[PHP] Re: php applications
Hello, on 06/08/2009 12:48 PM tedd said the following: Hi gang: I've heard that php can be used for more than web programming, but I am not aware of specifically how that can be done. So, let me ask directly -- can php be used to create a Mac Application? If so, how? Sure, just yesterday it was released a class for controlling iTunes from PHP. http://www.phpclasses.org/itunes Another PHP package was just released for displaying Web galleries optimized for the iPhone. This is still a Web based application though. http://www.phpclasses.org/pipho For GUI based applications, there is PHP-Gtk for Mac like others have mentioned. -- Regards, Manuel Lemos Find and post PHP jobs http://www.phpclasses.org/jobs/ PHP Classes - Free ready to use OOP components written in PHP http://www.phpclasses.org/ -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP] PHP running Python script - not waiting for Python script to finish
Adrian Price-Whelan wrote: Hey - Running these on a Linux server with PHP 5 and Python 2.5. My problem is this: I have a simple php form that executes a long (~3 minutes) Python script using the 'exec' function from php. The issue is that the browser, I think, 'times out' before the Python script is finished and therefore kills Python and displays no output from Python. After some intense googling, I haven't found an answer, Can't you just change whichever timeout it is that terminates your script? /Per -- Per Jessen, Zürich (17.2°C) -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP] Strange PHP/Python problem
Adrian Price-Whelan wrote: Hey all- Something strange is happening with a python script I am executing from a php page: I am executing this by doing $output = `python blahblah.py arg1 arg2 arg3` Say my Python code looks like this: import sys import os thisPID = os.getpid() print thisPID print 1 RADeg = float(sys.argv[1]) decDeg = float(sys.argv[2]) clipSizeDeg = float(sys.argv[3]) print 2 ic.myFunction(RAdeg, decDeg, clipSizeDeg) print 3 os.system(SOME LONG COMMAND) print 4 for i in os.listdir(blah): print 5 os.system(gunzip BLAH)[/code] print 6 $output collects these numbers from the print statements, all the way through #6, but it doesn't execute the rest of the code - the stuff that I actually want it to do...any ideas? Your question belongs on a python list. Cheers, Rob. -- http://www.interjinn.com Application and Templating Framework for PHP -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP] PHP running Python script - not waiting for Python script to finish
Per Jessen wrote: Adrian Price-Whelan wrote: Hey - Running these on a Linux server with PHP 5 and Python 2.5. My problem is this: I have a simple php form that executes a long (~3 minutes) Python script using the 'exec' function from php. The issue is that the browser, I think, 'times out' before the Python script is finished and therefore kills Python and displays no output from Python. After some intense googling, I haven't found an answer, Can't you just change whichever timeout it is that terminates your script? set_time_limit( 600 ); Cheers, Rob. -- http://www.interjinn.com Application and Templating Framework for PHP -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP] Show the entire browser request
2009/6/8 Dotan Cohen dotanco...@gmail.com: If its the request from the browser, why not just fire up a packet sniffer and get it that way? Unless it's using SSL/TLS/VPN/something that would encrypt it, you should be able to see the request in clear text. The browser is running on a Symbian cellphone. Run this on a command line and hit the IP on port 8000. All it does is read the request and send it back as the response. It ignores POST bodies but it would be pretty simple to modify it so it echo's those back too. http://dev.stut.net/php/httpsrv.phps -Stuart -- http://stut.net/ -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP] Show the entire browser request
Run this on a command line and hit the IP on port 8000. All it does is read the request and send it back as the response. It ignores POST bodies but it would be pretty simple to modify it so it echo's those back too. http://dev.stut.net/php/httpsrv.phps Stuart, that is quite a bit of work! Nice! I also learned some really nice tips here, such as your usage of define for the header and footer, and why that is the cleanest solution when you need the content-length. The usage of sockets is new to me too, but this was easy to follow. Thanks! -- Dotan Cohen http://what-is-what.com http://gibberish.co.il -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
[PHP] automatic timezone adjustment
hi all, i'm trying to implement automatic timezone adjustment in one of my application, it should work based on the country,state and city which users specify in their account settings. i have two questions. 1. since there are thousands of cities, what is the best and the easiest way to figure out the correct time zone for each country-state-city combination? (i couldn't find a free database or a service for this specific purpose, but those many social networking sites do this) 2. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zoneinfo says 'It also includes transitions such as daylight saving time, and even records leap seconds', does this means, that i do not have to worry about DST calculations? many thanks! ~viraj -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP] Show the entire browser request
Why should this be run on port 8000? Is there a security implication of running this on port 80? Would it be unwise to use this as a public service, for instance? I was considering adding the tool to http://simplesniff, which is why I ask. Of course, that would only be with your permission, and it would give you credit for writing the code as well. -- Dotan Cohen http://what-is-what.com http://gibberish.co.il -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP] Show the entire browser request
2009/6/9 Dotan Cohen dotanco...@gmail.com: Why should this be run on port 8000? Is there a security implication of running this on port 80? Would it be unwise to use this as a public service, for instance? You can run it on port 80 but you'll need to make sure there's not another web server running on that port and you'll probably need to run it as an admin user. I was considering adding the tool to http://simplesniff, which is why I ask. Of course, that would only be with your permission, and it would give you credit for writing the code as well. There are no risks that I can see in the code. You're welcome to use it, and a link to http://stut.net/ is always appreciated ;-) If you're running it on a server that already has a web server on port 80 you have 2 choices... 1) Run it on another port. 2) Bind it to a different IP address. Option 1 is the simplest and wasting an IP for just this is a bit daft IMHO. One thing to note is that it can only handle a single request at once. If you want it to handle more simultaneously it'll need modifying a bit. Another way to go about this would be to run it using xinetd, but be sure to remove the while(true) loop before you do that, and close the $s socket at the end of the script. -Stuart -- http://stut.net/ -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP] how to get rid of that annoying |
On Tue, Jun 9, 2009 at 1:47 AM, PJaf.gour...@videotron.ca wrote:
Robert Cummings wrote:
PJ wrote:
Robert Cummings wrote:
PJ wrote:
Robert Cummings wrote:
PJ wrote:
I know this a silly question, but I can't figure out if it's even
possible to get rid of that final annoying | in my pagination
script.
?echo pNavigation/p;
echo (($page !=1)?a href='.build_url(books.php, page,
1).'first/a:first). ... ;
echo (($page1)?a href='.build_url(books.php, page,
$page-1).'prev/a:prev). | ;
for($i=$page; $i=($page+$records_per_page-2)+1; $i++){
if ($i!=$page $iceil($count/$records_per_page))
echo a href='.build_url(books.php, page,
$i).'$i/a,
| ;
elseif ($iceil($count/$records_per_page))
continue;
else echo $i, | ;
}
---|
echo | ... .(($page$count)?a href='.build_url(books.php,
page, $page+1).'next/a:next);
echo ... .(($page$count)?a href='.build_url(books.php,
page,
ceil($count/$records_per_page)).'last/a:last);
//echo pTable Order/p;
echo br /Ordered alphabetically by book title : ;
echo $dir==ASC?Ascending:a href='.build_url(books.php,
dir,
asc).'Ascending/a;
echo | ;
echo $dir==DESC?Descending:a href='.build_url(books.php,
dir,
desc).'Descending/a;
echo br /;?
This produces a very nifty pagination - the problem is how to get
rid of
the final pages that show up as greater than what is available. The
script above works fine, except it leaves that final | ...
Any simple solutions?
Do it differently... build an array of the appropriate entries. When
done, use implode( ' | ', $yourArray ).
Cheers,
Rob.
Hate to disappoint you all, but I finally found the errant | .
Ridiculous, really, that I bothered you all.
it's in the line indicated above --- echo | ... --- lose the | and
it all works like a charm.
:-) ;-)
You didn't disappoint me... I've seen code like that before, I just
thought you'd benefit from a cleaner approach instead of the above
mess.
Actually, as I am new to this, I still have another little glitch which
is a pita. Oh, I know it's a bit of a mess; I have a hard time
following, myself. But, being lazy, I'm trying to fix thigs with a
band-aid. :-(
But I don't understand how I would build an array of the appropriate
entries... what entries do you mean?
You have links, each separated by the pipe '|' character. Add each
link to a links array:
?php
$links = array();
foreach( $items as $item )
{
$links[] = 'a href=#'.$item.'/a';
}
echo implode( ' | ', $links );
?
