powermail-discuss Digest #2893 - Thursday, November 11, 2010
Re: 2 GB limit
by "Jeremy Hughes" <jer...@softpress.com>
Re: 2 GB limit
by "Tobias Jung" <new...@tobiasjung.net>
Re: 2 GB limit
by "Jeremy Hughes" <jer...@softpress.com>
Re: 2 GB limit
by "Tobias Jung" <new...@tobiasjung.net>
Re: 2 GB limit
by "John Snippe" <j...@snippe.ca>
Re(2): 2 GB limit
by "George Henne" <g...@nsbasic.com>
Re: 2 GB limit
by "Michael J. Hußmann" <mich...@michael-hussmann.de>
Re: Creator Codes
by "Michael J. Hußmann" <mich...@michael-hussmann.de>
Re: 2 GB limit
by "Tobias Jung" <new...@tobiasjung.net>
Re: Creator Codes
by "Tobias Jung" <new...@tobiasjung.net>
Re: 2 GB limit
by "Jeremy Hughes" <jer...@softpress.com>
Re: 2 GB limit
by "Michael J. Hußmann" <mich...@michael-hussmann.de>
Re: 2 GB limit
by "Beatrix Willius" <bwill...@gmx.de>
Re: 2 GB limit
by "Jeremy Hughes" <jer...@softpress.com>
Re: Creator Codes
by "Beatrix Willius" <bwill...@gmx.de>
Re(2): 2 GB limit
by "George Henne" <g...@nsbasic.com>
Re: Creator Codes
by "Tobias Jung" <new...@tobiasjung.net>
Re: Creator Codes
by "Beatrix Willius" <bwill...@gmx.de>
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Subject: Re: 2 GB limit
From: "Jeremy Hughes" <jer...@softpress.com>
Date: Thu, 11 Nov 2010 11:10:14 +0000
Sean McBride (9/11/10, 02:31) said:
>Which email client are you all switching to? I'm not sure which to
choose....
What are the pluses and minuses of switching to Apple Mail?
I know it was hinky in the past, but I think that many of the problems
that it used to suffer from have now been resolved.
The main things that have kept me from switching are that PowerMail has
better filtering and notifications, and maybe better searching.
The advantages of switching (that I know about) are:
1. Separate databases for each mailbox rather than a single monolithic
database (this solves the 2GB limit issue and backup problem)
2. Threading
3. Decent IMAP support
4. Decent HTML support (not so important to me personally)
I've kind-of been preparing for a switch by archiving old mail into
Apple Mail - in an attempt to stay below the 2GB limit (and vainly
hoping that CTM would fix PowerMail in the meantime).
Jeremy
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Subject: Re: 2 GB limit
From: "Tobias Jung" <new...@tobiasjung.net>
Date: Thu, 11 Nov 2010 14:32:47 +0100
Jeremy Hughes wrote (Thu, 11 Nov 2010 11:10:14 +0000):
> [Apple Mail]
> 1. Separate databases for each mailbox rather than a single monolithic
> database (this solves the 2GB limit issue and backup problem)
Just to be accurate:
Nowadays Apple Mail saves each _message_ as a single file, MBOX was
dropped with the Tiger version.
Of course, this also solves both issues. I just wanted to point this out
because some people don't like the idea of having thousands of message
files, too.
Kind regards,
Tobias Jung
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Subject: Re: 2 GB limit
From: "Jeremy Hughes" <jer...@softpress.com>
Date: Thu, 11 Nov 2010 13:47:02 +0000
Tobias Jung (11/11/10, 13:32) said:
>Nowadays Apple Mail saves each _message_ as a single file, MBOX was
>dropped with the Tiger version.
You're right...
... and yet searching seems to be very fast (but with fewer options than
PowerMail, unless I'm missing something).
>Of course, this also solves both issues. I just wanted to point this out
>because some people don't like the idea of having thousands of message
>files, too.
I'd rather have separate message files than a single monolithic
database. So this is another way that PowerMail could go.
I'm not sure what's so wrong with having thousands of message files -
most application packages (e.g. Safari) contain thousands of resource files.
Jeremy
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Subject: Re: 2 GB limit
From: "Tobias Jung" <new...@tobiasjung.net>
Date: Thu, 11 Nov 2010 15:13:27 +0100
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----------------------------------------------------------------------
Subject: Re: 2 GB limit
From: "John Snippe" <j...@snippe.ca>
Date: Thu, 11 Nov 2010 09:25:31 -0500
On 11-Nov-10, at 9:13 AM, Tobias Jung wrote:
> So I merely guessed that there might be people here who don't like
> thousands of message files, too.
I like it (conceptually)... don't know that it has a benefit. Might
even hurt as regards system performance, no? I just wish the files
were clear .txt files, so the OS itself could search within the email
content.
--
John Snippe
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Subject: Re(2): 2 GB limit
From: "George Henne" <g...@nsbasic.com>
Date: Thu, 11 Nov 2010 09:54:59 -0500
I think the idea of one file per folder is an interesting compromise.
