Re: [HACKERS] non-ipv6 vs hostnames

2011-08-17 Thread Charles.McDevitt
 On tis, 2011-08-16 at 16:17 +0200, Magnus Hagander wrote:
  Well, I got this on a win64 build. It's *supposed* to have ipv6. I
  wonder if it breaks on windows just because there is no ipv6 address
  on the machine...
 
 It would mean that getaddrinfo() of ::1 failed.  That seems weird.
 

A system admin can set registry keys to disable IPv6, either partially 
(allowing ::1), or totally (all IPv6 addresses fail).

If the system has IPv6 enabled, it's not possible for there to be no ipv6 
address.  There is always the link-local address of each LAN adapter.


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Re: [HACKERS] Debian readline/libedit breakage

2011-02-17 Thread Charles.McDevitt
 On 02/17/2011 12:34 PM, Bruce Momjian wrote:
  Andrew Dunstan wrote:
 
  On 02/17/2011 12:13 PM, Bruce Momjian wrote:
  FWIW, the only interactively usable version of psql for windows I know
  of is the one that runs under Cygwin. It can be build with readline and
  works as expected.
  Uh, don't we have a psql built via MSVC?  Doesn't it work interactively?
 
  Not if you want readline. And in my book that's a requirement of a psql
  that's usable interactively. It's pretty horrible to use without it.
  Well, as horrible as other Windows apps.  I will leave others to decide
  if that is usable.  ;-)  I am unclear if we would ship readline support
  on Windows even if we didn't have a license issue (no OS readline
  version on Windows).
 
 
 Windows developers almost universally work from GUIs and not using
 console apps (and that's true of many Unix developers also, particularly
 those who can't recall a time when X-Windows wasn't almost universally
 available). Microsoft has de-emphasized console apps for 15 years. So
 the only people who are likely to be interested in using an enhanced
 psql on Windows are old Unix-heads like you and me. It's not worth a lot
 of effort, IMNSHO.
 
 cheers
 
 andrew
 

I think this is wrong...  There are plenty of people who use the command line 
in Windows, and Microsoft has been adding better support for this, including 
PowerShell and interfaces to every administrative operation from command line 
scripts.

Psql on Windows is ugly... Readline does (supposedly) run on Windows, but no 
one has done the work to get it to happen.
One of the problems with libedit is that it does not support Windows, as far as 
I know.

I don't know of a good solution, given the license for readline.  But it would 
sure be nice.


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Re: [HACKERS] Debian readline/libedit breakage

2011-02-12 Thread Charles.McDevitt
 charles.mcdev...@emc.com wrote:
  The GNU people will never be 100% satisfied by anything you do to psql, 
  other
 than making it GPL.
  Readline is specifically licensed in a way to try to force this (but many 
  disagree
 with their ability to force this).
 
 
 The GNU people are perfectly content with the license of PostgreSQL.
 They are unhappy with the license terms of OpenSSL, which is fair
 because they are ridiculous.  Eric Young and the rest of the
 contributors produced a useful piece of software, and made it considerly
 less valuable to the world due to the ego trip terms:
 http://www.openssl.org/source/license.html -- the worst specific problem
 is the requirement to acknowledge OpenSSL use in advertising of projects
 that use it.
 
 The PostgreSQL community has had similar issues with popular software
 commonly used on top of PostgreSQL, that happened to use a non-standard
 license with unique terms.  It would be both hypocritical and incorrect
 to now blame the GNU projects for taking a similar stand on this one.

You are correct... I overreacted, after having run into problems in the past 
with GPL (vs LGPL) issues.
My apologies to all for adding stupid distracting comments to this thread.

It would be wonderful if the OpenSSL people would compromise on this, but I 
suppose that isn't possible.

I'd love to see libedit get better, and would like to see that solution, 
because OpenSSL's FIPS compliance really helps with Federal customers, but I 
realize that involves a lot of effort.
I hope if the PostgreSQL project goes down the path of switching to GnuTLS, 
OpenSSL remains an option (for the server side). 



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Re: [HACKERS] Debian readline/libedit breakage

2011-02-11 Thread Charles.McDevitt
Don't forget that OpenSSL has a FIPS-140 compliant version, and FIPS-140 
compliance is essential to many Federal users.

