Re: Everything You Know Is Wrong (Object Systems Yet Again)

2002-08-13 Thread Rocco Caputo
On Fri, Aug 09, 2002 at 11:22:05PM -0600, Chris Fedde wrote: Second: Maybe I am misreading things a bit. It appears that the actual level of abstraction in this system is not much higher than exists for the current PoCo set of packages. I was hoping for something much higher level that

Re: Everything You Know Is Wrong (Object Systems Yet Again)

2002-08-11 Thread tr16
On Sat, Aug 10, 2002 at 12:15:20AM +0200, Arthur Bergman wrote: On fredag, augusti 9, 2002, at 03:33 , [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Then go take that time and improve ithreads performance ! :) That's a prerequisite for transaction support somehow ... torvald How so? And whats

Re: Everything You Know Is Wrong (Object Systems Yet Again)

2002-08-11 Thread tr16
On Sat, Aug 10, 2002 at 02:22:58PM -0600, Chris Fedde wrote: On Sat, 10 Aug 2002 14:18:57 -0400 Rocco Caputo wrote: +-- | You bring up an interesting question in passing. What should POE's | components be called? POE::Component, POE::Class, POE::Object?

Re: Everything You Know Is Wrong (Object Systems Yet Again)

2002-08-10 Thread Rocco Caputo
On Fri, Aug 09, 2002 at 11:22:05PM -0600, Chris Fedde wrote: First: Are you abandoning plain perl? Will POE become a preprocessor that chews on both code and pod/markup segments to build the final system? I'm not sure I like that idea much. I enjoy a clean separation between doc and

Re: Everything You Know Is Wrong (Object Systems Yet Again)

2002-08-09 Thread Rocco Caputo
On Fri, Aug 09, 2002 at 01:41:46AM +0200, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: hi, here are my comments: -detailed information about aggregates: components not only provide methods, they can hold data as well. so you might need several components of one type, and you might want to share them

Re: Everything You Know Is Wrong (Object Systems Yet Again)

2002-08-09 Thread tr16
On Fri, Aug 09, 2002 at 03:18:55AM -0400, Rocco Caputo wrote: The issue then becomes: How do specific instances of these anonymous, dynamic components communicate with each other? The difficult part of this problem is specifying the path for messages to travel. How do you link an instance

Re: Everything You Know Is Wrong (Object Systems Yet Again)

2002-08-09 Thread Arthur Bergman
On fredag, augusti 9, 2002, at 01:42 , [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Arthur's question towards transaction support would be the real, big solution. It would be really cool to support transactions, and if you have full control about the input that goes into components you can do rollback, make

Re: Everything You Know Is Wrong (Object Systems Yet Again)

2002-08-09 Thread tr16
On Fri, Aug 09, 2002 at 01:47:27PM +0200, Arthur Bergman wrote: I agree, transactions are often overkill and can be heavy, designing in support for transactions that can be enabled and added in the future would be very cool. We have all the time in the world :-) Then go take that time

Re: Everything You Know Is Wrong (Object Systems Yet Again)

2002-08-09 Thread tr16
On Fri, Aug 09, 2002 at 08:30:00AM -0400, Richard Soderberg wrote: On Friday, August 9, 2002, at 07:42 AM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: What I meant was something different. A directory in which components can publish their services can be helpful, like you said. The interfaces I'm

Re: Everything You Know Is Wrong (Object Systems Yet Again)

2002-08-09 Thread Al Tobey
Dia (http://www.lysator.liu.se/~alla/dia/) can draw UML, but can only generate C++ and Java (using a separate tool). I've used it for documentation purposes, but not much else. It's part of GNOME, it's free, it's written in C. -Al Tobey BTW, still working on marionette licensing. Slow as

Re: Everything You Know Is Wrong (Object Systems Yet Again)

2002-08-09 Thread tr16
On Fri, Aug 09, 2002 at 10:43:01AM -0400, Al Tobey wrote: Dia (http://www.lysator.liu.se/~alla/dia/) can draw UML, but can only generate C++ and Java (using a separate tool). I've used it for documentation purposes, but not much else. It's part of GNOME, it's free, it's written in C. Well,

RE: Everything You Know Is Wrong (Object Systems Yet Again)

2002-08-09 Thread Garrett Goebel
From: Rocco Caputo I keep looking at UML, but nothing on the web has made much of an impression with me. Is there a good book about UML? UML Distilled: www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/020165783X POE users should not be required to know UML. It its done well, consumers of UML diagrams

Re: Everything You Know Is Wrong (Object Systems Yet Again)

2002-08-09 Thread Richard Soderberg
On Friday, August 9, 2002, at 07:42 AM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: What I meant was something different. A directory in which components can publish their services can be helpful, like you said. The interfaces I'm talking about are real roles that components claim to be able to play. So

Re: Everything You Know Is Wrong (Object Systems Yet Again)

2002-08-09 Thread Chris Fedde
On Fri, 9 Aug 2002 10:09:36 -0500 Garrett Goebel wrote: +-- | From: Rocco Caputo | I keep looking at UML, but nothing on the web has made much of an | impression with me. Is there a good book about UML? | | UML Distilled: www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/020165783X |

Re: Everything You Know Is Wrong (Object Systems Yet Again)

2002-08-09 Thread Al Tobey
Well, generating Perl should be possible then. I think the approach of embedding the description (UML or Rocco's notation) in the Perl code is better. There are tools that try to generate UML from code, but this is hard, and probably impossible for Perl code. Additionally, POE does want to

Re: Everything You Know Is Wrong (Object Systems Yet Again)

2002-08-09 Thread tr16
On Fri, Aug 09, 2002 at 12:27:02PM -0400, Al Tobey wrote: Note that I think creating a custom description language/format within POE would likely be much more efficient than using UML. I don't remember seeing any UML-type modules on CPAN. Although, the XML modules are quite nice - I've used

Re: Everything You Know Is Wrong (Object Systems Yet Again)

2002-08-09 Thread tr16
On Fri, Aug 09, 2002 at 10:25:17AM -0600, Chris Fedde wrote: On Fri, 9 Aug 2002 10:09:36 -0500 Garrett Goebel wrote: +-- | From: Rocco Caputo | I keep looking at UML, but nothing on the web has made much of an | impression with me. Is there a good book about UML? |

Re: Everything You Know Is Wrong (Object Systems Yet Again)

2002-08-09 Thread Arthur Bergman
On fredag, augusti 9, 2002, at 03:33 , [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Then go take that time and improve ithreads performance ! :) That's a prerequisite for transaction support somehow ... torvald How so? And whats wrong with the performance? Arthur

Re: Everything You Know Is Wrong (Object Systems Yet Again)

2002-08-08 Thread tr16
hi, here are my comments: -detailed information about aggregates: components not only provide methods, they can hold data as well. so you might need several components of one type, and you might want to share them with other aggregated components. so the namespace that is filled with