Hope that helps.
I'm afraid I still don't understand. I think you are seeing something
that I don't see. What do you mean by link in the present context... are
you talking about some snippet of code equaling each page or every page
in the db? This is an ever growing db.
Anyway, I finally found the error of my ways (at least in this code). It
may look sloppy, but then I haven't looked that hard for other examples.
Some I found were too simple, others too bloated.
At least, this one works for what I need and does exactly what I wanted.
:-)
Here's the final fixed code; some obvious (I hope) variables are left
out and precede the code:
echo (($page !=1)?a href='.build_url(books.php, page,
1).'first/a:first). ... ;
echo (($page1)?a href='.build_url(books.php, page,
$page-1).'prev/a:prev). | ;
for($i=$page; $i=($page+$records_per_page-2)+1; $i++){
if ($iceil($count/$records_per_page))
continue;
elseif ($i!=$page)
echo a href='.build_url(books.php, page, $i).'$i/a, | ;
else
echo $i, | ;
}
echo ... .(($pageceil($count/$records_per_page))?a
href='.build_url(books.php, page, $page+1).'next/a:next);
if ($page==ceil($count/$records_per_page))
echo ... last;
elseif ($i!=ceil($count/$records_per_page)) echo ...
.(($pageceil($count/$records_per_page)+$records_per_page)?a
href='.build_url(books.php, page,
ceil($count/$records_per_page)).'last/a:last);
else echo ... .(($page$count)?a href='.build_url(books.php,
page, ceil($count/$records_per_page)).'last/a:last);
echo brOrdered alphabetically by book title : ;
echo $dir==ASC?Ascending:a href='.build_url(books.php, dir,
asc).'Ascending/a;
echo | ;
echo $dir==DESC?Descending:a href='.build_url(books.php, dir,
desc).'Descending/a;
If there is a way to simplify things, please do let me know (with an
example, please)
PJ
--
Hervé Kempf: Pour sauver la plančte, sortez du capitalisme.
-
Phil Jourdan --- p...@ptahhotep.com
http://www.ptahhotep.com
http://www.chiccantine.com/andypantry.php
--
PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/)
To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
http://www.weberdev.com/get_example-4092.html
http://www.weberdev.com/get_example-4093.html
are two paging examples that I wrote some time ago
--
Bastien
Cat, the other other white meat
--
PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/)
To
[PHP] socket_write return wrong data length
Hi all,
I'm writting a little telnet client, but I've a problem with the socket_write
function
public function send($data){
$datalen = strlen($data);
$datawritten = 0;
do {
$datawritten = socket_write($this-_tnsocket, $data,
$datalen);
if( $datawritten === FALSE) {
echo __METHOD__. :
.socket_strerror(socket_last_error()).\n;
return (FALSE);
}
echo Bytes written : .$datawritten.\n;
$data = substr($data, $datawritten);
$datalen = strlen($data);
} while($datawritten $datalen);
return (TRUE);
}
When I use this function for writting a sample message of 4526 Bytes it returns
:
Bytes written : 4526
But it really wrotes only 1460 Bytes (verified with Wireshark).
So my question is why socket_write returns me a wrong data length ?
Thanks
--
PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/)
To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP] Show the entire browser request
There are no risks that I can see in the code. You're welcome to use it, and a link to http://stut.net/ is always appreciated ;-) In August when I will have more time to devote to it I will put it on the site. With link, and it is _me_ who appreciates _your_ help. Thanks! Dotan Cohen http://what-is-what.com http://gibberish.co.il -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
[PHP] Any conflict with $_POST when 2 users concurrently submitting the same form using POST method?
Let's say user A and user B submitting purchase order form with order.php at the same time, with method=post action='confirmation.php'. (1) Will $_POST['order'] submitted by user A replaced by $_POST['order'] submitted by user B, and the both user A B getting the same order, which is made by user B? Why? (2)Since $_POST['xxx'] is superglobal array, will $_POST['order'] read by users other than A B? In shared hosting server environment, are all domains hosted within that server using the same $_POST array? Can $_POST array accessible by all domains even if not from the originating domain? Thx for clarification! Keith -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP] Any conflict with $_POST when 2 users concurrently submitting the same form using POST method?
Hell no! Why would they be overwritten? An HTTP request is sent from user A, the interpreter is compiling the PHP script with the received HTTP request variables and send back the HTTP response to user A, during this time the same thing happens with user B. I can't think of any possible reason in which the $_POST variables will be overwritten during paralell requests. Regards, Nitsan On Tue, Jun 9, 2009 at 9:27 AM, Keithsurvivor_...@hotmail.com wrote: Let's say user A and user B submitting purchase order form with order.php at the same time, with method=post action='confirmation.php'. (1) Will $_POST['order'] submitted by user A replaced by $_POST['order'] submitted by user B, and the both user A B getting the same order, which is made by user B? Why? (2) Since $_POST['xxx'] is superglobal array, will $_POST['order'] read by users other than A B? In shared hosting server environment, are all domains hosted within that server using the same $_POST array? Can $_POST array accessible by all domains even if not from the originating domain? Thx for clarification! Keith -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
[PHP] Cross site scripting
Hey all, You may have seen my earlier message about a current client whose site I've taken over maintenance on that is trying to get PCI Compliance from Security Metrics. I've put all the forms behind https and a couple of other things, but this one I don't know how to solve. I'll read up on cross site scripting, but could someone help me understand what they believe the vulnerability is in their notes below? Thanks, Skip Possible cross site scripting on http://www.ranghart.com/index.php Use the following commands to verify this: wp --inject http://www.ranghart.com/index.php?action=searchkw=SEARCH%22%3E%3Cscript%3Ealert%28123%29%3C% TCP http/https 4 curl -L http://www.ranghart.com/index.php?action=searchkw=SEARCH%22%3E%3Cscript%3Ealert%28123%29%3C% grep 123 This website may have other injection related vulnerabilities. -- Skip Evans Big Sky Penguin, LLC 503 S Baldwin St, #1 Madison WI 53703 608.250.2720 http://bigskypenguin.com Those of you who believe in telekinesis, raise my hand. -- Kurt Vonnegut -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP] Re: SHOULD I NOT USE ELSE IN IF STATEMENTS....?
I'm not sure I agree with NEVER using else. Sometimes else is a very
logical way to organize code. However, it should not be used for data
validation IE:
function myValidatorFunc($data) {
if (empty(data)) {
return false;
} else {
if (!is_numeric($data)) {
return false;
} else {
}
}
}
It's all about how deep you nest your code, and keeping the flow clean.
That code would be much more readable as such:
function myValidatorFunc($data) {
if (empty(data)) {
throw new BadMethodCallException(Paramater data missing);
}
if (!is_numeric($data)) {
throw new InvalidArgumentException(Paramater data should be an
integer.);
}
}
See the difference?
- Craige
O. Lavell wrote:
adam.timberlake wrote:
Im reading this post and i donnot understand how i should write my code:
http://www.talkphp.com/absolute-beginners/4237-curly-
brackets.html#post23720
Does it mean that i am to not write else statements in my ifs? or is it
just saying it is something i should avoid to rite better code?
please help me...
I happen to not agree completely with the post, because it seems to
propose the use of things like continue, break and return within
control structures (the latter as opposed to at the end of a function,
exclusively). Very bad practice in my opinion. Think of everything that
has ever been said of goto, it's just as bad for structured programming.
(however the use of break in switch .. case statements is an
unfortunate necessity in PHP)
Not that I am diagramming much nowadays, but I still try to write code
such that it could fit into a Nassi-Shneiderman diagram (NSD):
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nassi-Shneiderman_diagram
If you have never learnt to draw these then you probably should. It can
be fun to do and they are very helpful for planning ahead and writing
uncluttered code that can be easily debugged. And you will know you are
nesting too deep when the diagram doesn't fit on the piece of paper you
started on :)
To more directly answer your question I would say that if there is a
*logical* requirement to use else after if then yes, you should use
it and certainly not try to avoid it. There is absolutely nothing wrong
with else.
--
PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/)
To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP] Re: SHOULD I NOT USE ELSE IN IF STATEMENTS....?