GnuTLS doesn't qualify.



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Re: [HACKERS] Debian readline/libedit breakage

2011-02-11 Thread Charles.McDevitt
If psql uses libreadline and libgnutls, does that mean psql will be distributed 
under the GPL in the future?  Or Dual-licensed?

If I read the readline license right, applications that link to it must be GPL.

That's why we (EMC/Greenplum) switch to libedit, even though readline is 
nicer... We didn't want to ship part of our product as GPL


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Re: [HACKERS] Debian readline/libedit breakage

2011-02-11 Thread Charles.McDevitt
 * charles.mcdev...@emc.com (charles.mcdev...@emc.com) wrote:
  Don't forget that OpenSSL has a FIPS-140 compliant version, and FIPS-140
 compliance is essential to many Federal users.
 
 Essential?  That's a bit much.  Yes, it shows up on a FISMA review as an
 open action item, but it's a risk that can both be accepted and
 mitigated.  I also thought FIPS-140 version required API changes..
 
  GnuTLS doesn't qualify.
 
 That should be doesn't currently..
 

Doesn't currently?  Does that mean you know of a project to get FIPS 
certification for it?  I don't.

The current OpenSSL has a version that is (the only source-code-level FIPS-140 
certification ever).
And yes, it is API compatible with the non-FIPS one.  It just doesn't support 
some of the algorithms that the other does.

The GNU people will never be 100% satisfied by anything you do to psql, other 
than making it GPL.
Readline is specifically licensed in a way to try to force this (but many 
disagree with their ability to force this).

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Re: [HACKERS] Debian readline/libedit breakage

2011-02-11 Thread Charles.McDevitt
 -Original Message-
 From: gsst...@gmail.com [mailto:gsst...@gmail.com] On Behalf Of Greg Stark
 Sent: Friday, February 11, 2011 4:03 PM
 On Fri, Feb 11, 2011 at 11:06 PM,  charles.mcdev...@emc.com wrote:
  The GNU people will never be 100% satisfied by anything you do to psql, 
  other
 than making it GPL.
  Readline is specifically licensed in a way to try to force this (but many 
  disagree
 with their ability to force this).
 
 This is just libelous FUD. There's absolutely no reason postgres would
 have to be GPL'd to satisfy any library license. 

Ok, but be aware that readline is GPL v3, not GPL v2, and has those additional 
requirements.

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Re: [HACKERS] Debian readline/libedit breakage

2011-02-11 Thread Charles.McDevitt
 -Original Message-
 From: gsst...@gmail.com [mailto:gsst...@gmail.com] On Behalf Of Greg Stark
 Sent: Friday, February 11, 2011 4:14 PM
 To: McDevitt, Charles
 Cc: sfr...@snowman.net; alvhe...@commandprompt.com;
 g...@2ndquadrant.com; mba...@debian.org; t...@sss.pgh.pa.us;
 and...@dunslane.net; j...@commandprompt.com; pgsql-
 hack...@postgresql.org
 Subject: Re: Debian readline/libedit breakage
 
 On Sat, Feb 12, 2011 at 12:07 AM,  charles.mcdev...@emc.com wrote:
  This is just libelous FUD. There's absolutely no reason postgres would
  have to be GPL'd to satisfy any library license.
 
  Ok, but be aware that readline is GPL v3, not GPL v2, and has those 
  additional
 requirements.
 
 No

What?  From the GNU Readline home page:  Readline is free software, 
distributed under the terms of the GNU General Public License, version 3.

I know it used to be GPLv2, but that isn't true these days.

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Re: [HACKERS] Why don't we accept exponential format for integers?

2010-12-17 Thread Charles.McDevitt
  And so does:
  SELECT 1.23e+01::Integer
 
 
   which I find just as dangerous as
   SELECT '1.234e+01'::Integer;
 
  Add quotes to either of the other two, and then they don't work either.
 
 Well, that's stupidly arbitrary.  If we're not going to accept
 '1.234e+01'::Integer, then we shouldn't accept 1.234e+01::Integer either.
 

Isn't this a case of an explicit cast?  Shouldn't our answer to 
1.234e+1::Integer be the same as CAST(1234e+1 AS Integer)?
Which is legal ISO SQL, as far as I can see.

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