[HACKERS] Debug crash

2008-12-11 Thread Alif Isophoqote
Hi, I am developing a backend module for postgresql. For some queries, postgresql crashes: segmentation fault (most probably due to my own code). How to get the function name line number where it crashes? isophoqote

Re: [HACKERS] Debug crash

2008-12-11 Thread Martijn van Oosterhout
On Thu, Dec 11, 2008 at 04:29:56PM +0800, Alif Isophoqote wrote: Hi, I am developing a backend module for postgresql. For some queries, postgresql crashes: segmentation fault (most probably due to my own code). How to get the function name line number where it crashes? Arrange for a core

Re: [HACKERS] Debug crash

2008-12-11 Thread Zdenek Kotala
Alif Isophoqote napsal(a): Hi, I am developing a backend module for postgresql. For some queries, postgresql crashes: segmentation fault (most probably due to my own code). How to get the function name line number where it crashes? At first it depends on your OS. On unixes you should get

Re: [HACKERS] Sync Rep: First Thoughts on Code

2008-12-11 Thread Simon Riggs
On Thu, 2008-12-11 at 09:44 +0200, Heikki Linnakangas wrote: Simon Riggs wrote: When the WAL starts streaming the *primary* can immediately perform synchronous replication, i.e. commit waits for transfer. Until the standby has obtained all the missing log files, it's not up-to-date,

Re: [HACKERS] WIP: default values for function parameters

2008-12-11 Thread Pavel Stehule
2008/12/10 Pavel Stehule [EMAIL PROTECTED]: 2008/12/10 Tom Lane [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Pavel Stehule [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: next argument - if we accept AS for param names, then we introduce nonconsistent behave with SQL/XML functions. select xmlforest(c1, c2 as foo, c3) -- there foo isn't

Re: [HACKERS] Sync Rep: First Thoughts on Code

2008-12-11 Thread Heikki Linnakangas
Simon Riggs wrote: On Thu, 2008-12-11 at 09:44 +0200, Heikki Linnakangas wrote: Simon Riggs wrote: When the WAL starts streaming the *primary* can immediately perform synchronous replication, i.e. commit waits for transfer. Until the standby has obtained all the missing log files, it's not

[HACKERS] COCOMO Indians

2008-12-11 Thread Dmitry Turin
Hi, Pgsql-hackers. We would like to obtain your opinion on these two questions: 1) We wanna append possibilities into Postgres engine, and wanna get top estimation for size of code, cost and time of implementation. 1.1) We divide possibilities to elementary features, find analogues in already

[HACKERS] COCOMO Indians

2008-12-11 Thread Dmitry Turin
Hi, Pgsql-hackers. We would like to obtain your opinion on these two questions: 1) We wanna append possibilities into Postgres engine, and wanna get top estimation for size of code, cost and time of implementation. 1.1) We divide possibilities to elementary features, find analogues in already

Re: [HACKERS] Sync Rep: First Thoughts on Code

2008-12-11 Thread Simon Riggs
On Thu, 2008-12-11 at 11:29 +0200, Heikki Linnakangas wrote: Simon Riggs wrote: On Thu, 2008-12-11 at 09:44 +0200, Heikki Linnakangas wrote: Simon Riggs wrote: When the WAL starts streaming the *primary* can immediately perform synchronous replication, i.e. commit waits for transfer.

Re: [HACKERS] Sync Rep: First Thoughts on Code

2008-12-11 Thread Fujii Masao
Hi, On Thu, Dec 11, 2008 at 7:09 PM, Simon Riggs [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Recent changes I have requested in the architecture are: * making archiving optional on primary, so we don't need to send WAL data *twice*. Agreed. I'm not so much worried about the bandwidth, but it's a lot of

Re: [HACKERS] Sync Rep: First Thoughts on Code

2008-12-11 Thread Fujii Masao
Hi, On Thu, Dec 11, 2008 at 7:09 PM, Simon Riggs [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Thu, 2008-12-11 at 11:29 +0200, Heikki Linnakangas wrote: Simon Riggs wrote: On Thu, 2008-12-11 at 09:44 +0200, Heikki Linnakangas wrote: Simon Riggs wrote: When the WAL starts streaming the *primary* can

Re: [HACKERS] Sync Rep: First Thoughts on Code

2008-12-11 Thread Simon Riggs
On Wed, 2008-12-10 at 15:06 -0500, Aidan Van Dyk wrote: Call me think, but I'm confused... In sync rep, there *can't be* any catchign up do do... i.e. if the slave isn't accepting the WAL the master stops doing *anything*... In normal/steady state, yes, you are correct. But there is more...

