray.pmc, now based on list.c. It's not totally finished yet (the clone codes needs some polishing to call the init_pmc method) and needs a lot more tests. But I hate failing tests ... leo Well done Leo you beat

Re: Wh[ie]ther Infix Superposition ops

2002-10-29 Thread Markus Laire
On 29 Oct 2002 at 5:45, Piers Cawley wrote: Whilst I don't wish to get Medieval on your collective donkey I must say that I'm really not sure of the utility of the proposed infix superposition ops. I'm a big fan of any/all/one/none, I just think that one(any($a, $b, $c), all($d, $e,

Re: Wh[ie]ther Infix Superposition ops

2002-10-29 Thread Piers Cawley
Markus Laire [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: On 29 Oct 2002 at 5:45, Piers Cawley wrote: Whilst I don't wish to get Medieval on your collective donkey I must say that I'm really not sure of the utility of the proposed infix superposition ops. I'm a big fan of any/all/one/none, I just think that

Re: Wh[ie]ther Infix Superposition ops

2002-10-29 Thread Luke Palmer
Mailing-List: contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]; run by ezmlm From: Piers Cawley [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Tue, 29 Oct 2002 05:45:01 + X-SMTPD: qpsmtpd/0.12, http://develooper.com/code/qpsmtpd/ Whilst I don't wish to get Medieval on your collective donkey I must say that I'm really not sure of

Re: Wh[ie]ther Infix Superposition ops

2002-10-29 Thread Luke Palmer
Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED] From: Piers Cawley [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Tue, 29 Oct 2002 09:36:12 + Luke Palmer [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Mailing-List: contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]; run by ezmlm From: Piers Cawley [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Tue, 29 Oct 2002 05:45:01 + X-SMTPD:

[perl #18139] [PATCH] Yet another sprintf bug

2002-10-29 Thread Jürgen
# New Ticket Created by Jürgen Bömmels # Please include the string: [perl #18139] # in the subject line of all future correspondence about this issue. # URL: http://rt.perl.org/rt2/Ticket/Display.html?id=18139 Found yet another bug in sprintf: The code insists on prepending at least one

Re: Of mops and microops

2002-10-29 Thread Nicholas Clark
On Tue, Oct 29, 2002 at 08:26:00AM +0100, Leopold Toetsch wrote: Dan Sugalski wrote: I'm currently leaning against it only because it doesn't ultimately help the JIT. What we have now is wildly cool and damn useful (and has anyone heard from Daniel lately, BTW?) but there's room for more

[perl #18141] [PATCH] determine PARROT_STACK_DIR on Win32 with Visual C++

2002-10-29 Thread Aldo Calpini
# New Ticket Created by Aldo Calpini # Please include the string: [perl #18141] # in the subject line of all future correspondence about this issue. # URL: http://rt.perl.org/rt2/Ticket/Display.html?id=18141 due to a bug in config/auto/stackdir.pl, Configure.pl was unable to determine

Re: [CVS ci] multiarray

2002-10-29 Thread Leopold Toetsch
Josef Hook wrote: Well done Leo you beat me to it, :-) i got finished last weekend with my version of marray with underlying list. If I had known, that i will rewrite it, I'd dropped a note - sorry for work duplication. But it took an hour or so and I thought, just commit early so that

[perl #18142] [PACTH] Parrot_destroy

2002-10-29 Thread via RT
# New Ticket Created by Leopold Toetsch # Please include the string: [perl #18142] # in the subject line of all future correspondence about this issue. # URL: http://rt.perl.org/rt2/Ticket/Display.html?id=18142 Attached is a (big) patch that implements Parrot_destroy. Test results with

Re: Parrot 0.0.9

2002-10-29 Thread Juergen Boemmels
Dan Sugalski [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Well, on thinking a bit about this, there's no reason that we have to worry--it's perfectly OK for us to declare, unconditionally, that segment 0 is always bytecode, 1 line number info, and so on, with everything after position X (for some value of X)

Re: Of mops and microops

2002-10-29 Thread Leopold Toetsch
Nicholas Clark wrote: On Tue, Oct 29, 2002 at 08:26:00AM +0100, Leopold Toetsch wrote: But then you end up with a messier two level register spillage problem at compile time, don't you? Yes. ...Which values to spill from fast to slow registers, and which values to spill further from slow

[perl #18144] [PATCH] resurrect pdump

2002-10-29 Thread Jürgen
# New Ticket Created by Jürgen Bömmels # Please include the string: [perl #18144] # in the subject line of all future correspondence about this issue. # URL: http://rt.perl.org/rt2/Ticket/Display.html?id=18144 In order to do some debugging with PackFiles I had resurrected pdump. It now uses