The current single large database concept doesn't work anymore. It's bad
for the power users with 2 gig of messages - but it's also very bad for
people using Time Machine style backups. My Time Machine backup probably
is running 30 minutes out of every hour - and it's all due to Powermail.
This constant activity slows down my system and the network - the
opposite of the intent of PowerMail to be an efficient solution.
>
>On 11-Nov-10, at 9:13 AM, Tobias Jung wrote:
>
>> So I merely guessed that there might be people here who don't like
>> thousands of message files, too.
>
>I like it (conceptually)... don't know that it has a benefit. Might
>even hurt as regards system performance, no? I just wish the files
>were clear .txt files, so the OS itself could search within the email
>content.
>
>--
>John Snippe
>
>
>
>
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Subject: Re: 2 GB limit
From: "Michael J. Hußmann" <mich...@michael-hussmann.de>
Date: Thu, 11 Nov 2010 16:58:41 +0200
Jeremy Hughes (jer...@softpress.com) wrote:
> I'm not sure what's so wrong with having thousands of message files -
> most application packages (e.g. Safari) contain thousands of resource files.
Just try to copy one 1 MB file versus 1000 files of 1 KB each ... Not to
mention that a monolithic files takes up less space. For the same reason
I am not a big fan of the package idea; even moving rather than copying
a package takes more time. Sometimes when I have to copy a package
containing thousands of files to a slow medium I first compress the
package to a ZIP archive and copy that. Even when the total file size
wouldn't be significantly smaller, copying a single file is so much
faster as to make this worthwhile.
So I'm all for the monolithic database approach. I don't care if a
backup needs to copy the whole file - copying a single file is fast.
- Michael
Michael J. Hußmann
E-mail: mich...@michael-hussmann.de
WWW (personal): http://michael-hussmann.de
WWW (professional): http://digicam-experts.de
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Subject: Re: Creator Codes
From: "Michael J. Hußmann" <mich...@michael-hussmann.de>
Date: Thu, 11 Nov 2010 17:13:19 +0200
Tobias Jung (new...@tobiasjung.net) wrote:
> So my question is: Who is responsible for this?
> Is it PowerMail or OS X?
> And is it possible to change the default creator code for certain file
types?
I've just checked the attachments and most of the HTML files didn't have
a creator code; also some other types of files were mostly missing
creator codes. Of those which had a creator code assigned I suppose that
they had that code to begin with. I don't think PM is assigning creator
codes on its own.
Using "MSIE" (of all things) as the creator code of an HTML file would
be quite odd anyway. Who is still using Internet Explorer these days
(under Mac OS X)?
- Michael
Michael J. Hußmann
E-mail: mich...@michael-hussmann.de
WWW (personal): http://michael-hussmann.de
WWW (professional): http://digicam-experts.de
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Subject: Re: 2 GB limit
From: "Tobias Jung" <new...@tobiasjung.net>
Date: Thu, 11 Nov 2010 16:22:56 +0100
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----------------------------------------------------------------------
Subject: Re: Creator Codes
From: "Tobias Jung" <new...@tobiasjung.net>
Date: Thu, 11 Nov 2010 17:23:14 +0100
Michael J. Hußmann wrote (Thu, 11 Nov 2010 17:13:19 +0200):
> I've just checked the attachments and most of the HTML files didn't have
> a creator code; also some other types of files were mostly missing
> creator codes. Of those which had a creator code assigned I suppose that
> they had that code to begin with.
Thanks for checking.
That's really strange, most of the attachments I received do have a
creator code; and _all_ HTML files have "MSIE", no matter when I
received them. I really wonder who or what is responsible for this.
> Using "MSIE" (of all things) as the creator code of an HTML file would
> be quite odd anyway.
I agree.
Kind regards,
Tobias Jung
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Subject: Re: 2 GB limit
From: "Jeremy Hughes" <jer...@softpress.com>
Date: Thu, 11 Nov 2010 16:28:39 +0000
Michael J. Hußmann (11/11/10, 14:58) said:
>Just try to copy one 1 MB file versus 1000 files of 1 KB each
How often do you copy or move your mail folder?
>So I'm all for the monolithic database approach. I don't care if a
>backup needs to copy the whole file - copying a single file is fast.
Not so fast over a network, and wasteful of backup space.
Jeremy
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Subject: Re: 2 GB limit
From: "Michael J. Hußmann" <mich...@michael-hussmann.de>
Date: Thu, 11 Nov 2010 18:43:19 +0200
Jeremy Hughes (jer...@softpress.com) wrote:
> How often do you copy or move your mail folder?
Every time I do a backup. Actually if I do a complete backup, copying
the message database is the fastest part and nothing to worry about;
it's copying the attachments folder that takes time (lots of mostly
small files, you see?).
- Michael
Michael J. Hußmann
E-mail: mich...@michael-hussmann.de
WWW (personal): http://michael-hussmann.de
WWW (professional): http://digicam-experts.de
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Subject: Re: 2 GB limit
From: "Beatrix Willius" <bwill...@gmx.de>
Date: Thu, 11 Nov 2010 17:43:51 +0100
Hi,
as database programmer I can say that both approaches have benefits and
drawbacks.
