Mutating methods

2004-03-10 Thread Juerd
mutating operators. Please excuse me if this or something like this has already been taken care of - I've searched for messages about it, but haven't found anything. Regards, Juerd

z ip

2004-03-21 Thread Juerd
that zips. Regards, Juerd

Re: z ip

2004-03-21 Thread Juerd
symbol for this to mean something else. Even if it weren't, it would still be too similar. Juerd

Re: Dereferencing Syntax (Was: Outer product considered useful)

2004-03-26 Thread Juerd
that. Has this Csay already been decided? Juerd

Re: z ip

2004-03-29 Thread Juerd
programmers; why should programmers of languages that aren't even Perl be treated differently? Juerd

lists and arrays

2004-04-09 Thread Juerd
? What is a list? Regards, Juerd

Re: Compatibility with perl 5

2004-04-13 Thread Juerd
? use 5; no 6; It could be a special case: not throwing a fatal exception, but instead changing the grammar to a Perl 5 compatible one. Juerd

backticks

2004-04-14 Thread Juerd
key to readpipe if you can use it for hashes instead. I think %hash`key makes sense. But I'd like to find out if more people like this idea. Juerd

Re: backticks

2004-04-14 Thread Juerd
can be used. Juerd

Re: backticks

2004-04-14 Thread Juerd
Jonathan Scott Duff skribis 2004-04-14 14:21 (-0500): On Wed, Apr 14, 2004 at 12:07:18PM -0700, chromatic wrote: On Wed, 2004-04-14 at 05:18, Juerd wrote: I think %hash`key makes sense. But I'd like to find out if more people like this idea. How do you request a hash slice

Re: backticks

2004-04-14 Thread Juerd
with that. Even beginners. Juerd

Re: backticks

2004-04-14 Thread Juerd
John Williams skribis 2004-04-14 13:36 (-0600): On Wed, 14 Apr 2004, Juerd wrote: I propose to use ` as a simple hash subscriptor, as an alternative to {} and . It would only be useable for \w+ keys or perhaps -?\w+. As with methods, a simple atomic (term exists only in perlreftut, afaix

Re: backticks

2004-04-14 Thread Juerd
to use the easier syntax when my hash does in fact have a key 'keys'. Juerd

Re: backticks

2004-04-14 Thread Juerd
coder will be surprised when seeing Perl 6 in action. And that is a good thing. Juerd

Re: backticks

2004-04-14 Thread Juerd
Randal L. Schwartz skribis 2004-04-14 13:56 (-0700): Juerd == Juerd [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Juerd readpipe/qx/`` isn't used much. In all my @INC, only a handful of uses Juerd can be found. Most are in Debian's modules. That's because they aren't particularly interesting in modules

Re: backticks

2004-04-15 Thread Juerd
of whether it is possible. I know it is possible. Either by changing the grammar or perhaps by adding an operator/macro. And as explained in multiple messages already, implementing this using the . has too large drawbacks. Juerd

Re: backticks

2004-04-15 Thread Juerd
of the entire 'problem' that this thread addresses. No, it only was an extra motivation. Juerd

Re: backticks

2004-04-15 Thread Juerd
: $(...) It's just one keyword and a set of quotes more: $( readpipe pwd ) Juerd

Re: backticks

2004-04-15 Thread Juerd
Aaron Sherman skribis 2004-04-15 14:29 (-0400): On Wed, 2004-04-14 at 16:56, Juerd wrote: How many of those backticks Note, those weren't backticks, those were programs. There were 123 PROGRAMS that used backticks or equivalent syntax. I said backticks, and I meant backticks. I'm not sure

Re: backticks

2004-04-15 Thread Juerd
methods are added. Option two: keys get precedence Would have to delay everything until runtime. No, if we want a simple and lean operator for this, it must not be one that in the same context also has another function. Juerd

Re: backticks

2004-04-15 Thread Juerd
as that in normal use always follows whitespace or at least interpunction. On the grounds that personally I hate the backtick :-) ... Juerd

Re: backticks

2004-04-15 Thread Juerd
glyph. (And because of its location on most keyboards.) Juerd

Re: backticks

2004-04-15 Thread Juerd
, that's better spelt as $obj.keyval. Sometimes an object is overkill. I'd say: most of the time. Juerd

Re: backticks

2004-04-15 Thread Juerd
Austin Hastings skribis 2004-04-15 18:38 (-0400): $foo % bar % is 4 keys: space, shift, 5, space. Too much, IMHO. Typability and readability are both VERY important. Juerd