Re: [perl #18139] [PATCH] Yet another sprintf bug

2002-10-29 Thread Leopold Toetsch
Jürgen Bömmels (via RT) wrote: # New Ticket Created by Jürgen Bömmels # Please include the string: [perl #18139] # in the subject line of all future correspondence about this issue. # URL: http://rt.perl.org/rt2/Ticket/Display.html?id=18139 Thanks, applied leo

Re: Copyright notices and license stuff

2002-10-29 Thread James Michael DuPont
Dan Wrote, This came up a while back in regards to GCC. Someone was working on a front (or back, I don't recall) end to gcc to dump out the internal representation of source as XML for some damn thing or other. I am working on something like that, there are 2-3 other similar projects. I am

Re: How to portably link on Win32 (all flavors), OS/2 and VMS?

2002-10-29 Thread Andy Dougherty
On Mon, 28 Oct 2002, Josh Wilmes wrote: If patch [perl #18127] goes in, we can dodge this bullet a while longer :) Agreed. But since we can't dodge it forever, this seemed as good a place to try it as any. (Particularly if your patch goes in, then I can't possibly break anything :-). --

Re: [perl #18127] [PATCH] Implicit stack direction probe

2002-10-29 Thread Leopold Toetsch
Jason Gloudon (via RT) wrote: # New Ticket Created by Jason Gloudon # Please include the string: [perl #18127] # in the subject line of all future correspondence about this issue. # URL: http://rt.perl.org/rt2/Ticket/Display.html?id=18127 I have problems to understand the line below:

Re: How to portably link on Win32 (all flavors), OS/2 and VMS?

2002-10-29 Thread Aldo Calpini
Andy Dougherty wrote: but I'm unsure what to put for link_exe_out for each of the three compilers mentioned in config/init/hints/mswin32.pl, nor for the compilers used under OS/2 and VMS. config/init/hints/mswin32.pl already defines what you need. is called 'ld_out' (also see my recent patch

Re: [perl #18127] [PATCH] Implicit stack direction probe

2002-10-29 Thread Jason Gloudon
On Tue, Oct 29, 2002 at 02:40:14PM +0100, Leopold Toetsch wrote: +cur_var_ptr = (size_t)((ptrdiff_t)cur_var_ptr + PARROT_PTR_ALIGNMENT) When PARROT_PTR_ALIGNMENT is not 1, that much pointers -1 are skipped during stack scanning by incrementing cur_var_ptr by sizeof(size_t) *

Re: [perl #18144] [PATCH] resurrect pdump

2002-10-29 Thread Leopold Toetsch
Jürgen Bömmels (via RT) wrote: # New Ticket Created by Jürgen Bömmels # Please include the string: [perl #18144] # in the subject line of all future correspondence about this issue. # URL: http://rt.perl.org/rt2/Ticket/Display.html?id=18144 Thanks, applied - with little modifications.

Re: How to portably link on Win32 (all flavors), OS/2 and VMS?

2002-10-29 Thread Andy Dougherty
On Tue, 29 Oct 2002, Aldo Calpini wrote: Andy Dougherty wrote: but I'm unsure what to put for link_exe_out for each of the three compilers mentioned in config/init/hints/mswin32.pl, nor for the compilers used under OS/2 and VMS. config/init/hints/mswin32.pl already defines what you

Re: Wh[ie]ther Infix Superposition ops

2002-10-29 Thread Austin Hastings
--- Piers Cawley [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: one(any($a, $b, $c), all($d, $e, $f)) Is a good deal more intention revealing than the superficially appealing than ($a $b $c) ^ ( $d | $e | $f ) Would it be practical/meaningful to say $result = bitwise ($a $b $c) ^ ($d |

Re: Wh[ie]ther Infix Superposition ops

2002-10-29 Thread Jonathan Scott Duff
On Tue, Oct 29, 2002 at 03:06:51AM -0700, Luke Palmer wrote: Superpositions will turn out to be unimaginably handy, possibly used in 10% or 15% of the code, so they get shorter names. Statements like this bother me. Not because I don't think it might be true, but because it's in future tense.