Craige Leeder wrote:
I'm not sure I agree with NEVER using else. Sometimes else is a very
logical way to organize code. However, it should not be used for data
validation IE:
function myValidatorFunc($data) {
if (empty(data)) {
return false;
} else {
if (!is_numeric($data)) {
return false;
} else {
}
}
}
It's all about how deep you nest your code, and keeping the flow clean.
That code would be much more readable as such:
function myValidatorFunc($data) {
if (empty(data)) {
throw new BadMethodCallException(Paramater data missing);
}
if (!is_numeric($data)) {
throw new InvalidArgumentException(Paramater data should be an
integer.);
}
}
See the difference?
I believe the article was suggesting not ending a function that returns
a value with no return. So rather than return in the else, return
outside the else as the last expression of the function. This way it is
clear that the function returns a value.
Contrast:
?php
function foo( $foo )
{
if( $foo )
{
return true;
}
else
{
return false;
}
}
?
Versus:
?php
function foo( $foo )
{
if( $foo )
{
return true;
}
return false;
}
?
Personally, I also prefer the latter style.
Cheers,
Rob.
--
http://www.interjinn.com
Application and Templating Framework for PHP
--
PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/)
To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
RE: [PHP] Any conflict with $_POST when 2 users concurrently submitting the same form using POST method?
-Original Message- From: Craige Leeder [mailto:clee...@gmail.com] Sent: Tuesday, June 09, 2009 11:54 AM To: Keith; PHP-General List Subject: Re: [PHP] Any conflict with $_POST when 2 users concurrently submitting the same form using POST method? While yes $_POST is a supergloabal, even a superglobal has it's own scope. The scope of $_POST is to the call of the user to the web server. Therefor, no User A's information will not be overwritten by User B's information. Hope this helps. Let me know if you want any further clarification. This was just a very simplified answer. Keith wrote: Let's say user A and user B submitting purchase order form with order.php at the same time, with method=post action='confirmation.php'. (1) Will $_POST['order'] submitted by user A replaced by $_POST['order'] submitted by user B, and the both user A B getting the same order, which is made by user B? Why? (2)Since $_POST['xxx'] is superglobal array, will $_POST['order'] read by users other than A B? In shared hosting server environment, are all domains hosted within that server using the same $_POST array? Can $_POST array accessible by all domains even if not from the originating domain? Thx for clarification! Keith Wow what a major security risk and headache this would be -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php __ Information from ESET Smart Security, version of virus signature database 4141 (20090609) __ The message was checked by ESET Smart Security. http://www.eset.com -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
[PHP] Php and Imagemagick problems
I am having a heck of a time getting a script to convert images to
workit worked fine for a few hours, then someone tweaked it and now it
doesn't work and I can't get it back...they tweaked the original file
The script runs and uploads files but no longer converts them with the
ImageMagick..wondering if anyone else has run into this
Code:
--
// -- Get Images from
folder--- //
$FileName = $row['Image'];
$ImageName = $row['Image'];
$ImageName = str_replace(/,
, $ImageName);
//the many confusing paths
//Local path on localhost of image names with NO file extenstion on them as
seen through the webserver
$FilePath =
http://127.0.0.1/HarrisAutomate/output/WebImagesHiRes/test/$ImageName;;
//same as $SysPath not sure why - as of this point
$FileName and $ImageName are the same thing
$FullSysPath =
C:/Inetpub/wwwroot/HarrisAutomate/output/WebImagesHiRes/test/$ImageName;
$BackupPath =
C:/Inetpub/wwwroot/HarrisAutomate/output/WebImagesHiRes/backup/test/;
//add jpg extenstion to the filename stored in the harris folder
$FileName = str_replace(/, , $FileName);
$FileName =
str_replace(.jpg, , $FileName);
$FileName =
str_replace(/, , $ImageName);
$FileName = str_replace(.jpg, ,
$ImageName);
//actual path to the files with NO file extension
as found on the hard drive
$SysPath =
C:/Inetpub/wwwroot/HarrisAutomate/output/WebImagesHiRes/test/$FileName;
//lets do some echos
echo $FileName .'br';
echo
$ImageName .'br';
// include (VariableReveal3.php);
echo
($FileName) . 'br /';
echo ($FilePath) . 'br /';
echo 'img src=' .
$FilePath .'' . 'br /';
if (file_exists($SysPath)) {
echo
The file $ImageName Exists!! Hooray!! . 'br /';
} else {
echo The file $FileName located at $SysPath does not exist . 'br
/';
}
//--If they exist go ahead and convert them
WINDOWS VERSION//
if (file_exists($SysPath)) {
$command =
convert.exe mogrify -format eps *.jpg -normalize -density 200x200 -trim
-resize 150 -colorspace rgb -filter Sinc -quality 100 ñtrim -identify
-verbose ;
$command .= addslashes($SysPath . $FileName) . ;
$command .= addslashes($FilePath . $FileName) ..jpg;
/*
$command = convert.exe -normalize -density 200x200 -trim -resize 150
-colorspace rgb -filter Sinc -quality 100 -identify -verbose ;
$command .= addslashes($SysPath) . ;
$command .=
addslashes($FullSysPath) . ;
*/
//echo the command for
the image not so magick
echo $command . br /;
//--Error Reporting about the
Conversions-//
if (system($command, $status) === false) {
echo ($command).
'br /';
echo Image Failed . 'br /';
} else {
echo Image Processed . 'br /';
}
//---Once Converted Then connect to the php
server online//
$ftp_server = 20.20.20.20.;
$ftp_user_name = blah blah ;
$ftp_user_pass = blahblah;
$conn_id = ftp_connect($ftp_server);
$login_result = ftp_login($conn_id, $ftp_user_name, $ftp_user_pass);
$FilePath =
http://127.0.0.1/HarrisAutomate/output/WebImagesHiRes/$FileName;;
$remote_path = /httpdocs/Announcements/photos/obitsTest/$ImageName;
echo I'm going to upload $FilePath to $remote_path. . 'br /';
set_time_limit(120);
ftp_pasv($conn_id, true);
// upload a
file
if (ftp_put($conn_id, $remote_path, $SysPath, FTP_BINARY)) {
echo successfully uploaded $ImageName\n;
} else {
echo There was a problem while uploading $ImageName\n;
}
--
PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/)
To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
[PHP] Re: Cross site scripting
Skip Evans wrote: Hey all, You may have seen my earlier message about a current client whose site I've taken over maintenance on that is trying to get PCI Compliance from Security Metrics. I've put all the forms behind https and a couple of other things, but this one I don't know how to solve. I'll read up on cross site scripting, but could someone help me understand what they believe the vulnerability is in their notes below? Thanks, Skip Possible cross site scripting on http://www.ranghart.com/index.php Use the following commands to verify this: wp --inject http://www.ranghart.com/index.php?action=searchkw=SEARCH%22%3E%3Cscript%3Ealert%28123%29%3C% TCP http/https 4 curl -L http://www.ranghart.com/index.php?action=searchkw=SEARCH%22%3E%3Cscript%3Ealert%28123%29%3C% grep 123 This website may have other injection related vulnerabilities. Well, their example is not correct, try: http://www.ranghart.com/index.php?action=searchkw=SEARCH%3Cscript%3Ealert%28Im doing some nasty JavaScipt hacking here!%29%3B%3C%2Fscript%3E in a browser. This means that you're not validating/sanitizing input. You can't just take the contents of a $_GET, $_POST, etc. (any user input) variable and echo it out. -- Thanks! -Shawn http://www.spidean.com -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
[PHP] How does caching work?
This question may be too complex for a reasonable answer on this list, but I'll ask anyway. If a page has static content (no PHP variables, etc.), I can understand how caching works. The engine just checks to see if it's got a copy of the requested page in the cache, and displays it if so, or fetches it if not. But if a page is populated with variables from a database (for example) which could change from time to time, how could a caching engine possibly cache it? How would it determine whether to re-fetch the page or use the cached version? Paul -- Paul M. Foster -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP] best solution to ecommerce web pages
On Sun, 2009-06-07 at 13:29 +0200, mrfroasty wrote: Alain Roger wrote: Hi, i'm currently investigating what would be the best solution to develop an e-commerce web site. should i use some PHP template engine like smarty or CMS like Joomla, Drupal ? thanks a lot, Joomla +++ -- Extra details: OSS:Gentoo Linux profile:x86 Hardware:msi geforce 8600GT asus p5k-se location:/home/muhsin language(s):C/C++,VB,VHDL,bash,PHP,SQL,HTML,CSS Typo:40WPM url:http://mambo-tech.net url:http://blog.mambo-tech.net As commerce-orientated CMSs go, I've found OSCommerce to be pretty easy to get to grips with Ash www.ashleysheridan.co.uk -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP] How does caching work?