Re: backticks

2004-04-16 Thread Juerd
no suggestion for this operator's name, although if you wanted to rip out the current unary backticks, it could be a candidate: %hash{`key}. Same as 3, but with another character. Juerd

Re: backticks

2004-04-16 Thread Juerd
Austin Hastings skribis 2004-04-15 19:37 (-0400): I'm sure that if Juerd or someone were to write a PublicHash class, they would cleverly reverse the access so that some collision-unlikely path would get the methods. I'm sure I have explained several times already why I think using

Re: backticks

2004-04-16 Thread Juerd
Sean O'Rourke skribis 2004-04-15 8:55 (-0700): [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Juerd) writes: I think it has to go because `pwd`, `hostname`, `wget -O - $url` should not be easier than the purer Perl equivalents and because ``'s interpolation does more harm than good. I have to disagree with you here

Re: backticks

2004-04-16 Thread Juerd
we really need is one way with a good enough syntax to meet all of our needs. Or three syntaxes of which you can choose, depending on what you mean and like to write. I thought Perl minded people were used to TIMTOWTDI, but I'm proven wrong once again. Juerd

Re: backticks

2004-04-16 Thread Juerd
David Wheeler skribis 2004-04-16 9:58 (-0700): for @thingies, qw(blue yellow) xx Inf - $thingy, $class { print qq[tr class=$classtd$thingy/td/tr\n; } I think that $class would be Cundef after the second record in @thingies, unfortunately. Even with the xx Inf? Why? Juerd

Re: backticks

2004-04-16 Thread Juerd
`bar. Juerd

Re: backticks

2004-04-16 Thread Juerd
this? for @thingies, qw(blue yellow) xx Inf - $thingy, $class { print qq[tr class=$classtd$thingy/td/tr\n; } Juerd

Re: backticks

2004-04-16 Thread Juerd
Larry Wall skribis 2004-04-16 11:50 (-0700): On Fri, Apr 16, 2004 at 07:12:44PM +0200, Juerd wrote: : Except for the shocking number of closed-minded people on this list. You seem to be one of them. From my point of view, you've had your ego plastered all over this proposal from the start

Re: backticks

2004-04-16 Thread Juerd
} $foo or print; And there are many more examples in Perl. I personally like having two ways to write exactly the same thing. If the two ways are very different and one is because of that much easier than the other, I like having the alternative even more. Juerd

Re: backticks

2004-04-16 Thread Juerd
, as %hash`key would then just be %hash{`key}, but without the curlies. And :fooa and :foo`a would be :foo(a) and :foo(`a) without the parens. But I also like to think that // is m// with implicit m, instead of the other way around. Juerd

Re: backticks

2004-04-17 Thread Juerd
John Williams skribis 2004-04-16 18:32 (-0600): You didn't answer his question, which is less complicated? Wasn't that a rhetociral question? Juerd

Re: backticks

2004-04-17 Thread Juerd
-minded. Instead of asking me to stop interpreting disagreement as close-mindedness, ask yourself to stop interpreting closed-minded as disagreeing. There is no 'between the lines' in my messages. Stop looking for it. Juerd

Re: Is Dog|undef a legal type?

2004-04-19 Thread Juerd
Abhijit A. Mahabal skribis 2004-04-19 11:00 (-0500): when Dog: ... when Array: ... Shouldn't that be: when Dog { ... } when Array { ... } Or is there some .when that I have not yet heard of? Juerd

Re: A12: default accessors and encapsulation

2004-04-19 Thread Juerd
not? Juerd

Re: backticks (or slash, maybe)

2004-04-19 Thread Juerd
by something extremely important. for /home/angel - $file { That would mean giving up // for regexes (i.e. making the m mandatory). And I think having quotes for strings other than very simple ones (anything containing a / is not a simple string imho) is good for readability. Juerd

Re: backticks (or slash, maybe)

2004-04-19 Thread Juerd
is a hash slice. I don't understand. Could you give some examples? Is this in the context of bare /path/to/foo, even? Juerd

Re: backticks (or slash, maybe)

2004-04-19 Thread Juerd
except \0 and /). Juerd

Re: backticks

2004-04-20 Thread Juerd
that it's special syntax, which makes it recognisable. Still, your idea is doable. Juerd

Re: A12: default accessors and encapsulation

2004-04-20 Thread Juerd
this be written as: method buffersize { +$.buffer.bytes } will store { my $sqrt = $^v.sqrt; ... } Or does will store BLOCK really have to go before the main block? Juerd