Re: Wh[ie]ther Infix Superposition ops

2002-10-29 Thread Simon Cozens
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (Jonathan Scott Duff) writes: Statements like this bother me. Not because I don't think it might be true, but because it's in future tense. If someone (named Damian :-) wrote a superposition synopsis that showed the many and varied uses of superpositions in contexts that

Re: Wh[ie]ther Infix Superposition ops

2002-10-29 Thread Jonathan Scott Duff
On Tue, Oct 29, 2002 at 10:13:39AM +0200, Markus Laire wrote: Also the idea of allways using 'function' style for something so basic like superpositions doesn't appeal to me. Superpositions are basic in a fabric-of-the-universe kind of way, but they are hardly basic in the

Re: Wh[ie]ther Infix Superposition ops

2002-10-29 Thread Piers Cawley
Simon Cozens [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Jonathan Scott Duff) writes: Statements like this bother me. Not because I don't think it might be true, but because it's in future tense. If someone (named Damian :-) wrote a superposition synopsis that showed the many and varied

Re: Wh[ie]ther Infix Superposition ops

2002-10-29 Thread Dan Sugalski
At 11:22 AM -0600 10/29/02, Jonathan Scott Duff wrote: On Tue, Oct 29, 2002 at 10:13:39AM +0200, Markus Laire wrote: Also the idea of allways using 'function' style for something so basic like superpositions doesn't appeal to me. Superpositions are basic in a fabric-of-the-universe kind of

RE: [perl #18127] [PATCH] Implicit stack direction probe

2002-10-29 Thread Garrett Goebel
Dan Sugalski wrote: Leopold Toetsch wrote: Can we really have e.g. odd aligned PMCs on stack? the specs are available *somewhere*, and we should see about digging them up and getting a final answer one way or another. A gold mine of cpu specs:

Re: [perl #18131] [PATCH] make disassemble.pl print header information

2002-10-29 Thread Leopold Toetsch
Matthew Zimmerman (via RT) wrote: # New Ticket Created by Matthew Zimmerman # Please include the string: [perl #18131] # in the subject line of all future correspondence about this issue. # URL: http://rt.perl.org/rt2/Ticket/Display.html?id=18131 Thanks applied + printing of fingerprint.

Re: [perl #18127] [PATCH] Implicit stack direction probe

2002-10-29 Thread Leopold Toetsch
Jason Gloudon wrote: On Tue, Oct 29, 2002 at 02:40:14PM +0100, Leopold Toetsch wrote: +cur_var_ptr = (size_t)((ptrdiff_t)cur_var_ptr + PARROT_PTR_ALIGNMENT) When PARROT_PTR_ALIGNMENT is not 1, that much pointers -1 are skipped during stack scanning by incrementing cur_var_ptr by

Re: [perl #18127] [PATCH] Implicit stack direction probe

2002-10-29 Thread Dan Sugalski
At 3:27 PM +0100 10/29/02, Leopold Toetsch wrote: Jason Gloudon wrote: On Tue, Oct 29, 2002 at 02:40:14PM +0100, Leopold Toetsch wrote: +cur_var_ptr = (size_t)((ptrdiff_t)cur_var_ptr + PARROT_PTR_ALIGNMENT) When PARROT_PTR_ALIGNMENT is not 1, that much pointers -1 are skipped

Re: Draft sketch of bytecode generation

2002-10-29 Thread Dan Sugalski
At 8:40 AM -0800 10/28/02, chromatic wrote: On Sunday 27 October 2002 23:27, Brent Dax wrote: Appearances are deceiving--the first adds some (unparsed?) source code, the second adds information on file and line numbers, probably based on offset into the bytecode. Similar in terms of

Re: [perl #18127] [PATCH] Implicit stack direction probe

2002-10-29 Thread Leopold Toetsch
Jason Gloudon wrote: ptrdiff_t is not a pointer type, so cur_var_ptr + PARROT_PTR_ALIGNMENT skips exactly PARROT_PTR_ALIGNMENT bytes. I did modify your patch slightly - reversed directions (top-down is probably more common) - increment by sizeof(void*) This boost life.pasm gens from 270 -

Re: [perl #18127] [PATCH] Implicit stack direction probe

2002-10-29 Thread Leopold Toetsch
Dan Sugalski wrote: At 3:27 PM +0100 10/29/02, Leopold Toetsch wrote: ... Can we really have e.g. odd aligned PMCs on stack? I don't think so. Or am I still missing something? There was some indication back when this was first implemented that the i386, at least when running windows, could

Re: [perl #18127] [PATCH] Implicit stack direction probe

2002-10-29 Thread Dan Sugalski
At 4:57 PM +0100 10/29/02, Leopold Toetsch wrote: Dan Sugalski wrote: At 3:27 PM +0100 10/29/02, Leopold Toetsch wrote: ... Can we really have e.g. odd aligned PMCs on stack? I don't think so. Or am I still missing something? There was some indication back when this was first implemented

RE: Parrot 0.0.9

2002-10-29 Thread Brent Dax
[EMAIL PROTECTED]: # Well, on thinking a bit about this, there's no reason that # we have to # worry--it's perfectly OK for us to declare, unconditionally, that # segment 0 is always bytecode, 1 line number info, and so on, with # everything after position X (for some value of X) left up

Re: How to portably link on Win32 (all flavors), OS/2 and VMS?