On Tue, Jun 9, 2009 at 16:35, Paul M Fosterpa...@quillandmouse.com wrote: But if a page is populated with variables from a database (for example) which could change from time to time, how could a caching engine possibly cache it? How would it determine whether to re-fetch the page or use the cached version? This is more a matter of the HTTP protocol and HTML standards. Check into meta (pragma) 'no-cache' tags and Google cache control for the basics on this. Thankfully, (at least most) clients do not check the full page to see if there's an updated version --- because if they did, they may as well display it, as they'd use up the network, server, and a portion of the client resources in doing so. Instead, they check the cache expire time and/or compare the local (cached) copy against the timestamp of what the server says for the file's last-modified stamp - known as a file's 'mtime' data. If I've somehow circumlocuted your question, ignore me and pretend I was never here. ;-P -- /Daniel P. Brown daniel.br...@parasane.net || danbr...@php.net http://www.parasane.net/ || http://www.pilotpig.net/ 50% Off All Shared Hosting Plans at PilotPig: Use Coupon DOW1 -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP] How does caching work?
Paul M Foster wrote: This question may be too complex for a reasonable answer on this list, but I'll ask anyway. If a page has static content (no PHP variables, etc.), I can understand how caching works. The engine just checks to see if it's got a copy of the requested page in the cache, and displays it if so, or fetches it if not. But if a page is populated with variables from a database (for example) which could change from time to time, how could a caching engine possibly cache it? How would it determine whether to re-fetch the page or use the cached version? By setting a duration during which stale information is not a problem. let's say you have a request for your homepage once per second. Now let's say you display the 10 most recent news articles on your homepage. Now let's say you cache the homepage news articles for 10 minutes. You save a bunch of database queries for every homepage request during those 10 minutes... approximately 600 requests. What does this cost you? You're homepage news articles may be stale for 9 minutes and 59 seconds. This is just a minor example, look at MediaWiki as an example of some heavy computation to render a page. This intense operation is cached so that it not be necessary on every article view. Wikis usually have a high number of read operations versus writes, in fact any site with a high number of reads versus writes probably has an opportunity for caching. Cheers, Rob. -- http://www.interjinn.com Application and Templating Framework for PHP -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP] Re: Cross site scripting
XSS or Cross Site Scripting is the ability to inject malicious javascript or HTML to the $_POST or $_GET variables, and at the bottom line - to get them printed and output-ed to the client through the HTML code of the page. In order to avoid such security issues all you have to do is to sanitise the $_GET and $_POST input before output-ing them to the browser. Check out htmlentities() and similar stuff. On Tue, Jun 9, 2009 at 8:47 PM, Skip Evanss...@bigskypenguin.com wrote: Well, the function filter_input(INPUT_GET, 'kw', FILTER_SANITIZE_ENCODED); ...seemed to take care of the example on the report by Security Metrics. Am I on the right track here, at least? I'm reading pages on 'sanitizing PHP input'. Is that where I should be headed? Skip Shawn McKenzie wrote: Skip Evans wrote: Hey all, You may have seen my earlier message about a current client whose site I've taken over maintenance on that is trying to get PCI Compliance from Security Metrics. I've put all the forms behind https and a couple of other things, but this one I don't know how to solve. I'll read up on cross site scripting, but could someone help me understand what they believe the vulnerability is in their notes below? Thanks, Skip Possible cross site scripting on http://www.ranghart.com/index.php Use the following commands to verify this: wp --inject http://www.ranghart.com/index.php?action=searchkw=SEARCH%22%3E%3Cscript%3Ealert%28123%29%3C% TCP http/https 4 curl -L http://www.ranghart.com/index.php?action=searchkw=SEARCH%22%3E%3Cscript%3Ealert%28123%29%3C% grep 123 This website may have other injection related vulnerabilities. Well, their example is not correct, try: http://www.ranghart.com/index.php?action=searchkw=SEARCH%3Cscript%3Ealert%28Im doing some nasty JavaScipt hacking here!%29%3B%3C%2Fscript%3E in a browser. This means that you're not validating/sanitizing input. You can't just take the contents of a $_GET, $_POST, etc. (any user input) variable and echo it out. -- Skip Evans Big Sky Penguin, LLC 503 S Baldwin St, #1 Madison WI 53703 608.250.2720 http://bigskypenguin.com Those of you who believe in telekinesis, raise my hand. -- Kurt Vonnegut -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP] best solution to ecommerce web pages
Ashley Sheridan wrote: On Sun, 2009-06-07 at 13:29 +0200, mrfroasty wrote: Alain Roger wrote: Hi, i'm currently investigating what would be the best solution to develop an e-commerce web site. should i use some PHP template engine like smarty or CMS like Joomla, Drupal ? thanks a lot, Joomla +++ -- Extra details: OSS:Gentoo Linux profile:x86 Hardware:msi geforce 8600GT asus p5k-se location:/home/muhsin language(s):C/C++,VB,VHDL,bash,PHP,SQL,HTML,CSS Typo:40WPM url:http://mambo-tech.net url:http://blog.mambo-tech.net As commerce-orientated CMSs go, I've found OSCommerce to be pretty easy to get to grips with osCommerce is lethargic, no realeses or release candidates have been put out in about 2 years. I'd put my money on ZenCart at this time. Cheers, Rob -- http://www.interjinn.com Application and Templating Framework for PHP -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP] Show the entire browser request
On Tue, 2009-06-09 at 17:58 +0300, Dotan Cohen wrote: There are no risks that I can see in the code. You're welcome to use it, and a link to http://stut.net/ is always appreciated ;-) In August when I will have more time to devote to it I will put it on the site. With link, and it is _me_ who appreciates _your_ help. Thanks! Dotan Cohen http://what-is-what.com http://gibberish.co.il Just checked your site in Elinks (works like Lynx) and I'm getting the headers come back to me. I'm assuming you changed your site code before me sending this and after you sent the original message? Ash www.ashleysheridan.co.uk -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP] best solution to ecommerce web pages
Ashley Sheridan wrote: On Sun, 2009-06-07 at 13:29 +0200, mrfroasty wrote: Alain Roger wrote: Hi, i'm currently investigating what would be the best solution to develop an e-commerce web site. should i use some PHP template engine like smarty or CMS like Joomla, Drupal ? thanks a lot, Joomla +++ -- Extra details: OSS:Gentoo Linux profile:x86 Hardware:msi geforce 8600GT asus p5k-se location:/home/muhsin language(s):C/C++,VB,VHDL,bash,PHP,SQL,HTML,CSS Typo:40WPM url:http://mambo-tech.net url:http://blog.mambo-tech.net As commerce-orientated CMSs go, I've found OSCommerce to be pretty easy to get to grips with Ash www.ashleysheridan.co.uk I had really bad experience with osCommerce. - I used on several stores in the company I worked for and it happened few times that fresh downloaded will be demaged - the code is easy to modify because it's writen very simple. but, since there was tons of developers (community) you will find annoying number of stiles the code is written. - easy to modify, but with any modification there is big chance you will not be able to patch/update/upgrade - every time I had an issue I had to wait several days on answers/help on their forum. of course, nobody is paid to help me but if just want to let you know - don't count on forum as fast help. - simply, my suggestion stay away from osCommerce, CRA and other derivates. I didn't use (yet), but according research I did, I wold recommend Drupal + Ubercart afan -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP] Show the entire browser request
Just checked your site in Elinks (works like Lynx) and I'm getting the headers come back to me. I'm assuming you changed your site code before me sending this and after you sent the original message? The individual headers are as they always were. It's the entire request verbatim (valid or not) that I'd like to add. -- Dotan Cohen http://what-is-what.com http://gibberish.co.il -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP] best solution to ecommerce web pages
On Tue, 2009-06-09 at 16:52 -0400, Robert Cummings wrote: Ashley Sheridan wrote: On Sun, 2009-06-07 at 13:29 +0200, mrfroasty wrote: Alain Roger wrote: Hi, i'm currently investigating what would be the best solution to develop an e-commerce web site. should i use some PHP template engine like smarty or CMS like Joomla, Drupal ? thanks a lot, Joomla +++ -- Extra details: OSS:Gentoo Linux profile:x86 Hardware:msi geforce 8600GT asus p5k-se location:/home/muhsin language(s):C/C++,VB,VHDL,bash,PHP,SQL,HTML,CSS Typo:40WPM url:http://mambo-tech.net url:http://blog.mambo-tech.net As commerce-orientated CMSs go, I've found OSCommerce to be pretty easy to get to grips with osCommerce is lethargic, no realeses or release candidates have been put out in about 2 years. I'd put my money on ZenCart at this time. Cheers, Rob -- http://www.interjinn.com Application and Templating Framework for PHP Ah, my last experience with it was 2 years ago, so that might explain why I didn't find that problem! Ash www.ashleysheridan.co.uk -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP] php applications
Paul M Foster wrote: On Mon, Jun 08, 2009 at 09:30:18AM -0700, Kyle Terry wrote: snip I don't mean to be the thread spirit killer, but I think another language would be better for this. Such as Python. PHP desktop apps might be fun to hack around with, but I wouldn't use it for a production application. I've coded a bit in Python, and parts of it really annoy me. I much prefer PHP, as it's more C-ish. Why wouldn't you use PHP for production applications? Paul Why wouldnt you? Besides the design of PHP generally being completely against it? PHP is not designed to be run continuously in infinite-loop (while true) scenarios... it's threading support is poor and it's memory handing and library are geared almost exclusively towards web-programming. If you want to compile it, or use it in a .NET/Java context... fine (see phc, etc.). The language itself can handle it, but the standard implementation *shouldnt*. In anycase other languages have much better support of desktop and network programming, entire libraries and communities have been developed around it. Preferably use Python/Java/etc. though C has its place. -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP] How does caching work?