Re: A12: a doubt about .meta, .dispatcher and final methods

2004-04-23 Thread Juerd
for important things in the core language. On the sixth hand, by that argument, since .dispatcher is aiming at a Class, it should be an uppercase C. :-) Doesn't unicode have that, then? :) Juerd

Re: A12: Typed undef

2004-04-23 Thread Juerd
then? Or maybe just my $spot := Dog? This is, as pointed out, just sugar for Dog::new and Dog::list_breeds, but it brings up the spectre of undef invocants: :: or .? I'm confused. $c-foo-bar-baz; # If foo or bar fails, what happens? - or .? Even more confused now. Juerd

Re: C style conditional statements

2004-05-12 Thread Juerd
like this better: for { s:g/\w+/WORD/; print; } But I think I still want to have some non-mutating version of s/// that returns the modified string, so that you can just write something like print s:gx/\w+/WORD/ for ; Juerd

$foo.s/foo/bar/

2004-05-12 Thread Juerd
Juerd skribis 2004-05-12 20:15 (+0200): But I think I still want to have some non-mutating version of s/// that returns the modified string, so that you can just write something like print s:gx/\w+/WORD/ for ; Actually, can't we just use the . for s///? You'd then use $foo.s/// to get

Re: C style conditional statements

2004-05-12 Thread Juerd
Larry Wall skribis 2004-05-12 11:39 (-0700): On Wed, May 12, 2004 at 08:15:36PM +0200, Juerd wrote: : A2 says $*STDIN and $*STDOUT. Has this been changed? It's $*IN and $*OUT. I like this change! : I'd hate to have to specify stdin and stdout in throw away scripts. Just because there's

Re: C style conditional statements

2004-05-12 Thread Juerd
= new IO::Socket::INET :LocalPort 20010 :Listen 5; But unfortunately, parens are not optional with :pairs. Juerd [1] Because I'd use something like that in other contexts. I expect that I will not use indirect object syntax even in Perl 6 and will in reality write: my $n = IO::Socket::INET.new

Re: Yadda yadda yadda some more

2004-05-12 Thread Juerd
Aaron Sherman skribis 2004-05-12 17:30 (-0400): I like C... I like it a LOT. In fact, I'm partial to the idea that it should be usable anywhere I agree. It'd make even more of my pseudo code (#perlhelp and perlmonks.org) valid syntax :). Juerd

Re: Compatibility with perl 5

2004-04-26 Thread Juerd
. #!/usr/bin/perl = #!/usr/bin/perl =6 Feels like something is missing. Like a LHS. I like - for command line switches. Juerd

Re: Required Named Params and go write your own grammar

2004-05-04 Thread Juerd
them as positional ones? Don't document the feature and you'll effectively have required named parameters. Or am I missing something? the entire P6 grammar Are parts already available in Perl 6 rule syntax? Juerd

Re: RFC eq and ==

2004-05-17 Thread Juerd
of attractive to me, because it's a bit like lc $a eq lc $b Juerd

Re: idiom for filling a counting hash

2004-05-18 Thread Juerd
. But again, just having a method for that is probably a better idea (if only because with the hash, the original order is lost). Juerd

Re: idiom for filling a counting hash

2004-05-18 Thread Juerd
{ my %foo; $_++ for @[EMAIL PROTECTED]; } }' Rate a b a 51121/s -- -9% b 56220/s 10% -- Juerd

Re: idiom for filling a counting hash

2004-05-19 Thread Juerd
, '9' = 2, '12' = 1, '14' = 1, '15' = 1, '8' = 2, '4' = 2, '10' = 2, '5' = 2 }; This is perl, v5.8.4 built for i386-linux-thread-multi Juerd

Re: FW: Periodic Table of the Operators

2004-06-08 Thread Juerd
can afford to download it each time you start it: http://startputty.com/ - if you trust them. Juerd

Re: cmd line like switches for functions and operators.

2004-06-22 Thread Juerd
Juerd

Re: cmd line like switches for functions and operators.