Re: [HACKERS] Updates of SE-PostgreSQL 8.4devel patches (r1268)

2008-12-11 Thread KaiGai Kohei
Bruce Momjian wrote: Bruce Momjian wrote: KaiGai Kohei wrote: CREATE TABLE t ( a int, b text ) WITH (ROW_LEVEL_ACL=ON); Let me outline the simplest API, assuming we are using table-level granularity for the security columns. CREATE TABLE would support WITH

Re: [HACKERS] COCOMO Indians

2008-12-11 Thread Jonah H. Harris
On Thu, Dec 11, 2008 at 4:43 AM, Dmitry Turin [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: We would like to obtain your opinion on these two questions: This is the wrong place to do it. 2) We are captivated by price of Indians, we listened much about low quality of code, written by Indians, we are fearing, that

Re: [HACKERS] Sync Rep: First Thoughts on Code

2008-12-11 Thread Simon Riggs
On Thu, 2008-12-11 at 19:19 +0900, Fujii Masao wrote: All I've asked for is the ability to turn on and turn back on archiving, yes, with synchronisation so its safe. (snip) OK, I will add such archiving feature. My new design of archiving is as follows. Primary -- I extend

Re: [HACKERS] visibility maps

2008-12-11 Thread Zdenek Kotala
Heikki Linnakangas napsal(a): Pavan Deolasee wrote: /* * We don't need to lock the page, as we're only looking at a single bit. */ result = (map[mapByte] (1 mapBit)) ? true : false; Isn't this a dangerous assumption to make ? I am not so sure that even a bit can be read

[HACKERS] Refactoring SearchSysCache + HeapTupleIsValid

2008-12-11 Thread Peter Eisentraut
Our code contains about 200 copies of the following code: tuple = SearchSysCache[Copy](FOOOID, ObjectIdGetDatum(fooid), 0, 0, 0); if (!HeapTupleIsValid(tuple)) elog(ERROR, cache lookup failed for foo %u, fooid); This only counts elog() calls, not user-facing error messages constructed with

Re: [HACKERS] COCOMO Indians

2008-12-11 Thread Sreejesh O S
On Thu, Dec 11, 2008 at 3:13 PM, Dmitry Turin [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi, Pgsql-hackers. We would like to obtain your opinion on these two questions: 1) We wanna append possibilities into Postgres engine, and wanna get top estimation for size of code, cost and time of implementation.

Re: [HACKERS] COCOMO Indians

2008-12-11 Thread Ibrar Ahmed
Do we really need this kind of discussion here? On Thu, Dec 11, 2008 at 4:43 PM, Sreejesh O S [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Thu, Dec 11, 2008 at 3:13 PM, Dmitry Turin [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi, Pgsql-hackers. We would like to obtain your opinion on these two questions: 1) We wanna

Re: [HACKERS] COCOMO Indians

2008-12-11 Thread Sreejesh O S
On Thu, Dec 11, 2008 at 5:24 PM, Ibrar Ahmed [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Do we really need this kind of discussion here? Dont know. But the post would have contained more specific matters. On Thu, Dec 11, 2008 at 4:43 PM, Sreejesh O S [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Thu, Dec 11, 2008 at

Re: [HACKERS] COCOMO Indians

2008-12-11 Thread Dmitry Turin
Hi, Jonah and Ibrar. This is the wrong place to do it. Seggest other place. 2) We are captivated by price of Indians, we listened much about low quality of code, written by Indians, we are fearing, that American company will resale implementation to Indian subcontractor (i.e. real

Re: [HACKERS] COCOMO Indians

2008-12-11 Thread Robert Haas
This is the wrong place to do it. Seggest other place. No. This topic is off-topic for the mailing list. When someone brings up an issue that is off-topic, it is not our job to find them another place to discuss it. ...Robert -- Sent via pgsql-hackers mailing list

Re: [HACKERS] COCOMO Indians

2008-12-11 Thread Dmitry Turin
Hi, Robert. This is the wrong place to do it. Seggest other place. This topic is off-topic for the mailing list. I feel strong desire to recall you, that Pg has no concreate instructions till now how to hire for appending features into engine. And of cource, there is no usefull

[HACKERS] plpgsql: numeric assignment to an integer variable errors out

2008-12-11 Thread Nikhil Sontakke
The following plpgsql function errors out with cvs head: CREATE function test_assign() returns void AS $$ declare x int; BEGIN x := 9E3/2; END $$ LANGUAGE 'plpgsql'; postgres=# select test_assign(); ERROR: invalid input syntax for integer: 4500. CONTEXT: PL/pgSQL function

Re: [HACKERS] COCOMO Indians

2008-12-11 Thread Pavel Stehule
Hello Dmitry, you are really on wrong place. You have to accept, so your proposals are not interesting for this community. Because PostgreSQL is under BSD licence, you can do own project based on PostgreSQL source code. There you can test all your ideas - it should not be first similar project -