2002-10-29 Thread Andy Dougherty
Here's my proposal for stage one: This patch is intended to define explicitly what the different compiler and linker commands and flags are, what they are supposed to mean, and how they are to be used. Does this set of variables look sufficient for everyone, and are the definitions clear? If

Re: How to portably link on Win32 (all flavors), OS/2 and VMS?

2002-10-29 Thread Andy Dougherty
On Tue, 29 Oct 2002, Andy Dougherty wrote: Here's my proposal for stage one: This patch is intended to define explicitly what the different compiler and linker commands and flags are, what they are supposed to mean, and how they are to be used. Does this set of variables look sufficient

Re: Parrot 0.0.9

2002-10-29 Thread Dan Sugalski
At 11:46 AM +0100 10/29/02, Juergen Boemmels wrote: Dan Sugalski [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Well, on thinking a bit about this, there's no reason that we have to worry--it's perfectly OK for us to declare, unconditionally, that segment 0 is always bytecode, 1 line number info, and so on, with

RE: Parrot 0.0.9

2002-10-29 Thread brian wheeler
On Tue, 2002-10-29 at 11:48, Brent Dax wrote: [EMAIL PROTECTED]: # Well, on thinking a bit about this, there's no reason that # we have to # worry--it's perfectly OK for us to declare, unconditionally, that # segment 0 is always bytecode, 1 line number info, and so on, with #

RE: Parrot 0.0.9

2002-10-29 Thread Brent Dax
brian wheeler: # Is this really necessary? Seems like a chicken-and-egg # thing: to know which chuck the directory is in, you need to # read the directory. # However, since you've defined that the first chunk (0) is # always the directory, there's really no need to have it in # the

Re: Draft sketch of bytecode generation

2002-10-29 Thread chromatic
On Monday 28 October 2002 13:02, Dan Sugalski wrote: At 1:08 PM -0800 10/27/02, chromatic wrote: Is there an underlying function used to add arbitrary (Unicode text) metadata to the bytecode? Arbitrary metadata? Nope, no plans for that. While I can see it as a useful thing (though it

Re: Copyright notices and license stuff

2002-10-29 Thread Tim Bunce
On Tue, Oct 29, 2002 at 05:18:53AM -0800, James Michael DuPont wrote: The gcc interface project has been offically restarted. http://gcc.gnu.org/ml/gcc/2002-10/msg00806.html Congratulations. I think it's an important project. Tim.

Re: [perl #18127] [PATCH] Implicit stack direction probe

2002-10-29 Thread Jason Gloudon
On Tue, Oct 29, 2002 at 12:17:55PM -0600, Garrett Goebel wrote: Dan Sugalski wrote: Leopold Toetsch wrote: Can we really have e.g. odd aligned PMCs on stack? the specs are available *somewhere*, and we should see about digging them up and getting a final answer one way or another.

Re: Wh[ie]ther Infix Superposition ops

2002-10-29 Thread Damian Conway
Larry wrote: All other things being equal, I think people will find modal operators more confusing than if we just make separate operators. Agreed. That being said, I'm still wondering whether we can finesse it. We can get close. But that might actually be counterproductive. Damian's

Re: Persistance of superpositions?

2002-10-29 Thread Brian Ingerson
On 29/10/02 16:05 -0500, Buddha Buck wrote: I was wondering... How persistant are superpositions? How pervasive are they? Speaking of persistence, I just realized I'll need to start thinking about YAML serializations of superpositions. My first cut at it would be: --- letters:

Re: Wh[ie]ther Infix Superposition ops

2002-10-29 Thread Damian Conway
Austin Hastings wrote: I confess, I don't get it. Yes, you did. :-) To me, it appears to iterate over the input, printing unique values except that two values ($start, $finish) are considered to have already been encountered. If that's all, then okay. Okay then. That's all. But does

Re: Wh[ie]ther Infix Superposition ops

2002-10-29 Thread Brian Ingerson
On 29/10/02 14:47 -0500, Dan Sugalski wrote: At 10:22 AM -0800 10/29/02, Michael Lazzaro wrote: This is why I am nervous about introducing terms like eigenbunny, etc. Oh, I dunno, I kind of like it. Of course, now my kids want eigenbunny slippers... (Though the trouble with those is they

Re: Persistance of superpositions?

2002-10-29 Thread Damian Conway
Brian Ingerson wrote: Speaking of persistence, I just realized I'll need to start thinking about YAML serializations of superpositions. My first cut at it would be: --- letters: !super [0, 1, 2] digits: !super - 0 - 1 - 2 ... Not quite. You also need to

Re: Persistance of superpositions?