Database:
Pro: fast useage, fast copying
Con: if it's hosed, then it's really kaputt. However, most issues should be
fixable by deleting the index.
Incremental backups are not so easy.
Files:
Pro: simple, problems are usually easy to fix.
Con: slloooowww searches. Try using AppleMail with a mailbox of 100.000 mails.
This is just a pain.
Somehow, databases got a bad reputation with people using emails. Most likely
because of proprietary databases. Stupid Entourage corrupted itself every time
I tried to use it for a few months and I only need it for testing. However,
modern databases in general don't do corruption very often. Or do you think
that big corporations would trust their data to systems that are easily
corrupted?
Oh, and all modern databases do 2 GB. I do this routinely with bigger
databases.
Am 11.11.2010 um 17:28 schrieb Jeremy Hughes:
> Michael J. Hußmann (11/11/10, 14:58) said:
>
>> Just try to copy one 1 MB file versus 1000 files of 1 KB each
>
> How often do you copy or move your mail folder?
>
>> So I'm all for the monolithic database approach. I don't care if a
>> backup needs to copy the whole file - copying a single file is fast.
>
> Not so fast over a network, and wasteful of backup space.
>
> Jeremy
>
>
Mit freundlichen Grüßen/Regards
Trixi Willius
http://www.mothsoftware.com
Mail Archiver X: archive, clean and search email
http://www.beatrixwillius.de
Fractals, 3d landscapes etc.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Subject: Re: 2 GB limit
From: "Jeremy Hughes" <jer...@softpress.com>
Date: Thu, 11 Nov 2010 16:54:12 +0000
Michael J. Hußmann (11/11/10, 16:43) said:
>> How often do you copy or move your mail folder?
>
>Every time I do a backup.
Well, I don't know what backup program you use - and you obviously have
much less mail than me since you don't care about the 2GB limit - but my
backups are much larger and slower than those of people who are using
Apple Mail.
We're using Retrospect to backup over a network.
Jeremy
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Subject: Re: Creator Codes
From: "Beatrix Willius" <bwill...@gmx.de>
Date: Thu, 11 Nov 2010 17:55:58 +0100
Hi Tobias,
Am 11.11.2010 um 17:23 schrieb Tobias Jung:
> Michael J. Hußmann wrote (Thu, 11 Nov 2010 17:13:19 +0200):
>
>> I've just checked the attachments and most of the HTML files didn't have
>> a creator code; also some other types of files were mostly missing
>> creator codes. Of those which had a creator code assigned I suppose that
>> they had that code to begin with.
>
> Thanks for checking.
> That's really strange, most of the attachments I received do have a
> creator code; and _all_ HTML files have "MSIE", no matter when I
> received them. I really wonder who or what is responsible for this.
this is a Finder thing. Go to the Finder, select a html file. View the
information and then "Open with". Change this and remember to click on "Change
All".
Mit freundlichen Grüßen/Regards
Trixi Willius
http://www.mothsoftware.com
Mail Archiver X: archive, clean and search email
http://www.beatrixwillius.de
Fractals, 3d landscapes etc.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Subject: Re(2): 2 GB limit
From: "George Henne" <g...@nsbasic.com>
Date: Thu, 11 Nov 2010 12:14:13 -0500
I just checked - PowerMail is responsible for 90% of of the backup
activity on my system. (I use TimeMachine). The problem is that if just
one email comes in an hour (which always happens), the complete database
gets backed up again. One database per folder would reduce the backup
requirements dramatically. There would be less load on the system, and
my Time Machine would be able backups for a much longer time period.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Subject: Re: Creator Codes
From: "Tobias Jung" <new...@tobiasjung.net>
Date: Thu, 11 Nov 2010 18:17:31 +0100
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cywNClRvYmlhcyBKdW5nDQo=
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Subject: Re: Creator Codes
From: "Beatrix Willius" <bwill...@gmx.de>
Date: Thu, 11 Nov 2010 18:52:50 +0100
Hi Tobias,
Am 11.11.2010 um 18:17 schrieb Tobias Jung:
> Well, thank you, but this (of course) only affects files that already
> are stored on your hard disk. But I received a HTML file three days ago
> that's what brought my attention to this matter and it has the
> "MSIE" creator code, too.
>
> And while I can't be sure that I never used the procedure you describe
> on HTML files, I _am_ sure
> a) that I didn't do this within the last three days;
> b) that _if_ I did it at some point in the past, I wouldn't have set the
> "Open with" option to Internet Explorer
>
> So while I know how to change the creator code of existing files, I
> wonder what sets the creator code of files that arrive on my system.
Sorry, this wasn't clear from your mail :-)
This shouldn't affect only existing files but also new ones. Try rebuilding
Launch Services with Onyx. Optimize/Create new (Neuaufbau) and then
LaunchServices.
Mit freundlichen Grüßen/Regards
Trixi Willius
http://www.mothsoftware.com
Mail Archiver X: archive, clean and search email
http://www.beatrixwillius.de
Fractals, 3d landscapes etc.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
End of powermail-discuss Digest