2009/6/9 Paul M Foster pa...@quillandmouse.com: This question may be too complex for a reasonable answer on this list, but I'll ask anyway. If a page has static content (no PHP variables, etc.), I can understand how caching works. The engine just checks to see if it's got a copy of the requested page in the cache, and displays it if so, or fetches it if not. But if a page is populated with variables from a database (for example) which could change from time to time, how could a caching engine possibly cache it? How would it determine whether to re-fetch the page or use the cached version? Assuming you're not talking about client-side caching which Dan has already covered... Generally speaking there's two ways to approach server-side caching... update-on-expiry and update-on-change. For update-on-expiry you simply tell the caching system how long the cache should last and when the cache expires that chunk the code will generate it again from the database. In update-on-change you take a more pro-active approach and have any code that changes cached data update/expire any cache items that use it. Which approach is best depends on a number of factors including the type of data being cached, how often it will change and how fresh you need the site to be. It's also worth nothing that update-on-expiry is fine as it is for low traffic sites but if you have a high traffic site you'll need to look at locking the cache item while it's generated otherwise you could have a large number of requests simultaneously updating the same cache items. On the main site I maintain I use update-on-change and just store the raw data in the cache - most pages are generated from this data on-the-fly. There are a few pages that are hit a lot that I cache as an HTML chunk but for the most part it's just data in the cache. My reasoning behind this is that DB's are painful and expensive to scale whereas HTTP/PHP servers are simple and cheap. -Stuart -- http://stut.net/ -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP] php applications
On Mon, Jun 8, 2009 at 9:33 AM, Robert Cummings rob...@interjinn.comwrote: Kyle Terry wrote: On Mon, Jun 8, 2009 at 8:48 AM, tedd t...@sperling.com wrote: Hi gang: I've heard that php can be used for more than web programming, but I am not aware of specifically how that can be done. So, let me ask directly -- can php be used to create a Mac Application? If so, how? Cheers, tedd -- --- http://sperling.com http://ancientstones.com http://earthstones.com -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php I don't mean to be the thread spirit killer, but I think another language would be better for this. Such as Python. PHP desktop apps might be fun to hack around with, but I wouldn't use it for a production application. Why not? The technology won't mature if nobody uses it. And since there's a want, there's no reason why it can't. Not too sure how good Programmed desktop applications in PHP would look on a resume. ;) Cheers, Rob.
Re: [PHP] php applications
Depends on how you look at it, I'd take the perspective that that's a non-normal approach to the language and demonstrates a fuller understanding of the language. Same as if you put (and I do) wrote an asynchronous socket server in PHP. Despite the position PHP developers are usually applying for being limited to web development, I take the approach that non-standard usage of the language not only demonstrates a more mature understanding of the language, but also the ability to handle more complex (because who are we kidding, GUI programming is much more complex than web development) programming concepts and the ability to solve non-standard problems which aren't easily able to be googled. On Tue, Jun 9, 2009 at 7:59 PM, Kyle Terry k...@kyleterry.com wrote: On Mon, Jun 8, 2009 at 9:33 AM, Robert Cummings rob...@interjinn.com wrote: Kyle Terry wrote: On Mon, Jun 8, 2009 at 8:48 AM, tedd t...@sperling.com wrote: Hi gang: I've heard that php can be used for more than web programming, but I am not aware of specifically how that can be done. So, let me ask directly -- can php be used to create a Mac Application? If so, how? Cheers, tedd -- --- http://sperling.com http://ancientstones.com http://earthstones.com -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php I don't mean to be the thread spirit killer, but I think another language would be better for this. Such as Python. PHP desktop apps might be fun to hack around with, but I wouldn't use it for a production application. Why not? The technology won't mature if nobody uses it. And since there's a want, there's no reason why it can't. Not too sure how good Programmed desktop applications in PHP would look on a resume. ;) Cheers, Rob.
Re: [PHP] php applications
Kyle Terry wrote: On Mon, Jun 8, 2009 at 9:33 AM, Robert Cummings rob...@interjinn.comwrote: Kyle Terry wrote: On Mon, Jun 8, 2009 at 8:48 AM, tedd t...@sperling.com wrote: Hi gang: I've heard that php can be used for more than web programming, but I am not aware of specifically how that can be done. So, let me ask directly -- can php be used to create a Mac Application? If so, how? Cheers, tedd -- --- http://sperling.com http://ancientstones.com http://earthstones.com -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php I don't mean to be the thread spirit killer, but I think another language would be better for this. Such as Python. PHP desktop apps might be fun to hack around with, but I wouldn't use it for a production application. Why not? The technology won't mature if nobody uses it. And since there's a want, there's no reason why it can't. Not too sure how good Programmed desktop applications in PHP would look on a resume. ;) From my POV, better than writing Programmed desktop applications in VB. But that's just my POV :) Cheers, Rob. -- http://www.interjinn.com Application and Templating Framework for PHP -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP] Re: SHOULD I NOT USE ELSE IN IF STATEMENTS....?
On Tue, 09 Jun 2009 12:22:22 -0400, rob...@interjinn.com (Robert Cummings)
wrote:
Craige Leeder wrote:
I'm not sure I agree with NEVER using else. Sometimes else is a very
logical way to organize code. However, it should not be used for data
validation IE:
function myValidatorFunc($data) {
if (empty(data)) {
return false;
} else {
if (!is_numeric($data)) {
return false;
} else {
}
}
}
It's all about how deep you nest your code, and keeping the flow clean.
That code would be much more readable as such:
function myValidatorFunc($data) {
if (empty(data)) {
throw new BadMethodCallException(Paramater data missing);
}
if (!is_numeric($data)) {
throw new InvalidArgumentException(Paramater data should be an
integer.);
}
}
See the difference?
I believe the article was suggesting not ending a function that returns
a value with no return. So rather than return in the else, return
outside the else as the last expression of the function. This way it is
clear that the function returns a value.
Contrast:
?php
function foo( $foo )
{
if( $foo )
{
return true;
}
else
{
return false;
}
}
?
Versus:
?php
function foo( $foo )
{
if( $foo )
{
return true;
}
return false;
}
?
Personally, I also prefer the latter style.