2002-10-29 Thread Brian Ingerson
On 29/10/02 13:26 -0800, Brian Ingerson wrote: On 29/10/02 16:05 -0500, Buddha Buck wrote: I was wondering... How persistant are superpositions? How pervasive are they? Speaking of persistence, I just realized I'll need to start thinking about YAML serializations of superpositions. My

Re: Wh[ie]ther Infix Superposition ops

2002-10-29 Thread Damian Conway
Brian Ingerson wrote: Oh! I just remembered the ultimate word for a container. It's cozy, of course! Every eigenbunny needs a supercozy! The plural of which is, presumable, supercozens. Now *I'm* really scared! ;-) Damian

Re: Perl6 Operator List, Damian's take

2002-10-29 Thread Aaron Crane
Damian Conway writes: My personal favorite solution is to use square brackets (for their dual array and indexing connotations, and because they highlight the operator so nicely): $count = a + b; sums = a [+] b; Mmm, yummy. I do have a question though (and apologies if I've

Re: Wh[ie]ther Infix Superposition ops

2002-10-29 Thread Larry Wall
On Tue, 29 Oct 2002, Austin Hastings wrote: : --- Piers Cawley [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: : : one(any($a, $b, $c), all($d, $e, $f)) : : Is a good deal more intention revealing than the superficially : appealing than : : ($a $b $c) ^ ( $d | $e | $f ) First I would like to

Re: Wh[ie]ther Infix Superposition ops

2002-10-29 Thread Larry Wall
On Tue, 29 Oct 2002, Dan Sugalski wrote: : Perhaps the best thing to do is to define a word operator for : superpositions and, if they later become really popular, snag some : generally-available* extended character to represent the operators. Sorry, I believe in the transactional model of QM,

Re: Wh[ie]ther Infix Superposition ops

2002-10-29 Thread Larry Wall
On Tue, 29 Oct 2002, Jonathan Scott Duff wrote: : On Tue, Oct 29, 2002 at 10:13:39AM +0200, Markus Laire wrote: : Also the idea of allways using 'function' style for something so : basic like superpositions doesn't appeal to me. : : Superpositions are basic in a fabric-of-the-universe kind of

Re: Wh[ie]ther Infix Superposition ops

2002-10-29 Thread Michael Lazzaro
On Tuesday, October 29, 2002, at 09:08 AM, Jonathan Scott Duff wrote: Statements like this bother me. Not because I don't think it might be true, but because it's in future tense. If someone (named Damian :-) wrote a superposition synopsis that showed the many and varied uses of superpositions

Re: Wh[ie]ther Infix Superposition ops

2002-10-29 Thread Simon Cozens
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (Larry Wall) writes: So I would look favorably on finding a replacement for superposition. Predicate calculus? :) Seriously, I see no problem with calling them set operators. -- For true believers, LORD would be K\textsc{nuth} in TeX, and L\textsc{amport} in LaTeX. Atheists

RE: Wh[ie]ther Infix Superposition ops

2002-10-29 Thread Garrett Goebel
From: Simon Cozens [mailto:simon;ermine.ox.ac.uk] [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Larry Wall) writes: So I would look favorably on finding a replacement for superposition. Predicate calculus? :) Seriously, I see no problem with calling them set operators. Great minds think alike. Or in this case

Re: Perl6 Operator List, TAKE 4

2002-10-29 Thread Michael Lazzaro
On Monday, October 28, 2002, at 01:25 PM, Michael Lazzaro wrote: Again, I'm wondering if we're going about this wrong way -- perhaps we need to go to more effort to save ^ as xor, and use something different for hypers, like h+ or h[+] or `+ or ~+ or ~~+, etc? OK, I'm calling Warnock's on

Re: Wh[ie]ther Infix Superposition ops

2002-10-29 Thread Dan Sugalski
At 10:02 AM -0800 10/29/02, Larry Wall wrote: On Tue, 29 Oct 2002, Dan Sugalski wrote: : Perhaps the best thing to do is to define a word operator for : superpositions and, if they later become really popular, snag some : generally-available* extended character to represent the operators. Sorry,

Re: Wh[ie]ther Infix Superposition ops

2002-10-29 Thread Brian Ingerson
On 29/10/02 09:58 -0800, Larry Wall wrote: On Tue, 29 Oct 2002, Jonathan Scott Duff wrote: : On Tue, Oct 29, 2002 at 10:13:39AM +0200, Markus Laire wrote: So I would look favorably on finding a replacement for superposition. How about christmasgift or gift? You don't know what it is until

Re: Wh[ie]ther Infix Superposition ops

2002-10-29 Thread Jonathan Scott Duff
On Tue, Oct 29, 2002 at 10:22:36AM -0800, Michael Lazzaro wrote: This is why I am nervous about introducing terms like eigenbunny, etc., into the general vocabulary of the language. It attempts to make it sound harder than it is, I think -- there are plenty of uses for these operators

Re: Wh[ie]ther Infix Superposition ops

2002-10-29 Thread Jonathan Scott Duff
On Tue, Oct 29, 2002 at 11:12:28AM -0800, Brian Ingerson wrote: On 29/10/02 09:58 -0800, Larry Wall wrote: On Tue, 29 Oct 2002, Jonathan Scott Duff wrote: : On Tue, Oct 29, 2002 at 10:13:39AM +0200, Markus Laire wrote: So I would look favorably on finding a replacement for superposition.