Re: [HACKERS] COCOMO Indians

2008-12-11 Thread Dmitry Turin
Hi, Pavel. you have to show some real product, real project Money will not be confirmed, until size of it will be known. No IT solution can be confirmed or not, but business solution. Budget for implementation is part of business solution. Dmitry (SQL50, HTML60) -- Sent via

Re: [HACKERS] visibility maps

2008-12-11 Thread Pavan Deolasee
On Thu, Dec 11, 2008 at 5:01 PM, Zdenek Kotala [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: IIRC, Memory reading/writing is atomic operation. Only one CPU(hw thread) can access to the same memory address(es)* in same time*. The question is how compiler compile C code to assembler. But this code seems to me

Re: [HACKERS] Refactoring SearchSysCache + HeapTupleIsValid

2008-12-11 Thread Tom Lane
Peter Eisentraut [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Our code contains about 200 copies of the following code: tuple = SearchSysCache[Copy](FOOOID, ObjectIdGetDatum(fooid), 0, 0, 0); if (!HeapTupleIsValid(tuple)) elog(ERROR, cache lookup failed for foo %u, fooid); ... Shouldn't we try to refactor

Re: [HACKERS] visibility maps

2008-12-11 Thread Zdenek Kotala
Pavan Deolasee napsal(a): On Thu, Dec 11, 2008 at 5:01 PM, Zdenek Kotala [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: IIRC, Memory reading/writing is atomic operation. Only one CPU(hw thread) can access to the same memory address(es)* in same time*. The question is how compiler compile C code to assembler. But

Re: [HACKERS] visibility maps

2008-12-11 Thread Pavan Deolasee
On Thu, Dec 11, 2008 at 7:03 PM, Zdenek Kotala [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Yes, because it is not simple write operation. You need to read byte from memory to register, set bit and write it back. Write memory itself is atomic but somebody could change other bits between read and write. Yeah,

Re: [HACKERS] Refactoring SearchSysCache + HeapTupleIsValid

2008-12-11 Thread Alvaro Herrera
Tom Lane wrote: If we could just move the error into SearchSysCache it might be worth doing, but I think there are callers that need the flexibility to not fail. Pass a boolean flag? -- Alvaro Herrerahttp://www.CommandPrompt.com/ PostgreSQL Replication,

Re: [HACKERS] visibility maps

2008-12-11 Thread Heikki Linnakangas
Pavan Deolasee wrote: On Thu, Dec 11, 2008 at 5:01 PM, Zdenek Kotala [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: IIRC, Memory reading/writing is atomic operation. Only one CPU(hw thread) can access to the same memory address(es)* in same time*. The question is how compiler compile C code to assembler. But this

Re: [HACKERS] visibility maps

2008-12-11 Thread Pavan Deolasee
On Thu, Dec 11, 2008 at 7:15 PM, Heikki Linnakangas [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Yeah, if we accept that bits can be bogusly set. There is scenarios where that can happen already, but they involve crashing, not during normal operation and clean shut down. In the future, I'd like to move in the

Re: [HACKERS] COCOMO Indians

2008-12-11 Thread Pavel Stehule
2008/12/11 Dmitry Turin [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Hi, Pavel. you have to show some real product, real project Money will not be confirmed, until size of it will be known. No IT solution can be confirmed or not, but business solution. Budget for implementation is part of business solution. I

Re: [HACKERS] visibility maps

2008-12-11 Thread Tom Lane
Pavan Deolasee [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: On Thu, Dec 11, 2008 at 5:01 PM, Zdenek Kotala [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: IIRC, Memory reading/writing is atomic operation. Only one CPU(hw thread) can access to the same memory address(es)* in same time*. The question is how compiler compile C code to

Re: [HACKERS] Sync Rep: First Thoughts on Code

2008-12-11 Thread Aidan Van Dyk
* Simon Riggs [EMAIL PROTECTED] [081211 05:45]: On Wed, 2008-12-10 at 15:06 -0500, Aidan Van Dyk wrote: Call me think, but I'm confused... In sync rep, there *can't be* any catchign up do do... i.e. if the slave isn't accepting the WAL the master stops doing *anything*... In

Re: [HACKERS] COCOMO Indians

2008-12-11 Thread Dmitry Turin
Hi, Pavel. Money will not be confirmed, until size of it will be known. I though some different, First you have to show real code show read code before hiring develop process is based I'm not intersting process of development in pgsql-hackers@postgresql.org now - i'm interesting method to

Re: [HACKERS] Sync Rep: First Thoughts on Code

2008-12-11 Thread Aidan Van Dyk
* Fujii Masao [EMAIL PROTECTED] [081211 05:25]: - standalone The primary doesn't archive the WAL only during replication. If replication is not in progress, the primary archives the WAL. That is, the primary switches the modes whenever replication starts / ends. That scares the

[HACKERS] Re[2+]: COCOMO Indians

2008-12-11 Thread Dmitry Turin
Hi, Pavel. Let me replace We by Somebody for your comprehension. Money will not be confirmed, until size of it will be known. I though some different, First you have to show real code show read code before hiring develop process is based I'm not intersting process of development in

Re: [HACKERS] Updates of SE-PostgreSQL 8.4devel patches (r1268)

2008-12-11 Thread Bruce Momjian
KaiGai Kohei wrote: Bruce Momjian wrote: Bruce Momjian wrote: KaiGai Kohei wrote: CREATE TABLE t ( a int, b text ) WITH (ROW_LEVEL_ACL=ON); Let me outline the simplest API, assuming we are using table-level granularity for the security columns.