I don't particularly like scattered returns, and prefer
Function foo;
{
result = false;
if ( ) { $result = 'yellow'; }
elseif ( ) { $result = 'blue'; }
return $result;
}
--
PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/)
To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP] php applications
Michael wrote: Paul M Foster wrote: On Mon, Jun 08, 2009 at 09:30:18AM -0700, Kyle Terry wrote: snip I don't mean to be the thread spirit killer, but I think another language would be better for this. Such as Python. PHP desktop apps might be fun to hack around with, but I wouldn't use it for a production application. I've coded a bit in Python, and parts of it really annoy me. I much prefer PHP, as it's more C-ish. Why wouldn't you use PHP for production applications? Paul Why wouldnt you? Besides the design of PHP generally being completely against it? PHP is not designed to be run continuously in infinite-loop (while true) scenarios... Citation? it's threading support is poor and it's memory What does threading support have to do with running something in an infinite loop? What if I don't need threads? handing and library are geared almost exclusively towards web-programming. I dunno, I've written amultitude of shell/cron scripts in PHP that leverage the codebase already written for the web application. If you want to compile it, or use it in a .NET/Java context... fine (see phc, etc.). The language itself can handle it, but the standard implementation *shouldnt*. Why? In anycase other languages have much better support of desktop and network programming, entire libraries and communities have been developed around it. Preferably use Python/Java/etc. though C has its place. As I've said before, ones place in the sun can't be identified if one never tries sitting in the sun. It's hard to grasp the proverbial brass ring if you never extend your reach. Cheers, Rob. -- http://www.interjinn.com Application and Templating Framework for PHP -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP] php applications
On Tue, Jun 9, 2009 at 20:42, Robert Cummingsrob...@interjinn.com wrote: From my POV, better than writing Programmed desktop applications in VB. But that's just my POV :) Did I happen to tell you that's what I've been doing all day, or are you just *that* good at making me miserable --- even when it's not *me* to whom you're speaking? ;-P -- /Daniel P. Brown daniel.br...@parasane.net || danbr...@php.net http://www.parasane.net/ || http://www.pilotpig.net/ 50% Off All Shared Hosting Plans at PilotPig: Use Coupon DOW1 -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP] php applications
Robert Cummings wrote: Michael wrote: Paul M Foster wrote: On Mon, Jun 08, 2009 at 09:30:18AM -0700, Kyle Terry wrote: snip I don't mean to be the thread spirit killer, but I think another language would be better for this. Such as Python. PHP desktop apps might be fun to hack around with, but I wouldn't use it for a production application. I've coded a bit in Python, and parts of it really annoy me. I much prefer PHP, as it's more C-ish. Why wouldn't you use PHP for production applications? Paul Why wouldnt you? Besides the design of PHP generally being completely against it? PHP is not designed to be run continuously in infinite-loop (while true) scenarios... Citation? see the history of php development and use it's threading support is poor and it's memory What does threading support have to do with running something in an infinite loop? What if I don't need threads? handing and library are geared almost exclusively towards web-programming. I dunno, I've written amultitude of shell/cron scripts in PHP that leverage the codebase already written for the web application. i wasnt arguing against cron-scripts, these are 'run-once' sort of things which php handles well. they dont run for minutes let alone hours. If you want to compile it, or use it in a .NET/Java context... fine (see phc, etc.). The language itself can handle it, but the standard implementation *shouldnt*. Why? for the reasons detailed in this post. using web-oriented php as a desktop programming language is a magnitude of dumb perhaps only eclipsed by the smarty programming language In anycase other languages have much better support of desktop and network programming, entire libraries and communities have been developed around it. Preferably use Python/Java/etc. though C has its place. As I've said before, ones place in the sun can't be identified if one never tries sitting in the sun. It's hard to grasp the proverbial brass ring if you never extend your reach. There are good reasons why php isnt in the sun (ie. used for desktop programming), as i've listed. If you'd care to learn a few other languages the reasons would be immediately obvious, python can be learnt in a few days - try it. Cheers, Rob. The standard PHP execution model is geared almost exclusively towards web-used (though crons etc. are reasonable)... that is, to sit in/with a server and handle requests... to operate over, at maximum, insane lifespans of 30 seconds. There are languages designed to be used for desktop programming, and for various tasks in general. The smart thing would be to use them. PHP may be a hammer, but every problem is not a nail. Use the tools designed for the job. Michael -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP] php applications
While the technology is pretty immature at the moment, due to its under-use no doubt, saying that PHP is never the tool for a desktop application is pretty inane. While the primary developmental lifecycle is geared towards web development (who's arguing that?), there's nothing really pervasive preventing people from using it for desktop apps. Given the recent focus towards closing memory leaks internally and the control of the (new, iirc) garbage collector, I wouldn't say it's a bad idea, resource speaking, to write in PHP (certainly no worse than Java). There's sound support, GTK support, CUPS support, Windows COM / printing support, so the support for the APIs is certainly there (and where it's not, there's ways around it, like with the java extension). Just because you have a hammer that's only been used for nailing particle board doesn't mean it's not suited for hammering into plywood! The only issue I see with PHP is the relative difficulty of making stand-alone applications that are bundled with a statically compiled PHP executable, but that shouldn't be too hard to overcome, with a little bit of time and creativity. On Tue, Jun 9, 2009 at 9:28 PM, Michael mich...@mjburgess.co.uk wrote: Robert Cummings wrote: Michael wrote: Paul M Foster wrote: On Mon, Jun 08, 2009 at 09:30:18AM -0700, Kyle Terry wrote: snip I don't mean to be the thread spirit killer, but I think another language would be better for this. Such as Python. PHP desktop apps might be fun to hack around with, but I wouldn't use it for a production application. I've coded a bit in Python, and parts of it really annoy me. I much prefer PHP, as it's more C-ish. Why wouldn't you use PHP for production applications? Paul Why wouldnt you? Besides the design of PHP generally being completely against it? PHP is not designed to be run continuously in infinite-loop (while true) scenarios... Citation? see the history of php development and use it's threading support is poor and it's memory What does threading support have to do with running something in an infinite loop? What if I don't need threads? handing and library are geared almost exclusively towards web-programming. I dunno, I've written amultitude of shell/cron scripts in PHP that leverage the codebase already written for the web application. i wasnt arguing against cron-scripts, these are 'run-once' sort of things which php handles well. they dont run for minutes let alone hours. If you want to compile it, or use it in a .NET/Java context... fine (see phc, etc.). The language itself can handle it, but the standard implementation *shouldnt*. Why? for the reasons detailed in this post. using web-oriented php as a desktop programming language is a magnitude of dumb perhaps only eclipsed by the smarty programming language In anycase other languages have much better support of desktop and network programming, entire libraries and communities have been developed around it. Preferably use Python/Java/etc. though C has its place. As I've said before, ones place in the sun can't be identified if one never tries sitting in the sun. It's hard to grasp the proverbial brass ring if you never extend your reach. There are good reasons why php isnt in the sun (ie. used for desktop programming), as i've listed. If you'd care to learn a few other languages the reasons would be immediately obvious, python can be learnt in a few days - try it. Cheers, Rob. The standard PHP execution model is geared almost exclusively towards web-used (though crons etc. are reasonable)... that is, to sit in/with a server and handle requests... to operate over, at maximum, insane lifespans of 30 seconds. There are languages designed to be used for desktop programming, and for various tasks in general. The smart thing would be to use them. PHP may be a hammer, but every problem is not a nail. Use the tools designed for the job. Michael -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP] php applications