2004-06-23 Thread Juerd
: *foo.wrap sub (*foo.signature, +$new_thingy) { # or whatever syntax ... call; } Or is the original signature not usable, and does one need to consult the manual/source and copy it? Juerd

Re: definitions of truth

2004-06-24 Thread Juerd
-ish: a keyword that always returns the same value). Juerd

Re: definitions of truth

2004-06-24 Thread Juerd
one? Please don't say that picking a random sequence of at least 5 different unicode dingbats will be the best way to be sure :) Juerd

Re: definitions of truth

2004-06-24 Thread Juerd
something that does .isa('Str') ? .chars : .isa('str') ? .bytes : .isa('Hash') ? .keys : .isa('Array') ? .elements : 1. Synopsis 6 describes 'str' as 'native string'. Is my assumption that such a string is one that doesn't have multi-byte characters correct? Juerd

Re: definitions of truth

2004-06-24 Thread Juerd
understand it correctly. It's been a while since I had a feeling of understanding Perl 6 :) Is this complexity really needed? Juerd

Re: definitions of truth

2004-06-24 Thread Juerd
Austin Hastings skribis 2004-06-24 15:54 (-0700): I'd say yeah, it is. 0-but-true is pretty nice to have. (Finally the system calls can return something other than -1.) That we already have. 0 but true. (perldoc -f fcntl) It's 1 but false that's really special :) Juerd

Re: definitions of truth

2004-06-25 Thread Juerd
, but try to appreciate what Perl 5 can do. It's not a stupid, old language now that Perl 6 is being designed. It is still the powerful programming language with lots of quirks and handy exceptions. Juerd

Re: more than one modifier

2004-06-25 Thread Juerd
statement modifier, as if is just a fancy and (or vice versa): $a and $b and print $a + $b for 1..3; Juerd

Re: more than one modifier

2004-06-25 Thread Juerd
as: say .{foo} for @@foo; # Looks strange. Is this correct? Juerd

Re: The .bytes/.codepoints/.graphemes methods

2004-06-28 Thread Juerd
Dave Whipp skribis 2004-06-28 9:55 (-0700): substr($string, 2 bytes, 4 bytes) = $substitute; substr($string, 2, 4 :bytes) substr($string, 2 but graphemes, 4 but bytes); I think but even makes sense, if substr defaults to something. Juerd

Re: undo()?

2004-06-29 Thread Juerd
Mark A. Biggar skribis 2004-06-29 9:07 (-0700): Besides we already have MTOWTDI with local() and hypotheticals. I thought temp replaced local. If not, how do they differ? (is temp for lexicals, local for globals (and why would that make sense?)) Juerd

Re: The .bytes/.codepoints/.graphemes methods

2004-07-01 Thread Juerd
hope, has a default itself. (I like default defaults...) Juerd

Re: if not C, then what?

2004-07-01 Thread Juerd
Scott Bronson skribis 2004-07-01 12:42 (-0700): But C; requires a surrounding do block, as you noted. Then invent a horizontal ; operator that does not :) pray_to $_ then sacrifice $virgin for @evil_gods pray_to $_ ., then sacrifice $virgin for @evil_gods; Juerd

Re: if not C, then what?

2004-07-01 Thread Juerd
;. See: ., If you turn your head 90 degrees counter clockwise, you see the horizontal semicolon and even a smiley face :) Juerd

Re: if not C, then what?

2004-07-01 Thread Juerd
Scott Bronson skribis 2004-07-01 14:11 (-0700): On Thu, 2004-07-01 at 13:35, Juerd wrote: pray_to $_ ., then sacrifice $virgin for @evil_gods; I meant it without then, but apparently forgot to remove it. pray to $_ ., sacrifice $virgin for @evil_gods; Ha! I love it. Good source code

Re: if not C, then what?

2004-07-03 Thread Juerd
programs probably only be used through infix:Y or infix:z, which I will define myself if necessary. (zip() is not infix and thus not an *equivalent* alternative.) Juerd

Re: scalar subscripting

2004-07-08 Thread Juerd
subscripting. Accessing strings as if they are arrays was discussed recently. Please read the archives. (groups.google.com is my favourite interface) Juerd

Re: if not C, then what?

2004-07-09 Thread Juerd
then as an infix operator is the way to go, if comma really won't allow us to write this. then as a method my brain won't grok. Juerd

Re: if not C, then what?

2004-07-09 Thread Juerd
abusing things that normally mean something else. Juerd

Re: enhanced open-funktion

2004-07-13 Thread Juerd
mode and filename in one argument. Ever since I read about the new :pairs, I thought that would imply :rw instead of . Juerd

Re: Cartesian products? [Especially wrt iterations]

2004-07-13 Thread Juerd
Luke Palmer skribis 2004-07-13 10:28 (-0600): for outer(1..3, 4..6) - $x, $y { say $x,$y; } 1,4 1,5 1,6 2,4 2,5 2,6 3,4 3,5 3,6 So outer is somewhat like {} in shell globs? perl -le'print for glob {1,2,3},{4,5,6}' Juerd