Re: [HACKERS] visibility maps

2008-12-11 Thread Heikki Linnakangas
Pavan Deolasee wrote: On Thu, Dec 11, 2008 at 7:15 PM, Heikki Linnakangas [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Do we have any tests to prove that the VM page lock does not indeed become a bottleneck ? No. I can do some if we don't have already. Oh, yes please! Only the first update to a page needs

Re: [HACKERS] WIP: default values for function parameters

2008-12-11 Thread Bruce Momjian
Pavel Stehule wrote: 2008/12/10 Pavel Stehule [EMAIL PROTECTED]: 2008/12/10 Tom Lane [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Pavel Stehule [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: next argument - if we accept AS for param names, then we introduce nonconsistent behave with SQL/XML functions. select xmlforest(c1, c2 as

Re: [HACKERS] WIP: default values for function parameters

2008-12-11 Thread Tom Lane
Pavel Stehule [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: what do you thing about? select fce(p1,p2,p3, SET paramname1 = val, paramname2 = val) I'm not really seeing any redeeming social value in that. It's more keystrokes than the other; and if you dislike AS because of possible confusion with other usages

Re: [HACKERS] Sync Rep: First Thoughts on Code

2008-12-11 Thread Simon Riggs
On Thu, 2008-12-11 at 09:27 -0500, Aidan Van Dyk wrote: But catchup *has* to be *done* before PostgreSQL can enter sync rep. Not true. Please reread the thread where Heikki questions that and I reply. This was Fujii-san's idea, which I now agree with. -- Simon Riggs

Re: [HACKERS] Sync Rep: First Thoughts on Code

2008-12-11 Thread Simon Riggs
On Thu, 2008-12-11 at 09:37 -0500, Aidan Van Dyk wrote: * Fujii Masao [EMAIL PROTECTED] [081211 05:25]: - standalone The primary doesn't archive the WAL only during replication. If replication is not in progress, the primary archives the WAL. That is, the primary switches the

[HACKERS] RE: [HACKERS] Updates of SE-PostgreSQL 8. 4devel patches (r1268)

2008-12-11 Thread Zeugswetter Andreas OSB sIT
Ah, that is a good point, that if we have security column which is usually null then we are requiring the NULL bitmask. Yes, I think that would not be optimal, thus I think WITH SECURITY_CONTEXT is needed. I sure wish others were adding ideas to this discussion. One such idea would be,

Re: [HACKERS] Updates of SE-PostgreSQL 8.4devel patches (r1268)

2008-12-11 Thread Bruce Momjian
Zeugswetter Andreas OSB sIT wrote: Ah, that is a good point, that if we have security column which is usually null then we are requiring the NULL bitmask. Yes, I think that would not be optimal, thus I think WITH SECURITY_CONTEXT is needed. I sure wish others were adding ideas to

Re: [HACKERS] WIP: default values for function parameters

2008-12-11 Thread Kevin Grittner
Tom Lane [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: In any case, I'm not wedded to using AS for this, and am happy to consider other suggestions. But = isn't acceptable. How about using a bare equals sign (or the = characters) for parameter assignment, but require that the parameter name be prefixed with

Re: [HACKERS] Sync Rep: First Thoughts on Code

2008-12-11 Thread Aidan Van Dyk
* Simon Riggs [EMAIL PROTECTED] [081211 10:03]: Sending data twice is not a requirement I ever heard expressed, nor has the lack of ability to send it twice been voiced as a criticism for any form of replication I'm familiar with. Ask the DRBD guys if sending data twice is necessary or

Re: [HACKERS] Updates of SE-PostgreSQL 8.4devel patches (r1268)

2008-12-11 Thread Tom Lane
Bruce Momjian [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Let me outline the simplest API, assuming we are using table-level granularity for the security columns. CREATE TABLE would support WITH (ROWACL = TRUE/FALSE); for row-level acl and: WITH (SECEXT = TRUE/FALSE); for SE-Linux, with 'SECEXTL'

Re: [HACKERS] WIP: default values for function parameters

2008-12-11 Thread Pavel Stehule
2008/12/11 Tom Lane [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Pavel Stehule [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: what do you thing about? select fce(p1,p2,p3, SET paramname1 = val, paramname2 = val) I'm not really seeing any redeeming social value in that. It's more keystrokes than the other; and if you dislike AS because