Perl6 Operator List, Damian's take

2002-10-29 Thread Damian Conway
Oh boy, I just *hate* the idea of CX for xor. Hate it, hate it, hate it! Yuck, yuck, yuck! But I do like Michael's idea of using C as the hyperoperator marker (the array connotation works well, I think). The only problem is that we end up with too many C's in most expressions: $count = a + b;

Re: Wh[ie]ther Infix Superposition ops

2002-10-29 Thread David Wheeler
On Tuesday, October 29, 2002, at 09:58 AM, Larry Wall wrote: What kindergartener can't understand a logically entangled list of nouns? I want a tricycle or a video game or a teddy bear for Christmas. I want a tricycle and a video game and a teddy bear for Christmas. That's no

Re: Wh[ie]ther Infix Superposition ops

2002-10-29 Thread Austin Hastings
I think this may be in response to an earlier message of yours looking for a replacement for superposition. But I recall getting a Dilbert calendar for Xmas some years back with a cover featuring the PHB saying I'm not indecisive - I'm flexible! Thus, flexops. And flexpressions (flexprs, for

Re: Perl6 Operator List, Damian's take

2002-10-29 Thread Michael Lazzaro
On Tuesday, October 29, 2002, at 11:21 AM, Damian Conway wrote: My personal favorite solution is to use square brackets (for their dual array and indexing connotations, and because they highlight the operator so nicely): $count = a + b; sums = a [+] b; Any ideas on what { $^a op $^b }

Re: Perl6 Operator List, Damian's take

2002-10-29 Thread Uri Guttman
DC == Damian Conway [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: DC Oh boy, I just *hate* the idea of CX for xor. DC Hate it, hate it, hate it! Yuck, yuck, yuck! tell us how you _really_ feel! :-) DC My personal favorite solution is to use square brackets (for their dual DC array and indexing

Re: Perlmasons. Be the first on your block to join...

2002-10-29 Thread Austin Hastings
Can we have a secret handshake, too? Will we be blamed for the secret features of the new US dollar bill? You know that eye-in-the-pyramid looking thingy? Well, notice what character on the COMPUTER KEYBOARD that looks like? It's not by coincidence that many of the programmers at the Treasury

Re: Perl6 Operator List, Damian's take

2002-10-29 Thread Damian Conway
Michael Lazzaro wrote: Any ideas on what { $^a op $^b } would become? It would be unchanged. Placeholders have nothing to do with hyperoperators. And never have had. Damian

Re: Perl6 Operator List, Damian's take

2002-10-29 Thread Luke Palmer
Mailing-List: contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]; run by ezmlm Date: Tue, 29 Oct 2002 11:36:20 -0800 Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED] From: Michael Lazzaro [EMAIL PROTECTED] X-SMTPD: qpsmtpd/0.12, http://develooper.com/code/qpsmtpd/ On Tuesday, October 29, 2002, at 11:21 AM, Damian Conway wrote: My

Re: Wh[ie]ther Infix Superposition ops

2002-10-29 Thread Dan Sugalski
At 10:22 AM -0800 10/29/02, Michael Lazzaro wrote: This is why I am nervous about introducing terms like eigenbunny, etc. Oh, I dunno, I kind of like it. Of course, now my kids want eigenbunny slippers... (Though the trouble with those is they may or may not be keeping your feet warm--you can

Re: Perl6 Operator List, Damian's take

2002-10-29 Thread Damian Conway
Uri Guttman wrote: what is a string complement? bitwise? i take it the numeric is one's complement. String complement treats the value as a string then bitwise complements every bit of each character. Integer complement treats the value as a int then bitwise complements every bit. DC

Re: Wh[ie]ther Infix Superposition ops

2002-10-29 Thread Miko O'Sullivan
At 10:22 AM -0800 10/29/02, Michael Lazzaro wrote: This is why I am nervous about introducing terms like eigenbunny, etc. Beats the heck out of thingy. I had to read that chapter three times before I realized that Randal hadn't just forgotten the real word. I still feel uncomfortable saying it

Re: Wh[ie]ther Infix Superposition ops

2002-10-29 Thread Damian Conway
Simon Cozens wrote: In this case I find the latter to be easier to decode and more appealing. There are less chars and paretheses are seen much more easily. Ack, I guess that means we need a one character DWIM operator. Although ... comes pretty close, I suppose. Great minds think alike.