This was about half of my point, writing these applications in PHP is difficult, it is a task to be overcome. PHP requires cajoling into being useful. Your solution to use the Java extension is peculiarly ironic - yes: Use Java! If the only language you know is PHP i'm sure it looks very capable, and i was, several years ago, in this position (wanting to write various desktop apps in it) the wise and experienced freenode gurus then told me to learn the right tools. Despite how it may look from the myopia of primarily PHP development, PHP isnt a desktop-capable language. It would take a great deal of time and effort to do in PHP what would take a handful of lines in python, due to the extensive library support. Many PHP programmers goes thru' the phase of wanting to write 'http servers', 'irc clients', etc. in PHP. It would be irresponsible to not point them in the direction of more capable languages, when they are in fact, greatly more capable. Eddie Drapkin wrote: While the technology is pretty immature at the moment, due to its under-use no doubt, saying that PHP is never the tool for a desktop application is pretty inane. While the primary developmental lifecycle is geared towards web development (who's arguing that?), there's nothing really pervasive preventing people from using it for desktop apps. Given the recent focus towards closing memory leaks internally and the control of the (new, iirc) garbage collector, I wouldn't say it's a bad idea, resource speaking, to write in PHP (certainly no worse than Java). There's sound support, GTK support, CUPS support, Windows COM / printing support, so the support for the APIs is certainly there (and where it's not, there's ways around it, like with the java extension). Just because you have a hammer that's only been used for nailing particle board doesn't mean it's not suited for hammering into plywood! The only issue I see with PHP is the relative difficulty of making stand-alone applications that are bundled with a statically compiled PHP executable, but that shouldn't be too hard to overcome, with a little bit of time and creativity. On Tue, Jun 9, 2009 at 9:28 PM, Michael mich...@mjburgess.co.uk wrote: Robert Cummings wrote: Michael wrote: Paul M Foster wrote: On Mon, Jun 08, 2009 at 09:30:18AM -0700, Kyle Terry wrote: snip I don't mean to be the thread spirit killer, but I think another language would be better for this. Such as Python. PHP desktop apps might be fun to hack around with, but I wouldn't use it for a production application. I've coded a bit in Python, and parts of it really annoy me. I much prefer PHP, as it's more C-ish. Why wouldn't you use PHP for production applications? Paul Why wouldnt you? Besides the design of PHP generally being completely against it? PHP is not designed to be run continuously in infinite-loop (while true) scenarios... Citation? see the history of php development and use it's threading support is poor and it's memory What does threading support have to do with running something in an infinite loop? What if I don't need threads? handing and library are geared almost exclusively towards web-programming. I dunno, I've written amultitude of shell/cron scripts in PHP that leverage the codebase already written for the web application. i wasnt arguing against cron-scripts, these are 'run-once' sort of things which php handles well. they dont run for minutes let alone hours. If you want to compile it, or use it in a .NET/Java context... fine (see phc, etc.). The language itself can handle it, but the standard implementation *shouldnt*. Why? for the reasons detailed in this post. using web-oriented php as a desktop programming language is a magnitude of dumb perhaps only eclipsed by the smarty programming language In anycase other languages have much better support of desktop and network programming, entire libraries and communities have been developed around it. Preferably use Python/Java/etc. though C has its place. As I've said before, ones place in the sun can't be identified if one never tries sitting in the sun. It's hard to grasp the proverbial brass ring if you never extend your reach. There are good reasons why php isnt in the sun (ie. used for desktop programming), as i've listed. If you'd care to learn a few other languages the reasons would be immediately obvious, python can be learnt in a few days - try it. Cheers, Rob. The standard PHP execution model is geared almost exclusively towards web-used (though crons etc. are reasonable)... that is, to sit in/with a server and handle requests... to operate over, at maximum, insane lifespans of 30 seconds. There are languages designed to be used for desktop programming, and for various tasks in general. The smart thing would be to use them. PHP may be a hammer, but every problem is not a nail. Use the tools designed for the job. Michael -- PHP General Mailing List
Re: [PHP] php applications
Hate to police threads here, but please don't top-post. On Tue, Jun 9, 2009 at 21:48, Michaelmich...@mjburgess.co.uk wrote: This was about half of my point, writing these applications in PHP is difficult, it is a task to be overcome. PHP requires cajoling into being useful. Your solution to use the Java extension is peculiarly ironic - yes: Use Java! As someone who programs in several languages (to a degree of competence and skill I shall leave judged by those who receive the end-result of my work) and who is directly-involved in the PHP Project, I feel more than qualified to disagree with you on this. Coincidentally, I do. For once my qualifications and opinion lie in the same place (and not just because my wife told me that they belong there). If the only language you know is PHP i'm sure it looks very capable, and i was, several years ago, in this position (wanting to write various desktop apps in it) the wise and experienced freenode gurus then told me to learn the right tools. Despite how it may look from the myopia of primarily PHP development, PHP isnt a desktop-capable language. It would take a great deal of time and effort to do in PHP what would take a handful of lines in python, due to the extensive library support. This is not only incorrect, but exhibits deeper issues. Python seems more capable because you are importing numerous modules, nodes, and extensions, in turn inheriting and extending others, building a full framework. The same can - and is - done in PHP. Perhaps not in the stock distribution, but in more than a few third-party offerings. And this doesn't even touch into the PEAR and PECL stuff, nor the fact that Python is more than one-and-a-half times as old as modern PHP. Many PHP programmers goes thru' the phase of wanting to write 'http servers', 'irc clients', etc. in PHP. It would be irresponsible to not point them in the direction of more capable languages, when they are in fact, greatly more capable. is what you would say if you hoped beyond hope that technology would stagnate. All of this said, believe it or not, I do agree with the statement that there are other languages better-suited to desktop programming (at this time), just not for the points so far that you've argued. We're on the same side, just not the same end. ;-P -- /Daniel P. Brown daniel.br...@parasane.net || danbr...@php.net http://www.parasane.net/ || http://www.pilotpig.net/ 50% Off All Shared Hosting Plans at PilotPig: Use Coupon DOW1 -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP] php applications
Daniel Brown wrote: Hate to police threads here, but please don't top-post. Apologies, my client was not configured properly. Hopefully it is threading now, if not please notify me. Michael -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP] php applications
Michael wrote: Robert Cummings wrote: Michael wrote: Paul M Foster wrote: On Mon, Jun 08, 2009 at 09:30:18AM -0700, Kyle Terry wrote: snip I don't mean to be the thread spirit killer, but I think another language would be better for this. Such as Python. PHP desktop apps might be fun to hack around with, but I wouldn't use it for a production application. I've coded a bit in Python, and parts of it really annoy me. I much prefer PHP, as it's more C-ish. Why wouldn't you use PHP for production applications? Paul Why wouldnt you? Besides the design of PHP generally being completely against it? PHP is not designed to be run continuously in infinite-loop (while true) scenarios... Citation? see the history of php development and use Please explain the purpose of the php-cli binary? it's threading support is poor and it's memory What does threading support have to do with running something in an infinite loop? What if I don't need threads? handing and library are geared almost exclusively towards web-programming. I dunno, I've written amultitude of shell/cron scripts in PHP that leverage the codebase already written for the web application. i wasnt arguing against cron-scripts, these are 'run-once' sort of things which php handles well. they dont run for minutes let alone hours. I have daemons in PHP that have been running for months without stop. They are using the infinite-loop mechanism you purport to be not designed for continuous long-term use. I have an mplayer wrapper script that has been running for the past 3 months non-stop... it's purpose is to shuffle my kids shows, reload a play list when it changes, allow queueing of shows, handle random selection of shows based on tags and weighting, remember what episode in a series was last played and where the timestamp currently rests... all this without being shut down. If you want to compile it, or use it in a .NET/Java context... fine (see phc, etc.). The language itself can handle it, but the standard implementation *shouldnt*. Why? for the reasons detailed in this post. using web-oriented php as a desktop programming language is a magnitude of dumb perhaps only eclipsed by the smarty programming language Narrow mindedness won't earn you any brownie points from me. In anycase other languages have much better support of desktop and network programming, entire libraries and communities have been developed around it. Preferably use Python/Java/etc. though C has its place. There's always other languages... there's always another language better at doing something... so what? There was Perl before PHP, Perl was undoubtedly better than PHP for web applications at one point... yet I would argue that has changed... why? Because the naysayers were ignored. As I've said before, ones place in the sun can't be identified if one never tries sitting in the sun. It's hard to grasp the proverbial brass ring if you never extend your reach. There are good reasons why php isnt in the sun (ie. used for desktop programming), as i've listed. If you'd care to learn a few other languages the reasons would be immediately obvious, python can be learnt in a few days - try it. Cheers, Rob. The standard PHP execution model is geared almost exclusively towards web-used (though crons etc. are reasonable)... that is, to sit in/with a server and handle requests... to operate over, at maximum, insane lifespans of 30 seconds. Please point me to this standard-- I would like to have a gander at it. There are languages designed to be used for desktop programming, and for various tasks in general. The smart thing would be to use them. PHP may be a hammer, but every problem is not a nail. Languages were designed to be programmed, what they are programmed to do is entirely up to the programmer. Use the tools designed for the job. Then how would we find new uses for the tools? Just because there's only one known use for a tool, doesn't exclude it for consideration for new uses. There's always serendipity too. Cheers, Rob. -- http://www.interjinn.com Application and Templating Framework for PHP -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP] php applications