Re: [HACKERS] Updates of SE-PostgreSQL 8.4devel patches (r1268)

2008-12-11 Thread Tom Lane
KaiGai Kohei [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I have a plan to add a new field (declared as int2 relrowacl) into pg_class to show what column stores its Row-level ACLs. If you want the column to be hidden in the same way that system columns are, I'm afraid this is a pretty bad idea. There are way too

Re: [HACKERS] COCOMO Indians

2008-12-11 Thread Hannu Krosing
On Thu, 2008-12-11 at 15:20 +0200, Dmitry Turin wrote: Hi, Pavel. you have to show some real product, real project Money will not be confirmed, until size of it will be known. No IT solution can be confirmed or not, but business solution. Budget for implementation is part of business

Re: [HACKERS] Sync Rep: First Thoughts on Code

2008-12-11 Thread Aidan Van Dyk
* Heikki Linnakangas [EMAIL PROTECTED] [081211 10:09]: Simon Riggs wrote: On Thu, 2008-12-11 at 09:27 -0500, Aidan Van Dyk wrote: But catchup *has* to be *done* before PostgreSQL can enter sync rep. Not true. Please reread the thread where Heikki questions that and I reply. This was

Re: [HACKERS] WIP: default values for function parameters

2008-12-11 Thread Pavel Stehule
2008/12/11 Kevin Grittner [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Tom Lane [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: In any case, I'm not wedded to using AS for this, and am happy to consider other suggestions. But = isn't acceptable. How about using a bare equals sign (or the = characters) for parameter assignment, but require

Re: [HACKERS] Sync Rep: First Thoughts on Code

2008-12-11 Thread Simon Riggs
On Thu, 2008-12-11 at 17:07 +0200, Heikki Linnakangas wrote: Simon Riggs wrote: On Thu, 2008-12-11 at 09:27 -0500, Aidan Van Dyk wrote: But catchup *has* to be *done* before PostgreSQL can enter sync rep. Not true. Please reread the thread where Heikki questions that and I reply.

Re: [HACKERS] Updates of SE-PostgreSQL 8.4devel patches (r1268)

2008-12-11 Thread KaiGai Kohei
But SE-PostgreSQL does not need its table option to control its availability per table granuality due to its security model. Database ACL is a kind of DAC. It allows resource owners to set up its access rights. In other hand, SE-PostgreSQL is an implementation of MAC. It does not allow

Re: [HACKERS] Updates of SE-PostgreSQL 8.4devel patches (r1268)

2008-12-11 Thread Alvaro Herrera
Bruce Momjian wrote: The idea is that the security columns will hold an OID and the OID will point to a row in a table that contains the security rights/ACL for the column, with multiple rows using the same rights OID. If you change the rights on the column the code has to check the existing

Re: [HACKERS] Function with default value not replacing old definition of the function

2008-12-11 Thread Tom Lane
Pavel Stehule [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: no, it's little bit different Default is only stored parameter value. You created two functions with two different signatures myfunc(int) myfunc(int, int) Yeah, we already bit this bullet with variadic functions --- if you have myfunc(int,

Re: [HACKERS] Sync Rep: First Thoughts on Code

2008-12-11 Thread Heikki Linnakangas
Simon Riggs wrote: On Thu, 2008-12-11 at 09:27 -0500, Aidan Van Dyk wrote: But catchup *has* to be *done* before PostgreSQL can enter sync rep. Not true. Please reread the thread where Heikki questions that and I reply. This was Fujii-san's idea, which I now agree with. I think the

Re: [HACKERS] Updates of SE-PostgreSQL 8.4devel patches (r1268)

2008-12-11 Thread Bruce Momjian
At this point I am so confused I don't have any response. --- KaiGai Kohei wrote: But SE-PostgreSQL does not need its table option to control its availability per table granuality due to its security model. Database

Re: [HACKERS] Updates of SE-PostgreSQL 8.4devel patches (r1268)

2008-12-11 Thread Zeugswetter Andreas OSB sIT
Ah, that is a good point, that if we have security column which is usually null then we are requiring the NULL bitmask. Yes, I think that would not be optimal, thus I think WITH SECURITY_CONTEXT is needed. I sure wish others were adding ideas to this discussion. One

Re: [HACKERS] Updates of SE-PostgreSQL 8.4devel patches (r1268)

2008-12-11 Thread KaiGai Kohei
Bruce Momjian [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Let me outline the simplest API, assuming we are using table-level granularity for the security columns. CREATE TABLE would support WITH (ROWACL = TRUE/FALSE); for row-level acl and: WITH (SECEXT = TRUE/FALSE); for SE-Linux, with 'SECEXTL'