Re: Perl6 Operator List, Damian's take

2002-10-29 Thread Michael Lazzaro
On Tuesday, October 29, 2002, at 11:47 AM, Luke Palmer wrote: [i.e. this change doesn't make any difference] Doh! You're right, of course. For some reason I was thinking a long while back that it would be confusing to have { $^a op $^b } if ^ went back to meaning xor. But there's the

Re: Wh[ie]ther Infix Superposition ops

2002-10-29 Thread Jonathan Scott Duff
On Tue, Oct 29, 2002 at 11:26:56AM -0800, David Wheeler wrote: Well, I like set operators, too, but what's the grammatical term for the above logically entangled list of nouns? I'd call them ents if not for Austin Hastings' more sensible flexops (unless someone wants to take a stab at

Re: Perl6 Operator List, Take 3

2002-10-29 Thread Damian Conway
Scott Duff wrote: Actually, I think we need a universal method on scalars that gives the eigenstates of that value. It might be C$val.eigenstates or maybe just C$val.states. The method would work on non-superimposed values as well, in which cases it would just return a list containing the value

Re: Wh[ie]ther Infix Superposition ops

2002-10-29 Thread Damian Conway
Piers Cawley wrote: Whilst I don't wish to get Medieval on your collective donkey I must say that I'm really not sure of the utility of the proposed infix superposition ops. I'm a big fan of any/all/one/none, I just think that one(any($a, $b, $c), all($d, $e, $f)) Is a good deal more

Re: Wh[ie]ther Infix Superposition ops

2002-10-29 Thread Damian Conway
If someone (named Damian :-) wrote a superposition synopsis that showed the many and varied uses of superpositions in contexts that ordinary programmers can relate to, it would bother me less when people make claims about the usefulness of superpositions. I'll take one of those for perl.com!

Re: Perl6 Operator List, Damian's take

2002-10-29 Thread Dave Mitchell
On Wed, Oct 30, 2002 at 06:51:14AM +1100, Damian Conway wrote: String complement treats the value as a string then bitwise complements every bit of each character. Is that the complement of the codepoint or the individual bytes? (I'm thinking utf8 here). -- Nothing ventured, nothing lost.

Re: vector vs. hyper

2002-10-29 Thread Dave Mitchell
On Tue, Oct 29, 2002 at 02:55:57PM -0500, Uri Guttman wrote: damian's syntax table and his use of the term vectorizing made me wonder why we call his [op] thing a hyperoperator? the word hyper i assume came from hyperdimensional. but calling [] the vectorizing (or just vectored) op variant

Re: Wh[ie]ther Infix Superposition ops

2002-10-29 Thread fearcadi
Brian Ingerson writes: On 29/10/02 09:58 -0800, Larry Wall wrote: On Tue, 29 Oct 2002, Jonathan Scott Duff wrote: : On Tue, Oct 29, 2002 at 10:13:39AM +0200, Markus Laire wrote: So I would look favorably on finding a replacement for superposition. How about christmasgift or

Re: Wh[ie]ther Infix Superposition op

2002-10-29 Thread Damian Conway
Larry... would look favorably on finding a replacement for superposition. any( multivalue, multival, opval= andval|orval|xorval|nandval, opval= andval|orval|exval|nonval, opval= allval|anyval|oneval|noneval, set = andset|orset|xorset|nandset, set =

Re: Wh[ie]ther Infix Superposition ops

2002-10-29 Thread Damian Conway
David Wheeler wrote: Well, I like set operators, too, but what's the grammatical term for the above logically entangled list of nouns? Superposition. Damian

Re: Wh[ie]ther Infix Superposition ops

2002-10-29 Thread John Siracusa
On 10/29/02 3:13 PM, Damian Conway wrote: I suspect it will be quite unusual to see nested superpositions in code. Most folks are going to be using them for simple but very common checks like: [...] my $seen = $start | $finish; for - $next { print $next unless $next == $seen; $seen |=

Re: Wh[ie]ther Infix Superposition ops

2002-10-29 Thread fearcadi
Jonathan Scott Duff writes: On Tue, Oct 29, 2002 at 11:12:28AM -0800, Brian Ingerson wrote: On 29/10/02 09:58 -0800, Larry Wall wrote: On Tue, 29 Oct 2002, Jonathan Scott Duff wrote: : On Tue, Oct 29, 2002 at 10:13:39AM +0200, Markus Laire wrote: So I would look favorably on

Persistance of superpositions?