Re: enhanced open-funktion

2004-07-13 Thread Juerd
with :append and :clobber. Juerd

Re: enhanced open-funktion

2004-07-15 Thread Juerd
; } No, translations don't work in programming. 3. They play nice with possible extensions 'open :utf8, $file; But open :w('utf8'), $file; it would even make using different layers for in and output easy: open :r('iso-8859-15') :w('utf8'), $file; although you shouldn't want that :) Juerd

Re: enhanced open-funktion

2004-07-15 Thread Juerd
# single-letter modifiers open FH, /usr/bin/foo|; open :w :p, ...; And open2 is :r :w :p or :rwp or :read :write :pipe. Or something like that. Juerd

Re: enhanced open-funktion

2004-07-15 Thread Juerd
$ ls -R * |: usr |/usr: bin |/usr/bin: foo Juerd

push @bar, .splice;

2004-07-17 Thread Juerd
If an array element knows that it is an array element, this can be useful: for @foo { push @bar, .splice if EXPR } Juerd

Re: push @bar, .splice;

2004-07-17 Thread Juerd
Dave Mitchell skribis 2004-07-17 18:24 (+0100): On Sat, Jul 17, 2004 at 06:53:28PM +0200, Juerd wrote: If an array element knows that it is an array element, this can be useful: for @foo { push @bar, .splice if EXPR } What happens if the element is an element of more than one array

:)

2004-07-17 Thread Juerd
Do we have a :) operator yet? Juerd

Re: This week's summary

2004-07-20 Thread Juerd
«bar». James Mastros pointed out that . is rather ambiguous in a literal string; sometimes a full stop is just a full stop. My preference is $file\.ext. Clear, light and ascii. Juerd

Re: String interpolation

2004-07-21 Thread Juerd
], but not @foo is not simple. In fact, with {}, is anything more than $foo and {} needed? Is $foo needed, even (I'd like to have it, because I dislike brackets everywhere)? Juerd

Re: String interpolation

2004-07-22 Thread Juerd
and probably harder to parse. Why fix this with regexes and then reintroduce it in interpolation? Juerd

Re: String interpolation

2004-07-22 Thread Juerd
string, the rest of that string becomes bizarrely unreadable. Juerd

Re: Precedence table update

2004-08-18 Thread Juerd
operators in this terminal and have it dwym.) Juerd

Re: Return with no expression

2004-08-19 Thread Juerd
workforme. Juerd

- as - with automatic is rw

2004-08-20 Thread Juerd
for zip(@foos, @bars, @xyzzies) - $foo is rw, $bar is rw, $xyzzy is rw { ... } for %quux.kv - $key is rw, $value is rw { ... } Comments, anyone? Juerd

Re: A thought for later -- POD tables

2004-08-21 Thread Juerd
tdttCodelt;$gt;/tt/td tdttscalar sub truth/tt/td tdttmatch if $x($_)/tt/td /tr !-- ... -- /table I haven't thought of a solution for non-verbatim cells yet. I'm not convinced that they are needed. Juerd

Re: - as - with automatic is rw

2004-08-21 Thread Juerd
being the other's specialized form. It's really sick Sick would be if - were introduced to make the variable write-only ;) W R @foos - $foo @foos - $foo @foos - $foo It would be consistent, though... Juerd

Re: Instantiation

2004-08-23 Thread Juerd
something must be added to tell it *when* to load modules: at runtime or during compilation. It shouldn't be hard to implement this module yourself, should it not go into the standard distribution. Juerd

Re: Progressively Overhauling Documentation

2004-08-23 Thread Juerd
also please me. Especially if we can get {b:foo} instead of Bfoo. But I haven't really given this much thought. That's why I haven't proposed it yet. But since POD is a hot topic now anyway, let's see what everyone thinks about this. Juerd

Re: Progressively Overhauling Documentation

2004-08-23 Thread Juerd
; .mouth.close $strength; } } Juerd

Re: Progressively Overhauling Documentation

2004-08-23 Thread Juerd
Thalhammer, Jeffrey BGI SF skribis 2004-08-23 12:03 (-0700): unsubscribe It doesn't work that way. If I'm not mistaken, unsubscribing is done by sending mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]. Also, you might want to consider using a sane e-mail program and some training in quoting :) Juerd

Re: Return with no expression

2004-08-23 Thread Juerd
for different things in different places, I suspect. Where :: (in a module name) can be used, an operator could have been used. How is $foo??Bar::Baz::Quux parsed? I hope it's an error, although some people aren't going to like mandatory whitespace around an already rather fat operator. Juerd

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