Re: [HACKERS] Updates of SE-PostgreSQL 8.4devel patches (r1268)

2008-12-11 Thread Bruce Momjian
Zeugswetter Andreas OSB sIT wrote: Please reread with above correction, and I'll also try a little differently: Since a pg_security row already represents a combination of rights within selinux, I do not really see why that cannot be extended to a combination of rowacl and selinux rights

Re: [HACKERS] COCOMO Indians

2008-12-11 Thread Pavel Stehule
2008/12/11 Hannu Krosing [EMAIL PROTECTED]: On Thu, 2008-12-11 at 15:20 +0200, Dmitry Turin wrote: Hi, Pavel. you have to show some real product, real project Money will not be confirmed, until size of it will be known. No IT solution can be confirmed or not, but business solution.

Re: [HACKERS] Refactoring SearchSysCache + HeapTupleIsValid

2008-12-11 Thread Peter Eisentraut
On Thursday 11 December 2008 15:28:08 Tom Lane wrote: Peter Eisentraut [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Our code contains about 200 copies of the following code: tuple = SearchSysCache[Copy](FOOOID, ObjectIdGetDatum(fooid), 0, 0, 0); if (!HeapTupleIsValid(tuple)) elog(ERROR, cache lookup

Re: [HACKERS] COCOMO Indians

2008-12-11 Thread Pavel Stehule
2008/12/11 Hannu Krosing [EMAIL PROTECTED]: On Thu, 2008-12-11 at 15:20 +0200, Dmitry Turin wrote: Hi, Pavel. you have to show some real product, real project Money will not be confirmed, until size of it will be known. No IT solution can be confirmed or not, but business solution.

Re: [HACKERS] posix_fadvise v22

2008-12-11 Thread Greg Stark
I'll send another path with at least 1 and 3 fixed and hunt around again for a header file to put this guc into. On 10 Dec 2008, at 04:22, ITAGAKI Takahiro [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hello, Gregory Stark [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Here's an update to eliminate two small bitrot conflicts.

Re: [HACKERS] Updates of SE-PostgreSQL 8.4devel patches (r1268)

2008-12-11 Thread Peter Eisentraut
On Thursday 11 December 2008 04:52:51 Bruce Momjian wrote: We do have a per-row HEAP_HASOID bit, so I wonder if we can have a HEAP_HASSEC bit too.  Right now the HEAP_HASOID is controlled by the CREATE/ALTER table; The current patch add HEAP_HASSECURITY bit to t_infomask. :-) When

Re: [HACKERS] Updates of SE-PostgreSQL 8.4devel patches (r1268)

2008-12-11 Thread KaiGai Kohei
Bruce Momjian wrote: At this point I am so confused I don't have any response. Are you discussing the case when we start a PostgreSQL with $PGDATA generated by different binary? At first, please consider the case when we start SE-PostgreSQL with $PGDATA generated by vanilla binary. (1) In

Re: [HACKERS] Updates of SE-PostgreSQL 8.4devel patches (r1268)

2008-12-11 Thread Peter Eisentraut
On Thursday 11 December 2008 17:43:38 KaiGai Kohei wrote: In addition, I want folks to remind that the Row-level ACLs are not designed based on SQL standards. Thus, I called it one of the enhanced securities. We have a lot of things in our code that are nonstandard, beyond the standard,

Re: [HACKERS] visibility maps

2008-12-11 Thread Pavan Deolasee
On Thu, Dec 11, 2008 at 8:09 PM, Heikki Linnakangas [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I'm not sure if we should set the bits in very aggressively. If we're more aggressive about setting the bits, it also means that we have to clear the bits more often, increasing the likelihood of contention that you

Re: [HACKERS] COCOMO Indians

2008-12-11 Thread Hannu Krosing
On Thu, 2008-12-11 at 16:48 +0100, Pavel Stehule wrote: 2008/12/11 Hannu Krosing [EMAIL PROTECTED]: On Thu, 2008-12-11 at 15:20 +0200, Dmitry Turin wrote: Hi, Pavel. you have to show some real product, real project Money will not be confirmed, until size of it will be known. No

Re: [HACKERS] Updates of SE-PostgreSQL 8.4devel patches (r1268)

2008-12-11 Thread Robert Haas
I think there should be only *one* underlying column and that it should be manipulable by either SQL commands or selinux. Otherwise you're making a lie of the primary argument for having the SQL feature at all. I agree that we're getting pretty far afield from the original proposal, but I

Re: [HACKERS] Updates of SE-PostgreSQL 8.4devel patches (r1268)

2008-12-11 Thread Peter Eisentraut
On Thursday 11 December 2008 17:09:25 Tom Lane wrote: I think there should be only *one* underlying column and that it should be manipulable by either SQL commands or selinux.  Otherwise you're making a lie of the primary argument for having the SQL feature at all. Well, an SQL-manipulated row