2002-10-29 Thread Buddha Buck
I was wondering... How persistant are superpositions? How pervasive are they? I mean, will the following work? $letters = any('a'..'z'); $digits = any('0'..'9'); $ndaTable = { start = { $letters = 'OneLetter', $digits = 'OneDigit' } OneLetter = { $letters =

Re: Wh[ie]ther Infix Superposition ops

2002-10-29 Thread Austin Hastings
I confess, I don't get it. To me, it appears to iterate over the input, printing unique values except that two values ($start, $finish) are considered to have already been encountered. If that's all, then okay. But does it somehow skip all entries before/after the delimiter? Also, in a related

Re: Perl6 Operator List, Damian's take

2002-10-29 Thread fearcadi
Michael Lazzaro writes: Any ideas on what { $^a op $^b } would become? MikeL maybe { $_a op $_b } { _ op _ } and we have simple ( ? ) rules to distinguish it from space-eater _ * sp _ sp surrounded by spaces is placeholder if term is

Re: Persistance of superpositions?

2002-10-29 Thread Damian Conway
Buddha Buck wrote: I was wondering... How persistant are superpositions? How pervasive are they? As I mentioned in a recent post, would expect them to be all-pervasive and fully propagating. I mean, will the following work? I would certainly hope so! (modulo the syntax snafu) In fact,

Re: Perl6 Operator List, Damian's take

2002-10-29 Thread Damian Conway
Aaron Crane wrote: Mmm, yummy. I do have a question though (and apologies if I've merely missed the answer). We've got two productive operation-formation rules: one saying add a final = to operate-and-assign, and the other saying wrap in [] to vectorise. But no-one's said which order they

Re: Persistance of superpositions?

2002-10-29 Thread Michael Lazzaro
On Tuesday, October 29, 2002, at 01:50 PM, Damian Conway wrote: PS: Is anyone collecting these examples. It would make writing that perl.com article much easier for me ;-) But of course! Piers is summarizing this entire thread -- right, Piers? :-) Aaron Crane wrote: x [+]= y; I

Re: Persistance of superpositions?

2002-10-29 Thread Brian Ingerson
On 30/10/02 08:36 +1100, Damian Conway wrote: Brian Ingerson wrote: Speaking of persistence, I just realized I'll need to start thinking about YAML serializations of superpositions. My first cut at it would be: --- letters: !super [0, 1, 2] digits: !super - 0

Generalising properties

2002-10-29 Thread Paul Johnson
OK, perl6-language is getting scary again ;-) So here's something else to think about. Code coverage. We don't have to worry about how to do it here. That's a problem for internals, and they seem to be solving it quite well without my interference at the moment, even if they are not aware of

Re: Perl6 Operator List, Damian's take

2002-10-29 Thread Luke Palmer
Mailing-List: contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]; run by ezmlm Date: Tue, 29 Oct 2002 21:37:32 + From: Aaron Crane [EMAIL PROTECTED] Content-Disposition: inline X-SMTPD: qpsmtpd/0.12, http://develooper.com/code/qpsmtpd/ Damian Conway writes: My personal favorite solution is to use square

Re: Perl6 Operator List, Damian's take

2002-10-29 Thread Austin Hastings
Interesting point, especially if operator:+= can be overloaded. @a [+=] @b; implies iteratively invoking operator:+=, whereas @a [+]= @b; implies assigning the result of iteratively invoking operator:+ It only matters when they're different. :-| And, of course, if they ARE different then

Re: Wh[ie]ther Infix Superposition ops

2002-10-29 Thread Dan Sugalski
At 1:34 PM -0800 10/29/02, Brian Ingerson wrote: On 29/10/02 14:47 -0500, Dan Sugalski wrote: At 10:22 AM -0800 10/29/02, Michael Lazzaro wrote: This is why I am nervous about introducing terms like eigenbunny, etc. Oh, I dunno, I kind of like it. Of course, now my kids want eigenbunny

Re: Generalising properties

2002-10-29 Thread chromatic
On Tue, 29 Oct 2002 14:19:59 -0800, Paul Johnson wrote: So I would like to see able to tag arbitrary information onto just about everything, including files, packages, classes, subroutines, blocks, control structures, statements, lines, expressions, variables and whatever else I've forgotten

Re: Persistance of superpositions?

2002-10-29 Thread Larry Wall
On Tue, 29 Oct 2002, Michael Lazzaro wrote: :x [+]= y; : : I guess that's OK looking, tho either is fine with me. My only syntactic quibble with [+] is that it's officially ambiguous when it's a unary operator: a = [+]b could also be the start of a = [+1, +2, +3] Or worse:

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