Michael wrote: This was about half of my point, writing these applications in PHP is difficult, it is a task to be overcome. PHP requires cajoling into being useful. Your solution to use the Java extension is peculiarly ironic - yes: Use Java! If the only language you know is PHP i'm sure it looks very capable, and i was, several years ago, in this position (wanting to write various desktop apps in it) the wise and experienced freenode gurus then told me to learn the right tools. Despite how it may look from the myopia of primarily PHP development, PHP isnt a desktop-capable language. It would take a great deal of time and effort to do in PHP what would take a handful of lines in python, due to the extensive library support. Many PHP programmers goes thru' the phase of wanting to write 'http servers', 'irc clients', etc. in PHP. It would be irresponsible to not point them in the direction of more capable languages, when they are in fact, greatly more capable. I program in several languages, but I do enjoy the speed in which I can cobble together something functional in PHP with minimal effort. You underestimate the glue power of PHP. I don't need to program something like mplayer in PHP, it is sufficient that I can control it and expand upon it via PHP. PHP is quite competent at filling many of the roles formerly handled by Perl. Yes there are advantages to other languages, certainly other languages can be better choices for any particular application, but outright exclusion of PHP just to fulfill your fantasy of the right tool for the job is just silly. Cheers, Rob. -- http://www.interjinn.com Application and Templating Framework for PHP -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP] php applications
Languages were designed to be programmed, what they are programmed to do is entirely up to the programmer. Perhaps there is no hope then. This is so distant from the actual case it does not require more than pointing out. If you want to write demons in php fine, i wince at the thought. The question isnt whether a PHP programmer thinks PHP is the right tool for the job, unanimously the answer will be 'yes' because of the myopia of the position. It is whether people with experience on a number of different platform, using a number of different languages think it is... i've yet to hear *anyone* in this position advocate PHP. Michael -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP] php applications
Michael wrote: Languages were designed to be programmed, what they are programmed to do is entirely up to the programmer. Perhaps there is no hope then. This is so distant from the actual case it does not require more than pointing out. If you want to write demons in php fine, i wince at the thought. Demons are fantastical creatures. The word you're erroneously trying to repeat is daemon. The question isnt whether a PHP programmer thinks PHP is the right tool for the job, unanimously the answer will be 'yes' because of the myopia of the position. It is whether people with experience on a number of different platform, using a number of different languages think it is... i've yet to hear *anyone* in this position advocate PHP. I don't have myopia, I've already said many times that there can certainly be better ways to do something, there can be more established choices, but just because there are, doesn't preclude the use of a less worthy tool with the possible side effect that the less worthy tool undergoes some kind of evolution such that it becomes a better choice in the future. There was a time when C was a less worthy choice, there was a time when Java was a less worthy choice, there was a time when you probably had a more open mind. The fact remains that things change, and usually change is driven by some impetus. That impetus may indeed be due to the selected environment having been found lacking. Cheers, Rob. -- http://www.interjinn.com Application and Templating Framework for PHP -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP] php applications
Robert Cummings wrote: Michael wrote: Languages were designed to be programmed, what they are programmed to do is entirely up to the programmer. Perhaps there is no hope then. This is so distant from the actual case it does not require more than pointing out. If you want to write demons in php fine, i wince at the thought. Demons are fantastical creatures. The word you're erroneously trying to repeat is daemon. You'll find both spellings refer to the same thing. The question isnt whether a PHP programmer thinks PHP is the right tool for the job, unanimously the answer will be 'yes' because of the myopia of the position. It is whether people with experience on a number of different platform, using a number of different languages think it is... i've yet to hear *anyone* in this position advocate PHP. I don't have myopia, I've already said many times that there can certainly be better ways to do something, there can be more established choices, but just because there are, doesn't preclude the use of a less worthy tool with the possible side effect that the less worthy tool undergoes some kind of evolution such that it becomes a better choice in the future. You're advocating using a hammer as a screwdriver to spur the invention of the screwdriver? We already have the screwdriver, it's called python. If you need a drill there's Java, etc. There was a time when C was a less worthy choice, there was a time when Java was a less worthy choice, there was a time when you probably had a more open mind. The fact remains that things change, and usually change is driven by some impetus. That impetus may indeed be due to the selected environment having been found lacking. Yes, certainly. This is why we have phc, phalanger, pint, mod_php, PHP4Mono, etc. You'll also notice youre talking about a progression of languages... not a progression within a language. People arent writing operating systems in python precisely because that would be an absurd misuse of a tool, nor are they writing RDMBs in PHP. There are good reasons for this. Michael -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP] php applications
Michael wrote: Robert Cummings wrote: Michael wrote: Languages were designed to be programmed, what they are programmed to do is entirely up to the programmer. Perhaps there is no hope then. This is so distant from the actual case it does not require more than pointing out. If you want to write demons in php fine, i wince at the thought. Demons are fantastical creatures. The word you're erroneously trying to repeat is daemon. You'll find both spellings refer to the same thing. Doh. The question isnt whether a PHP programmer thinks PHP is the right tool for the job, unanimously the answer will be 'yes' because of the myopia of the position. It is whether people with experience on a number of different platform, using a number of different languages think it is... i've yet to hear *anyone* in this position advocate PHP. I don't have myopia, I've already said many times that there can certainly be better ways to do something, there can be more established choices, but just because there are, doesn't preclude the use of a less worthy tool with the possible side effect that the less worthy tool undergoes some kind of evolution such that it becomes a better choice in the future. You're advocating using a hammer as a screwdriver to spur the invention of the screwdriver? We already have the screwdriver, it's called python. If you need a drill there's Java, etc. No, I'm advocation the invention of the Robertson screwdriver despite the existence of the Philips screwdriver! There was a time when C was a less worthy choice, there was a time when Java was a less worthy choice, there was a time when you probably had a more open mind. The fact remains that things change, and usually change is driven by some impetus. That impetus may indeed be due to the selected environment having been found lacking. Yes, certainly. This is why we have phc, phalanger, pint, mod_php, PHP4Mono, etc. I'm not sure what point you were making with the above list. You'll also notice youre talking about a progression of languages... not a progression within a language. People arent writing operating systems in python precisely because that would be an absurd misuse of a tool, nor are they writing RDMBs in PHP. There are good reasons for this. No, I'm specifically talking about a progression WITHIN a language. When C first came out there were likely almost no libraries available and many many ASM libraries. That changed over time. You already made a point about libraries being a reasonable criteria for language selection. Cheers, Rob. -- http://www.interjinn.com Application and Templating Framework for PHP -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP] php applications
On Wed, Jun 10, 2009 at 02:48:23AM +0100, Michael wrote: This was about half of my point, writing these applications in PHP is difficult, it is a task to be overcome. PHP requires cajoling into being useful. Your solution to use the Java extension is peculiarly ironic - yes: Use Java! If the only language you know is PHP i'm sure it looks very capable, and i was, several years ago, in this position (wanting to write various desktop apps in it) the wise and experienced freenode gurus then told me to learn the right tools. Despite how it may look from the myopia of primarily PHP development, PHP isnt a desktop-capable language. It would take a great deal of time and effort to do in PHP what would take a handful of lines in python, due to the extensive library support. Not. PHP is based very closely on C. Its syntax and native function calls mirror C almost completely. Considering the breadth of applications written for the desktop in C, I think your argument is weak. Especially when you consider that, unlike C, we don't have to predefine variables and PHP does its own memory management and housecleaning, unlike C. Moreover, there are tons of add-on extensions for PHP which allow it to do some very unusual things. Same is true for C (but in C, they're libraries). I'm just playing devil's advocate here. Normally I would use Python or Bash for anything shell, and some GUI apps. But I haven't heard a really compelling reason yet for *not* using PHP. Paul -- Paul M. Foster -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
[PHP] PHP as Server Side for a Web Database Application.
Hi, We are in phase of evaluating PHP as Serverside technology for our first web application. We have finalized Flex for user interface and Birt as reporting engine. Now the data services are to be evaluated. Flex forums recommended us using PHP for this. We would like to implement SOA for database access/Inserts/Updates/Queries for report engine BIRT. For SOA implementation we are considering XML-RPC and WSO2-WSF since we dont have any past experience on web development we are not position to make any decisions about PHP serverside technologies can somebody guide use which one we should select (May be different than these two). We will be using flex forms to insert and update data through web services (mainly CRUD operations) and PHP Query data services will be acting as Data Source to Birt for reporting. Please suggest us technolgy which is secure and prooven. The problem of integrating Birt in to PHP has been solved and successfully tested also. Thanks and Best Regards Raja