Re: [HACKERS] COCOMO Indians

2008-12-11 Thread Pavel Stehule
2008/12/11 Hannu Krosing [EMAIL PROTECTED]: On Thu, 2008-12-11 at 16:48 +0100, Pavel Stehule wrote: 2008/12/11 Hannu Krosing [EMAIL PROTECTED]: On Thu, 2008-12-11 at 15:20 +0200, Dmitry Turin wrote: Hi, Pavel. you have to show some real product, real project Money will not be

Re: [HACKERS] Updates of SE-PostgreSQL 8.4devel patches (r1268)

2008-12-11 Thread KaiGai Kohei
Peter Eisentraut wrote: On Thursday 11 December 2008 17:09:25 Tom Lane wrote: I think there should be only *one* underlying column and that it should be manipulable by either SQL commands or selinux. Otherwise you're making a lie of the primary argument for having the SQL feature at all.

Re: [HACKERS] Updates of SE-PostgreSQL 8.4devel patches (r1268)

2008-12-11 Thread Peter Eisentraut
On Thursday 11 December 2008 17:04:05 Bruce Momjian wrote: The idea is that the security columns will hold an OID and the OID will point to a row in a table that contains the security rights/ACL for the column, with multiple rows using the same rights OID. That sounds somewhat scary for a

Re: [HACKERS] posix_fadvise v22

2008-12-11 Thread Tom Lane
Greg Stark [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: A variable prefetch_pages is defined as unsigned or int in some places. Why don't you define it only once in a header and include the header in source files? Just... Which header? MHO: the header that goes with the source file that is most concerned with

Re: [HACKERS] Updates of SE-PostgreSQL 8.4devel patches (r1268)

2008-12-11 Thread Tom Lane
Peter Eisentraut [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: On Thursday 11 December 2008 17:09:25 Tom Lane wrote: I think there should be only *one* underlying column and that it should be manipulable by either SQL commands or selinux.  Otherwise you're making a lie of the primary argument for having the SQL

Re: [HACKERS] WIP: default values for function parameters

2008-12-11 Thread Peter Eisentraut
On Thursday 11 December 2008 17:11:28 Pavel Stehule wrote: maybe this combination should be safe $name = or $name - ... it's not used everywhere Why don't you actually just implement the whole thing first using a random, simple, and nonconflicting syntax? Adjusting the syntax to

Re: [HACKERS] Updates of SE-PostgreSQL 8.4devel patches (r1268)

2008-12-11 Thread Peter Eisentraut
On Thursday 11 December 2008 18:24:54 KaiGai Kohei wrote: Peter Eisentraut wrote: On Thursday 11 December 2008 17:09:25 Tom Lane wrote: I think there should be only *one* underlying column and that it should be manipulable by either SQL commands or selinux. Otherwise you're making a lie

Re: [HACKERS] Refactoring SearchSysCache + HeapTupleIsValid

2008-12-11 Thread Alvaro Herrera
Peter Eisentraut wrote: About the error message, I find neither version to be very good. People see these messages and don't know what to do. I agree. People see this: ERROR: cache lookup failure for constraint 123123123 and they think it means the same as this: ERROR: cache lookup

Re: [HACKERS] WIP: default values for function parameters

2008-12-11 Thread Pavel Stehule
2008/12/11 Peter Eisentraut [EMAIL PROTECTED]: On Thursday 11 December 2008 17:11:28 Pavel Stehule wrote: maybe this combination should be safe $name = or $name - ... it's not used everywhere Why don't you actually just implement the whole thing first using a random, simple, and

Re: [HACKERS] Updates of SE-PostgreSQL 8.4devel patches (r1268)

2008-12-11 Thread Bruce Momjian
Peter Eisentraut wrote: On Thursday 11 December 2008 17:04:05 Bruce Momjian wrote: The idea is that the security columns will hold an OID and the OID will point to a row in a table that contains the security rights/ACL for the column, with multiple rows using the same rights OID. That

Re: [HACKERS] posix_fadvise v22

2008-12-11 Thread Greg Stark
On Thu, Dec 11, 2008 at 4:29 PM, Tom Lane t...@sss.pgh.pa.us wrote: Greg Stark greg.st...@enterprisedb.com writes: A variable prefetch_pages is defined as unsigned or int in some places. Why don't you define it only once in a header and include the header in source files? Just... Which

Re: [HACKERS] Updates of SE-PostgreSQL 8.4devel patches (r1268)

2008-12-11 Thread Peter Eisentraut
On Thursday 11 December 2008 18:32:50 Tom Lane wrote: How can we stick all of these in the same column at the same time? Why would we want to? Because we want to use SQL-based row access control and SELinux-based row access control at the same time. Isn't this exactly one of the objections

Re: [HACKERS] benchmarking the query planner

2008-12-11 Thread Tom Lane
Robert Haas robertmh...@gmail.com writes: Ah, that makes sense. Here's a test case based on Greg's. This is definitely more than linear once you get above about n = 80, but it's not quadratic either. n = 1000 is only 43x n = 80, and while that's surely more than 1000/80 = 12.5, it's also a

Re: [HACKERS] Updates of SE-PostgreSQL 8.4devel patches (r1268)

2008-12-11 Thread Tom Lane
Peter Eisentraut pete...@gmx.net writes: On Thursday 11 December 2008 18:32:50 Tom Lane wrote: How can we stick all of these in the same column at the same time? Why would we want to? Because we want to use SQL-based row access control and SELinux-based row access control at the same

Re: [HACKERS] Updates of SE-PostgreSQL 8.4devel patches (r1268)

2008-12-11 Thread Bruce Momjian
Tom Lane wrote: Bruce Momjian br...@momjian.us writes: Let me outline the simplest API, assuming we are using table-level granularity for the security columns. CREATE TABLE would support WITH (ROWACL = TRUE/FALSE); for row-level acl and: WITH (SECEXT = TRUE/FALSE); for

Re: [HACKERS] benchmarking the query planner

2008-12-11 Thread Vladimir Sitnikov
BTW, does anyone have an opinion about changing the upper limit for default_stats_target to, say, 1? These tests suggest that you wouldn't want such a value for a column used as a join key, but I can see a possible argument for high values in text search and similar applications. Do

Re: [HACKERS] benchmarking the query planner

2008-12-11 Thread Tom Lane
Vladimir Sitnikov sitnikov.vladi...@gmail.com writes: Do you consider using hash tables? Doubt it's really worth it, unless there's some way to amortize the setup cost across multiple selectivity estimations; which would surely complicate life. One thing that just now occurred to me is that as

Re: [HACKERS] benchmarking the query planner

2008-12-11 Thread Robert Haas
When looking at these numbers one might think the threshold of pain is about 50, rather than 100 which is where I'd put it for the text example. However, this is probably an extreme worst case. On the whole I think we have some evidence here to say that upping the default value of

Re: [HACKERS] Function with default value not replacing old definition of the function

2008-12-11 Thread Dimitri Fontaine
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Hi, Le 11 déc. 08 à 16:22, Tom Lane a écrit : Yeah, we already bit this bullet with variadic functions --- if you have myfunc(int, float) myfunc(int, variadic float[]) then it's ambiguous which one should be used for call

Re: [HACKERS] benchmarking the query planner

2008-12-11 Thread Vladimir Sitnikov
Do you consider using hash tables? Doubt it's really worth it, unless there's some way to amortize the setup cost across multiple selectivity estimations; which would surely complicate life. MCV lists are updated only during analyze phase, don't they? If the setup cost is the cost of

Re: [HACKERS] Updates of SE-PostgreSQL 8.4devel patches (r1268)

2008-12-11 Thread Gregory Stark
Peter Eisentraut pete...@gmx.net writes: On Thursday 11 December 2008 18:32:50 Tom Lane wrote: How can we stick all of these in the same column at the same time? Why would we want to? Because we want to use SQL-based row access control and SELinux-based row access control at the same

Re: [HACKERS] Updates of SE-PostgreSQL 8.4devel patches (r1268)

2008-12-11 Thread Aidan Van Dyk
* Gregory Stark st...@enterprisedb.com [081211 14:47]: Peter Eisentraut pete...@gmx.net writes: On Thursday 11 December 2008 18:32:50 Tom Lane wrote: How can we stick all of these in the same column at the same time? Why would we want to? Because we want to use SQL-based row access

Re: [HACKERS] benchmarking the query planner

2008-12-11 Thread Robert Haas
On Thu, Dec 11, 2008 at 2:06 PM, Tom Lane t...@sss.pgh.pa.us wrote: Vladimir Sitnikov sitnikov.vladi...@gmail.com writes: Do you consider using hash tables? Doubt it's really worth it, unless there's some way to amortize the setup cost across multiple selectivity estimations; which would

Re: [HACKERS] Function with default value not replacing old definition of the function

2008-12-11 Thread Tom Lane
Dimitri Fontaine dfonta...@hi-media.com writes: The sanest answer I can see is so, don't do that. Is there any warning level message at CREATE FUNCTION time for the user/dba to know he's doing something... border line, almost shooting himself in the foot? It's not that easy to produce a

Re: [HACKERS] Function with default value not replacing old definition of the function

2008-12-11 Thread Dimitri Fontaine
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Le 11 déc. 08 à 21:23, Tom Lane a écrit : It's not that easy to produce a message that wouldn't be annoying noise. Something really amazing in PostgreSQL is the HINTs system in error messages. Almost all the time thoses messages are focused and

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